It's not so much the haggle I'm concerned about. It's the lemon factor. If I'm buying a used car, there's a lot more than meets the eye to any car, and whether or not the dealer is no-haggle, there are many aspects of quality that may not be addressed simply by price. Sure, you can take it to your mechanic (though as a non-car owner presently, I don't have a mechanic, and it may be more difficult for me to thus have to find a mechanic who will look at a car before I buy it and give an honest assessment. On the one hand, he may not pick up on some of the problems from a simple once-over; and also, if he assumes I'm going to bring the car to him from now on, isn't it just as advantageous for him to recommend I buy a car with [undisclosed] future problems, since he may assume I will bring it to him to fix them?
Sorry, wouldn't buy an Impala. Way too big for my tastes, and coming from a GM town, I have a phobia of anything GM-made.
Thanks for the input, but unfortunately none of you have done anything to convince me to buy a used car -- if anything, you've shifted my opinion even more in favour of buying new. Some of you make great points that may be useful for other people with different tastes, financial situations, living in different areas, etc, so the points are valid, they just aren't valid for me.
Here's my arguments so far: 1) As a student with no savings (aside from a small downpayment possibly), I will finance most of the cost. New car financing deals can be had for 3%, whereas my bank will charge me at least 7% (and this will go up over the next few years, since interest rates will be rising). Over 4 years, a $16,000 used car loan would cost at least twice as much as a $22,000 new car loan ($2800 vs $1400).
2) Variety. At least 90% of used Mazda3s and Corollas (at a quick scan of local dealer websites) are silver or tan. Eww. I would also prefer a stick shift, which could be cheaper to get in a used car theoretically, but they're really hard to find, especially if you are picky about the combination of other options. For a quick search: of 355 Corollas in my area, 20 of those are actually a colour I like, and only 2 have manual and the other add-ons I want (a/c, remote key entry) - this doesn't give me a whole lot of bargaining power (not to mention, since they're 2+ hours away from my home, it makes the whole shopping process difficult).
I'm not saying that I wouldn't buy a used car (though just looking at the market around here, I'd probably buy a 1-year old over a 2 or 3 year old; overall there isn't a huge difference in price in that 2nd year, but there are options available on newer cars that aren't there with the older ones - especially if I want to buy a Mazda 3, which only came out last year). However, I'm still not convinced to buy used over new. There are just certain things that don't come used...
>There are just certain things that don't come used...
True, but as someone just starting out with no savings, maybe you should wait for those things. Yes, you have to pay a higher percent loan for a used car, but if you got one for around $10,000 (and plenty of reliable used cars can be had for that price) rather than $16,000 you would have lower payments and might even be able to save up some money for that new car.
Anyone can tell you a good local mechanic to take car to and for around $20 they will look it over for you. No, they won't catch everything, but probably the most important things. And no mechanic has a vested interest in letting a customer buy a car with problems. There are so many good, reliable used cars out there now. If reliability is your issue, a used Toyota or Honda will be nearly bulletproof and will last for many years. No, it won't be as cute or exciting as you want (although my manual Civic was fun to drive) but they won't break down, cost much to repair, and will get pretty good gas mileage too.
That being said, if you insist on new, the Mazda3 is a great looking car. You won't go wrong with it. I think your idea of internet pricing first is a good one, because then the salesperson won't have prejudged you on age. The key is to be as informed as possible in advance. And if you encounter salespeople who brush you off or ask when you are bringing your husband or boyfriend with you (this has happened to me many times, a hoot because my husband knows nothing and has zero interest in cars) your knowledge will give you confidence.
Some people should NOT buy a used car. these people are too suspecious or fearful.
If you do find a used car you like, take it to a RECCOMMENDED shop for an inspection. You will NOT pay 20.00 as someone suggested. You will pay a lot more than that for an intense inspection.
If you buy used, you will pay a lot less money but do expect to have a repair bill once in awhile.
And, in my not so humble opinion, with a used car, the color should be the LAST thing to worry about.
And, in some cases, a used car is *not* nessisarily more expensive than a new car. As an example, in 2002, I bought a new 2002 Camry for 18500. I looked at getting a loaded 2000 Accord EXV6 whoch would have cost about the same.
I sold the camry to carmax for $11,400. I do not know that the 5 yo accord is going for, but according to kbb, the value would have been somewhare around $9500.
**You will NOT pay 20.00 as someone suggested. You will pay a lot more than that for an intense inspection. **
You will GENERALLY pay $75-100 for a thorough examination of the vehicle. I believe that a lot of the AAA approved shops through certain AAA branches have a $75 deal.
OK, I'm out in the hinterlands where things don't cost as much. My point was that, relatively speaking (considering the total cost of buying a car), inspections aren't very expensive, and they will give you peace of mind when buying used cars.
though as a non-car owner presently, I don't have a mechanic, and it may be more difficult for me to thus have to find a mechanic who will look at a car before I buy it and give an honest assessment.
isell: I'm talking no-haggle prices that already include a substantial discount. Even Honda has one such store in the DC area.
Also check your credit union to see if they have pre-negotiated prices with certain dealers. That's if you want to avoid the hassles. Some people love to negotiate.
Are you aware of the impact of a stick shift when you sell or trade this car in the future? It will be much harder to sell privately, and as a trade it will bring significantly less than an equivalent car with an automatic. This is just how it is in the auto market.
Now, if you intend to keep your auto for a long time, it will make less of a difference. But, in general, a stick shift is tougher to find a buyer for, and because of this, is of less value to a dealer as a trade-in.
Now, as a new college grad, you probably don't think much about this. You intend to drive the wheels off this new car. But in a few months you get a nice job and meet the love of your life at you new company. You are married in a year and a half. And surprise, there is a young jezebel on the way. This happens in less than 3 years in the future, and you've got a 4 year auto loan. And that new Corella, Civic, Mazada 3 just isn't going to be able to handle 3 people and diaper bags, stoller, playpen, etc for the weekend trips to the grandparents. (Hubby's not going to sell his Mustang, dang it if impending fatherhood is going to impact his 'sporty' look. Anyway, one of the first things a guy does when he get married is sell his wife's car... Been there, done it, twice.)
Oh, you have NO IDEA just how important color is to a lot of shoppers! I wouldn't have believed it myself. I've had people switch from buying a Civic to a Pilot they have no use for because they liked the stupid color better. I'm serious!
I was talking more about used cars. Unless it's a really bad color, the rest of the deal is MUCH more important!
And that new Corella, Civic, Mazada 3 just isn't going to be able to handle 3 people and diaper bags, stoller, playpen...
It will just fine, esp. in a wagon form (i.e., Matrix and Mazda hatch.) Ok, maybe not the playpen. No reason to not buy a compact because a few years down the road one may start a family and have kids. Unless these twins/triplets have already been concieved...
I would stay away, however, from 2-door cars - too impractical for anybody except a committed bachelor/bachelorette....
when we take a road trip to Madison from Minneapolis (250-300 miles) with 2 small kids, we usually take my Prizm rather than my wife's Accord - better mileage, cheaper cost per mile, and the Accord's seat is uncomfortable for me on long trips. No playpen though...
When I buy a car I tend to give myself several color options I could live with. When I bought my Civic, the Value Package only came in Green or Silver and I didn't really care. My Odyssey, I would have been fine with Green, Beige or Red. (We ended up with beige) and with my I35, I was open to any color except white or black. So yes, I tend to leave a few options open for myself when car shopping. Try not to be swayed by the color- Don't be the person that switched from a Civic to a Pilot simply because you like the Pilot's color scheme better.
