The extra 2yr and 150K is worth a lot for resale value. Not sure if you are comforted by Toyota's claim that the battery is good for at least 150k based on extensive lab testing. I am not. If they put it in writing in terms of a warranty for all hybrids irrespective of states, then I would believe it!
Total miles driven: 20,513 Average miles per month: 1,282 Total amount spent on gas: $1,492.13 Average price paid per gallon: $2.67 Average cost per fill-up: $36.39 Average gallons per fill-up: 14.16 Average miles driven per tank of gas: 497.58 Average miles per gallon: 35.1
I keep track of operating cost per mile and (making an assumption on trade in valve) total cost of ownership per mile. My operating cost is about 7cents / mile and total ownership is around 11 cents / mile. My past vehicle ownership costs have been in the 40 to 70 cent range.
Obviously for me the benefit of the $2600 FED and $3750 State tax credits as well as a free tires for life program from my dealer has made this an outstanding ownership experience. I'm guessing right now my trade in value is about equal to my purchase cost less tax credits I'm approaching 31,000 miles and still have a lifetime FE of a little shy of 38.1mpg
I also live on an Island I drive 170 miles round trip 5 days a week to Seattle. I have a 50th ann. TCH and love it I am on my 4th tank I got over 700 miles the last time I filled up Best MPG has been 42.2 but I can beat that I have 108 miles on the tank right now and am getting 47.9 I actually look forward to traffic on the freeway so I can get even better mpg. On the Island if I keep it at about 40 I feel like I am driving free. I love this car I had a Lexus before this. I gave up some things but the trade offs were worth it. Try to keep the gage that is on the left at 60 for as long as you can. your MPG will increase good luck
I agree how can anyone get less than 35 MPG on this car. Even my wife gets 36 MPG when she drives it and she just drives like a normal car. I wish I could drive the cars that are getting such bad MPG.
I am on my fifth tank and so far I am getting such great "tank ave" that I am doubtful about its accuracy.
However, I think it is entirely possible to get lousy mpg depending on the circumstance. I have seen situations where the engine simply refuse to back down. I can imagine if you make short trips with lots of power offs in between, you will get poor mpg. My weekend trips are typically 30 miles altogether and often involve ~10 poweroffs and ~30 traffic stops. My mpg would drop by 10 points!!!
Here's another scenario that kills my mpg. Driving out from a cold start with the first stretch of road in a 25 mph zone. My typical choice for a morning commute is find the route that will allow me to drive at 40-45 mph as quickly as possible. But once the engine is warmed up, I get back on a 35 mph zone and drive at 40 mph before I hit the highway.
Those of you with mpg issues should consider route planning. The only downside is the extra commute time and extra miles. For me, that extra time to myself and knowing that I am minimizing the damage of this car to the environment is worth every extra minutes.
Be sure to check out Senior Editor John O'Dell's newest addition to our lineup, the Green Car Advisor for news and commentary on environmental automotive trends and technologies.
Now what does that mean???? All 2008's are covered? All cars bought after January 1st 2008 are covered? Your guess is as good as mine. What about all the 2007's... are they covered? I do not know but if anyone finds out, let us know.
Also my 2002 Van had a header go bad last June... and the dealer said was covered under the California Emissions. Is it now in effect or were they just blowing smoke? Either way it saved me over $700.
The TCH emmission is so low already that they meet CA emission standard by default. It is simply up to toyota to extend the same warranty on the battery. Should they choose to honor the extended warranty on '08 model, then one would expect to see PA stated explicitly in the warranty booklet.
I have an 07. The warranty booklet shows clearly that PA is NOT on the list of states with extended warranty.
The great news for me is that I am not totally bonkers. I did think I heard somewhere that Pennsylvania was now using the California emission standards: I just did not realize or remember when it was taking effect. It's a good thing to know that it wasn't just those little voices in my head that were telling me that. They already tell me the strangest things.
But seriously, I wonder if this means that Pennsylvania dealers will not start offering the Nissan Altima Hybrid. My Toyota Camry Hybrid is, all-in-all, the best car that I have ever owned but I confess that the car I am now really curious about is the Altima Hybrid.
I will even confess that if the Altima Hybrid were avaialble when I bought my Camry Hybrid, I might have bought the Altima.
Who knows.
By the way, I have not kept a detailed log but in the year I have owned my Camry (it will be exactly one year on September 28th), my "guessti-mate" is that I am avaeraging a little bit better than 37mpg. Usually, the trip computer shows me in the 37-38 mpg range as my avaerage.
Hi, just completed my 5th tank 719 miles traveled 16.1 gallons to fill up. my Nav. said 45.4 as did my dash gauge so they might be a little off. I still had 23 miles till empty on gage 3109 miles traveled so far. will try to drive as normal as possible to see whit kind of mileage I get when not being a fanatic about it. I love this car...
