TOYOTA TACOMA vs FORD RANGER- Part XI

cpousnr

Well got me there...if you read 4 wheeler mags, most people who are heavy into the sport will buy the platform they want and build from there.

Just happens that Rangers have Dana front diffs, a darn good 8.8inch rear diff with easy conversion to the Ford 9" rear differential, great articulation, are resonably inexpensive to buy. They make great "built" off-road machines and can take a heck of a deal of punishment. They are good off-road stock also. Many people get an older one for 5K or so, add 3-4 K and can compete with the best as the add ons are usually a locker, 4:56 gears or above, lifts to 8-12 inches and 32"+ tires. And they go anywhere without the need of a Supercharger. . .heck I have seen a guy with and old late 80's, small 2.9 v6 with 200,000 miles do things I have not seen many vehicles do.

Problem with the 98+ Ranger and maybe the Tacoma, due to IFS, is the lifts are very expensive, $1,200 parts alone, and they raise the body but not much in the clearance area.

smc13

I was looking at NHTSA's website and I noticed that not only do they list TSBs and recalls, they also have a listing of complaints. I looked up the 2001 Tacoma and the 2001 Ranger and found that there are 6 complaints listed for the Tacoma and 25 for the Ranger. To me this is another example of the taco's superior reliability. One the summeries for the ranger says that an owner complained that he didn't have a 2nd gear and the dealer told him that was how the vehicle was designed. :-)

I just thought of another reason I like my tacoma better then the ranger. It has a better nickname. I can tell people I drive a Toy Taco. What do ranger owners tell people they drive. :-)

eharri3

Allknowing... I'll be sure to tell my friend who had his head gaskets go plus has poured thousands of dollars into suspension problems on his Tacoma that he must be hallucinating, and that he really is NOT several thousand dollars poorer after fixing his truck.

I also love Tacoma owners' logic... Tacoma better than a Hummer, Rav4 better off road than a Ford Ranger. Where can I get some of what you guys are smoking.

smc13

Just in case you didn't figure it out we've been joking about the RAV4. We were just joking, really. Just a joke. Seriously, it was just for laughs. Ha Ha? At least snicker a little?

indacurl2k

I think AK was joking there eharri3.

Where is vince8 these days anyway? I think my last post was in response to the Ranger (ST) was compared to the Tacoma going 0-60 while towing 5000 lbs. I was obviously mistaken about the Ranger needing the bigger engine to keep up with the Tacoma and wanted to go on record saying 'I was wrong'. I guess Toyota owners aren't perfect, even if their trucks are (joking of course).

Hey vince8, did you end up having to sell the Ranger? Maybe you'll get lucky and the wife will opt for a 4-Runner or Rav-4! If you sell the Ranger, will you stop posting here? I'm just kidding vince.

Seriously though, it would s*ck if you had to sell it. Sounds like you've got a good one. I thought about selling my Tacoma. I had a guy offer me $15K the other day at the mere mention of selling. If I sold now at that price, I could pay off the loan (under $10K remaining), get my down payment back ($5000) and still have a few dollars leftover. Not too shabby after having used it for 3 years. So I washed it and waxed it once again in case I decide to sell. It looked so good when I got done though, I decided to keep it. If I did sell it though, I'd seriously consider a new Ranger.

smc13

I forgot to provide a link to the complaints database that I mentioned above. Here it is:

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/complain/compmmy1.cfm

For 2000, Rangers had 237 complaints, the taco 40. So how is the ranger almost as reliable as the taco?

Btw, how many of you ranger owners still have Firestone tires? There is a lot of complaints dealing with tread seperation and blow outs.

allknowing

Some of you Ranger guys are a little too defensive. If you start actually believing that I would recommend a RAV4 over a 4x4 Ranger you're definitely wound too tight. I like the Ranger and it would be my second choice below the Tacoma. Both trucks have their strong points but I prefer the TRD Tacoma. It is true, however, that I've never personally witnessed a Tacoma with a problem but I know that they're not perfect. I believe that the wind exists even though I haven't seen it so I'm sure Tacomas have problems too.

spoog

http://www.jdpa.com/studies/pressrelease.asp?StudyID=292&CatID=1

This is the 5 year long term reliability test by JD Powers. This sort of comprehensive, LONG-TERM test is the best way to determine a vehicles reliability and quality.

