Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
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I found this "forum" by chance. I'm leaving by choice. You two have met your goal of trashing this site.
Guess it's like the old adage about arguing with a pig. Nobody wins but you end up just as dirty as the pig.
Don't fall for this "expert's" whining about platform. He has no idea about what he's talking about.
Such thin skin for avant-garde style leaders!
Stick in the 3800, perhaps a supercharged option for a performance version. It is a Pontiac, and would be one thing mainstream SUVs have yet to do-yet.
Get rid of the silly ads.
Fit some third seats in there, even if you have to work on the rear glass overall length.
"I be the dog"""
Oh and I am not a expert..!! However, Edmunds states the Aztek is the same platform at the Montana...dog..!
You are wrong"
Just what the he_l are you trying to say..!!!
Hey I do NOT drive a BMW X/5.. I drive the BMW 328, wich Edmunds states "one of the best vehicles you can buy at any cost"
Oh and I drive a REAL SUV. LX470 not a bloated Minivan .>> Aztek
Question, is it still important to use protectant on the cars interior? I've been told the dash is designed not to fade or crack even in the heat of New Mexico. I have trouble believing everything I read, like this forum, so I'm skeptical. What do you think?
Topgn, can you name a more consistant, or better return on investment than the stock market over the last 50 years? And please don't tell that story about your foreign car purchase.
I think the recent statement by one owner is he will give it to his kid for college. Then that child will then give it to their kids...
Or all Aztec owners will keep their minivan's for 10 years...
In Canada you have over $110K of vehicle in your drive way.
Congratulations.......you are wealthy and the number of people that can afford $110K of depreciating rolling stock in their driveway........is probably less then 1% of the population.
Frankly.......If i could afford it I may have an ACURA MDX.
But dollar for value......my search showed nothing better then the AZTEK.
Now as for resale.......People in your income category........who can afford or must drive the latest in snob appeal......RE-sale is important. By the way..........With a $110K investment in CARS you can afford to say money is no object.
I think you are hopelessly out of touch with what real people can afford. You remind me of George Bush Senior.....lost at supermarket checkout. You are truly a comedian.
For myself.......I buy a vehicle and drive it for as long as possible. My previous vehicles:
1985 Toyota Corolla GTS........sold last year 300,000 kilometres
1987 Astro..........Died last week
My AZTEK will give me at least 300,000 kms or 180,000 miles. This is the most econmic method of owning.
And yes........I hope you do not OWN a 1999 ......BMW:
1. Recall on Breaks, Hydraulic systems and linkages
2. 3 recalls on interior systems.....SIDE DOOR(pops open), SEAT BELTS and AIRBAG
check it out on NHTSA site
2000 model has recall too
NOT ONE RECALL.......on the AZTEK???.........great well made vehicle!
Plain and simple another second hand story with no real prove.
Similar to your comments about safety??
You sound like the Minister of Truth from 1984.......Master of DOUBLESPEAK!!
Actually, buying a car new and driving it into the ground is a foolish way to spend your automotive dollars.
You would have been much better off buying a 6 month old Aztek or better yet, a used Honda van, use it for a couple years, sell it while it is still nice and then buying another near-new car.
Your technique guarantees a 100% loss on your investment, lots of repair costs later in the car's life and later, the risk of driving somrthing that may drop dead at any second leaving you to have to run out and overpay because you need something NOW.
Maybe he has money BECAUSE he considers depreciation when making decisions.
But, if someone loves it, who cares???
I think Edmunds ought to create a topic, "Why I hate the Aztek" topic and then delete ALL Aztek bashing posts.
People who delight in arguing with Aztek lovers need to get a life. Let them enjoy their "novel" looking vehicle and go do something worthwhile.
BOTTOM LINE;
RE. THE AZTEK - WHO CARES??!!
If you don't care- don't read, don't post.
Create a page for why I hate the AZTEK.......
Then create AZTEK OWNERS DISCUSSION PAGE
That way people like Topgun, Gonzo and friends could play in their playpen and we can discuss the vehicle that is THE BEST BUILT NEW SUV.....in the industry.
The Aztek "Best SUV" come on...!!
First it's a MINIVAN. built with a minivan platform...
OK here we go: examples of true S.U.V.'s
1, Toyota Lancruiser
2. 4 Runner
3. Range Rover
4. Chevy Tahoe
5. Ford Expedition
6. Nissan Xterra
7. Jeep Grand Cherokee
NO WAY DOES A AZTEK BELONG IN THIS CATAGORY.
Again for the simple minded, if all you can afford is a Aztek, it would be a better use of $$$ buying a used 4 Runner, Nissan Pathfinder,
or a X Terra..
LOL
Listen the AZTEK is a well built solid vehicle whose quality is undeniable........That is all.
With $110 K of rolling stock in your drive. Why are you obsessed with slaming a solid vehicle that by all accounts is serving it's owners in a fine fashion.
