First off, I would post what part of the country you are in. There is a chance someone on the forum will be able to point you to a dealership that is known to make good deals. Trying to pound the round peg of a good deal into the square hole of some of my local dealerships would be a waste of time. On the other hand, getting super prices without a hassle at other dealerships can be a piece of cake.
If you look at the "special" for the car you are interested in, check the "net cap cost" they show and see how much of the proposed money down goes toward "Cap cost reduction". Add this amount to the new cap and you have the selling price. Then check online (like here at Edmunds) for invoice price, including destination. How close are these numbers? If pretty close, then you can get a decent deal by "doing the special".
As to your trade, if you are wanting rock bottom price on your new Honda you can expect the dealer to be willing to be rock bottom for your trade - or less than you expect. You can try selling the car yourself or see if some place like CarMax might want it.
The dealer can, but probably will not, inflate the money factor on a Honda captive lease. The dealer can't change the residual percentage - that is set and can't be changed by you or the dealer. It does vary with model and trim level, but for the same car it would be the same amount for all.
Look on your lease contract for "cap cost" or "net cap cost". What is that number? It may say cap cost: $xx,xxx cap cost reduction: $1,638.53 net cap cost: $xx,xxx.
Cap cost (not net) is what you paid for the car. You can compare that to the invoice for that model and see what is up.
I got my new accord last jan 10 of 2006. I got the SE 4 cyl. I had a trade in of $1000. They gave me several numbers to where I could negotiate my payment, depending on what I paid at signing. I Leased this car, and he said if I paid $318, I could pay that amount for all of following payments. I leased for 36month, 12k, so I paid $318. BUT, now there are so many good deals on the accords, that I am feeling like I got ripped off. I really wanted an accord with a sunroof, but I didnt get one. I love my accord though, but for my payment, I could be driving a higher model. I really want a sunroof.
But, a salesmen had told me that if I wanted to trade in early for an accord with a sunroof, I could. He said its a honda, it has equity. Well do it for ya. I also asked if I would have to pay to get out of my lease, he said no, but said to let it mature a little longer, like til june then trade in. DID I GET RIPPED OFF? Should I bring this to there attention and possibly they could do something. Though the new accord comes out late this year.
06 accord SE 4cyl 36month, 12k. $318payment bad deal??
What should I do? If anyone could help, that would be greatly appreciated.
sorry, yes you did get ripped off. But thats the way I learnt after getting ripped off few times. Make sure u read each and every post here.
also the sales man gave you bull. you will have to wait till your lease is over. The first year of the car has the maximum depricaiation so June won't help. Just drive and enjoy, we have all been there, also talking to dealer will not help.
I am sorry, but someone can please correct me if I am wrong
wow, so I wonder which model I could be driving if I were to get the deal I should have gotten? I have had it 1 year, so in june it will be a year and a half. Well, I am young, i am 21 and dont look 21 and so they took advantage of me. Also they actually made me pick the car the did not have a spoiler on it. I actually test drove the one with the spoiler, the finance guy said it would make my payment go up like $20. That is insane. Looking back I should have the courage to stand my ground and haggle them a bit. Were talking a peice of fiber glass wing here. I looked at VW's but they didnt want to work with me to get a sunroof, but when I was at honda I just really was so excited to drive an accord that I overlooked it. It really is a beautiful car.
I am getting the new Accord they have launched for the end of the year. I want sunroof, and navigation. IT is a must for the navigation. Im moving. They'll probably give me the run around on that. I know for a fact the hybrid with navi is $500 a month.. and thats they highest you can go on models. but Ill use my 06 SE as a trade.
Rule #1 would be to ask on the forum BEFORE you sign the paperwork.
Rule #2 is to negotiate the price of the car first (to invoice or less) BEFORE saying anything about the lease. You played payments so you have no idea what you paid for the car and if you got a good deal or not.
Also, paying $318 is not that bad if you have a high tax rate and put nothing into the lease. So I can't tell if you got ripped or not. The current lease "special" is $209 a month plus tax but calls for $2,199 at signing. So if you did that deal and paid nothing up front and had a 7% tax rate on the payment you could end up close to $300 a month. If you paid a lot up front and you have a low tax rate, the $318/month is way too high.
What I would do? If you have not done it yet, register online with the Honda ownerlink and then tie your AHFC (you did lease through Honda financial, right?) account into the ownerlink account. Then you can login anytime and see your current payoff. Compare that payoff with the Edmunds/KBB/NADA trade in values. If your car is worth that much or more you might be able to trade it with $0 negative equity or just sell it outright to a dealer like CarMax. Then you can start fresh with a new lease and negotiate the price, negotiate the lease, check it all with others, and drive your new car. If you find (as I suspect) your payoff is more than used trade in value, then you may be stuck. You can (by going through a licensed dealer) sell your car to someone else if the payoff is such that you make money or break even (after paying the dealer some fees).
ok, I thought you got the car recently since the special started. So when u got is last june I don't know if they had a special going on. Maybe at that time is was a good deal. Most of us on this board are discussing current deals going on with AHF and Honda not about offers that we running more than 6 months back. I suggest keep the car until the lease is over, even with the new accord next year they will be selling at a MSRP +
Do all Accords in Southern California have the Partial Emission installed? According to the dealer, I won't be able to find one in Southern California without one, hence the extra $150.
The dealers msrp is 25795 (Base msrp:25,050 + Destination:595 + Partial Emission: 150).
The dealers invoice is 23316 (base invoice:22571 + destination:595 + partial Emission:150)
My cap price is 22449.
Is this a good start point? I did not want to discuss monthly payments until we settled on a cap price.
Did you tell them you are doing a lease? It as been stated that the $750 incentive can't be combined with the cheap lease deal. Your price is well below invoice (by your numbers) so it sounds like it includes the $750 dealer incentive. So on a lease, your price will likely be $750 higher.
You also don't state how much the dealer's doc or prep fee is, a high fee can take some of the good out of a good price.
I got a letter from Honda today inviting me to come lease a new 07 Accord (we are leasing an 05 right now). Anyway, all of the lease deals in the letter expire 2/28/2007.