Why does Ford finish below the industry average?

bess

Ford is better than the industry average according the link you provided..
The lower the number, the better.. These number are for all vehicles of a manufacturer and not just trucks.. Toyota = 291
Ford = 365
Industry average = 375

Note that both Ford and Toyota are below the industry average (which is a good thing).

I would think that on the average trucks have a higher problem rate than cars. Given the fact Ford sells a significantly higher number of trucks vs cars, this might explain some of the difference.. Of the manufactures that sell more trucks than cars, Ford ranked the best..

scape2

to only believe what they want? Look right here in your own backyard at Edmunds at the reliability ratings of a 98 Ranger vs a 98 Tacoma or go back even farther if you want! Also check MSN.. The reliability is closer than you think and the Toyota crowd hates to read it! Too bad you paid thousands of dollars more... I will state this again.. Yes, the Toyota does have a reliability advantage.. A SMALL ADVANTAGE that is! NOT the huge gap Toyota owners want potential buyers to think.

scape2

In this months Motor Trend their is a square off between the Toyota Tacoma TRD SC and a Nissan Frontier SC. I'm not trying to push Nissan by any means.. But over and over they mention how costly the Supercharger is along with how expensive the Tacoma is for options when comparing the two. See, its no secret Toyota is expensive and has lost their value edge...

allknowing

Shhhhh vince. You're right!! We just hate it when obsessed Ranger lovers, like yourself, admit that the Tacoma is a more reliable truck. Don't spread that around or everyone will want one and we'll have more trouble getting the good deal most of us got. I agree that the Ranger is getting closer but I'd still opt for the Tacoma any day and feel that the small difference in price, much less than you attempt to portray, is well worth it. If you really like the Ranger better, which many do, why do you fell the need to justify your decision by repeating the same mantra over and over? I think that you would have been happier, at least with yourself, if you had purchased a Tacoma. It seems to have become an obsession and perhaps destroying your life that you made the Ranger choice. Don't feel bad Vince. The Ranger's a good truck and it's nothing to be ashamed of that you own one. With a little work it will do almost anything a Tacoma will do.

eagle63

there's nothing funnier than watching spoog post something only to have it backfire on him!!

midnight_stang

Spoog->You are a complete idiot. Same posts all the time, same nonsense. "Why does Ford finish below the industry average?" Wrong. You can't read a graph right. 2 year old report, and on 5 year old trucks.

For a contrary report, please visit

http://carpoint.msn.com/vip/overview/Toyota/Pickup/used.asp

and

http://carpoint.msn.com/vip/overview/Ford/Ranger/used.asp

1994 tied with 4 out of 5. 1993 and before, Ranger keeps it's 4 out of 5, and the Pickup gets 3 out of 5. This is where the Pickup goes from slight to moderate on several areas.

Long term reliability?? This report is based on common problems and cost to fix(the more the worse the score)

smc--->I love that complaint database. There are legitimate complaints in there I'm sure, but plenty of them are full of it. Engine shut off, while reporting innacurate guage. With the fuel pickup near the rear of the truck, sounds like out of gas to me. "Fire in engine bay while at dealership" could be anything like dumping oil on a hot manifold. Tsk Tsk Ford, no cold fusion engine yet? "Fuel tank over flows when filled" That's why you're not supposed to top it off! Looks like this is driven off a "hotline" 800 number... I can imagine the rigorous scientific and proven criteria required for each "Report".

allknowing--->Thought this was a fairly serious debate. People are obviously one way or the other, and hardly sitting on the fence. While I can appreciate you trying to bring humor into the place, here's where I (and maybe others) are coming from. I used to work on cars and trucks for a living before getting my air conditioned cubicle I type to you from now. Most people I've encountered say they hate Ford because of the quality of their cars or trucks. Further conversation reveals they hated their tempo, or their hand me down family Taurus. Another former f-150 owner never changed his oil, and complained about performance and MPG. Ford Cars and trucks outsell, which puts more of them on the market. Couple that with general consumer and public stupidity, and you got a bunch of people doing insane things to their vehicles(or nothing at all in the ways of maintenance). Pop the hood on any Ford owner and hater. Check three things, air filter, a spark plug, and oil. I bet you one or more are neglected. Now broaden the picture to stuff like greasing the bearings, lubing the chassis, rotating/balancing tires, transmission filters, rear differential oil level, power steering and brake fluid level. Don't forget the ancient battery that makes your alternators work 110%, and then give the ghost. Or the engines getting redlined before any oil has made it into the heads yet. Or the transmission getter power shifted. 98% water in the radiator. Or running watered down 84/85 octane gas. And the list could go on.

