Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
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Joel, that was funny!
What have they got to lose besides their (gold) chains?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
but i'm no pro. Just a massively in-debt consumer.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Anyway, here's the related question. They took close to four hours to get me into finance. Once there I was out in five minutes. The problem? Only one person working finance and the person ahead of me in the line had lousy credit so they were playing around on how to finance him! I have a score that depending on the bureau is between 794 and 826! Shouldn't that put you at the head of the line? I am sorry that I didn't just get up and say "now or never." What a waste of my time!
The van is fine. I just can't believe making an easy customer wait that long!
Sorry its an AFIP violation to give service to or base negotiations on a persons credit score. Kind of like when you go to the grocery and it seems like you alway manage to get behind the person that wants a price check on every thing, its just luck of the draw. If you would have paid the asking price you would have not spent an hour negotiating and been ahead of the other guy in line, would have saved you 5 hours total.
Also think about how mad you would have been if there was a guy there with an 835 beacon score that they put in front of you
I do have a talent for picking wrong lines but this was teh only line to be had.
Learn something new every day which is why I asked.
Remember, they want to sell the car TODAY!!
Now I am getting to write to them in that two weeks have gone by and nothing on the "we owe" items. Heck, I could have bought them from h and a and have them by now.
I am shopping for a car the next couple weeks.
Thanks
Thanks
It depends on the lender as to what each tier means and how many they have. But I can give you an example of how it works with Ford Credit. There is no set rule with Ford that a 720 beacon score means level 0 or that a 595 equals level 4. Each deal stands on its own
They have 6 tiers, Tier 0-5. O being the best 5 being the other end of the spectrum, the lower the tier the better the rate. Your loan application is entered electronicly and it takes about 5 minutes to enter a deal and get a tier. if you have great to above average credit there is a chance you will go ECA (Electronic Credit Approval) meaning the computer approves you.
Lets say you you are going to apply for a 0% loan and the disclaimer say not all applicants will qualify.
Tier 0-1= 0%
Tier 2= 1.9%
Tier 3= 3.9%
Tier4-5=5.9
Some times that varies and the tier 4-5 can be as high as 10.9 depending on the program.
To get the tier there are like 1100 different variables but the main ones are
Credit (duh)
Advance
Probability of pay
Stability
Payment to income
Debt to income
Kisses of death
Past due on current auto
Past due on Mortgage
Past Repo where lender lost money
No Job, Yes we get people every week who do not have a job and do not understand why they cannot buy a car.
Now those first 3 are KOD's with the captured, there are allot of other sources who will lend money on a properly structured deal, obviously not at 0%, those are the loans rolling at rates in the high teens low twenty' s. I know it sounds like you are just ripping a person off by charging them 20% but if I was to run an add that said:
Weekend sale, 20% interest, you are approved with no money down, Used Mustangs, F150's, and Explorers to choose from, the term is long and the rate is high, but you ride TODAY!!!! So come on in TODAY and buy a $15000 car and pay back $12500 in finance charges.
We would have them lined up around the building to buy one. Now obviously you can't do that but I was just making an example.
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Weekend sale, 20% interest, you are approved with no money down, Used Mustangs, F150's, and Explorers to choose from, the term is long and the rate is high, but you ride TODAY!!!! So come on in TODAY and buy a $15000 car and pay back $12500 in finance charges.
We would have them lined up around the building to buy one. Now obviously you can't do that but I was just making an example.
Joel, I am pretty much convinced that when I went shopping for a Sienna at a couple of screamer-ad, "up" system Toyota dealers in not-so-hot parts of the Bronx and Yonkers a few months ago, having a very favorable credit/income/debt profile got in the way of my making a deal.
These dealers were absolutely mobbed, and some of the stuff I saw/overheard while waiting for my numbers to be run to a manager was exactly in line with what you're saying -- they weren't negotiating so much as they were praying for the dealer to put them in a new ride.
