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Comments
Actually, that's not true.
In _general_, gas engines are most efficient with a wide-open throttle. With a partially open throttle there are pumping losses, and effectively a lower compression ratio, since the piston isn't compressing as much air. Finally, a higher-revving engine is losing more power due to internal friction.
This is why standard cars (i.e., non-hybrid) don't get their best gas mileage at low speed - there's less wind resistance at, say, 30 MPH, but the engine's efficiency drops off so much that it matches the reduction in friction.
Now, with older carbureted engines, there were frequently fuel enrichment valves which opened when the throttle was wide open. The requirement for emissions control curtailed that somewhat, and I'm certain that fuel-injected engines now don't have such a feature.
So you'll find a standard emissions-controlled gasoline engine gets its best mileage with a wide-open throttle at low RPMs.
If you check out people who compete in gas mileage contests, you'll see they use this feature of gasoline engines, putting the car in top gear, flooring the throttle at 10 MPH (!), then putting the car in neutral and turning off the engine at around 30 MPH. Once they've coasted down to about 10 MPH they repeat the process.
This, also, is the biggest reason hybrids get better gas mileage, and much more so at city speeds than on the highway. A hybrid will generally run its engine with a fairly wide-open throttle while charging up the batteries, then turn off the engine and run on electric alone until the batteries' charge drops to a specified amount (it's the electronic equivalent of the 10MPH-30MPH-10MPH mileage fanatics).
Unfortunately for the Fit, it (at least the automatic version running at 5000 foot altitudes) simply doesn't have enough oomph to keep going 75 up most inclines while in 5th gear (I tried this during the last trip from Casper to Denver). So it's a viable option only when running at the speed limit is NOT a high priority, and when traffic is light enough that you're not causing a jam by slowing down on the uphill segments.
I guess it's just as well that the Fit isn't as powerful as my '93 Civic (it _does_ have maybe 5% more horsepower, but the Fit is much taller, and weighs about 20% more, so the Civic can make the entire Casper-Denver trip at 75 mph in 5th gear). Why do I say that? Because our Fit is SO quiet and smooth that it would be quite easy to be doing 90 or more without knowing it, if the car actually had enough power. Our insurance is high enough without incurring big speeding tickets.
And city MPG is worse than highway mpg due to the physics of moving a stationary object (ie stop and go traffic) versus one in motion.
And hybrids get better city mpg because they're running on pure battery.
Is there a source of information to find out if my particular car, 96 Riviera supercharged V6, gets better MPG at 55 mph or 60 mph, all else being equal?
Is there a rule of thumb concerning when to use AC vs. roll the windows down when it comes to MPG?
Does using the sun roof vent increase drag enough to affect MPG?
Comment: Synthetic oil, performance air filter, and slowing to 55-60 mph has gotten me up to 28 MPG on my mostly freeway commute.
That being said, the affects of open windows and AC use on MPG will vary between cars. If you have one of the old cars with giant V-8, then the fact that the AC is on may not be significant enough to make much of a difference in MPG. It will affect it, but maybe by only a fraction of a percent. On the other hand, if you have a tiny 4cyl engine, the affect of the AC may have a greater percentage loss of MPG.
It's sort of the same as if you have a 4cyl Kia Rondo with 1 passenger and a Suburban with 1 passenger. Check the MPG. Then add 6 more passengers of equal weight to each vehicle and check the affect to MPG. And then crank the AC in both cars. I'd bet that the MPG drop as a percentage will be greater in the Rondo.
I am not an aggressive driver, and it's not that hilly where I am. The traffic can be very stop-and-go, though. I haven't yet taken it on a long road trip so cannot say about true highway mileage.
I'm disappointed to hear about the variation in mileage and that Honda can't figure it out. I definitely plan on complaining to the dealer at my 5K oil change if things aren't significantly better.