I am a mechanical engineer who bought my Camry Hybrid in Nov 2006, so I have had a fair amount of time to really understand this car. I love it, and now I will bore you with a bunch of data and observations. I have been averaging 42-44 MPG in the city this summer as indicated by the car’s mileage computer. My best average for a whole tank is 45.5 MPG. In the winter, or at 80 mph on the freeway, or with the AC on, it drops into the 36-39 MPG range. My worst tank average ever was 35.5 mpg, due to very cold weather last winter. Now I should say that the car’s mileage computer over-predicts mileage by about 2%, or 1 MPG. I have checked this several times by calculating MPG by using odometer mileage and gallons measured at the gas pump, and it is consistently off by about 1 MPG. I also calibrated my odometer versus highway odometer checks and factored those results into the equation. Some observations from the data that the car computer spits out are that mileage is reduced for cold starts, short trips, high speed freeway driving, on very cold days, or with the AC on (these are true for any car). The mileage in the low-mid 40’s quoted above always has included one or more of these mileage reducing conditions for at least a good part of the tank full of gas over which it is calculated. I was curious as to what mileage I could achieve if I could eliminate these conditions and drive in totally optimal conditions. So I did a test. I drove, starting with a warm engine, 10 laps around my community, a total distance of 36 miles, or 3.6 miles per lap. Each lap had 4 stops, and I admit to rolling through most of them at about 10 mph, because even though the brakes regenerate electricity, they are not 100% efficient, so you are better off maintaining kinetic energy when you can. It was about 65 degrees that day, so I did not need AC. The elevation averaged 6000 ft (southwest of Denver), and it probably varied +/- 100 feet across the course. I put 45 psi in the tires. Owner’s manual recommends 32 psi, but the tires allow 51 psi max. Winds were almost non-existent. I averaged a speed of 34.3 miles per hour during the test, including the stops, so I was mostly doing 35-40 mph. The car operated in electric mode 74% of the time, and in gas mode 26% of the time. It was on gas mainly when it was climbing hills or accelerating from a "stop", and on electric most of the rest of the time. I started the test at the same elevation as I ended, so it was not like it was one long downhill test. The winds were light, and I went in 10 big circles, so wind had no effect on the mileage. I started with an 80% charge on the battery bank, and ended with a 90% charge, so I did not drain down the batteries to artificially inflate the gas mileage. In the end, the car’s mileage computer indicated 63.0 MPG for the duration of the test. Even though it over-predicts mileage slightly, I am still confident I got over 60 MPG. I have read about Priuses, under very controlled conditions getting over 100 mpg. They were on courses with no hills and no stops. They also used driving methods called gliding (coasting with electric mode and gas mode off) and warp driving (no idea what this is). I find it difficult and impractical to glide so I didn't for the test. But I suspect if my course had no hills or stops, I could have gotten over 70 mpg in my Camry just driving normally. Just a few more observations - Obviously, it drops into electric mode most frequently and easily when the engine is warm. On really cold winter days (below 20 degrees F or so) it will rarely if ever go into electric mode, even after driving more than 10 miles. On warmer days, it will drop into electric mode after driving 3 or 4 miles from a cold start IF you take your foot off the gas while going about 40 mph. If you do the same thing at 30 or 20 mph it will not go into electric mode. There seems to be a sweet spot around 40 mph because that's where it will go into electric mode quickest and easiest. After driving 10 or 20 miles, it will go into electric mode at lower speeds. It also seems to like to go into electric mode if you drive it for 5 or more miles, then park the car for 10 minutes to an hour, then drive again. I think there is probably some emissions equipment that needs to be hot (like a catylitic converter) to go into electric mode. While driving, the air flow keeps it somewhat cool. But if parked with a warm engine, the hot engine heats that component such that when you drive again it goes quickly into electric mode. That is just speculation on my part, but it makes sense to me. You will occasionally find people who tell you they are disappointed because they only get 25 or 30 mpg. I strongly suspect they do many short trips on cold starts with the AC on or in very cold conditions. It you drive 3 miles to work in the morning, and 3 miles home at night, and that it typical of most of your driving, you will probably only get 25 to 30 mpg. But very few people drive that way, hence very few people complain about the mileage. My daily commute to work is 10 miles each way, but I also usually do other driving as do most people. As far as power goes, the Camry has plenty. I can maintain 90 mph up any mountain grade in the Colorado Rockies with 2 adults, 2 teenagers, and 2 Golden Retrievers in the car and a packed truck. And it can beat many cars off the light when I need it to. I can't find any reason why every car should not be a hybrid. I love mine.
Rocketman, I think you nailed it. I drive round 2-3 miles to work. Other than that, it is usually short trips around town. So, my mileage is around 25-28. But I thought that it was supposed to get very good mileage in stop-and-go traffic. : (
Good observations, rocketman. From what I've read there are four modes of operation. In the first two (during warm-up) the car won't go into electric mode. In mode three it will when you decelerate from 40+ (as you have observed). In mode 4 it will at any speed. Apparently to get mode 4 you need to come to a full stop so the ICE shuts off. It can go back to mode 3, but I don't remember the conditions.
"The TCH emmission is so low already that they meet CA emission standard by default. "
I should point out that this statement is true of many non-hybrid cars, such as all Honda models. Most manufacturer prefer to make all cars "50 state" emissions compatible rather than deal with having two emissions requirements.
The exception is diesels, which cannot be sold in CARB states unless the vehicle weighs over 6000 lbs. However, CARB compliant diesels are set to debut in 2009. I have read that VW and Honda have such diesel technology.
You will get very very good fuel economy in 'City' driving but City driving isn't necessarily stop and go driving. The laws of physics still hold...it takes a lot of effort to put a 3000# vehicle into motion. It's much much much better if you can keep from having to stop!! Seriously, rolling in heavy traffic at 5-10 mph is much better than coming to a full stop multiple times.
As you've noticed in the prior posts the single biggest killer of fuel economy for all vehicles is short trips. As a further example when CR does its vehicle tests it often finds fuel economy values of 12-18 mpg in its 'City' segment for a standard ICE vehicle.
