Vibration Defect in 2006 4WD Honda Pilots

ksayers

I have a 2006 Pilot with a vibration defect at 70MPH. This is not steering wheel shake, rather, a very noticable shudder.

Apparently this issue is well know with Pilot 4WD owners. Tire changes/balancing does not help. Neither do other "simple" fixes like alignment.

Does anyone have an answer to this product defect ? If everyone has tried and failed, is the only answer to raise heck with American Honda ? Or ???

Thanks !

prosource1

I was just mentioning to my wife today, while driving our new Pilot, that it felt like there could be a tire/balancing/shudder in the front end of this truck. I owned a 2004 Pilot and never had anything like this in feel or shake. I was going to take it in for balancing or have tires checked but now that I know this I am not filling out my survey and sending it in til I have this issue dealt with. I will definitely be pursuing this!

ksayers

If you do find something out please let me know. I have about 1500 miles on our Pilot. I have heard horror stories about the stock tires and will be flushing them at the earliest opportunity. However, reading other posts, it appears others have tried tires, balancing, alignment, air pressure, etc., all with no luck. What is odd is that if this was a simple fix Honda should readily have an answer. Every service manager should know "the fix". Apparently, they don't. That leads one to believe that it is more than just a simple fix and, potentially, a design defect.

One person has "solved" the problem by removing the front drive shaft. I find that an inexcusable solution for a vehicle owner.

If I find anything out I will post. Let me know how it goes.

thanks !

odie6l

I haven't noticed any vibration in our '06 Pilot EX so I'm happy. But the way the roads are in PA, you wouldn't be able to tell anyway. Plus none of the roads in PA are higher than 65 MPH anywhoo. :P

Odie
Odie's Carspace

vtm4

OK, here's the deal. The vibration at 70mph impacts a number of pilots regardless of the year they were built. Mine is a 2003 and had had the vibration since it was new (it actually vibrates at 72 and 76mph). I've followed the forums closely and nothing really seems to resolve the vibration. I've heard stories that removing the drive shaft resolves it or precision balancing will fix it. What's weird is that I just test drove 3 different 2007 CRV's and all 3 of them have a vibration at 65mph and at 75mph. It seems to be that there's an engineering problem with Honda's drive system that they either haven't fixed or can't fix. I'm staying away from Honda for the time being because of this. Looking at the Toyota Camry SE as an option although my wife likes the RAV 4 with the V6. BTW, we test drove the RAV 4 and it was perfectly smooth between 60 and 80 mph. Go figure.

solo

PILOT VIBRATION
I said this in a 2004 forum and was ridiculed. I saw the problem surface again 2 months ago and got no "heat" at all. I will say it again. My service manager was honest with me! ALL pilots vibrate. The source is the drive shaft to the rear differential. It can not be fixed. Honda feels most people who buy their cars won't don't notice. Drove me crazy! By removing the shaft (8 bolts) the problem is GONE. I'M in Chicago, so this week the shaft goes back on for the winter. It sucks but I got nowhere with honda. :sick:

joesacramento

I am thinking about getting a 2007 Pilot 4WD. This vibration problem makes me curious. I had an old GMC truck with a two-pieces drive shaft and balacing took care of a vibration. Has anyone had the balance checked on the shaft? Any more specifics on the what inside the differential is causing this?

master1

I have been following this issue for a VERY long time. This is the story :
HONDA KNOWS ABOUT THIS but is playing dum because they either don't know what causes the problem, OR they don't want to issue such a big recall.

I have written a letter to American Honda headquarters, and Honda Motor Company headquarters in Japan. They responded trying to cover up the problem and saying it is "a characteristic" of the vehicle! I recently got rid of my Pilot because I could no longer deal with this flaw; very unexecptebale for a $29,000 vehicle.

Don't take the risk in purchasing this vehicle; you may want to consider the upcoming redesigned Highlander, or you can wait for the new redesigned Pilot.
Otherwise, the Pilot is an EXCELLENT vehicle.

odie6l

well I checked Alldata.com for the TSB's and recalls on the pilot (any year) and now you need to subscribe to get them. So much for them being free any longer. I guess it's true Honda hides all their recalls and bulletins from public eye.