Considering the fit is rated at high 20's for city mpg, your 26 average for the conditions (which are quite bad) you drive in are not too shabby.
try going on a long road trip, you'll be happier. don't worry about inconsistencies either, as sites like this are foodder for people who love to report bad gas mileage. for all you know, someone could just have it out for the fit, and make up some legitamite sounding story just to talk crap.
I know on the Fit the a/c cycles on and off even when the ac light is on. So perhaps the Fit ac is different the Cr-v. What I don't know is if adding warm air makes it cycle off more or whether it's just wasting energy.
It's a bit of a pain, but you can decrease a/c cut into mpg by turning off the a/c when you're accelerating and climbing hills. After a while it becomes second nature to turn the button on and off.
With the "NON" Climate Control systems, the temp knob can be used to act as kind of a POOR MANS' climate control.
Personally, I put the "Recirculate" into action and turn the AC on and off when needed. Usually ON when going down hill. :shades:
Kip
I managed to get 39.7mpg last tank _with_ a/c on some of the time this last tank (100+ degrees out!), so I must be doing something right. ;-)
100 degree Outside air coming into the car thru the AC will be a bit cooler than recirculate, only if the car has been sitting and gotten really hot inside. However once the inside has dropped to below the temp of outside, the AC will be much more efficient (Colder) on recirculate.
The colder the inside gets, the colder the AC gets.
If my car has been sitting in the sun and heated up inside, I will usually get it moving with the windows down for long enough to get that hot air out. Then to recirculate mode. :shades:
Kip
Averaged 32.6 mpg driving mostly in suburbia with 95+ degree weather, and with tons of boxes in the back (finally finished our move!). Not to shabby for an engine that just BARELY completed its break in. (we've got about 650 miles on him now, and we got him last thursday.)
looking forward to this next tank, as it will involve our normal freeway/highway route to and from work, with lots of cruising.
Did you trade something in on it? The bunny?
we were putting to many miles on him, and the service was getting out of control. While the vw held its value better than i thought, its still no honda.
I missed the big H.
we love it. the process was quick and painless, and i like breaking 30mpg now!
the handling is superb as well. My bunny was no slouch, not at all, but its not as taut, and tuned for high speed cruising, not exactly corner carving.\
But yeah, we love it!
Honda Fit Sport 5AT. Blue
27 MPG. Worst
41.4 MPG. Best mileage. 300 mile round trip with 50% A/C
33-35 MPG. Everyday *
*This is mixed City/Hwy with A/C and hilly Cincinnati terrain. 30 mile round trip. Still going easy on the engine and have yet to open up the throttle. The car is always run in "D" mode. I engine break on hills and during stopping cycles.
My first fill-up was about 37MPG and I was bragging like I just had my first child. The next couple of fill-ups were in the 27MPG range which is good, but 5 less than my 2000 Civic.
Took a day trip from Cincinnati to Granville OH. A/C was running during the outbound leg. My Fit ran 41+MPG. I was jumping for joy.
I now have about 1800 miles on the car and am getting 33-34MPG on my workday commute. The A/C is running about 65% of the time.
I expect my MPG to increase by 2-4 with the AirCon off. Agree?
oh, and my third tank was another 32 mpg. a/c on about 90% of the time, with about 70/30 highway/city.
To get the revs at 40 and 50 just do the math - it is directly proportional.
A 6 speed manual would be welcome - as long as the first 5 gears stayed the same and the 6th was taller. The Versa has a 6 speed and still revs about the same as the Fit - makes no sense to me.
Try it and listen to your machine. It will tell you when the time is right to shift.
[non-permissible content removed] luck!
Jack H.
On a 200 mile roadtrip to New Hampshire, I still only averaged about 30 mpg with minimal congestion or stopping. I'm hoping things improve after the car is fully broken in.
At what speed do you drive on the highway going to New Hampshire?
Highway cruising between 70 and 75, occasionally faster (never more than 80) but more often slower.
