Toyota Echo Real World MPG

kneisl1

And of course youd have to spend $20,000 + to buy an Insight before you could start "saving."

highmiler650

Exactly! A used Echo or Yaris makes more sense to me when it comes to saving!

moparblue2

no body likes to talk about there Echo no more. great little car. great gas mileage. good power for the cars size. we have owned 2000 bought it new. we now own 2004 Echo we bought used in 2004. 56,000 miles no problems

kneisl1

Well heck Im always here! My 2001 has 44k miles on it and the 2000 auto I bought for my son for $3000 last year has 124,000 miles. (started at 116k) Runs like a top too!

nippononly

last fill-up was 374 miles, 8.9 gallons, so 42 mpg right on the nose. The little Echo just keeps chugging along, 118K now, still no repairs ever and no maintenance beyond oil changes in the last 12 months. The spark plugs and air filter come due around 125K, and it will need tires right after that, so it may be that I will choose to sell it instead of do the maintenance, which will cost more than $500 including the tires.

We will see.

mnman

Spring is here in the midwest and my mileage is up, I got 54 mpg on a 180 mile trip to the lake and 50 on the way back, according to the ScanGauge. It seems accurate to me. I bought the car in 03 for a pittance $5800 w/26k miles. It has 115,000 miles on it now and is just broke in. I hope to be hitting the road more often and my goal is to wring out 300,000 miles out of it. If you want a cruise, check out the Rostra.

kneisl1

www.fueleconomy.gov

Gp to this site and click on the lower left where it says Your Mpg. You can keep a running record of your MPG and keep it for ever and for others to see.

electrify

How are you guys recording 40+ MPG when filling up?!? When I hypermile the hell out of my car (shift to park at red lights, slow and smooth acceleration, driving the speed limit - which is 100km/h (62MPH) where I am, releasing throttle at certain points to upshift sooner, tire pressure at max, etc), and most of the time I get 37 to 38 MPG max!!! I work as a courier, so I end up bringing my car in each month for oil changes and regular maintenance.

Are you guys using manual transmissions or coasting in neutral? The only time I've ever recorded over 40 MPG was by shifting into neutral when approaching red lights or going down hills. I stopped though, since I heard it could be bad for the engine from most sources.

I really need to buy a Scanguage

dephinusorca

There is no doubt that the manuals can get higher miles--a solid ten percent higher, I think, everything else being equal. Also, from what I have observed people reporting, I think that there is just some significant difference from vehicle to vehicle, irrespective of driver. And then there are the issues of how you drive, how long your commute is, how cold the weather is, etc. My car has averaged 46mpg for the 30,000mi or so I've had it, with probably 85%/15% freeway to city. Once or twice during cold spells and with lots of city driving I got (barely) less than 40mpg on a tank. But I haven't seen automatics post averages over 40mpg very often on this board.

kneisl1

Definately notice a BIG difference in the manual shift cars vs the autos mileage wise. Autos just dont cut it. My 04 ECHO with auto averaged 31 mpg and my new Yaris with auto is getting 34. (well thats the first tank) Thats all city miles NO highway. My manual ECHO got pretty much 40 mpg (less in winter) just city driving. You can expect high 40s with a manual on the highway if you keep it to 60-65 mph. I got 52 mpg once like that over 165 miles highway driving. Its interesting to me that the new mpg numbers for the Yaris are identical manual and auto. (and they stink) Weird and hard to believe.

electrify

I'm in the Toronto area, the weather is currently very nice spring/summer like. Surprisingly, I did notice a slight drop when I switched off my winter tires (which were new this season) to the all season that came with it when I got it last year, so maybe I should look into getting new tires? I also checked the air filter the other day (which is a pain in the [non-permissible content removed] on this car) and it didn't seem too dirty, but I will probably change it when I bring her in next weekend.

kneisl1

Air filter a PITA on an ECHO? I suggest removing the air intake hose from the housing before unsnapping the clips. Theres a clamp that uses a philips screw to loosen it. It might be a fight but once you get it off the air filter housing is easy to deal with. Spray the hose and filter housing with WD40 to make reassembly and futurre disassembly a snap!

electrify

If you must know, I was able to get it out with relatively little problems. But I had problems getting the rear clips to go back in, and figured that I had to disconnect the big hose on the front to do it. I removed the clasp but still had problems, so while trying to put it back on I dropped the screw somewhere under the hood :mad: !

