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Nissan Titan vs. Chevrolet Silverado/GMC Sierra 1500
Which one will you drive? why?
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so let me ask you...if you wouldnt consider another truck besides GMC/Chevy...why did you post here?
"Which one will you drive? why? "
and I gave an answer
Ok this is in reply to the ford topic where you said you sell nissans. I am just curious if you or anyone you know get upset when someone doesnt like the product. I found this to be the way at a few toyota dealerships when I was looking at the tundras. The salesman asked my opinion and I said i didnt like it because the backseat was to small. He blew up and got all bent out of shape. He asked my opinion and I gave it. I cant comment on the titan because I have only seen pics and the performance figures.
the only thing that gets on my nerves is when people make a buying decision without all the information, or incorrect information. for example, a guy bought a ranger with the ABS option instead of the frontier. he told me that it was because the frontier didnt offer it as an option. i told him thats because its standard.
if you like the competition, fine...i just want to be able to provide the info. my customer needs to make an educated decision.
having said that, the titan is a true full size truck with full size capabilities, where the tundra is more of a soccer-mom's truck. ;-)
now back on topic, you may keep a bowtie around your neck for life, but i would check out the titan on december 1st...you might just end up on the 'shift_' bandwagon! lol
I've read the stats and it seems that Nissan has done on it's first attempt what Toyota hasn't done in two tries.
That said,when Nissan (or ANY mfg) comes out with a big block gas powered 3/4 ton I'll check it out.The Ford V10 was a bit anemic and the new Dodge Hemi has 100 lb less torque than my 8.1. I had hoped Dodge would do better with thier now discontinued V10
Until somebody builds a more comfortable,more powerfull truck,I'll stick with my GMC,questionable quality and all.
kip
As far as the ford V-10 they are thirsty. I drive one around the plant at work (crew cab long bed 2wd) alot of idling starting and stopping and alot of offroading. It averages about 7-8 mpg
Im not in the truck market now bowke. About a month ago put a chunk of change down on some land and I am (contractor not me) building a house in a little over a year
In 2000 there were plans to have the V10 upgraded to a new cylinder head and intake manifold design that would significantly raise both HP and torque. However, since the new Hemi was already on the drawing board it was decided that much more could be done with the new Hemi engine and likely performance improvements would render the V10 as obsolete.
A V10 built off of the current Hemi is is being talked about, but it will likely find its way into 3/4 ton and up platforms.
There is also a displacement and power increase planned for the Hemi V8 as well.
Dusty
kip
For me, I like the original version prototype Nissan which came out about two years ago. The Titan looks too similar to the Frontier. Course looks are subjective but I can't see paying for something I don't like looking at.
Saw the new F150 and the sides of the bed looks like the Ave. Got to be 7'6" to put anything into the bed.....
as far as the looks, nissan wanted SOME brand recognition. in a few years, they will probably redesign the front...but until then, they want people to look at it and go "that looks like a nissan".
Granted Toyota has nothing to rival the Titan, but the Tundra is the best at what it is (and thats not a truck for soccer moms). I haven't looked at what the Titan has other than a lights out hoss of a motor, so I will keep an open mind. I would never buy one though just from the image Nissan has always carried with their trucks and SUVs.
I mean now disrespect with this post as similar criticism about Toyotas has made me mad at times as well. If Nissan gets involved with NASCAR, I may change my mind, though.
Alpha T was the concept truck....
http://www.edmunds.com/news/conceptcarspotlight/articles/46354/ar- ticle.html
When I bought the '01 GMC,I chose it over the Chev cuz I hated the high hood on the HDs.
I like the new F150s looks
And anyone who compares the Tundra to the Titan is dumber than a snow-mobile in Canton, MS (hehe, Titans manufacturing place). Apples and oranges! I say this after bowke has tried to bring it up about 4 times. Its not saying much for this truck hes trying so desperately to sell, when he pitches it against a vehicle that is tons smaller in every way. Are you trying to tell me that Toyota tried to build a truck the same size as the silverado/ram/f-150 with a 5+L engine and everything magically shrank on the assembly line. Don't sound so clueless, they knew exactly what they were building and are selling exactly as many as they want. Just for the record I don't really like em, but you talk about uneducated comments -- bowke, you are just one in a million blurting out that very thing when you continually push that debate.
Thanks.
I was just making the point that this fella is complaining about the very thing he has done the most of. Dunno if I said it, but the Silverados my faves by far -- but I just felt like this guy needed to realize some of the ways he was defying his own advice, thats all. Happy turkey day!
"i like the looks of the f150 better than the titan myself, but its just not as much all-around truck as the nissan. "
What is your deffinition of an 'all around truck'? I like longbed extended cab myself, others have other needs. Does your Nissan meet them?
That V-8 ? What is it's history? The Triton and the Vortex have been in service long enough to know how they will work, but I hesitate to buy the first year of anything. Is the auto tranny a proven unit in heavy duty service, or is it brand new?
The Nissan may be a good truck, but to say it is a better "all around truck" than the F-150 is premature.
Harry
They will eventually add other things like 3/4 and 1 tons with a diesel option but to even suggest they do that the first year is a little much. One of the biggest differences between Japanese managed and NA managed car companies is the way they market their vehicles. The Japanese have been very successful with keeping there costs down by limiting options available. They find out what the majority of consumers want in each particular segment and they package their vehicles to match.
It has been very successful because they are not trying to be all things to all people. For example, The "pretender" Tundra is actually a very profitable vehicle that sells very well for Toyota. It might not reach the numbers of the F150 but it makes Toyota money and that is what counts. It's number have been steadily climbing each year.
