...and I had a nice little rebuttal going about whether or not the movie made the viewer think.....or whether Al did all the really critical thinking FOR the viewer...
Personally, I am so tired of all the complaining about gas prices. I have had to listen to about 75 people complain to me about the high price of gasoline. I have yet to see ANYONE of those people actually DO ANYTHING to reduce the impact.
I have cut my mileage on the beater from 13k per year to just under 8k. That is a lot more savings than had I gone out and spent 25k on a Prius or 30k on a SMART Car. Most of the savings comes from planning trips and consolidating and hitting the rails one or two days a week.
My last tank of gas was at $3.069 on August 14th. Seems like I should pay less next week when I refill my tank.
The next door neighbor was complaining that HIS electric bill (for a two bedroom condo) was over $150. Mine was $18. Of course, I don't air condition my house when the temperature outside is 55F.
On my way to a doctor appointment today I noticed the 5 stations near my home were at $2.749 for 87 reg and then after my appointment (1.5 hours later) the gas dropped to $2.699 and the last station was just finishing changing their sign. That has never happened to me before. This is the start of labor day weekend, this should not be happening it should be going up not down.
local station at 2.84x x=9. they had a line of cars out into the street. i don't like the owners, so i would never get gas for my car there. i did get a gallon for my mower, once in a moment of weakness.
2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
I may be wrong, for the first time grin, and the prices won't jump up for the holiday weekend, airshow, computerfest, or any other area events.
The stores have been holding prices up higher even though wholesale price to them has dropped is what I heard on the news. They are keeping the extra profits at the local gas stations. Some of our area is still at $2.639
finally someone else thinking as I on this whole gas issue. Many of the complainers I hear are the SUV drivers or the drivers burning rubber stoplight to stoplight. They expect the president and everyone else to do something. If they would just slow down, drive the limit and combine trips their mileage would go up and cost would go down. Just by doing that (and have been since fuel went to $2, yes $2) I've saved quite a bit of money over the past few years. :shades:
I haven't hit the $18 mark electric bill yet but came close @ $20. Natural gas was $31, for TWO MONTHS.
Back on topic, fuel cost are coming down slowly, @ $2.98 across from work, $2.89 in right outside W. Chicago, $3.05 - $3.09 by home; haven't been to downtown Chi lately, so fuel may be a tick higher.
LOL... sometimes I feel like I am! I have 28.5 tons of air conditioning using 7 units. The house has 6,400 sq. ft... you know, just your typical desert bungalow! LOL!
Off to the beach to get out of the heat!
Gas in Palm Desert at the Exxon..
Reg. $3.14 Mid. $3.24 Prem. $3.34
Fuel at this station is usually much cheaper than Chevron but they are inching closer and closer. Many times, this Exxon has been .20 cents cheaper per gallon than anywhere in the desert.
Mark
2010 Land Rover LR4, 2013 Honda CR-V, 2009 Bentley GTC, 1990 MB 500SL, 2001 MB S500, 2007 Lincoln TC, 1964 RR Silver Cloud III, 1995 MB E320 Cab., 2015 Prevost Liberty Coach
Here in Crystal Lake, IL, I have seen prices as low as $2.85.
To get a lower rate from COMED, give them the authority to cut-off your air conditioning during peak usage hours (dueing which I am rarely home) and they give you $10/ month off.
Rode the METRA into work and walked a mile to work.
I was listening to some old time radio last night. They had some old commercials - SIGNAL GAS - rationing of gasoline was four gallons per week during wartime.
Hopefully, the natural gas rates remain at two year lows ...
Not only does Al Gore want to alert people about global warming, he also wants us to be aware of a greater threat. I'm talking about Manbearpig! He's half man, half bear, and half pig! I'm serial!
I have cut my mileage on the beater from 13k per year to just under 8k.
I am in total agreement. Some people think that buying a new hybrid so they can drive more miles on a gallon of gas is conserving. Conserving is driving less and keeping what you have well maintained for more years.
Gas at Costco in San Diego dropped to $2.90 for the Labor Day weekend. Are we driving less or is the supply greater than the demand?
Average wholesale prices have dropped off a lot. Gas prices historicaly have dropped at the end of the summer and I think demand has also started to drop. People are finaly feeling enough pain to cut back on driving. Cheapest gas around here is a $2.82 for regular.
...because the weather forecasters have downrated this season as one for a large number of hurricanes. Kind of a "duh" now that we're into September (usually the worst month), but IIRC there have been no Atlantic storms that reached hurricane strength over land.
