2000 Dakota Quad Cab -Cross Country Trip

andy_jordan

2001 ordering should be easier - no telling what the restrictions might be, but assuming that that isn't a major problem you should be able to order late July and probably be driving it around the time that September becomes October.

c5alive

Thanks for the information. I too heard that the 2001 should be more plentiful. Hopefully it won't take too long.
One question for anyone who might know. You have the option of getting full-time 4-wheel drive system. Now does that still give you the option of going two wheel when wanted, or are you stuck in 4 all the time. After reading the brochure, it looks almost like you have 4 options with the transfer case.
Neutral (2 wheel drive)
4 high
4 Low
and Full time 4-wheel.
Does that sound accurate?

bigal31

I have that Quad 4x4,4.7L,3.55. I don't know I havn't had it up to 75 mph yet.Got only 350 miles on it ,but I'll check and let you know the rpm's..
Allen

bpeebles

NOPE! Always in 4WD. Your only choice is to LOCK the xfer case or not lock it (Open differential)
The Neutral is just that... (neither driveshaft driven)

The pros/cons of the full-time-xfer-case has been discussed in the past in another forum.
Basically it costs more and offers LESS traction/control in the snow and costs more in fuel due to 4WD parts ALWAYS in motion. It is truly a poor choice for the informed individual(Technical discussion previously available)

balser

It's true it's better to lock the transfer case on slippery snow covered roads. But I still like the full time transfer case for MARGINAL roads. If I remember right, even the guy who said he was always stuck in his Select-Trac Cherokee admitted this. It beats shifting in and out of four wheel drive. I talked to several dealers and they all assured me the full time transfer case would not act like a true open differential.

Refer to the Dakota review at allpar.com. They recommend the full time case over part time 4 wheel drive. Also, Consumer Reports truck issue (or some other similar quality magazine - I was reading it in Barnes & Noble at the time) noted that full time transfer cases have advantages over part time cases, with the caveat about locking the case in really slippery situation.

I suggest you talk to people in your area with a Jeep Select-Trac transfer case and ask them about their experiences in full time (not locked) four wheel drive. Unfortunately, you won't have the 2wd option on the Dak, but the full time 4wd should work the same as the full time selection in the Select Trac, at least from what I've been told.

I have it ordered and I'm keeping it. Just 'uninformed' I guess.

catnip2377

I read the article at www.allpar.com :

As usual, we do not recommend getting part-time four wheel drive unless you absolutely need it. It makes the truck much heavier, adds to the price, and has little use most of the time, unless you
happen to live in very snowy areas. The optional NV242 full-time transfer case provides
all-condition, full-time four wheel drive, but is not available with the V6. This system does not penalize fuel efficiency as much, is
more convenient, and it lets drivers use the system on dry or moderately slippery roads as well as very slippery surfaces.

The part time makes the truck much heavier? It adds to the cost? From reading this article.. it seems that the full time system is the way to go. Any comments?

balser

Just to fan the flames a little more - check out the following: http://www.4x4abc.com/4WD101/def_turn.html

balser

Good explanation about three quarters of the way down the page. Actual driver experience.
http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/WWW/DAKOTA/ARCHIVES/9907/1215.html

What's really weird is that, from what I've found at various sites on the 'net, the NV242 is the Jeep Select-Trac transfer case with 2wd, full time 4wd, part time 4wd, and 4wd lo. This case was also included on the Durango per some '98 reviews I found. I wonder why the NV242HD listed in the Dak sales brochure is different. Or is the picture in the brochure showing no 2wd selection wrong?? Can someone explain...

bpeebles

(catnip2377)
I assume you are referring to the following URLs.

http://www.allpar.com/eek/k/SUVs.html
http://www.allpar.com/reviews/dakota.html
http://www.allpar.com/model/cj/power.html

You are mis reading what was written. When it speaks of the Full-time 4WD making the truck MUCH heavier it is obviously comparing it against a 2WD. The difference in weight between
the two xfer cases is less than 50 lbs with the NV242 being the HEAVER of the two.

Additionally, the NV242 is the one that costs MORE than the NV231.

Sure the NV242 xfer case is more convenient ... but do not expect it to work like a real 4WD.

Using your own argument of weight/cost...A 2WD with trac-lock rear end would be a better choice if one does not need 4WD. Plus it makes the truck MUCH lighter than the NV242. If you do not drive on snow or mud...what woud you need 4WD for anyway? and... if you need 4WD then the NV231 (PART TIME) is superior.

For those of us that actually NEED a 4WD, the NV231 provides MUCH better traction and does not constantly spin the front driveshaft. It goes in/out of 4wd with the flick of the wrist at any time. plus, the front tires will not wear out extremely fast as on the NV242 xfer case.