3 of the 4 listed in the letter are identical in payment and money due at signing to existing deals: I4 LX for $199, SE V-6 for $209, and the EX-L V-6 for $269 (same amount due as the Jan lease specials). The I4 SE deal is not shown, but they have an I4 EX-L lease for $249 with $1,999 due at signing. Missing is the I4 SE for $209 - with the SE V6 and I4 the same price down and per month, the V6 is a much better lease deal. They could still have the I4 SE deal, but it is not shown in the letter.
What it means to folks wanting a lease? No rush, you can get the same deal next month as this month. Since the current $750 dealer incentive can't be combined with the cheap lease, you might want to wait until next month and see what the incentive is and if it can be combined. In the past you could combine these. In any case, you should pay no more next month than this month, so no rush unless you need the car right away.
Those paying cash or financing, I would go ahead and buy since it may not get much better than $750 under invoice w/dealer fees like you can get a some dealers right now.
Yes, I did tell him I planned on leasing (2yr/12K per year). His deal was given 2000 down, I could get it for $239/month. Given a 67% residual, the dealer said it would be $17282.65, so I just calculated the dealers msrp from that to be 25795
You are right as I should ask him about doc/prep fees.
First off, I would like to thank everyone on this forum for their valuable information and experiences.
Today I was able to acquire a 36 month /12kyr lease for a 07 Accord Sedan EX-L V6/auto in NJ for..
$249 a month $2500 Total out of pocket (taxes,dmv, first month, etc etc) The lease was based on a cap cost of approximately $23950. CarsDirect had a cap cost of about $24900. MF .0009 RV 58%
I feel and have been told by others that this is a great deal. Can someone confirm or provide any feedback regarding this?
Again, my thanks to the many of you for making this possible. Thank you
Genearally speaking, deals should get better leading upto mid-spring. They need to clear a lot of inventory before new model intro (which I suspect will happen sooner rather than later since Toyota Camry has been out for a year already) However, keep in mind your selection might be limited in terms of trim, color, etc.
I would also like to point out, it is easily possible to get cap cost below invoice, as much as 500-700. Based on current special deals, if you can avoid $1400 down get get the same monthly payments, it would be a great deal if you can find a dealer in a hole.
Remember the first rule of economics, "supply and demand" If you can find a dealer with big supply and little demand, you are in the "dirver's seat".
In the past, you could combine the cheap lease deals (below market money factors, decent residuals) with dealer incentives to get a cap cost below invoice with nothing "down". The current incentive can't be combined, so invoice is close to out it for a lease deal - unless you dip into the holdback. I don't know that many dealers will be desperate enough this time of year to give all that up - which is 3% of MSRP.
When/if Honda lets us combine any incentive with a cheap lease, then your lease price will be less.
For purchasing, $750 is a lot of incentive and we would rarely (in the past) see more than that except maybe after the new models are out.
yes, it was honda special for 2199 upfront payment & 209/mo for 36 month + tax, reg, doc (129). with NJ 7% tax it should be 223.63 but it looks like my monthly payment of 227.47 includes doc fee of 129.
i'm trying to figure out how all this is calculated but with the #'s on Honda special don't add up nor the #'s on the contract. i used 0.0009 as money factor in my calculation. also, the Honda special says 2199 includes the acquisition fee but the dealer contract doesn't show acquisition fee but it includes registration, doc, tire fee. ------ FEATURED SPECIAL LEASE: Closed-end lease for 2007 Accord Sedan Special Edition V-6 Automatic Transmission (Model CM6647EW) for $209.00 per month for 36 months with a $1,395.00 capitalized cost reduction available to customers who qualify for the AHFC Super Preferred credit tier. Other rates/tiers are available under this offer. $2,199.00 total due at lease signing (includes first month's payment, AHFC upfront acquisition fee, capitalized cost reduction, security deposit. Security deposit waived in featured lease example. Total net capitalized cost and base monthly payment does not include tax, license, title, registration, documentation fees, options, insurance and the like). Not all buyers may qualify.
Subject to limited availability. Through 02/28/2007, to approved lessees by American Honda Finance Corp. Closed end lease for 2007 Accord Sedan Special Edition V-6 Automatic Transmission vehicles (Model CM6647EW), for well qualified lessees. Not all lessees will qualify. Higher lease rates apply for lessees with lower credit ratings. MSRP $24,845.00(includes destination) less the capitalized cost reduction (which may be paid by the suggested dealer contribution) resulting in actual net capitalized cost $21,026.20. Dealer contribution may vary and could affect actual lease payment. Taxes, license, title fees, options and insurance extra. Total monthly payments $7,524.00. Option to purchase at lease end $14,658.55. Lessee responsible for maintenance, excessive wear/tear and 15 cents/mi. over 12,000 miles/year for vehicles with MSRP less than $30,000, but for vehicles with MSRP of $30,000 or more, mileage cost is 20 cents/mi. over 12,000 miles/year. See dealer for complete details.
your deal: cap cost reduction 1638.53 1st month 227.47 (inc. 7% tax) registration fee 196.50 doc fee 129.00 tire fee (?) 7.50 total 2199 and 227.47/mo
special lease: cap cost reduction 1395 1st month 209 acq fee 595 total 2199 + mv,doc,tax and 223.63/mo
your price 22,063.77 against invoice 21,638 I think you paid about 400 over invoice, still a good deal especially if you got the car (color, trim, options) you wanted.
I am curious on whether anyone would know or has seen a deal for an EX-L with navi. I would like to have a quote that requires no money down, and would lease for 36month 12k yr. I am currently in a lease, so when the time comes I could use my car as trade in, but I want I quote that if I were to walk in the door at the dealership, what exactly would be my payments. I have talked to a couple salesmen, and they sorta smile, and make it seem like I cant handle it. I really want navigation, because I am moving. so really its a must. If anyone knows what my payments would be on an EX-L with navi, it would be awesome!!! Thanks so much!!
assuming 2500 included the first month's payment and typical doc(150), and mv(200) for NJ,
your "out of pocket" is $200 and $20/month better than special lease. Overall, about 900 better than the "cheap" lease. If $249 is including tax, than more like 1200 better.
You should be able to figure it out, or I can when I have some time. I think I posted the MF and residuals (they are about the same for all Accords - close, anyway). The car would should have a cap cost of about invoice and you go from there.