In general, who is more likely to do any of the above to their vehicle? Those who are a little more financially stable that can afford to spend more for the import, and more for it's maintenance, or Joe Cheap who could barely afford a vehicle in the first place?

Voices and complaints come free, and a reliable truck does not.

If I added all the expenses and repairs I've done to my truck, (including a new auto transmission with life time repair), and 137k miles later I still have paid less than purchasing a Tacoma alone(not counting taking it to the shop).

To wrap up, yes there are some problems with Ford vehicles, or should I say mass production. Especially with the high volume, a higher percentage of error is probable(ie more claims, defects, whatever). However the percentage is very slightly higher in Ford, as you have to take in it's 2 or 3 or 4 times the sale volume. But in frey's case, he has a vibration he really can't stand. I don't blame him, but I do wonder about the test drive he took before purchasing. I do wonder what his dealership's service managers are smoking. And let me re-iterate my previous thoughts on quality, etc with steelman. I do think Toyota has a better reputation of quality, especially in the drivetrain department. However I do believe Ford is really starting give you a run for the money(does that count as a pun?), with 100,000 mile first scheduled tune-ups, 4v 4 bangers become more and more the standard, safety features offered as standard, just to name a few.
Ford engineers listen to Ranger owners, and the 2001 redesign (EDGE) really shows. Just think of what will happen in 2003/2004 while this keeps up!

frey44

i crawled under some new 2001 Rangers last week. i noticed that 2X4 extended cabs have a new ALUMINUM shaft (very large diameter), however, 4x4's (at lest the ones on the lot) still have the solid rust variants. anybody know if Ford is acknowledging wholesale some kind of shaft problem on all ext. cab Rangers ?? has anybody here had their driveshaft replaced ?? i am still trying one last time to fix a shake before i trade in my 2000 model. Ford won't tell me anythin usefull, so i am digging.

smc13

I agree that there were many bogus complaints in that database for both Ranger and Taco. I was laughing at the ones where the person got cut off, hit the break, and had the truck accelerate (hmm... are you sure you didn't hit the gas? - really?). To me there were a few ways to interpret the data given that there are significantly more complaints for Rangers, either the Ranger is a worse truck, Ranger owners are worse than Taco owners, or Taco owners are to stupid to complain about problems. I am betting the first one. Vince seems to think the third one is true.

allknowing

I don't think that you'll find many Tacoma owners that don't acknowledge that the Ranger has above average quality and ability. I wouldn't say that about the 94-97 Ford Mustang which is full of problems and much below average or even the Explorer which is the recall king of all time and has serious problems with its SOHC 4.0 V6. I don't base my opinion on those vehicles and feel the Ranger is one of Ford's best vehicles. I still personally prefer the Tacoma though and, contrary to most posts here, the price difference isn't that great particularly when you consider the better warranty coverage on the Tacoma. It all depends on which truck suits your personal needs.

smc13

I am looking at the toyota owner's website. In the parts faq there is a question asking what happened to the brush guard/grille gaurd for 4x4s. The response is that toyota discontinued the parts since the intruduction of the air bag. It states that since the guard is mounted to the frame it could interfere with the air bag sensor.

Anyone hear anything about this?

lariat1

There should not be any problem with installing a brush guard on any neew trucks as far as I know all new vehicles use an "inertia" switch for air bag deployment. Also I am thinking if there is a brush guard that prevents air bag deployment there would be a major lawsuit by now.

cpousnr

"Finishing below industry average in alphabetical order are: Chevrolet, Chrysler, Dodge, Eagle, GMC, Hyundai, Isuzu, Jaguar, Kia, Mazda, Mitsubishi, Plymouth, Pontiac, Saab, Saturn, Suzuki and Volkswagen"

Hello, soog, how did you miss that statement. . .? I do not see Ford or Ranger anywhere in that list. . .and it is from you post.