ANYONE that has owned a full-time 4WD based on a simple open differential in the xfer case will attest to the excessive front tire wear.

bpeebles

These are NOT the same XFER case.
(Dakota NV242 -vs- Jeep Selec-trac)

bpeebles

Great find! That URL says it all. A good explanation of the wheel-speed problem and a decent attempt to explain how full-time 4wd overcomes these problems.(But does not fully explain what is LOST in the process of allowing the wheels to spin at different speeds.)

This reminds me of a multi-car accident that occurred during a snowstorm recently. The out-of-stater that had caused the accident by sliding into another lane was interviewed and said something like... "It must be my full-time 4WD was not working" ... This man actually thinks that 4WD allows him to drive at any speed he wishes!
They will allow anyone to drive a 4WD ;-)

andy_jordan

It seems like I write this post about once a month, hopefully with winter nearly over it will ease up. I do not offer myself as the oracle on this subject, but I do have substantial 4 wheel driving experience in some fairly extreme conditions.

As far as I am concerned full time 4wd is a waste of money in a modern vehicle. The effort required to shift to 4wd is minimal in the modern vehicle where shift-on-the-fly is the norm. It is literally no more effort than changing gear, but without the need to declutch. Full time costs more in initial cost, running costs (less fuel efficient) and maintenance costs.

It has a marginal benefit over a vehicle in two wheel drive mode in some situations. In my opinion all of these situations are ones where the intelligent, safety conscious driver will already have shifted into 4wd (lock). Examples are bridges and ramps in marginal weather conditions. Full time 4wd tends to encourage people to think that they have full 4wd capabilities, and we all know that many people think they are immune to the road conditions in 4wd.

I don't care what dealer employees say, the centre differential in a full time system is open unless it is locked via the transfer case. Now someone tell me what advantage an open 4wd system has over a locked one in marginal (or bad) conditions, or what benefit 4wd offers on warm dry pavement and I will buy the hype. Until then - it is your money, but in my opinion it would be far better invested in a part time system with limited slip - spend the rest on something else.

henne

what andy just said, ditto for me.

robert

p.s. thanks for all that typing andy, makes less typing for me hahaha

andy_jordan

I could just cut and paste from the last times that I worte it, or better yet link to it. I guess I just have too much verbal diarrhea!!!

Oh well, you can do it next time.

ozark

Andy is right. Seems to me that one of the selling points for the Dakota Quad is the shift of the fly part-time system. Have a similar system on the Cherokee and wouldn't trade it for the full-time system. Part of this whole thing is being in control of the vehicle and using your brain as well as your foot to drive with. I like have some sense of knowing how the vehicle will respond in a given situation. Too some extent the full-time systems tend to take this away. Here in the Ozark mountains we get occasionally snows and have plenty of off-road opportunities the rest of the year. Maybe up North in ice and snow country the full-time 4x4 system might make sense but I kind of doubt it. But I ordered a 4x4 part-time with limited slip and am confident it will meet my needs. Like Andy suggested, I'll be spending the savings on other things like tonneau covers, tubular side steps, aftermarket stereo upgrades, or considering the prices, GAS.

bpeebles

(ozark) (andy_jordan) (henne) I was beginning to think that I was all alone. It is good to hear some intellegence about that full-time NV242 xfer case. (Waste of $$)

To quote Andy Jordan;
"Full time costs more
in initial cost, running costs (less fuel
efficient) and maintenance costs."

Adding my own summary;The FRONT tires will be the first to slip and you loose steering control too!!

themacguy

I particularly like ozark's "using your brain... to drive with" part. As most Texans and other flatlanders seem to find out the hard way (except maybe the hard core skiers), there's no experience like snow experience! #-O

catnip2377

Thanks for all your insight into the full time system, however it would be nice to have some feedback on dakota owners who actually have the system (If there is any?!)

Thanks again

Also does anybody know if there will be any changes made to the 2001 model year? It would be nice to see the third door option on the club cab.

henne

well, im taking my quad from the mississippi coast to kansas city area for the weekend, about 14 hours one way and ill be towing a 6x12 u-haul trailor round trip also, well see how this puppy does out of overdrive on a long trip like this. i have the 4.7, auto, 3.92 and 4x2.

wish me luck everyone,

robert

carls5

Robert, you didn't say if you had a V6 or V8 but if you have a V8 your configuration is identical to what I have on order. I am interested how the trip goes. Plse post how it how it handle, MPG, etc.
Thanks
Carl

db7700

I placed an order for a 4x4 Quad Cab in late Feb. and was wondering if anyone knows about how long it may take before I get it. I'm getting anxious.

db7700

When my Dakota finally arrives, should the oil be immediately changed to synthetic? Same question for the TXMN.

andy_jordan

Conventional wisdom says that you should use regular oil until your truck is run in and everything is seated properly. The use of synthetics can prevent everything from seating as it should for one of the very reasons that you would switch to synthetic in the first place - smaller, more consistent molecules.

