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ON ANOTHER ISSUE, WHOMEVER SCHEDULES BUICK'S COMMERCIALS SHOULD BE FIRED IMMEDIATELY. ALTHOUGH I HAVE NEVER SEEN THE COMMERCIALS I CAN NOT SPEAK ON THEIR CONTENT. HOWEVER, THAT'S JUST THE POINT, I'VE NEVER SEEN A COMMERICAL FOR THE RDV...WHERE ARE THEY????
P.S. AND YES, I'M YELLING
Have seen a lot of print ads in the Toronto papers, but I've only seen the TV spots with Tiger Woods three times. I'm sure come the fall, you will see more of a push. I think they are selling well with no ads so they figure why bother.
fedlawman: ...speaking of trying to keep up w/ each other, Brian, you take it easy on those Tacoma roads. Don't want you getting any tickets. - Btw, let me know what progress you're making on the minor blemishes.
As cwj (still in lurk mode) said a long time ago, if someone is asing about "power" or "off-roading", the RDV is probably not the car for them. Perhaps they need an 8 Cylinder Durango, Suburban or Expedition. Then make sure to have lots of cash when going for fill-ups.
In reality, power is kind of like 4-Wheel Drives. There ares so many 4-wheel drives on the road & yet less than 5% of their owners actually use the 4-wheel drive. The other 95% 2-wheel drive to their schools, grocery stores, & work, "but they've got 4 Wheel Drive!" Similarly, a lot of the soccer moms (formerly in vans) and/or their husbands are driving around in their 8 cylinders, not even beginning to tap into their power, "but they've got a big engine!" My wife drives our RDV up and down a couple steep hills every day with no problem whatsoever - really no need for the big 8 cylinder power. And as fedlawman, said, the RDV can keep up with the 6 cylinders (MDX, etc...) w/ no problem.
mmeehan: not trying to convince myself or the others here, because we know the RDV reality. However, believe-it-or-not, new folks come here all the time, and for them, this is good info.
Anyway, some may remember that I tried to strangle the power question in its infancy and was chastised for not taking it seriously as an issue. So be it, and I suspect we'll hear plenty more as time goes on. But here's my point, every vehicle is a package. The Rendezvous is a good looking, good riding, good mileage (the reward), limited towing capacity, crossover vehicle with many luxury touches, and a class walloping amount of cargo capacity. And for what the Rendezvous is, I fail to see the problem that more rated power is supposed to cure. Indeed, while my tongue would be firmly planted in my cheek, I could plausibly argue that given the true offroading probabilities of an MDX or RX300 that these vehicles are wastefully overpowered. Indeed, I've yet to see either one of these models with a towing hitch (which should be required equipment along with a cabin cruiser or trailer), lest all their vaunted power go to waste.
If the Rendezvous is NOT your cup of tea, that's fine. That's why there are literally dozens of SUV permutations out there. But for my family's needs and desires, it's perfect, and I'm glad Buick came out with it rather than try to duplicate someone else's niche or product.
Spiritman - I love the HUD, and consider it as much a safety device as a convenience. On the other hand, I have no idea how I'm going to keep that well in the dashboard clean as dust collects down there over time. Ideas anyone?
CWJ
Thanks in advance
I forget the poster of that url link (mercasable??), but anyway when I visited it, found that they only offered the replicas in black. I wanted to get a couple for my kids, but I was hoping to get something closer to the color we have (pewter). Does anyone know if they're available in colors other than black?
CWJ: great to see ya on the board. Yeah, I kind of remember a lot of your wise observations, and I'm grateful for all that you've shared with us. I've learned quite a bit from you, Fedlawman, r5, Bertoli, Buzzbo, mmeehan, etc... It's been a great learning/sharing experience. btw, I'm hoping r5 makes an appearance. The big Raider/9er game is coming up this week; I'm sure he's getting psyched-up for it. Take care...
Go 9er's,
John B.
I have not brought the car to goodwrench yet since I don't think this is a serious problem.
