2013 and earlier Kia Optima Prices Paid and Buying Experience
2006.5+ actually.
Re-state of my post on the general Kia Optima board.
*2007 LX with appearance group
*Dealer installed leather (January 2-- we'll see but it looked OK in the showroom.
*Spoiler (who cares)
$16,100
Chose the Optima over the Sonata because I'm not too crazy about the high-pressure local Hyundai dealer.
Good experience so far.
Compared to my Malibu Maxx ($100 less)--
1. Better handling than the Maxx with 50 series Michelins.
2. Four cylinder seems almost as quick as the 3.5 Maxx.
3. More stuff on the Maxx--power petals, better drivers information center, power seats.
4. Maxx seems bigger despite the Optima's roughly equal interior space. Think Optima puts it into more head room. Maxx seems a bit more comfortable to me.
5. Maxx should be cheaper on maintenance: no timing belt, cheaper tires, longer oil change intervals (roughly 7000 on dino. oil.
6. Like the looks of the Optima more and more. Better interior design. No goofy front-end clip of the pre-06 'Bu's.
I have 40K trouble free miles on 'Bu, only a couple of hundred on Optima. At this point, they're probably the two best cars I've ever had with my 01 Elantra a close third. Actually counting my beloved 88 Festiva, Korean cars count for three of the four best cars I've ever owned.
Re-state of my post on the general Kia Optima board.
*2007 LX with appearance group
*Dealer installed leather (January 2-- we'll see but it looked OK in the showroom.
*Spoiler (who cares)
$16,100
Chose the Optima over the Sonata because I'm not too crazy about the high-pressure local Hyundai dealer.
Good experience so far.
Compared to my Malibu Maxx ($100 less)--
1. Better handling than the Maxx with 50 series Michelins.
2. Four cylinder seems almost as quick as the 3.5 Maxx.
3. More stuff on the Maxx--power petals, better drivers information center, power seats.
4. Maxx seems bigger despite the Optima's roughly equal interior space. Think Optima puts it into more head room. Maxx seems a bit more comfortable to me.
5. Maxx should be cheaper on maintenance: no timing belt, cheaper tires, longer oil change intervals (roughly 7000 on dino. oil.
6. Like the looks of the Optima more and more. Better interior design. No goofy front-end clip of the pre-06 'Bu's.
I have 40K trouble free miles on 'Bu, only a couple of hundred on Optima. At this point, they're probably the two best cars I've ever had with my 01 Elantra a close third. Actually counting my beloved 88 Festiva, Korean cars count for three of the four best cars I've ever owned.
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Comments
More and more I am looking to Kia Motors to supply us with our next new rig. Might be one of the new Optima's or I'm interested in this new concept car of Kia's called the C'eed. I would go for a 5-speed, 5-door Kia C'eed if the production model looks anywhere near as good as the concept car. And if Kia keeps the price around $17,000 or lower. Figuring Kia's history in they probably will keep the C'eed reasonably priced.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I believe we will get the Kia C'eed here because it is talked about as being the new design direction Kia is going to for the future.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
The Optima EX V6 I'm interested in originally stickered for about 24,700. According to a dealer e-mail, they are asking $19,200. But Kelley Blue Book for this same model used (even with very low miles) is $17,600. A near by Enterprise Rent-A-Car sales place has the same model 2007 - with fewer options and 30,000 miles - for about $12,700.
Any thoughts?
In my opinion there's not a lot of benefit in going with the V6. Not much more power, lower MPG's (although the four is none too good), and an expensive timing belt to replace.
So I was wondering what kind of deals people are seeing/getting right now? The trim I am interested in is the LX AT with the ESC package and Appearance package (which is required with ESC/ABS). With mats and $675 destination, MSRP is $20,110 and invoice (per Edmunds.com) is $18,755. There is a $3000 general rebate and a $500 competitive rebate (which I qualify for since I own a 626).
I have seen some Hyundai dealers offer as much as $2000+ off invoice on 2009 Sonatas, before rebates. If I could find a Kia dealer who offers a comparable discount off invoice, that would make the Optima I want a little over $13k + TTL. If I could get a price like that, it would be pretty hard to pass up. Wishful thinking?
The Optima is actually a good looking vehicle, even when compared to Accord, Camry and Sonata. The Appearance package is a must-have for the price (17-inch wheels, fog lights, trip computer, leather steering wheel) as is the Stability/Traction Control with ABS. I priced an Optima LX 4-cylinder automatic with those two options at a local dealer- with rebates factored in, I could buy it for $16,000 plus tax (sticker is $20,025). That's a steal and I'd be a fool to pass it up, right?
