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War of the Compacts:Frontier, Ranger, Tacoma, S10, Dakota, B-Series, & Hombre - II
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I currently own a 98 Dodge Ram and am looking to get something new. I'm at a crossroads between a the pickups in this topic and a small SUV. Just got back a few days ago from doing a little looking and I haven't yet made up my mind.
As I said, I own a Dodge currently and am going to look into the Dakotas in a few days. I'm pretty happy with what my 98 has given me so far, but I split time between working full time and a student, and do a lot of traveling. So gas mileage is a factor. Here's my thoughts on two of the options so far. (Have been looking at quad cab/crew cabs by the way) Only two listed right now because I spent a lot of that first day looking into small SUVs.
Tacoma: Did not get to drive (late in the day, unfortunately). But liked a lot of what I saw and have heard good things about performance. Until I got into one. My father recently bought himself a new GMC full-size and while shopping around checked out the Tundra. He loved it, except for one thing - it felt really small. Not much room. I felt the same way about the Tacoma. Just felt extremely cramped. Anyone give me a little info about the gas mileage as well? (Don't recall what it was.)
Frontier: For the record, I really like the design - a big reason I went to take a look in the first place. Decent drive - I tested the V6, but not the 'supercharged' model. Pretty good handling. Not as cramped as the Tacoma, although the crew cab was just barely large enough to constitute being called one. A little tight there. Big negative was the mileage, where I expected a little better. In any case, a lot of positives for me but the negatives are tough to overlook.
Spent the rest of the day in Rav4s, CR-Vs, Xterras and Escapes. Not really the kind of thing I was looking for (I thought) but mileage and styling were appealing.
As you can see, its really up in the air right now. So how about a little help? Any way you good people can help me narrow my decision?
Gooba the contractors are responsible for paying our benefits to our hall once a month if they do not pay are union hall would cover if needed.
small SUV's in Truck Trend mag. My wife leased a '99 TRACKER, 4x4, 4 door with the new 2.0L engine and auto tranny, it came with skid plates, gets 24 mpg, does 105 mph...kind of cute looking, I hate driving it myself, but she loves it. Suzuki Gran VIAGARA, opps, sorry GRAN VITARA with V6 is also worth checking, all made in Canada. The Tracker is great on hills, good passing power...check out
the SUV posts....If you must have a pick-up, any of the tiny, mini trucks with 4 bangers will do,
S10 XTREME with four popper and manual tranny
gets 28+ mph at steady cruise and looks sleek...
very gutless but then you want decent mpg...
good luck in your search
"Please don't start comparing the Tacoma to the
Ford or Chevy. Take a look at these vehicles 3 or
4 years down the road, and you will truly see which one is superior. That Taco will still be flawless and rattle free."
Thats why I asked when you were going to buy a tacoma.
Tacos are great....from Taco Bell! LOL
First it was the drywall union crew, then it was the framing union crew, then it was the insulation crew... yes, the framing crew refused to touch the insulation - it wasn't their job. All it would have taken was a little tug on the fiberglass batting to push it aside enough to work on the framing work. But NOOO!!!! Union rules absolutely forbade that. So they had to pay for the hourly and trip charge for an insulation guy to come in and push on the batting. And all this was before the union electrician was even brought in.
It gets worse when the trivial eletrical work was
done: insulation crew, framing crew, drywall crew, texture crew, paint crew and clean up crew. I'm sure I'd missed a few more union crews in there somewhere since I wasn't staring at them work 100% of the time.
The whole mess took over 2 weeks to do and, I'm sure costed the company a boat load of money.
Ask why the North American International Auto Show hates New York City, and they will tell you unequivocally: "UNION LABOR".
Give my money to the Unions? Right. I'd rather donate it to the Florida Election Recount Fund. It'd be just as futile, but at least it's tax-deductible. ;-)
I'll try it ONE MORE TIME. What is more beneficial to the AMERICAN WORKER: That G.M. is making tons of money building vehicles in Mexico? Sure helps put food on my table. Or that Toyota/BMW/Kawasaki/Honda etc. employs AMERICAN WORKERS and contributes to a community economy with property taxes?
Madhat, please, look up what a HP/Torque curve is.... Yes, your truck CAN haul, tow, pull stuff.. But the Ranger will do it better...
San Jose), awesome offroading, great hill climb,
also Del Velle near Livermore. I had a mudduck
'87 S10 ext. cab 4x4 2.8L with 205-75R15 tires and
could cross deep streams, tackle sand, mud and
make it up the steep hill climb where many V8
Scouts, CJ's would squirm their tires, forget the
big boys (Broncos, CK5's) they were limited to the
Bunny hills....
thanks, Bush and Gore)Reason?... Where does the money that the foreign companies pay the american employees go? Goes to taxes for schools, income tax, american cars, clothes, food, houses, interest at banks, savings accounts, the stock market etc. Also we are at the smallest trade deficit in recent memory and are close to having a balanced budget, also there are American car delaerships in Japan, they are going belly up, the US automakers do not want dealerships there because they cannot compete. all of these facts would have to be factored in in any logical argument against buying foreign products especially one that claims they are draining the economy and we should all run for the hills. Well, I am off to spend some of my American money I got from Nissan in Italy, I know it will probably tank the stock market, but hey it is a nice place, ciao! And you boys play nice.
2. We have only ourselves to blame for the amount of products that we depend on other countries for. There should be no reason that we buy products from China, a country that uses slave labor and pollutes the world. They make the products cheap and we buy for that reason. I used to buy Zenith electronics. They could no longer afford to make them here in the U.S. and now they are a brand of Gold Star and cheap.