At this point, I got my landlord's brother who is an amateur mechanic to come by and he was able to reattach the casing without a problem. However with the hose, he simply reconnected it and said not to worry about it... I didn't feel comfortable with this advice, so I took it to a Canadian Tire and they reattached it properly.

So bottom line, dealing with the air filter is a little more complicated with the Echo than with most cars.

Anyways, does anyone have any suggestions for good low rolling resistance tires? From what I can tell visually, they don't seem to be worn out, however according to Google, I believe they are designed for grip rather than fuel economy. Also seeing my mileage drop from 36-39MPG to 34-36MPG AFTER removing my winter tires AND getting my alignment corrected is leading me to believe that there may be issues with the tires.

mnman

Winter takes down my mileage big time, say 10 mpg highway. I do very well in the summer on the rural highways at 60mph, often above 50 mpg. On one trip it was 56 mpg, must have been perfect weather... I have 80,000 miles on the irridium plugs, they say they are 100K plugs, but I may change them sometime soon (this summer maybe) BTW- my Echo is a 01 manual with 115000 miles on it. I love the car for what it does the best, gets me there cheaply and purrs like new all the way!!
The wife has a Prius ('08) It is nice, the ride is better and it has more luxeries, but she paid for it- five times more than I did for the Echo....

nippononly

The tires that have enabled me to attain a 42 mpg lifetime average on my '02 (with stick shift, NOT automatic) are Toyo Spectrums which have the added advantage of a 65K-mile treadwear warranty (which they have easily achieved. It's looking like 75K will be possible at this point).

In a stick shift Echo, it's child's play to pull 50 mpg on a highway trip as long as you keep it to the speed limit and no more.

A lot of tire shops will offer you "a bit more tire" (a bigger size) as mine did when I went for the Echo's tires, but sticking to the 175/65/14s that were stock (unless you had the appearance package in later years) will give you the best mileage.

nippononly

With summer now here in full force, A/C use is once again a daily occurrence for me, but despite that I am managing 41 mpg - filled last night with 9.5 gallons, 391 miles. The one before that was actually 42 mpg, so I am doing a bit better than last summer if memory serves.

This little car is really something in the fuel economy department. :-)

'02 5-speed 4-door.

mnman

That is great per tank mpg, my '01 5M got me home from northern Wisconsin again for the umteenth time last night, I started out with the gauge at about 5/8 tank, a little lower actually, 180 miles later- still above 1/4 full. 53 mpg. according to scangauge. I drove another 30 miles today around town (traffic signals all over) then stopped and put in some $2.40 gas, six bucks I had in my pocket brought er back up to half a tank again, good to go for awhile. I felt like a kid trying to get by on a few bucks all the time! That was 30 years ago, LOL

nippononly

because I came across a station with a great price and I had a long drive home.

Anyway, it was a hair under 6 gallons for 286 miles, a whopping 47.5 mpg!! Of course, I assume it was a short fill so I will average it with the next one, but still I bet the average for this 700 miles will be more than my usual 42. :-)

Gotta love how frugal the Echo is with gas.

nippononly

So the next fill was tonight, 326 miles, 8.5 gallons, 38 mpg. So that's a hair short of 43 mpg for the last 600 miles or so, not bad considering it's summer and I'm using the A/C all the time now.

kneisl1

How fast were you goin'?

kneisl1

Well I had the Yaris out for a long distance drive to upstate NY and back this weekend. 250 miles up and 250 miles back. I set the cruise control on 70 mph and used the AC about 20% of the time. MPG? I averaged just a hair under 40 mpg. Not bad! The ECHO would get maybe 1 or 2 mpg more on trips like that. Although I drove about 80 mph in the ECHO.
Sometimes I shut down the CC because when going up hill the transmission would downshift to maintain 70 mph. I just let the car slow down 5 or so mph but stay in high gear.
I realize this isnt an ECHO we're talking about here but I mention it because many current ECHO owners may find themselves in a Yaris someday.

dephinusorca

That is encouraging. Hopefully my echo lasts until there's actually an improvement in efficiency out there, but the Yaris would be a good replacement choice if there isn't.

