Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

204meca

Personally I would say that for 90% of drivers, a T rated tire on a Forester should be fine, perhaps a little quieter, smoother, & better tread wear. I believe load rating is based more on tire size than speed rating. Some H rated tires have a max inflation of 44 psi, as do so T rated tires. You can look up that info for most brands at tirerack.com. Many tire dealers are hesitant to a lower load rating for perceived liability issues.

204meca

Now that I have my FXS back - minus the clutch judder - I have noticed that it has a fair amount of body roll on the corners (at least compared to my dear, recently departed Civic Si). I will be replacing OEM Yokos this November with either BFG Traction TA/ T or Kuhmo HP4s, but that won't do much for the body roll.

Are there any relatively easy (DIY), inexpensive mods that can be done that will signficantly reduce the body roll without negatively impacting the overall handling dynamics or ride (I don't want it any stiffer)? I am thinking perhaps a larger rear sway bar and or a strut tower brace. I believe that the stock rear sway bar on the XS is 17 mm. Does the XT or a WRX come have a larger sway bar (22mm? ) that will bolt right on and make a substancial difference?

Your thoughts and sources for body roll reduction would be much appreciated.

rdbandkab

thanks!

lfdal

Couple of things - I think someone on the board did a front sway bar mod and it was a nightmare, if I recall correctly.

I just did a rear sway bar - the 20mm from the Sti, and new mounts, with PolTec end links, and the PolTec bar collars. Worked slick and the car is definitely snappier in turns. Entire job is well spelled out on another site, grep sway bar and scooby from google. It should get you there.

There's some concern that the 22mm bar is too much for the rear links on the 04 XT's to handle. A couple of people with bigger bars have reported snapping off the weld where the new end links attach. This is usually the result of more robust autocross driving, but I've seen some Boston potholes that qualify as canyon driving, so it wouldn't surprise me if the same snapping would appear.

My understanding is that on the 05's and 06's the rear sway bar is already heavier. I've heard 22mm but can't confirm.

Also, there's collars / adapters available to beef up the rear links, but some people have just replaced them with the more expensive Sti or aftermarket links. Depends upon how hard you're going to push the envelope when you're done. Definitely get the weight off the rear wheels after the mod and make sure you can't flip that sway bar. Of course, use jack stands.

In my case the dealer's already made it clear that he's not going to warrant anything I did. I can agree with him re: PolTec equipment and non Subaru equipment, but I think he should at least warrant the Subaru equipment. At least he didn't try the "whole car warranty is invalidated scam" Them there would've been fightin words.

So far my modest list of mods is
1) Sti sway bar and mounts
2) PolTec endlinks and collars
3) Grillcraft scoop insert - best thing I ever did for my XT
4) Added a glove compartment light - that was so easy and simple I can't believe I put it off for almost two years
5) replaced the instrument cluster plastic with the one from the 05. The painted silver rings arouns the tach / speedo look much nicer.

HTH

Larry

ezshift5

The new mini-towel racks in the cargo area: would it be a fair statement that these are supplemental cargo tie-downs?

Still don't care for the new tail-lites, but all the young car dudes - - - gathered around this nice looking Champagne Gold Opal - - - that I informally quizzed liked 'em big time.........who knew?

best, ez......

wdaveo1

Now that the 2006's are showing up, would you expect there to be greater discounts on the 05's?

Are there any major differences between the 04, 05, and 06's that would make one a better choice over the other?

I'm all for saving money if I can get a low mileage 04 or 05...