On used cars it's even more crucial to not focus on color because a) it's hard to find one with your color scheme and option combination and b) if you do find one with your color scheme it'll be harder to negotiate because you just love that color so much and will probably end up paying more for it.
You're right, colour should be the last thing you consider when buying a used car. Which is exactly why I'm not leaning towards buying a used car. Because, regardless of how much I try to avoid it, I am tremendously affected by visual stimuli, colour etc. Not to mention, I'd have a much easier time finding my car in the parking lot if there are that many silver ones out there.
I don't ever plan on up-sizing. A four-door car is a four-door car. Unless your kids are 16 and 5'10", a small car is not a problem of fit. Not to mention, I have serious doubts that I will have any children in the next 6 years, if ever. My concerns right now are more about travel/exploration - and a small car makes a huge difference when you're driving cross-country.
Focusing too much on the practicality of cars just takes the whole fun out of ownership. If I really wanted to maximize every single penny, I'd buy a bus pass, and just take a cab when I need to buy groceries or travel after the buses stop running. But there's a non-monetary value to the convenience of being able to travel when I want, where I want, not having to wait in the freezing cold for a bus to come.
By the same logic, there are other nonmonetary features of car values. And the happier you are with the exact features of your car, the longer you will want to keep it. A manual transmission may be harder to sell, but it's cheaper on gas, and more importantly, it keeps you engaged while driving, preventing driver boredom and thus making accidents less risky (especially for me, since that's my biggest driving problem - spacing out). By the same story, I could save $5000 by buying a one-year-old Mazda 3 instead of a new one (well, it works out closer to $3000 when you factor in financing rates) - but being the first production year, it also has problems with air-conditioning, and probably some underdetermined faults that are typical of being the first year of a run. The expense of those repairs, of renting a car while it's in the shop, the stress, etc, is something that isn't factored into the initial price - though it will much likely be factored in when it comes time to sell the car.
Finally, on the colour/manual thread.. there is a correlation between what people want - people with similar tastes like similar packages. I want a black car; not coincidentally, black cars are more likely than other colours of car to have stick shifts. It's the sporty taste. You won't see a tan car with a stick, but you'll see lots of black ones. In fact, to get the Mazda 3 GT sporty model, of the 3 or 4 I've seen on the resale market already, ALL of them are black, and half of them are sticks. So in this case, it would likely increase the resale value.
Other reasons to buy new: I can take advantage of the $500 graduate rebate; I'm thinking of doing a cross-country trip, and it would be much easier to fly one way, pick up the car on the coast, and then drive it back. Much Much easier to arrange with a new car (can negotiate over phone/email and have the deal complete before I leave home) than with a used car (bad idea to not look at it first). Driving both ways would be inefficient, but doing the whole trip with no car would suck - and there are so many places you just can't get to on the Greyhound or train. Also: that new car smell, the fact that I've waited so long for this moment that I want to do it right, the idea that my tastes don't change much and I'll still enjoy this car for years to come; a higher resale value when I do sell it (at least $1000, cutting the immediate cost difference down to less than $2000 for the new car); etc.
I won't be promoted to make more money in a few years and thus want a nicer car. I'll be starting in the middle range (jobs I'm currently interviewing for have salaries around $50K+), but I don't plan to stay in that field forever. Once I get the experience and deal with the finances, I will move toward more independence in my job - positions in the non-profit sector, which pay less, and/or some freelance work, so I'd like to buy the car now, and be able to keep it for a long time. I doubt that I will be "up-sizing" anywhere in the near future.
Hey, you asked, and you are getting lots of opinions. A lot of good opinions, too.
Don't listen to me, but listen to isellhondas, he's a very knowledgable and experienced auto salesperson - if he says manuals are a tough sell, believe him.
And what do I know about playpens and strollers. I've never had any kids.
And about buying what you want and not focusing on practicality - I'm into that. I've owned several Corvettes, and talk about impractical cars!!!! And I now own 3 vehicles. One for me, one for the wife, and ..... oh, yes, one for the cat.
The things people are putting out there are for you to think about. And when you come back in here 2 years from now, we'll remember you. And the 'We told you so's' will come flying out.
Another of my opinions is coming.... Your idea of buying a car long distance, flying to it, and driving it home. This just doesn't sound like a good idea to me at all. First off, salesmen have been known to 'fib'. With your inexperience, dealing long distance with a purchase will just magnify greatly the possibility for 'problems'.
"Oh, you wanted a 5-speed? I must have missed that. Oh, yes, it does say that in my email, but that was a mistake. We haven't had a 5-speed in that model in years. But just look over here at this nice automatic. It's got 3 other options you don't want, after market mag wheels, scotchguard interior, wearever wax, a different color, and is $3,000 more than we quoted. But you are 2,000 miles away from home, don't know where any other dealers in the city are located, and ok, since we did have a little miscommunication on this, I think I can get that difference knocked down to only $2,800."
And.... I've bought several new cars. And I really, really don't think it is a good idea to strike out across the country in a brand, spanking new car. Get those first 600-1,000 'break-in' miles on there. I've bought 2 cars 'down the road' about 60 miles that were so out of alignment I had to hang onto the wheel to keep them on the road. One of them I already knew about and specifically told them to have it aligned before I returned to pick it up. Did they do it? NOoooooo. Think about buying that wonderful new car, far far away from home. Driving it off the lot and, what, bad alignment when you get it up to speed on the freeway? Stange noise when it first starts up cold? That dreaded 'check engine light' comes on the second day? Do you want to spend the next 2 or 3 days of your vacation watching TV and reading the magazines in the waiting room while the dealer 'works the bugs' out of your new car?
Buy this car in your hometown. If something isn't going right in the 'deal', you can leave the dealership and work it out. Then when it is bought, get some miles and time on it. At least one month and 1,000 miles.
I used to not care about car colors, except I wanted one that would not show the dirt. After 10 years of metalic beige, I finally started to care. This time, the car had to be blue or red. It is red. I am happy.
I "strongly encourage" my company drivers to reconsider their decision to buy white or black cars up here in Chicago. Buy those two colors and they'll be at the car wash nearly every week - at $8-10 a pop.
"I want a black car; not coincidentally, black cars are more likely than other colours of car to have stick shifts." Very true. So have you learned how to drive a stick yet? Just don't learn on the car that you buy!
Its always better to buy the car at your local dealer, especially if the price difference is insignificant. I would have saved only $500 by buying my Infiniti in Boston instead of Nashville but I'd have to buy a plane ticket ($400) arrange for a hotel ($60) and spend money on gas to drive the car back home ($250 maybe) In the end, although the actual car cost more at my local dealer, I saved money on other expenses- I didn't have to fly in, stay in a hotel or drive a very long distance to get home.
you write: "A manual transmission may be harder to sell, but it's cheaper on gas, and more importantly, it keeps you engaged while driving, preventing driver boredom and thus making accidents less risky (especially for me, since that's my biggest driving problem - spacing out".
A manual may also be more reliable and less costly to maintain long-term. I'm not positive about that but i've personally never had a problem with a manual transmission in any vehicle i've owned (5 or 6: i've lost count).
I agree 100% about being actively engaged in the driving experience with a manual!!! It seems you'd have much more fun driving a manual too and that is important.
Hopefully you're inclined to take good care of the vehicle and drive it for a long time. Who cares how easy it is to sell, if you drive it for a decade?
