With regards to the TSB, I to have heard that some coupes have had the problem. It must have not been enough for Honda to release to TSB. I find this odd to be honest. Honda is not at their finest lately.
The reason why the dealership does not want to touch your car is because they know it's been hit. This gives them an excuse not to have to fix your car because REPAIRS COST MONEY, warranty work or not & LABOR COST AS WELL. The accident gives them the perfect excuse to lay blame, not on faulty parts but the accident. Even if the parts were faulty, there is no way to prove it now, one way or another.
I have learned that WARRANTY does not always mean what we think it means. We always think it's unconditional. We really know it's very conditional and STEALERSHIPS no many ways to get out warranty work. This is why they always turn down cars that have been modified even if the part was a failure due to being faulty. It's just an excuse and a viable one, at least to them.
Insurance companies are powerfull. If you feel comfortable, let them do the work for you but keep on their butts for info.
Eventhough I am like you and like to KNOW WHY, most times we don't ever get the WHY and when we do, most times it's BS so you don't sue the manufacturer over something like this. The truth will be very hard to come by at this point, SO DON'T FOCUS ON THE WHY, focus on getting your car back and moving onto more important things and bigger and better things.
I hope all gets resolved. Take this from someone who went through their own nightmare with a car and and accident.
What makes this all so hard to wrap my head around is the fact that my husband's father opened the GM training center here in Houston in 1955 and was a Fisher Body factor rep for years until he was retired during the truly dark days of the American auto industry in the early 1980's. He has stories of how he and the dealers worked together to make sure that the customers were satisfied, even if they thought the customer was in the wrong.
Sigh! How times have changed.
However, there is no claim whatsoever that I modified the car or did anything to void my warranty. The allegation is that the body shop didn't repair the car properly over five months ago. So this isn't a loophole--it's just "bounceback", if you will.
My big concern, though, is that by letting the body shop do the work, they're giving themselves an opportunity to claim that the warranty on the engine is now voided.
That's the best reason for getting a Honda rep involved in the mix.
Yep, I think I've convinced myself. I'll be on the phone first thing in the morning--both to Honda and also to let my insurance adjuster and the body shop know what I'm doing.
I have to protect my warranty, and not let some sleezy service manager cheat me out of what I paid for.
Of course, I'll also be talking to the body shop telling them I want to know when they'll be taking the car apart and that I'll need to document it for Honda's purposes.
I can't wait to see the allegedly damaged parts. Are they damaged? And, more importantly, is there evidence that they were damaged prior to the engine mount failure?
All of that will help the insurance company point the finger at the proper party. And they definitely plan to.
Maybe that's the most important part--that the insurance company doesn't let anyone get away with anything. They're my best ally at this point.
Can I let it go entirely? It's not in my nature to drop it without trying to get a few more answers. I spent too many years litigating. Will I take it upon myself to sue? No. Not worth it on so many levels.
How much is this engine mount anyhow? Don't know the Honda, but isn't it just a hunk of rubber sandwiched between 2 metal plates? I can't imagine this is a big deal for either the dealer or autobody shop to do.
As a replacement in the abstract, doing the engine mount it's not a big job. It pays about an hour's labor. I don't know the cost of the mount, but it can't be tremendous. I'm sure I could find out from the Honda website simply by trying to order the part.
But mine became much more complicated when, for whatever reason, the engine moved about 4 inches forward in the engine compartment. It's a major complication, but not my problem. It either happened because of the failure or because of unrepaired wreck damage. The complication is when Honda started passing the buck.
I really feel that, at this point, I need to document that Honda refused to do any repairs on the car. The more I think about it, the madder I get. I mean, there was money to be made there if, for example, Honda said, "We can fix it, but it's gonna cost. You might want to talk to your insurance company, because it's related to the prior wreck." The Honda dealer could have had the insurance repair if it had played its cards right. Instead, it flat out refused to work on the car.
The refusal worries me for its implications in the future. Is it always this difficult to get warranty work done on your Honda? Is this attitude why I haven't heard a word about the Service Bulletins that I've learned about in the last two days on this board and another one? And, most importantly, are they going to use this incident to try to void my warranty?
So, I'll continue to document--my camera and I are headed to the body shop today to take pictures of the engine and my experiences over the past two days are already being documented. I'll call Honda and get a rep out to look at the car if they'll send one. If not, then I'll get the rep to talk to the body shop and my insurance adjuster. And then we'll save the parts that are being removed. Like I said earlier, I just can't let this go yet. I'll reach that point later, but not until my insurance company has had a chance to hold Honda accountable.
And do you want to know the worst part? I really miss my car! I've driven a 2006 Toyota Forerunner and a 2007 Saturn Ion now, and neither holds a candle to my Civic. For everyone who is complaining about the quality of your Civic, yes, our cars may have problems (my problems were either self inflicted--one wreck was my fault--or inflicted by someone else--a jerk hit my car--or a warranty problem--the questionable motor mount), but there is a lot worse baseline quality out there. Neither of the two vehicles I've driven has the feel of the Civic, or the interior touches that our cars have. Right down to the cup holders, Honda engineers stand head and shoulders above the others.
My husband wants to either trade my Civic on a Saturn Vue (maybe a Green Line) or add a Vue, but I'll have a hard time giving up Honda, notwithstanding this service experience.
