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Comments
Got any surplus ferrous-core memory modules? If so, who cares?
Anyone got anything to say about the RX?
Steve
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And we can make a ton of glue with all these dead horses laying around.
And what's a google is it closely related to a booper??? (Just pulling your chain wwest)
Out of curiousity, what are you using to prep for the LSAT?
So....
I just went outside, chocked the front wheels and jacked (roller jack)the rears off the ground, and then did the reverse.
With the front wheels chocked and the rears elevated so they could turn freely I started the engine and put the transmission in drive. With the engine simply idling there was no noticeable torque to the front wheels and the rear wheels spun along slowly. I could apply slight hand pressure to either of the rear wheels and bring them to a stop easily.
Note: I would have assumed the Trac system would have applied the brakes to the rear wheel still spinning freely, It did not.
If I raised the engine speed then there was noticeable torque to the front wheels, they clearly were trying to climb the chocks.
Then with the front wheels elevated and the rears chocked and the engine at idle everything was pretty much the same, no noticeable torque to the rear wheels and the fronts spinning slowly, and again I could stop either of them with hand pressure easily. Still no Trac intervention.
When I applied throttle the front wheels would spin faster but there was no noticeable torque to the wheels on the ground, the rears.
Since there appeared to be no torque I was able to raise the engine speed higher in this circumstance than in the other. At about 20MPH indicated the "skid" (car image outline with squiggly tire lines) indicator would illuminate briefly.
Even at 20MPH indicated there was no noticeable torque applied to the wheels with traction, the rear wheels.
In CONCLUSION:
The 2001 RX300 is predominantly FRONT WHEEL DRIVE.
The bothersome thing about all of this is the fact that the TRAC system never intervened when one or two wheels were spinning freely and the other were stalled.
Is Lexus seriously misleading the public or is the public and the automotive media misleading themselves?
Frankly I did not believe the stories about the demo/test held by MB? BMW? wherein the RX would not climb a ramp with no traction on the front wheels, but now I guess I have to admit the truth of that test.
I hope you're not saying the fog light issue was/is off topic.
Drew
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Just curious; when you did the above, did the rear wheels spin any faster, and were you still able to stop them with your hand?
Also, to be fully clear, this experiment was on a 2001 RX300 that you own? (You had mentioned 2001 shop manuals so I was a bit confused.)
Thank you. Hope you got out for the rest of the afternoon with the great post-12pm weather.
So I can't tell you if the rear wheels spun any faster. Now that you mention it I probably could have looked but didn't think of it. Obviosuly I didn't attempt to stop the rear wheels from turning while my foot was on the accelerator. There again, come to think of it, I could have applied the emergency brake to check.
Why must you ask such embarrassing questions?
I had a 2000 RX3000 and bought the shop manuals for it. I traded up to the 2001 primarily for the HID, VSC and Trac, forced to take the Nav in the bargain.
Oh, now that you have caused me to give it more thought, I did notice that the transmission parking brake only "locked" the front wheels, the rear wheels tended to turn as I jacked them up. That would be further confirmation that the 2001 AWD setup is the same as the 2000. The transmission parking brake typically only locks the transmission output shaft, in this case it locked the front wheels but was not able to lock the rears "through" a viscous coupling.
Begins to look as if all I got for my trouble that was worth trading up to was HID.
Steve
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Ugly cars? take a look at your RX.
Sounds like you need a ride in the stang too.
Tony, combination of boredom, withdrawal pains from lack of education, the fact that my boss can't remember a conversation I had with him last week about ways to improve our department which he agreed to and then somehow forgets (sorry guys), and the fact that my mother won't stop telling everyone a story about me crying in the supermarket as an infant and some guy said I'd be a lawyer. I keep trying to tell her I was just hungry!!!
gimpy, what's the deal with you, we know your upset about your sludge and fudge problem, the rest of us haven't experienced this (yet, fingers crossed), and your wife who the RX belongs to is driving your "Stang" (I just love saying it while I'm typing, everyone join in)
Isn't the Mustang built off of a platform that dates to the late 70's???
Drew
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The lifestyle issue well only you can answer that and it seems that you have already. You'll probably move up a few notches in popularity with your kids (joke). And assuming you don't know this. Lexus is Toyota's luxury division, Toyota products have very good reliability. The RX and Highlander are very similar, built off the same platform.(calm down wwest) As far as incentives, there are loyalty rebates. My own personal experience with service has been outstanding, but don't take my word for it check JD Power and [non-permissible content removed]. survey. Oh and the Lexus dealer won't tell you that your purchase is putting his kid through college (All four yrs.) And don't worry about the babbling even the Hosts do a lot of that :-P
Drew, I didn't get that one until now, I just look at the host portion of the name. And with everyone changing their name around here, Drew/Steve it's all too confusing.