Odie
Odie's Carspace

joesacramento

It must have been a pretty bad vibration if you had to get rid of the car. I find it diappointing that Honda can't figure the out how to remedy the problem. Do you beleive that all Pilots have the same severlty of vibration and the other owners are just willing to put up with it, or don't drive 70 mph very often? Did your vibration get worse with time?

I guess I will have to take some more test drives.

rekh

Hi everybody, I bought my Pilot EX 4WD in October. Since then I have followed the posts closely. I didn't have any problem till last week when I found the vibration(2500 miles). Both my house and work are so close to highway, so when I am in the highway in the mornings the car is still cold. I have vibration for the first 2-4 miles then it disappears. I wonder if it can be related to cold weather and clod tires?!!! Since In the afternoons the vibration is minimal or there is not any at all. Or other possibility is that the vibration comes after a while and gets worse with time?!!! Any idea? (I live in MA.)

stever

I thought Alldata always charged for anything more than summary info, but Honda (and BMW) TSB info was always hard to come by there. The NHTSA has 7 TSBs (summary info only) for the '06 Pilot, but nothing that seems related to vibrations.

odie6l

No, now they charge for everything. It really sucks, and started when they merged with Autozone.

Odie
Odie's Carspace

awsaulnier

I have a 2006 with about 6000 miles. Change the tires. Integritys are junk. Problem solved.

ksayers

I am quite glad your problem is solved. You are lucky.

I dumped the Integritys for Michelins. The problem persists. If you review other sections of Edmunds boards you will see that others have had no success with changing tires. Some appear to have slightly lessened the problem with very, very precise balancing, however, most have not. And... then there is the individual who has removed the front drive shaft on a 4WD to "solve" the problem.

Glad you have had success. However, Honda has a major defect and, to date, has not come forward with a solution.

darrickh

I purchased an 06 as well in April of this year and we are experiencing a type of "resonate frequency" in our Pilot. Mainly at very low speeds or when we are stopped and this is very strange. It sounds like a very deep BASS from the Stereo system, although I do not believe it is coming from the speakers. But it elevates slowly and is almost deafening. Here are a few things I have noticed. If I open any door to the vehicle, the noise subsides. Once I close the door again, the noise starts back. My wife stayed inside the Pilot one time when we were parked at a stop sign. I wanted to hear the sound from outside of the vehicle as I thought it may be coming from the engine. Guess What? I could not hear anything outside the car and my wife would Nod her head from inside the vehicle that the inside of the car had the deep vibration (Stereo Bass Like) noise inside. We also told the dealership about it, but could not reproduce it at the time. It is very annoying and happens at least every 2 - 3 days. If I hear it now, I usually just open the door until I start moving again and it goes away.

Other than that, and the fact that my cell phone makes the stereo act wacky, I really like the vehicle.

Has anyone experienced this with their Pilot?

bcool

I'm wondering how real this vibration problem is. I didn't notice it on the test drive, but I just canceled my purchase of a '07 Pilot AWD EX-L after reading this bulletin board. It was a great deal and a beautiful SUV. I think that I'll hold off until I find out what's going on, or find something else. Would the Acura MDX have the same problem? I'm guessing that the AWD drive train is similar. There are no vibration issues on the Acura bulletin board. :confuse:

ksayers

It is real, however, it is not always exhibited in every vehicle. Take a test drive on a smooth highway and vary your speed between 67 and 73 MPH. Avoid police. Be safe.

If your vehicle has "the disease" it will appear to have significant wind buffeting. The steering wheel doesn't shake, rather, it feels/sounds like... well.... wind buffeting. If you have the stereo turned up you will notice it less, therefore, always demo drive with the radio off.

This problem has been reported on multiple Honda 4WD models, including Acura's. It is not simply a "tire balance issue", although that may lessen it to some degree. One person reported that the problem went away when they removed a drive shaft. Tires still rotate but the problem was gone.