Thanks,

Dawn

204meca

wdaveo1 There a number of discussions/threads on this topic from the month of May & early June. Plow thru them & you will probably find the answers you are looking for.

oluap

Ateixeira/juice asked me to post here from the Mazda5 forums. I have a '98 Forester S w/manual trans. It was bought at CarMax in August '03 w/82k miles, and has since had quite a few problems. I don't have the records in front of me, but here's a rough list of what has gone wrong in the past two years:

-Drive shaft bolt fell out, causing shaft to make violent rattling sound when delerating. This happened during a trip from Virginia to Massachusetts.
-A/C belt tensioner jammed itself into timing belt cover, frying the A/C belt and scraping against the timing belt. Replaced: A/C belt, A/C belt tensioner, timing belt cover, and timing belt.
-O2 sensors (check-engine light came on)
-Transmission-neutral switch failed (car was stalling when shifting to neutral)
-Speed sensor failed (speedometer was bouncing around or just showing 0)
-Clock-spring wiring ripped itself apart (airbag light on, horn and cruise didn't work)
-Front tie-rod had to be replaced for car to pass inspection

once_for_all

thanks for posting, none of these are "usual". From the sounds like, was the vehicle involved in any accidents/repairs from the previous owner(s)? Did it have any signs of abuse?

Note: tie rod perhaps front end accident related; drive shaft bolt, perhaps had to pull the engine/tranny out; A/C belt tensioner, maybe the pulley was bent out of alignment causing a bearing failure; tranny issues--pulling and replacing? wrecking yard tranny? Speed sensor--someone maybe messed with the odometer?

Hard to say, sorry about all the problems.

John

rambo5

I spoke with salesman from my two local dealerships in regards to when the 06 Forester will arrive on the lots. They both claimed that the car will not arrive for several weeks and possibly August. Are these gentleman blowing smoke? Is ignorance rampant in Upstate NY?

crashton6

All three Subaru dealers here in town in Ohio already have 06's in stock. Hard to say if they're blowing smoke or not. My guess is they'd rather have you buy one of the 05's they already have.

Chuck

tidester

Is ignorance rampant in Upstate NY?

Absolutely not, but there are isolated cases of rudeness.

tidester, host

cmuniz

The dealer in the small town of Spruce Pine, NC has one is stock so my guess is that they should be available in NY before Aug, if not now. Look for the Nissan Altima-looking tail lights on the 06 Forester as the most obvious clue they have arrived.

damish003

My dealer here in PA has several in stock. If you're close enough to the state line, come on down!

-Dan-

onlysurfer

I understand that there are a few cosmetic changes (such as head/tail lights etc) It'd be nice if someone can summarize major changes? Thank you.

ateixeira

Stock sways used to be tiny - 13mm, so I upgraded to 18mm. A lot wider and you risk oversteer, so just be careful. I also have a front strut tower brace so mine has a neutral balance in corners.

Since you're starting with 17mm, you will get diminishing returns. I've also heard the front ones are a bear to install. Maybe hire paisan to install it if you're in the tri-state area.

82k miles when purchased, eh? Does CarMax include any kind of warranty? I suspect they didn't really do a thorough inspection if all those problems slipped by.

2006 gets:

* turn signals in the mirrors
* clear lens tail lights
* projector beam headlights
* flip over cup holders for the rear seat
* rear seat arm rest
* 173hp (vs. 165) and AVLS (varies valve lift for high-rev breathing)
* about a 1/2" lift in the suspension
* new fabrics (same as Tribeca's cloth)

I think that's about it.

-juice

bluesubie

I put on an STi sedan RSB as well and it makes a nice noticeable difference. I didn't change the endlinks or add collars and haven't had any problems.

Switching to 17's makes it all come together nicely. Some other suspension options are Forester STi springs from your dealer; Forester STi take-off struts/springs from http://www.jdmpartstx.com/; or brand new adjustable STi struts and springs from http://www.rallispec.com/product-suspension.htm.

Sticking with only upgrading to an STi swaybar will probably be enough for you since you don't want a stiffer ride.

-Dennis

p0926

Also gets a nose job (new grill and slightly modified front end)

-Frank

204meca

>>Sticking with only upgrading to an STi swaybar will probably be enough for you since you don't want a stiffer ride.<<

I spend quite a bit of time reviewing posts about RSB. Yeah, I think a STi will satisfy provide the improvement in handling I am looking for.

