Jeep Cherokee Grand Cherokee Steering Stability and Suspension

teberts

This is the 2nd Cherokee w/4 wd that I have had this problem with. At anytime on a highway the front end will go into a violent shake that sends me to the shoulder to slow down. Once I slow to about 30 mph it goes back to normal. It happened on my 1999 Chrokee 4 wheel and now on my 1997 Limited. If anyone has had this experience please help. Scarey to drive.

mullins87

First off, are the tires balanced? Are these lifted? If they are lifted, it could be "death wobble." I've never experienced it myself, but I've been told it is a problem in lifted Jeeps and it is quite scary.

If they aren't lifted and/or "death wobble" is not your problem, then I'd look at the steering/suspension. First off, check your tierod ends. If they are worn/loose, replace them. Make sure the drag link ends are not loose as well. Check for worn hubs and ball joints. Basically, jack up the front end and check for any movement in the front tires. To check for a worn hub or bad balls joins, grab the top and bottom of the tire and try to rock it up and down. If there is ANY movement at all, then the hub and/or ball joints need to be replaced. Next grab the left and rigt side of the tire and try to manually turn it. When you do this it is normal for there to be a little movement side to side. Just make sure the other front tire and steering wheel are moving with the tire you are turning. If the tire seems to move rather freely for just a little without the other tire or steering wheel moving with it, then you've got a bad tie-rod end/ends or drag link joint.

You can grab the tie-rod itself and try to rotate it. It will rotate a small amount, less than 1/8 turn. If it seems to rotate freely, then the joints are bad. The same holds true for the drag link.

Finally, check that track bar. Make sure it is absolutely tight. I do know of one situation on a late model lifted Cherokee where it came loose. The guy was driving down the road and did the "death wobble" shake. Once he got it straightened out, he hung his head out the window and got it up to speed again. This time he saw the front axle literally moving from side to side. When he got home, the track bar was ready to fall out. He recentered the axle and tightened the track bar down, with some LockTite this time, and he hasn't had any problems since.

Good luck. I hope I helped.

teberts

The tires and alignment have just been done. The vehicle has no lift package but I just put new shocks in it and had the alignment done at the same time. This is "death wobble" for sure. 2 cars same thing. I am taking it in this week. My mechanic says he has not heard of this. I am telling him to check:

Track bar bushings

Tie rod at the knucle

Steering stabilizer

Let me know what else. Thanks for the help. This is a bad wobble.

mullins87

You said you just had an alignment done?!? If your alignment shop rotated the axle forward, that could cause the problem. The steering knuckles are installed so that their vertical centerline is not perpendicular to the ground. It is slanted so that the top of the knuckle points "toward" the rear of the Jeep. This is known as "caster" and is a measure of the distance between two lines where they meet the ground. I'm not going to try to explain it here as I don't have pics and I don't feel like typing a novel.

Caster is what makes the front end stable at high speeds and what makes the front end track straight when no other forces are acting upon it. If the axle were to be rotated forward, then the caster has been reduced or eliminated. This will cause the front end to lose their natural tendancy to "find" neutral and could cause them to wander rather violently.

mullins87

maybe I can explain it in a succinct manner.

Imagine a vertical line drawn through the center of the axle. Next, imagine a line drawn through the center of the steering knuckle. The steering knuckle line will hit the ground in front of the point where the vertical line hits. The difference in these two lines can be measured in degrees of the angle or in inches between the two points and is referred to as caster. The greater the angle, or greater distance, the more stable it will be at high speeds.

The tire, of course, will contact the ground where the vertical axle line hits the ground. It is the steering knuckle line that will "lead" the front tire. This is how you can pull a car around and the front tires will turn as the tow vehicle turns.

The most obvious examples of this principle are two motorcycles. The first bike being a racing bike, while the second is a cruiser - such as a Harley. The racing bike's fork is nearly vertical while the Harley's fork is stuck way out in front. The racing bike is very agile and the Harley is rather heavy by comparison. However, the racing bike is not very stable at high speeds and requires the total attention of the rider while the Harley is very comfortable and stable at high speeds.