OK. Here's a question for the "motorheads" out there driving TCH's. Have any of you made modifications to your TCH to further increase the MPG? Some examples would be: increasing the air pressure in your tires or taping off a portion of your grill to decrease air resistance. My stop and go MPG in a standard Camry jumped from 25.5 to 30.5 MPG by doing just those two things. I'm planning on buying a TCH and was just wondering if anyone has done this? Thank you.
In the middle of taking my first extended trip. Left Wed Oct 3 from Daytona Beach area for Chicago area then will move on to Cleveland and back home. Did a fill up in Lexington Ky and upon arriving at my son's home in Libertyville Il, the tank average read 41.7 MPG while the MPG for the total trip (1230 miles) registered at 39.2. Shared driving with my wife and neither one of us did anything special. Used cruise 90% of the time and ran around 73 MPH. I probably could have done the trip on 2 tanks but we ran into very heavy rain in northern FL al the way to SCar and milage was in the 36-37 range and I filled up in Ky knowing that gas would be cheaper there than in Chicago (30 to 40 cents a gal cheaper). Have averaged right around 37 MPG in the 3 + months I've owned it with a best of 38.5. Will be interesting what I get going back home seeing that it will all be downhill :-)
I'm looking into a TCH purchase and would like to know what owner's have experienced for cold weather hybrid mileage. I live in Minnesota so once real winter arrives cold means temperatures going back and forth between -20 to +20 F for several months.
Non-hybrid cars take quite a hit in MPG in the winter. I assume that the extreme cold will impact a hybrid’s battery efficiency not to mention the impact of cold engine starts, engine warm-ups and the like.
I'm interested in knowing how the TCH performs in extreme cold.
Hybrid cars also take a mileage hit in cold weather, particularly when trips are short. The hybrid system needs to warm up fully before it performs efficiently and delivers the gas mileage people expect.
In Oregon, our TCH's mileage dropped about 5 mpg (from 38-40) when we crossed into winter. Still, the car delivered superior mileage to a non-hybrid Camry.
I am on my 2nd tank and in my 3rd week of driving a 2008 TCH. On the first tank, in ca 60-70 degree weather, I could only get about 30-31 MPG, (confirmed by real gas and odometer readings) but thought it would improve. Now on tank #2, I am registering 28 MPG, and my last 8 mile trip through town, 1/2 on highway, didn't even register on the "ecodrive" MPG indicator, i.e. it was less than 25 MPG. That almost matches the mileage of the 1994 Camry LE I traded in!
I am driving almost 100% city, with some short stretches of highway, but a moderate # of stops. I don't have a heavy foot, and am doing my best to start gently from stop signs and red lights, but no go. The temp is now around 30-40, and I am told that Maryland oxygenated fuels that start around now can drop the mileage by 1-2 MPG. The town has a grade, so my 7 mile AM commute is 90% mild downhill, and the reverse coming back. My own house is on a very steep short grade. In the one stretch of 50 mile highway driving I did, it got maybe 33-34 MPG.
Should I be worried? Is there anyway to improve the mileage in city driving if one cannot control the amt of stopping? Does the car indeed "learn your style" and adjust? I don't know how to warm up the car before driving, because the gas engine doesn't turn on. Does it warm up anyhow? I am completely puzzled by those on this list who say they get 35 MPG w/o even trying, and more if they do. Should I expect improvement w/some more mileage? Why would that be so? Do the cars vary, or are the only variables the driver style, temp and nature of the trips?
I am ready to turn this back to the dealer service to see if there is anything that can be adjusted, but I am also 90% sure there will be nothing to find. Aside from this mileage thing, which really bugs me, the car is a dream. Any words of wisdom or comfort would be appreciated.
I have owned my 2007 TCH since February, and I have about 10,000 miles on it. I have mastered every trick and technique discussed in these forums, and I don't live in a city with a lot of hills. But the lifetime mileage on my TCH so far is 31.8. That includes a fair amount of highway driving, although probably 75-80% of my driving is in the city. If I drive only in the city for an entire tank, it's a struggle to keep the mileage above 30. My worst calculated mileage on a tank is 26.6 and my best is 36.6 (that was a tank with all highway driving at about 65-70 mph). My last 5 tanks have been 29.6, 31.2, 34.2, 31.9, and 32.6. I did not notice any improvement at 5,000 miles or after breaking the car in. My battery is fine and everything else on the vehicle checks out OK, so I don't know why I can't do better. But I'm very skeptical of people on here who keep saying they can get 35 or better in the city without even trying. They must be going downhill all the time I know that if I didn't try very hard to keep my mileage up, I would get 27 at best.
Thanks for taking the time to reply. I do feel less alone now, but not too much better! I am less concerned that I got a lemon, but remain puzzled as to how so many folks get much better mileage. I saw the distribution of mileage on the greenhybrid site (don't know the exact name), and I believe the very lowest was around 31. I can't figure out if this is purely driving style, climate and terrain, or whether there is actual variation in the cars themselves.
As a little experiment, I did try driving this AM w/my foot totally off the gas pedal as much as possible and mileage did seem to improve. That is definitely a different style than normal cars, and maybe that is the whole difference, i.e. those that think they are driving "gently" but keep a steady foot on the accelerator, and those who really take it off entirely, or nearly so.