Why make a mini, even if it's a quick one, when the next guy who walks through the door is willing to cut off his arm to purchase from you? I didn't stand a chance.
Yes there are stores that are "back end" stores (in more ways then one
It is very simple to do. Prior to entering the Finance Office ask for a bottom line, write that number down. When you are presented with a contract look in the Federal Truth-in-Lending Disclosure which is on every contract. If the number in the amount financed box does not match the bottom line you were give then something is out of wack.
It makes no difference to me if a deal comes to me like that because as I have said before we run a fully disclosed office that uses a menu. The first thing we do any how is present you with a menu that shows your bottom line, base payment, and interest rate. Then you are presented with optional products with the payment and $$ figure for those optional items.
You won't find my butt in court charged with predatory lending practices, I can guarantee that.
I recently got the car serviced and I'm still experiencing the same problems before it needed the service. Its an internal issue(software). I'm just tired of paying this much for this car because the bulk of my pay goes to this car. I call it my apartment on wheels.
I'd like to know what is the penalty if I return the car to either the dealer or the finance company. I'd like to get rid of it and get something more affordable. Also how bad will this affect my credit score?
Thanks
QL
First, have you thought about refinancing?
Second, do you know how far upside-down you are? Have you tried trading it?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
No pretty much about it. That is a Repossesion, and a Voluntary one at that. People have this mis-perception that a voluntary repo is OK. Heck it is worse then an involuntary. A voluntary means you just quit and are going to make some one else pay for your buying mistake.
If you think your rate is high now, let a REPO get in your bureau and see how high your next one is.
You may be driving the best thing available to you right now. If your not careful you will end up in an older car at a higher rate and payment.
it doesn't make sense why you giving back the car is a bad thing. There are too many factors in why 'some' people have to give back the car. I can't give it back to the finance company.
ALso, I tried to ask my dealer who sold me the car if I could trade it in. They told me that I'd trade in my car - take out a new loan on the new car and whatever is remaining from the old loan less the car's value will be added onto the new loan. NOW WHO DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO BESIDES THE DEALER? if i'm paying that much, i better be driving off with 2 cars!!!
if there's nothing that i cna really do just say...keep ur piece of crap...
OH by the way....the 07 amanti looks like the E350 front and s55 rear and acura interior. Go kia...if they can only get thier software right maybe people would buy more of their cars!
Only if you finance it for longer than the current remaining term. I mean for you to try to refi at the same length, but maybe now you can get a better rate. So if you financing in 12/05 for 72 mos at 17%, maybe now you can refi for 54 mos at 10%. Who knows? Can't hurt to find out.
They told me that I'd trade in my car - take out a new loan on the new car and whatever is remaining from the old loan less the car's value will be added onto the new loan. NOW WHO DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO BESIDES THE DEALER?
Must make sense to alot of people because, as dealers around these boards will tell you, it happens every minute of every day. There are just too many factors. I don't know HOW upside-down you are.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
The dealer makes perfect sense. If your car is worth $5000 and you owe $7000, you have to come up with the difference somewhere. You can't magically owe the amount the car is worth. He's talking about rolling it over into your next car loan, people do it all the time.
Basically, you're in a hole-stop digging!
True there are many different situations. The only one you have given is that you don't like the car and there is a "software" problem.
The reason giving a car back is a bad thing is because you signed a legal binding contract stating you agreed to the terms of the contract and would make the payments as scheduled. Nothing more nothing less.
If you have 5 years left on a Kia at $400+ a month I don't think there is any refinancing in your future. Also if you do give it back you will still owe thousands of dollars in attorneys fees and the difference between what your car brings at auction and what the pay off is. I am guessing you will still owe at least $10K. And that $10K debt will follow you around in your bureau for 7 years minimum.
So letting the car go back may be a quick fix but it will continue to haunt you for years.