You will take a very big hit on it's value not only because the accident but the first year, the car depreciates the most and then levels off.
I went to trade my 06 LX Sedan. The car is perfect in and out, not a ding or damage to be found. I even clean my engine bay every few months.
I paid $17,200 (at the time, it was a great price) and just a week ago went to trade for a 07 scooby impreza "I" wagon (I had an impreza wagon in the past, loved it) and 3 dealerships appraised my car at $14,000. This is $3200 loss in the first year. They even remarked at how low the mileage was at 10.200 (the car should have 14,000 miles by now, it just reached one year old).
You will have a ton of negative equity (unless you paid cash for your car) and most banks finance only so much negative equity, normally $2000-$3000 unless they play the "hide the negative equity game"
I wanted to trade mine because I felt for the money, the problems I was having would only get worse based on people who have more mileage with shocks going, struts going, engines leaking oil, etc etc.
I am going to hold onto it for a year or so longer and just take care of it so I can pay it down more.
Interestingly, since I took my Civic to the dealership five weeks ago to have it checked out, I have not had any starting problems.
At the time, they told me they found nothing wrong. But because the problem magically disappeared after that visit, I get the feeling they knew exactly what to "tweak" to make it go away. Maybe there is a secret fix and if you complain, they do it, thereby avoiding a recall? Who knows?
Of course, the starting problems may yet resurface (hope not!), but it's been five weeks so far of perfect starts since the dealer visit so I'm hoping they did something that made the problem disappear.
I test drove a new Civic today (EX with Auto, no Nav system). The car had a shake, or very very noticeable vibration after reaching 40 mph. I drove it for about 5 miles and returned it to the dealer. The car had 1.8 miles when I started. So, the salesman did not react but promised to check it out ASAP. Therefore, two things come to mind: this forum talks about the problems experienced by this model the first year it came out and someone mentioned that a car with less than 2 miles was never tested by the dealer to make sure the car was OK. First lesson, is make sure you test drive the car and put it through its paces. Next, a car with less than two miles was driven by no one to see if it was OK or not. Lastly, Honda may still be having problems even though the car has been in production since Sept 2005 (?).
I personally do not want that car and wrote down the VIN in case they tried to sell it me anywhere, as I liked the color and it was the only one between the 3 dealers I am working with.
Question: anybody has any ideas what the vibration could have been? The salesman kept saying tire air pressure was off. I thought no way, as I am one of those that checks the family fleet (4 cars!) every single darn week. Own an air compressor and I know what a low tire looks like. Hope some one has an answer. Have a great day folks!
To let you know, my car did not go through pre-inspection process before I purchased it. I got lucky for the most part. The alignment was way off and a few other minor problems had happened.
10,000 miles later, the alignment (done 3 times in less than 1000 miles) seems to be holding and the motor mount was replaced and so was the belt for the longer belt to eleminate the 1400-1500 rpm lug bug problem.
With regards to your test drive, dealers rarely correct the tire pressure and almost all cars have 5-6 PSI higher than what the sticker says it should be. This can cause a very harsh ride and also can translate much more noise and vibration into the car. It's like driving on rocks. It can also cause unpredictable handling characteristics and make the car feel twitchy and all over the place.
Also, the car might have had a tire weight missing and thus maybe one of the tires were out of balance.
It does not mean the car was not good.
I always bring a tire gauge with me so if and when I purchase, I correct the pressures before I drive home so I know if something is really wrong or not.
I agree that the car may be just fine. But, when something does not work right of the shelf, I get nervous. Plenty of other Civics on the dealer lots around here. Thanks for the advice, I will use it. Wish you a good holiday.
I am the same way. I am ultra picky when I buy a new car and even the most minor thing can turn me off.
With regards to my galaxy gray LX sedan, no one else had this color at the time so I took the chance.
So far, other than the things I mentioned, all else is well. I hope I don't develop the oil leaks others have and also I hope my shocks & struts hold up. Other have had them replaced with low mileage.
I am considering purchasing a Civic that is in the show room floor. It looked spotless, no scratches, etc. If I want to test drive it, it appears that I have to be absolutely ready to buy. My question: any thoughts on a show room car versus one in the parking lot? My thoughts are that the one inside has been protected from the environment better...any thoughts? Thanks all & happy Easter!
#1 check how many miles on the car. I never buy a new car with over 10 or so miles. If the car has 20-30 miles, it most likely has been test driven a lot or been transferred from another dealership.
#2 these cars have been sat in alot and have been tinkered with by customers and salesman. This is not a big deal but again, I myself don't like this type of thing, does not mean anything bad though. Just my preference.
#3 the good thing is that the car most likely has been waxed well to make it look great in the show room. When they prep a car from the lot I think they normall do a sloppy job as they are rushed to deliver the car to you so you take it the same day.
#4 if you are going to purchase this car, check all fluids including oil & other vitals fluids. This car most likely has been sitting a while in the showroom (ask how long) and if it's been months. Have them change the oil for you as a courtesy so you know the oil in the car is fresh. Oil should not sit for many months without the car being started.
Those are my views. Check the cover over carefully for scratches as people tend to lean on the car in the showroom.