From my experience after 6000+ miles, and from what I've read, short trips are the major contributing factor to poor mileage. The ICE must be warmed up before it enters any economical modes. If you have the NAV you can watch the mileage climb from typically 20mpg to 40+mpg as the engine warms. Use the ECO setting of the climate control year around. Check your tire pressures. There is a sweet spot of accelerator position where the car just coasts -- find it for best results. The accelerator response is different from a conventional car because the pedal doesn't control the engine throttle.
The people that do the best have the longest commutes. I've got a dual commute -- 3 miles to my day job and 20 miles to evening classes when I've got them. I normally use another car to my day job when I don't have an evening class. Mileage to work is typically 25mpg with temps in the 40's. I'll get 39-41mpg to class.
Not that it will help much, but driving conditions, probably beyond your control, have more to do with a hybrid's mileage than anything else.
When I moved from Oregon to California and my driving went from mostly city to mostly rural (and to a warmer climate), my mileage went from good to outstanding. I doubt my driving habits changed any.
A fair test of the car's mechanicals would be on a level freeway at 65 mph, using cruise control if possible. You should expect about 38 mpg.
Don't worry, life's too short. However that milage does stink
I've always wished I was in the position to drive one of these "lemons" or to have my car in the same situatuion just to really see the effect of different drivers, location or cars.
I don't use my car for commuting but have found that interstate driving is not my cars best feature. At less than 70mph I can get 38 to 40mpg, but at "speed" keeping it at 70 to 75 mph I'll usually be between 36.5 and 37.5mpg. Most of my trips are between 5 to 15 miles but mostly rural. After 35,500 miles I'm still at a 37.6 mpg lifetime average. It used to be 38.5 but for the last several months I've quit being obsessed and my milage has dropped to 37's.
I can understand the 34's and 35's but the absolute worst tank I've ever had was 31.5mpg and that trip was in the cold, on the interstate mostly at 85+mph in traffic and with wind and rain. Under normal circumstances, even when driving in Baltimore and Pittsburgh I've been able to get 36. In smaller cities like Charleston WV and that size I've been able to get in the high 39's. At Nags Head I had a300+ mile tank where I was getting 45mpg. Where the car really shines though are on rural 2 lane roads (even in the hills of WV) and I can easily get 40.
In a rural setting on short trips I've found that even with a cold engine, accelerating fairly briskly to achieve speed and then lifting off the throttle and then maintaining speed I can easly get 38+ without the engine kicking off until I get into town. I can then coast pretty much around town until the battery discharges and the ICE kicks back on.
Does anyone out there have experiences with driving daily in Atlanta area traffic with the unending brakelight parade on 400/285? What are your MPG experiences? We are considering a TCH for the Alpharetta to Smyrna commute.
The thing they aren't telling us about Hybrids, is the vehicles are no different than the standard gas model. It is that the car cuts off when the brakes are applied and stops emitting fumes, then when you go, it starts up and resumes creating fumes. Fuel mileage may be a little better because drive accessories are battery powered .. a/c, p/s, and the deceleration recharge. Mainly they are best for producing less fumes in town or stop go driving. You get the same effect if you turn off your car every time you stop for a sign or red light. If you're not moving you waisting gas. The Hybrid Chevy Trucks we got still only get 15-17 mpg, and they take some getting use to, just like when ABS brake systems came out and people did not understand their function...(Don't pump the peddle).
Don't get me wrong, I do applaud the advances in automotive technologies, but the correct info would be nice. I myself am still waiting on the long celebrated Hydrogen Powered vehicles that make water for exhaust, (better have stainless steel exhaust pipes.) especially since we are in drought conditions. Enjoy the discussion, :shades:
Not a "green guy" but wanted a car for the wife driving in Atlanta that got good gas mileage. Drove matrix, normal camry and hybrid camry and she choose the hybrid camry. (Downsizing from a Pontiac minivan with 130k) So typically with her 12 mile round trip commute she hits about 35 MPG average. On one hwy trip to Birmingham she got 40MPG. We did a trip today from Suwanee to Columbus Ga to see our daughter in college. I drove this time and tried to get good mileage. I got 40.6 when i hit the garage. This was driving on the highway between 65 and 75 miles per hour and then the 5 miles or so off the why to get to and from the home were about 40 miles per hour.. I have driven the car to work maybe 4 times when the wife would let me and I manage to get between 38 to 40 paying attention to how I drive. When I drive like a normal mad man and rush from the starts to accelerate fast, the mileage will be in the 32 range.. So those are real world numbers. We have about 2500 miles on the car. Bought Sept 23. This car is quiet, smooth and fun to drive. We tinted the windows and put on an after market (factory style ) spoiler.. and have used layers of Zaino polish to keep the shine spectacular... PS (I get GM employee discounting and after driving numerous GM cars, we decided there were no cars that GM makes in this midsize range that compared with gas mileage!) Our first non GM car since 1983 toyota celica! We are happy and made the correct decision! _I am convinced if you drive this car like a normal gas car expecting instant gas pedal response from a stnadstill then your gas mileage will be in the 30 -33 range. Relax, enjoy the driving, ease into it from a standstill and enjoy the money savings to pay for that starbucks coffee! Ed
I got my new 2008 Toyota Camry Hybrid. I am not able to link my garage door to the Homelink System in the car. Does anybody have a similar issue? I tried to follow the instruction as per the Owners Manual and the owners Manual of the Garage Door Opener(Phantom and Legacy CD/CDB Series). ANy Help is appriciated. Thanks
I got my new 2008 Toyota Camry Hybrid. I am not able to link my garage door to the Homelink System in the car. Does anybody have a similar issue? I tried to follow the instruction as per the Owners Manual and the owners Manual of the Garage Door Opener(Phantom and Legacy CD/CDB Series). ANy Help is appriciated. Thanks
Your garage door opener changes its code all the time. So you have to program the car correctly. There are 2 options according to the camry manual. One that has same code all the time or one that the code changes all the time, which is what most openers are today.. (I have a Genie) If I remember you push the camry button in for a few seconds until it is ready to program, then you have like 30 seconds to go up to your garage door opener motor and somewhere is probably a small black button.. You need to push that button on your opener in the 30 seconds, then the camry will be programmed correctly. If that does not work or you do not get another reply, let me know and I will dig out the camry manual and give exact directions. This was the same for my chevy avalanche also..