I think the biggest obstacle is my own snobbery (Kia doesn't roll off the tongue as easily as Honda or Mazda). Then again, maybe driving a good looking, well-equipped mid-size car with a 100k mile warranty and payments less than a Honda Fit are just the cure for that!
It really irritates me that the ESC package is an option rather than standard across the model range because it's the only way to get ABS! How can Kia even think about competing with any of the mid-size class leaders when every one of them has ABS standard on all trim levels. Even if they wanted to claim the low MSRP, they could simply make the ESC package a "standard" option and include it on all of the Optimas they build. Sending them to dealers without ABS is baffling to me....
ABS isn't even standard on the EX V-6 but it has leather and automatic climate control. Hyundai includes ABS, TSC and ESC on all Sonata models....that needs to trickle down to its Kia sibling.
And whlie they're at it, they could share the 3.3L V6 from the Sonata, too. That'd get me to upgrade from the 4-cylinder model. As it stands, I can't see much logic in paying for the 2.7L V6 (at least $1000 depending on trim level). You get 23 more horsepower, lose 1 mpg city and 3 mpg highway and pick up about 110 pounds in vehicle weight. The marketing folks really didn't think thru that one very well, I don't think.
Then again, I suppose they're working with what they have. The 2.7L V6 is just a slightly revised version of the V6 in the previous-gen Sonata, right?
"Unlike the previous Optima, this vehicle no longer shares its platform with the current generation Sonata (NF) nor Hyundai Elantra (HD). It instead uses a global platform, unique to Kia, designated "MG," shared with the the Kia Carens/Rondo."
I'm never comfortable saying exactly what a platform is in modern manufacturing. The previous gen Sonata/Optima were identical with different clips. This version has struts like the Elantra, not links like a Sonata.
I remember long discussions with Backy whether or not the Spectra shared a platform with the earlier Elantra or next gen Elantra. Sometimes figuring out platform evolution can be a tricky thing. Certainly the Optima is very close to the Rondo.
ESC has to be the biggest advance in auto safety since the inception of seat belts; and probably more so than air bags, by a wide margin.
Consumer Reports did a lengthy study comparing vehicles equipped with and w/out ESC, and the results were startling.
ESC literally increases your chances of maintaining control of your vehicle, steering where you want to, and avoiding an accident, under almost any conditions, by approximately 50%.
MSRP: $18,920
No additional options:
$14,998 + TTL
What do you guys think? I haven't decided between this or the Sonata. I rented an Optima once in Puerto Rico and loved the interior and the ride (smooth).
How much below invoice do you think I can go? Is the 2009 a complete redesign?
I look online for pictures and it looks exactly like the 2008 I think.
IMO your maximum target price should be invoice, before rebates. You can start out below that and see what the dealer says.
Don't forget the competitive rebate... applies to lots of different non-Kia cars.
I'll get back to you guys.
Thanks for your help!
Thanks, Backy.
Don
Now on the Optima... I've found a 2007 EX I4 that appears loaded except for the Appearance Package. So it has leather, heated dual power seats, etc. etc. AND most importantly has the ABS/ESC package. It's in my favorite color for the Optima, grey, has about 14k miles and appears from what I can tell from the photos and description to be in good shape. I haven't had a call back from the seller (private party) yet, but I was wondering what kind of offer y'all think would be appropriate? Asking price is $13,900. KBB is between $13k-13.7k, Edmunds is a bit higher. The ad states that it has the 10/100 warranty so I have to find out if it has the Kia extended warranty, since the 10/100 wouldn't transfer. I also want to find out why they would want to part with such a fine car so soon.
I've noticed a lot of cars, whether Buicks, Hyundais, Kias, Chryslers, Fords - they are typically 12 to 18 months old with anywhere from 12k to 20k miles, and a lot of them seem to be former rental cars according to the free car fax reports that typically accompany those types of ads.
I personally think you can do a little better on the price - it seems that all car pricing, no matter the brand (except for the rare cars and hybrids), has become very competitive.
Good luck to you.
Also, as you insinuated, because I know you're sharp, the warranty issue (the fact they didn't know the 100k/10year warranty is cut almost in half for 2nd owners) might give you huge leverage to get that price much lower.
Finally, try to find honest figures on what they'd get on a trade-in from a dealer, or at a lot on a cash sale, and bring those numbers with you.
Good luck, Backy.
