Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

lark6

Hi, Chris. I live on the other end of the state from you, between Philly and Easton. Our demographics sound similar except we have no dog. My wife has an older Accord. I bought a 2000 Forester S in January 2000 and currently have 30,700 miles on it. I agree with your initial assessments of the Forester, both pro and con. I do not drink enough in the car to make cupholders a deterrent to purchase. My Forester came with the premium sound package that includes tweeters in the upper door panels and a small subwoofer under the driver's seat. It does leave a bit to be desired; I blew out a front speaker about 3 months ago and replaced all the speakers expect the tweeters with a DIY upgrade from Crutchfield. It is now adequate, but not spectacular.

Mechanically my Forester has not been perfect. I had a fuel gauge sender failure at less than 10K miles which was repaired under warranty. I had two rear wheel bearing failures at 8K and 13K miles that were repaired under warranty. Both failures were attributed to improper installation of the bearing; the first from the factory, the second by the dealer technician. The second failure was addressed with the involvement of SoA, whose Patti Mickel (now a regular on this forum) and Susan Hopf helped me reach a quick and satisfactory conclusion. The Forester has been defect free since then.

In shopping for the Forester my selection process went as follows: Chevy Silverado 4x4 -> Nissan Frontier Crew Cab -> Nissan Xterra -> Audi A4 Avant -> Subaru Legacy GT wagon -> Forester. Some logic there though maybe hard to explain. I had issues with the Xterra's seating position and the nasty attitude of the Nissan dealer who suggested I was too old for the Xterra (I was 36 at the time). I cannot speak for the Tribute beyond its early - and scary - recall problems. The Outback has greater rear seat room than the Forester, but I don't see that as an issue for any future children you may have until they're at least 10 years old (not knowing how tall you and your wife are, that is.)

The Forester has been a great car for what I want and need it to do; the OEM tires have been adequate under our winter conditions but could be better in warm weather and on dry pavement. I find that the more I drive it the better I like it, and I want to find new conditions under which to test its limits. I have taken it off-roading and rough-roading successfully, within reason (i.e., not trying to climb boulders or cross over large tree trunks).

Long story short, I have no problems recommending the Forester to you for use in Pennsylvania.

Sorry to be so long winded.

Ed

p0926

Chris- The Outback is a little bigger. It has more rear seat room and slightly larger cargo capacity. It's also more along the lines of a traditional wagon while the Forester is closer to "mini-SUV" territory. The Forester is somewhat more capable off-road but you wouldn't want to take either too far off the beaten path. Both are excellent vehicles, it really comes down to personal preference. You should certainly look at an Outback and take it for a spin.

-Frank P.

kens

Chris,

I'm also married with no kids and I love the utility of the Forester. It has enough cargo room to haul around my gear, but it's small and nimble enough to make everyday driving fun.

The OB is a good choice too. It's more expensive, but you get more luxury features, bigger cargo and passenger space, but the power-to-weight ratio is not as good as the Forester. The OB has a different feel to it -- try one.

The Tribute V6 will probably have the best power out of the bunch. It's also quite roomy, but unfortunately, it's an Escape twin. We've all seen how many problems those have had.

The 2002 CR-V is a new model. Honda upped the engine displacement in this new model based on all the complaints of the old anemic engine. It's brand new, but you may want to try it. Unfortunatley, Honda didn't change the part-time AWD system in the CR-V. It still has one of the most unsophisticated AWD systems of the bunch.

Ken

asplundh

You guys were right, my CEL went out so it must have been the gas cap.

Thanks,
Mike

leomort

Did anyone read Edmund's review on the Forester?What did they mean the Forester isn't as "versatile" as other mini-SUV? I'm curious in what ways are they talking not being as verstatile?