Thanks for your reply. I did exactly as you mentioned earlier also. First I used the remote for the garage door opener and pushed the opener remote and the Homelink button simultaneously till the solid red light underneath the Homelink system inside the car starts flickering. Once the above step is done I went and pushed the back knob in the overhead garage door opener. Red Light started flickering in the garage door opener and within 30 seconds I came and pushed the Homelink button inside the car twice and thrice (as per the direction) but still the Homelink is not programmed. I looked into the Manual for the Camry as well as the Manual for the Garage Door Opener. Both the manuals are directing the way you mentioned. Please let me know if something else needs to be done.
hmm. I am no expert but I did get mine working quite easily (Or should I say my wifes! I got the manual out just now to see if I can help you. So I went back and read it.. Pleas try this exact sequence as I have written below.. 1, I have a Genie Intellicode (2 of them actually) garage door opener-- just an FYI. It is the Rolling code type.... 2, so lets try this: Step 1. Press the "training button" on the garage door opener- one in the ceiling) You have a few seconds to get back to the camry. Step 2. press and release the one button you want to program in the camry 2 times. (maybe hold it for 1/2 second each time) If the door opens the process is complete, if not, press it a third time. YOU MUST DO ALL THIS ABOVE IN 30 seconds! (Maybe get a friend or spouse to help if needed. (one person push the button on the opener in the ceiling and one in the car... Just wait maybe 30 seconds and now try to push the camry button you programmed and see if it works now.... If not let me know and we can try something else I suppose.. The other thing is this does not work is maybe you need to CLEAR the memory.. Reading on page 264 ERASE the program a (See picture also) and then try the above procedure as I have written.. Maybe the program is messed up Ed
You might consider an engine block heater. Funny that the '08 hybrid escape comes with manufacturer option but not the Toyota's.
Temp just drop to 30+ in the morning for me and clearly my mileage drops significantly. My commute is 16 miles in the morning with 50%/50% higway/suburban. Mileage should not drop much over the winter if the bulk of your commute in on the highway. Just be sure you are using the 0w20 grade oil.
He he he....my wife was just recently in my car and she notices I was not driving the camry as slowly as I did a month ago. The reason is simple. With the drop in temperature, I noticed that speeding up to 40+mph quickly will get the engine to warm up faster! Funny how my driving habit adapts to improve mileage. I am much more aggresive in the winter and less so in summer!
I test drove a new TCH today and was very impressed. I did notice a whining noise when coming to a stop. The salesman told me this was the generator and is normal in hybrids. Can any TCH owner out there confirm this whining noise as normal? I am probably on the wrong board, but this board appears to be the most active. Thanks.
I wouldn't describe the sound I get as "whining", but there is a high pitched whooshing or whirring sound a bit like an electric motor/generator is being forcibly spun, which I believe is exactly what is happening. I sort of like it. But it is somewhat subtle; if you are getting something that is really a loud whine, maybe something is really wrong.
Nothing wrong....the sound when slowing down is the regenerative braking....perfectly normal. There are quite a few strange sounds associated with the hybrid. Some when you shut the car down and are walking away.....clicks, burps, etc. All normal. Enjoy the car....it is just fantastic.
You have best described what I was hearing today. It was not annoying and something I could easily live with. I am sure the odd sounds will go away over the years with improvements in technology. I believe I am sold on the Camry Hybrid and probably will buy one by year-end.
I am sure the odd sounds will go away over the years with improvements in technology.
I doubt it. The ICE has been around a long time and it still makes noises. Many people spend big $$$'s to make that noise even more pronounced. I'm guessing real hybrid fanactics will eventually figure out which whinny noises they want people to hear and figure out a way to make them louder.
Comments
The extra 2yr and 150K is worth a lot for resale value. Not sure if you are comforted by Toyota's claim that the battery is good for at least 150k based on extensive lab testing. I am not. If they put it in writing in terms of a warranty for all hybrids irrespective of states, then I would believe it!
Total miles driven: 20,513
Average miles per month: 1,282
Total amount spent on gas: $1,492.13
Average price paid per gallon: $2.67
Average cost per fill-up: $36.39
Average gallons per fill-up: 14.16
Average miles driven per tank of gas: 497.58
Average miles per gallon: 35.1
Loving it !!!
Obviously for me the benefit of the $2600 FED and $3750 State tax credits as well as a free tires for life program from my dealer has made this an outstanding ownership experience. I'm guessing right now my trade in value is about equal to my purchase cost less tax credits
However, I think it is entirely possible to get lousy mpg depending on the circumstance. I have seen situations where the engine simply refuse to back down. I can imagine if you make short trips with lots of power offs in between, you will get poor mpg. My weekend trips are typically 30 miles altogether and often involve ~10 poweroffs and ~30 traffic stops. My mpg would drop by 10 points!!!