204meca

It has been a week and about 250 miles since the clutch was replaced under warranty. The engagement from a start is now pretty smooth (not perfect). However, when changing gears -- especially if downshifting -- there is a little bit of shudder felt when the clutch is engaged. Should I be concerned about this at this stage?

ateixeira

Try to match revs if you downshift, in fact take it easy in general for the first 1000 miles. I'd treat this like another break-in period.

-juice

veritasusa

I can't find a reference to this in searching the Forester forums.

Can anyone tell me if the STI rear sway bar will also fit the LL Bean model with the self-leveling suspension?

onlysurfer

06 doesn't get Side Curtain Airbags? I think CRV, RAV4, Tribute etc already have them or plan to offer in 06. (Sorry if this is discussed before but I'm new to the group and haven't found reference to it)

p0926

Nope. The Forester's current side airbags do provide head protection but only to the frontseat passengers.

-Frank

ateixeira

No, and that's probably because Forester already earned a "Good" from the IIHS and 5 stars front/5 stars back from NHTSA in side impact tests.

It would be hard to convince the bean counters that there is a need, basically. I wouldn't want to be the guy presenting that proposal:

For about $400 extra per unit, the already good results won't improve at all, but we can pretend they did! )

veritasusa: they should, the self-leveling is built-in to the shocks themselves and should not affect the sway bars at all.

-juice

onlysurfer

"Good" from IIHS and 5 star front/back works for me, I'll be replacing my VW Passat Sedan in Nov and so many to choose from! So far, my list has following front runners - Audi A3, BMW 325xi, VW Passat Wagon, Mazda 3 and Forester. List also includes CRV, RAV4, Pilot and Highlander. It sure would be nice if there is some sort of car-club to join where I can choose different model every month (or every six months)

Suggestions welcome.

ateixeira

Funny thing is the Forester scores better than the Legacy sedan, which has the curtains. Now go convince the bean counters. ;-)

A3 - love it but it's tiny. Only if you have 0 kids. 2.0FSI is a hoot but add quattro and options and it's pricey.

325xi - too pricey for a compact IMHO, but very nice if price is no object. A little short on power given the weight. About to be replaced.

Passat wagon - nice but also being replaced. Roomy. 1.8T is fun with a manual. Poor service and reliability is iffy at best.

Mazda3 - cool little car, you can even get NAV on those. V50 is roomier, I wish the 3s was shaped more like a wagon and less like a hatch.

Forester - opt for the XT and all the others here will eat your dust.

CR-V - a bit less fun than the others here. Back seat is a limo.

RAV4 - look closely, it's really a 4 seater. 2.4l engine is an improvement over the 2.0l.

Pilot - compared to the others here it's a monster, huge inside and out, feels a lot more bulky. This would be my pick of this list only if you have 3+ kids.

Highlander - great on paper but it still makes me yawn. Maybe if TRD got its hands on one and really made it handle well.

Depends on my budget and my needs, but I'd cross shop a Mazda 3s 5 door, A3 Quattro, and Forester XT.

-juice

onlysurfer

Thanks Juice, At the moment, Forester XT looks like the winner. I've one toddler and this vehicle will be for daily commute including one way trips to day care center plus weekend trips. Passat Sedan is fun to drive but cargo is limited, besides, now I have the firsthand experience of poor service and reliability, still Passat keeps coming back on the list due to driving characteristics. A3/A4, 325xi are desirable, partly due to badge, but price is certainly an issue. Pilot/Highlander made it to the list just because of that, they cost about the same but offers a lot more value, especially for those weekend trips; I almost certainly won't like driving them everyday though. Vibe and Matrix are in mind but they are underpowered. Mazda 3s 5 door is nice but 4WD is preferred in bean town Boston. (I know, A3, the one I would want to buy, won&#146;t be offered in AWD model)

Decisions...decisions...decisions. That&#146;s the best part of car buying, like that VW advt, blister continues to grow on my forehead!

ateixeira

I'd at least wait to see the new one, the current one dates back to 1998 or so with only one mild face-lift.

