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Saab 9-7X

theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
in Saab
The new Saab SUV based off the GMT-360 platform (same as Envoy and company) will make its world debut at the 2004 New York Auto Show in April, 2004, and will go on sale about one year later. Initially, the 9-7X will be produced specifically for the United States and Canadian markets.

It will be very similar to the Rainier, coming in short-wheelbase only and offering the the inline six and 4.2L V8. It will be lowered a bit for a more sporting appearance, and may have an upgraded interior. This is just a stopgap model, plans are already underway for a true new model debuting much later in teh decade. Here's the initial sketch:

image

P.S.: It will have the shifter on the floor.
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Comments

  • vcjumpervcjumper Member Posts: 1,110
    On that Ranier!
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    Whoops. I meant it will have the ignition on the foor.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    if it is a 'Saab Rainier' the only way this vehicle will not get absolutely butchered in the automotive press will be if it has a unique and quality interior. Not a detroit interior.

    To me if they are committed to proceeding with this brand slander, then turbocharge the 6 to be unique......
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    Not a bad idea. Since the ads for Saab right now brag that the whole line is turbocharged. That'll make it unique.
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    The platform has been heavily modified to make it sportier (they should have done that for the SSR), so hopefully that means a new interior as well. Don't expect turbocharging any time soon.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    At least that will draw some buyers from the other models not just because there's a Saab badge plastered to the front but because it's sportier than the TrailBlazer, Envoy or Ranier.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    it would still make sense for Saab to engineer a turbo for the thing.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    just add a turbo to the 3.6 to make up for the small difference in horsepower between the 2.
    3.6 makes 245 non turbo- engineer a 35 horsepower turbo making 280 horsepower, five more than the 4.2 inline 6.
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    Actually the HF 3600 makes 260 HP in the STS. Only problem is it's a car engine. The HF engines can't tow squat, neither can the Northstars.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    I doubt saabers will be pulling yachts
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    you can always throw in a hybrid. The Prius has 295 pounds of torque! That'll tow like crazy. Then again, most Saab customers don't tow.
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    A 1000 lb towing capacity is not acceptable in a full out, BOF SUV. Bragging rights. Besides, Saab hopes to snag some new customers.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    295 Lb ft at ZERO rpm...LOL!
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    yeah.... 295 pounds of torque ought to tow your boat and the neighbor's boat!
  • buddhabmanbuddhabman Member Posts: 252
    Saab should add the low pressure turbo to both the V6 (280-290 HP) and V8 (290 -320 HP) motors.
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    The inline 4200s are getting a power boost to 290 next year anyway.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    they are?
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    The inline 4200 will be upgraded to 290 HP and 290 lb ft, as well as a few other changes:

    -A few internal improvements
    -Some software changes
    -A fuel economy improvement of 13%.
    -15% quieter at idle
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    will the 9-7X at least get a turbo and an ignition on the floor? I noticed that the 9-2X does not have the ignition on the floor, which might make some Saab loyalists mad.
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    It will have the ignition on the floor, but turbocharging is very unlikely.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    got the turbo but not the ignition on the floor. Hmmmmmm....
  • buddhabmanbuddhabman Member Posts: 252
    Remember, Saab has not had alot of time to re-engineer many things on the 9-2X (Subaru WRX) car before it comes to market. Some body panel changes (front hood), some interior trim (Forester dash pieces) so I imagine the ignition placement was not high on the list of changes/per cost to change.

    Hopefully they will have had more time and final approval input on changes with the 9-7X. Otherwise if it is a GM bargain bin Frankestein job they are going to get slaughtered in the press and in forums like this. I hope for the best, as we should be in the market for a car by 2005/6. I think/hope it will be a lesser SRX which is not a bad thing.
  • buddhabmanbuddhabman Member Posts: 252
    If Saab executes these new models properly, they should be a new force, kind of like the comeback of Infiniti.