I hope this helps. :confuse:

humahuma10

I have a 1997 Wrangler and I have the same problem. When I hit a small pot hole or bump at highway speed (50-60 mpg) the front end feels like it is going to fly right off the Jeep. I have to pull off the highway to make it stop. I took it to the shop for advice and they told me the ball joints are fine but the steering damper needs replacing...I had that done and there is no difference at all. I have been reluctant to drive it on the highway and only use it in town, and now I have to slum it in my Nissan 350Z if I want to go on the highway....hehe

teberts

This is also the second time for me. I had a 99 Cherokee that got fixed and it seemed OK, but it was totaled 4 months later so not sure if it really was fixed. Anyway, I live in the mounatins of Colorado where there are tons of Jeeps and they seem to know the problem. I took my 97 in last week and the guy told me it was the Track bar. He put in a new one and we will see. One note is I put new shocks all the way around and after that the problem started. When you read these posts people with "lift kits" usually have this. I am wondering if the new shocks triggered the track bar?Anyway, my mechanic says it is a bad design flaw from Jeep. I also had 94 Cherokee 4WD and it had a different front end setup. That Jeep was a horse. I just sold it and it was still tight in the steering. The mechanic told me they changed the front end after the 95 year. My 97 Cherokee Limited was driven by an old guy in Florida and I knew him when he bought it. He took perfect care with it and probably never used the 4WD.

The replacement of the track bar cost me about $375 including labor. If your mechanic wants to do other things that cost more tell him your friend has had the same problem with 2 different Jeeps and both times it was the track bar. Don't let them just start fixing stuff. Long story but I am becoming an expert with this problem. Good luck.

jimcoulter

I own a 2001 Jeep Cherokee sport 2 wheel drive. I bought it used in 2002 with 30,000 miles on it. It seemed in perfect condition. The day i test drove it I noticed a slight shimmy on the steering wheel at around 50-55 mph. It drives smoothly at lower speeds and also gets smooth once you pass 55 mph. I thought it just needed a wheel balance so after purchasing the vehicle i took it to Discount tire for balancing. This did not correct the problem. The Dicount Tire mechanic told me I had bent rims so I bought a new set of aluminum wheels. This did not fix the problem either and he suggested new tires because the ones on the Jeep has a lot of cupping. I replaced the tires and this did make it better but over the course of 4 years since I have owned the Jeep I have continued to have this problem recur about every 3-4 months after I have the tires rotated and rebalanced. I have completely replaced all 4 tires 4 times in 4 years. Let me also say that during this time I have had the Jeep dealership check out my front end and they said everything was tight. I replaced the shocks myself and I have had the front end aligned several times as well. I have never had these kinds of problems with any other vehicle I have owned! Last week i had Discount Tires try to balance the tires on a new high tech machine and the steering wheel continued to wobble again around 55 mph again smoothing out after you pass 55 mph. They put yet another set of new tires on my Jeep and this time I took it directly over to Jeep to resolve the problem once and for all. The have had my Jeep 5 days. First they replaced all the tie rods and bushings and stabilizer bar etc, they said was worn. the cost was $600 as soon as I drove off their lot the wobble continued...the problem was still there! I did a U-turn and took it right back. Since then 4 days later they still cannot find the problem. The Service Manager is now involved and he has been on the phone with Chrysler. their suggestion was to replace the sway bars at a cost of around $300 more. I authorized them to do it but I get the feeling that they are just throwing darts at the wall. I have lost confidence in them to find the problem without replacing every part up there and costing me a fortune. If anyone else has had a problem like mine please let me know and how you solved it or not. It's quite frustrating to drive it this way on the highway and it is wearing out my tires much earlier than normal.

em9596

hi i have a 95 sport with a 2 in.lift and i also have a horrible front end shake. when i go over bumps on the hiway it feels like the whole front end wants to fall apart. also when i am going about 65mph on the hiway i get a vibration that makes me rear veiw mirror vibrate so bad i cant even see out of it. i had to take the rear swaybar out because it was rubbing the tires. could the shaking and stuff be from the lift and sway bar or something totally diffrent.i would appreciate any advice thanks :P

jimcoulter

Hi...here is an update to my previous post titled "Vibration or wobble at 55 MPH" I finally got my 2001 Jeep Cherokee back from the Jeep dealership. Almost $1000 later (all tie rods, bushings,sway bars etc replaced) and the problem continues. I have done everything except switch out the axles and the to no avail. I have given up and I will dump this Jeep the first opportunity I get. I have a very strong suspicion that the problem is inherent in this model Jeep. Or at least in mine...very possibly a design flaw that Jeep has ignored. Wehn you have a wobble that always occurs at around 50-55 mph and you have replaced all 4 rims and tires, balanced them and had the fron end aligned, replaced all worn steering and front end stabilizers, bearings checked etc and the problem persists...what else could it possibly be? The dealership said it checked the driveshaft (it's fine) The jeep is not lifted and it's not a 4 wheel drive. You guys tell me....I'm at a complete loss.