There are many people who feel just like you, but there are also many people who don't feel that way.
So, although I understand where you are coming from, I think the pretender label is a little harsh. I slao, tend to agree with Nissan's strategy! After all, Nissan and Toyota are making a s--tload of money and the domestics aren't.
[http://www.autosite.com/editoria/asmr/svtruck.asp]
Don't think so. Tundra sales have never met Toyota's expectations. At 76,537 units in 2002, it has a long way to go to beat the F150s 620,197 from the same year. It only beat the Avalanche by a little over 6000 units, and the Tundra is a heck of lot more "real truck" and aesthetically appealing. Dakota, S10, and even Tacoma (117,443) outsell it.
Dusty
Well, just a few years ago Nissan wasn't doing all that well. But, a point well taken. Most Asian nameplates build more on demand philosophy, the domestics build more on speculation. But that too is minor in this case.
The real problem in the past years is the informally declared war GM is waging against Ford. GM has continued heavy rebates, even on their most popular models just to keep market share away from Ford. Ford was destined to become the largest automobile manufacturer based on its market growth of the last decade and the ego-empire just won't sit idly by and let that happen.
GM has forsaken profit to keep its market share. Ford is still reeling from the disasterous Ford Explorer tire issue. Chrysler is colateral damage. It doesn't have the market depth to be isolated from the GM-Ford price war. With a compressed schedule of new product on the horizon, it takes Chrysler longer to recoup investments with smaller market share.
Asian companies have the luxury at the moment if higher customer loyalty. This allows shallow or no discount scenarios and holding on to a greater portion of their market segments. If the GM-inspired price war continues into next year, the outlook for Nissan, Toyota, Honda and others could become more tentative as well.
Regards,
Dusty
Your explantation of the demise of the profits for the American companies is interesting. You don't think the fact Ford's quality is/was crap; all the American car companies have high pension obligations, they all also have over capacity (maybe caused by trying to be everything to everybody), has anything to do with it? Just a thought.
Just to add to the current convo: hasn't Ford laid off a bunch of workers at least two different times over the last couple of years?
Some of my thoughts on tundra sales stem from the fact that EVERY year where I live Silverados and F-150s that retail for $32k-$35k can be had for $10k less than that. I have yet to see a rebate/mark down of more than $2500 on a tundra yet. At least down here, they are not having any trouble moving the ones they get and obviously the dealers don't have enough to go around. Now, these observations are simply that -- not good or bad toward any make.
There are a number of factors involved with the current state of the North American automobile market. But your previous comments were directed specifically towards profit, and that answer is directly related to the current price war. Ford still maintains a commanding lead in light duty pick-ups, and does well in big trucks, too. While the entire market is depressed at the moment Ford still has roughly the same share of the market lead over GM and Chrysler as they did four years ago.
Toyota had been in the full size LDPU market now long enough to establish a market percentage, and they have...albeit very, very small. They don't have to rely on rebates because they have never overestimated the market for their Tundra, and customer loyalty keeps their small market share stable.
To their credit, Nissan has taken a bold step in entering the fiercely competitive fullsize LDPU segment, especially at a time of downturn in the North American market. I think Nissan will be very successful, mainly because of Toyota's arrogance. The market be damned, Toyota builds vehicles their way because they can rely heavily on loyal customers, a large percentage of them willing to accept things the Toyota way just for the privilege of owning another Toyota. Toyota has become the GM of 20-30 years ago and someday they might suffer the same fate.
Nissan has taken a much more serious evaluation of what will sell and to do that they have made their LDPU entry very appealling to a broader range of PU buyer. They realize they are the new guys on the street with LDPU sheet metal. They realize the PU market has become very competitive, is filled with some of the best product from all of it's competition, and will have to compete on proof instead of hype.
Many of the same comments about the Titan have been said about the new Dodge RAM: it was "butt-*** ugly." In the case of the RAM, it was the rear seating was too small, but they gave you two regular length bed sizes, something Ford didn't do. On the Titan it's the bed is too small. The RAM has established a niche in an already crowded and competitive LDPU market. Yes, Dodge's unit sales are behind that of the F150 and Silverado/Sierra, but still almost five times better than Tundra. Without expansion, the RAM facility couldn't make numbers as large as GM and Ford anyway. Even with huge rebates, Dodge at least has made profit on the RAM where GM and Ford are barely doing so.
All of the negative comments heard so far about the Titan, just like the RAM, are predictably from people who already don't like Nissan and wouldn't be buying one if in a landslide of proof it could be proven to be the best product on the planet. That being said, statements about the Titan's prowess as a truck, real or otherwise, is just as likely to be driven by blind allegiance and tribalism as well.
The truth is that the Titan will likely appeal to some and not others whether based on rational evaluations or plain bias. The Titan will establish it's own market share based on the degree of customer acceptance, whatever that turns out to be.
Regards,
Dusty
I do not think the F-Series and the Silverado/Sierra sales will decline as a percentage of total vehicle sales in 2004. If the Titan is VERY succesful, it will motivate the domestics to improve their products, and we (customers) will all win.
Harry
Some say the Tundra is very succesful for Toyota, and Toyota may be satisfied, but they haven't motivated the domestics much.
Hopefully, this new genuine full sized entry from Nissan will change that and as you said, "we all win"
kip
So, the head scratching will have to continue for awhile until I decide, or the price is cut so low for the Titan that I just can't pass it up.
The actual Specs form GM Canada website:
Rear leg room 856/33.7 (mm/in.)(extended cab)
Nissan Specs
Rear Leg room 33.0 in. (king Cab)
The CC specs are, GM 39.1 in.
Nissan 40.4 in.
I wonder which one is posted wrong?