People driving a lot of bigger cars/CUVs/minvans with 18-20 EPA mpg city ratings often find that they only get about 15mpg in city driving, or about 20% less than the old EPA. So if the old EPA for the Fit is 33mpg and you're also getting 20% less, that would make it 26-27mpg real-world city.
The driver makes a difference too. For example with our Fit, my wife has been driving it most of the time lately and the last MPG was only 28. The worst I've ever had was 30mpg. And the MPG variation is pretty big too. With my wife driving 100% of the time in city/suburb driving, I can easily see our Fit only getting 26MPG, while if I'm driving in the same conditions I'd get about 30mpg. On the highway I can get just over 40MPG if I keep the speed at 65mph. We have a sport auto Fit.
In general our Fit gets about 40% better MPG than our bigger car, a Ford Freestyle, in the same types of driving conditions.
If MPG was our sole issue, then I would have just bought a Civic or Corolla, but then on weekend trips, vacations, for large grocery trips, etcs, we would have had to take the Freestyle because a Corolla or Civic wouldn't have had the space to hold everything. With the Fit's spacious and versatile interior, we're able to use it instead of the big car, so the spaciousness and versatility outweight the poorer MPG as compared to a Civic/Corolla.
It seems that almost every low mileage claim in this thread is countered by apologists for the Fit, as though there's no possible way that poorer-than-expected mileage could be any fault but the driver's, or just be happy with the mileage you do get because it's still better than other cars.... not so helpful!
My original question pertained to my optional wheels (whether they're adding weight), and I'm also wondering if the engine computer could be set to a fuel/air mix that skews high. And to cover all bases: I've double checked my tire pressure and my A/C use has been low to moderate.
On the other hand, MPG is affected by the driver, conditions and car, so if the driver and the conditions remain constant, then I'd look to the vehicle. Every Fit is mechanically different than every other Fit. It's true with any car. I'm sure some Fit owners will have engines lasting 200,000+ miles, while others may have multiple problems before reaching 50,000 miles. It's due to the fact that each component of any car is made up of parts that are not manufactured 100% identical, so the sum of the little differences can add up to mechanical breakdowns at different points.
In the same way, MPG for any car is a broad range. Perhaps this is the first vehicle you've bought where mechanically it's at the low end of the EPA range and you're pretty much stuck with this fact no matter how much you modify your driving style.
So yes, while driving style and conditions affect MPG, the inherent MPG of a vehicle is a range and not a specific number. Some folks are lucky to get cars high in the mechanical EPA range while others do not. Most are somewhere in the middle. And then you add to that conditions and driving style.
If you're used to beating the EPA estimates and now you're not, get the vehicle checked out by an independent mechanic and if there's nothing mechanically wrong, then you'll just have to live with the MPG you're getting, but you can't blame the whole line of Fits...just the particular one you're driving.
Wow, I'm not quite sure where you got that I was blaming the whole line of Fits. If I'm citing how others here get great mileage and I want to figure out a way to match them, obviously I believe their reports are true! And, by the same virtue, I think there might be something amiss with the particular Fit I'm driving.
Anyway. I guess I'll ask the dealer when I bring it in for the first scheduled maintenance to check it out. Do you think there's a real advantage to asking an independent mechanic? Would Honda have an incentive not to help me get better mileage? (not sarcasm, a real question)
Actually, there is no incentive for Honda to spend a lot of time trying to test an analyze your low MPG. It's easier for them just to say, "it's in the appropriate range." at least as a warranty item. Now if you're willing to pay them $80/hour (or whatever the rate in your area) for them to run different tests you can do that and it should be okay.
I drive my Sport AT in florida (almost always a flat terrain with very few inclines due to expressway overpasses) with AC always on and driving in suburbia/expressways/short/long distances and drive an average of speed limit plus a few miles over but never over 35-45 in city streets and 75-80mph on the highway. I have calculated an overall average of 25 city/ 34 highway.