"Okay, fellas here's the plan. We build a vehicle that is universally scorned. And not just made fun of by everyone interested in cars but people who never give cars a second glance will make fun of this one. It will be ridiculed by Letterman and Leno. Then, we'll sell less than half of our goal. Also huge, even massive rebates and discounts will be in order. That is the plan and we shall achieve our goal. Then 5 monthe into production we'll announce a panicked redesign. We will consider it a success"
Sound like I'm GM's kind of material?
Interesting the problems both BMW and Mercedes have had with their SUVs. I would be really pissed if I spent 50-90K Canadian $ and got poor workmanship. Lexus on the other hand, stil lleads a charmed existence. When I win the lotto (this will take time since I don't buy tickets), I will gladly park the GS400 in the garage.
It would be nice if all cars were as elegant as those that these posters supposedly own, but the vast majority of the population either cannot afford 50K for a vehicle, or they choose to put the money elsewhere, like kid's college fund, retirement fund, house, portfolio, etc.
I have worked in the automobile business for 21+ years, seen a lot of cr*p come and go, and probably will see more cr*p before I get my butt out of the business, but I will say that the only thing that motivates a car person more than their form of transportation, is their choice of bed partners! It is a most entertaining forum, makes me laugh every time I check it out! Keep up the amusement fellas, it breaks up the corporate monotony!
As far as investments go, and resale value, who gives a rat's ---? Cars are just machines, not an example of your sexual prowess, if I wanted to invest, I sure wouldn't do it in the automobile market! Remember the Ferrari market after Enzo died?
Regards,
MAK
You are right about 1 thing. When buying a vehicle you should buy second hand and let the other guy take the depreciation.
But buying and holding a vehicle for it's entire life span is without question the CHEAPEST way to own a vehicle. My Toyota was virtually trouble free.......I got full value out with minimal repair bills........
My Astro......which i use for hauling was an outstanding work horse that again cost me little and delivered 200,000 miles.
Every book.......every expert ......tell you to buy dependable vehicles and hold on.
I agree that wealthy......People who can afford over $110 K of rolling stock can buy luxury vehicles.......keep them 2 years then flip at little cost. Great formula......If you are the fewer then 5% that can afford it.
Tired of reading posts like #1369.......that are off topic and frankly ignorant.
These posts......are not relevant and frankly discourage a debate about the AZTEK and it's comparison to other vehicles.
You start by saying I proved how little I know then proceed to agree that buying a near new car that someone else has taken the depreciation, paid the sales and luxury taxes and even the license is smart.
You also mention that buying a near new car and selling in a year or two is a "great Formula" and that you can keep "cars at little cost."
Plus there's no way you can tell me that you feel good about sending your FAMILY off in a van with
200k miles on it.
Aztek Fans: Don't make the mistake of buying a new one. It is like throwing money away. Look for a used one- they're out there in the 15-16k range and that will really drop when GM's rebate hemmorage starts and all of the rental ones soon hit the market.
It is funny how close minded the avant-garde owners of this thing are. I've posted that I would guess that the crash testing should be better than the fraternal twin-Montana van and I also compared it's concept to a Lexus RX 300.
Then create AZTEK OWNERS DISCUSSION PAGE"
In the mean time, I have set up a AZTEC OWNERS Club at Yahoo!
<http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/pontiacaztecowners>
From Pontiac or GM for purchasing an Aztec??
Yeah, I always hear those Lexus owners complaining about the "sewing machine" like reliability, refinement and customer service.
They sit in the service area waiting for their oil changes, drinking Espresso eating Biscotti lamenting that they wish they owned a V-8-6-4, cadillac, a diesel oldsmobile, a fiero, a vega, a chevette, a 4100 V-8 Cad, a Cimarron, a rod-knocking 4.8 Silverado or an orphaned Olds soon to be worth 50% of it's intrinsic value.
If you expect us to believe GM is happy with Aztek's performance, you need some fresh air.
They sit in the service area waiting for their oil changes, drinking Espresso eating Biscotti lamenting..."
Actually, they are never waitng for their cars because they have either been given a loaner car of equal or greater value, the dealer has picked up the car for service, or they have been chauffered to whatever destination they want while their vehicle is being serviced.
As long as guys like RW and HP, and Jack Smith get paid the bonuses that they get paid for their financial footwork, there will be no good GM cars, only mediocrity! I'm not what is wrong with GM, our leadership is! Where is the guy or girl who understands what you and I do, that to evoke a strong emotion to a vehicle, you can't compromise! That is why I say that the Aztec is at least a step in the right direction. So what if you don't like the way it looks, you don't have to look at it or buy it, and if nobody else does, then why are you so in your face about it? It will go away in time, just like the rest of our screw-ups.
Oh, and by the way, how many Lexus owners even know where their oil filler is? Oh, that's right, they are drinking latte, how bourgeois!!!
I agee with you when you make sense. Your point about purchasing second hand is valid.
Why I didn't. I did not feel comfortable forking over more then $20 K Canadian for a vehicle where I do not truly know it's history.
So I purchase new and will carefully maintain an own the vehicle for many years.
As for sending out my family in vehicle over 200k. I'm sorry......but I carefully maintain my vehicles and have no fear.