3. Did anyone actually vote for Al Bore or are they all in nursing homes and mental institutions?
wake up people!!! we're in a global economy! 50 years ago I would have agreed with people who said "buy american." now it doesn't matter. Just read an article in Newsweek talking about Chevy Silverados make in Mexico. It costs GM far less to have them made there, and the quality of work is better than in the US factories. hmmmmm. can someone explain to me why we have unions again???
Much obliged in advance.
Oh and I might be doing some snow driving. Is a 4x4 worth the money or would snow tires do a better job?
Croy2 here is a good question do you think its fair that an employee at the Indiana Tundra plant makes 1/3 less than the average UAW worker.
I worked nonunion for awhile and put up with a lot of crap,organized labor is the only way for me, also you can blame NAFTA for the migration to Mexico and Canada but at least those Countries trade fairly with the US.I think either Reagan or Bush created Nafta.I absolutely would never buy a Tundra I even think the front of them looks Asian.I would consider a Tacoma but I think Ford and Chevy have come a long way since the 80's and there trucks are almost as good and better in ways than the Tacoma,plus the Taco is overpriced have any of you taco owners compared the price of a Tundra to a taco they are almost the same thats why they can't give away the tundras.
Allknowing, once again you show your true colors. We have deserts in Eastern Oregon bud..And we do have something here in the NW California doesn't, clean air!! and there is more, clean water, two mountain ranges, rivers galore... room to roam... shall I go on??.... The most livable city in the USA, Portland, Oregon! (per Money mag).
Madhat, just showing you your Tacoma isn't all that you think it is, had to pop the old "Toyota is god" bubble...:-) I would say a rear diff, and hp/torque curves are pretty important for those of us who use our 4x4's as real 4x4's that is. Do you know where the Tacoma sits as far as crash test ratings???....
Notice the side impact rating on the tacoma.
As far as the crash tests Madhat- The Tacoma has an acceptable rating. It scores low only in side impact tests which statistically make up a very small percentage of real accidents. You will find, if you check available data, that the Tacoma does not have more injurys or deaths per units sold than the Ranger. In fact, the Ranger may have a higher per unit death rate (See crashtest.com). The Ranger is scored the worst possible for death rates on several model years while the Tacoma isn't for some reason which is not explained. Another safety fact to consider, if cp's past four wheel mag. link is correct, is that the Tacoma's stopping distance from 55-0 was 30 feet less than the Ranger in their tests. That could easily be the difference between being part of, or avoiding, an accident. The Ranger is a good truck but it isn't a superior truck to it's competition. Unless, of course, you're really worried about a side impact crash which is the Tacoma's weak point.
jschoon: Check out the Dakota, if you would rather a new vehicle. If not, the Ranger would be a good choice. There are a lot of questions which could better help in our assisting you. How much and what type of snow conditions are you looking at? Do you plan on getting off the main roads? Is this a fun vehicle or is there a reason for going to a pickup? How often do you expect to haul more than two people? Towing? As an example, if you are in a flat land state, the slightly underpowered models may do just fine. Driving in the Rockies requires planty of reserve power. If most of your driving is in the cities, forget 4x4. And remember that there is a world of difference in driving a pickup and a BMW.
I did look at the 4-door pickups but I dont really
like them so Ive ruled them out..
The new Ranger for 2001 is awesome. It now come with a 204HP/240ft/lbs of torque SOHC 4.0. Ford has also listened to its consumers and is going to offer an offroad version with special rearend, shocks, tires ect... Dakota is a nice truck no doubt. The 4.7 V8 is a very nice addition. You really have to ask yourself though, what are you going to use the truck for? Do you need 4WD? Are you going to tow large loads?
Allknowing, The Ranger has the better HP/Torque curve. Do your homework on what this means as far as towing, pulling or hauling. I can write a whole page explaining this to you...
in the summer and definitely want 4 wheel drive for my hunting trips. Other than that, my truck would not see any heavy duty work.
The Ranger's "standard towing" rating of around 2000lbs (give or take depending on trim, engine, tranny, etc...) is when the truck is equipped only with a ball hitch on the bumper.
The Ranger's "maximum towing" rating of around 5800lbs (give or take depending on trim, engine, tranny, etc...) is when the truck is properly equipped with a Class III hitch.
I am assuming the Toyota's rating of a max around 5000lbs is when the truck is properly equipped with a Class III hitch. Toyota doesn't give a rating for a ball hitch on the bumper (if it's even possible, I can't remember).
To all of the payload junkies, the Tacoma's maximum payload rating is around 2000lbs and the Ranger's maximum payload rating is around 1800lbs.
I'd personally never load either truck down like that, except for extremely short jaunts.
BTW, I actually went with a Class II Reese hitch for my truck. It's rated at 3500lbs, which is pleanty for my needs. I just don't like towing more weight than my actual truck. If I needed to do so, I'd just switch to a full-sized truck.
Actually, if you look at the warranty it says it will cover defects in material and workmanship, you getting mud in the alternator does not fall in that category, if you broke the axle going over a boulder would you say that they should have made the axle stronger and expect them to fix it? if they fix it for you for free, feel lucky and install some kind of guard on it. Same thing happened to a frontier 4x4 I know of, but the kid did a very poor 3" body lift, and left all of the hoses and evrything else stock, now there was more room for mud to get in there, then he went in mud that was up to the bottom of the truck, there was mud in the intake, alternator, everywhere, Nissan would not fix it because of the mods and the fact that there was mud everywhere. Good luck I hope it works out for you.
Personally, I think that if a person wants to go off-roading, they should get a beater and use the savings on repairs. Of course, I also don't have a high regard for what Toyota thinks a truck should be. Almost as bad as what GM laughingly refers to as a pickup.