My wife and I have always driven manuals, until the past few years when we had to buy a mini-van to haul the family. We sold a 4DR toyota corolla manual which was 10yrs old with 183K for 2K. The 2DR honda accord coupe was cumbersome to get the little ones in and out but it was great w.r.t. drivability / response / fun / mileage / reliability.
But much to my dissapointment - the 2DR suffered a fractured cam-shaft leading to almost immediate valve damage at 150K. This vehicle was intended to go another 60K... Even in non-working condition, we got pretty good money for it. Had it been working, it was probably worth 3-4K private party.
Forced into another vehicle, I compromised and moved to a '02 4cyl 4DR honda accord automatic. i love the vehicle, but i definitely miss the manual.
my criteria has changed with time.
If I were you, I'd consider a used 4DR manual, 3-4yrs old maybe, CARFAXed ($25 is cheap), checked out by a local mechanic knowlegable about that vehicle (isell was right - expect to pay more, at least $50 or $75 for a good inspection - also cheap). I'd look for something getting good mileage, with good reliability marks and decent depreciation and reasonable cost to own.
While it doesn't have to be an "appliance" vehicle, it should be getting you where you need to go, not constantly in the shop. Personally, I'd be extremely flexible on color, leaning more towards vehicle condition / maintenance as critically important to me over trim-level, and any gagetry / accessories / extras.
Now as to "spacing out", only you know what you mean by that. I'd get that checked out first before I went shopping.
I've been doing a lot of reading on buying cars, financing, general insurance quotes and looking at local dealers sites checking out prices and trying to find one I like. I need the monthly payments for both the insurance and car payments as low as possible. (for the first few months at least)
Right now I think I'm going to go with a used Honda Civic, possibly an Accord. Although lately I've been looking at Acura Rsx's. I want something small, reliable and easy on gas. The lowest year I'd go is 2002. I'd like the price to be around $10,000 and 15,000, the lower the better but whatever.. I'm more concerned with the total monthly payments and I know that can make the total cost more with interest. My FICO score is 666. I pay all my balances off each month, except for one card that is almost paid off and will be paid off before I get a car.
One thing that is confusing me is I'm seeing 2002 Honda Civics for about 15,000 and brand new 2005s for around the same price. Makes me think I'd be better off going with a new one if the 2002 is going to cost more to fix it every month. I know a lot of it has to do with extra features which most of them I don't really care about.
Then there's the thing with insurance. I had my license when I was 16. I think that was good for 1 or 2 years, I never renewed it because I didn't have a car to drive anymore. So it expired. (stupid, I know that now) I'm 23 and just got it back. I've been going to sites like Progressive.com and doing quotes just to get a general idea on insurance costs with the different models and makes. They recommended $359 a month on 2002 Civic. I guess I need to go with full coverage because I'm going to finance or take out a loan. But none of the sites say what exactly full coverage is. They want you to customize everything. I also don't want to put my SS# in to do a quote because I don't want a million inquiry marks on my credit report.
Also anyone know any sites to find out how reliable a local dealer is? I want to do a Carfax report, but would also like to read reviews on a dealer if there are any. I went to dealerrater.com, but not many listed in my area. I'm from RI.
If I need to post this in another board, please let me know.
I am a new graduate, 26 yr old, on the verge of landing a job. I have all loans paid off, apart from some credit card debt (~$2000). I will need to buy my first car for commuting, which will mostly be in Pittsburgh, PA. I do some road trips too, so will need to travel for longer periods in the car. Ideally I’d like to keep the car for 7/8 yrs. My priorities in descending order are: Reliability, Safety, Fuel economy, Performance, Handling, looks, color etc. My budget is $20,000 & I need to purchase the car in May/June this year.
Being a newbie, I have done a lot of research about what might be suitable for me. Here is what I came up with: I am leaning towards a certified pre-owned car (as opposed to a new one). As for leasing I can’t seem to make up my mind.Based on my requirements, I ended up narrowing my choices to: (All automatic transmission) Honda Civic (a 2003/2004 model) Toyota Corolla (2004) Toyota Matrix (2004)
Here is what I would like help with: 1. Feedback/comments on my choices (Are there any issues about the models mentioned I need to know?, your preferences for the three, etc). Are there any other models I should be looking into? I am not buying any American cars. 2. Should I consider leasing at all, for the first year (for any positive reason that you might think of), or buying new for that matter? 3. I am relatively new driver, so when it comes to ABS, I think I will be able to unlearn the old techniques with less difficulty. But after having read quite a few complaints on the NHTSA website (Civic & Corolla, 04 & 05 models) regarding the ABS systems, I am not sure if the fault lies with the system on these models or the drivers. Now I debate on if I should get ABS or not. Advise please. 4. Should I consider an AWD vs. a FWD, if I have to drive in some snow and hilly areas? Would it really have an advantage over a FWD?
I appreciate all your comments and insights. I might add a few more concerns that need answering as we go along. Thank you very much.
First of all, congratulations on graduating, and good luck with getting a new job!
You are bound to get plenty of opinions on your purchasing plans, so I'll start by throwing in my $0.02 (you can just add that to your base salary). All of the vehicles you mentioned are great choices for used vehicles, and I don't think you can make a "wrong" choice there. So, it's basically down to personal preference.
If I were in your situation, I would not consider leasing. New vehicles generally take the biggest depreciation hit during the first year, so your payments would be higher than necessary, and you'd be stuck with this decision all over again in 12 months. Leasing for longer at such a young stage in your career is usually not a good idea, as a lease tends to lock you in for several years. Getting out of a lease if your income or other circumstances change can be VERY costly.
Since it's your first car purchase and you're just starting a new job, I would go with a used vehicle. That way, you can keep your payments at a really affordable level. If your income goes up significantly, you can always upgrade in a year or two, and if it goes down, you're not saddled with a big payment or being severely upside-down in terms of the vehicle's value vs. what you owe.
I'll let others chime in and offer comments as well - plus, I don't feel qualified to comment on questions 3 & 4!
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
If you like the Matrix, you might want to take a look at the Pontiac Vibe. Same car, built on the same line, but since it says "Pontiac" on it instead of "Toyota", they can usually be had considerably cheaper. A new Vibe may be cheaper than a year old Matrix.
Just ignore Qn # 2. I am not considering leasing or buying new anymore.
Since I currently live in Columbus, OH I was planning on buying the car here, and driving it upto Pittsburgh. Are there any issues that I might have to face with insurance/dealer/financing since I will essentially provide a PA address?
Also just out of curiosity, how is color going to affect my insurance rates? Even though I am not hung up on color (won't make my decision based on it), I am partial to red.
I saw some CPO listings for 2005 Civic & Corolla, with avg miles of 6,000 on them. For the same given price and trim levels ( since both these don't depreciate much, seems like), do you suggest I get '05 model?
As for the Pontiac vibe, I haven't looked into it, but will do so. Even though the vibe and matrix are built on the same platform, I don't overall trust GM very much... more of a judgemental block I guess, but alas!!!
The Vibe and Matrix are the same car. Co-Developed by Toyota Motor Co. and General Motors. So, between the two, I'd go for the Vibe. Since it's badged as a Pontiac it'll carry more incentives than the Matrix.
But have you tried the Mazda3? It's a fun to drive car and fairly reliable.
The Korean car companies (Kia & Hyundai) sell decent compact cars also. I'd take a look. Elantras and Spectras can be had for several thousand less than a comparable Civic or Corolla.