If you have a vehicle without the disease and at a good price, enjoy.

The problem is real, just not universally applied to every vehicle. And, apparently, Honda denies it.

jim70

Hi darrickh,

I have read similar comments elsewhere about low frequency sound at slow speed. In some cases it was indicated that it may have to do with the Active Noise Cancellation system that is found on the Pilots with VCM. You might want to check the hondapilot.org site under "forums", "problems", then "deep thrumming sound". There is also an extensive section there regarding the vibration issue.

nvdriver

I have been doing a fair amount of research on these topics and there seem to be two distinctly different issues:

Vibration: An apparently serious vibration that is most prominent around 70 MPH. This seems to affect a significant number of AWD Pilots going back at least to the 2005 model year. There are many comments, complaints and theories but the common thread seems to be that, for the people who have this problem, Honda has been unable to fix it.

Noise: There are many complaints about road noise, as well as a more recent surge in complaints about a strange low pitched noise on new Pilots with VCM. It appears that Honda is utilizing some sort of active noise cancellation which comes through the speakers of the stereo. Unfortunately, it looks like that may have created some problems of it's own.

ksayers

Actually, 3 problems:

- 70MPH vibration/shudder design defect, ignored or at
least not acknowledged by Honda. They probably don't
want a national recall, including the expense and
publicity.

- Road noise, makes having a radio totally useless.

- Low pitched noise from ???? source.

pratzert

I bought a 2006 AWD EX-L Pilot 6 weeks ago and I am beside myself with this vibration.

I have had the tires road forced balanced and it helped "a little" but ONLY a little.

It's still there at 60-70. It's a very fast type of vibration.

If only I had felt it before I bought it. I assure you that I would NOT have bought the Pilot !

It's horrible and extremely distracting... so much so that I feel it's dangerous.

I drive my brand new Pilot very little now because of it and drive my Sebring instead.

How's THAT for a testimonial !

Tim

miles267

Can any new 2007 Honda EX-L 4WD owners comment on this vibration? Am ramping up to purchase one end of year or early next year but this has caught my attention. Especially since I want a relatively quiet vehicle so I can utilize bluetooth cell phone within. Thanks.

justaveragejoe

I don't notice any vibrations in my 2007 except for the first hundred feet after it has been parked for a few days. I am sure that that is from flat spots on the tires from being parked so long, I can feel that in my other vehicle also. If you want a real quiet vehicle you should consider a sedan. Pushing a big box like the Pilot through the air at 60 mph will produce quite a bit of turbulence and wind noise.

ksayers

It's not wind noise. If you drive on very smooth asphalt
the noise is minimal. If you drive on anything OTHER than
very smooth asphalt (rough asphalt, concrete of any sort,
etc.) it is very noisy. Same speed. Same air. Honda
has a serious issue with road isolation, specifically,
picking up the noise through the suspension to the passenger
interior. And... doesn't matter whether it is the original
Integrity tires or new Michelin's.

Most people don't take a test drive for any extended time
on a freeway. If they did, Honda sales would suffer.

doctor_dirt

It's strange I have read these forums for a while and have always been concerned with this topic but have been lucky not to experience the problem at all. I now have a little over 5,000 miles on my 06 AWD/EXL and haven't experienced any problem with vibration other than a small vibration at 42 MPH. As far as higher speeds, our speed limit on the highways here in Arizona is 75 and I frequently drive at 80-85. Road noise has also been an issue in the forum and I find my Pilot very quiet and can easily listen to the stereo at speed. As far as road noise and wind the Pilot is much quieter than the Subaru WRX/STI that I traded in against it. I wonder if the noise and vibration started immediately and if it didn't show up in your initial test drive of the vehicle.

justaveragejoe

As a matter of fact, I drive from old asphalt to brand new asphalt everyday (65 mph speed limit) and I am aware of that difference, which is significant. Since I also drive a Buick sedan over the same route, I have compared the differences between those vehicles. The Honda does produce more noise on both surfaces. But it's better than the Chevy Blazer that it replaced. I test drove the Highlander also but didn't sense a significant improvement vs. the Honda.

kabill

I know this thread is supposed to be about vibrations in the PILOTs, but since you mentioned wind noise, I have to say that I've not driven a PILOT (10-15 of them) that didn't have excessive wind noise. It's a problem that's been thoroughly discussed throughout these forums, as well as readily admitted to by my local Honda dealer.