Yesterday, paid $2.68 for BP 87 in a neighboring town in central VA. I also saw $2.59 for Excel 87 (a new player in these parts), but I passed because I'm not sure what I'd be buying.
$2.269 here in Western Ohio near Dayton. I can't believe they didn't raise it for Labor Day travel. They really are trying to make people forget the price-gouging by November election day.
I was in the Linthicum area (near BWI airport) and saw gas as cheap as $2.619 per gallon. Of course, right near the airport is was still in the $2.8X range.
Closer to home, I notice the Citgo on my way to work is down to $2.759 for 87, and the Shell is down to $2.839.
for Slop at the Amarillo Shell station. The weird thing is since I've been regularly putting in Shell gas my noise in the mustang has quit. Perhaps Shell really is a Top Tier gasoline that cleans your engine as you drive ? Neways dad will be here tommorow and I will still have him go over my vehicles
$2.23 for Mobile at one. Others will drop. Shell is at $2.28 so I think I'll make a milk run in the morning when I go out and stop by.
This is sad I know, but damn that sounds cheap to me! The oil companies really have us conditioned, don't they? :sick:
I put $2.859 89 octane in my truck yesterday. I could have put 87 in and saved 10 cents a gallon, but I didn't feel like hearing the valves clatter every time I hit the gas pedal. Fuel economy's holding around 14 mpg, which is what its EPA city rating is, so I'm not complaining. And the last time I filled it up was about 3 weeks ago, so its appetite isn't bleeding me.
...Sunoco on Rising Sun Avenue shows a two-cent drop. Regular is now $2.63 and "ultra?"93 is $2.93. Isn't it about time they bring back the real Ultra 94? Saw this octane booster that claims 108+. Costs $9.99. Even I think this is excessive for my Seville. Must be great for an old muscle car.
I remember being in San Francisco in 2000 and seeing Regular at $1.87 and thinking it was ridiculous. I believe I was getting Amoco Ultimate or Sunoco Ultra for around $1.47 in Philadelphia at the time.
Lemko, are you still on that octane kick? Just out of curiosity, what do your owner's manuals say to use in your Cadillacs? As I have stated ad nauseum, I don't think there's a car sold in America that recommends 94 octane.
Imidazol, you really think the politicos and oil companies have that much power over prices? When China is "automobiling" at a rapid rate, thereby driving up worldwide demand dramatically?
Last I checked the oil companies aren't charities, willing to sell (or give away) their product below market prices.
Anyone: if you had a '66 GTO priced by the market (meaning a willing buyer) at $50,000, say, would you sell it for $20,000?
Not that I like the high gas prices or anything, but I don't get this thinking there's gotta be some kind of conspiracy going on.
My local Lukoil outlet is selling 87 for $3.04, 89 for $3.41, and 91 for $3.45.
(87 at everywhere else in the area has settled down to $2.94-$2.99.)
If I ran an oil company, I sure would be scared by the prospect of an angry, activist, Democratic Party-controlled Congress with a Democratic president on deck in 2008. They might institute trading controls and windfall taxes and all sorts of nasty, extreme measures. So I'm sure it's not a total coincidence that the oil companies and refiners and market speculators have decided to give up some profit to the consumer -- take a short hit now in the hopes of maintaining something close to the status quo going forward.
Maybe that's thinking conspiratorially. But it's more rational than thinking that gasoline pricing is based solely and purely on supply and demand.
Or maybe all the talk early in the summer about how this would be one of the worst hurricane seasons EVER (thank YOU Mr. Gore) had a slight effect on the price of gas futures? You think?
And maybe once it was realized that it WOULDN'T be one of the worst hurricane seasons ever (thank YOU Mr. Gore), the price of the gas futures fell.
In other words, what drives UP the price at the pump is the ANTICIPATED cost to replace the gas in the underground tanks at the gas station. If gas futures are high (perhaps due to ANTICIPATED shortages from any number of highly publicized 'ohmygodtheskyisFALLING' stories in the press), then these high futures prices are reflected in the price at the pump.
Of course, once all the myriad doomday scenarios DON'T play out like the MSM so breathlessly anticipated, then reality checks back in. Such realities as "anticipated supply WILL meet anticipated demand". And the price of gas futures falls.....and the price at the pump starts to come down.
Of course, it's SO much easier to just believe that THEY are all out to get you and that THEY enjoy nothing more than jacking you around and that THEY are simply unable to 'influence' those paragons of virtue on the left side of the aisle and so THEY are shaking in their collective boots at the thought of the outcome of the November elections and so THEY all got together to drop the price of gas.