Leo

pal086

I have been trying to read most of the near 3000 posts on this board and elsewhere regarding the Forester. Apart from the usual complaint about the location of the cup-holders and few negatives about the sound-system, the following three seems to be the most common complaints:

1. Wheel bearings: quite a few people had to change it and a number of times.

2. Oxygen sensors gets knocked, again a number of times for various people

3. Excessive tire wear.

We have just ordered a 2002 Forester S Premium with leather and a few other goodies. However, I am a little worried about these above problems. While I don't mind the cup-holder positioning (audio seemed okay to me), I really don't feel like having a car that I have to take to the dealer every so often for things other than routine maintainance. I have had enough of that from my last car. The only solace I have is that most of he problems described above have occurred in 98-2000 models. I am really keeping my fingers crossed that Subaru got enough complaints on these to make a permanent fix for them in the 2002 models. Could some other 2002 model owners comment on their experiences ?

We decided on the Forester after comparing it with the Honda CRV and OB Limited and OB LL Bean.

I liked the CRV for the Honda reliability, roominess and the fact that our local dealer is letting the SEs go for about 100$ over invoice. However, the acceleration was just AWFUL -- the worst I have seen anywhere -- the engine groaned like crazy while I was trying to merge into the highway. The biggest negative was that my wife had problems with the 'more horizontal' (I don't know how else to put it) position of the steering wheel in CRVs. She is short and had to keep her hands raised all the time to hold the wheel and starts feeling numb in her hands. We tried three test drives with different seating and steering positions but the problem remained. That more or less excluded the CR-V. The other thing against CR-V was of course its poorer crash test ratings than Forester and the availability of 4-channel ABS and side airbags in the Forester

The Forester of course accelerates and handles better than the CR-V. I also liked the romminess of the front seats when compared to the OB Wagons(Its probably psychological due to the large windshield ). The Forester seemed to have a better zip while accelerating than the OB H4 and almost same as the H6 Bean. Then of course we loved that huge sunroof. Final consideration was of course $$s. The Forester S Premium with leather was about 1500 less than the Limited OB and almost 4000 less than the Bean.

So that was how we came to order the Forester. I am expecting it in mid-November. I will probably, like so many Forester owners on this board, just love the car once I start driving it regularly.

But right now I am losing a lot of sleep thinking if I made the right choice on reliability (should I wait for the 2002 CR-Vs ??) before the car comes in.

Some solace and comfort might help )

armac13

I can only speak from my own experience with Rufus (Forester S MY2001, auto) but it has been the most reliable vehicle I have ever owned. I bought my first new car in 1968 so I do have a bit of experience. The only problem I had was a noisy hatch latch, promptly repaired. Otherwise he has been a total gentleman despite being asked to tackle some outrageous forestry roads and other minor abuse. Over the years I have purchased English, French, German, Japanese and even (to my regret and shame) 2 American cars. After almost a year and a half of ownership, the Forester has been the best in terms of initial quality and reliability (my Toyota was second best) and it's fun to drive as well. Your mileage, of course, may vary. Good luck.

Ross

beachfish

...that the new CR-V will be what you want AND have all of the bugs worked out of it? Honda makes good stuff, but they don't do everything right either. Look at that lousy steering wheel in the current CR-V(my cousin has one) - they stole the horizontal layout from the bus company and put it in a car. No, no, no. Not good at all.

I took delivery of an '02 Forester w/leather on 9/1 and think you should get one too. Of course, I did all of my second guessing ahead of time. I paid for mine on a Friday night and picked it up at noon Saturday.

SUV = Subaru Utility Vehicle

Speaking of my cousin who gets a new car every two years or so, the only thing she didn't like about my Forester was that it wasn't hers

John

beatfarmer

And you want to test drive an '02 CR-V, wait a little and test drive onw. They will be out in November. That way you get a complete picture as to what is available. If you can't wait a couple of weeks, get the Forester and be happy.

rangerron7

We have a 2000 OB Ltd and 2002 Forester and everyone has been right on the mark in comparing these two models. The only thing that I would add is that the OB rides a bit more refined and quieter than the Forester. On the other hand, the Forester is definitely more fun to drive and whip into and out of corners. Seating position is also a bit more upright in the Forester. I would also agree that there is a bit more cargo room and more back seat room in the OB.
Ron

jim_loves_cars

Chris - It seems like your problem is a good one - too many quality vehicles to choose from :P My folks have an Outback Limited and my sister-in-law has a Forester. I'm happy to say that everyone loves their Subaru's, especially when it snows.