About AWD, it adds weight and lowers fuel economy but in some areas it's an absolute must-have. I'd say if you see snow more than four months of the year (November, December, January, February) or if you get a lot of snow, it's worth the upgrade. In this case, I'd recommend the Subaru Impreza/Saab 9-2X or a smaller crossover- Hyundai Tuscon, Kia Sportage, Honda CR-V, Toyota RAV4, etc.
Civics and Corollas don't depreciate much. Same goes for Accords and Camrys. I have a 99 Civic with almost 100K miles on it, huge stains in the carpet and a few fairly large scratches in the bumpers. The car is a mild eye-sore and is essentially a beater. KBB still says it's worth almost $6,000. I don't know why somebody would pay that much for my car. I only paid $12,000 for it new.
If $20,000 is your budget, you could try looking at some used (2001-2002) CPO entry level luxury cars. The Infiniti G20 is reliable (although not much fun) as is the I30/I35 and the Acura Integra. Don't try to get a used Lexus at that price- it'll have quite a few miles on it and the prices will be outrageous. About the only thing, in my opinion, with better resale than a Civic, Camry, Accord or Corolla would be a Lexus. Those things don't depreciate much.
Be sure to pre-arrange financing or get pre-approved from the auto manufacturer if you plan to finance through the car company.
And test drive many different cars before reaching a decision.
You really don't want to be stuck with a car like this: :lemon:
More utility and there are less of them on the road. My mother has a Protege5 and LOVES it. A great used car value. I have a Mazda3 5-door and I really liek mine.
I had also considered the Vibe/Matrix and Focus. All seemed like nice cars.
And don't forget your grad discount. I believe Mazda, Pontiac, and Ford all have one.
I think the first thing I would do is go face-to-face with an agent. From one of the 'Name Brand' insurance companies. State Farm, Farmers, Allstate, etc. Find someone you 'like'. If you don't like an agent, don't give up on the company, go find another agent. They should be able to give you a pretty close estimate of what the insurance will cost for an exact car you are interested in.
An agent should explain each of the coverages. You might not necessarily need 'full coverage'. I don't carry Medical, because this covers other people's injuries that are riding in my car. Everyone that rides with me has their own insurance, or, my opinion is that if I cause them injury, they can sue me and collect under my liability. Many new cars, if that is what you are buying, has coverage that will include towing, while it is under warranty. Therefore you do not need towing insurance for first 3 years/36,000 miles (or whatever).
Get to know what the coverages are and if you really need them. And get to know about 'deductable' amounts. A higher deductable can save you a lot of money.
But horrors - a quote of $369 A MONTH on a 2002 Civic!!!!!!!!!! I pay only about $250 for 6 months for a 2002 Accord EXV6!!!!!! But then, I'm an old fa*t and live in a town with very low insurance rates. This still seem extremely high!!!!! Expecially if you are female!!!!!!!
Your choices are very good ones. All 3 should be extremely reliable, relatively cheap to insure, and good on gas mileage. Really, it's more a matter of which one you like the best, which is the best price, etc. You get an insurance discount if you buy a new model, but used cars of the type you are looking at are fine too. Regarding insurance, if you go with a company like Geico, you can buy the car in Columbus (I am gussing you want to do this because you know the area dealers?) and still insure for Pittsburgh.
For the poster wanting to know about insurance I would check out Geico. The phone operator can explain to you what full coverage requires and give you an estimate. If you are male, it's going to be horrendously expensive until you are at least 26 with no accidents. For single young women it isn't cheap either but nowhere as bad as for males. A good reason to get a much older car and only carry liability!
With respect to auto insurance, which is likely to be costly for a young driver, State Farm insurance puts out a guide as to which cars cost more or less to insure.
Choose a vehicle with an "A" rating to get the lowest insurance rates.
Note from the link that the Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla, and Toyota Matrix all get the "C - ie. worst" rating for insurance damage and theft. Therefore insurance for these cars will cost more than other cars.
Although there are plenty of exceptions, In general, the least costly cars to insure are the somewhat boring medium to large size 4 door sedans. Sports cars and sporty cars can be costly to insure.
Some of that seems counter-intuitive, for instance the convertibles from Audi and BMW actually have lower theft rates. :confuse:
But insurance does represent a high percentage of your total outlay for a young driver, so do check that list and speak to your insurance agent before you pick a car. A former neighbor bought a Mustang Cobra for his kid and they couldn't afford to keep it so he sold it after a year or so. Insurance was UNBELIEVABLY expensive for that car.
Honda Element looks good, 30% discount plus A rated. Check out Miata, 40% and B, not bad. Vibe > Matrix > Corolla if you shop those. Highlander looks solid but they cost a bit more. Outback and Forester also look good.
Are you into small car-based SUVs? Element and Forester are pretty affordable, high teens.
Top 10 insurance-friendly cars (2004) Make Model Style 5-yr avg insurance cost (Chicago area) MSRP Chrysler PT Cruiser 4dr Wagon (2.4L 4cyl 5M) $4,240 $17,490 GMC Safari SLE AWD 3dr Minivan (4.3L 6cyl 4A) $4,298 $27,440 Dodge Caravan SE 4dr Minivan (2.4L 4cyl 4A) $4,357 $21,130 Saturn ION 1 4dr Sedan (2.2L 4cyl 5M) $4,373 $10,430 Pontiac Sunfire 2dr Coupe (2.2L 4cyl 5M) $4,389 $14,930 Jeep Liberty Sport 4WD 4dr SUV (2.4L 4cyl 5M) $4,408 $19,890 Saturn L300 1 4dr Sedan (2.2L 4cyl 4A) $4,410 $16,370 Volvo S40 4dr Sedan (1.9L 4cyl Turbo 5A) $4,420 $24,700 Saab 38600 Linear 2.3t 4dr SportWagon (2.3L 4cyl Turbo 5M) $4,422 $32,525 Buick Century Special Edition 4dr Sedan (3.1L 6cyl 4A) $4,426 $25,805 Source: Edmunds.com
Some cars that are not the very safest actually are lower to insure because the people who buy them (minivan owners, for example) tend to drive very conservatively. According to this article, the best method is to compare comparably priced cars. Best is to just ask an insurance agent what it would cost to insure the cars you are interested in.
The reason I wanted to purchase a car in Columbus : I am a female & single to boot. The same old concerns of being considered naive and getting ripped by a dealer plague me. I have never owned a car and do not have a passion for them (not car tech savy), apart from the utilarian.... all adding up to the fact that it may not be wise to walk in alone by myself into the dealership. I have a perfect friend here in Columbus, to go shopping with me (male, loves cars, knows them well), who will go with me, as long as I do my research.
I am trying to get the cheapest car, true, but that is not going to drive me to look into any Korean/American cars. This inspite of considering their insurance rates, buying price , rebates etc. It probably doesn't sound very logical, but makes me feel better.
I am not into buying SUV's either.
I am still looking for some input on this:-
ABS vs. no ABS
Now back to the most confusing shopping I've ever done..( and I thought I liked shopping!!!)
I was a little apprehensive about ABS too but I've had it on my last 2 cars now and I can honestly say I've never even noticed it. It doesn't kick in unless you're in a real emergency.I think it's good to have and you usually get an insurance discount if you do.
Sounds like buying in Columbus will work well for you. You can get your insurance from a company like Geico. My son bought his car in Columbus also but got it insured for Virginia over the phone from them.
I still think your 3 original choices are very good ones. Given the way gas prices are going, I'd look at a frugal gas-sipper like those over a larger car even if the bigger ones cost a bit more to insure. The practicality of the Matrix might give it a little bit of an edge but only you can tell which one you prefer to drive. I admit I'm partial to Toyota over Pontiac for the better resale value.