I haven't been tracking mileage for the last year because my wife has taken over the car and I'm on foot except for weekends. But we'll be going on about a 2500 mile road trip soon, and will chart the mileage. Last year a similar trip got just a shade under 50mpg average and three tanks of around 53.

kneisl1

Boy no way I see 50 mpg with this Yaris and auto transmission. Maybe if I set the CC for 60? I think that would be suicide on the interstate though! :sick:
I have a bad feeling the most FE/affordable ever to be made car will be the ECHO.

nippononly

I'm really hoping that when Toyota revises the Yaris for 2011, there will be significant improvements in the fuel economy. It's so unlike Toyota for a successive model to DROP in fuel economy as happened when the Echo transitioned to the Yaris.

kneisl1

I think the way the Yaris is selling we'll be lucky to even see one in 2011. I saw a TV ad pitching a $79 a month lease of the Yaris recently.

dake

It's all about weight. Weight is the fuel economy killer and the newest Yaris is heavier with all the added safety features. That's why we'll be hard pressed to beat the old 3 cylinder Geo - the thing was a toaster box. Once you start adding in side curtain airbags, and all the other bells and whistles, the pounds start adding up.

I just really want them to follow through with a Yaris Hybrid. It'll weigh less than a Prius (which is really pretty big) so it should do better over all including operate under battery power to a higher speed.

mopar71

Hybrid technologies has a yaris hybrid. its called the liv wise.
http://www.hybridtechnologies.com/products

nippononly

Last tank was 414 miles, 9.6 gallons, for a better than 43 mpg reading. The little car just keeps chugging along providing amazing fuel economy, and this summer was a surprise as even with lots of A/C usage, my tank to tank average didn't drop much.

Thanks to kneisl's advice, I am upshifting a bit sooner these days than I did when I first got the car, and I make a habit of not exceeding the speed limit on the highway, expressly to conserve gas. But beyond that I do none of the hypermiling stuff some Prius owners do.

Still 42 mpg overall, over the last 65K miles. The little guy gets new spark plugs and air filter (and maybe a battery) this fall. :-)

'02 5 speed.

kneisl1

I think youve got a big advantage with that 5 speed. With the automatic in the Yaris, it wont shift into fourth until the warmup light goes out. With the ECHO I was in 5th as soon as possible! Still Im averaging 37 mpg overall so far although that includes a 500 mile trip (2500 total miles) where I got 41. Going to work I get 34-36 mpg.

nippononly

small engine + auto trans with less than 5 speeds =

At least that's usually the case. Echo seems to be one of the most extreme examples of that out there.

lhanson

I have had both a manual and an automatic Yaris. I have averaged 37 MPG in 90% city driving with both.

Grumbleshark

Hooray! I had the 1996 3-cylinder Metro, I'm currently in the process of graduating from my 2000 Echo, to a 2010 Yaris. And yes the Metro WAS a toaster - I could pick it up if I wanted to.

Words can't describe how much I LOVE my Echo... at 200,000 miles going gangbusters up and down the highway with an automatic transmission, I still get 34 mpg.

(I have to say though... the interior of the Yaris doesn't look NEARLY as nice as the interior of the Echo.)

nippononly

since the new tires were put on, and the reading is a little low! :-(

384 miles, 9.4 gallons, that's not quite 41 mpg. I hope it is a 1-tank aberration, and that the new tires are not going to cause my mileage to decrease permanently.

On the plus side, the tires are nicer to drive on than the last set, with very little downside beyond a bit more "squirm" on the tread because it is such a deep, widely spaced tread on this tire.

'02 5-speed, officially past 125K on the odo now.....

dake

So YOU are the one person that actually liked that gawd-awful upholstery pattern in the Echo. Thank goodness for seat covers.

nippononly

it would appear that my choice of new tire has indeed reduced my fuel economy by 2 mpg. :-(

379 miles, 9.4 gallons, 40 mpg.

If I get much better wet traction than the precious little I had before, I guess I might call it an even trade...

'02 5-speed.

kneisl1

:mad: That sucks!

nippononly

You can say that again!

It was immediately apparent when I got the new tires that they were much softer than the old ones, and probably have much higher rolling resistance as a result. One consequence of that was BOUND to be lower fuel economy, but the ride is softer now too, which is a plus, and if I do end up getting lots more traction in the rain, I guess I will call it even.