Here's another scenario that kills my mpg. Driving out from a cold start with the first stretch of road in a 25 mph zone. My typical choice for a morning commute is find the route that will allow me to drive at 40-45 mph as quickly as possible. But once the engine is warmed up, I get back on a 35 mph zone and drive at 40 mph before I hit the highway.
Those of you with mpg issues should consider route planning. The only downside is the extra commute time and extra miles. For me, that extra time to myself and knowing that I am minimizing the damage of this car to the environment is worth every extra minutes.
Looking forward to all your comments!
http://www.eere.energy.gov/states/news_detail.cfm/news_id=10285
Now what does that mean????
All 2008's are covered?
All cars bought after January 1st 2008 are covered?
Your guess is as good as mine.
What about all the 2007's... are they covered?
I do not know but if anyone finds out, let us know.
Also my 2002 Van had a header go bad last June... and the dealer said was covered under the California Emissions.
Is it now in effect or were they just blowing smoke?
Either way it saved me over $700.
Gampa
The TCH emmission is so low already that they meet CA emission standard by default. It is simply up to toyota to extend the same warranty on the battery. Should they choose to honor the extended warranty on '08 model, then one would expect to see PA stated explicitly in the warranty booklet.
I have an 07. The warranty booklet shows clearly that PA is NOT on the list of states with extended warranty.
But seriously, I wonder if this means that Pennsylvania dealers will not start offering the Nissan Altima Hybrid. My Toyota Camry Hybrid is, all-in-all, the best car that I have ever owned but I confess that the car I am now really curious about is the Altima Hybrid.
I will even confess that if the Altima Hybrid were avaialble when I bought my Camry Hybrid, I might have bought the Altima.
Who knows.
By the way, I have not kept a detailed log but in the year I have owned my Camry (it will be exactly one year on September 28th), my "guessti-mate" is that I am avaeraging a little bit better than 37mpg. Usually, the trip computer shows me in the 37-38 mpg range as my avaerage.
Great car!
Some observations from the data that the car computer spits out are that mileage is reduced for cold starts, short trips, high speed freeway driving, on very cold days, or with the AC on (these are true for any car). The mileage in the low-mid 40’s quoted above always has included one or more of these mileage reducing conditions for at least a good part of the tank full of gas over which it is calculated. I was curious as to what mileage I could achieve if I could eliminate these conditions and drive in totally optimal conditions. So I did a test.
I drove, starting with a warm engine, 10 laps around my community, a total distance of 36 miles, or 3.6 miles per lap. Each lap had 4 stops, and I admit to rolling through most of them at about 10 mph, because even though the brakes regenerate electricity, they are not 100% efficient, so you are better off maintaining kinetic energy when you can. It was about 65 degrees that day, so I did not need AC. The elevation averaged 6000 ft (southwest of Denver), and it probably varied +/- 100 feet across the course. I put 45 psi in the tires. Owner’s manual recommends 32 psi, but the tires allow 51 psi max. Winds were almost non-existent. I averaged a speed of 34.3 miles per hour during the test, including the stops, so I was mostly doing 35-40 mph. The car operated in electric mode 74% of the time, and in gas mode 26% of the time. It was on gas mainly when it was climbing hills or accelerating from a "stop", and on electric most of the rest of the time.
I started the test at the same elevation as I ended, so it was not like it was one long downhill test. The winds were light, and I went in 10 big circles, so wind had no effect on the mileage. I started with an 80% charge on the battery bank, and ended with a 90% charge, so I did not drain down the batteries to artificially inflate the gas mileage. In the end, the car’s mileage computer indicated 63.0 MPG for the duration of the test. Even though it over-predicts mileage slightly, I am still confident I got over 60 MPG. I have read about Priuses, under very controlled conditions getting over 100 mpg. They were on courses with no hills and no stops. They also used driving methods called gliding (coasting with electric mode and gas mode off) and warp driving (no idea what this is). I find it difficult and impractical to glide so I didn't for the test. But I suspect if my course had no hills or stops, I could have gotten over 70 mpg in my Camry just driving normally.
Just a few more observations - Obviously, it drops into electric mode most frequently and easily when the engine is warm. On really cold winter days (below 20 degrees F or so) it will rarely if ever go into electric mode, even after driving more than 10 miles. On warmer days, it will drop into electric mode after driving 3 or 4 miles from a cold start IF you take your foot off the gas while going about 40 mph. If you do the same thing at 30 or 20 mph it will not go into electric mode. There seems to be a sweet spot around 40 mph because that's where it will go into electric mode quickest and easiest. After driving 10 or 20 miles, it will go into electric mode at lower speeds. It also seems to like to go into electric mode if you drive it for 5 or more miles, then park the car for 10 minutes to an hour, then drive again. I think there is probably some emissions equipment that needs to be hot (like a catylitic converter) to go into electric mode. While driving, the air flow keeps it somewhat cool. But if parked with a warm engine, the hot engine heats that component such that when you drive again it goes quickly into electric mode. That is just speculation on my part, but it makes sense to me.
You will occasionally find people who tell you they are disappointed because they only get 25 or 30 mpg. I strongly suspect they do many short trips on cold starts with the AC on or in very cold conditions. It you drive 3 miles to work in the morning, and 3 miles home at night, and that it typical of most of your driving, you will probably only get 25 to 30 mpg. But very few people drive that way, hence very few people complain about the mileage. My daily commute to work is 10 miles each way, but I also usually do other driving as do most people.