Have this color on my LX sedan and really like it. Have gotten many compliments on the color and is it just me, but it seems to look darker in different light conditions. Might be my old eyes playing tricks on me but I'd swear that the color does indeed change a bit. Broke my cardinal rule of car buying by buying a 1st year model but so far have been lucky. Had the lug bug TSB performed eventhough it wasn't that noticeable. But since they agreed to do it, figured why not. Besides that, the car's been fine. Very happy with everything about it.
What's the production date on your civic? I have an '06 EX MT in Galaxy Gray, built in April '06, and i've had no problems at all with this car. My lowest MPG has been 34, due largely to snowy weather and winter mix fuel.
I have vibration/rattling in the front end driver's side that only occurs after the car is warmed up and in gear at a stop. It doesn't happen when driving the car and is most notable in drive when at a complete stop. The dealership has replaced all the motor mounts and it is a little better but after driving the car for about 15minutes the noise is still there. Any thoughts? Honda tech has not idea what the problem may be.
I would call Honda Care and open up a case so that at least your problem is documented. This will help should you in the future should honda not be able to repair it correctly. Maybe either to replace the vehicle and or to have the lemon law envoked.
How bad is the vibrating/rattling? If you bring it to the dealership, can you reproduce the problem while with a technician. If so, it's just proves there is a problem and they need to fix it.
You can always call the Honda Car line and insist on a higher level technician meet you at the dealership and or a regional manager with a field rep/tech.
I would get this documented as soon as possible and insist to whomever that they figure out the problem and repair it.
Build date was June '06 and I bought the car on the 16th, a day after the car came into the dealership. Only had 3 miles on the odo when I test drove it on a Saturday. Picked it up that Monday after they added the stripes, door edge guards and wheel well mouldings, and checked the alignment for a slight pull. Nice car.
I've been updating my situation periodically so here it goes. I was able to get Honda to revisit my complaints regarding the damaged condenser, caused by road debris. My position was simple. It was occuring to many other Honda owners (not limited to the Civic), the damage was minimal and should not have resulted in equipment failure (I haven't had AC since Sept. 06), AND, there is evidence that Honda does repair some condensers damaged by road debris, but chooses not to repair others (like mine). I supplied them with countless evidence found on this forum as well as others that supported these claims.
Today, American Honda phoned me to let me know that they had reviewed my complaint a second time, and looked at the web links that had been provided. Wayne (I'll hold his last name) explained to me that the data found on these websites is nothing more than "opinion" and that American Honda was not going to change its position. I asked who else I could talk to and he told me no one. This was the final decision. I told him that I wasn't satisfied because he had not sufficiently explained why Honda repairs some and not others. He told me that Honda had repaired the others out of "goodwill" to those customers. I told him he had just lost me as a customer.
Ironically, I used some photos and support material from this and other websites to illustrate how Honda owners are fixing the vibration/rattle that originates from the subwoofer, back speaker deck. The dealer took that info and instead of using paper towels to stuff into the openings, they used a foam material. Unfortunately, the support materials I sent regarding the condenser didn't fly with them.
So, now I will take the vehicle to an independent repair shop (the dealer wants $750 and the indie guy wants $500). Other than potential warranty issues, I will NEVER step foot on another Honda lot. This will be my first and only Honda, and I very much can't wait to trade it for something else.
Finally, I've ordered lemon magnets and I plan to drive it up and down the street in front of th dealer. I told Wayne that I'd really f- with them and I will. Yep, folks, I am ticked off... and truly hurt that Honda is not the company I thought it was.
sorry to hear about your ordeal. I would summarize your conversation with Wayne and send a letter to the higher ups at Honda. The fact that he admitted they did repair some condensers out of "goodwill" is the key to your argument. Include copies of your supporting information.
You may have to do some searching to find who is the next person in the chain of command. You can also try a website called planetfeedback.com. It's a place where you can submit bad customer service for a host of different industries. From what I understand, companies do monitor this website.
I just came to the forum to post a similar message. Last night I drove 3 civics - Two EX with Nav and Automatic and one 4 door SI. ALL three had bad vibration exactly as you mention, it started in the 40's and continued up from there but was most noticeable in the 40's and 50's. When we drove the SI - the third one we drove, the salesman even commented on the vibration before I did. I know this is not the way these cars should be- I loved the EX with NAV but I couldn't buy one with the vibration. I am hoping it is something very simple but I was shocked to drive 3 in a row with this problem.
The salesman was going to have their service manager check the cars and have one ready for me to drive again this weekend. If someone can put me at ease on this that would be great because I love everything about the car and have had an accord in the past that I was very happy with.
Sounds like the tire pressure is too high in the tires...probaly around 40 psi or so. Find out if they checked the tires and put the pressure down to 32psi. A more comfortable range for the car which should alleviate the vibration issues. Seems like someone screwed up the PDI when the car came into the dealership.
PDI is a joke. On more than one occasion, 2 cars I purchased were delivered with well over the proper PSI on the tires.
My current 06 LX sedan, the pressures were 6 to 7 PSI high.
Many year ago I started bring a tire pressure gauge with me when I pick up my new cars so I can lower then before driving home. This helped me to make sure things were okay or not okay with the car.