I made a test on my way back from the office tonight and was wondering if your car would react the same... I simply turned the air conditionning off and the fluttering went away. This tells me the noise probably comes from or around the A/C compressor.
I know your RDV was supposed to be serviced today. Have they said anything about this? Hope they were able to fix the "traction control" light.
Thanks
The chips will cost so little to fix that, to me, it is not worth even the appearance of impropriety of talking to my agent about them.
As for the bumper, I'm going to live with it for now. Our 93 Honda Accord has new scuffs on the corners of the bumpers almost on a monthly basis (not to imply anything but, my wife is the only person who drives the Honda). I'm sure that as soon as I fix the RDV scuffs, it won't be long before new ones appear.
I guess I love my wife more than my cars. What has happened to me?
Brian
Quick question, before I take the plunge: does the 3 row seat fold completely flat like what is shown in the brochure? Also, it pretty easy to manuever? We're not really sure we need it, but we decided to go ahead and get it so we'd have no regrets. Also, we're pretty much signing this contract before seeing the vehicle. We of course have the opportunity to withdraw if the vehicle is not to our satisfaction, but in the meantime, we'd appreciate any advice on what to look out for during our test drive and delivery inspection. Thanks ahead of time. :-)
Mary
I have had a pewter CXL with the versatility package for about 3 weeks now (also a lease) and I like it very much.
Good luck!
pacinpelo: I personally really liked the look of the GM Bravada and saw it before I saw the RDV. However they made a terrible design flaw in their new model, and it took my wife to point it out to me. The rear doors sit on half of the wheel well. Not terribly convenient for kids & folks getting in & out. I'm not sure if they plan on fixing it when they add the 3rd row. Hopefully they will.
Rem933: Thanks for the input on the replicas. Let me know how it turns out painting them. If it works, I'll do the same. Btw, I guess my memory was not as good as cwj was alluding to earlier. You are indeed the one we owe the thanks to for providing the url link on the RDV replicas. Thanks for sharing...
Fedlawman: ... it begs the question. I believe you have the rear-park assist, don't you? If so, I would think the number of self-inflicted rear-bumper wounds would have to be minimal, if not non-existent. Do you turn it off? - - I used to think it would be a nuisance to have on all the time (b4 we got the RDV), but it's really not. It's been great for us. I'm sure it has its limitations, but up until now its been foolproof for us.
Unfortunately, the only time it doesn't work is when backing out of our garage. You see, we have large rose bushes on the passenger side of the garage that set off the sonar every time...we don't even pay attention to it when leaving the house.
Other than that, you have a very good point that hadn't occurred to me. It really does reduce the risk of future mishaps. For now however, I actually feel a little relieved knowing that I don't have to worry about blemishes anymore and I'm in no hurry...my deductible wouldn't cover the repair cost anyway. I might as well wait and see what happens.
If we can go 6 months without another incident, then I'll think about it.
A hint for anyone currently buying or shopping. When I signed my sales contract I told the dealer that I wouldn't take delivery of the RDV with Firestone/Bridgestone tires. After trying to convince me that I had nothing to worry (I probably didn't, but it makes me feel better anyway) they agreed and wrote it into the contract. Well, when the vehicle finally arrived it had the Firestone tire. After I pointed this out to them they agreed to switch them for Aztec tires which were Uniroyal Tigerpaw Nailguards. These were the tires that I wanted all along since I have them on my Windstar and they are great. Long story short, it's pretty easy to get different tires other than Firestone/Bridgestone if you want.
BY
The RDV and the Aztec are desperate attempts by GM to "step outside the box" and create a PT Cruiser type vehicle. Unfotunatly these two twins are sales flops and will more than likely be discontinued in 2 or 3 years. I personally like the looks of the RDV(though not the Aztek).
As mentioned, the RDV does seem to be over-priced and under-powered. Though with sales slow, the price will drop-like the Aztek.
Buick has been building vehicles of above-average quality in recent years (and before). The reason they've been losing customers is death, not vehicle quality. Their demographic has been aging out. RDV is one attempt to bring in younger people. And it looks to me like it will do well enough, if the general SUV demand stays high. Calling it a flop is way premature. Looks like the buyers here like it well enough (and do not think it is under-powered either).