As far as power goes, the Camry has plenty. I can maintain 90 mph up any mountain grade in the Colorado Rockies with 2 adults, 2 teenagers, and 2 Golden Retrievers in the car and a packed truck. And it can beat many cars off the light when I need it to.
I can't find any reason why every car should not be a hybrid. I love mine.
Beautiful, BEAUTIFUL post !! Bravo, Double Bravo, and Excellent work !!
My lifetime is still 35.2 but many of my trips are short (less than 10 miles) so I have a disadvantage.
Love my TCH though......
I think you nailed it. I drive round 2-3 miles to work. Other than that, it is usually short trips around town. So, my mileage is around 25-28. But I thought that it was supposed to get very good mileage in stop-and-go traffic. : (
I should point out that this statement is true of many non-hybrid cars, such as all Honda models. Most manufacturer prefer to make all cars "50 state" emissions compatible rather than deal with having two emissions requirements.
The exception is diesels, which cannot be sold in CARB states unless the vehicle weighs over 6000 lbs. However, CARB compliant diesels are set to debut in 2009. I have read that VW and Honda have such diesel technology.
As you've noticed in the prior posts the single biggest killer of fuel economy for all vehicles is short trips. As a further example when CR does its vehicle tests it often finds fuel economy values of 12-18 mpg in its 'City' segment for a standard ICE vehicle.
Non-hybrid cars take quite a hit in MPG in the winter. I assume that the extreme cold will impact a hybrid’s battery efficiency not to mention the impact of cold engine starts, engine warm-ups and the like.
I'm interested in knowing how the TCH performs in extreme cold.
Thanks in advance
In Oregon, our TCH's mileage dropped about 5 mpg (from 38-40) when we crossed into winter. Still, the car delivered superior mileage to a non-hybrid Camry.
I am driving almost 100% city, with some short stretches of highway, but a moderate # of stops. I don't have a heavy foot, and am doing my best to start gently from stop signs and red lights, but no go. The temp is now around 30-40, and I am told that Maryland oxygenated fuels that start around now can drop the mileage by 1-2 MPG. The town has a grade, so my 7 mile AM commute is 90% mild downhill, and the reverse coming back. My own house is on a very steep short grade. In the one stretch of 50 mile highway driving I did, it got maybe 33-34 MPG.
Should I be worried? Is there anyway to improve the mileage in city driving if one cannot control the amt of stopping? Does the car indeed "learn your style" and adjust? I don't know how to warm up the car before driving, because the gas engine doesn't turn on. Does it warm up anyhow? I am completely puzzled by those on this list who say they get 35 MPG w/o even trying, and more if they do. Should I expect improvement w/some more mileage? Why would that be so? Do the cars vary, or are the only variables the driver style, temp and nature of the trips?
I am ready to turn this back to the dealer service to see if there is anything that can be adjusted, but I am also 90% sure there will be nothing to find. Aside from this mileage thing, which really bugs me, the car is a dream. Any words of wisdom or comfort would be appreciated.
Macolyte
I have owned my 2007 TCH since February, and I have about 10,000 miles on it. I have mastered every trick and technique discussed in these forums, and I don't live in a city with a lot of hills. But the lifetime mileage on my TCH so far is 31.8. That includes a fair amount of highway driving, although probably 75-80% of my driving is in the city. If I drive only in the city for an entire tank, it's a struggle to keep the mileage above 30. My worst calculated mileage on a tank is 26.6 and my best is 36.6 (that was a tank with all highway driving at about 65-70 mph). My last 5 tanks have been 29.6, 31.2, 34.2, 31.9, and 32.6. I did not notice any improvement at 5,000 miles or after breaking the car in. My battery is fine and everything else on the vehicle checks out OK, so I don't know why I can't do better. But I'm very skeptical of people on here who keep saying they can get 35 or better in the city without even trying. They must be going downhill all the time
Good luck!
As a little experiment, I did try driving this AM w/my foot totally off the gas pedal as much as possible and mileage did seem to improve. That is definitely a different style than normal cars, and maybe that is the whole difference, i.e. those that think they are driving "gently" but keep a steady foot on the accelerator, and those who really take it off entirely, or nearly so.
Thanks again, and I hope a few others chime in.
The people that do the best have the longest commutes. I've got a dual commute -- 3 miles to my day job and 20 miles to evening classes when I've got them. I normally use another car to my day job when I don't have an evening class. Mileage to work is typically 25mpg with temps in the 40's. I'll get 39-41mpg to class.
I've got 38mpg overall at greenhybrid.com.
When I moved from Oregon to California and my driving went from mostly city to mostly rural (and to a warmer climate), my mileage went from good to outstanding. I doubt my driving habits changed any.
A fair test of the car's mechanicals would be on a level freeway at 65 mph, using cruise control if possible. You should expect about 38 mpg.
I've always wished I was in the position to drive one of these "lemons" or to have my car in the same situatuion just to really see the effect of different drivers, location or cars.
I don't use my car for commuting but have found that interstate driving is not my cars best feature. At less than 70mph I can get 38 to 40mpg, but at "speed" keeping it at 70 to 75 mph I'll usually be between 36.5 and 37.5mpg. Most of my trips are between 5 to 15 miles but mostly rural. After 35,500 miles I'm still at a 37.6 mpg lifetime average. It used to be 38.5 but for the last several months I've quit being obsessed and my milage has dropped to 37's.