Be sure to check out the Subaru Impreza and Saab 9-2X. The 9-2X isn't selling well and seems to have a $5000 Manufacturer-Dealer Rebate.
I still don't understand why my Infiniti I35 is rated 'B' by State Farm. Its average drivers tend to be older, drive conservatively and the I is relatively safe. (not necessarily the best, but better than some other cars out there) But then again, the I35's buyers are still younger than ES330 buyers...
Sounds like you have the perfect friend. Be sure to drag him along whenever you walk into a dealership and offer to buy him lunch or dinner in return for his help.
Depending on the car, there isn't anything wrong with buying American/Korean. With American cars, you just have to look for a model that is more reliable. (Taurus, Sable, Century, etc) The Koreans offer great values and most of them tend to be reliable.
Be sure to speak with an insurance agent before buying a car to see how much it might cost to insure the car you'd like.
There are less dealers for those vehicles in the MIdwest, so if you're new to car ownership you get more service and dealer choices if you go with Toyota and Honda.
I called Proggressive today. They gave me a much better quote than what I got online. I quoted a 2002 and 2005 Civic LX and a 2002 and 2005 Acura RSX. All around the same price, 1300 for 6 months Insurance was actually a little cheaper with the newer cars. What the heck? I thought it was the other way around. I didn't even give my SS# because I didn't want my credit report pulled, so since I have good credit I think it might even go down a little more. Tomorrow I'm going to call a few other places and see what they give me.
I really don't know which to go with now. Price is an issue for me, but on the other hand I feel once I go over a certain amount.. the extra few hundred or so doesn't matter much if I do get a used car and have to fix it every few months. I planned on going with a certified used, but I don't know much about that or how reliable that is either. And again, if it comes out to almost the same price as a new, 2005.... Why not go with a 2005? Am I missing something here?
And now I think I'm leaning more towards the Acura. But I'm not going to be able to get anywhere to see the cars in person for at least a few days and test drive anytime soon..so now this is driving me nuts. lol. Ugh.
A newer car will have a lower chance of needing a repair in the first few years of ownership, therefore a lower insurance rate.
The Civic and RSX share a platform, so they should be similar in a few ways. If the price difference between a used 2002 and a new 2005 is minimal, why not go for the 05? I know that's what I would do. You get the new car warranty, smell and a car with about 0-100 miles on it. Plus resale will be slightly higher in a few years.
If you like the Civic, get a 2005 Civic. If you like the Acura RSX, get a 05 RSX. But the 9-2X looks pretty good and Saab has a truckload of incentives on it right now. The 9-2X board here has people posting prices for Aero models for around $21,000... A bargain in my book. The Saab also could be considered a luxury car- don't really know how that will affect insurance rates.
Comments
Sorry, wouldn't buy an Impala. Way too big for my tastes, and coming from a GM town, I have a phobia of anything GM-made.
Thanks for the input, but unfortunately none of you have done anything to convince me to buy a used car -- if anything, you've shifted my opinion even more in favour of buying new. Some of you make great points that may be useful for other people with different tastes, financial situations, living in different areas, etc, so the points are valid, they just aren't valid for me.
Here's my arguments so far:
1) As a student with no savings (aside from a small downpayment possibly), I will finance most of the cost. New car financing deals can be had for 3%, whereas my bank will charge me at least 7% (and this will go up over the next few years, since interest rates will be rising). Over 4 years, a $16,000 used car loan would cost at least twice as much as a $22,000 new car loan ($2800 vs $1400).
2) Variety. At least 90% of used Mazda3s and Corollas (at a quick scan of local dealer websites) are silver or tan. Eww. I would also prefer a stick shift, which could be cheaper to get in a used car theoretically, but they're really hard to find, especially if you are picky about the combination of other options. For a quick search: of 355 Corollas in my area, 20 of those are actually a colour I like, and only 2 have manual and the other add-ons I want (a/c, remote key entry) - this doesn't give me a whole lot of bargaining power (not to mention, since they're 2+ hours away from my home, it makes the whole shopping process difficult).
I'm not saying that I wouldn't buy a used car (though just looking at the market around here, I'd probably buy a 1-year old over a 2 or 3 year old; overall there isn't a huge difference in price in that 2nd year, but there are options available on newer cars that aren't there with the older ones - especially if I want to buy a Mazda 3, which only came out last year). However, I'm still not convinced to buy used over new. There are just certain things that don't come used...
True, but as someone just starting out with no savings, maybe you should wait for those things. Yes, you have to pay a higher percent loan for a used car, but if you got one for around $10,000 (and plenty of reliable used cars can be had for that price) rather than $16,000 you would have lower payments and might even be able to save up some money for that new car.
Anyone can tell you a good local mechanic to take car to and for around $20 they will look it over for you. No, they won't catch everything, but probably the most important things. And no mechanic has a vested interest in letting a customer buy a car with problems. There are so many good, reliable used cars out there now. If reliability is your issue, a used Toyota or Honda will be nearly bulletproof and will last for many years. No, it won't be as cute or exciting as you want (although my manual Civic was fun to drive) but they won't break down, cost much to repair, and will get pretty good gas mileage too.
That being said, if you insist on new, the Mazda3 is a great looking car. You won't go wrong with it. I think your idea of internet pricing first is a good one, because then the salesperson won't have prejudged you on age. The key is to be as informed as possible in advance. And if you encounter salespeople who brush you off or ask when you are bringing your husband or boyfriend with you (this has happened to me many times, a hoot because my husband knows nothing and has zero interest in cars) your knowledge will give you confidence.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
If you do find a used car you like, take it to a RECCOMMENDED shop for an inspection. You will NOT pay 20.00 as someone suggested. You will pay a lot more than that for an intense inspection.
If you buy used, you will pay a lot less money but do expect to have a repair bill once in awhile.
And, in my not so humble opinion, with a used car, the color should be the LAST thing to worry about.
No one "right" answer for the questions you ask.
I sold the camry to carmax for $11,400. I do not know that the 5 yo accord is going for, but according to kbb, the value would have been somewhare around $9500.
So, in that case, I was better off buying new.
You will GENERALLY pay $75-100 for a thorough examination of the vehicle. I believe that a lot of the AAA approved shops through certain AAA branches have a $75 deal.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
Go to cartalk.com's Mechan-X-Files (http://www.cartalk.com/content/mechx/find.html), enter your zip code and pick the most convenient from the list.
Also check your credit union to see if they have pre-negotiated prices with certain dealers. That's if you want to avoid the hassles. Some people love to negotiate.
-juice
Are you aware of the impact of a stick shift when you sell or trade this car in the future? It will be much harder to sell privately, and as a trade it will bring significantly less than an equivalent car with an automatic. This is just how it is in the auto market.
Now, if you intend to keep your auto for a long time, it will make less of a difference. But, in general, a stick shift is tougher to find a buyer for, and because of this, is of less value to a dealer as a trade-in.
Now, as a new college grad, you probably don't think much about this. You intend to drive the wheels off this new car. But in a few months you get a nice job and meet the love of your life at you new company. You are married in a year and a half. And surprise, there is a young jezebel on the way. This happens in less than 3 years in the future, and you've got a 4 year auto loan. And that new Corella, Civic, Mazada 3 just isn't going to be able to handle 3 people and diaper bags, stoller, playpen, etc for the weekend trips to the grandparents. (Hubby's not going to sell his Mustang, dang it if impending fatherhood is going to impact his 'sporty' look. Anyway, one of the first things a guy does when he get married is sell his wife's car... Been there, done it, twice.)
