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Comments
Do you have any evidence to support that statement? I believe the Accord is a better handler. It is not far better than the Sonata, but it is better. In the C&D comparison, it tied with Hyundai in road handling. But beat it in the emergency-lane test.
Wrong - maybe as good as a Camry but the Accord is definitely the best handling small sedan in the bunch. Hands down. Drive one at high speed through the twists and turns instead of just guessing what its like. The 06 Sonatas I've driven were competent but uninspiring.
Hyundai will never be number one in sales. Where do you come up with this stuff? Just wingin it?
This statement is very true in economics it is called "price inferred quality". You can take a perfume and sell it for $5.00 and no body buys it because they think it is cheap and poor quality. Take the same perfume and put a $100 price tag on it and it sells like crazy. People think assume because of he price it must be high quality.
The concept works for anything else you are selling.
Guess what - there are many many cars nowadays that are better than the Sonata. And some even cost more.
Nice blanket statement. Totally dilutes your opinion.
One day Hyundai will be number one in sales, not next year, or the next but it will happen.
How many people in 1960 were saying Toyota was going to be number one in sales? Next year I predict Toyota will surpass GM as the number one car maker.
People should keep their cars at LEAST 5 to 7 years and take that money they have saved and invest it in bonds, stocks, real estate and other asset appreciating investments. Cars go no where but DOWN in value.
Ever wond why they put a 10 year warranty on it. Is it transferable or original owner only?
They may be improving, but my money is still going with a sure thing. I may change my mind when I see a steady history of quality improvement, but not yet.
The concept works for anything else you are selling.
Yes, this does apply to automobiles. But you have to account for the other factors that influence the consumers decision. Like me, I bought the Accord based on its merits. It offered good handling, IMO the best front seats and IMO the best interior. Those are some of the area's I value most in an automobile. After that, I look at the price. I was able to justify the extra amount of money because to me, the Accord was the best car.
I'm not saying you do, but some people make the assumption that people buy the Camry and Accord based solely on its name or higher price. Yes, some people do, but not all.
too much sway to the body on turns
Actually, both C&D and other auto mags state that the Accord actually is too harsh, due to its tighter suspension. This is funny, some people say the Accord's suspension is too tight. But you say it's too soft.
C&D comparison test: The suspension lacks the muscular control that gives the Honda such a sporting feel, and it lacks the plush-carpet smoothness that eases the Camry over Michigan's broken roads. Hey, benchmarks are very hard to beat. That said, the Sonata certainly behaves within the envelope of contemporary expectations.
I also feel there is an inherent bias with many of the car reviewer organizations against American and Korean cars and certain makes of Japaneses cars. They always seem to rate Honda and Toyota ahead and there are many times I do not think it is warranted.
I'll be honest with you too part of the reason I bought the Sonata (besides truly beliving in its quality and features) was to be a little different that the crowd. When the phone system broke up in the 80's I purposely joint Sprint so as not to follow the heard. Just my personality I guess.
Good discussions! Finally!!
Also, compare the number of types of problems and occurances over a longer time period. Honda and Camry have so few that when they do have an issue everyone makes such a big deal out of it. It's so common with other models it doesn't even cause a ripple.
Check again in the Consumer Report's Annual Auto Issue, april 2005. Accord hand moderate problems in transmissions in 2001 only. Fewer in previous years and none from 2002 on. And, it's better-than-average reliability from 1997 through 2004. (2006 isn't published yet)
Camry had moderate engine problems in 1997, and fewer in 1998 and 1999, none from 2000 on. They did have some brake problems from 1997 through 2000. After that almost perfect reliability, and, better-than-average reliability from 1997 until 2004.
Sonata, not recommended in 2000, average in 2001 and 2002, finially recommended in 2003 and 2004, but they may not have been around long enough. I would want to see longer term reliability.
Hyundai is coming along, but they're not their yet.
Have you drive a Hyundai - lately?
Toyota has the highest return buyer rate.
~alpha
The are a myriad of mutual funds that you can get into for as little as 1,000. The overseas markets have done exceedingly well this year. I am very happy with my returns. I was very plsd with the performance of my Franklin-Templeton Capital Accumulation fund. It has quite abit of European and South American holdings. Also Gold (you can buy under the symbol GLD) is really on a bull run for several reasons. I won't go into them all. REITS are a great way to invest in real estate but I would be real caution of real estate at this point. The unemployment rate dropped to 4.7% and I am very bullish on 2006.
Do you realized if you bought $10,000 of GE stock in 1981 when Jack Welch took over as CEO and reinvested all your dividends and splits (adding no more money)it would have been worth $800,000 in 2001 when he left the company!
Gee $800,000 or a new car - which should I pick? LOL!
I can "be a leader" in more constructive ways.....
Check out intellichoices cost of ownership on any model you choose. And over a 5-year period, not just a 2003, 2004, or 2005.