teberts

Did the dealer put in a new track bar? I have put in new ones twice to repair the "death wobble". Not just a little wheel wobble. Anyway, track bar fixed both of mine.

Tom

mac376

I recently put a 1.5" Terralift suspension lift in my 2000 Cherokee Sport. I am noticing a slight vibration at about 30mph can anyone help me fix this problem?

2confused

It's funny as each lifted Jeep acts differently. Normally a 3" lift and above is when these issues happen. I would attack this problem with a 1" transfer case lowering kit. They don't cost a lot of money; somewhere around $35 or so.
I think that will solve your problem. If it doesn't, a SYE might need to be installed but I really doubt it as a 1.5" lift *shouldn't* alter the driveline geometry much for that. But again, each Jeep acts differently to a lift kit.

Also, I'd get a wheel alignment as the toe will be off a bit.

jimcoulter

I did have work done on the "track bar" in fact here is what was done...they found slack in the track bar and inner tie rod, and dampner weak...replaced all three items and performed alignment to center toe and replaced sway bar. The following was also done... New tires, new rims, newly balanced tires.

None of these repairs fixed the problem...my 2001 Cherokee Sport continues to vbrate/ wobble at between 50 to 58 mph.

My Jeep is NOT lifted and I have not altered the original suspension in any way.

em9596

i also have a 1.5 lift. i had to lower the trans case. i also had to get a whole new rear end ever since then i hadn't had a problem with that vibration. i just had to replace the steering damper and both front u joints.but that was a completely diff. vibration :shades:

chris1323

I have a 94 Jeep grand cherokee that shakes violently at around 40mph. I Lifted it 4 inches and that might be the problem but WHERE? I have had mechanics check it but still no reason why it does that. Iv had it aligned, bought and put on a steering stableizer,and a few other parts but still didnot work. I cant even drive it over 35mph so i rarely use it. If u know anything PLEASE PLEASE let me know. Thanks alot.

teberts

I have had this happen in 2 different Jeeps. By shake, I mean so violent you have to pull over. Anyway, both times it was fixed by putting in a new track bar. Try that.

harry27909

I have a 99 JGC Laredo with 77K miles on it. I am experiencing a weird vibration from the front of the car when I make sharp left or right hand turns. The whole car shudders really bad! Is anyone else having the same problems, or know what is causing this?

Thanks

harry27909

ag1999

I have a 2002 Jeep Cherokee Laredo that has a steering problem. Does anyone else have problems steering their Jeep when driving at highway speeds? I've heard that the problem could be my steering gear or tie rod ends. Anyone have the same problems?

Thanks!

ag1999

I am having problems steering my 2002 JGC at highway speeds. I have been told the problem could be the steering geear or the tie rods. Sounds like it could be an expensive problem. Anyone have similar experience/advice?

Thanks!

jeepenvy

I have my 2001 in the shop right now for steering issues. There is a recall on the 01's, but I'm not sure about the 02's. It looks like they replace the hoses and fittings running to the power steering pump. My local Jeep dealer says they don't know anything about it, even though there is a documented TSB for it.

badwreak

I'm a disabled vet. My family and I were almost killed in Aug 06 by a 21 year nut driving on the wrong side of the road and hit us doing 75 mph.
I lost my Monte Carlo that day but we all lived. Thank God!
The boy had no insurance and no DL.
My insurance refused to pay because it had just lapsed.

Anyway I am now in a wheelchair. My wife took my 95 Dodge Ram that had a bench seat in it and traded it for a 97 Jeep Grand Cherokee TSI, plus she gave the guy $800.00 to boot.
She did this so we all would have a car we can all fit in and put the wheel chair in.

Since I got out og the hospital I have driven it and noticed that it makes a grindind noice when I try to put it in 4 wheel drive or all wheel drive. It will work if I put it in low, but not the others. What is wrong with it?