ALso, I tried to ask my dealer who sold me the car if I could trade it in. They told me that I'd trade in my car - take out a new loan on the new car and whatever is remaining from the old loan less the car's value will be added onto the new loan. NOW WHO DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO BESIDES THE DEALER? if i'm paying that much, i better be driving off with 2 cars!!!
How does that not make sense to you?
Is it under warranty? Make them fix it!
I'd really like to know what are some options/actions that I can take before I go to the dealer.
THanks 4 all of ur help
You're in a big hole now. Getting a different car-leased or otherwise-will make the hole bigger. You will owe what you owe now and then some if you go into a new car deal.
If you already have bad credit,the repo will finish you off. You won't be able to buy a car on credit for many years.
That Kia is now worth (to a dealer)thousands of dollars less than you paid for it. I'm sorry but unless you are able to write a LARGE check you are stuck.
I do hope things work out for you.
I just read through some old posts here, and I'm wondering if I have this right.
I wanted to have a financing offer set up when I went into the dealer, so I contacted Chase, who Equifax said was offering the lowest rate in my area for my credit score (currently 650 on Equifax, fluctuates between 650 and 675 depending on the time of the month the report is run, I swear).
Background..
I graduated from law school in 99, got into trouble with my student loans, rehabilitated them, and have been paying with no breaks since 2004 - no blemishes to speak of. I have a few negative bills that were more than 120 days in the same period, but nothing in the last 3 years (other than stuff I paid off that got added back to the report...). I make 94k/year, have been rebuilding my credit with two cards, both of which are paid off completely or down to almost zero every month. I rent an apartment, and have had no car payment since I was 19.
I am buying a new car because the transmission in my car (11 year old) is going and I want reliable transportation. Anyway...I do not have a bank that offers auto loans (WAmu) so trying with Chase, I was surprised to be turned down because I don't have a history of paying anything "on a regular basis that is like this kind of payment". Translation: no mortgage, and no car payment. They wanted to know if I could get a cosigner for the loan!
Please! I'm 32 years old!!!
Anyway...should I just go with what the dealer is offering and hope I get a decent offer? I just feel powerless going in without a competitive offer.
Help?
You are, however on track for better rates in the future.
My advice: don't buy a new car. Buy a used car, maybe 2 years old so it will still have some warranty left, and don't finance more than half the cost. Pay as much cash as possible. Sounds like you still have some student loan debt, right? Concentrate on paying that off and saving up for your next big purchase (either a car or a house).
You've got a good income but you don't want to get yourself into a hole when you're of a prime age to think about buying a home, maybe having a family, within the next 5 years or so.
I've checked my credit score (FICO score) on the MyFICO.com before applying for the auto lease. It was in good (next to the excellent) category. However, when the dealer ran my credit, the credit score was 100 lower than that from MyFICO.com and I was put into Tier 4. Where's this difference coming from? Does the auto industy use difference credit scoring system from FICO? I'm very confused. Please help. I went to two different auto companies and the scores were the same.
So I've already been denied a loan from eloans and roadloans. But I did get a $13,000 loan approval from Capital One for 12.9% APR. Is this the best I'm going to get? I haven't approached my bank yet about a loan or checked out dealership financing. I'm hoping to not be paying more than $250 a month. And the thing is, because of my job, I already pay that a month to get to work and back (cabs and the bus). So it's not a matter of not being able to afford it.
Should I bother going to the bank or CU? Or does it sound like that 12.9% is the best I'll get? I'm looking for a car around $10,000 max. The capital one loan states I have to get a car under 60,000 miles which pretty much eliminated most of what's in my price range if I use it.
Wachovia had suggested a voluntary repo, that's why I'm trying to get information on it from people who might have real life experience. Any help, advice would be greatly appreciated. I can't afford a rental car, forever. :mad: :sick:
But ... you can't be the same person because that person was talking about a Kia, not a land rover. I searched the discussion and this is the only post you've made here.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Kelesmom, it looks like your situation sucks. If you have documentation that the car was brought in for the same issues before warranty expiration, you may have a case, but at 16k miles out of warranty, it doesn't look good from here.