I remember how THEY were all going to jack up the prices for the Labor Day weekend. That little prediction didn't pan out.
One thing I like about conspiracy theories: no matter WHAT actually happens, it can be nicely dovetailed into the theory.
In other words, if the prices went UP for Labor Day, it would be a 'sure sign' of a conspiracy for price collusion. However, if the prices go DOWN, then it becomes a 'sure sign' that they are afraid of fallout from the November elections.
Hey, it's a win-win no matter which way it goes. Gotta love it....
Interesting response,... but in our area controlled primarily by Marathon and BP the prices have gone up for any holiday weekend for years. They didn't go up this time. Really odd. Guess it's just their benevolence according to your theory?
When visiting other areas like Smyrna TN our friends say the prices change slowly and rarely. Here they go up 30 cents on a whim. The 3 gas stations down the road by the interstate exit go up a cent or two. Different areas experience different movement dynamics in the pricing. I can understand why you don't understand the expectation of a jump based on experience. I.e., a chain owned by Marathon raises its prices $.20 on Thursday but other stations go up almost as much and a couple stay down or go up only $.05. By Friday afternoon the chain prices have come back down $.15; by Monday, $.18.
So you can make fun, but I'm going on what's been happening in this area for years.
I've seen a big drop in prices this past week or two. Prices have dropped from the mid $2.60 range to as low as $2.339 & $2.359 this morning. A couple of no-name brands and Shell and Citgo. Several others on the drive to work are still hanging in the upper $2.40s to low $2.50s.
I think that what you are seeing is due to the practices of the owner(s) of the local stores; not something set in motion by the suits at Marathon or BP.
Unless you think that Marathon and BP are SPECIFICALLY targeting just your neighborhood. THEY must think you guys wield unbelievable political clout.....
What you MIGHT be seeing is simply the result of not enough competition, since your area is 'controlled' primarily by Marathon and BP. Perhaps if more folks bought their gas from other stations, you wouldn't have a problem.
"They didn't go up this time. Really odd. Guess it's just their benevolence according to your theory?"
Benevolence has NOTHING to do with the LAWS of supply and demand. 'Benevolence' only fits into YOUR theory that all the various companies get together and set the price. See, you've started with the premise that EVERY ONE of the oil companies are ALL in cahoots (that sort of conspiracy doesn't work if even ONE company doesn't follow along because that one company will simply undercut the other guys). Once you START with the premise they are all in cahoots, then it follows that EVERY price change (either up or down) MUST be due to something OTHER than supply/demand. It's either political, greed, 'benevolence' or whatever the reason du jour may be. And then whenever there's a price change (up or down), then you try to look at the situation from the perspective of "huh, now I wonder why THEY did that? It must be due to......." in this case, upcoming elections. But never supply/demand. Never. Under no circumstances could it EVER be supply/demand....
Under my theory, the various companies are all run by a bunch of greedy SOBs that would like nothing better than running the other guy out of business. And the way you do that is by offering a better product (service), or a better price, or a combination of the two. Since most folks perceive very little real difference from one brand of gasoline to another, the way to gain business is to undercut the other guys price. But since they ALL have essentially the same cost of doing business, and since the price of oil is set on the global market (unless you believe that ALL of the oil producing players are ALL in cahoots with EVERY futures trader), then it follows that the wholesale prices for gasoline would all be very very similar. And THEN what effects prices is ANTICIPATED supply/demand (since gas is sold on the wholesale level as 'futures').
The only thing political that I see happening is the grandstanding from certain government officials seeking to lauch YET ANOTHER round of government 'investigations' into 'price fixing' by that evil (eeeeevil I say) 'Big Oil'. Of course, these investigations go on ONLY when prices go up; never when the prices go down.
>I think that what you are seeing is due to the practices of the owner(s) of the local stores; not something set in motion by the suits at Marathon or BP.
The operators at the stores get messages to raise prices from the company. Strange all these independent, by your theory, operators raise their prices to the same $2.899 within hours of each other. They're not independent moves.
>Marathon and BP are SPECIFICALLY targeting just your neighborhood.
Did anyone say "neighborhood"? I've seen the price rise for the majority of SW Ohio within a day.
>Perhaps if more folks bought their gas from other stations,
A friend told me there were only a limited number of suppliers of fuel in this area. Other stations are simply labeling the fuel from the other suppliers with their brand.
The beauty of most conspiracy theories is than virtually any data fed into the theory can find a home......