The cruise control will not work either, and the fuses has been checked. ( I need that because I can't put presure on my leg)
I also noticed by being in the wheel chair that the driver side front tire is turned out further then the other.
I have everyone suing me for hospital bills, ect. While this 21 yr old is out on promation for 2 years.
So I don't have money to repair it. Cand someone please help me, please?

tidester

Omigosh! How awful. I am so glad everyone survived.

I suggest reposting your message in the Jeep Grand Cherokee: Problems & Solutions discussion since your questions are not specifically about steering problems. As an aside, we'll be restructuring the Problems & Solutions boards down the road a bit but, for now, it's the best place for you to start.

Good luck!!

tidester, host

steve35

I just replaced 4 tie rod ends on my 2000 JGC at 141k miles. The TR ends are sealed and can't be lubed so having them wear out is not unexpected. I replaced 4 because if 1 was bad (and it was) then the other 3 couldn't be too far behind. Each TR end was $70. Installation and alignment brough the bill to $550. A chunk of change but the vehicle drives very well. ">

wheatley1

Hey bud, I am not sure if anyone has suggested this, but after installing a $125.00 Old Man Emu steering stabilizer on my '92 lifted Cherokee, I found out that the reason for my wobble at 55mph was because I had broken belts in both front tires, after putting on a brand new set of Yokohomas, I fixed my problem and learned that GoodYear tires bite. Hope this helps.

teberts

I appreciate your idea but I must tell you that the wobble I am talking about is no broken belts in the tire. This wobble is so violent you cannot imagine unless it has happened to you. Your entire car shakes so bad that you have to immeadiately try to stop the vehicle. I have been driving around 65 or 70 mph and had it happen and it is scary. Once you get the speed under about 40 with no acceleration it stops. I have fixed the problem in 2 different Cherokee's by replacing the "trac bar". I hope you never have to experience it. Good luck and it is great that people resond to these posts.

wheatley1

I see, I have experienced that and always on the highway! I would be cruising along and all the sudden it would start shaking so violently other cars would avoid me as I used every bit of energy in my arms to keep the wheel straight and slow down to regain control. I lifted mine though and that is why it did this, but the steering stabilizer took care of it, that is until the belts went out. I read your post from earlier and you said you haven't lifted the vehicle, I believe. I would highly suggest putting a steering stabilizer on. You can get one like I got from Quadratec.com and I am pretty sure the one I got is called Old Man Emu or something like that. I noticed an immediate absense of the shaking the minute I drove mine home from the 4x4 shop. It doesn't cost a lot and if you have time you can do this yourself. The new shocks you put on may be overcompensating for your vehicle. The ones that I put on did this and the two add a leafs in the back didn't help the case either. Hopefully this helps out.

ag1999

I had a friend of mine look at it and he said the tie-rod ends were extremely loose. He said that is very rare for tie-rod ends to come loose over time. Apparently the ends are torqued like heck during assembly.

Has anyone else had their tie rod ends looked at? How much is it to replace them?

cher17

I also have a 94 Jeep Cherokee that shakes violently!! It is so scary when your on the highway with two small children and it happens.Im not sure what the problem is but I have never had it lifted so I dont think that has anything to do with it. I have had it for about 5 years and had more problems than I can tell you. Currently one of the stangest problems is that it rolls if it is parked on any small hill. I have to park on a flat surface or it slowly rolls back. Does anyone have this problem?

teberts

I had a 94 and now have a 97 4WD that had the same problem. The ANSWER IS TRAC BAR! Have your mechanic replce it. I had it done on both of mine and have not had the "death wobble" since. Do not let your mechanic talk you into all kinds if repairs.