As far as the vibration, I've experienced it on a few Pilots, and road noise is a given on most Hondas.

I'm hoping these issues get addressed for the 2008 model, but I'm not very optimistic considering they haven't been yet.

jph123

I have a 2004 Pilot with 59000+ miles. Replaced tires with Michelin® Cross Terrain recently. The vibration is finally gone.

kabate

This sounds EXACTLY like my Pilot. I purchased my Pilot in Sept. 06 and the vibration appeared the day after I picked it up. It has been back to different dealers 4 times. After five sets of tires and rims, five rotations, 4 wheel alignments, a "special road balance" and 2 disconnections of the drive train, the problem still exists. Honda does acknowledge that there is a problem with the car - the regional service rep has driven it and agrees - but they have no idea what the problem is or how to fix it. They also can't confirm or deny that the problem makes the vehicle unsafe. Comforting thought when you have a 3 year old in the car everyday. I want my '03 Pilot back.

Also, any thoughts on what to tell the dealer to fix the window noise - rattling kind of "styrofoam" noise. Repair attempts on this is four times as well.

ksayers

As you have gone through plenty with the dealer, I would suggest requesting a meeting with the regional manager and go in with the assumption that the defect IS a safety hazard and if Honda wants to PROVE otherwise, do so. There is no reason to buy into the concept that they define whether its a hazard or not. I would default to "it is a hazard and once you figure out what it is, then you can try to convince me otherwise". After that, offer the 15 cents a mile for what you have for mileage minus your time/effort for all the repairs and have them buy the vehicle back.

blackexv6

Make sure you doucument each repair order. If the receipts acknowledge your complaint each time then files a Lemon Law suit against Honda. Check your state's laws for requirements.

I filed suit against Honda for our '06 Odyssey this past week. My attorney tried mediation with Honda's pre-litigation department but they concluded my problem was a "normal operating characteristic of the vehicle".

My documentation is a clear cut Lemon case win, however, it may take up to 9 months until award. If you have the willpower and good documentation (i.e. parts failing each time or written acknowledgement of the problem) then file a claim.

lawnmower

This seems to be an AWD problem. Anybody experience it with FWD vehicles. I like the Pilot be these complaints scare me.

ksayers

It is a defect that appears to be linked to AWD. Read the forum chain and I believe you will see that the vibration defect is AWD centric.

And... Honda has yet to admit the problem, much less fix it. The only group that sees the problem is the customer base. You may consider what that means.

Oh, by the way, test drive your Honda on a concrete highway and check the road noise. b-a-d

craigers

ksayers,

You are correct about the noise on a concrete highway. I cant even carry on a conversation without shouting. But I can tolerate the noise better than I can the Vibration in the front end. I have tried pretty much everything. It aint the tires and since it seems to be more prevalent in the AWD I can only assume it has something to do with the driveshaft to the rear tires?

Anyway, your advice is good for anyone looking at Pilots, be sure and test drive the car good at Highway speeds for both vibration and noise.

sddoc07

I have an AWD 2003 Honda Pilot LX. I also noticed a significant vibration, strongly transmitted thru the steering wheel, at about 75+ mph. However, I was lucky b/c as soon as I switched to Continental Contitracs, the vibration improved dramatically. Is it completely gone? No. But does it bother me anymore? No. I also want to say that while the vibration was annoying, it was nowhere near dangerous and while I understand people's feelings on this, I think it's been a bit overblown i.e. it is nowhere near bad enough to make you drive poorly.