I'm going to be buying a new vehicle myself in a couple of months and am torn between a few subies and the CRV. I'm waiting to test the new CRV before making a purchase decision. It has a new engine and a refined transmission that should (according to Car & Driver) remedy the current vehicle's anemic powertrain.

The new CRV should have considerably more interior space than the Forester. This is important if you find yourself suddenly "ready" for kids. My wife is due to have our first in a couple of weeks and we just bought a Honda Odyssey minivan. After toting my two-year-old nephew around for a week, I'm glad we had the room. A CRV might give you more long-term lifestyle flexibility.

That said, the Subies seem to have a superior AWD system and Subaru dealers are, well, dealing. Honda is going to try to sell the new CRV at MSRP for the first little bit as they gauge demand.

All told, I'd probably lean toward the Outback Wagon. It's bigger than a Forester, has Subie AWD and you can get a good deal right now. Now if you like performance, there's always the WRX wagon...:')

kens

pal086 Oct 24, 2001 12:04pm

Rest easy. You've made a great choice with the Forester. Remember, you're getting a 2002 model -- Subaru has had four years to continually improve the model.

I think the items you mention are relatively minor concerns:

1. Wheel bearings: quite a few people had to change it and a number of times.

True, but the problem seemed to be with the improper installation of the wheel bearings. I'm sure SOA has clamped down on that by now.

2. Oxygen sensors gets knocked, again a number of times for various people

02 sensors are not made by Subaru (Bosch, if I recall). There are occasional bad batches that result in premature failure, usually pretty close to each other. My Forester has been fine, but my VW has gone through 2 of them in one year.

3. Excessive tire wear

First thing to keep in mind is that OE tires are usually not the best you can get. I don't know too many that last beyond 40K miles. Since you've purchased the Premium S (nice choice, BTW) you'll be getting the Geolandars. These are far better than the Bridgestones that come with the L models. My Geolandars lasted me about 45K miles with relatively even wear. I think that's fair considering they're H-rated tires with a treadwear rating of 200.

Instead of losing sleep, have some nice dreams about your Forester!

Ken

alanwg

Frank, Juice, Mike, and all,

I've been reading here that the Subaru extended warranty ("Added Security") costs $1000 and assume that is an average since there are 48 plan combinations to choose from (Classic or Gold, years/miles, $0 or $50 or $100 deductibles). Prices range from $198 to $2258.

I was told by my Subaru dealer that this ("Added Security") was the only contract backed by Subaru. And, he wrote on the plan that 75% of my money would be returned if the plan was not used. This is not the only dealer doing this and it is not a new offer. The others I knew who got it have a '99 and '00, purchased new.

I did not ask if the 75% return deal was transferable, mostly because I plan to keep the Forester a LONG time. But, I will ask and report.

Is this only available in the Western division?
I've written Subaru, but haven't heard back.

By the way, the maximum coverage offered (Gold Plan = B2B) is 7 years/100,000 miles.

Alan G.

paisan

Yep my dad has the Gold B2B 7/100K, $0 deductible.

Most of the plans are refundable, and are also pro-rated based on how much you have used of it. The std. subaru plans are available anywhere outside the New England Region.

-mike

p0926

pal086- I think Ken did a good job of allaying your concerns. I might add for clarification purposes that the relatively few posts I've seen complaining about the tires all pertain to the L model's tires. I've not seen one complaint about the S model's Geolanders. I know I've got 23k on mine and there's plenty of tread left. There certainly have been more complaints about the CEL (I for one had the same sensor go bad twice). However, it appears that Subaru has finally used up the bad batch since I've seen very few complaints recently. Also, improperly installed wheel bearings were a problem with earlier model Foresters but that problem seems to have been fixed.

Still, if you don't need a new vehicle right now, maybe you should wait and check out the new CRV. Personally, I'm confident that the Forester will prove itself a better all around vehicle but you might feel different. I'd hate to see you get the Forester now and then regret the decision in a couple of months.

-Frank P.

pal086

Thanx a lot to everyone for their advice. Slept a lot better last night )
And of course I have been dreaming about it almost every night. I really loved the car (SUV!) after test driving it.