2000jeep

I have a 2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport that I have had all kinds of problems with. The one that concerns me the most which I also had trouble with is a strange shaking that starts at around 53 mph. Somtimes it wont shake at all other times once it starts it keeps shaking somtimes rather violently then leaves. You can accelerate out of it or apply the break and it will stop. It only happens at around 52-55 mph range. I have had the tired balance and allignment check both were fine. I know that my u-joints are worn but I don't think that those are the problem. I had the same problem with my past 93 Cherokee. If you have any ideas or suggestions please let me know. Also on the 2000 Cherokee I have since I bought it the passenger side back window was stuck wouldn't go up but would go down, I replaced the motor and it did nothing, then the pass. side front window did the same thing. I'm assuming its the main controller on the driver side door but I havn't yet replaced it. Another problem is that the heat/AC setting works only on the highest setting and non of the others. I loved my old Jeep any ideas if the 2000 model Cherokees are known for having a lot of troubles? I'm new to this also wondering how I start my own discussion. Anyone have any input i'd be much appreciative.
Thanks,
Eric

2000jeep

Yea I have a 2000 Cherokee Sport that is doing the same thing. I thought just like you that it was an allignment problem because the shaking was minor when I test drove it. Now that I own it it shakes around 50-55 somtimes much worse that others and somtimes not at all. I'm contemplating whether I should just try and sell it and get a different one unfountunatly. In the past I owned a 93 Cherokee Sport that also did the same thing. I've tried all the same thing that you have and more but still nothing has helped. The things people have mentioned to me that I have not be able to check is apparently a sensor in the transmition could be causing the shake and I have also been told that the computer may need to be reset. Thats my 2 cents keep me posted if you make on progress on your problem.
Good Luck,
Eric

jimcoulter

I see there are still people out there having the same shaking issues I did with my 2001 Cherokee Sport. Here is an update on my problem. After having put new rims, new tires (balanced & front end aligned) the problem persisted. I took it to Archer Jeep here in Houston and they kept it for almost a week. They replaced the Trak bar all the steering linkages the sway bar and all the bushings...more than $1000 worth of work plus they supposedly road tested it using some kind of vibration test (they gave me a computer readout of the results) They said there was no problems with the driveshaft vibrating, or any other discernable problems but after coming to pick up the Jeep I felt the vibration again as soon as I drove it away from the shop! It was actually WORSE! I'm guessing because now the front end was tight from all the new parts they had put in. I drove it right back to the shop and complained. They wanted to keep it and look further into the problem. After a couple days they called me and wanted to add a whole new slew of parts. I said no...I refused to spend more money on the problem! That kind of problem can go on and on until you've replaced everything under the Jeep and you could still continue to have a problem! My gut feeling is that these Cherokee Jeeps have always had this problem...probably a design flaw. Although I don't think Jeep will ever admit it...it may even be one of the reasons this particular design was discontinued. Anyway I had had enough! I took my Jeep and traded it for a new Kia Sportage which I absolutely am in love with! The ride and feel of the Sportage is soooo much better than the Jeep and it handles like a sports car! Plus a 5 year 50,000 mile warranty! I love the look of the Jeep but they need to get their act together or they will continue to lose good customers to other brands. Best of luck to you guys who continue to have the problem.

woody67

I just bought a 97 Grand Cherokee Laredo with the same "death shake" at 55-60 mph. I drove for several days without noticing the problem but was generally driving 35-45 on city streets or 70+ on the interstate. The problem first happened at about 50 mph on a gravel road & I thought it was just the washboard surface, but it has since happened numerous times on concrete & asphalt roads. Tonight after earlier experiencing the problem while going to a meeting, I drove mostly 70+ on the way home without a repeat of the vibration. This is clearly a manufacturer defect and needs to be recalled and repaired soon or a class action suit needs to be initiated. This kind of safety problem is not tolerable on a modern-day vehicle.

Perhaps one of the network news channels needs to be informed, also.

bakulaj

Two months ago I bought a 98 Grand Cherokee TSi. This car was assembled here in Europe and I experienced the same problem with shaking at the speed between 80 to 100 km per hour. My garage mechanic exchanged lower control arms bushings, but without significant result in better drive. I am affraid which parts should be replaced next time to solve the problem.

jimcoulter

I know how you feel! I felt the same way after I discovered the shake problem in my Jeep. I wanted Jeep to be accountable. I felt as though I had been sucker punched. No one likes to get a lemon. It drove as smooth as glass at lower speeds and also at speeds over 60 mph but when you got to around 50-55mph it would begin shaking. Mine never shook violently more like the tires were out of balance but annoying nonetheless particularly after I had already spent so much time and money trying to fix it. Mechanics were perplexed but always offered their own solutions...none of which worked. the bottom line is I traded mine off, something I would have never done had it not had that problem. My biggest fear was that whoever ended up buying it would come back to me and complain. But it took me well over a year after I bought it to figure out that the problem was not the tires!