I'm afraid a voluntary repossession will damage your credit. Repos are not good for credit, voluntary or otherwise.
Face reality. You can't afford a $250 car payment, PLUS gas, insurance, maintenance, if you're already behind on your student loan (yes, that's what "deferring" it means). At least the $250 that you're paying for transportation now doesn't have those other costs associated with it.
Get yourself out of the hole you're in now before you start digging a deeper one.
There are three major credit bureaus -- TransUnion, Equifax, and Experian. If I'm remembering correctly, the basic MYFICO report only gives you ONE of those scores. They all have different scoring methods, and it could be that the dealer is pulling their scores from a different bureau than your MYFICO.
However, a 100-point difference seems pretty high to me -- I've checked mine and my wife's scores every year for the past 5-6 years, and our respective scores are never more than 10-30 points apart.
I think it would be very much worth your while to buy a product that lets you check all three credit reports and scores. It could be that there is an error in one or more of the profiles which is generating a significantly lower score.
Have the dealers told you the number of the actual score they're pulling? It could be that the raw FICO number is the same, but they are concerned about something they see in your debt-to-income profile (which a FICO score doesn't capture). And lastly, a finance rate is negotiable like anything else -- some dealers won't offer you a great rate, others will wait until you demonstrate that you know your credit is sound.
If you need to borrow money to buy a car, it really pays to pre-qualify (through Cap One or e-loan, etc) and have an accurate, up-to-the-minute credit score from all three bureaus.
Good luck.
P.S. I am pretty sure that the dealers are using the same Experian/TransUnion/Equifax scores that you can buy yourself. Maybe one of the dealers here can weigh in/correct me if I'm wrong.
Thank you so much for your info on voluntary repo. It doesn't look like that is an option, I have never been so clueless on what to do. I don't have the money to fix the engine, and I'm going through a divorce, so my credit has been damaged a bit.
thanks, again. any other advise, anyone...I'd appreciate it.
Thanks much for the comments. In fact, I've checked all three major bureau's scores, and as you said, they ranged within 10-30 scores.
Yes. the dealer showed me my credit score from TransUnion and this score was lower by 100 from the one from MyFICO. I've talked to MyFICO customer service rep, and she told me that the dealer was probably using different scoring system. However, as far as I know, most of the dealer are using FICO scoring system? I am still very confused.
New to the forum. Just wanted to put my "story" out there and see if you think it would be possible for me to get financing. I'm looking at a 2006 BMW 325i...approx $35,000 - $40,000.
Age 37
Equifax Credit Score - 569
Experian Credit Score - 559
TransUnion Credit Score - 563
Currently no auto loan. No home mortgage. No credit cards. No revolving lines of credit.
Have an installment student loan of approx $89,000 which has been in and out of deferment for many years. It will come out of deferment once I graduate from nursing school in May 2007. There is currently one 60 day delinquency for Jan 07 but that's due to a school delay in returning the deferment documentation to the lender. The lender has since applied a retroactive deferment and has informed me the delinquency will be cleared at the end of this month (hopefully this will increase my credit score a bit). The account is now current. The only other delinquencies are from 2001 - the loan was at one time many many different accounts with several lenders and it was nearly impossible to keep track of all of them. I was trying to work and take care of an ill family member during this time. Some of the accounts show delinquencies during this time while I was trying to get them all consolidated under one lender.
There are a few older medical collection accounts in amounts of $556, $75, $33, $76, $30. ALL HAVE BEEN PAID IN FULL but are still showing on credit report due to 7 year limit.
I do have a checking and savings account that is and has always been in good standing but have not applied for any other credit at all...and I really don't want a credit card. I have paid cash for everything over the past several years! The student loan account(s) and the collections are the only things on my credit report.