Regarding the wind noise, I think this is a common feature to many Hondas. The price advantage versus Toyotas has to come from somewhere and I feel that the luxurious-like noise isolation in higher-priced cars is always missing in Hondas. It is unfortunate but quite frankly, not enough to keep most people from buying the great bargain that is the Honda Pilot.

ksayers

Thanks for the reply. When we updated tires to Michelins and chucked the junk factory tires things improved. Not resolved but "better". Anyone buying a Pilot may want to mentally tack on $500 to the purchase price to help... the problem. Honda should be embarrassed about such a blunder.

As an FYI, the noise issue is "road noise" verses "wind noise". It is picked up via the tires through the suspension and body. That is why traveling at 70 on concrete is very, very noisy and on asphalt is tolerable.
I suppose those who really like their radio/CD's must be pondering why they bought this vehicle.

Consumer Reports just came out with their auto issue. Global reviews of Honda noted one consistent negative: road noise.

iodine8

I don't think this problem is just limited to Pilots. I have an '05 Odyssey and I'm experiencing a similar vibration problem everyone else is describing.

I had the original tires balanced several times and the problem was not solved. I just put new tires on the car and the problem still has not gone away.

I've recently been told (not by Honda) that the rims might be the problem. The rims are not the conventional style rim where they can put the weights on the outer part of the rim. They have to use the adhesive backed weights and I'm told these reims are very troublesome to balance.

The researh continues....

vtm4

Ok, my 2003 Pilot suffered from the 70 mph vibration since day one. After 45 miles I decided it was time to replace the OEM tires. They were replaced with the Michelin Cross Terrain as recommended my many on various Pilot forums. First of all let me say all though the Michelins are a bit more noisy they are a far superior tire in terms of performance in snow and wet pavement. Well, to my complete surprise, the vibration has all but disappeared. Yes there remains a very minor vibration at 72 and 76 mph but it's almost indiscernible from the normal road vibration. I suspect there still is a design problem with Honda's with the poor quality tires magnifying the problem. So anyway, after 5 years the vibration is "gone" and I'm feeling better about the Pilot. Good luck with yours.

sagaliba

Check this out:
http://www.hondapilot.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14481&perpage=15&pag- - enumber=1

It is about a pair of braces for rear subframe that are on Accura MDX but not on Pilot. Apparently, they can be retro-fitted.

Several people tried and claimed they did improve ride and the "70 mph vibration" problem.

ksayers

It would be great if it did... but...

Reading through the thread it is unclear as to what the writers believed they "fixed". The 70mph vibration appears, from most earlier posts, to be more a "front end" thing than a "rear end" thing. One poster eliminated the front drive shaft, I believe, and eliminated the problem.

The posters on the noted thread are focused on the read end and seem have found more value in improved handling, body sway and side wind buffeting. However, after 10 pages of resplies, I have yet to see/hear/read from anyone that adding braces actually fixed the vibration defect.

I really wish it did. If it did, I would install the braces, front and rear, immediately.

If anyone has a thread/message that indicates that installing these braces actually FIXES the vibration defect (or lessens it to a significant degree) PLEASE post it as there are many people, including myself, that would take action at that point.

Thanks for the post !!

sagaliba

Yeah, the vibration problem they talked about is not specific to the front. I wonder if the vibrations everybody talks about are the same thing (since they are many different sources for vibrations)?

I myself just bought a '07 EX-L AWD, and I have not noticed the vibration problem yet. I also have not noticed posts regarding vibration problem for '07 Pilot (maybe there are there, I just haven't read it). This of course may be because there are not that many '07 out there. (Assuming they sell the same number of cars each year, only half are sold so far. Besides, it took some times for people to notice the problem and wonder onto the forums, so the percentage would be even smaller).

ksayers

Having gone through the threads on a possible rear brace fix... I ordered the $50 worth of parts, left/right braces, bolts, nuts.

While the improved handling, sway and wind buffeting are interesting, my focus continues to be the vibration defect. If anything else benefits, fine, but that's not my objective.

Parts will be here in 2-3 weeks and then I will install and report on the results.