Second, here, is that egg I see on your face?

bess

Actually, items that are bolted to the front frame can alter the 'pulse signature' that is used in determination of whether the airbag should deploy or not. (its not just a straight simple inerta sensor).

I thought I saw a recall a few years back on a particular truck for airbag reprogramming because the addition of tow hooks changed the pulse signature so in some cases the air bag wouldn't deploy properly.

eharri3

Sometimes I'm so slow these jokes you guys make fly right over my head... guess that happens alot to us Ranger owners

1995 Ford Ranger 4x2 5 speed manual
73,000 miles without a mechanical hiccup and still purrs like new on the highway. I know that ain't much, but I have no doubt the truck will easily last another 10 years.

Maintenance to date: oil changes, timing and fan belt, transmission fluid replacement, tire rotations, and one temperature gauge replaced for free at Fomoco's discretion despite it being a used truck way out of warranty.

ebbgreatdane

Because I'm wondering, why and how F.O.R.D. has come to mean so many things?

Fix Or Repair Daily
Fouled up Rebuilt Dodge (and that's being polite)
Found on Road Dead

I didn't make these up so don't shoot the messenger; I assume they are deserved. But what would Toyota's look like?

T ight
O ffroad
Y ota
----------
T acomas
A lways
C rank
O ver

Food for thought I suppose.
Shadetree Philosophy

ebbgreatdane

A good 4X4 is built, not bought.

Yeah but garbage in garbage out no?

John

modvptnl

F first
O on
R race
D day

F for
O Off
R road
D duty


T turds,
O obnoxious
Y yahoos
O own
T these
A atrocities

T terrible
O overheating
Y yuppie
O owning
T toy
A automobile

T The
A auto
C crackhouse
O occupants
M mostly
A adore

ebbgreatdane

What some people can't think of at 1:30 in the morning....

With the exception of midnight, before you guys and girls start comparing the Toyota Problems post and the Ranger Problems post, you may want to read them first.

Honestly. I'm not kidding. You will probably find as I do that:

A) The Tacoma problems post is kept alive by me and a few others who post on the occasional loose floor mat.

The Ranger problems post is kept alive by the volume of truck sales the Ford owners like to brag about.

Cheers,
John

ebbgreatdane

T turds,
O obnoxious
Y yahoos
O own
T these
A atrocities

Damned straight I'm obnoxious when I'm on the road and observant. Get in the slow lane if you don't want to keep up cause it's the only way to drive in CA.

T terrible
O overheating
Y yuppie
O owning
T toy
A automobile

Yuppies owning oveheating vehicles? I don't think so. To my knowledge they all own BMW Bummers. My '85, even when the radiator cracked never overheated on me and with the 1/16" brake dust build up on the wheels, I doubt any yuppie would ever have touched it. And yes it was a Toy automobile; the same as my new Toy that can tow around 5000 lbs and carry 3/4 ton and well....it's the Toys that seperate the Men from the Boys right?

T The
A auto
C crackhouse
O occupants
M mostly
A adore

I can't begin to tell you what's wrong with this. I guess all I can say is I didn't make the Ford ones up.

Off my soap box.

John

modvptnl

sometimes I think it's a pride thing, sometimes a volume thing, sometimes I think a manufacturer is better at keeping secrets.

Wish I had a digital camera the other day(still wouldn't know how to post pics though)A later model toy pick up's bed was nearly non-existent from the cancer it had. The head gaskets are a very well kept secret. High school buddies 1st year T100 caught on fire in S. Calif. Toy said no previous like problems ever existed...call your insurance co. They are all mechanical things and are not perfect but until Ford lets me down I'll spend about the same money on an '01 Crew Cab F-250 Super Duty as some paid for a tacoma. (I realize that's a little off topic) After incentives and financing and all the other perks a Ranger has over a toy I would be hard pressed to buy a Toy 'cause it might go some arbitrary number of miles longer. I don't keep anything long enough for that to even matter.

cpousnr

Article No.99-13-4
06/28/99

NOISE - "THUMPING" AND/OR "BUMPING" SENSATION FELT ON LIGHT ACCELERATION/DECELERATION - 4X4 VEHICLES ONLY

FORD: 1998-1999 RANGER

ISSUE
A "thumping" and/or "bumping" sensation may be felt on light acceleration and/or deceleration on some vehicles. This may be due to the driveshaft
splines not moving freely during suspension movement.