Anyway, just to let you all know that one that we ordered is a Black '02 Forester S Premium Package with leather (The one I test drove was a black too and was really impressed by the color). I also added the Autodimming mirror/compass, Full dash woodgrain trim, security upgrade, upgraded speakers, tweeter kit and a rear differential protector. Getting it all for about $24,800 pre taxes.

Can anyone tell me if the moon-roof air deflector is really worth it and if I should for an aftermarket for it. Dealer is charging $75. Read one post here where someone installed a deflector from Pep-boys that reduced the buffering noise at high speeds when the moonroof is opened.

Will give more details once we our hands on the car!

nygreg

Sounds great. The only thing I see a problem with is that winter is too close for you to really enjoy that outrageous moonroof.

Greg

beachfish

If it makes a difference, somebody let me know

I've had my '02 Forester for nearly two months and don't see a need for a air deflector. I know I ruined my hearing many years ago, but I enjoy riding at 70 or 75 m.p.h. with the sunroof wide open and the windows half down.

I did slide the front crossbar back out of the way to the improve the view.

John

caperosier

My post about the L OEM tires -- Bridgestone Dueler HT -- is a critique of Subaru. These tires are dangerous and useless in any kind of cold weather found in most of North America. SOA needs to disclose this to its major market consumers.
NO response about this from Subaru. Not good business practice.
Treadwear burnout below 30K for a non-performance, non-touring tire is silly at best. Why even sell this or, for that matter, put them on a vehicle mostly used in temperate regions?
Bridgestone did offer a 50% off on any of their line for replacement because of "premature wear.". Generous, but we chose to go with Michelin Symmetry.

mtbe

Please help with recommending new tires for Forester S. My driving is mainly highway, some city. Some ice and wet snow in Columbus, OH. I also drive curvy, hilly roads on weekends in South Ohio.

My Geolanders have been shot since about 35K, and I have 50K now. Procrastination will kill me! I looked at Michilen X-Ones but they are very expensive!

Please help

mtbe

I've had hesitation problems since I bought the car in late '98. It is a manual Forester '99. The first winter, I thought I just had to get use to it, and hey, it cleared up in late February! Then the following winter, the same thing, then I noticed more posts of others having the same problem. Last winter, thankfully, I was travelling for work, so didn't drive it much. Of course, I took it in several time, but they could not duplicate the problem. Got my special number from SOA 800 number. NOW WHAT?

I'm dreading this winter!!!! With the low percentage manual foresters sold, I imagine the complaint percentage is fairly high. But nothing is being done!

This is pathetic on SOA's part. I have been very happy with the car, but don't know if I can live another winter like this. I will definately be warning potential buyers about this issue! I hear the same problem is in the WRXs! Negative issues like this will only hurt Subaru's reputation. Why are they not doing anything about it?

Vent...vent...vent!

David

paisan

How could there be the same problem in the wrxs? They haven't been here in wintertime?

-mike

kens

50K! You better change those tires quickly!

If you don't have heavy winters then it you'll probably be okay with some all-season tires.

Michellins are great tires, but very expensive. I've always been a fan of Yokohama and Dunlop.

Try checking out the Tire Rack for some recommendations in the performance category that fits you.

Some tires that have been rated well are:

Yokohama Aegis
Goodyear Aquatread 3
Dunlop SP Sport A2 (replacements for A2 D60 JLB)

Ken

stever

Check out the Tires, tires, tires board too. If you have your heart set on the Michelins the same tire is sold at Costcos, Sams, etc., rebranded as the X Radial Plus, for a bit cheaper.

Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

p0926

David- What kind of hesitation problems? Could you provide more specifics? This is the first I've heard of any hesitation problem.

FYI: I believe approx 20% of Foresters sold are MT

-Frank P.

danm10

pal086 et al.,

How was the negotiating experience? Seems like they moved well off MSRP including your add-ons but any trade-in variable makes it hard to tell from here. Anyone have recent experience "in willingness to deal" off MSRP in Chicago-area that i can use as benchmark? Winter's coming soon here!

pal086

We went to a no haggle dealership near Rochester, NY (Vanbortel Subaru). They charge $200 over invoice for the car and 30% over the factory cost of the accessories. These prices, I believe are similar to what carsdirect.com is charging. So it should be a pretty good benchmark. ( I can send you the figures if you want)

They have also given me a more or less acceptable value for our trade-in, but since the Forester is not due till at least mid November, we are trying to sell it ourselves now.