Tire pressures are so overlooked when cars are on the lot and when they are delivered.
Guess I was lucky, my car was fine when I picked it up. They did check the alignment as it drifted a bit during the test drive. When I got there to pick it up 2 days later, the car was in great shape...even the pressures were at 33 psi, just where I like them.
i have a 07 civic coupe with a similar problem. thing is, it rattles even when the cover is closed and it doesn't happen all the time, which is frustrating. sounded like it was coming from the roof area behind the moonroof. i will take it to a service center soon and post the results.
Most likely fall 2008, for 2009 MY. Honda typically waits 3 years for Mid-Model changes. But they have been known to make significant tweaks outside that schedule, e.g. adding standard side bags to the Accord before its MMC in the fall of 2005.
This is a very interesting conversation. My nephew sells used cars and tells me I don't need to use the parking brake at all on level ground. However, When I bought my 1969 VW Bug I got into the habit of using it in every car I've ever had since. Nice to know I'm doing the right thing.
Does anyone know if there is a TSB for the leaking struts that were reported here? I suspect my right front is leaking but I wanted to see if anyone has a copy of a TSB before AllData was taken down, please kindly post it here. Thanks.
I had leaking rear shocks on my 2006 Civic and simply took it back to the dealer because of the symptoms (noisy rear suspension)and they confirmed the shocks were leaking and ordered new ones under warranty. Since my car had less than 4K miles at the time there was no problem. I do not think a service bulletin (TSB) was issued for this but leakage is self evident so maybe none was necessary. This also applies to front struts in my opinion. If you are out of warranty coverage you may have to get tough with the dealer...or not depending on mileage and individual dealer.
There may already be a TSB out there, but I honestly believe that if you take your car in to your dealer they will automatically replace the struts at their cost. My dealer did it on my 2002 Civic EX coupe in 2005 so I think it's something they are aware of. Unfortunately.
I had no idea about these reasons, it just always seemed a safe thing to do. My father ran a gas station and worked on cars for most of my life and he always said to use it. Seemed to make sense. I still do.
"If your brakes break, they won't brake and your car will break."
How you apply the parking brake on a hill is important. Always apply it first, then let off the foot brake pedal for second to place the load on the parking brake, then shift into park.
If you shift to park 1st, all the strain of the car on the hill will be held by the relatively small parking pawl inside the transmission. This can make it difficult to move out of park.
This is something I noticed in my 2002 Civic EX coupe. Seemed more so when the roof was closed. I too stopped it when pushing up on the panel. It didn't start until the car was about 3 years old though. So, it's been going on for quite some time without Honda being able to correct it.
"Is it always this difficult to get warranty work done on your Honda?
I find this very strange because when my 2002 Civic EX coupe had the failed struts at 3 years and again a year later with the timing belt tensioner/water pump problem there was no question they were to be repaired by the dealership. I feel Honda knew this was coming because the 2002 was the second year of that model redo. I'm getting ready to buy a 2007 Civic EX coupe and I'm hoping that if this model has been out there since Sept. 2005 that this 2007 will not have any of the 2006 problems. If it does, this will be my last Honda as my 5 year old 1982 Accord had a failed rack and pinion steering seal. Cost me almost $1,000 to replace.
On Long Island, the dealerships (service departments) are far from friendly for the most part (I am sure there are a few good ones) and you really have to make a stink to get something fixed that they think is fine when you know it's not. I took me 4-5 visits and a call to Honda to get my mount replaced and the serpetine belt replaced (lug bug noise). I also have to bring down copies of the service bulletings which they said they never saw. I know their system has these TSB's cause mine problems were quite a while after honda issued the TSB's.
Either way, buy your car, enjoy it and most likely, some or all of the problems have been resolved.
If you have any doubts, buy something else. Nothing worse than buying a new car and already feeling worried about things.
Ok.... I don't get what my Honda dealership is telling me and I want to know if it is true or not so someone please help me.
This is my first car I ever purchased, because I was never able to have my parents give me a car, I'm a 19 female and I think I'm being taken advantage of.
Ok.... I have 30,000 miles of my 2006 Honda Civic and they are already telling me my rotors have to replaced along with my brake pads. I understand that around 30,000 miles your brakes need to be change, I know that and I know how to do that. But my rotors, I didn't think that was right. Someone please tell me if this is correct or not. I need help before I pay someone to do this for me.
Depending on driving habits and local conditions, 30K sounds just about right for time to replace DISC PADS, not drums. Rear drums (if you have an LX) normally get replaced once for every 2 or 3 times you replace the DISC PADS. Drums pads last much longer and since they are in the rear of the car, they wear much less.
Honda rotors are known to warp very quickly. I have had many hondas and was advised by a long time mechanic that they tend to be thinner than other makes so heat warps them quicker.
Most likely, you would need a rotor resurface. If your steering wheel does not shake left to right while braking, you rotors are not warped. Normally when replacing disc pads, most places do a resurface of the lining so that the new brakes don't wear prematurely.
Chrissy, as a woman who has had this kind of thing happen a number of tmes, I say get another opinion. If there's another Honda dealer you can go to, or a mechanic you can trust, find someone else to give you information before going along with this.