You need to pick the car and negotiate the deal, then you do the lease just making sure the MF is right. I don't think you could walk into a dealership and said "I want to lease that car for $300 a month with nothing down" and have them take you serious - they would have to work backwards to see if they were making a killing or losing money on such a deal. They know if you say "I will give you $23,497 for that car including dealer fees and destination" that they can do that or not.
So say you are moving, if you are going to a new state you need to watch out. Different states have different lease tax laws and you could get double taxed if you move to/from the wrong state. In those cases, you are far better off to do the lease from your new state. If you are just moving inside the state state, then never mind.
Keep in mind also that Honda uses a tier system for lease rates. It may be published a certain deal or someone may post a number, but the rates will be higher if you don't qualify for the best rate.
the final total is about what Honda Special states but what I don't understand is what's on my contract & the actual calculation. Another thing is if agreed value is 22063.77, how is gross cap cost 23308.72? What's being added? & shouldn't my contract show the Acquisition fee? 2199 should be of 1st month, acq. fee, & cap cost red but my contract shows as cap cost red, 1 st month & reg. fee
not sure how these guys write up the deal so i would focus on the total as opposed to the breakdown.
my guess would be gross cap includes interest (about $30/mo) and all fees (about 300 in youy case) during the transaction where as agreed value represents purchase price.
Just want to remind you "...water under the bridge..." enjoy your car.
I can't seem to find where you posted the MF and Residuals. How much do they vary by trim and miles? I'd really love to do some number crunching, but I don't want to keep pestering people for MF and Residual numbers.
I am hoping someone can help me get this process started. I am looking to lease the above mentioned car but new to the overall leasing game. I live in NORTHERN NEW JERSEY and started today with a dealer to get a price on this car but everything is greek to me. I know the MSRP of the car is $29,995.00 but after that - I am lost. The dealer I talked to tonight, told me he was selling me the car for $1,000 over invoice but I have no clue what the invoice is. For a 36 month lease, 12k a year the only money due at signing was my first months payment, title /doc fees and plates (~$700) he quoted me $411 a month. This seems (I would think)to be a very high price for this car. This all being said, a few questions:
(a) How do I know what the invoice price is? Is it a set number?
(b) Are the money factor, residual, etc negotiable or are they set?
(c) If a dealer is telling me they are selling me the car at invoice - do they typically go lower then that?
(d) Finally, if anyone lives in my area and has had a good buying experience for this exact car, could you tell me your deal and point me to the dealership?
Again, I am totally new to this. So any help would be greatly appreciated.
I can give you some help. I will state that I believe that $411 quote is excellent. I met someone at work that had gotten an Accord Hybrid, which is about 30k-33k, she said she is paying $500 a month, but she did not state whether she was leasing or not. That $411 quote seems very reasonable, Also for you and others there are sites that you can see how much people are paying right at this moment, You may want to look at Leasetrader.com also, google other similar sites, it will tell you payments they are paying now. $411 with no money down except first payment is great! You are getting a beautiful car, with navi. Also, just to let you know, they will soon this late summer want to be clearing out there 07 inventory, so getting a good deal on an ACCORD EX-L would be awesome during that time, so keep that in mind. If this $411 payment seems too high, you may want to consider getting the $27k car, this car would have the navi and have the 4cylinder, but you would get everything pretty much as the $29k accord. Just look at both trims and see really what the differences are. Your payment will go down a bit.
Also,
Invoice- is the price in which the dealer gets the car for. Therefore when the markup is above that, they get profit.
You may negotiate the MSRP, that is how you lower your payments.
Be strong, stand your ground, they will want to earn your business, do your research, and know when to walk away as well, but in most cases, they will stop you before you do that.
Rule of thumb, look at the car when the dealer is closed, take notes, run some numbers of your own, call other honda dealers for quotes.
Assuming you qualify with good credit, I would look to pay around 30 to 50 per month less. I think any dealer would close the deal for 380/mo with "only money due at signing first months payment, title /doc fees and plates (~$700-30)" Stand your ground and you should do fine.
If you decide to be more aggressive in your bargaining, remember the dealer has to make a profit as well.
Also check out earlier posts, there are some gems.
$1k over invoice is too much. $411/mo. is too much.
You can see invoice prices for cars right here on Edmunds. Just go to the root www.edmunds.com site and click on the New Cars tab. Then choose Honda, Accord, etc. Invoices, MSRPs, and TMVs (true market value according to edmunds' assessment of what people have paid in your area) are all available.
I think the easiest thing you can do is to e-mail dealerships in your area. Tell them the fees you are willing to pay at signing and ask for their best lease payment on the car. You may get 3 replies from 10 dealers, but it should be enough to give you an idea of what the going rate is. If need be, e-mail outside of your area. Take quotes from 40 miles away, if you have to.
I don't know how far north you are, but I suggest contacting Coast Honda (Sea Bright) and Kay Honda (Ocean).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Does anybody know if there are any changes to the Residual and Money Factor in February for the 2007 Accord SE V6 with 15,000 miles per year for 36 months.
I posted back a week ago that in the letter I got from Honda that the lease specials were the same as January's - same payment, same amount due at signing. You are asking about a 15k per year lease, but my feeling would be that if the lease specials - including the SE V-6 with 12k miles per year - are the same then the other leases would be the same.
Normally the only thing that changes between a 12k and 15k per mile lease is the 15k lease has a lower residual. Since the dealer can't change the residual percentage, and the SE v6 lease special is the same as last month, it would follow that the SE V6 lease with 15k miles should be the same - or at worst maybe a further drop of 1% in the residual. But they usually drop all the models at the same time as the model year passes, and not drop one mileage limit at a time.
have any of you guys bought a remote start/alarm for your lease I am wondering if its worth it since your paying full price for something you have to give back in a few years. I want to get it on my accord because I live in NYC and its getting cold and I hate getting into my car when its cold and having to wait for the heat to warm. I got a quote from tarry town honda of 595 for both a alarm and remote start but the only thing is that i will have two different key fobs, is this standard? has anybody gotten in cheaper in this area?
Aren't the Accord door trunk buttons on the key head itself?
Any good stereo shop should be able to install a remote starter / alarm system in your car for you. It WILL cost a bit more than normal since you have to bypass the coded key thing (or in most cases hide a coded blank key under the dash). It also compromises the security of the car - someone could pop the ignition and make it start since the remote start has bypass the protection.
