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Midsize Sedans Comparison Thread
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The sales figures don't back that statement up. Toyota and Honda are reporting record sales. Sounds like more people are buying them, not less. Let's see what Hyundai can do with the next generation of the Sonata. Will they make it better than the current generation (like Accords and Camrys) or will they just stay in line, with the other pretenders. When the new Accord comes out for 08 next year, the Sonata will be left in the dust by Honda and Toyota and Nissan again. The chances of them catching up with the Japanese "Big Three" (as far as sales) are slim and none.
Take the F-150 for example. I'm willing to bet that when the 2007 Tundra comes out, it'll be better than the F-150 in most ways.
However, the F-150 will continue to outsell the Tundra by more than 5 to 1.
"Lots of past Hotoy buyers have Hyundai and Kia in their garage."
The above quote was said probably because Sonata sales increase percentage-wise (% vs. last year) are much higher than Camrys, Accords, etc...it is speculation but I would say very likely Camry/Accord owners have switched to Sonata and others...
>The sales figures don't back that statement up.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
-Loren
Tranny seems to have a lot of reported problems for a car that has been on the market for only 6 weeks or so.
I'm sure Toyota will take care of it eventually. Fixes don't happen like switching a light switch.
OK, I'll bite. Could you please substantiate that statement? I don't think you can, but I am interested to see what you come up with. I am especially interested to see the quotes from Hyundai executive(s) stating that Hyundai is the most troublesome marque since the Yugo. Not even 3rd party data such as from J.D. Power or CR backs that up, so I would be utterly shocked if Hyundai's executives made that kind of statement.
-Loren
-Loren
Hyundai current sits as the 7th largest automaker in the world, 4th among import nameplates in the US, etc...it strives to reach #5 in 2010 - a lofty goal but if anyone can do, it'd be Hyundai
There also seem to be maybe 3 or 4 performance issues on the 4c as well. None are recalls, they are break-in issues if you read the thread.
Annoying perhaps but to my friend choe13, less than 200 V6 Camry's have been 'serviced'/replaced out of nearly 100,000 vehicles shipped. You might like to think this is a huge issue but it it not until shown otherwise. But you can keep pointing it out as you are free to do.
If you think 200 units is bad... you should get a load of this... 2006 SONATA recalls
From Automotive.com
2006 Hyundai Sonata Recalls
NHTSA Campaign ID Number: 05V377000 - Get Details
Recall Date: AUG 29, 2005
Component: SEATS:FRONT ASSEMBLY:RECLINER
Potential Units Affected: 36000
NHTSA Campaign ID Number: 05V316000 - Get Details
Recall Date: JUL 07, 2005
Component: SUSPENSION:AUTOMATIC STABILITY CONTROL (ASC)
Potential Units Affected: 1970
OUCH!!!
37,000+ units recalled???? How many have they made?
BTW, you were the one who first brought up the subject of individual reviews in your post #3866. Just stay with the fact, they are your friend and you can't go wrong.
I suppose the Sonata and Azera may not out handle the Mazda6 or have the resale of the Accord, but they do have some good selling points. Hope they do NOT sell too many fleet cars. Oh no, Hyundai should not become the fleet kings, like GM, of the import market. Please no!
-Loren
In contrast, for the first model year of the 2002-2006 Camry, about 148,000 units were recalled. There were 3 recalls on the 2002 Camry--all for airbag issues.
Can you post the link? There is nothing like that in the upper left corner of my forums page.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Toyota
Indeed it will. The engines have quite a story behind them. They were developed by a huge team comprised of Hyundai, Daimler-Chrysler, and several other Detroit and California design firms. I read somehwere the 3.3 V6 was designed to last for 300K miles. If these engine fail, it's not because they didn't have a good pedigree.
Although I like everything about my 06 Sonata, the V6 is my favorite feature. When idling, it's so smooth that it's almost impossible to tell whether it's running. When you nudge it a little, it responds with jet smoothness and impressive power from idle up to redline.
Go to the Toyota forum, click on Camry and you'll see the '07 Camry woes amoung the listed topics.
Good engines do not fail! They are definitely linked to a fine pedigree. That's the reason German engines are considered to be the cream of engine. The 300K miles depends upon the driver. An idot behind wheels can screw-up even a German engine. I'm not quite sure whether the US designers can match up with the durability & performance of German engines.
When idling, it's so smooth that it's almost impossible to tell whether it's running.
I hope you are comparing the V6 engine with an I4 engine. I've test driven the V6 of the far east asian brands & have observed Toyota has the smoothest of them all.
Try driving the V8s & you'll be amazed how smooth they are.
Had our Sonata since last Sept.No problems up to now.Car drives great,sounds great,feels great,very comfortable and peppy(sporty).For the last 10 months we have yet to get a dirty look or nasty comment because we were driving a Hyundia Sonata,nor did we get questioned on why we didn't buy what so many followers buy.What we have got was non ending compliments about how classy our Sonata looks.So far 3 of our friends have gone out and bought the Sonata after seeing and trying our car.As far as the new Camry,all I can say is wow,what an ugly looking stump.There is no doubting their past popularity or how well made they have been in the past,but folks ,the new Camry is just plain ugly and I don't care how good or popular it is,I wouldn't be seen in one! Oh and those are the FACTS!
First of all, you said the Sonata is peppy then you said the new Camry is an ugly looking stump and you closed it out by saying those are the FACTS.
Let me tell ya something, the only "FACT" that's in your statements is that they are your OWN OPINIONS. :mad:
Next time don't forget to put "IMO" after your statement if you are going to bash a product that has good reputation like the Camry.