The RDV is a terrific, well designed vehicle that may not succeed if GM fails to advertise it properly. So far, except for a few enthusiasts, the only people who have even heard of the RDV are PGA golf fans.
Also, the PT Cruiser was never used as a benchmark in the design of the RDV. The PT Cruiser is an inexpensive, 4 cylinder Dodge Neon that has been gussied up to create a nostalgic "lifestyle" car. Although one could argue that the Aztek followed this general "lifestyle" concept, the RDV, on the other hand, was designed to be a price leader in the near-luxury SUV segment in order to compete with the Lexus RX300 and Acura MDX, to name a few. It is completely "inside the box", and in my opinion, succeeds in it's mission.
Secondly, comparing the RDV with the Aztek and calling them twins is akin to calling the Audi A4 and VW New Beetle twins. They share a platform, but are completely different cars...maybe they're cousins.
I agree that GM has lost market share over the years and is attempting to make a comeback. GM has improved quality in recent years and is coming out with some great cars. The Oldsmobile Intrigue, Chevy Trailblazer, Chevy Corvette, and the upcoming Cadillac CTS are all examples of GM done right. Now all GM needs to do is regain the confidence of the customers it has lost to the imports. The RDV is the vehicle that brought me back.
Agree its underpowered. 3.4L 185hp? GM's 3.8 would give 205, the supercharged version 240. Compare to Highlander V6 at 220, Acura MDX 240. GM has to give on the price or the power eventually, I would think?
The RDV is also less expensive than the Highlander, which doesn't offer as much equipment as the RDV.
BTW, on average, the RDV is only about 0.3 sec slower than the Lexus RX300 from 0-60. I'm thinking that the Highlander has similar performance.
That's my logic, anyway.
Peterpie- GM's HUGE market share decline is due more to poor quality/wrong vehicles at the wrong time than anything else. Their share of market would still be down,no doubt, but not NEARLY as great a loss. I have not driven nor am I in the market to purchase a RDV. I never questioned anyone's ability to choose what ever they want to drive, I just don't see where there is any hope for the long term survival of the brand. I feel it will join Olds and go bye-bye. I DO NOT want this to happen, I just think it will.
All that aside, however, things are definately looking up over here at the General. While we can't sit back and say everything's great now, we can at least see some of the results of years of work. The new SUV triplets are very nice, and for my money, the RDV has been a great buy, and I love my 2000 Bonneville. The biggest thing working against GM now is its own past, and that could prove very difficult to overcome. But the RDV is a step in the right direction.
BY
Our former "family car" was a 1992 Dodge Caravan ES which went through 3 trannys, 3 master brake cylinder pumps, and had peeling paint for which Chrysler never took any responsibility. I believe that year (92) was Dodge's biggest recall year ever. And believe-it-or-not Chrysler/Dodge still uses the same problem-plagued tranny in all its present day vans and in who knows what else.
Now take Ford who decides to come out with a redesigned 2002 Explorer to regain the confidence of consumers who are fearful of the car tipping over or of tires exploding. Unfortunalely the "new and improved" model was placed on conveyor belts that were too narrow, thus slashing all their tires. Oh well! So much for a "better idea" & confidence-building. And now this week Ford has finally settled a 15 year ongoing problem with their electrical ignition system which will cost I don't know how many $$ billions. Do I trust Ford? Not really...
Frankly we were going to buy a Toyota Sienna until we heard about the RDV here at Edmunds. And after a tremendous amount of research, We chose the RDV over the Highlander, the Explorer and the MDX. And don't get me wrong, Indy, I grew up with Fords & Chryslers and used to like them a lot. But not anymore... If it wasn't Buick, it would have been a Toyota.
And whether Tiger Woods drives the RDV makes absolutely no difference at all. Do you really believe that all celebrities that promote a product actually use it? If so, I have a bridge to sell you. Advertisers use people like Michael Jackson (Pepsi) and Tiger Woods (Buick) Michael Jordon (whatever) to make great associations in consumers' minds. And guess what? It works, whether they in fact use the product or not.