But who wants my 5-speed little car??????
Just something else to think about.
Yeah, 5 speeds can be VERY hard to sell down the road. for every shopper who wants one, there are twenty others who hate them.
I was talking more about used cars. Unless it's a really bad color, the rest of the deal is MUCH more important!
At least in my opinion.
Life is too short...
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
As I switch over to a Triumph TR6 web site.
I deal with this everyday.
It will just fine, esp. in a wagon form (i.e., Matrix and Mazda hatch.) Ok, maybe not the playpen. No reason to not buy a compact because a few years down the road one may start a family and have kids. Unless these twins/triplets have already been concieved...
I would stay away, however, from 2-door cars - too impractical for anybody except a committed bachelor/bachelorette....
On used cars it's even more crucial to not focus on color because a) it's hard to find one with your color scheme and option combination and b) if you do find one with your color scheme it'll be harder to negotiate because you just love that color so much and will probably end up paying more for it.
I don't ever plan on up-sizing. A four-door car is a four-door car. Unless your kids are 16 and 5'10", a small car is not a problem of fit. Not to mention, I have serious doubts that I will have any children in the next 6 years, if ever. My concerns right now are more about travel/exploration - and a small car makes a huge difference when you're driving cross-country.
Focusing too much on the practicality of cars just takes the whole fun out of ownership. If I really wanted to maximize every single penny, I'd buy a bus pass, and just take a cab when I need to buy groceries or travel after the buses stop running. But there's a non-monetary value to the convenience of being able to travel when I want, where I want, not having to wait in the freezing cold for a bus to come.
By the same logic, there are other nonmonetary features of car values. And the happier you are with the exact features of your car, the longer you will want to keep it. A manual transmission may be harder to sell, but it's cheaper on gas, and more importantly, it keeps you engaged while driving, preventing driver boredom and thus making accidents less risky (especially for me, since that's my biggest driving problem - spacing out). By the same story, I could save $5000 by buying a one-year-old Mazda 3 instead of a new one (well, it works out closer to $3000 when you factor in financing rates) - but being the first production year, it also has problems with air-conditioning, and probably some underdetermined faults that are typical of being the first year of a run. The expense of those repairs, of renting a car while it's in the shop, the stress, etc, is something that isn't factored into the initial price - though it will much likely be factored in when it comes time to sell the car.
Finally, on the colour/manual thread.. there is a correlation between what people want - people with similar tastes like similar packages. I want a black car; not coincidentally, black cars are more likely than other colours of car to have stick shifts. It's the sporty taste. You won't see a tan car with a stick, but you'll see lots of black ones. In fact, to get the Mazda 3 GT sporty model, of the 3 or 4 I've seen on the resale market already, ALL of them are black, and half of them are sticks. So in this case, it would likely increase the resale value.
Other reasons to buy new: I can take advantage of the $500 graduate rebate; I'm thinking of doing a cross-country trip, and it would be much easier to fly one way, pick up the car on the coast, and then drive it back. Much Much easier to arrange with a new car (can negotiate over phone/email and have the deal complete before I leave home) than with a used car (bad idea to not look at it first). Driving both ways would be inefficient, but doing the whole trip with no car would suck - and there are so many places you just can't get to on the Greyhound or train. Also: that new car smell, the fact that I've waited so long for this moment that I want to do it right, the idea that my tastes don't change much and I'll still enjoy this car for years to come; a higher resale value when I do sell it (at least $1000, cutting the immediate cost difference down to less than $2000 for the new car); etc.
I won't be promoted to make more money in a few years and thus want a nicer car. I'll be starting in the middle range (jobs I'm currently interviewing for have salaries around $50K+), but I don't plan to stay in that field forever. Once I get the experience and deal with the finances, I will move toward more independence in my job - positions in the non-profit sector, which pay less, and/or some freelance work, so I'd like to buy the car now, and be able to keep it for a long time. I doubt that I will be "up-sizing" anywhere in the near future.
Don't listen to me, but listen to isellhondas, he's a very knowledgable and experienced auto salesperson - if he says manuals are a tough sell, believe him.
And what do I know about playpens and strollers. I've never had any kids.
And about buying what you want and not focusing on practicality - I'm into that. I've owned several Corvettes, and talk about impractical cars!!!! And I now own 3 vehicles. One for me, one for the wife, and ..... oh, yes, one for the cat.
The things people are putting out there are for you to think about. And when you come back in here 2 years from now, we'll remember you. And the 'We told you so's' will come flying out.
Another of my opinions is coming.... Your idea of buying a car long distance, flying to it, and driving it home. This just doesn't sound like a good idea to me at all. First off, salesmen have been known to 'fib'. With your inexperience, dealing long distance with a purchase will just magnify greatly the possibility for 'problems'.
"Oh, you wanted a 5-speed? I must have missed that. Oh, yes, it does say that in my email, but that was a mistake. We haven't had a 5-speed in that model in years. But just look over here at this nice automatic. It's got 3 other options you don't want, after market mag wheels, scotchguard interior, wearever wax, a different color, and is $3,000 more than we quoted. But you are 2,000 miles away from home, don't know where any other dealers in the city are located, and ok, since we did have a little miscommunication on this, I think I can get that difference knocked down to only $2,800."
And.... I've bought several new cars. And I really, really don't think it is a good idea to strike out across the country in a brand, spanking new car. Get those first 600-1,000 'break-in' miles on there. I've bought 2 cars 'down the road' about 60 miles that were so out of alignment I had to hang onto the wheel to keep them on the road. One of them I already knew about and specifically told them to have it aligned before I returned to pick it up. Did they do it? NOoooooo. Think about buying that wonderful new car, far far away from home. Driving it off the lot and, what, bad alignment when you get it up to speed on the freeway? Stange noise when it first starts up cold? That dreaded 'check engine light' comes on the second day? Do you want to spend the next 2 or 3 days of your vacation watching TV and reading the magazines in the waiting room while the dealer 'works the bugs' out of your new car?
Buy this car in your hometown. If something isn't going right in the 'deal', you can leave the dealership and work it out. Then when it is bought, get some miles and time on it. At least one month and 1,000 miles.
"A manual transmission may be harder to sell, but it's cheaper on gas, and more importantly, it keeps you engaged while driving, preventing driver boredom and thus making accidents less risky (especially for me, since that's my biggest driving problem - spacing out".
A manual may also be more reliable and less costly to maintain long-term. I'm not positive about that but i've personally never had a problem with a manual transmission in any vehicle i've owned (5 or 6: i've lost count).
I agree 100% about being actively engaged in the driving experience with a manual!!! It seems you'd have much more fun driving a manual too and that is important.
Hopefully you're inclined to take good care of the vehicle and drive it for a long time. Who cares how easy it is to sell, if you drive it for a decade?
My wife and I have always driven manuals, until the past few years when we had to buy a mini-van to haul the family. We sold a 4DR toyota corolla manual which was 10yrs old with 183K for 2K. The 2DR honda accord coupe was cumbersome to get the little ones in and out but it was great w.r.t. drivability / response / fun / mileage / reliability.
But much to my dissapointment - the 2DR suffered a fractured cam-shaft leading to almost immediate valve damage at 150K. This vehicle was intended to go another 60K... Even in non-working condition, we got pretty good money for it. Had it been working, it was probably worth 3-4K private party.