    The 9-2X really needs an upgraded interior, the 9-3 needs to be as nice on the inside as it is out, with a competnet AWD system and all the new 9-3 bugs fixed. The 9-7X had better be right(interior, ride, features controls, relaibility) or they are going to get slaughtered. I am optimistic though.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    in the local paper today, there was an article about the 9-7X, with a big sketch like on the first post right there, the headline of the business section.
  • merc1merc1 Member Posts: 6,081
    They only way Saab is going to stage a comeback like Infiniti is if they manage to fool enough non-Saab traditionalist into buying these warmed-over vehicles. I doubt they can do that in sufficient numbers.

    M
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    the forthcoming 9-3 Hatch (actually wagon, but it will not be called that in NA).

    This car will be a Saab throughout. And it will be a very nice Saab indeed. Infiniti has a big old truck in its line up. If it still sells the I, it still has a warmed over Maxima as well.

    There is no reason Saab should be any worse off for mixing pretenders with the real thing.
  • buddhabmanbuddhabman Member Posts: 252
    Infiniti / Nissan cross platform sharing was key to them saving costs to be able to develop the G35. The Murano and FX are crossed also. The 9-2X is a stop gap admittedly. The 9-3 is new and based on a shared platform and the 9-7 is shared but supposed to be executed and detailed quite differently. We will see. Either way they have to get more than Saab traditionalist to buy. Saab is not going away though. The work of Saab (Styling) & Subaru (robust mechanicals) together in future projects could be great.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    the 9-2x is fine car because the WRX is a fine car.

    but the interior has no 'scandinavian appeal' of saab's products. its obviously a japanese design.

    no self respecting urban yuppie who wants a european car can go for something so obviously low buck middle market Asian. That ruins a huge part of brand image right there. Its a sport compact car dash for cryin out loud.

    no saabs have had boxer engines. boxers are subaru engines. saab fans will notice and care.

    people will buy this car for the car itself, not because it has any saab qualities to it.

    this is just opening up a marketing channel to sell more WRX's is all it is. The brass may think it will broaden Saab's appeal, but the end result will be to water down the brand till it blends in with the rest of the GM fold. It doens't do anything to strengthen brand image long term. All it does is enable Saab dealers to have a little more revenue in the interim. What is sacrificed is snob appeal. Or as we call it, market position.

    Saab would have been better off in the interim to broaden the appeal of the 9-3 even more.

    The VERY LEAST they could have done is given the car an interior worthy of Saab design. Something all new. Something reminiscient of contemporary artful design and not your punk teen neighbor's fartcan winged compact car.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    they could have brung over the 1.8 9-3 models from Sweden and price them where the 9-2X currently stands.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    GM doesn't know how to make money...well, that is. The only way they make money is by exploiting one car into many different forms. For example:

    05 Uplander = Montana SV6, Terraza, Relay

    Now with the TrailBlazer...OMG!!

    04 TrailBlazer = Envoy, Rainier, Ascender, Bravada, and now 9-7X!!!!

    Why so many forms??
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    they can spread out the engineering costs over all the different cars (or trucks) to make it more profitable. How much did it take to engineer the 9-7X? Not much. All you had to buy was the retooling of some factory equipment, an ignition on the floor, a Saab steering wheel, Saab wheels, and a Saab front fascia.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    I know all of that. But, I wouldn't buy them because of the average crash rating, lack of refinement, and the fact that side-curtains aren't available. I'll stick with Japanese thank you very much.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    I'm not exactly interested in BUYING a 9-7X either. I'm more interested in the 9-3, which isn't a rebadged Malibu.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    thank God that the 9-3 isn't a rebadged Malibu!!!
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    the 9-3 is quite affordable, after the financing and lease deals GM and Saab slapped on that car and they're still offering low lease rates on 9-3 Linear models, I think.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    yeah, and actually at end of 2k3 model year new base linears were advertised for not much over 21k.