Good luck with your shopping !

danm10

Pal, thnx for the offer of the data but let me do some other homework first. also, if experience with my acura is at all comparable, the wind deflector will limit the buffetting that occurs especially when all windows are up & travelling at speed - installing it was straightforward on this car. based on the size of sub monroof, i'd gues it should be even more useful.

nygreg

David: Check out November's issue of CR. They did a review of tires. Tires rated good in snow are: Yokohama Aegis LS4s (just put some on my Sienna), Goodrich T/A M65s, Uniroyal Tiger Paws. Other very good tires with average snow performance: Michelin x-ones ($$$), Pirelli P400. I bought the Yokohamas from tirerack and had them installed at Costco for $9/tire. Total cost was $260 for 4 tires (215 65 R15). Pretty good. Not sure which tire comes in the Forester's size.

Greg

outback165

Can you be more specific re hesitation... I have a hesitation problem with my 01 Outback since 1200 miles. Service Manager and District Service Rep can replicate it. Annoying as h*ll but registered. (Doesn't help when you're trying to cross an intersection and a Mack truck is barrelling in at you!)

Best,

-OB165

nygreg

Sometimes I get a slight hesitation from stop when I floor it. It typically will happen the first time I floor it, but not subsequently. Is this similar to yours?

Greg

paisan

Interesting. My buddy had a hesitation problem on his 2.5RS '00 Only as idle speed like when in traffic and beggining to hit the gas hard. Unfortunately he totalled the car before he was able to get to a dealer to have it diagnosed.

-mike

scirocco22

pal-- I agree with John and am doing the same thing he does with mine and am not bothered by the buffeting noises, etc. It's probably a good idea to wait and see how much it bothers you before actually buying the deflector ...and remember, there's a built-in mini-deflector already installed too that helps somewhat.

David-- I got your e-mail and responded back but I don't think you received it because I'm having some probelems with my e-mail server. I did post what I wrote in the email in response to your thread over at VMag so I won't repost it here. I agree with the findings that Greg came up about the Consumer Reports article but those he mentioned don't happen to come in the 215/60-16 size. Some of them may come in the 225/60-16 but I'm one who prefers to stay with the OEM size when replacing tires if at all possible. I suppose that's part of the reason that I'm leaning toward the Touring T/As. I haven't yet checked out the Dunlops that Ken mentioned.

--'rocco

outback165

My hesitation is wierd. First I thought it happened after I reversed, shifted in drive, and turned the wheel while accelerating (and thought it might be binding) ... but then I found instances where it happened and the wheel was not turned (there goes that theory!). Then I thought, maybe it's only when I accelerate hard (ie intersection and Mack truck) but then I found instances where I was pulling away from my house nice and slow, and it happens. One thing for sure, I can't MAKE it happen, which means SOA can document it, which means they can't diagnose, repair, and test. SOOOO, District Service Rep said it's in the record and to wait until it's worse ... unless a Mack truck gets me first! Today I had it occur pulling out of a parking space I had backed into. So no backing up, and no turning. It actually felt like the car was choking on the gas. This was the longest it ever happened for...

ANYONE with a hesitation problem... PLEASE report to SOA, not just your local dealer. PLEASE try to take notes of when it occurs (instructions from my District Service Rep) ie RPMs, MPH, etc. I am hearing more and more about this, yet SOA is stumped... My dealer and district rep have been great about working with me, so from that stand point, I'm very happy with Subaru. District rep came down to meet with me and plug her computer into my car and went for a ride with me, so from that standpoint, no complaints... if on the car had hesitated with the computer hooked up!

Anyhow - still love the car!

-OB165

pattim3

FYI - the refund for Added Security

It is not something that we (SOA) do, but individual dealers may offer to do that. I'd make sure I got it in writing from the dealer because it won't be on the actual agreement.

Hope this helps.

Thanks!

Patti

pattim3

Please call the 800 number and ask the Rep. to review your case with me. I'll do my best to "move things along". - Promise -

Patti

pattim3

Hi - I think I responded to you before, but I guess you missed it??