(I just realized I posted this as a reply to kero in error, as opposed to Chrissy, sorry )
You'd have to replace the rotors under 2 conditions, typically. If you let the disc pads wear down to the point where you had metal to metal contact (worn out pad grinds against rotor). You hear this by the grinding noise when applying brakes, and visually you can inspect the rotors to see if they are scored. Be sure to look on both sides of each rotor.
The second reason is if the rotors have warped. You notice this when you are applying the brakes, and you feel a pulsation in the brake pedal. This warping happens with heavy braking where the rotors get very hot.
I have heard of a number of situations where companies are just automatically replacing both, so I don't think it is necessarily a case of somone wanting to take advantage of you.
You might be able to have rotors re-surfaced, where they cut off some of the metal using a lathe to make it smooth and true. However, since the rotors don't cost all that much, it is usually just easier to replace them.
At 30K I would expect to replace the front pads, nothing would normally be needed on the rears as they do minimally work stopping the vehicle. You would not normally need front rotors, unless you have experienced the grinding or warping.
Holy Cow! I never realized how much money I was saving on brakes living here in the rural deep South. I've never had to replace a set of brake pads, shoes, rotors, drums or anything brake wise on a vehicle before the warranty ran out. As a matter of fact, I've never had brakes that didn't outlast at least one, if not two, sets of tires.
Chrissy, I encourage you by all means to take the advice you've already been given and get a second opinion.
I don't think living in the south has much to do with it......the previous posts are pretty much on target with my experience, altho most of it is Toyota and not Honda.
Many places now just replace the rotors rather than bother with turning them, since in their case, time is money. Since I do my own brake work, I typically have them turned. It's more bother and takes a bit longer, but i do it anyway.....
It is rare that a rotor needs to be replaced, if done properly turning them (actually done on a lathe) will extend their life for a very long time.
However, if you let the pads wear too far, you WILL damage the rotors and they will need to be replaced. So replacing the pads whenever you start hearing the squeal is very important (and cost effective!)
My 97 camry has 201,000+, my 93 had 198,000+ and I've only replaced the rotors once on each. They had been turned so many times they were past the minimum allowable thickness. On average, every other pad replacement got the rotors turned, but only if warped or badly glazed.
I drove my Civic for almost 7 years (95,000 miles) before I ever replaced the original brake pads (front only, the rear ones were fine). I don't know if that's typical, but that's when my mechanics started bugging me about getting new ones. They should give you an estimate of how much the pads are worn (80%, for example). There was never an issue with my rotors.
You should definitely get a second or third opinion.
Ah, but others may actually need to stop 100's of times or more every day in a city commute. Location..location...location. City? suburban? rural? For the record 95 K miles on original pads isn't typical nor should your mechanics have had to "bug" you about replacement. Many states including mine have annual mechanical inspections and when the pads/shoes get within a certain point they MUST be replaced. But nonetheless I don't scrimp on things like brakes (cost: about $40 +/- for new pads) and mine last about 35K miles or so.
This is only from experience and you do not have to follow this:
I have realized from the many different hondas I have had, an 86 LXi accord, 86 CIVIC SI 1500, 2006 LX, it's best to use OEM pads or a high quality replacement.
If you don't specify this when going to a small shop or one of those tire centers, they will use a cheap replacement and your car will not only stop worse but the pads will wear quicker.
Honda's OEM pads are really good from my experience.
I have your typical big city commute: 50 miles per day, about half of it stop-and-go, with the other half at highway speeds. In other words, lots of braking.
My brakes worked perfectly fine for the duration of the 95,000 miles (no noises or other weird symptoms.) I replaced the pads when they needed to be replaced.
That Civic was virtually maintenance free, which is why I decided to buy the '07 model. Hope it will be as great as my previous car.
Comments
With regards to the TSB, I to have heard that some coupes have had the problem. It must have not been enough for Honda to release to TSB. I find this odd to be honest. Honda is not at their finest lately.
The reason why the dealership does not want to touch your car is because they know it's been hit. This gives them an excuse not to have to fix your car because REPAIRS COST MONEY, warranty work or not & LABOR COST AS WELL. The accident gives them the perfect excuse to lay blame, not on faulty parts but the accident. Even if the parts were faulty, there is no way to prove it now, one way or another.
I have learned that WARRANTY does not always mean what we think it means. We always think it's unconditional. We really know it's very conditional and STEALERSHIPS no many ways to get out warranty work. This is why they always turn down cars that have been modified even if the part was a failure due to being faulty. It's just an excuse and a viable one, at least to them.
Insurance companies are powerfull. If you feel comfortable, let them do the work for you but keep on their butts for info.
Eventhough I am like you and like to KNOW WHY, most times we don't ever get the WHY and when we do, most times it's BS so you don't sue the manufacturer over something like this. The truth will be very hard to come by at this point, SO DON'T FOCUS ON THE WHY, focus on getting your car back and moving onto more important things and bigger and better things.
I hope all gets resolved. Take this from someone who went through their own nightmare with a car and and accident.
Sigh! How times have changed.
However, there is no claim whatsoever that I modified the car or did anything to void my warranty. The allegation is that the body shop didn't repair the car properly over five months ago. So this isn't a loophole--it's just "bounceback", if you will.
My big concern, though, is that by letting the body shop do the work, they're giving themselves an opportunity to claim that the warranty on the engine is now voided.