VWs are funny, they have avid fans on one side and then people that were burned and would never (under any circumstances) buy another. Pretty polarizing.

-juice

smittynyc

Last night I was driving with the windows down, and I heard a slight click coming from underneath the car as I slowed for stop signs or red lights. This happened during shifts from third to second, and from second to first.

I have a 2004 Forester X AT. Transmission fluid level looks fine, and there aren't any other symptoms -- slipping, noises, harsh downshifts, etc. I'm bringing the car in for 15K service in about a month, but I was wondering if I should have it checked out sooner?

Thanks.

onlysurfer

VW is a bit of a cult type thing, I didn't realize that until I owned one. Unfortunately, I got burned but still feel like giving VW another chance, fact remains that this is the only affordable European brand available in America. Good news is that it's possible to get comparable ride quality from Japanese or American manufacturers, so the little part that will be missed by not owning a VW would be the "distinction"...

ateixeira

That can be good and bad - parts prices might be higher. Plus they build a lot of cars in Mexico and Brazil, and those aren't known for their quality. I think Passat is an exception though.

-juice

toasterpilot

When has anything good come out of Brazil, Juice? O.K., maybe the music, coffee and Juice. :lemon:

sduford

That's because they are great cars, fun to drive. And while they have pretty bad reliability, lots of people have no problems with them. For example, in a recent survey, the Touareg had the worst reliability of all cars, with 48% of owners reporting problems. As bad as that is, that still leaves a whopping 52% of owners who are quite happy.

204meca

I believe the rear sway bar is the same 17 mm in all Foresters. Contact Allsubaru.com, they should be able to tell you today.

Just got my 20mm STi RSB today. I will probably do the install this weekend. Hope it is as easy as it sounds.

onlysurfer

Speaking of reliability, how good is Subaru, particularly, Forester XT and Outback 2.5 XT.

VW could be made outside of Europe but it still has that European ride quality. Perhaps it's all about that multi-link rear suspension? I was told that Passat is made side-by-side with Audi A4 in Germany but I care less about where it is made compare to how well it is made.

By the way, which one would you choose from these two Subaru models, and why? I have never owned Subaru but come November, this may be the first.

ozman62

Sly wrote "...in a recent survey, the Touareg had the worst reliability of all cars, with 48% of owners reporting problems. As bad as that is, that still leaves a whopping 52% of owners who are quite happy. "
No, that leaves 52% that haven't had reportable problems. It doesn't necessarily mean that all of those 52% are happy. But probably some of them are..
Owen (in a quibbling mood)

njswamplands

ateixeira

What good has come out of Brazil?

Soccer
Coffee
Samba
Bossa Nova
Gisele

)

The current Passat shares a platform with the A4, but the new one won't.

The Jetta and Golf didn't get an indy rear suspension until just recently. I believe they used torsion beams, like most minivans do, up to the Golf IV.

VW also still uses heavy cast iron blocks, even the new 2.0FSI engine.

In some ways they are very advanced but in others they trail.

Forester XT vs. Outback XT?

Forester is more frisky, quicker, more fun. Better city car, smaller though so better for 0-1 kids.

Outback is really nice, IMO, and roomier. Longer wheelbase makes it a good highway distance cruiser, but it needs more room to park too. Better if you have 2 kids.

I'm more into driving fun that space and luxury, so my pick would be the Forester XT.

-juice

PF_Flyer

Can't wait to see what the full moon will bring up in the chat tonight...LOL

PF Flyer
Host
News & Views, Wagons, & Hybrid Vehicles

The Subaru Crew Chat is on tonight. The chat room opens at 8:45PM ET Hope to see YOU there! Check out the schedule

bluesubie

Hope it is as easy as it sounds.
It is. Just be careful not to overtighten the nut on the brackets (the bolt is made into the bracket). I snapped mine on the first try and removed it and ordered a new one.