Forced into another vehicle, I compromised and moved to a '02 4cyl 4DR honda accord automatic. i love the vehicle, but i definitely miss the manual.
my criteria has changed with time.
If I were you, I'd consider a used 4DR manual, 3-4yrs old maybe, CARFAXed ($25 is cheap), checked out by a local mechanic knowlegable about that vehicle (isell was right - expect to pay more, at least $50 or $75 for a good inspection - also cheap). I'd look for something getting good mileage, with good reliability marks and decent depreciation and reasonable cost to own.
While it doesn't have to be an "appliance" vehicle, it should be getting you where you need to go, not constantly in the shop. Personally, I'd be extremely flexible on color, leaning more towards vehicle condition / maintenance as critically important to me over trim-level, and any gagetry / accessories / extras.
Now as to "spacing out", only you know what you mean by that. I'd get that checked out first before I went shopping.
Right now I think I'm going to go with a used Honda Civic, possibly an Accord. Although lately I've been looking at Acura Rsx's. I want something small, reliable and easy on gas. The lowest year I'd go is 2002. I'd like the price to be around $10,000 and 15,000, the lower the better but whatever.. I'm more concerned with the total monthly payments and I know that can make the total cost more with interest. My FICO score is 666. I pay all my balances off each month, except for one card that is almost paid off and will be paid off before I get a car.
One thing that is confusing me is I'm seeing 2002 Honda Civics for about 15,000 and brand new 2005s for around the same price. Makes me think I'd be better off going with a new one if the 2002 is going to cost more to fix it every month. I know a lot of it has to do with extra features which most of them I don't really care about.
Then there's the thing with insurance. I had my license when I was 16. I think that was good for 1 or 2 years, I never renewed it because I didn't have a car to drive anymore. So it expired. (stupid, I know that now) I'm 23 and just got it back. I've been going to sites like Progressive.com and doing quotes just to get a general idea on insurance costs with the different models and makes. They recommended $359 a month on 2002 Civic. I guess I need to go with full coverage because I'm going to finance or take out a loan. But none of the sites say what exactly full coverage is. They want you to customize everything. I also don't want to put my SS# in to do a quote because I don't want a million inquiry marks on my credit report.
Also anyone know any sites to find out how reliable a local dealer is? I want to do a Carfax report, but would also like to read reviews on a dealer if there are any. I went to dealerrater.com, but not many listed in my area. I'm from RI.
So any advice on where to start or whatever?
If I need to post this in another board, please let me know.
I am a new graduate, 26 yr old, on the verge of landing a job. I have all loans paid off, apart from some credit card debt (~$2000). I will need to buy my first car for commuting, which will mostly be in Pittsburgh, PA. I do some road trips too, so will need to travel for longer periods in the car. Ideally I’d like to keep the car for 7/8 yrs. My priorities in descending order are: Reliability, Safety, Fuel economy, Performance, Handling, looks, color etc. My budget is $20,000 & I need to purchase the car in May/June this year.
Being a newbie, I have done a lot of research about what might be suitable for me. Here is what I came up with: I am leaning towards a certified pre-owned car (as opposed to a new one). As for leasing I can’t seem to make up my mind.Based on my requirements, I ended up narrowing my choices to: (All automatic transmission)
Honda Civic (a 2003/2004 model)
Toyota Corolla (2004)
Toyota Matrix (2004)
Here is what I would like help with:
1. Feedback/comments on my choices (Are there any issues about the models mentioned I need to know?, your preferences for the three, etc). Are there any other models I should be looking into? I am not buying any American cars.
2. Should I consider leasing at all, for the first year (for any positive reason that you might think of), or buying new for that matter?
3. I am relatively new driver, so when it comes to ABS, I think I will be able to unlearn the old techniques with less difficulty. But after having read quite a few complaints on the NHTSA website (Civic & Corolla, 04 & 05 models) regarding the ABS systems, I am not sure if the fault lies with the system on these models or the drivers. Now I debate on if I should get ABS or not. Advise please.
4. Should I consider an AWD vs. a FWD, if I have to drive in some snow and hilly areas? Would it really have an advantage over a FWD?
I appreciate all your comments and insights. I might add a few more concerns that need answering as we go along. Thank you very much.
You are bound to get plenty of opinions on your purchasing plans, so I'll start by throwing in my $0.02 (you can just add that to your base salary). All of the vehicles you mentioned are great choices for used vehicles, and I don't think you can make a "wrong" choice there. So, it's basically down to personal preference.
If I were in your situation, I would not consider leasing. New vehicles generally take the biggest depreciation hit during the first year, so your payments would be higher than necessary, and you'd be stuck with this decision all over again in 12 months. Leasing for longer at such a young stage in your career is usually not a good idea, as a lease tends to lock you in for several years. Getting out of a lease if your income or other circumstances change can be VERY costly.
Since it's your first car purchase and you're just starting a new job, I would go with a used vehicle. That way, you can keep your payments at a really affordable level. If your income goes up significantly, you can always upgrade in a year or two, and if it goes down, you're not saddled with a big payment or being severely upside-down in terms of the vehicle's value vs. what you owe.
I'll let others chime in and offer comments as well - plus, I don't feel qualified to comment on questions 3 & 4!
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
-juice
Then I rented one for a weekend. It is a pretty nice vehicle and I got about 33mpg for the weekend which was pretty good for that size of vehicle.
Personally, I would buy a used Vibe rather than a new one as you'll save more in the long run.
-juice
Since I currently live in Columbus, OH I was planning on buying the car here, and driving it upto Pittsburgh. Are there any issues that I might have to face with insurance/dealer/financing since I will essentially provide a PA address?
Also just out of curiosity, how is color going to affect my insurance rates? Even though I am not hung up on color (won't make my decision based on it), I am partial to red.
I saw some CPO listings for 2005 Civic & Corolla, with avg miles of 6,000 on them. For the same given price and trim levels ( since both these don't depreciate much, seems like), do you suggest I get '05 model?
As for the Pontiac vibe, I haven't looked into it, but will do so. Even though the vibe and matrix are built on the same platform, I don't overall trust GM very much... more of a judgemental block I guess, but alas!!!
Thanks
But have you tried the Mazda3? It's a fun to drive car and fairly reliable.
The Korean car companies (Kia & Hyundai) sell decent compact cars also. I'd take a look. Elantras and Spectras can be had for several thousand less than a comparable Civic or Corolla.
About AWD, it adds weight and lowers fuel economy but in some areas it's an absolute must-have. I'd say if you see snow more than four months of the year (November, December, January, February) or if you get a lot of snow, it's worth the upgrade. In this case, I'd recommend the Subaru Impreza/Saab 9-2X or a smaller crossover- Hyundai Tuscon, Kia Sportage, Honda CR-V, Toyota RAV4, etc.
Civics and Corollas don't depreciate much. Same goes for Accords and Camrys. I have a 99 Civic with almost 100K miles on it, huge stains in the carpet and a few fairly large scratches in the bumpers. The car is a mild eye-sore and is essentially a beater. KBB still says it's worth almost $6,000. I don't know why somebody would pay that much for my car. I only paid $12,000 for it new.
If $20,000 is your budget, you could try looking at some used (2001-2002) CPO entry level luxury cars. The Infiniti G20 is reliable (although not much fun) as is the I30/I35 and the Acura Integra. Don't try to get a used Lexus at that price- it'll have quite a few miles on it and the prices will be outrageous. About the only thing, in my opinion, with better resale than a Civic, Camry, Accord or Corolla would be a Lexus. Those things don't depreciate much.