That's the best reason for getting a Honda rep involved in the mix.
Yep, I think I've convinced myself. I'll be on the phone first thing in the morning--both to Honda and also to let my insurance adjuster and the body shop know what I'm doing.
I have to protect my warranty, and not let some sleezy service manager cheat me out of what I paid for.
Of course, I'll also be talking to the body shop telling them I want to know when they'll be taking the car apart and that I'll need to document it for Honda's purposes.
I can't wait to see the allegedly damaged parts. Are they damaged? And, more importantly, is there evidence that they were damaged prior to the engine mount failure?
All of that will help the insurance company point the finger at the proper party. And they definitely plan to.
Maybe that's the most important part--that the insurance company doesn't let anyone get away with anything. They're my best ally at this point.
Can I let it go entirely? It's not in my nature to drop it without trying to get a few more answers. I spent too many years litigating. Will I take it upon myself to sue? No. Not worth it on so many levels.
But mine became much more complicated when, for whatever reason, the engine moved about 4 inches forward in the engine compartment. It's a major complication, but not my problem. It either happened because of the failure or because of unrepaired wreck damage. The complication is when Honda started passing the buck.
I really feel that, at this point, I need to document that Honda refused to do any repairs on the car. The more I think about it, the madder I get. I mean, there was money to be made there if, for example, Honda said, "We can fix it, but it's gonna cost. You might want to talk to your insurance company, because it's related to the prior wreck." The Honda dealer could have had the insurance repair if it had played its cards right. Instead, it flat out refused to work on the car.
The refusal worries me for its implications in the future. Is it always this difficult to get warranty work done on your Honda? Is this attitude why I haven't heard a word about the Service Bulletins that I've learned about in the last two days on this board and another one? And, most importantly, are they going to use this incident to try to void my warranty?
So, I'll continue to document--my camera and I are headed to the body shop today to take pictures of the engine and my experiences over the past two days are already being documented. I'll call Honda and get a rep out to look at the car if they'll send one. If not, then I'll get the rep to talk to the body shop and my insurance adjuster. And then we'll save the parts that are being removed. Like I said earlier, I just can't let this go yet. I'll reach that point later, but not until my insurance company has had a chance to hold Honda accountable.
And do you want to know the worst part? I really miss my car! I've driven a 2006 Toyota Forerunner and a 2007 Saturn Ion now, and neither holds a candle to my Civic. For everyone who is complaining about the quality of your Civic, yes, our cars may have problems (my problems were either self inflicted--one wreck was my fault--or inflicted by someone else--a jerk hit my car--or a warranty problem--the questionable motor mount), but there is a lot worse baseline quality out there. Neither of the two vehicles I've driven has the feel of the Civic, or the interior touches that our cars have. Right down to the cup holders, Honda engineers stand head and shoulders above the others.
My husband wants to either trade my Civic on a Saturn Vue (maybe a Green Line) or add a Vue, but I'll have a hard time giving up Honda, notwithstanding this service experience.
You will take a very big hit on it's value not only because the accident but the first year, the car depreciates the most and then levels off.
I went to trade my 06 LX Sedan. The car is perfect in and out, not a ding or damage to be found. I even clean my engine bay every few months.
I paid $17,200 (at the time, it was a great price) and just a week ago went to trade for a 07 scooby impreza "I" wagon (I had an impreza wagon in the past, loved it) and 3 dealerships appraised my car at $14,000. This is $3200 loss in the first year. They even remarked at how low the mileage was at 10.200 (the car should have 14,000 miles by now, it just reached one year old).
You will have a ton of negative equity (unless you paid cash for your car) and most banks finance only so much negative equity, normally $2000-$3000 unless they play the "hide the negative equity game"
I wanted to trade mine because I felt for the money, the problems I was having would only get worse based on people who have more mileage with shocks going, struts going, engines leaking oil, etc etc.
I am going to hold onto it for a year or so longer and just take care of it so I can pay it down more.
At the time, they told me they found nothing wrong. But because the problem magically disappeared after that visit, I get the feeling they knew exactly what to "tweak" to make it go away. Maybe there is a secret fix and if you complain, they do it, thereby avoiding a recall? Who knows?
Of course, the starting problems may yet resurface (hope not!), but it's been five weeks so far of perfect starts since the dealer visit so I'm hoping they did something that made the problem disappear.
So, the salesman did not react but promised to check it out ASAP.
Therefore, two things come to mind: this forum talks about the problems experienced by this model the first year it came out and someone mentioned that a car with less than 2 miles was never tested by the dealer to make sure the car was OK.
First lesson, is make sure you test drive the car and put it through its paces. Next, a car with less than two miles was driven by no one to see if it was OK or not. Lastly, Honda may still be having problems even though the car has been in production since Sept 2005 (?).
I personally do not want that car and wrote down the VIN in case they tried to sell it me anywhere, as I liked the color and it was the only one between the 3 dealers I am working with.
Question: anybody has any ideas what the vibration could have been? The salesman kept saying tire air pressure was off. I thought no way, as I am one of those that checks the family fleet (4 cars!) every single darn week. Own an air compressor and I know what a low tire looks like. Hope some one has an answer. Have a great day folks!