That said many people feel that the tolerances on modern engines are such that there would be no problem, often quoting Corvettes as an example - they are shipped with Mobil 1 in them.

My personal view, and the course I have taken, is to switch to synthetic at the first oil change (regular maintenance schedule) or second oil change (accelerated maintenance schedule). This way the engine is fully run in and you have minimized the likelihood of anything going wrong.

aerohead

I've had my Quad 4.7/auto/3.55/full time 4x4 for about a month now, with about 1500 miles on it. During that time here in Minnesota, we've had a 10" snow storm and most recently sunny 75 degree days. I've gotten to drive the full time system in many extremes of road conditions during that time.
First I must say that I bought the full time system with my wife in mind. She had problems with our 93 Ranger 4x4 and it's part time system in 'marginal' road conditions. Eventually I found that she was leaving the truck in locked 4x4 all the time in the winter, which really eats up the tires and causes wear on the system.
Our 97 Expedition had an 'all wheel drive' setting which she could leave on all the time and worked well on the patchy snow--dry--ice conditions we see in the North.
As for experiences with the new Quad, so far it has worked very well in dry and snow conditions. Once the snow gets as deep as the axles, you better be in 'locked' 4x4. If not, the tire with the least amount of traction will just spin. But, when going from dry to snow to dry again, the full time system works great. There is no 'fish tailing' or loss of control on an snowy curve in the road.
As for the extra cost and weight arguments, I agree that this system is not as 'cost effective' as the part time unit for those who want a 4x4. If I still lived in the South and only used 4x4 for back roads and sandy beaches, I would have gone with the part time unit.
For mileage, I've seen 15.5 mpg overall in 1500 miles of mixed driving. My latest (dry) road trip of 450 miles saw 17.3 mpg while averaging 72mph. So far, I don't regret the full time purchase at all. That's saying a lot for a 'Ford' guy who once swore he'd never be stupid enough to buy a Dodge. If the next 150,000 miles go as well as the first 1500, I'll end up a 'Dodge' guy....

bigal31

Sorry it took so long to get back to you!You wanted to know the RPM's at 75 mph w/ 4.7L 3.55.31" tires. Well I just tested it, a little over 2200.If I was turning 2500 (yours) I think I'd be around 90 mph! Wow, are your sure your reading your tach. right? I hope you don't have long stretches to run. Let me know.
Allen

tpmiller1

How often do you change oil/filter and what brand(s) do you use or recommend? I have read just enough to be confused about this topic. Regardless of how long I intend to keep the quad, I would like to have the records show how it was maintained.

andy_jordan

I follow the regular maintenance schedule as recommended by Dodge - choose your schedule depending upon your driving - they are in the back of the owner's manual.

I always change the oil and the filter together (I know some people prefer to change the filter mid way through the period as well - but I don't see the need).

I use Mobil 1 oil and Mobil 1 filters - I am told Wix filters are also good, but have no experience. All of the full synthetics are going to be more than adequate if you change on schedule, but take care with the filters. I would never, under any circumstances, use Fram filters.

I always keep a note of dates and odometer readings of changes and also a note of the oil and filter used - just in case I change. I also keep purchase receipts to prove to a prospective that I didn't just make the numbers up.

Incidentally, don't be surprised if you find that the oil appears to be overfilled if you use the Dodge capacity for the 4.7 (7 quarts I believe).

bookitty

Read post #77 for some home brewed insight. Hope this helps.

Bookitty

chadc777

Allen, thanks for the comparison. your setup at 2200 is only slightly higher than my 2000-2100 (we're setup the same except a 5.2L).

Johnboy has a 3.92 rear so his 2500 rpm at 75 is about right. That is the price one pays for a geared down rearend. Better towing / acceleration at the cost of cruising at higher rpm and worse mileage.

For only occasional heavier towing or only towing light utility trailers, etc., make mine a 3.55.

Chad

bpeebles

Andy,
Good info on synth-oil, If you are in your Dak for the long-haul... synth oil may be econonomical.
There are some REALLY GOOD shareware software packages that can track all of your vehicles. They 'learn' your driving habits, produce graphs of MPG and FUEL COST... and , best of all, they remind you of EVERY upcoming maintenance event for your beloved Dakota. I know the TRUE operating cost-per-mile for all three of family vehicles.