I would call around and get quotes - they should be able to install a system that will work off of a single keyfob. I like stuff made by Directed Electronics (brands like Viper, Python, etc). For a little more money you can get a nicer two-way system that has an LCD screen or lights that confirm to you that your car has started and is running.
Most of the cost of the system is in the install, so it is usually not worth removing it for re-use or sale when done. You could always buy the car off lease and keep it, or find a dealer or someone to buy your car from you off lease at the end (you may have to go through a dealer to avoid double taxes if you sell to a private party).
I have been quoted the following (of course expires today). Accord EX-L V6 automatic sign and drive ($0 upfront costs due), 36 mo, 12k lease for $299/mo. When I calculate the online honda deal it seems like it is a minimum of $330 if you figure in the $2199 down ($269/mo). Is $299 (includes monthly sales tax) a good deal or should I shoot for a lower price. I'm in MA.
Invoice is $25,414 . The lease special has a net cap cost of $24,598.10 with a $1,335.00 cap cost reduction from the buyer (out of the $2,199 due at signing). So the selling price (gross cap cost) would be $25,933.10 on this deal.
All you need to know is what is your negotiated price - the gross cap cost - including the car, destination and any dealer doc or prep fees. If you price for this is at or below invoice ($25,414) then you have a good deal. If your number is higher, then you do not. I don't just a deal by the PAYMENT but by the price of the car with dest and dealer fees (but not lease acq fee, security deposit, taxes, etc). The other numbers should be the same for everyone with the same credit tier approval - so focus on the selling price of the car. If at or below invoice - get it.
As I posted, the letter I got from Honda offered this same car at the same price down and per month in deals that expire 2/28/2007. So I would EXPECT that you should not have to rush into a decision today to lease this car - the same residual and money factor should be available after today.
Note that someone posted prices from some MA area dealers over in the Honda Price Paid forum that were quite a bit below invoice - but those numbers may not be good for a lease deal.
But do I really need those calculations if the per month is good? Especially if I plan to turn the car back in. I looked at many of the posts here and calculate the per month cost for the same vehicle -- usually about $330. Am I missing something? Thanks!!!
You can do what you want, it is your money. The fees and taxes on each deal vary too much to be able to say your payment is a good deal or not. I live in a state with high taxes, but low registration fees, for example. In some states sales tax is due on the full price of the car up front (or rolled into the lease), other states charge tax on the payment.
Tier 1 borrowers should all get the same money factor (unless the dealer jacks it up, which Honda dealers almost never do), the residual will be the same, the cars should be the same as is invoice (most states) - all of the other stuff - tire fees, registration, taxes, etc all vary too much to compare. So you look at the price of the car including dealer fees and destination and compare that to what others ANYWHERE are getting - then you know you are getting a good or bad deal, since everything else is the same.
I would never sign a lease when I did not know what I was paying for the car - but again, you can do what you want.
I could probably research your state tax and local tax and registration laws and how they apply to a lease and work your deal backwards to solve for gross cap cost - but why would I? It is on the contract and/or the deal they offered you - or just ask them for a break down of the numbers and compare to invoice. If they can't or won't, I would go elsewhere.
Ok, I think I am getting it now -- I guess I'm a little thick I have asked the dealer for more details regarding the offer. I'm in MA so my registration and title is only $85, and our sales tax is charged monthly at 5% so those costs are pretty insignificant. Thanks again.
If you are still out there Dennis -- this is the deal. I'm usually pretty good with $ but I don't know how to figure if this is good. The cost for the EX-L V6 auto is $24,230 and the gross cap cost is $25,160. Again my sales tax would be 5% each month (included in the $299/mo figure) and my title and reg fee in MA is $84.50. We don't have any tire fees, etc. I think there doc is $249.
So it appears that I'm well under invoice. She tells me it expires today but of course it seems like it doesn't.
Invoice is $25,414, so at gross cap of $25,160 you are under invoice by a bit - you would have to see if they add the $249 (or whatever) doc fee on top of that or not, if they do then you are right at invoice with the doc fee.
From what I can tell right now, that should be a good price. there is a $750 dealer incentive, but the dealers say they don't get that if you do the cheap lease. So getting way under invoice AND the cheap lease can be tough right now.
Without running all the numbers, I would say this is a good deal.
Keep in mind that in years past, they would sweeten the deals as we got later into the year. These lease numbers are nice right now, but when I leased my wife's Accord we had similar numbers AND the dealers were getting $300+ incentive no matter lease or buy, so we did under invoice and cheap lease. Now that really would not save you that much money over right at invoice with dealer fee - so if all the other numbers look OK (no paint sealant or other add ons) then if you want it, get it, I suppose.
I am always worried about deals that have a nice, round payments - when taxes and fees are included. It always makes me wonder about the deal....
Welcome Joe. Since you are new to the world of leasing, you definitely should check out the following informative articles that are available here at Edmunds.com prior to visiting any dealers: 10 Steps to Leasing a New Car and Calculate Your Own Lease Payment.
Dealer invoice prices for vehicles are indeed a set number. You can look up the invoice price of the exact car that you want by looking up the exact model that you want in the following section of this site: Edmunds.com New Vehicle Pricing.
Vehicles' money factors are set by banks. They are not negotiable in that dealers do not have the authority to lower banks' published money factors. However, dealers are often allowed to mark vehicles' money factors up to add additional hidden, back-end profit to deals. that is why it is important to know exactly what the lease program is like for the vehicle that you want prior to entering into negotiations. Through February 28th, Honda Finance's 36 month, 12,000 mile per year buy rate lease money factor and residual value for the 2007 Accord EX-L V6 with Navigation are .00090 and 56%, respectively.
Dealer invoice is probably the lowest that you will be able to lease an '07 Accord for right now.
That answers all of the questions that you posed. Let me know if you have any more.
Hi thomasp3. Honda's January lease program for the 2007 Accord was extended through February 28th. Here is the current program again for your convenience. Honda Finance's current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2007 Accord SE V6 with 15,000 miles per year are .00090 and 57%, respectively.
Don't worry about getting your Accord before the January program ends, jmpellet. Honda extended its special lease on the 2007 Accord through February 28th. You never mentioned the MSRP or selling price of the car that you are interested in. These numbers will show me how much of a discount you are being given on this car and they will enable me to use Honda's lease program to estimate what your payment should be. Let me know what these numbers are and I'll tell you what I think.