They are very grippy!

thegreyone

Coming from Edmonton (northern Canada) where temperatures are often under - 20 degrees Celcius (-4 degrees Fahrenheit) Although an electric block heater acts as insurance for getting the vehicle started on frigid mornings, there still needs to be a warmup period to get the ice scraped off the windows and the windows all defogged... so we certainly are at the 20% drop of efficiency. And I was interested when the "Mythbusters" TV show did a "A/C vs Open Windows" episode showing that at speeds over 55 mph that A/C is certainly more efficient than the open windows that cause lots of drag due to air friction... especially for sedans that are more streamlined than SUVs. Open windows decreased the mpg by about 20% !!!!!!
Below is an interesting link about a similar study... with references.

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kneisl1

I have a hard time believing that open windows would make your mileage go from 40 mpg to 32 mpg on the freeway at 75 mph. Maybe its true?

dake

Drag increases exponentially with speed, so I wouldn't be totally surprised.

mcdawgg

I once read somewhere that when tires are brand-new, they will get less mpg because of the mold release stuff still on them. I don't know if it's true or not.

thegreyone

And I'm also not surprised that the windows down doesn't make as much of a difference for the more box-like SUVs compared to the more streamlined sedans and coupes. But 20% change in gas mileage is significant.

nippononly

Well, I hope so, because I want my 42 mpg average back! :-|

Certainly as tires age, the rubber hardens even if they still have a lot of tread, and that hardening decreases traction but increases fuel economy.

nippononly

and it seems to be getting a little better....386 miles, 9-1/3 gallons, so I am back over 41 mpg, and that's the second tank in a row. Bring on 42! :-)

kevin4332

I just joined this forum and I am very interested in a few things here.. I have a 2003 echo 2 dr auto. I drive the snot out of this car. and havent spent a dime on this car since i bought it in 2004 other than plugs, oil, airfilters and ocational fuel cleaner additives.
I pull about 32-34 mpg and drive it kind of hard. I am an aircraft mechanic and we do alot of driving to various airports here in SoCal. Not uncommon to do 800 miles a wk.
Recently i have been getting a pinging sound while taking off from a light or under low pedal acceleration, and when i did a plug change i noticed a little oil in the combustion chamber. Any advice on how to get rid of this pinging?. i use 87 but even w/89 or 91 octane i still get it..
Thanks

moparblue2

We have 04 echo it has 60,000 miles. Now we avg. 39 MPG city & hwy. No problems but battery. We are on 3 battery. But love that mpg. This is are 2nd echo. We had new 2000 traded for van for kids in 2002. Still kicking myself for tradeing it. Echos are hard to find for sale that are not beat up or wrecked! P.S. DO NOT BY WALMART BATTERYS. THEY BACK THERE WARRITY BUT HOW MANY DO YOU HAVE TO CHANGE OUT?

pesterkid

I only got one key when I bought my used car and today I lost it
I have a duplicate but is there a way to get an original from Toyota?
I feel so stupid!

pesterkid

I went to the Toyota showroom expecting the worst- either they won't make me a key or will get charged exorbitantly.
I was pleasantly surprised by how helpful they were. I got a spare factory key for $16 which they made off my VIN number.
There was also an option of a cheaper metaheal key for $10.
I can relax now

nippononly

Echo is one of the last models out there without a chipped key (a key that provides some theft protection), but the upside is what you just experienced - really cheap replacement keys. This would have been $150 from the dealer, including the labor cost to program the new key to the car, if it had been a chipped key.

Still chugging along here, up over 132K now, got 43 mpg on the last tank but it had more straight highway driving than I usually do, and the tank before that yielded only 39. :-(

Should have bought tires with a higher speed rating like the ones I had before, the dropoff in mileage has been a consistent 2-3 mpg. The Michelins I got are Harmonys, a soft little S-rated tire, and the Yokohamas I had before were H-rated. Harder tires, less rolling resistance, better mileage (and a harder ride).

Fell for the Harmonys because of the 80K treadwear warranty.....

thegreyone

We are starting to have so many thaw/freeze cycles here in western canada that I have started to stay away from the "harder" high mileage, less rolling resistance tire simply because they suck on glare ice... especially on the occasional skating rink commuter highway drives that are high-risk. I used the "softer tires" and have not been as white-knuckled. When my son started driving he hit the ditch a few times or had a couple of 360/540s, we put on 4 of the new breed of "snow tire" that keeps soft in the cold and he is feeling much less stressed about commuting to work each day. Yup... gas mileage is down a bit but when you consider the safety side... it's no question.