ACTION
Remove production driveshaft and replace with revised driveshaft. Refer to the following Service Procedure for details.

SERVICE PROCEDURE

1. Reference yellow balance mark on existing driveshaft. Using chalk/paint-pen or equivalent, index a mark on axle in-line with yellow mark
on driveshaft.

2. Remove existing driveshaft from vehicle.

3. Using the previous reference mark on the axle, align the applicable revised Driveshaft's (XL5Z-4602-DA - Short Wheelbase or XL5Z-4602-EA - Super
Cab) yellow mark to the axle's mark. This will assure correct orientation of the new service driveshaft.

4. Install driveshaft. Torque new service driveshaft to 103 +/- 15.5 N.m (76 +/- 11 lb-ft)

PART NUMBER PART NAME

XL5Z-4602-DA Driveshaft - Short Wheelbase
XL5Z-4602-EA Driveshaft - Super Cab

OTHER APPLICABLE ARTICLES: NONE

WARRANTY STATUS: Eligible Under The Provisions Of Bumper To Bumper Warranty Coverage

OPERATION DESCRIPTION TIME

991304A Remove And Install 0.4 Hr. Driveshaft

DEALER CODING CONDITION BASIC PART NO. CODE
4602 07

OASIS CODES: 597997, 702200, 702300, 703200, 703400

midnight_stang

But Acronyms are just like Assumptions. And we all know what Assumptions make...

allknowing

Regarding your comment that you don't keep the truck that long is a good point to consider when you choose your truck. I'd still pick the Tacoma myself for other reasons but most of the reliabily debate compared to the Ranger becomes mute if you don't keep the truck for a long period. That would be a plus for the Ranger to many.

midnight_stang

Seems www.autovantage.com favors the Ranger over the Tacoma. They tested/reviewed 3 different models of each in 2001 trim. Average scores: Ranger: 53 Tacoma: 37.6. out of a possible 70 points.

http://www.autovantage.com/Auto/NewCarSummary.asp?

A very comprehensive lists of statistics follow for either make. A good read...

ps. Tacoma's have to pay 50+ bucks for a clock? Must be because of it's "superior" quality...

modvptnl

The thing is for me is that it seems people think the toy is better stock as a 4WD. Maybe so. But neither the toy or Ranger would meet what I WOULD WANT in a 4 wheeler as a stock vehicle. My '96 F150 was very close. It also had $4000 in aftermarket parts to make it that way.
I actually DIDN'T get a 4WD Super Duty this time around because as I found out, they are just too big for what I like to do off road. I do have a highly modified early Bronco and my other toys for off roading now.
So the perceived reliability issue and the off road performance(which I would enhance anyway)doesn't matter TO ME and the other 10:1 ratio of Ranger owners compared to Toy owners. The up to $4000 (after incentives) does.

I won't be as passionate as Vince over other people's choices or as repetitive as spoog(can't believe you think Vince is more annoying then spoog!!)but if I WERE SHOPPING for a small truck, between the two, I would choose the one with most monetary advantages and fit it to what I want.

smc13

What 10:1 ratio? This year, the ranger has less than a 2:1 ratio. Last year the ranger had slightly more than a 2:1 ratio. How do you come up with 10:1. There is more than a 10:1 ratio for F150s VS Tundras but that is a different topic altogether.

Steve Cohen

cpousnr

What kind of tires you running?

Nice pictures, would have been better with sand flying, but nice just the same.

I am working on a 2nd annual trip over Medano Pass to the Sand Dunes NP, hope to, with more rigs along, get some action shots in the sand. Last year has a front receiver full of sand and sand flying over the hood!