We have no record of receiving any communications from you via e-mail. If you would like to re-send it, I'm sure you will get a prompt response. FWIW - It appears that the tire company (who is resonsible for your tires) did offer to help you. But, we still like to keep track of consumer comments.

Patti

outback165

Thanks for your offer, but I don't want the regional rep to think that I'm not happy. Acutally the service manager and district rep have been doing a great job. If I need to though, I will get this on your desk. Thanks for the offer!

-OB165

p0926

Patti- Has anyone told you lately how much we appreciate having you here? You're the greatest!

I wonder when the other car companies will catch on to the tremendous amount of goodwill that can be generated by listening and responding to complaints on boards like Edmund's. And at least in SOA's case, at virtually no cost. I just hope that SOA appreciates what you're doing here and rewards you somehow. Wait a minute, you're driving a new WRX, never mind.

-Frank P.

ateixeira

Hmm, Mid Atlantic, no kids, want AWD/ABS and good cargo room. Reminds me of me, when I was first shopping. :-)

I picked a Forester L and it's been great to me. We indeed started a family, and it's proven very user-friendly for parents. No buttons to push for AWD, no problems, 25mpg, low step in, low cargo lift up, nice roof rack, cargo liner standard, etc.

Why Forester and not the others you mentioned? Active AWD. Forester with manual trannies have a 50/50 AWD torque split, so they don't feel like FWD and manage traction proactively. Automatics start at 80/20 but even hitting the gas pedal shifts torque to the rear axle, so you aren't very likely to begin slippping. Plus, no torque steer. Hyundai Sante Fe and Toyota RAV4 use similar full-time systems.

Read the brochures for the CR-V, Escape, Tribute, and Vue. All are FWD. Yes, after you slip, they go to AWD mode, but that's after you have lost traction, then they react.

Subaru also has a long warranty, 5/60 on the powertrain, plus roadside assistance for 3 years. Payload is the best of the bunch. Towing is probably more than you'll ever need, and I've already been further off road than you'll ever require.

I say compare to the Hyundai and Toyota, maybe even the Highlander (also full-time AWD) if you can afford it.

-juice

nygreg

My very occasional, very minor hesitation is not even something I am concerned about. It only happens once in a while, the first time I floor the gas from a dead stop. It feels like one of the cylinders misfired. It could be that I do not do this often and the computer is use to my usual driving habits. It could also be that split second it takes to transfer the power from the wheels that slip to the.........

Greg

kens

I second Frank's comment about how much we appreciate having Patti here.

How many other car companies do you know of that actually will allow an employee to officially be a part of an owner's club and empower them to help customers? It really makes a difference when you (the customer) knows that you concerns and views are being communicated.

I really hope Patti's getting recognition for what she's accomplished here.

Patti -- Need any good references? Just ask us! BTW, which do you like better the WRX or the GT?

Ken

caperosier

Sorry Patti, no response is no response. Please read the stated problem with Subaru's choice of OEM tires for a vehicle marketed mainly to temperate regions.
Yes, Bridgestone was generous with their offer AND response to their product's performance.
The situation has not changed nor has the question to Subaru here and on your site: " why sell an AWD vehicle used for cold weather safety with tires that are dangerous (not just marginal) in snow, on ice, in slush, in cold rain. Should Fuji, Subaru, or SOA (your choice) disclose to consumers that the OEM tires are NOT for their region?"
This buyer and user is justifiably not pleased. Again: we're not in Dallas, Orlando, or Paris. Below freezing water changes to something else. Proper tires are needed.

hciaffa

I don't know if this is the same problem but back in 98,99 and 2000 many Outback and Forester owners were complaining about a hesitation problem and up on the old Vmag forum for Outbacks and Foresters this fellow posted a cure for it. He went by the name of hobiegary and to the surprise of Subaru it worked. They were a little annoyed because a backyard mechanic figured out the problem. The knock sensor was so sensitive that it would detect engine noise and thus retard the timing so much creating hesitation. His cure was to place a phenolic or teflon spacer between the the engine block and sensor body and most of the time it worked. Subaru couldn't beleive that the cure was that simple. But anyway it work and I think there was a TSB from SOA to change the Sensor to a less sensitive one. I believe this guys web site is still up I went to it a couple of months ago to refresh myself and to see if this might help my pinging problem which it didn't. This guys web site is www.geocities.com/hobiegary/hesitation.htm
See if its stillactive and read what he devised. Again this may not pertain to your problem but it was a nightmare for many in 98 and 99.

canadatwo

Engine? Low pressure turbo 2.5?