10,000 miles later, the alignment (done 3 times in less than 1000 miles) seems to be holding and the motor mount was replaced and so was the belt for the longer belt to eleminate the 1400-1500 rpm lug bug problem.
With regards to your test drive, dealers rarely correct the tire pressure and almost all cars have 5-6 PSI higher than what the sticker says it should be. This can cause a very harsh ride and also can translate much more noise and vibration into the car. It's like driving on rocks. It can also cause unpredictable handling characteristics and make the car feel twitchy and all over the place.
Also, the car might have had a tire weight missing and thus maybe one of the tires were out of balance.
It does not mean the car was not good.
I always bring a tire gauge with me so if and when I purchase, I correct the pressures before I drive home so I know if something is really wrong or not.
I hope you find a car you like.
Thanks for the advice, I will use it. Wish you a good holiday.
With regards to my galaxy gray LX sedan, no one else had this color at the time so I took the chance.
So far, other than the things I mentioned, all else is well. I hope I don't develop the oil leaks others have and also I hope my shocks & struts hold up. Other have had them replaced with low mileage.
Good luck and happy holiday!
My question: any thoughts on a show room car versus one in the parking lot?
My thoughts are that the one inside has been protected from the environment better...any thoughts?
Thanks all & happy Easter!
#1 check how many miles on the car. I never buy a new car with over 10 or so miles. If the car has 20-30 miles, it most likely has been test driven a lot or been transferred from another dealership.
#2 these cars have been sat in alot and have been tinkered with by customers and salesman. This is not a big deal but again, I myself don't like this type of thing, does not mean anything bad though. Just my preference.
#3 the good thing is that the car most likely has been waxed well to make it look great in the show room. When they prep a car from the lot I think they normall do a sloppy job as they are rushed to deliver the car to you so you take it the same day.
#4 if you are going to purchase this car, check all fluids including oil & other vitals fluids. This car most likely has been sitting a while in the showroom (ask how long) and if it's been months. Have them change the oil for you as a courtesy so you know the oil in the car is fresh. Oil should not sit for many months without the car being started.
Those are my views. Check the cover over carefully for scratches as people tend to lean on the car in the showroom.
Happy Easter!
Broke my cardinal rule of car buying by buying a 1st year model but so far have been lucky. Had the lug bug TSB performed eventhough it wasn't that noticeable. But since they agreed to do it, figured why not. Besides that, the car's been fine. Very happy with everything about it.
The Sandman
I have an '06 EX MT in Galaxy Gray, built in April '06, and i've had no problems at all with this car. My lowest MPG has been 34, due largely to snowy weather and winter mix fuel.
Thanks
How bad is the vibrating/rattling? If you bring it to the dealership, can you reproduce the problem while with a technician. If so, it's just proves there is a problem and they need to fix it.
You can always call the Honda Car line and insist on a higher level technician meet you at the dealership and or a regional manager with a field rep/tech.
I would get this documented as soon as possible and insist to whomever that they figure out the problem and repair it.
Nice car.
The Sandman
Today, American Honda phoned me to let me know that they had reviewed my complaint a second time, and looked at the web links that had been provided. Wayne (I'll hold his last name) explained to me that the data found on these websites is nothing more than "opinion" and that American Honda was not going to change its position. I asked who else I could talk to and he told me no one. This was the final decision. I told him that I wasn't satisfied because he had not sufficiently explained why Honda repairs some and not others. He told me that Honda had repaired the others out of "goodwill" to those customers. I told him he had just lost me as a customer.
Ironically, I used some photos and support material from this and other websites to illustrate how Honda owners are fixing the vibration/rattle that originates from the subwoofer, back speaker deck. The dealer took that info and instead of using paper towels to stuff into the openings, they used a foam material. Unfortunately, the support materials I sent regarding the condenser didn't fly with them.
So, now I will take the vehicle to an independent repair shop (the dealer wants $750 and the indie guy wants $500). Other than potential warranty issues, I will NEVER step foot on another Honda lot. This will be my first and only Honda, and I very much can't wait to trade it for something else.
Finally, I've ordered lemon magnets and I plan to drive it up and down the street in front of th dealer. I told Wayne that I'd really f- with them and I will. Yep, folks, I am ticked off... and truly hurt that Honda is not the company I thought it was.
You may have to do some searching to find who is the next person in the chain of command. You can also try a website called planetfeedback.com. It's a place where you can submit bad customer service for a host of different industries. From what I understand, companies do monitor this website.
Good luck.
The salesman was going to have their service manager check the cars and have one ready for me to drive again this weekend. If someone can put me at ease on this that would be great because I love everything about the car and have had an accord in the past that I was very happy with.
Seems like someone screwed up the PDI when the car came into the dealership.
The Sandman
My current 06 LX sedan, the pressures were 6 to 7 PSI high.
Many year ago I started bring a tire pressure gauge with me when I pick up my new cars so I can lower then before driving home. This helped me to make sure things were okay or not okay with the car.
Tire pressures are so overlooked when cars are on the lot and when they are delivered.
The Sandman
My car still pulls to the right despite the 3 alignments and dead balls accurate tire pressures.
It's not really that bad but if you let go of the wheel while coasting, it goes over to the next lane pretty quickly.