Honestly I'm glad you are doing well with your investments but alot of people have started paying CASH for their vehicles because they are not making anything on their money now.
I'll tell you one thing if you shorted their stock you'd be a millionaire now LOL!!!!
Where do I start, no the Sonata does not have OPDS (or any other disease that I know of LOL!!!!) does the Accord have ESC with TCS? Does the Accord come with rear disc brakes, they come in handy when you want to stop LOL!
Also a Sonata has been reclassified for 2006 as a "large" car which at least generally speaking is thought to be safer than the smaller "mid-size" car the Accord is.
The Sonata automatically locks when you get going and when you got little rascals like me that is a BIG safety concern.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has actually tested both cars, for your information.
Sonata rceived a 5 Star rating for frontal crash Driver and passenger and 5 Star rating for side crash for front and back passengers.
Accord got a 5 star rating for frontal crash both driver and passenger and a FOUR (4) star rating for side crash for both front AND rear.
You should also read Edmund's comparison it shows Sonata well ahead as well.
Morale of the story, if you are in an Accord make sure you crash in the front (or just buy a Sonata) LOL!!!
Here the links:
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/ncap/cars/3754.html
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/ncap/cars/3655.html
Hope all this helps.
Now the interesting question is how did you research it?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Well 5.5 to 6 years and 133,000 miles on it and its still going strong. Only non routine maintenice that I ever done on it was a sensor that went out just a couple of weeks ago, I plan on driving it until it falls apart. I'll let you know when that happens.
I know someone who is still driving a scoupe with well over 200k on it.
Also tell me how many cars have much value in them at 10 years?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Its also called snob appeal.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
It's called standing behind their product. to be honest if I was building a well built car I would back it with a long warranty too.
I wonder why Toyota and Honda don't match it, or beat it, if their cars are so much better.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Although, I feel the Warranty is a all part of marketing. This Stigma of anything Hyundia is junk is fading, and quick. Honda should be more worried than anyone else.
By the way, all those who are beating the death drum for Ford, can you tell me what profit Ford made worldwide last year? I'll give you a hint, they only lost money here in the U.S.... Surprise! Ford isn't going anywhere folks..
Let me again (I have already done this, have I not?) invite those who are interested in debating the issues of the manufacturers themselves instead of these four specific vehicles to hop over to the News & Views board.
Who wants to get back to talking about these cars?
For one thing, even though forces on the dummies' heads are measured, they aren't considered for the "star" ratings. Secondly, NHTSA counts only forces on the thorax and pelvis toward the ratings, even though head injuries cause the most deaths in real-world side impact crashes. Finally, their barrier simulates the front end of a car, so it's not high enough to strike the dummies' heads directly, as would be true for a large truck or SUV. Side airbags are most beneficial in protecting the head, by interposing a cushion between the intruding object and the head.
So, wait until the IIHS releases their side tests -- much more informative. - 210delray
If you look at the scores in the NHSTA test:
The Accord had 216 and 397 for head injuries.
The Sonata had 265 and 472 for head injuries.
Like 210delray stated, IIHS tests are much better. The Accord received a good on the test with side curtain airbags.
I am still waiting for the Sonata's score. It's been out longer than the Civic, and the GS's side impact scores just came out. I wonder why they haven't tested the Sonata. According to backy, it was suppose to be tested by the end of 2005.
Possible reasons:
1) to group results into "themes" so they can do a press release on a certain subject, or 2) the car doesn't do well and the manufacturer asks IIHS to hold up on publishing the results until they can make some mods for a re-test.- Backy
I doubt the first one will apply. They just came out with the GS's side impact score. If they can release an article for just a side impact test for one vehicle. I don't see what's the problem with releasing the Sonata on its own.
Could it be that the Sonata had a bad rating from IIHS? :surprise:
The Camry is the benchmark and price leader. Whereever Toyota puts the Camry all the others have to find their place in the 'pecking order' below the Camry. That is the way all markets are structured.
There is no way in this world Hyundai could come out and say its bread and butter Sonata is better than the Camry thus we are going to price it at $22500 ( +$500 over the Camry ) with no discounts or rebates. Their sales would go to one, stockmanjoe's. Hyundai understands that they are fifth in the pecking order and they have to price their product in this manner.
Now Hyundai is not a charitable organization. It's here to make money. Consider what the benefit to the two companies is:
Toyota sells 300,000+ base Camry's at ~ $20000
Honda sells 200,000+ base Accords at ~$20000
Hyundai sells 150,000+ base Sonata's ( loaded ) at ~$17000
Disregarding the 'additional units above 150,000, Toyota and Honda each is making about half a Billion dollars more than Hyundai on just 150,000 units. The management of Hyundai know this, the Corp Sales Dept knows this, the Product Mgrs know this. when do you think they will want to get a piece of this pie that the CamCords have all to themselves. When they do decide to go toe-to-toe with the CamCords on price where do you think sales units will go?