Be sure to pre-arrange financing or get pre-approved from the auto manufacturer if you plan to finance through the car company.
And test drive many different cars before reaching a decision.
You really don't want to be stuck with a car like this: :lemon:
More utility and there are less of them on the road. My mother has a Protege5 and LOVES it. A great used car value. I have a Mazda3 5-door and I really liek mine.
I had also considered the Vibe/Matrix and Focus. All seemed like nice cars.
And don't forget your grad discount. I believe Mazda, Pontiac, and Ford all have one.
Good Luck!
Jason
An agent should explain each of the coverages. You might not necessarily need 'full coverage'. I don't carry Medical, because this covers other people's injuries that are riding in my car. Everyone that rides with me has their own insurance, or, my opinion is that if I cause them injury, they can sue me and collect under my liability. Many new cars, if that is what you are buying, has coverage that will include towing, while it is under warranty. Therefore you do not need towing insurance for first 3 years/36,000 miles (or whatever).
Get to know what the coverages are and if you really need them. And get to know about 'deductable' amounts. A higher deductable can save you a lot of money.
But horrors - a quote of $369 A MONTH on a 2002 Civic!!!!!!!!!! I pay only about $250 for 6 months for a 2002 Accord EXV6!!!!!! But then, I'm an old fa*t and live in a town with very low insurance rates. This still seem extremely high!!!!! Expecially if you are female!!!!!!!
For the poster wanting to know about insurance I would check out Geico. The phone operator can explain to you what full coverage requires and give you an estimate. If you are male, it's going to be horrendously expensive until you are at least 26 with no accidents. For single young women it isn't cheap either but nowhere as bad as for males. A good reason to get a much older car and only carry liability!
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
http://www.statefarm.com/media/release/vehclrate_04.pdf
Choose a vehicle with an "A" rating to get the lowest insurance rates.
Note from the link that the Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla, and Toyota Matrix all get the "C - ie. worst" rating for insurance damage and theft. Therefore insurance for these cars will cost more than other cars.
Although there are plenty of exceptions, In general, the least costly cars to insure are the somewhat boring medium to large size 4 door sedans. Sports cars and sporty cars can be costly to insure.
Some of that seems counter-intuitive, for instance the convertibles from Audi and BMW actually have lower theft rates. :confuse:
But insurance does represent a high percentage of your total outlay for a young driver, so do check that list and speak to your insurance agent before you pick a car. A former neighbor bought a Mustang Cobra for his kid and they couldn't afford to keep it so he sold it after a year or so. Insurance was UNBELIEVABLY expensive for that car.
Honda Element looks good, 30% discount plus A rated. Check out Miata, 40% and B, not bad. Vibe > Matrix > Corolla if you shop those. Highlander looks solid but they cost a bit more. Outback and Forester also look good.
Are you into small car-based SUVs? Element and Forester are pretty affordable, high teens.
-juice
Top 10 insurance-friendly cars (2004)
Make Model Style 5-yr avg insurance cost (Chicago area) MSRP
Chrysler PT Cruiser 4dr Wagon (2.4L 4cyl 5M) $4,240 $17,490
GMC Safari SLE AWD 3dr Minivan (4.3L 6cyl 4A) $4,298 $27,440
Dodge Caravan SE 4dr Minivan (2.4L 4cyl 4A) $4,357 $21,130
Saturn ION 1 4dr Sedan (2.2L 4cyl 5M) $4,373 $10,430
Pontiac Sunfire 2dr Coupe (2.2L 4cyl 5M) $4,389 $14,930
Jeep Liberty Sport 4WD 4dr SUV (2.4L 4cyl 5M) $4,408 $19,890
Saturn L300 1 4dr Sedan (2.2L 4cyl 4A) $4,410 $16,370
Volvo S40 4dr Sedan (1.9L 4cyl Turbo 5A) $4,420 $24,700
Saab 38600 Linear 2.3t 4dr SportWagon (2.3L 4cyl Turbo 5M) $4,422 $32,525
Buick Century Special Edition 4dr Sedan (3.1L 6cyl 4A) $4,426 $25,805
Source: Edmunds.com
Some cars that are not the very safest actually are lower to insure because the people who buy them (minivan owners, for example) tend to drive very conservatively. According to this article, the best method is to compare comparably priced cars.
Best is to just ask an insurance agent what it would cost to insure the cars you are interested in.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
The reason I wanted to purchase a car in Columbus : I am a female & single to boot. The same old concerns of being considered naive and getting ripped by a dealer plague me. I have never owned a car and do not have a passion for them (not car tech savy), apart from the utilarian.... all adding up to the fact that it may not be wise to walk in alone by myself into the dealership. I have a perfect friend here in Columbus, to go shopping with me (male, loves cars, knows them well), who will go with me, as long as I do my research.
I am trying to get the cheapest car, true, but that is not going to drive me to look into any Korean/American cars. This inspite of considering their insurance rates, buying price , rebates etc. It probably doesn't sound very logical, but makes me feel better.
I am not into buying SUV's either.
I am still looking for some input on this:-
ABS vs. no ABS
Now back to the most confusing shopping I've ever done..( and I thought I liked shopping!!!)
-juice
Sounds like buying in Columbus will work well for you. You can get your insurance from a company like Geico. My son bought his car in Columbus also but got it insured for Virginia over the phone from them.
I still think your 3 original choices are very good ones. Given the way gas prices are going, I'd look at a frugal gas-sipper like those over a larger car even if the bigger ones cost a bit more to insure. The practicality of the Matrix might give it a little bit of an edge but only you can tell which one you prefer to drive. I admit I'm partial to Toyota over Pontiac for the better resale value.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
I still don't understand why my Infiniti I35 is rated 'B' by State Farm. Its average drivers tend to be older, drive conservatively and the I is relatively safe. (not necessarily the best, but better than some other cars out there) But then again, the I35's buyers are still younger than ES330 buyers...
Sounds like you have the perfect friend. Be sure to drag him along whenever you walk into a dealership and offer to buy him lunch or dinner in return for his help.
Depending on the car, there isn't anything wrong with buying American/Korean. With American cars, you just have to look for a model that is more reliable. (Taurus, Sable, Century, etc) The Koreans offer great values and most of them tend to be reliable.
Be sure to speak with an insurance agent before buying a car to see how much it might cost to insure the car you'd like.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
I really don't know which to go with now. Price is an issue for me, but on the other hand I feel once I go over a certain amount.. the extra few hundred or so doesn't matter much if I do get a used car and have to fix it every few months. I planned on going with a certified used, but I don't know much about that or how reliable that is either. And again, if it comes out to almost the same price as a new, 2005.... Why not go with a 2005? Am I missing something here?
And now I think I'm leaning more towards the Acura. But I'm not going to be able to get anywhere to see the cars in person for at least a few days and test drive anytime soon..so now this is driving me nuts. lol. Ugh.
The Civic and RSX share a platform, so they should be similar in a few ways. If the price difference between a used 2002 and a new 2005 is minimal, why not go for the 05? I know that's what I would do. You get the new car warranty, smell and a car with about 0-100 miles on it. Plus resale will be slightly higher in a few years.
If you like the Civic, get a 2005 Civic. If you like the Acura RSX, get a 05 RSX.
But the 9-2X looks pretty good and Saab has a truckload of incentives on it right now. The 9-2X board here has people posting prices for Aero models for around $21,000... A bargain in my book. The Saab also could be considered a luxury car- don't really know how that will affect insurance rates.