Since I am exhibiting mostly normal tire wear, I have learned to live with it.
Keep the rear drum brakes in adjustment if you have an LX or DX and it keeps the cable lubricated!
"If your brakes break, they won't brake and your car will break."
How you apply the parking brake on a hill is important. Always apply it first, then let off the foot brake pedal for second to place the load on the parking brake, then shift into park.
If you shift to park 1st, all the strain of the car on the hill will be held by the relatively small parking pawl inside the transmission. This can make it difficult to move out of park.
I find this very strange because when my 2002 Civic EX coupe had the failed struts at 3 years and again a year later with the timing belt tensioner/water pump problem there was no question they were to be repaired by the dealership. I feel Honda knew this was coming because the 2002 was the second year of that model redo. I'm getting ready to buy a 2007 Civic EX coupe and I'm hoping that if this model has been out there since Sept. 2005 that this 2007 will not have any of the 2006 problems. If it does, this will be my last Honda as my 5 year old 1982 Accord had a failed rack and pinion steering seal. Cost me almost $1,000 to replace.
It all depends on the dealerships in your area.
On Long Island, the dealerships (service departments) are far from friendly for the most part (I am sure there are a few good ones) and you really have to make a stink to get something fixed that they think is fine when you know it's not. I took me 4-5 visits and a call to Honda to get my mount replaced and the serpetine belt replaced (lug bug noise). I also have to bring down copies of the service bulletings which they said they never saw. I know their system has these TSB's cause mine problems were quite a while after honda issued the TSB's.
Either way, buy your car, enjoy it and most likely, some or all of the problems have been resolved.
If you have any doubts, buy something else. Nothing worse than buying a new car and already feeling worried about things.
This is my first car I ever purchased, because I was never able to have my parents give me a car, I'm a 19 female and I think I'm being taken advantage of.
Ok.... I have 30,000 miles of my 2006 Honda Civic and they are already telling me my rotors have to replaced along with my brake pads. I understand that around 30,000 miles your brakes need to be change, I know that and I know how to do that. But my rotors, I didn't think that was right. Someone please tell me if this is correct or not. I need help before I pay someone to do this for me.
Thanks!
~Chrissy
Honda rotors are known to warp very quickly. I have had many hondas and was advised by a long time mechanic that they tend to be thinner than other makes so heat warps them quicker.
Most likely, you would need a rotor resurface. If your steering wheel does not shake left to right while braking, you rotors are not warped. Normally when replacing disc pads, most places do a resurface of the lining so that the new brakes don't wear prematurely.
I hope this helps.
You'd have to replace the rotors under 2 conditions, typically. If you let the disc pads wear down to the point where you had metal to metal contact (worn out pad grinds against rotor). You hear this by the grinding noise when applying brakes, and visually you can inspect the rotors to see if they are scored. Be sure to look on both sides of each rotor.
The second reason is if the rotors have warped. You notice this when you are applying the brakes, and you feel a pulsation in the brake pedal. This warping happens with heavy braking where the rotors get very hot.
I have heard of a number of situations where companies are just automatically replacing both, so I don't think it is necessarily a case of somone wanting to take advantage of you.
You might be able to have rotors re-surfaced, where they cut off some of the metal using a lathe to make it smooth and true. However, since the rotors don't cost all that much, it is usually just easier to replace them.
At 30K I would expect to replace the front pads, nothing would normally be needed on the rears as they do minimally work stopping the vehicle. You would not normally need front rotors, unless you have experienced the grinding or warping.
Good luck
Chrissy, I encourage you by all means to take the advice you've already been given and get a second opinion.
Many places now just replace the rotors rather than bother with turning them, since in their case, time is money. Since I do my own brake work, I typically have them turned. It's more bother and takes a bit longer, but i do it anyway.....
It is rare that a rotor needs to be replaced, if done properly turning them (actually done on a lathe) will extend their life for a very long time.
However, if you let the pads wear too far, you WILL damage the rotors and they will need to be replaced. So replacing the pads whenever you start hearing the squeal is very important (and cost effective!)
My 97 camry has 201,000+, my 93 had 198,000+ and I've only replaced the rotors once on each. They had been turned so many times they were past the minimum allowable thickness. On average, every other pad replacement got the rotors turned, but only if warped or badly glazed.
You should definitely get a second or third opinion.
For the record 95 K miles on original pads isn't typical nor should your mechanics have had to "bug" you about replacement. Many states including mine have annual mechanical inspections and when the pads/shoes get within a certain point they MUST be replaced. But nonetheless I don't scrimp on things like brakes (cost: about $40 +/- for new pads) and mine last about 35K miles or so.
I have realized from the many different hondas I have had, an 86 LXi accord, 86 CIVIC SI 1500, 2006 LX, it's best to use OEM pads or a high quality replacement.
If you don't specify this when going to a small shop or one of those tire centers, they will use a cheap replacement and your car will not only stop worse but the pads will wear quicker.
Honda's OEM pads are really good from my experience.
My brakes worked perfectly fine for the duration of the 95,000 miles (no noises or other weird symptoms.) I replaced the pads when they needed to be replaced.
That Civic was virtually maintenance free, which is why I decided to buy the '07 model. Hope it will be as great as my previous car.