I can understand the 34's and 35's but the absolute worst tank I've ever had was 31.5mpg and that trip was in the cold, on the interstate mostly at 85+mph in traffic and with wind and rain. Under normal circumstances, even when driving in Baltimore and Pittsburgh I've been able to get 36. In smaller cities like Charleston WV and that size I've been able to get in the high 39's. At Nags Head I had a300+ mile tank where I was getting 45mpg. Where the car really shines though are on rural 2 lane roads (even in the hills of WV) and I can easily get 40.
In a rural setting on short trips I've found that even with a cold engine, accelerating fairly briskly to achieve speed and then lifting off the throttle and then maintaining speed I can easly get 38+ without the engine kicking off until I get into town. I can then coast pretty much around town until the battery discharges and the ICE kicks back on.
Mainly they are best for producing less fumes in town or stop go driving. You get the same effect if you turn off your car every time you stop for a sign or red light. If you're not moving you waisting gas.
The Hybrid Chevy Trucks we got still only get 15-17 mpg, and they take some getting use to, just like when ABS brake systems came out and people did not understand their function...(Don't pump the peddle).
Don't get me wrong, I do applaud the advances in automotive technologies, but the correct info would be nice.
I myself am still waiting on the long celebrated Hydrogen Powered vehicles that make water for exhaust, (better have stainless steel exhaust pipes.) especially since we are in drought conditions.
Enjoy the discussion, :shades:
So typically with her 12 mile round trip commute she hits about 35 MPG average.
On one hwy trip to Birmingham she got 40MPG. We did a trip today from Suwanee to Columbus Ga to see our daughter in college. I drove this time and tried to get good mileage. I got 40.6 when i hit the garage. This was driving on the highway between 65 and 75 miles per hour and then the 5 miles or so off the why to get to and from the home were about 40 miles per hour..
I have driven the car to work maybe 4 times when the wife would let me and I manage to get between 38 to 40 paying attention to how I drive. When I drive like a normal mad man and rush from the starts to accelerate fast, the mileage will be in the 32 range..
So those are real world numbers. We have about 2500 miles on the car. Bought Sept 23. This car is quiet, smooth and fun to drive. We tinted the windows and put on an after market (factory style ) spoiler.. and have used layers of Zaino polish to keep the shine spectacular... PS (I get GM employee discounting and after driving numerous GM cars, we decided there were no cars that GM makes in this midsize range that compared with gas mileage!) Our first non GM car since 1983 toyota celica! We are happy and made the correct decision!
_I am convinced if you drive this car like a normal gas car expecting instant gas pedal response from a stnadstill then your gas mileage will be in the 30 -33 range. Relax, enjoy the driving, ease into it from a standstill and enjoy the money savings to pay for that starbucks coffee! Ed
I got my new 2008 Toyota Camry Hybrid. I am not able to link my garage door to the Homelink System in the car. Does anybody have a similar issue? I tried to follow the instruction as per the Owners Manual and the owners Manual of the Garage Door Opener(Phantom and Legacy CD/CDB Series). ANy Help is appriciated.
Thanks
I got my new 2008 Toyota Camry Hybrid. I am not able to link my garage door to the Homelink System in the car. Does anybody have a similar issue? I tried to follow the instruction as per the Owners Manual and the owners Manual of the Garage Door Opener(Phantom and Legacy CD/CDB Series). ANy Help is appriciated.
Thanks
If I remember you push the camry button in for a few seconds until it is ready to program, then you have like 30 seconds to go up to your garage door opener motor and somewhere is probably a small black button.. You need to push that button on your opener in the 30 seconds, then the camry will be programmed correctly. If that does not work or you do not get another reply, let me know and I will dig out the camry manual and give exact directions. This was the same for my chevy avalanche also..
Pleas try this exact sequence as I have written below..
1, I have a Genie Intellicode (2 of them actually) garage door opener-- just an FYI. It is the Rolling code type....
2, so lets try this:
Step 1. Press the "training button" on the garage door opener- one in the ceiling)
You have a few seconds to get back to the camry.
Step 2. press and release the one button you want to program in the camry 2 times. (maybe hold it for 1/2 second each time)
If the door opens the process is complete, if not, press it a third time.
YOU MUST DO ALL THIS ABOVE IN 30 seconds! (Maybe get a friend or spouse to help if needed. (one person push the button on the opener in the ceiling and one in the car...
Just wait maybe 30 seconds and now try to push the camry button you programmed and see if it works now....
If not let me know and we can try something else I suppose..
The other thing is this does not work is maybe you need to CLEAR the memory.. Reading on page 264 ERASE the program a (See picture also) and then try the above procedure as I have written.. Maybe the program is messed up
Ed
Temp just drop to 30+ in the morning for me and clearly my mileage drops significantly. My commute is 16 miles in the morning with 50%/50% higway/suburban. Mileage should not drop much over the winter if the bulk of your commute in on the highway. Just be sure you are using the 0w20 grade oil.
Macolyte
You have best described what I was hearing today. It was not annoying and something I could easily live with. I am sure the odd sounds will go away over the years with improvements in technology. I believe I am sold on the Camry Hybrid and probably will buy one by year-end.
I doubt it. The ICE has been around a long time and it still makes noises. Many people spend big $$$'s to make that noise even more pronounced. I'm guessing real hybrid fanactics will eventually figure out which whinny noises they want people to hear and figure out a way to make them louder.