    I would LOVE to pop on a new 9-3 lease but i have never leased before and am a bit skittish about it. at the same time every dime you spend on car payments goes down the tubes anyways. you just dont get enough miles leasing.
  • merc1merc1 Member Posts: 6,081
    There is a major difference between platform sharing and sticking a Saab front end onto a Chevy. Huge difference. The Saab 9-3 has nothing to do with the upcoming 9-7. The 9-3 is on global platform shared with Opel, and others, the 9-7 is just like the 9-2, a quick rebadge/grille of an entire car from someone else. There is nothing Saab about either the 9-2 or 9-7 past what you can see on the outside of the car.

    M
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    As I said before, the 9-7X was a much more complete engineering job than the 9-2X. The platform was re-engineered, and the fact that they took the time to move the ingnition to the floor probably means a different interior. All will be revealed at the NY show.
  • dan165dan165 Member Posts: 653
    As a former owner of a 2002 Bravada, I'll tell you it's an excellent base and motor. What I will also tell you that if GM put a little more money into the interior of the Oldsmobile it would have probably sold better. While we were very happy with the truck over all, sometimes we sit in other vehicles and think GM could have done just a bit more refining to make it better. I hope they do a real good job with this 9-7 as Saab seems to be on a roll as of late and they need to keep that going if they want to be a player with the other European players.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    "Before you trash the 9-2X wait to see what they do with the interior"

    seen it. it looks like the interior of a mid level japanese compact, not a european near lux car.

    changing the seat color and adding some 'titanium' face panels doesn't instantly transform the interior into a euro lux car standard.

    it might be fine for the fast and furious crowd. its not a saab interior.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    well, they rushed the car out, what do you expect? Even Saab admits, right there on the minisite that it was "built by Fuji Industries of Japan"
  • jmingjming Member Posts: 9
    I left the Saab brand this year ( I was one of those 28% referenced in the 9-7x press release who switched to an SUV ) because Saab didn't offer a product for my lifestyle anymore. If I don't have traction in winter, I don't get to my house safely, regardless of whether or not the vehicle has a "Saab interior". I'm glad that Saab has realized that they need to respond to consumer needs in order to remain relevant. The sad truth is that it's years overdue, and hundreds/thousands of Saab workers in Sweden have been laid off because of the product being out of step with the market. Sorry to some fellow Saab fans - if the products don't change with the times, there won't be any Saabs at all for us to enjoy. Unfortunately, the "Saab traditionalists" aren't enough buyers to keep the brand alive in 2003. I'm not thrilled with a 9-7x on a platform of very dubious reliability (was anyone else reading the Chevy Trailblazer forum about a year ago?? Ugh!) but it's a start!
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    This SUV is for North America only, so it does not affect Swedish workers.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    will all be sold in Europe.
  • theo2709theo2709 Member Posts: 476
    That's true, but the 9-2X and 9-7X will be on different platforms by then, so this argument is a bit pointless.
  • buddhabmanbuddhabman Member Posts: 252
    regfootball - What crowd do you think they are trying to market to? Now I thought they were adding leather and nicer headline/pillar material and better switches. If all they are adding is titanium fascia then I agree with your point. But concievably they could add 2-3k worth of interior and fix that car up. And talking about titanium face plates - IS300 does that make it near lux.

    Why disparage the WRX as just the F&F crowd. Yes it skews young, because it is a relative bargain price for the performance. I see young professionals driving the wagon everyday here in So. Cal. But I do know of two 40+ that have some of the most tricked out WRX's in Cali - M3 killers.

    Again, this not an elegant fix but it is a needed stopgap. This is a great platform of a car regardless.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    is so they can buy some time to develop the upcoming 9-2X, 9-3X and 9-7X, which will all be more Saablike than the current 9-2X or 9-7X.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    "well, they rushed the car out, what do you expect"

    A DASH MORE IN LINE WITH TRUE SAAB LOOK AND FEEL, AND LEVEL OF MATERIAL QUALITY.

    LESS DILUTION OF BRAND.

    hey lets take an Mitsubishi Evo and Slap an Audi tag on it.

    SAME THING. It won't say AUDI to the folks who want to buy an AUDI.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    I agree totally!
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    there's not much you could add to an EVO that would justify the added cost Audi would charge for a rebadged version of the EVO.
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