Perhaps they are. I won't argue with your assertion.
But, if the Sonata idles so smoothly that you can't hear or feel it running, then it doesn't help the Toyota engine much to be even smoother.
I don't even want my engine to last 300K miles it was designed for. That's just too long to keep the same car. 150K and 10 years is plenty long enough for me to get tired of the same old car! :sick:
Congratulations to Toyota and Honda for being so close behind Hyundai. That's quite an accomplishment!
Don't you know that Hyundai's are pieces of junk? They made the Excel(Mitsu Precis with Mitsubishi powertrain)? They are crap! Don't bring in these facts or surveys because I don't believe any of it. Hyundai probably just paid off J.D. Powers to list them higher than Toyota and Honda. Ohhh yeah, I almost forgot, the warrenty is no good and they only need it because they know their quality sucks and people won't even go in their pathetic showrooms if they don't offer it!
All sarcasm aside, I still can't believe that people that people doubt Hyundai's arrival in terms of quality and reliability. I own a Hyundai and it is the least problematic vehicle I've ever owned. Even the fairly new Sonata(made in America) in a brand new manufacturing plant is listed among the best in its segment! Yet people say they can't be mentioned along with Camry or Accord. Where is the Mazda6 on that list? Where is Nissan Altima?
Call the Sonata ugly, boring, or bland, but please attack Hyundai's great quality with some sense of reasoning. Hyundai has arrived and people will continue to attack it, but let the fools pay more for what they and perhaps the world percieve to be better quality.
Here's the link...
http://www.jdpower.com/news/releases/pressrelease.asp?ID=2006082
Is there any info source that can provide more detail around this release?
~alpha
Thats a great point, but good to know it was designed to go that long with proper maintenence. Myself, i wouldnt like to venture to far over the 200k mark.
The longer a car is designed to run safely and reliably, the better resale should be, right?
I've got 162,000 miles on my 1996 Accord now (clicked over yesterday. Same engine parts, only a new fan motor and brake master cylinder after 10.5 years. Not bad. I wonder how long I can keep this up (driving this old car so cheaply, that is).
BTW, I'm still returning 28MPG in my old Accord as well, and this tank included one stint at extra-legal speeds (near 3 digits for extended time) on the interstate, and sitting at a train for a looooong time (I finally braved the heat and turned off the car and put the windows down).
I hear this quite often, but a friend and neighbor of mine bought their son a 1991 Accord back in 2001, so he would have a car while he was away at College. It had about 150,000 miles on it and the transmission was junk in 6 months. I think it's more about proper maintenance no matter what the vehicle brand is. Honda's will go bad just like the rest IMHO.
~alpha
I for one don't put Hyundai up there in Honda's quality realm.
~alpha
Guess one test drives both cars, does a look over a few hundred times to see if one looks better on the outside. The Accord may win on interior. Then there is the drive test between the four cylinder and the six to see which is preferable. Then there is the class testing done by some to be sure the yuppies approve of the car. May have to call the country club to ask if a Sonata or Azera is approved to be parked in the golfing club lot.
I will drive quite a few cars before deciding, the Hyundai included. Even considering trying a GM again, though there are some early warning signs of another meltdown in progress. Was thinking of a test drive of the Fusion too, but they need side air bags standard and to raise the crash test scores on frontal impact to compete with the big boys. You know, like Hyundai :P
-Loren
For the JD Power baloney covering 90 days -those surveys are pretty useless since they cover a very limited time frame and placement of knobs, switches, clocks, etc. are personal preferences, not indicative of quality concerns.
They just opened up a new Hyundai dealership in my area - about 20 miles from my home. Glad though that there are competitors knipping at the Camry and Accord though because it will keep overall prices down.
The sample is probably more accurate than a typical election poll.
How prophetic you were in your post!
Like it or not, JD Power/CR studies are influential in the industry and highly praised - you'd be surprised how many consumers rely on them because of their reputation. I don't know if there are anything better in terms of, well, in all aspects (sample size, reliablity, etc) - it's as good as you can get!!
Congrats to Porsche, Lexus and Hyundai, for finishing in the top three. Both Porsche and Hyundai defn. surprised me; I knew they would do well - I just didn't know they would both do that well - Kudos
not quite true. Some cars definitely have ability to take more torture and still bounce back than some others. Like nissan car usually are weak from my experiences. Hondas, mercedez, bmw believe it or not even saabs can take torture pretty good even if u drive it like a ignorant fool. Toyota can take torture as well but thats because they make their cars drivable to a "limit" from ever getting to be driven too hard etc. Toyota cars definitely controls u and not the other way around. Mazdas as well can take torture pretty well with all the handling torture u give it
American cars, forget about it. All those cars i see on the highways stopping cuz their engines blew, usually american cars. And i know cuz i've helped a couple of them already
Sonata has scored well in numerous highly influenced reliablity reports.
And to your other point about repair costs - recently, as a matter of fact, few days ago, the Sonata takes home the award for the least amount of repair costs in the large car segement (Optima takes home the award in the midsize segment). Check Intellichoice 2006 Awards for more details.
Personally I've examined and worked on many older-gen Sonatas and they hold up quite well, defn. more than many people give them credit for. Ex: My neighbor has a 98 Sonata (one owner - over 130K miles) - the car has clean bill of health to my knowledge, like it was purchased from day one. By my calculation, it's coming up to its 9th year in ownership (purchased in '97). On the other hand, I've only examined/worked on a few Accords so I won't say anything I can't back up (but I have heard/read numerous engine problems/issues...)