Hey jmpellet. A lease payment may look pretty good on the surface, but it may be possible to beat it. The lower your vehicle's selling price is, the lower your monthly lease payment will be. It is difficult to tell what the lowest possible lease payment on a car or truck is without using its dealer invoice price to calculate its lease payment.
Thanks for your offer of help. I am looking at an EX-L V6 with an MSRP (including dest) of $27,995 and an invoice of $25,278.
I have received initial quotes of gross cap cost (would this be compared to invoice since it would include car, dest, doc fees?) offer of $25160. It seems only marginally below the invoice and I'm in the competitive Boston market.
So...if I am able to negotiate a price that includes dest and doc of $1300 under invoice (others in Boston seem to have gotten quotes this low for purchases and there may be question whether the $750 is for leases also??) at $23,978, how do I even figure out what the monthly cost would be? The online calculator doesn't seem to come close to what I though it would be by plugging in .0009 MF. What is the residual based on?
This is my second lease and I think I did well the first time by luck:)
Thanks for the confirmation. I agreed to buy 3 cars last night. Deal #1 Accord SE V6 36mo/12k sign and drive 275/mo including 6.5% sales tax. Deal #2 Accord SE V6 36mo/15k sign and drive 300/mo including 6.5% sales tax. Deal #3 2007 CRV EX 2WD 36/15k sign and drive 400/mo tax inc. I will breakdown the details for everyone when I do the final paperwork on Sunday (the CRV is inbound). The cars are being purchased and registered in Central Florida.
These are the first cars I have leased while not working in the car business. I was a car salesman and F&I manager for 7 years ending in 2005. I can now appreciate how much car shopping drives everyone crazy. I had done all of my research, knew what I was willing to pay based on calculations I had done with a lease calculator. Knowing exactly what I wanted to buy and not changing what I was willing to pay by one dollar the entire time it took me 3 hours to negotiate the deals, and I left with a headache.
But in the end I got a deal on one hard to get car and paid a fair price on a couple of end of the model run Accords.
I'm looking to lease for the 1st time. They are advertising an Accord LX 4 cycle for 3 years at $189 with $1995 down with 12,000 miles a year. Our tax is 7%. Is this a decent price?
the dealer told me that it wouldn't be covered by my warranty if i got a alarm installed some where else other than a Honda dealership. BUt they dont have the two way alarms just the older versions
the dealer told me that it wouldn't be covered by my warranty if i got a alarm installed some where else other than a Honda dealership. BUt they dont have the two way alarms just the older versions
Sounds like dealer scare tactics to me.
If you get an alarm/remote start installed properly it should pose no problem for the car. Of course it would not be covered under a Honda warranty - it would be covered under the warranty of the alarm maker and/or the installer. But it should have no effect on the warranty on the rest of your Honda.
The Magnuson-Moss Act prevents the dealer from denying your warranty claim for a HONDA part failure just becuase an aftermarket part is on your car. They have to prove the part caused a failure not not just declare your warranty void. SEMA is quite active in fighting these problems, so the page at this link for more information.
Also, keep in mind that while Honda does have an OEM alarm system (for cars not factory equipped) they do not have an OEM remote start system. So whatever the dealer is going to install (or more likely farm out to get installed) is NOT going to be a "genuine Honda" item anyway. Most dealers would install the OEM stuff - it comes with complete instructions and is custom fit, very few dealers would have any interest in putting in an aftermarket remote starter themselves. They will use some local shop they trust to do it. Find that shop and just take your car there - you get the same thing w/o the middle man mark up. Or just ask around and find local places that do quality work and get a quotes.
Comments
If you look at the "special" for the car you are interested in, check the "net cap cost" they show and see how much of the proposed money down goes toward "Cap cost reduction". Add this amount to the new cap and you have the selling price. Then check online (like here at Edmunds) for invoice price, including destination. How close are these numbers? If pretty close, then you can get a decent deal by "doing the special".
As to your trade, if you are wanting rock bottom price on your new Honda you can expect the dealer to be willing to be rock bottom for your trade - or less than you expect. You can try selling the car yourself or see if some place like CarMax might want it.
The dealer can, but probably will not, inflate the money factor on a Honda captive lease. The dealer can't change the residual percentage - that is set and can't be changed by you or the dealer. It does vary with model and trim level, but for the same car it would be the same amount for all.
Dennis
07 Accord SE V6 for $227.47/month for 36 months, 12k miles/yr.
Is that a good deal? am i paying close to invoice?
msrp 23308.72
residual value 14658.55
i paid 2199.00 at dealer itemized as below:
cap cost reduction 1638.53
1st month 227.47 (inc. 7% tax)
registration fee 196.50
doc fee 129.00
tire fee (?) 7.50
i thought i must pay bank fee of 595 upfront but it doesn't show on contract.
also, is there a fee when i return the car after lease period?
thanx much,
Confused....
you should be able to trade-in and walk out with $0 down and 210/mo +tax if you shop around and stand your ground.
usair above got the deal of the year on SE I4 auto @ 170/mo.
hope this help
Cap cost (not net) is what you paid for the car. You can compare that to the invoice for that model and see what is up.
Dennis
I got my new accord last jan 10 of 2006. I got the SE 4 cyl. I had a trade in of $1000. They gave me several numbers to where I could negotiate my payment, depending on what I paid at signing. I Leased this car, and he said if I paid $318, I could pay that amount for all of following payments. I leased for 36month, 12k, so I paid $318. BUT, now there are so many good deals on the accords, that I am feeling like I got ripped off. I really wanted an accord with a sunroof, but I didnt get one. I love my accord though, but for my payment, I could be driving a higher model. I really want a sunroof.
But, a salesmen had told me that if I wanted to trade in early for an accord with a sunroof, I could. He said its a honda, it has equity. Well do it for ya. I also asked if I would have to pay to get out of my lease, he said no, but said to let it mature a little longer, like til june then trade in. DID I GET RIPPED OFF? Should I bring this to there attention and possibly they could do something. Though the new accord comes out late this year.
06 accord SE 4cyl 36month, 12k. $318payment bad deal??