And you seem to have incredible psychic powers. Although you have never driven a RDV and apparently haven't read the 10 or so posts before you're 1st post you seem to think there is a "power problem" - wrong. And somehow you have the premonition to know that "Unfotunatly these two twins are sales flops and will more than likely be discontinued in 2 or 3 years". I'd say, w/ any respect due you, that you're talking out of your hat. The RDV has only been out about 10 weeks in an economy that, I'm not sure if you know this, is in a downturn. All sales are down, not just GM/Buicks'.
Calling it Like I see it,
John B.
John- I think build quality for American vehicles has improved dramatically, even on par with Japanese and Germans in some cases. I feel the problem has been the poor quality "ingrediants" put into American vehicles in order to hold down costs/improve profits. This has killed the American car manufactures sales in the last 20 years. I'm not saying inferior engineering, (American Engineering put us on the moon and is far supieror in military hardware)just engineered on purpose to a lower/cheaper standard.
I realize alot of endorsers don't use the products; what I was implying that it a big strech to believe Tiger drives a Buick versus Mike drinking Gatorade. That's all.
What seems to be missing, then, is an AWD CX Versatility Package containing the 3rd row & power driver's seat, plus other odds & ends.
Seems like a gap in product packaging that's causing problems for some.
IMO, what American cars offer over the imports is extra goodies, sometimes at the cost of the basics. Some people go for this (like my Dad), some don't.
What I liked : bench seats in the second row. Comfortable seats.
My dislikes/goodies I won't pay for : The inability to open the back hatch without a key. Sonar ? I can't remember the last time I backed into something. The HUD was OK, but nothing I would pay extra for. Dual zone climate - I've never seen this work correctly without having a plexiglas divider. Cheap plastic (there is a difference between good plastic and cheap plastic).
The biggest factors were dependability and resale value. The maxed-out RDV was barely under the base MDX in price, with the MDX having a better engine (without a big mileage penalty - 17/23 mpg), better reliability (historically based) and warranty, and more storage (especially with the third row seats in use). If Buick had come out with a significant price difference, it would have made the decision much harder than it was.
Pete
Pete: As I said in an earlier post, I test drove an MDX and sat on the 2nd row bench seat. IMO the 2nd row seat was very hard. The RDV on the other hand is quite comfortable. Also, I almost defy an adult to try to get to the 3rd row seating. For a young kid or teenager/college student it may not be that bad. But at 6'1" I had to be a contortionist to get back there. And although I thought I'd never need the rear parking assist since I'm fairly tall, I indeed do need it & use it. It's a great convenience! As you probably know, the new Explorer has it as well.
Adding to the difference in comfort and convenience, I didn't like the fact that Accura dealers were pretty cavalier in saying "take a number" and your car will be here in 6 months. Oh well different strokes for different folks.
Looks to me like RDV is perfectly situated to take Buick into this decade.
Ken
If in the final analysis, the Buick Rendezvous offers as much as it does (ride, amenities, space, etc) at a competitive price , why are you so certain folks (babyboomers) won't buy it?
Lastly, I'm not the one declaring the RDV a sales flop, consumers aren't exactly lining up to purchase as reflected in the low sales volume. Newly hired GM exec declared it needed revamped.
As I have stated previously, I hope the RDV and Buick's sales in general skyrocket! I would love to see GM turn it around.
Its a General Motors product and worse yet it a Buick.
No these folks are settling into imports Lexus, Acura and the soon to be the come back story of Infiniti. American cars in general are losing market share because of the imports having the heads up. I drive a Regal GS and love it BUT am disappointed in GM as they are far behind in Buick and Cadillac development. These luxo divisions are still coming with huge cars (and future models look questionable in design)without 5 speed automatics and the remarkable return of rear wheel drive and each new comparison test shows that the imports are taking the lead and yes the media is biased BUT they have every right to be.
Thanks.
Spiritman
http://www.newsday.com/news/printedition/weekinwheels/ny-whtom2293805aug10.story
Carry on...
Drew
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