I learned how to do the install using "Peaty's" site.

-Dennis

toasterpilot

I forgot about soccer, but you forgot Tropicalismo, Milton Nascimento and Hermeto.

mckeown

Factory US spec Rear Sway bar on 98-02 Foresters is 13mm. An Impreza/Sti/WRX 17, 18, or 20 will bolt directly on.
Starting in 03 to 05 NON Turbo is 17mm. I can't find the Spec on the XT, so won't even guess.

lfdal

At least on the 04 XT's its still 17mm. I heard the 05's went to a heavier bar.

Just did my XT's so I'm sure about the 04 @ 17mm.

HTH

Larry

ericf1

Driving on Rte 9 here in MetroWest Boston I am pretty sure I was right behind a brand new '06 Forester. It didn't have dealer plates either.

Time to go down to my local Subaru dealer.:)

ateixeira

Bob said Fitz has them listed in their on-line inventory, too.

Yep - an XT Limited auto (basically loaded to the gills) is 26 and change. 21/26 mpg for a 230hp turbo, yum.

-juice

eps105

I was at my dealer yesterday to get some warranty work done on my 2003 XS (would you believe it was exactly 3 years old yesterday and had 35820 miles -- not a bad way to take the warranty to the limits! )

ANYWAY, they had a handful of 2006 Foresters on the lot and in the showroom, and at least 8 - 10 Tribecas.

In short, the differences between the 2003 XS Premium and 2006 X Premium are seemingly substantial -- just about every touch point in the interior has changed since 2003 -- the new 6-disc changer, improved climate control, 3-spoke steering wheel, improved armrest, improved gauge cluster, better upholstery, etc., etc., not to mention the added boost in engine power and fuel economy.

Yet, there's several nagging yet menial omissions that I was hoping they would add, but alas they have not, so I will be waiting until the 2008 redesign. The omissions include the continued lack of front-seat lighting at night due to the dome light being in the back seat when you have a sunroof; the lack of a glove compartment light; and most important to me, still no steering wheel audio controls.

Despite that, it is a worthy improvement and still the best compact SUV on the market. (I am especially happy that they improved the cloth upholstery. To me, the 2003 XS cloth was so cheap looking that I bought the leather just to avoid the cloth.)

Elliot

204meca

at least when you don't have all the right parts. :sick: I am a bit frustrated as I spent the last hour taking off the factory 17mm RSB & attempted to install the larger 20mm STi RSB. Removing the old one was very easy, but I could not get the larger 20mm bushings to squish into the original bushings clamps. :mad:

My impression was that all besides the new bar all that was needed was the larger bushings. Perhaps some have managed to use the smaller clamps, but after struggling to get the new bushings in the old clamps remounted I thru in the greasy towel! Perhaps I am missing some secret trick, but retrospectively, it just makes sense that larger clamps are better.

So I rebolted on the 17mm bar. Will call allsubaru.com Monday & order the larger clamps. With the proper parts & my newly acquired experience, it should take less than a half hour to do the job.

If I am missing any other details on this install, please do tell.

chaynes

If you are sitting in a Regional Jet awaiting takeoff, look out toward the wing tip. If it doesn't curve upward at the tip (a winglet, as on a Canadian Bombardier RJ) it is an Embraer made in Brazil. They practically own the RJ market and are looking seriously at Bizjets.

BTW, I just turned 60K in less than 3 years on my 03 XS and bought another set of Geolanders. Have read much mud tossed at them, but they have served me well. Would have gotten more mileage out of them but my curb-bumping messed-up the wheel alignment and shortened the life of the fronts. Anyway, I'm looking forward to another trouble-free 60K from this puppy on the way to 240K.

hypov

Larger clamps? :confuse:
I think they are one-size-fits-all.
It took alot of effort, for me, to mount the "clamps" with the new bushings.
The existings will fit.

Were you installing the RSB with wheels off the ground?

-Dave