"The operators at the stores get messages to raise prices from the company."
Alternate theory: the BP station owner's all receive word that their distributor is increasing the price of gas. They ALL anticipate that the next time they need a tanker load of fuel to restock their underground tanks, the price will be higher. Since all the local BP station owners are receiving fuel from the same distributor, wouldn't it make SENSE that wholesale gas price increases would result in 'strange' lockstep increases in the price of gas?
Or does it somehow make more sense that even though they all get gas from the same distributor (and pay the same wholesale price) that the only way to prove they were 'independent' would be to have wildly divergent reactions to the wholesale price? :confuse:
As a station owner (or even the owner of 2-3 stations), receiving word of an increase in the wholesale price from your distributor, would you:
a) keep selling your existing gas at the old price, leaving you somewhat short of cash when it comes time to refill your tanks....
or,
b) raise your prices so that you won't be AS short when it comes time to refill your tanks?
"I've seen the price rise for the majority of SW Ohio within a day."
Um, how many distributors in SW Ohio? Just because there may be 500 different gas stations doesn't mean they're all paying 500 different wholesale prices for their gas. My bet would be that there's very few distributors and that the wholesale price probably doesn't vary by more than a couple of cents. So if Distributor 'A' increases his price by 'X' amount, is it really any wonder that ALL the stations served by that distributor increase their price by a like amount?
"A friend told me there were only a limited number of suppliers of fuel in this area. Other stations are simply labeling the fuel from the other suppliers with their brand."
Um, yes. Kinda reinforces what I'm talking about.....
>Um, how many distributors in SW Ohio? Just because there may be 500 different gas stations doesn't mean they're all paying 500 different wholesale prices for their gas. My bet would be that there's very few distributors and that the wholesale price probably doesn't vary by more than a couple of cents. So if Distributor 'A' increases his price by 'X' amount
By your opinion if stations selling gas with price differences of $.15 all get a notice to increase by $.20 then they would end up higher but still with differences of $.15. However, as I've explained, they all end up at $2.899. You should be able to figure that out.
The number of distributors I was told. My friend was involved with gas purchase for a city's fleet of vehicles. I don't recall the exact number but Marathon, BP, and Shell were on the list or the list, FWIW.
It's obvious we're never going to have a dialogue of agreement other than the conspiracy fetish you like to throw up. EOD.
Just wait for the next dose of oil-favoring corporate welfare to see where the power really flows.
IIRC gas at my local Chevron was $2.94/3.04/3.14 Sunday...we've fallen some as everyone else, but we're a bit above the national average again...that wacky supply and demand no doubt.
"...if stations selling gas with price differences of $.15..."
If they're all receiving their marching orders from above, why are they $0.15 apart on the pump price prior to the price hike?
Some station owners try to sell the gas as cheap as feasible and hope to make their profit on volume. These stations (obviously) will sell more gas. Which means that their tanks empty quicker. Which means they need refills from the tanker trucks more often. Which means that these stations would be MORE sensitive to increases in the wholesale price of fuel.
Some station owners try to sell their gas for as much as they think the market will bear and hope to make more profit on each gallon. These stations (obviously) will sell less gas. Which means that their tanks take forever to empty. Which means they place fewer orders for refills (and can pick/choose when they buy gas). Which means these stations are LESS sensitive to increases in the wholesale price.
So, even though the stations may 'start' $0.15/gallon apart, when a wholesale price increase occurs, the cheapest stations SHOULD show the sharpest increase at the pump and the most expensive stations the least. And these changes would be immediate. As a few days go by, the pump prices will start to fall (due to COMPETITION between stations, something lacking in your conspiracy theory) with some falling faster (hoping to make profit due to volume of gas sold) and some falling very slowly (making more profit/gallon.)
IMO, you think that they ALL ended up at the same price because you're predisposed to believe they're all receiving the same marching orders and so when you see 3-4 stations with the same price (or within $.01), you think "aHA.....I THOUGHT so".
The next time you see one of the collective, mass increases so that ALL the stations are the same price, why not post a link to gasbuddy.com for your area and we can all witness this vast colusion amoung the stations in your area?
Frankly, I'd be surprised if the price spread in your area was ever, EVER, less than $0.10/gallon.
Look at the drop in price of a barrel of oil in the past week or so! Have you seen the price of gas drop that drastically?
OK, rhetorical question......
When you can see the price of gas rise on the same day with just a fractional increase in the price of a barrel, yet no decrease in gas prices takes place until a week or more after the price of a barrel drops drastically, you don’t have to be a rocket scientist to figure out why!