Nice pics, thanks.

barlitz

I'm trying to get a patent on a new men's cologne I've invented, its called, essence of a stroll through the pasture. I'll keep you all posted on how I make out.

rmacias_

I'm running 32X11.50 Mickey Thompson Baja Belted's on a 16X8 American Racing Atlas. Action shots would have been nice but everyone was to busy wheelin' to help me take shots. Maybe next time.

midnight_stang

I believe the 10:1 ratio mod was talking about is not current year sales, but overall vehicle amount on the road(all years).

barlitz->What you talkin' 'bout willis?

issisteelman

the longevity of our vehicles, and that is why we are willing to spend a little more than Ranger fans. I bought my truck and plan to run it into the ground. With good luck (and a quality Toyota) I'm hoping that it will need to be junked 10 years and 250,000 miles from now. That will leave me with 6 years without a truck payment. With all the money I save, I think I buy a full size Tacoma the next time around. Take care and I'll see you in those hard to reach places............. Steelman.

modvptnl

and that's good for you!! Not being facetious either. I would never WANT to keep a vehicle 10 years unless it was semi-collectible ie: old land cruisers, early Broncos. But here's one for 'ya: I HONESTLY believe that 10 years and 250,000 miles the Toy and Ranger would probably be very close in total cost of ownership AFTER factoring in initial cost, incentives and lower financing. The ranger MAY have to have a few more things replaced but it's the old axiom, pay me now or pay me later. At least on the Ranger you don't need to pay for it up front.

ebbgreatdane

the only thing I would add is that for some of us, we don't have the time or the patience to wait for the moment when the Ranger will need that extra thing replaced.

I want my truck where I bought it to be. On the ground running.

frey44

the info on the driveshaft PART NUMBERS is very valuable to me. thanks for the time and effort you spent trying to help me. i am still pursuing (after almost a year !) trying to get the shakes out of my 4x4 Ranger ! have a good one !

allknowing

modvptnl - What you're saying makes sense and I can respect your opinion. I still like the Tacoma better but that's me. As far as your spoog/vince comment, Vince is OK sometimes. Spoog has never accused me of saying things that I haven't said which Vince often has done. That's the main difference. I can respect spoog's opinion too, however, I can agree that the same opinion and info he posts has been repeated many too many times and I understand how it can be annoying.

midnight_stang - The Ranger is a good truck so it shouldn't be a surprise that some publications will rate it better than the Tacoma....even if they are wrong

rmacias - Your truck looks good with those tires. Nice pics..

cpousnr

That was posted on another board, I do not know where the guy got the full TSB. Gotta ask him that.

I do not know if that addresses your issue. I still think the problem is in the driveshaft and or the rearend. I still think you should contact the regional rep in your area. The main Ford site may have that info or direct you where to get it.

Good luck. I cannot relate too much as I have not had that problem.

cpousnr

Thanks for the info on quality, even if it is from a site you often discount as not a good site. It does cover all vehicles from a manuracturer, not just the Ranger and Tacoma. I would more than likely agree with the stats, but they are not that importaint.

Hey how did you like that site on the vehicle evaluations? Wonder what they were using as source data.

smc13

I looked through the ratings of the taco and the Ranger and then through the other compact pickups and I noticed something odd. They rate the ranger much better than the mazda B series even though they say that the two vehicles are similer. The B400 gets a 37 while the xlt supercab 4.0 gets a 53. They're the same truck so how is it possible?
Btw, comsumer reports also rates the ranger as better than the taco, but at least they give the b series the same rating as the ranger.

cpousnr

could not help but notice the Rancho Shocks in your pics.

9000 or 5000?

Whats your opinion compared to stock Tacoma shocks?

rmacias_

I'm running the RS5000 strut's up front and the RS9000's for the rear.

I was looking for a lift for the front to level the truck and decided to go with Rancho's 1.5" coil-over kit, that includes the RS5000 struts. The RS9000's are great I enjoy the flexibility of adjusting stiffness.

Overall I would have to rate that the Rancho suspension is much better than the stock gas pressurized Bilstein's. But if you can't afford an upgrade the TRD shocks are much better than the standard Tacoma shocks. I have a friend who owns a 2000 Prerunner and just bought and installed my TRD suspension. The difference is like night and day.

eharri3

Except for front end styling and some subtle contours on the outside of the bed as well as the badging and seat fabric. Other than that, same engines, same transmissions, same dashboard arrangement.

cpousnr

There are less configurations for the MAzda.

MAzda uses a 7.5 inch rear differential in the 4.0 v6 configuration(same as the Ranger differential used in the 3.0 v6), Ranger uses an 8.8 differential which is rated 35% stronger gears.