BTW...The recommended oil capacty for the 4.7 (With recommended-size filter)is 6 Quarts. (Not 7)

I have read many appends about it appearing over-full at times on the 4.7L. Right from the factory (7miles on Odemeter) my rig appeared over-full when cold. (All oil in crankcase) But when checked several minutes after running, it has always been RIGHT ON THE MARK of the dipstick.

Perhaps you are thinking of that situation instead?

themacguy

a_j - dittos on the change schedules and brands, etc.

My dipstick registers 1/2 quart low at 5 quarts warm fill - adding 1/2 after quick start / run / then off - to bring to 6 quarts. May be 'some' deviation among many vehicles regarding the dipstick tube or the way people check, etc. But most likely the film & residual oil left in the engine when changing accounts for the 'little bit too much' refill issue - I worked in a gas station changing oil / washing cars / busting flats for 3 years in high school & my brother taught me to use 1/2 qt. less oil than normal upon refilling the crankcase until warmed up / then add whatever was needed to top off. So 5 1/2 to 5 3/4 qts. is a 'perfect' fill on mine. The leftover 1/4 to 1/2 qt. I use over the 3k interval between changes...

balser

because I'm tired of waiting. I'm 99% sure I'm cancelling tomorrow. Ordered 11/23, and now the thing is on restriction again. This time it's the 4.7. I've heard plenty of you say you ordered after me, and your trucks are built or scheduled. I don't know if it's a problem with DC or the dealer - but it stinks. This whole process has been very frustrating - to the point I don't even look forward to getting the truck. The dealer has been friendly and all, but no real help in getting the thing moving. DC customer service and the zone reps have been totally useless. They haven't offered anything (other than excuses) to keep me interested.

Aerohead - thanks for the input. Sounds like the full time transfer case would have done exactly what I wanted.

Think I'll head over to the Subaru forum now and see how boring 20+ mpg can be.

2drive

Andy, why would you never use Fram Filters?? What is their shortcoming? I have used only Fram filters and 10W-40 Penzoil on my 2.2L and so far have 392,000 miles on the all-original engine.

jwm2

Here is a site you might want to check out for starters about the fram filters.
Jim


http://members.xoom.com/minimopar/oilfilterstudy.html

johnboy9

Hey, you really know how to hurt a guy .Anybody
want to trade a 3:55 for a 3:92 ? I could live
with 2000 rpm`s at 75.I must admit it has alot of
power off the line but I`m more interested in
highway acceleration and gas mileage.I`m an old
~#*& !Thanks for the comparison .
Johnboy

haddon

Don't leave me all alone, ordered mine 11/22. Status on 3/7 was bx.I am also fed up but I am keeping my order active waiting for a supercrew ford to show up on the lot and see what kind of a deal I can get on that. Don't cancell unless you have found something else to take it's place.

andy_jordan

wouldn't argue with much anything I read at the link posted by jwm2. Fram has a huge share of the market but, in my opinion, just has less quality. I have always used anecdotal evidence to stay away from them, but over the last few years there have been a lot of bad reports about them not doing their job properly.

bigal31

Chad sorry about the confusion. Your 5.2L sounds more like it.
Johnnyboy,The interesting thing is that w/ my 3.55 I still have "tire burning" ability. Your 3.92 must be made to tow a bridge,house,train.I'm still sure the 3.92 is a great truck,but what are "you" towing? I would be interested in the cost of changing it to a 3.55.You know aftermarket,or through Dodge? If you travel long distances at all I feel sorry for that 4.7L(beautiful) power plant. 2500 RPM'S at 75mph?The other option is to drive 50-55mph. I'm not trying to be a wiseguy.So don't get me wrong. Anyone with any thoughts?
Allen

tpmiller1

I agree with bookitty. Customer service should provide a detailed explanation of extended delay and I would go up the "food chain" if none is forthcoming. E-mail addresses posted at: www.madisoncountydodge.com/contacts.html
I have actually gotten responses. I wouldn't quit even if I had to get a german translator to speak directly with Daimler and Herr Schremp(?) himself and I would politely want to know what DC is going to "throw in" for your patience.
Keep track of all contact attempts and responses, date-who etc.
Keep this group updated. I'm sure there is a lot of interest here on order fulfillment.

bsparx

The 4 Wheel Parts Wholesalers web page www.4wheelparts.com has some gear sets for sale, with no case changes. Go to their page, click drivetrains, then look in the Genuine Gear section. If you don't see the ring and pinion set you want to change your gearing, give them a call, they can probably help. They show both the 3.92 and the 3.55 for Chrysler / Jeep 8.25" rear diff, but the model years stop early. I haven't called them, I'm happy with my 3.55.
Ben

db7700

Thanks for the synthoil info. Do you use it for your TXMN?

andy_jordan

I drive standard rather than automatic which obviously makes a difference.