Example: Gas prices in Western, NY was at 2.99 for Plus about a month and a half ago, then the price of a barrel went up by a few dollars and presto, gas went up to 3.04 almost immediately. The price of a barrel within the past 2 weeks dropped by more than $5.00 and yet our gas just went down and only went back to 2.99 a few days ago.
In the example above the drop in the price per barrel was 2 times more than the initial increase but yet the drop in gas prices did not reflect that!
If a price of a barrel goes up by $2.00 and the gas increases by 5 cents, then it stands to reason that if the barrel price drops by $5.00 then the drop in gas should be at least 10 cents!
I was born but it was not yesterday, the oil companies are playing games and should be flogged, tarred, feathered on public TV for all to see! This is how they are raising the prices and getting away with it!
Their marketing tactics are excellent; they have all their cronies putting out all sorts of different versions of why the prices rise.
Example: My Aunt Agnes had flatulence the other day and the gas prices went up, now doesn’t that sound stupid?
Well, that is exactly what I think of their lame lies and excuses! Fact is, they are insulting our intelligence with their shell game tactics!
And to top it all off, when the barrel prices does drop drastically and the gas is supposed to go down proportionately, they have all sorts of excuses for why that doesn't happen!
Comments
...and I had a nice little rebuttal going about whether or not the movie made the viewer think.....or whether Al did all the really critical thinking FOR the viewer...
I have cut my mileage on the beater from 13k per year to just under 8k. That is a lot more savings than had I gone out and spent 25k on a Prius or 30k on a SMART Car. Most of the savings comes from planning trips and consolidating and hitting the rails one or two days a week.
My last tank of gas was at $3.069 on August 14th. Seems like I should pay less next week when I refill my tank.
The next door neighbor was complaining that HIS electric bill (for a two bedroom condo) was over $150. Mine was $18. Of course, I don't air condition my house when the temperature outside is 55F.
I may be wrong, for the first time grin, and the prices won't jump up for the holiday weekend, airshow, computerfest, or any other area events.
The stores have been holding prices up higher even though wholesale price to them has dropped is what I heard on the news. They are keeping the extra profits at the local gas stations. Some of our area is still at $2.639
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
You air conditioning the desert??
It is 50F here at night ... and that helps.
finally someone else thinking as I on this whole gas issue. Many of the complainers I hear are the SUV drivers or the drivers burning rubber stoplight to stoplight. They expect the president and everyone else to do something. If they would just slow down, drive the limit and combine trips their mileage would go up and cost would go down. Just by doing that (and have been since fuel went to $2, yes $2) I've saved quite a bit of money over the past few years. :shades:
I haven't hit the $18 mark electric bill yet but came close @ $20. Natural gas was $31, for TWO MONTHS.
Back on topic, fuel cost are coming down slowly, @ $2.98 across from work, $2.89 in right outside W. Chicago, $3.05 - $3.09 by home; haven't been to downtown Chi lately, so fuel may be a tick higher.
LOL... sometimes I feel like I am! I have 28.5 tons of air conditioning using 7 units. The house has 6,400 sq. ft... you know, just your typical desert bungalow! LOL!
Off to the beach to get out of the heat!
Gas in Palm Desert at the Exxon..
Reg. $3.14
Mid. $3.24
Prem. $3.34
Fuel at this station is usually much cheaper than Chevron but they are inching closer and closer. Many times, this Exxon has been .20 cents cheaper per gallon than anywhere in the desert.
Mark
To get a lower rate from COMED, give them the authority to cut-off your air conditioning during peak usage hours (dueing which I am rarely home) and they give you $10/ month off.
Rode the METRA into work and walked a mile to work.
I was listening to some old time radio last night. They had some old commercials - SIGNAL GAS - rationing of gasoline was four gallons per week during wartime.
Hopefully, the natural gas rates remain at two year lows ...
OMG lemko, your killing me
Rocky
I am in total agreement. Some people think that buying a new hybrid so they can drive more miles on a gallon of gas is conserving. Conserving is driving less and keeping what you have well maintained for more years.
Gas at Costco in San Diego dropped to $2.90 for the Labor Day weekend. Are we driving less or is the supply greater than the demand?
Down to $2.65 here.
None of this has had much to do with actual supply and demand. Demand is still up, yet the prices are dropping?
The futures market sounds like it was overbought to me.