In the past few years I have returned to school and have worked part-time to pay my way. I will graduate in May as a registered nurse...needless to say my income level is about to change drastically (literally rags to riches). I'll be making about $54,000 a year and clearing about $3161 a month...rent is $400, student loan payment will be about $300-$400. Those are the only real expenditures I will have. I can easily afford the car. I have a letter from my employer verifying employment (which will start May 29, 2007) and salary. I plan to work about a month before applying for a car loan....this gives me enough time to save up for a down payment.
Taking all of the above into account, if you were a lender looking at my application and history what would your verdict be? What sort of interest rate would I be looking at? Should I take a chance on my bank of many years (since that's where my checking and savings history is) or should I just see what the dealer can arrange?
Thanks very much!
I posted the other day, and in preparation for my visit to the dealer tomorrow, I wanted to supplement my Equifax report with my FICO score.
So: Equifax was telling me my score was 679 (up 20 points from last month, no idea why except it was run at a time when my balances were down?).
I THEN ran a "3 in One" report from TransUnion because I wanted to make sure I had the TransUnion score, and didn't want to run the Experian one separately.
THIS IS IMPORTANT>
TransUnion reported three scores, underneath the logos for each of the major credit bureaus. My TransUnion score was 635, a full FORTY FIVE points lower than my Equifax score (as told to me by Equifax). Experian was 735, a full ONE HUNDRED points higher than my Equifax reported score. Here's where it gets screwy. On the 3-in-1 score report from TransUnion, they said my Equifax score was 635, exactly the same as the TransUnion score - but, oddly enough, 45 points lower than what Equifax was actually reporting.
I thought the whole point of doing a "3 in 1" report was to see what each agency was reporting as your credit score. WRONG. I spent five minutes with a customer service rep, then thirty minutes with a customer service manager, neither of whom could tell me where in the TransUnion information online it stated that they weren't actually doing this.
Here's what actually happens: TransUnion takes the DATA from your other bureau's reports, and it applies TransUnion's credit scoring models to your data - and then creates a TransUnion score of your credit data.
SO. To those who ask how the scores can be so different, this is how: each credit reporting agency has their own scoring model. If you want to know what your score is from each of the agencies, run it from each agency independently and you'll have a much better idea.
This way you'll never be surprised walking into the dealer.
It's crazy...but true.
Am I the only one who didn't know this? :confuse:
Now if you buy a house most lenders pull all 3 and throw out the lowest and the highest regardless of what bureau it is.
The finance guy kind of laughed, but I said that seriously, I had everything...when they ran it, the salesguy came back later and asked me how much I was putting down. I said $5,000 and he did a double-take, and said "what happened to the days when people put down $500?".
I explained that i had run my report and that Transunion was a harder score, and asked who they used. He said they used Transunion - and the score was the same as what was on my Equifax report (my higher score). I was totally flummoxed. I have no idea if they run it out of Equifax, and so the same situation as I described above was true (it applies Equifax's model to TransUnion's information, or what), but eventually, they ran it by the financing guys and I was approved for the special promotional rate (which was a surprise).
End of the day, I think three things mattered: one, I put down a large chunk of cash. Two, I make a good living and have a stable employment history. Three, I have shown good judgement and credit management in the last two years. The salesman said to me that he couldn't see how much I paid monthly on my student loans, but that if he had that much in student loans, he'd put a gun to my head. I then pointed out that he couldn't see that I paid almost $900/month, on time, regularly....and that worked well.
Anyway. I would also point out one other thing: I checked the dealers through the BBB and ended up at one with a slightly higher quote, but one that doesn't operate in a sub-prime "area" of the city - where they probably routinely push people into higher financing deals. I have no doubt if I had gone to one of those dealers, I'd be sitting with a 13% loan right about now.
(Proud, liberated, empowered new owner of a great new car...)