What should I do? If anyone could help, that would be greatly appreciated.
also the sales man gave you bull. you will have to wait till your lease is over. The first year of the car has the maximum depricaiation so June won't help. Just drive and enjoy, we have all been there, also talking to dealer will not help.
I am sorry, but someone can please correct me if I am wrong
wow, so I wonder which model I could be driving if I were to get the deal I should have gotten? I have had it 1 year, so in june it will be a year and a half. Well, I am young, i am 21 and dont look 21 and so they took advantage of me. Also they actually made me pick the car the did not have a spoiler on it. I actually test drove the one with the spoiler, the finance guy said it would make my payment go up like $20. That is insane. Looking back I should have the courage to stand my ground and haggle them a bit. Were talking a peice of fiber glass wing here. I looked at VW's but they didnt want to work with me to get a sunroof, but when I was at honda I just really was so excited to drive an accord that I overlooked it. It really is a beautiful car.
I am getting the new Accord they have launched for the end of the year. I want sunroof, and navigation. IT is a must for the navigation. Im moving. They'll probably give me the run around on that. I know for a fact the hybrid with navi is $500 a month.. and thats they highest you can go on models. but Ill use my 06 SE as a trade.
Thanks alot.
Rule #2 is to negotiate the price of the car first (to invoice or less) BEFORE saying anything about the lease. You played payments so you have no idea what you paid for the car and if you got a good deal or not.
Also, paying $318 is not that bad if you have a high tax rate and put nothing into the lease. So I can't tell if you got ripped or not. The current lease "special" is $209 a month plus tax but calls for $2,199 at signing. So if you did that deal and paid nothing up front and had a 7% tax rate on the payment you could end up close to $300 a month. If you paid a lot up front and you have a low tax rate, the $318/month is way too high.
What I would do? If you have not done it yet, register online with the Honda ownerlink and then tie your AHFC (you did lease through Honda financial, right?) account into the ownerlink account. Then you can login anytime and see your current payoff. Compare that payoff with the Edmunds/KBB/NADA trade in values. If your car is worth that much or more you might be able to trade it with $0 negative equity or just sell it outright to a dealer like CarMax. Then you can start fresh with a new lease and negotiate the price, negotiate the lease, check it all with others, and drive your new car. If you find (as I suspect) your payoff is more than used trade in value, then you may be stuck. You can (by going through a licensed dealer) sell your car to someone else if the payoff is such that you make money or break even (after paying the dealer some fees).
Dennis
The dealers msrp is 25795 (Base msrp:25,050 + Destination:595 + Partial Emission: 150).
The dealers invoice is 23316 (base invoice:22571 + destination:595 + partial Emission:150)
My cap price is 22449.
Is this a good start point? I did not want to discuss monthly payments until we settled on a cap price.
You also don't state how much the dealer's doc or prep fee is, a high fee can take some of the good out of a good price.
Dennis
3 of the 4 listed in the letter are identical in payment and money due at signing to existing deals: I4 LX for $199, SE V-6 for $209, and the EX-L V-6 for $269 (same amount due as the Jan lease specials). The I4 SE deal is not shown, but they have an I4 EX-L lease for $249 with $1,999 due at signing. Missing is the I4 SE for $209 - with the SE V6 and I4 the same price down and per month, the V6 is a much better lease deal. They could still have the I4 SE deal, but it is not shown in the letter.
What it means to folks wanting a lease? No rush, you can get the same deal next month as this month. Since the current $750 dealer incentive can't be combined with the cheap lease, you might want to wait until next month and see what the incentive is and if it can be combined. In the past you could combine these. In any case, you should pay no more next month than this month, so no rush unless you need the car right away.
Those paying cash or financing, I would go ahead and buy since it may not get much better than $750 under invoice w/dealer fees like you can get a some dealers right now.
Dennis
You are right as I should ask him about doc/prep fees.
Today I was able to acquire a 36 month /12kyr lease for a 07 Accord Sedan EX-L V6/auto in NJ for..
$249 a month
$2500 Total out of pocket (taxes,dmv, first month, etc etc)
The lease was based on a cap cost of approximately $23950.
CarsDirect had a cap cost of about $24900.
MF .0009
RV 58%
I feel and have been told by others that this is a great deal. Can someone confirm or provide any feedback regarding this?
Again, my thanks to the many of you for making this possible.
Thank you
I would also like to point out, it is easily possible to get cap cost below invoice, as much as 500-700. Based on current special deals, if you can avoid $1400 down get get the same monthly payments, it would be a great deal if you can find a dealer in a hole.
Remember the first rule of economics, "supply and demand"
If you can find a dealer with big supply and little demand, you are in the "dirver's seat".
When/if Honda lets us combine any incentive with a cheap lease, then your lease price will be less.
For purchasing, $750 is a lot of incentive and we would rarely (in the past) see more than that except maybe after the new models are out.
Dennis
yes, it was honda special for 2199 upfront payment & 209/mo for 36 month + tax, reg, doc (129).
with NJ 7% tax it should be 223.63 but it looks like my monthly payment of 227.47 includes doc fee of 129.
i'm trying to figure out how all this is calculated but with the #'s on Honda special don't add up nor the #'s on the contract.
i used 0.0009 as money factor in my calculation.
also, the Honda special says 2199 includes the acquisition fee but the dealer contract doesn't show acquisition fee but it includes registration, doc, tire fee.
------
FEATURED SPECIAL LEASE: Closed-end lease for 2007 Accord Sedan Special Edition V-6 Automatic Transmission (Model CM6647EW) for $209.00 per month for 36 months with a $1,395.00 capitalized cost reduction available to customers who qualify for the AHFC Super Preferred credit tier. Other rates/tiers are available under this offer. $2,199.00 total due at lease signing (includes first month's payment, AHFC upfront acquisition fee, capitalized cost reduction, security deposit. Security deposit waived in featured lease example. Total net capitalized cost and base monthly payment does not include tax, license, title, registration, documentation fees, options, insurance and the like). Not all buyers may qualify.