I picked the local dealer, even though I could have gotten a base car cheaper elsewhere in St. Louis. Kind of regret it now that I see what tires are going to cost for replacement and frankly the car (low mileage) hasn't been back to the dealer in the almost two years I've owned it.
Since Sonatas with ESC are really easy to find (i.e., ALL of them have it), and I don't prefer the Optima all that much more to the Sonata, that would be the route I'd take if I can't find an Optima LX with ABS/ESC or an Elantra SE at a decent price. I am also looking at the used route, as per my recent posts on the 2007 Optima.
:P
(If there were an Emotorcon for "utter disbelief", I would have used it.)
Also, can anyone confirm a $1,000+ dollar bill because the solid lifters must be adjusted near the 90k mile mark?
One last thing: Consumer Reports remarked that the Optima (I think 2007) had suspension noise. Anyone who owns one or has driven one care to comment?
Thank you.
Don
$14,496 + TTL ($15,728.00 OTD)
Do you guys think that's a good deal?
So, subtracting the appearance group and the leather you paid about what I did two years ago. Of course I bought a new 07 and you're getting a soon to be replaced 08. (Just noticed the 09 ad on the right of this page.) The 09 is uglier IMHO but should get better mileage and have more power.
I'm not sure what the rebates are on this, but I'd think you got a pretty good deal, especially if you got the appearance group thrown in.
I don't like listing TTL as part of the deal because it varies so much. For example in Missouri, taxes are paid separately depending on the town of residence within 30 days and the dealer sees none of this, other than some kind of title fee which I've never agreed to pay. Price paid to the dealer without these charges allows a much better comparison for a national market.
I'm almost certain I can get it down further, maybe another $500. The wild card in all of this is how much they are willing to give me for my Elantra... I guess I'll see when I go down to the dealer.
One other question, they have a 2007 EX V6 (fully loaded) that has been sitting on the lot brand new. They are offering it for like $15,687. Do you think I can ask for $14,496 and take that? It has like 20 miles and I much rather get the V6 with all the goodies for the same price.
Thanks for your input.
BTW, I agree 100% on the appearance of the 2009!
My problems with the V6:
1. Timing belt to replace.
2. Not much more power than the four.
3. Poorer gas mileage.
Make 'em an offer of under $14K on it and see if they take it. Can't do any harm. I haven't checked the price of a used EX (say with 5K mileage) on Edmunds. See what that would bring and offer it or less.
Having the Elantra in the mix complicates things as to what the car is costing. I know selling it yourself is a hassle but it might save you a thousand or more. At the very least I'd negotiate the Kia separately.
Kias still depreciate much more than Hyundais, so I don't see much difference between the 07 and 08. If you buy this car do so with the idea that you're going to run it into the ground.
Are there any other incentives out there we don't know about? Any more wiggle room in KIA? They're not into haggling. But its a bit more car than they wanted. They just wanted a sunroof and the ESC. But colors etc. are hard to find these days.
I guess I'll find out when I drive there this weekend, I'm sure they will give me dirt for my Hyundai, so I'm afraid I'll probably just walk out and wait till my loan is done with the Elantra (2.5 years yuck).
Check on the edmunds site under NEW and price out the 2008 Optima EX V6 with all the goodies and get a good idea of what the invoice is. The subtract the rebates to get a good starting point. I would offer $1,000 under invoice + rebates to see the response and see where that leaves you (like was mentioned above, new redesigned model, the extras also allow more giggle room for negotiations etc..)
Report back we'd love to hear an update.
The way the contract read, it was just over $16K for the car (under invoice), less $5400 in rebates (was really $4400, think they made up the last $1000 to get the deal). A little under $11000 before tax, title, doc fee, etc - under $12,700 out the door. I'm sure they did some funny math, I was just ecstatic to get that deal as I had another one on hold at another dealer for $13,692 & was willing to go with it.
I'm in Las Vegas, agreed with the dealer that I wouldn't mention them by name but there are only a few in the area, so you can narrow it down ... all in the area have lots of inventory, 2009s are just coming out & the rebate just jumped to $4000. Plus, my girlfriend qualified for the college grad rebate, another $400.
The sad fact is, Kias in general depreciate pretty rapidly, and unless an Optima has the safety gear that has become commonplace in the mid-sized class now--and standard on the 2009 Optima--namely ABS, traction control, and ESC, it will be hard for them to hold value. Fortunately, there have been great deals on the 06.5+ Optima almost since it arrived, although it's hard to beat the deal that was just posted. I don't know if you can even get a basic Accent or Rio for much less than that these days.