Design?

Release Date? Spring (like the new Impreza's)?

?????

Looking at the new 2002 CRV and need a reason to hold out for the 2003 Forester.

kens

The hesitation issue that Hugo mentions affected only manual tranny 2.5L DOHC Phase I engines. The new OBs don't use this engine. From what I know, there was nothing wrong with the engine -- just an overly sensitive knock sensor. It was remedied by replacing the ECU.

Ken

kens

There hasn't been much info out on the MY2003 Forester other than that it will be here next year. My guess is that Subaru will probably follow it's pattern of introducing a new model in the early part of the year -- at least that's what they did with the Legacy/OB and WRX.

There have been rumors of a turbo engine, but from what I've heard, it's not going to reach us until MY2004. My guess is that we'll still see the workhorse 2.5L SOHC engine first.

While the 2002 CR-V is a competitive vehicle, keep in mind that, from a power perspective, the CR-V is just now catching up to the Forester. The Forester has always had 165HP on tap from it's inception back in MY98. Getting rid of the anemic 2.0 engine was probably the biggest change you'll really notice in the CR-V other than the styling. Overall dimensions are relatively unchanged, it still uses part-time AWD and it still has a rear mounted spare.

I'm sure the 2003 Forester will have quite a few improvements. For sure, the chassis rigidity will be greatly increased as we've seen with the Impreza chassis.

I'd hold out if I were you. :-)

Ken

p0926

IIRC the release date is currently set for Fall 02. I think it highly unlikely to be any earlier than that considering the dearth of info and spy photos. The only concrete piece of info I've seen is that it will get a turbo for MY-04. Everything else has been pretty much pure speculation.

-Frank P.

p0926

caperosier- Maybe I'm missing something but what Patti is telling you is that they (SOA) can't respond to a complaint they never received (or possibly lost, hey mistakes happen). Since you're obviously P-O'ed about the tires, why don't you call again to register your complaint?

Regarding your statement: "Why sell an AWD vehicle used for cold weather safety with tires that are dangerous (not just marginal) in snow, on ice, in slush, in cold rain."

Who besides you is claiming that these tires are dangerous? Has there been a government recall? How do you define dangerous? Do you consider the Bridgestones to be as dangerous as the Ford/Firestone combo? (I've not seen any press accounts of Foresters rolling over). Sure, a studded snow tire would handle better in a snowstorm but since the Forester is sold in places like Dallas, Orlando, etc, Subaru has no choice but to select an all-season tire. Most Snow Belt buyers are aware that regardless of what make & model they buy, they are better off buying a dedicated set of tires for winter use.

Did Subaru save a few dollars by equipping the Forester L with something less than the optimal tire selection? I've no doubt they did (as do many other manufacturers). If this upsets you then don't buy another Subaru. However, I feel it irresponsible on your part to claim that the tires are dangerous.

-Frank P.

ateixeira

I don't agree that the tires are dangerous, and I had a set for 28k miles and two winters. If they were, Toyota and Honda wouldn't use them as an OE source. You may be more likely to get a response if your request doesn't include such radical conclusions about the tire (seriously).

If you word your feedback more carefully, such as saying "the tires didn't meet my expectations..." then perhaps someone in customer service would be more able (willing, even) to respond. But if Bridgestone already has, then why even bother Subaru about it? I don't get what satisfaction they could possibly give you.

I have worked at a Help Desk before, taking calls for tech support and complaints (though not car related), and frankly it annoyed me when people got hostile before I even had the chance to help them.

That Mag-X drawing looks more like someone heard about a few changes the Forester would get, then sketched what they though it might look like. I'd guess the 2003 model will have more changes than that drawing implies. When? I'm hoping April 2001, but we'll see.

-juice