Subject to limited availability. Through 02/28/2007, to approved lessees by American Honda Finance Corp. Closed end lease for 2007 Accord Sedan Special Edition V-6 Automatic Transmission vehicles (Model CM6647EW), for well qualified lessees. Not all lessees will qualify. Higher lease rates apply for lessees with lower credit ratings. MSRP $24,845.00(includes destination) less the capitalized cost reduction (which may be paid by the suggested dealer contribution) resulting in actual net capitalized cost $21,026.20. Dealer contribution may vary and could affect actual lease payment. Taxes, license, title fees, options and insurance extra. Total monthly payments $7,524.00. Option to purchase at lease end $14,658.55. Lessee responsible for maintenance, excessive wear/tear and 15 cents/mi. over 12,000 miles/year for vehicles with MSRP less than $30,000, but for vehicles with MSRP of $30,000 or more, mileage cost is 20 cents/mi. over 12,000 miles/year. See dealer for complete details.
cap cost reduction 1638.53
1st month 227.47 (inc. 7% tax)
registration fee 196.50
doc fee 129.00
tire fee (?) 7.50
total 2199 and 227.47/mo
special lease:
cap cost reduction 1395
1st month 209
acq fee 595
total 2199 + mv,doc,tax and 223.63/mo
your price 22,063.77 against invoice 21,638
I think you paid about 400 over invoice, still a good deal especially if you got the car (color, trim, options) you wanted.
I am curious on whether anyone would know or has seen a deal for an EX-L with navi. I would like to have a quote that requires no money down, and would lease for 36month 12k yr. I am currently in a lease, so when the time comes I could use my car as trade in, but I want I quote that if I were to walk in the door at the dealership, what exactly would be my payments. I have talked to a couple salesmen, and they sorta smile, and make it seem like I cant handle it. I really want navigation, because I am moving. so really its a must. If anyone knows what my payments would be on an EX-L with navi, it would be awesome!!! Thanks so much!!
assuming 2500 included the first month's payment and typical doc(150), and mv(200) for NJ,
your "out of pocket" is $200 and $20/month better than special lease. Overall, about 900 better than the "cheap" lease.
If $249 is including tax, than more like 1200 better.
Either way, well done.
You need to pick the car and negotiate the deal, then you do the lease just making sure the MF is right. I don't think you could walk into a dealership and said "I want to lease that car for $300 a month with nothing down" and have them take you serious - they would have to work backwards to see if they were making a killing or losing money on such a deal. They know if you say "I will give you $23,497 for that car including dealer fees and destination" that they can do that or not.
So say you are moving, if you are going to a new state you need to watch out. Different states have different lease tax laws and you could get double taxed if you move to/from the wrong state. In those cases, you are far better off to do the lease from your new state. If you are just moving inside the state state, then never mind.
Keep in mind also that Honda uses a tier system for lease rates. It may be published a certain deal or someone may post a number, but the rates will be higher if you don't qualify for the best rate.
Dennis
Another thing is if agreed value is 22063.77, how is gross cap cost 23308.72? What's being added? & shouldn't my contract show the Acquisition fee?
2199 should be of 1st month, acq. fee, & cap cost red but my contract shows as cap cost red, 1 st month & reg. fee
my guess would be gross cap includes interest (about $30/mo) and all fees (about 300 in youy case) during the transaction where as agreed value represents purchase price.
Just want to remind you "...water under the bridge..."
enjoy your car.
Any chance you can repost?
check the link for numbers as of 01/08/07
http://forums.roadfly.com/forums/financing/8191363-1.html
(a) How do I know what the invoice price is? Is it a set number?
(b) Are the money factor, residual, etc negotiable or are they set?
(c) If a dealer is telling me they are selling me the car at invoice - do they typically go lower then that?
(d) Finally, if anyone lives in my area and has had a good buying experience for this exact car, could you tell me your deal and point me to the dealership?
Again, I am totally new to this. So any help would be greatly appreciated.
Joe
I can give you some help. I will state that I believe that $411 quote is excellent. I met someone at work that had gotten an Accord Hybrid, which is about 30k-33k, she said she is paying $500 a month, but she did not state whether she was leasing or not. That $411 quote seems very reasonable, Also for you and others there are sites that you can see how much people are paying right at this moment, You may want to look at Leasetrader.com also, google other similar sites, it will tell you payments they are paying now. $411 with no money down except first payment is great! You are getting a beautiful car, with navi. Also, just to let you know, they will soon this late summer want to be clearing out there 07 inventory, so getting a good deal on an ACCORD EX-L would be awesome during that time, so keep that in mind. If this $411 payment seems too high, you may want to consider getting the $27k car, this car would have the navi and have the 4cylinder, but you would get everything pretty much as the $29k accord. Just look at both trims and see really what the differences are. Your payment will go down a bit.
Also,
Invoice- is the price in which the dealer gets the car for.
Therefore when the markup is above that, they get profit.
You may negotiate the MSRP, that is how you lower your payments.
Be strong, stand your ground, they will want to earn your business, do your research, and know when to walk away as well, but in most cases, they will stop you before you do that.
Rule of thumb, look at the car when the dealer is closed, take notes, run some numbers of your own, call other honda dealers for quotes.
Assuming you qualify with good credit, I would look to pay around 30 to 50 per month less. I think any dealer would close the deal for 380/mo with "only money due at signing first months payment, title /doc fees and plates (~$700-30)"
Stand your ground and you should do fine.
If you decide to be more aggressive in your bargaining, remember the dealer has to make a profit as well.
Also check out earlier posts, there are some gems.
good luck.
$411/mo. is too much.
You can see invoice prices for cars right here on Edmunds. Just go to the root www.edmunds.com site and click on the New Cars tab. Then choose Honda, Accord, etc. Invoices, MSRPs, and TMVs (true market value according to edmunds' assessment of what people have paid in your area) are all available.
I think the easiest thing you can do is to e-mail dealerships in your area. Tell them the fees you are willing to pay at signing and ask for their best lease payment on the car. You may get 3 replies from 10 dealers, but it should be enough to give you an idea of what the going rate is. If need be, e-mail outside of your area. Take quotes from 40 miles away, if you have to.
I don't know how far north you are, but I suggest contacting Coast Honda (Sea Bright) and Kay Honda (Ocean).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Normally the only thing that changes between a 12k and 15k per mile lease is the 15k lease has a lower residual. Since the dealer can't change the residual percentage, and the SE v6 lease special is the same as last month, it would follow that the SE V6 lease with 15k miles should be the same - or at worst maybe a further drop of 1% in the residual. But they usually drop all the models at the same time as the model year passes, and not drop one mileage limit at a time.