Not sure what the recommended maintenance intervals are for that but certainly wouldn't recommend against using a synthetic.

There are few situations where I would not use synthetic over natural. An older engine that has never had synthetic in ti would be one, as would an engine with a propensity to leak.

db7700

Bookitty is right. I just ordered mine last month and I'm starting to worry. I need mine by July 1st because my current car gets returned on a lease (never do that again). I am already taking steps to ensure delivery by then. Take bookitty's advice and establish a friendly relationship with someone that may be able to help you. I'm a pilot and fly to Detroit about once a week. I dropped by the assembly plant to check it out. I know they are making them because I saw it with my own 2 eyes. Of course mine wasn't even scheduled for assembly yet. I did talk to someone face to face, got his card & phone #, and am working with him on the detail of my truck. I don't badger him but I'll call every 2-3 weeks and try to get some info. Good luck!

db7700

Thanks again!

andy_jordan

You're welcome

and

You're welcome

tpmiller1

Can the paint color of an ordered vehicle slow delivery? Am curious as to how the lines are set up, do they do all colors all the time or a bunch of one or two colors at a time?

db7700

From what little I saw the paint color shouldn't matter. Of course they didn't let me wonder around the assembly plant either so I could be wrong. I'm going to Detroit next week and I will try to find out something for you. If anyone else has any questions let me know before Monday March 13th and I'll try to get answers. The dealer told me it could be 2-5 months for delivery. I didn't believe him at first but my contact at the assembly plant confirmed a backlog of orders and not to expect it in 2 months.

c5alive

I find it amazing how many people come to this website with a common bond. It's cool that everybody offers their advise and suggestions.

tpmiller1
I couldn't tell you forsure how the cars are painted. I would guess that they can change color from vehicle to vehicle. It depends on whether their system is automated or not. I've toured the Corvette assembly plant in Bowling Green, KY a couple times. Their painting system is automated, however the vehicles skin is pre-painted prior to being connected to the frame of the car so they do a number of one color then switch to a different color and so on....... If it is done one color at a time, that would sure slow down a few orders.

I am planning on ordering a 2001 Quad cab late summer. What I have learned after reading all of these comments and doing my own research on the quad cab, is that the best quad cab combination (for me) would be:
SLT Quad Cab
4.7L V8
Auto
Shift on the fly 4-wheel (NV231)
3.55 axle
wheel & tire package
Power/Overhead Convenience Group
4-wheel antilock
Skid plate
Power convenience group
Deluxe convenience group
rear sliding window
and the six way power seat

the only question I have is about the seats. I've driven two now (a 4.7 and a 5.9) however both had the split bench 40/20/40. Does anyone have the High-back buckets with the floor console?? How do you like that in comparison? Is it worth the extra $ ?

Other then that, my truck is complete. I think I'm going to get the two tone paint, Patriot blue with the gray bottom with mist gray interior. It's too bad they do not offer a sunroof as an option. However, I suppose that would omit the overhead console.

Any advise on some of the options I want? I basically want the thing loaded up, as you can see. Hopefully by 2001, ordering won't take as long and will not be such a pain.

Thanks

themacguy

Trust me, it's worth the wait - in my case 2 full YEARS. From the time I heard about it to the time I saw the first one was a shade over 23 months... I was also waiting on the Nissan Crew Cab. And the Ford SuperCrew. And mostly just curious about the little Ford Sport Trac. My well documented posts reveal just how much research I've done on this subject.

First and foremost: It bears out that YOUR FIRST IMPRESSIONS ARE USUALLY CORRECT. And mine (even as a dyed in the wool GM guy), plus 6k of driving is that the Dakota Quad Cab is the best new vehicle purchase (car, truck, bike) I've EVER made. I'll put it up $ for $ against ANYTHING MADE ANYWHERE.

And hey DODGE - anyone there listening to 'the few, the proud, the unpaid' selling the 'thousands' for you? Where's YOUR effort!

Semper Fi! osb (off soap box)...

mrb9

Themacguy, get back on that osb.. DC should be reading all of these posts dont you think??. it would make better vehicles and happier customers for everyone. There is some darn good info in these forums that go beyond just "guy talk". WE KNOW WHAT WE WANT AND HOW TO GET IT, and DC and every other car manuf. should pay attention to those of us who actually buy the vehicles. They could learn alot from US!!!! Now I will step off the SB.... MrB9