By the way.......do actually drive a Borg......or did you pick the most obscure vehicle possible. Guess if we really knew what you drive you could not stay above the fray.
Find another board.....because you add little of value. Sorry to tell you but :
"thems the fax!!!"
Excuse me, how many folks know where the -15volt regulator is inside their TV's power suppy??? (I do since I'm a BSEE).
Cars and TVs are both consumer products, there is no prequiste for a consumer to have to know the inards of either product. All they have to do is follow the service schedule outlined in their ownwer's manual and let the pros do the rest.
BTW, even though I could fix my own TV if I wanted to, I almost never because my time (family and work) is more valuable than what I have to pay for someone else to do it. When I was single/younger I would work on my car and TV all the time.
"The fish always rots from the Head"
Of course it's the leaders fault.
I agree GM is to be commended for quickly bringing a bold vehicle to market. Unfortunately, It's the Aztek. I fear they will shrink from this experience and say "Bold doesn't sell.--Pump out 10,000 more Cavaliers for Avis."
Tell me that bold doesn't sell after looking at the Beetle and PT Cruiser and even Xterra sales figures.
It's like GM was reaching out for something but put their fingers in a mouse trap.
Remember when Japanese cars first
really started selling?
The big three first blamed the "superior" Japanese workers. Then they said that the imports had unfair trade advantages.
Well guess what happened? They started building
Accords and Camrys here. They are still superior.
Lesson: Bad leadership is the one constant variable. Anyone who cares about this country should be offended that such inept "leadership" is running our manufacturing base into the ground.
Regards,
MAK
For people considering the AZTEK it performs very well in the snow.
I drive the AWD not the 4WD. Very secure!
Thoght you may want to know!
Then there is "tonychrys" who is a "BSEE". What in the world is a BSEE? Is that like a disease? I have a Masters degree in Information Sciences. That makes me a human male, not an "MIS". I have an "MIS", I am not an MIS!
And finally, those that claim to drive Beemers and Lexus do not hang out at the Pontiac Aztec forum. That's not the way humans work. It just does not happen.....
But you're such a bright guy you already knew that, right?
P.S. I hang out here purely for the entertainment value... beats much of the crap that is written for TV anyway.
You can't help to stare at the spectacle, but you're left feeling grateful you're not involved yourself.
They stare in amazement and gaulk......but if asked to help they are as usefull as those things on a bull.
Why do they come.......They come here to irritate real owners, to spread their venom and hate towards GM, to spread lies and false stories ranging from auctions and rental car experiences. They LIE AND DISTORT........serious issues like SAFETY........And generally want to discourage any potential buyer........and ridicule any owner. They own exotic cars like BORGLANDS/LEXUS/BMW .......and laugh at those not able to afford those high end vehicles.
I secretly believe .......they are like the 330 lb girl on the internet that says they are 5' 8" blonde blue eyed and voluptous. Really the drive old K CARS.......and would love to own a new AZTEK.
Do they bother me........no. However , an individual wanting to know the real experience of AZTEK owners has to weed through the garbage these RUBBER NECKERS post.
It is not fair to owners......and prespective buyers......and sadly the HOSTS allow it to happen here but not on other boards (like BMW x5......which is rapidly proving to be a $70,000 Problem).
I blame EDMUNDS for allowing this distortion. Create a "I HATE THE AZTEK" board and let the RUBBER NECKERS play in their own sand box.
Regards
A proud and satified owner!!!
Your first hand knowledge regarding the "quality" of the AZTEK production process very interesting.
Your info regarding the Rendezvous and Saab being produced in Mexico is also interesting. I would be more interested in your type of posts.
And more of your thoughts on the AZTEK you drive. So keep posting because your input is highly valued to AZTEK owners and potential owners. You offer insights few others do.
Regards
We went on a picnic yesterday. Sort of preliminary outing before we take the Aztek camping on Memorial Day weekend. All I can say, is that I can not wait to take this rig camping. Talk about fun. I removed the tray from the back, put the cargo net in, and loaded my electric cooler in the back full of food. Then I put my kids scooters back there, a folding picnic table, a baby stroller a backpack full of baby supplies, a picnic basket, a bar-b-que and a couple of small propane tanks for the bar-b-que and there was still enough room enough in the back for my son. We went to Fort Casey for the day and ran around all the gun emplacements, we had a blast. At about 4:30 we drove the campsite, unloaded the car and proceeded to have a tailgate party/picnic. Memories like this are priceless.
The number of people that approach me is astounding.......and most luv it. Adjust the price point.....sales will improve.
regards
Someone like me.....who has done the mini van thing but could not drive one for another 10 years. Despite the links to the mini van heritage the AZTEK does not feel like a mini van. It delivers much more fun and better handling.
Fun Fun Fun.......Those early 40's single child family.....ideal for the aztek.
The Aztek is pratical, reliable, safe, very nicely equiped, has tons of room, AWD and gets 22 miles to the gallon. What more could you ask for. Moreover, my insurance classifies it as a station wagon, meaning cheaper premiums.