Dennis
Any good stereo shop should be able to install a remote starter / alarm system in your car for you. It WILL cost a bit more than normal since you have to bypass the coded key thing (or in most cases hide a coded blank key under the dash). It also compromises the security of the car - someone could pop the ignition and make it start since the remote start has bypass the protection.
I would call around and get quotes - they should be able to install a system that will work off of a single keyfob. I like stuff made by Directed Electronics (brands like Viper, Python, etc). For a little more money you can get a nicer two-way system that has an LCD screen or lights that confirm to you that your car has started and is running.
Most of the cost of the system is in the install, so it is usually not worth removing it for re-use or sale when done. You could always buy the car off lease and keep it, or find a dealer or someone to buy your car from you off lease at the end (you may have to go through a dealer to avoid double taxes if you sell to a private party).
Dennis
All you need to know is what is your negotiated price - the gross cap cost - including the car, destination and any dealer doc or prep fees. If you price for this is at or below invoice ($25,414) then you have a good deal. If your number is higher, then you do not. I don't just a deal by the PAYMENT but by the price of the car with dest and dealer fees (but not lease acq fee, security deposit, taxes, etc). The other numbers should be the same for everyone with the same credit tier approval - so focus on the selling price of the car. If at or below invoice - get it.
As I posted, the letter I got from Honda offered this same car at the same price down and per month in deals that expire 2/28/2007. So I would EXPECT that you should not have to rush into a decision today to lease this car - the same residual and money factor should be available after today.
Note that someone posted prices from some MA area dealers over in the Honda Price Paid forum that were quite a bit below invoice - but those numbers may not be good for a lease deal.
Dennis
Tier 1 borrowers should all get the same money factor (unless the dealer jacks it up, which Honda dealers almost never do), the residual will be the same, the cars should be the same as is invoice (most states) - all of the other stuff - tire fees, registration, taxes, etc all vary too much to compare. So you look at the price of the car including dealer fees and destination and compare that to what others ANYWHERE are getting - then you know you are getting a good or bad deal, since everything else is the same.
I would never sign a lease when I did not know what I was paying for the car - but again, you can do what you want.
I could probably research your state tax and local tax and registration laws and how they apply to a lease and work your deal backwards to solve for gross cap cost - but why would I? It is on the contract and/or the deal they offered you - or just ask them for a break down of the numbers and compare to invoice. If they can't or won't, I would go elsewhere.
Dennis
So it appears that I'm well under invoice. She tells me it expires today but of course it seems like it doesn't.
HELP!
From what I can tell right now, that should be a good price. there is a $750 dealer incentive, but the dealers say they don't get that if you do the cheap lease. So getting way under invoice AND the cheap lease can be tough right now.
Without running all the numbers, I would say this is a good deal.
Keep in mind that in years past, they would sweeten the deals as we got later into the year. These lease numbers are nice right now, but when I leased my wife's Accord we had similar numbers AND the dealers were getting $300+ incentive no matter lease or buy, so we did under invoice and cheap lease. Now that really would not save you that much money over right at invoice with dealer fee - so if all the other numbers look OK (no paint sealant or other add ons) then if you want it, get it, I suppose.
I am always worried about deals that have a nice, round payments - when taxes and fees are included. It always makes me wonder about the deal....
Dennis
Dealer invoice prices for vehicles are indeed a set number. You can look up the invoice price of the exact car that you want by looking up the exact model that you want in the following section of this site: Edmunds.com New Vehicle Pricing.
Vehicles' money factors are set by banks. They are not negotiable in that dealers do not have the authority to lower banks' published money factors. However, dealers are often allowed to mark vehicles' money factors up to add additional hidden, back-end profit to deals. that is why it is important to know exactly what the lease program is like for the vehicle that you want prior to entering into negotiations. Through February 28th, Honda Finance's 36 month, 12,000 mile per year buy rate lease money factor and residual value for the 2007 Accord EX-L V6 with Navigation are .00090 and 56%, respectively.
Dealer invoice is probably the lowest that you will be able to lease an '07 Accord for right now.
That answers all of the questions that you posed. Let me know if you have any more.
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I have received initial quotes of gross cap cost (would this be compared to invoice since it would include car, dest, doc fees?) offer of $25160. It seems only marginally below the invoice and I'm in the competitive Boston market.
So...if I am able to negotiate a price that includes dest and doc of $1300 under invoice (others in Boston seem to have gotten quotes this low for purchases and there may be question whether the $750 is for leases also??) at $23,978, how do I even figure out what the monthly cost would be? The online calculator doesn't seem to come close to what I though it would be by plugging in .0009 MF. What is the residual based on?
This is my second lease and I think I did well the first time by luck:)
These are the first cars I have leased while not working in the car business. I was a car salesman and F&I manager for 7 years ending in 2005. I can now appreciate how much car shopping drives everyone crazy. I had done all of my research, knew what I was willing to pay based on calculations I had done with a lease calculator. Knowing exactly what I wanted to buy and not changing what I was willing to pay by one dollar the entire time it took me 3 hours to negotiate the deals, and I left with a headache.
But in the end I got a deal on one hard to get car and paid a fair price on a couple of end of the model run Accords.
Sounds like dealer scare tactics to me.
If you get an alarm/remote start installed properly it should pose no problem for the car. Of course it would not be covered under a Honda warranty - it would be covered under the warranty of the alarm maker and/or the installer. But it should have no effect on the warranty on the rest of your Honda.
The Magnuson-Moss Act prevents the dealer from denying your warranty claim for a HONDA part failure just becuase an aftermarket part is on your car. They have to prove the part caused a failure not not just declare your warranty void. SEMA is quite active in fighting these problems, so the page at this link for more information.
Also, keep in mind that while Honda does have an OEM alarm system (for cars not factory equipped) they do not have an OEM remote start system. So whatever the dealer is going to install (or more likely farm out to get installed) is NOT going to be a "genuine Honda" item anyway. Most dealers would install the OEM stuff - it comes with complete instructions and is custom fit, very few dealers would have any interest in putting in an aftermarket remote starter themselves. They will use some local shop they trust to do it. Find that shop and just take your car there - you get the same thing w/o the middle man mark up. Or just ask around and find local places that do quality work and get a quotes.
Dennis