pahefner01

I've read a lot about the Jeep "death wobble" on the Colorado 4X4 forum website. The people on that site are hardcore Jeepers and know how to take a Jeep apart and put it back together. I know I've read they have the solution to the death wobble. I have a 99 Cherokee and have not had this problem. I would suggest that you might want to check out the Colorado 4X4 forum and pose this question to them.

teberts

I have had the death wobble in 2 different 4 x 4 Jeeps. Both Cherokee's, 94 & 97. Both times it was fixed by changing the trac bar. My mechanic told me that is the problem and he has seen it in many Jeeps. I do live in the Colorado mountains and here are many Jeeps up there.

90xjgirl

well i'm going threw this same problem with my 90 4inch lifted xj. i just got an alignment done due to heavy duty tie rods! yay! but after the alignment my jeep went into the death wobble. i have the rancho lift kit on there and am very dissapointed with the trac bar. very small and doesn't fit correctly. so I'm assuming thats what the problem is, after doing some major research, many jeep owners (not just cherokee) get the death wobble and start with balancing their tires, if that doesn't help they go straight to replacing the track bar"> with bushings and so on. i will let everyone know if this helps! spread the word about the trac bar it seems to do the trick. :sick: :mad: :confuse:

bluemonster93

I have a 2000 JGC limited 4.7 it seems to be making wining sounds when i make sharp turns or if i make a 3 point turn. It sounds like the steering pump and the power steering fluid is ok. Any ideas on what is causing the noise and what can be done to fix?

nachojeep

I have a 2003 and I'm having the same problem. Any luck fixing it?

tuggajb

turn up radio mine has done this sence 35000miles and now have 1600000miles still no prob

tidester

and now have 1600000miles still no prob

I suspect you put an extra 0 in there!

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

tuggajb

yep sorry

mossback

I guess it's time to join the crowd. I had not had an issue with my 1987 Cherokee's front end until two weeks ago. Now it shakes violently as the rest of you have described. The car has 190,000 miles and has not been modified, lifted, etc. and has oem shocks. I have noticed that a "repair kit" was installed with an eccentric spacer at the small end of the "A" arm by a previous owner.

I'm going to get as much information as possible before I get into a chain of unnecessary expenses, since repairs and especially parts are expensive here in Hawaii. After reading all the reports, it looks like the first thing might be to rotate the tires (because it's free) and then look at the track bar. Any discoveries out there??? I can sure use the help.

Mahalo

teberts

Mossback,

I have had this problem with 2 different Jeeps 10 years apart. I am sure the balancing of tires will not help. Do not spend any money except get a new TRAC BAR put in. It will be a minimal cost of about $175-$200. Do not let your mechanic talk you into costly repairs. This will fix the problem. If for some reason it does not then move on to other expensive fixes. Tell them to replace the Trac bar and that should fix it. Please email me and let me know how it works out.

texas76

....the ol JGC was driving well, then the steering wheel started to shake, a tiny bit of rough idling and a burning smell coming in the cab. When I put on the brakes, it pulled some to the left. I put on the brakes once pretty good. As I got down the road, it started to drive okay again, but the smell was still in the air somewhat. Help or advice is appreciated. Great forum also!

tuggajb

sounds as if you have a capaler hanging up prog left side if so change both sides calapers, roters, pads, use good one N0t OEM

mgielow

02 JGC 4.0L with 85000 miles. At low speeds the turning effort is quite high -- dangerous if turning is necessary for avoidance manuever. Any thoughts on what problem is?

offroadpep

:sick: A little info from an Old Man, :>)
Been Jeep`en and off roading for years, and have had a similar problem myself.
With an old 1996 JGC that I run off road and on road here in Arizona.
We also pull our Quads with it.
Brake Pads can ware uneven and cause a brake caliper hang up. Or it can happen for other ware related reasons. This will give the ABS a big fit. It will cause one hell of a
shimmy in the front end and could happen in the back also.
In short, pull the fuse out of the ABS to disable it. Then drive it for a wile and see if that cures your problem.
No worry, the brakes will still work just like in the old days, but if you slam them on hard the wheels will lock up and slide, just like they used to before ABS.
If this cures the problem, have the brakes repaired or do it yourself if your up to it.
Best of luck with your problem.
Cactus “PEP” :>)