Yesterday, paid $2.68 for BP 87 in a neighboring town in central VA. I also saw $2.59 for Excel 87 (a new player in these parts), but I passed because I'm not sure what I'd be buying.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I wonder why it's more expensive west of Richmond? 87 has been in the high 2.40s here for two weeks.
I also saw $2.59 for Excel 87 (a new player in these parts), but I passed because I'm not sure what I'd be buying.
Hyundai gas? For every gallon you buy, you get $1 off a new Sonata?
Hmmm, hopefully a sign of things to come...
Hyundai gas? For every gallon you buy, you get $1 off a new Sonata?
Maybe the Excel marketers don't remember its car namesake! Not good.
Closer to home, I notice the Citgo on my way to work is down to $2.759 for 87, and the Shell is down to $2.839.
Rocky
Hey Rocky, is "neways" Texan for "anyway"? (Can't quite figure out what that means.)
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
What do you mean that he will "go over" your vehicles; what's the problem?
Mark
This is sad I know, but damn that sounds cheap to me! The oil companies really have us conditioned, don't they? :sick:
I put $2.859 89 octane in my truck yesterday. I could have put 87 in and saved 10 cents a gallon, but I didn't feel like hearing the valves clatter every time I hit the gas pedal. Fuel economy's holding around 14 mpg, which is what its EPA city rating is, so I'm not complaining. And the last time I filled it up was about 3 weeks ago, so its appetite isn't bleeding me.
Isn't $1.75 - 1.85 about where we ought to be on pricing is the trend had continued without the media-hyped Katrina excuse?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Hey, don't blame that on Texans. I think he picked up that habit from his previous life in Michigan.
Y'all take care now.......
Lemko, are you still on that octane kick? Just out of curiosity, what do your owner's manuals say to use in your Cadillacs? As I have stated ad nauseum, I don't think there's a car sold in America that recommends 94 octane.
Imidazol, you really think the politicos and oil companies have that much power over prices? When China is "automobiling" at a rapid rate, thereby driving up worldwide demand dramatically?
Last I checked the oil companies aren't charities, willing to sell (or give away) their product below market prices.
Anyone: if you had a '66 GTO priced by the market (meaning a willing buyer) at $50,000, say, would you sell it for $20,000?
Not that I like the high gas prices or anything, but I don't get this thinking there's gotta be some kind of conspiracy going on.
I like conspiracy theories. They beat actually THINKING about anything....
(87 at everywhere else in the area has settled down to $2.94-$2.99.)
If I ran an oil company, I sure would be scared by the prospect of an angry, activist, Democratic Party-controlled Congress with a Democratic president on deck in 2008. They might institute trading controls and windfall taxes and all sorts of nasty, extreme measures. So I'm sure it's not a total coincidence that the oil companies and refiners and market speculators have decided to give up some profit to the consumer -- take a short hit now in the hopes of maintaining something close to the status quo going forward.
Maybe that's thinking conspiratorially. But it's more rational than thinking that gasoline pricing is based solely and purely on supply and demand.
Anyone thinking politics hasn't played in the gasoline pricing has their head in the sand. Comspiracy theory, my foot.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
And maybe once it was realized that it WOULDN'T be one of the worst hurricane seasons ever (thank YOU Mr. Gore), the price of the gas futures fell.
In other words, what drives UP the price at the pump is the ANTICIPATED cost to replace the gas in the underground tanks at the gas station. If gas futures are high (perhaps due to ANTICIPATED shortages from any number of highly publicized 'ohmygodtheskyisFALLING' stories in the press), then these high futures prices are reflected in the price at the pump.
Of course, once all the myriad doomday scenarios DON'T play out like the MSM so breathlessly anticipated, then reality checks back in. Such realities as "anticipated supply WILL meet anticipated demand". And the price of gas futures falls.....and the price at the pump starts to come down.
Of course, it's SO much easier to just believe that THEY are all out to get you and that THEY enjoy nothing more than jacking you around and that THEY are simply unable to 'influence' those paragons of virtue on the left side of the aisle and so THEY are shaking in their collective boots at the thought of the outcome of the November elections and so THEY all got together to drop the price of gas.
Yep, conspiracy theories sure are fun....
I remember how THEY were all going to jack up the prices for the Labor Day weekend. That little prediction didn't pan out.
One thing I like about conspiracy theories: no matter WHAT actually happens, it can be nicely dovetailed into the theory.
In other words, if the prices went UP for Labor Day, it would be a 'sure sign' of a conspiracy for price collusion. However, if the prices go DOWN, then it becomes a 'sure sign' that they are afraid of fallout from the November elections.