Enjoy,

ksayers

Ok folks, the results;

a. Ordered the Code 50360 Retrofit Kit from HondaAcuraWorld.com. $50.95 delivered, took about 9 days.

b. The installation took about 22 minutes, total. The process is:
a. Remove the chassis bolt, replace with new bolt and tighten
b. Place brace on chassis bolt, hand tighten nut.
c. Install bolt on the other end of the brace (to frame).
d. Tighten bolt and nut. Verify everything is tight to spec.
e. Repeat on other side.

See the link on this forum to another forum that has pictures. E-a-s-y.

That's it. Really. Even the "hard side" is very easy, no real interference problems unless you have a hot muffler.

Road test:

I will ignore subjective commentary on "handling" as it is... subjective... and not my intent. I wanted the 70mph shudder gone.

I drove on smooth asphalt, no radio, no air conditioning, nothing to mask over the situation. I had to HUNT to find the vibration. HUNT !!! It's 95-97% gone, maybe more. If I didn't know EXACTLY where to look I would not have found it at all. Even at that, it was virtually g-o-n-e. It appears that dumping the cheap factory tires (contributed maybe 15% to the fix) and putting on the braces did it.

WARNING; YMMV Your Mileage May Vary

This fix worked on my vehicle. It MAY work on yours. No guarantee, no warranties, do at your own discretion. If you do it, you do it alone and you are responsible for anything and everything. There... my butt is covered.

Nevertheless, these braces have significantly improved my vehicle. It was absolutely worth the $50.95 spent. The install is EASY !! You need a 3/8" ratchet, about a 9 inch extension, a 17mm deepwell socket (11/16 may work... don't know). And plan for a half hour of time.

A hearty THANK YOU to those on this forum and the linked-to forum with details and photos of the kit.

Perhaps I should send the $50.95 bill to Honda...

Victory at last, regardless of the inattention of Honda.

I wish you all a very pleasant day.

Regards,

ksayers

I should have added another note; you do NOT have to jack up the vehicle. You do one side at a time. Access is almost trivial. On my 2006 I found the mounting points within 2 seconds. Literally. Just lay down on the ground and look up behind the rear tire and the differential.

This is one of those times when, it appears, the fix was simple (once found), the parts ordering was simple, the parts actually fit, the install was simple AND it worked. For me. As noted, YMMV.

sagaliba

Thank you for the update. As I said, I myself do not have the vibration problem, but I am interested in the brace for a different reason. Whenever I stopped on the left turn lane waiting for the left turn signal, every car that zipped past me on the right would cause my Pilot body to rock sideway. Granted, this probably happen to every car, especially higher profile SUV, but I had a minivan and a full-sized conversion before this Pilot, and neither would rock as much as the Pilot. (Please see my posting in that forum.) Do you think if this brace might help?

ksayers

I don't really know. Some other posters on this forum and the linked-to forum (hondapilot.org) have noted improved handling, less body lean and a "tighter" feel for their Pilot 4WD after the brackets were installed. Frankly, I haven't pursued that to any real degree as my focus was on the vibration. However, logically... (scary assumption), if the brackets reduce body lean and tighten up the structure as a whole one could surmise (scary assumption #2)
that it might help.

Go to hondapilot.org and review their forums closely with an eye to body integrity. Might be a fix... this is a link to the page/thread...

http://www.hondapilot.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14481

maxshop

Is this vibration issue in 4WD vehicles only, or are 2WD vehicles also affected? Thanks

ksayers

It appears, from my limited perspective, my opinion only, to be related to 4WD only based on the replies posted on this board and others. YMMV

zarba

We have an '07 EX-L AWD, and have not experienced the problem in the first 750 miles. My wife drives on the highway every day at 70 mph.

We'll be going on a long trip in late June, and that will be the measure.

mercara

I just returned to New Jersey from a 2000 mile round trip to Tennessee, Georgia, etc. Drove over 85 mph on Tennessee highways with 70 MPH speed limit and felt no vibrations. Mine is a 4WD Pilot with RES.