Hey, it's a win-win no matter which way it goes. Gotta love it....
87 - $2.699 - down 10 cents
89 - $2.799 - down 10 cents
91 - $2.859 - down 8 cents
93 - $2.899 - down 10 cents
diesel - $2.759 - down 11 cents
kcram - Pickups Host
Don't care if gasoline prices go down another dollar by November. I'm still throwin' the bums out!
When visiting other areas like Smyrna TN our friends say the prices change slowly and rarely. Here they go up 30 cents on a whim. The 3 gas stations down the road by the interstate exit go up a cent or two. Different areas experience different movement dynamics in the pricing. I can understand why you don't understand the expectation of a jump based on experience. I.e., a chain owned by Marathon raises its prices $.20 on Thursday but other stations go up almost as much and a couple stay down or go up only $.05. By Friday afternoon the chain prices have come back down $.15; by Monday, $.18.
So you can make fun, but I'm going on what's been happening in this area for years.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Unless you think that Marathon and BP are SPECIFICALLY targeting just your neighborhood. THEY must think you guys wield unbelievable political clout.....
What you MIGHT be seeing is simply the result of not enough competition, since your area is 'controlled' primarily by Marathon and BP. Perhaps if more folks bought their gas from other stations, you wouldn't have a problem.
"They didn't go up this time. Really odd. Guess it's just their benevolence according to your theory?"
Benevolence has NOTHING to do with the LAWS of supply and demand. 'Benevolence' only fits into YOUR theory that all the various companies get together and set the price. See, you've started with the premise that EVERY ONE of the oil companies are ALL in cahoots (that sort of conspiracy doesn't work if even ONE company doesn't follow along because that one company will simply undercut the other guys). Once you START with the premise they are all in cahoots, then it follows that EVERY price change (either up or down) MUST be due to something OTHER than supply/demand. It's either political, greed, 'benevolence' or whatever the reason du jour may be. And then whenever there's a price change (up or down), then you try to look at the situation from the perspective of "huh, now I wonder why THEY did that? It must be due to......." in this case, upcoming elections. But never supply/demand. Never. Under no circumstances could it EVER be supply/demand....
Under my theory, the various companies are all run by a bunch of greedy SOBs that would like nothing better than running the other guy out of business. And the way you do that is by offering a better product (service), or a better price, or a combination of the two. Since most folks perceive very little real difference from one brand of gasoline to another, the way to gain business is to undercut the other guys price. But since they ALL have essentially the same cost of doing business, and since the price of oil is set on the global market (unless you believe that ALL of the oil producing players are ALL in cahoots with EVERY futures trader), then it follows that the wholesale prices for gasoline would all be very very similar. And THEN what effects prices is ANTICIPATED supply/demand (since gas is sold on the wholesale level as 'futures').
The only thing political that I see happening is the grandstanding from certain government officials seeking to lauch YET ANOTHER round of government 'investigations' into 'price fixing' by that evil (eeeeevil I say) 'Big Oil'. Of course, these investigations go on ONLY when prices go up; never when the prices go down.
The operators at the stores get messages to raise prices from the company. Strange all these independent, by your theory, operators raise their prices to the same $2.899 within hours of each other. They're not independent moves.
>Marathon and BP are SPECIFICALLY targeting just your neighborhood.
Did anyone say "neighborhood"? I've seen the price rise for the majority of SW Ohio within a day.
>Perhaps if more folks bought their gas from other stations,
A friend told me there were only a limited number of suppliers of fuel in this area. Other stations are simply labeling the fuel from the other suppliers with their brand.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
"The operators at the stores get messages to raise prices from the company."
Alternate theory: the BP station owner's all receive word that their distributor is increasing the price of gas. They ALL anticipate that the next time they need a tanker load of fuel to restock their underground tanks, the price will be higher. Since all the local BP station owners are receiving fuel from the same distributor, wouldn't it make SENSE that wholesale gas price increases would result in 'strange' lockstep increases in the price of gas?
Or does it somehow make more sense that even though they all get gas from the same distributor (and pay the same wholesale price) that the only way to prove they were 'independent' would be to have wildly divergent reactions to the wholesale price? :confuse:
As a station owner (or even the owner of 2-3 stations), receiving word of an increase in the wholesale price from your distributor, would you:
a) keep selling your existing gas at the old price, leaving you somewhat short of cash when it comes time to refill your tanks....
or,
b) raise your prices so that you won't be AS short when it comes time to refill your tanks?
"I've seen the price rise for the majority of SW Ohio within a day."
Um, how many distributors in SW Ohio? Just because there may be 500 different gas stations doesn't mean they're all paying 500 different wholesale prices for their gas. My bet would be that there's very few distributors and that the wholesale price probably doesn't vary by more than a couple of cents. So if Distributor 'A' increases his price by 'X' amount, is it really any wonder that ALL the stations served by that distributor increase their price by a like amount?
"A friend told me there were only a limited number of suppliers of fuel in this area. Other stations are simply labeling the fuel from the other suppliers with their brand."
Um, yes. Kinda reinforces what I'm talking about.....
By your opinion if stations selling gas with price differences of $.15 all get a notice to increase by $.20 then they would end up higher but still with differences of $.15. However, as I've explained, they all end up at $2.899.
You should be able to figure that out.
The number of distributors I was told. My friend was involved with gas purchase for a city's fleet of vehicles. I don't recall the exact number but Marathon, BP, and Shell were on the list or the list, FWIW.
It's obvious we're never going to have a dialogue of agreement other than the conspiracy fetish you like to throw up. EOD.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
IIRC gas at my local Chevron was $2.94/3.04/3.14 Sunday...we've fallen some as everyone else, but we're a bit above the national average again...that wacky supply and demand no doubt.
If they're all receiving their marching orders from above, why are they $0.15 apart on the pump price prior to the price hike?
Some station owners try to sell the gas as cheap as feasible and hope to make their profit on volume. These stations (obviously) will sell more gas. Which means that their tanks empty quicker. Which means they need refills from the tanker trucks more often. Which means that these stations would be MORE sensitive to increases in the wholesale price of fuel.
Some station owners try to sell their gas for as much as they think the market will bear and hope to make more profit on each gallon. These stations (obviously) will sell less gas. Which means that their tanks take forever to empty. Which means they place fewer orders for refills (and can pick/choose when they buy gas). Which means these stations are LESS sensitive to increases in the wholesale price.
So, even though the stations may 'start' $0.15/gallon apart, when a wholesale price increase occurs, the cheapest stations SHOULD show the sharpest increase at the pump and the most expensive stations the least. And these changes would be immediate. As a few days go by, the pump prices will start to fall (due to COMPETITION between stations, something lacking in your conspiracy theory) with some falling faster (hoping to make profit due to volume of gas sold) and some falling very slowly (making more profit/gallon.)
IMO, you think that they ALL ended up at the same price because you're predisposed to believe they're all receiving the same marching orders and so when you see 3-4 stations with the same price (or within $.01), you think "aHA.....I THOUGHT so".
The next time you see one of the collective, mass increases so that ALL the stations are the same price, why not post a link to gasbuddy.com for your area and we can all witness this vast colusion amoung the stations in your area?
Frankly, I'd be surprised if the price spread in your area was ever, EVER, less than $0.10/gallon.
Look at the drop in price of a barrel of oil in the past week or so! Have you seen the price of gas drop that drastically?
OK, rhetorical question......
When you can see the price of gas rise on the same day with just a fractional increase in the price of a barrel, yet no decrease in gas prices takes place until a week or more after the price of a barrel drops drastically, you don’t have to be a rocket scientist to figure out why!
Example: Gas prices in Western, NY was at 2.99 for Plus about a month and a half ago, then the price of a barrel went up by a few dollars and presto, gas went up to 3.04 almost immediately.
The price of a barrel within the past 2 weeks dropped by more than $5.00 and yet our gas just went down and only went back to 2.99 a few days ago.
In the example above the drop in the price per barrel was 2 times more than the initial increase but yet the drop in gas prices did not reflect that!
If a price of a barrel goes up by $2.00 and the gas increases by 5 cents, then it stands to reason that if the barrel price drops by $5.00 then the drop in gas should be at least 10 cents!
I was born but it was not yesterday, the oil companies are playing games and should be flogged, tarred, feathered on public TV for all to see! This is how they are raising the prices and getting away with it!
Their marketing tactics are excellent; they have all their cronies putting out all sorts of different versions of why the prices rise.
Example: My Aunt Agnes had flatulence the other day and the gas prices went up, now doesn’t that sound stupid?
Well, that is exactly what I think of their lame lies and excuses! Fact is, they are insulting our intelligence with their shell game tactics!
And to top it all off, when the barrel prices does drop drastically and the gas is supposed to go down proportionately, they have all sorts of excuses for why that doesn't happen!
Give me a break!