All Mustangs to this day are built off the old Ford Fairmont platform of the mid/late 70s. ("Stayin' Alive"?)
Ms. Gordon, welcome. mvs1 pretty much stated the case in a nutshell. The HL has a third row of seats which even small children will rapidly be unhappy in and complain loudly about. It is doubtful(at least in my mind) that Lexus will add a third row to the next generation RX.
Lexus = quieter, arguably better ride, more lux, more bucks. Toyota = more seats (sort of), more spartan interior, fewer features, possibly the better buy. Both offer reliability well beyond anything you've experienced with Chrysler. Drive 'em both. BTW, Lexus will probably let you have one for a weekend to live with. Also, most Lexus dealers provide free Lexus loaners, should you so request, when your vehicle is in for service. Good luck and have fun!
gimpyrx-come on you know she wears the pants
This will be a first in the industry and is in keeping with Lexus' well-known strive for perfection.
This is a joke, right? All nav systems I know can adjust, and only the very early ones, like the Bosch TravelPilot RNS149, for ~$600, have a manual tire adjustment setting - the others autoadjust - by map matching. Some Lexus perfection - copying 5 year old stuff and selling it as new?
Wolfgang
The Lexus Nav is still one of the best out there, with the most complete street database on one DVD. Though it's not perfect, it's still the best available as an OEM option.
That double chime you get just as you reach a decision point is determined by the distance traveled, using vehicular input, from the last "fix" calculated from GPS input.
i must have sludged my brain. no warranty repair there either.
On the other hand (so to speak), I do appreciate you for explaining Tony's posts; boy, talk about someone being confused!
Obviously, he's all fogged-up, with bad Nav directions, lousy clear fog lights, and an AWD system that doesn't know when it's proper to spin the correct wheels.
Personally, I want to know more about PDP11s... isn't that a Compaq server? Whoops - HP server?
Shsssh! If my wife hears about this she'll be like, "Soooo, that explains everything about you..."
I took the findings alledged here about how the RX300 4WD is not permanent and emailed them directly to Lexus Corporate yesterday. Here is their response unedited (except for my bolding):
Thank you for contacting the Lexus Customer Satisfaction Department. I apologize for your concerns with the information you have received regarding the 4WD RX 300. The following is the information we have on the 4WD RX 300.
Automobile manufacturers continually try to make their four-wheel-drive systems simple to use. Lexus has accomplished simplicity by providing the four-wheel-drive feature on a continual basis, so that it occurs automatically without driver input. The system provides the proper power transmission ratio between front and rear axles, based on surface conditions. Because the connection is through a viscous coupling with disc plates, power transmission is smooth and seamless -- barely noticeable even when power is nearly evenly split between the front and rear axles. Common customer concerns like axle windup, wheel hop, and other conditions related to four-wheel-drive are virtually eliminated with the viscous coupling.
The viscous coupling is two sets of disc plates mounted closely together in a fluid. When the front and rear axles turn at different speeds, these plates resist moving relative to each other. When driven on low-traction surfaces, such as snow or gravel, this resistance in the viscous coupling will help direct power to the axle that has the most traction. When driven on a normal, high-traction surface, the four-wheel-drive RX300 viscous coupling distributes power approximately equally to each axle.
Regarding the 2001 4WD RX 300 with Traction Control (TRAC) and Vehicle Skid Control (VSC) - In addition to the benefits of 4WD on limited traction driving surfaces, if a drive wheel or wheels loses traction, TRAC will direct power to the wheels that still have traction and brake the spinning wheel(s). Additionally, VSC will help the driver manintain control when cornering on limited traction surfaces.
Predictably, there will of course be a response to this from someone who just likes the sound of their own voice.
Hi, how are you Tarik
Any feedback appreciated.
If you want Lexus to do the service (the Toyota idea is good also), then get a price quote from all the dealers in your area. Take the low price and call back that dealer and make them list what you are getting for that price. All you need at a minimum is what's listed in your owner's manual for 15K miles. If they do everything that's in the manual and the price is the lowest (and reasonable), then you have your answer.
Hopefully you have more than one Lexus or Toyota dealer in your area. Let us know how it goes.
P.S. Always save your service/repair bills and receipts!
That will never happen, not just me, you're simply living in the wrong world.
Did you go back and read the fog light link more carefully? Do you own me and others on this board an apology for your attempts to mislead?
I'm glad you got a better resonse than I did from Lexus regarding this matter, all I got was a referral to the dictionary meaning of viscous.
Now, go read the information that you got from Lexus again, where do you see that it says I'm wrong?
The strongest statement I see is the one that you high-lighted. If all four wheels have traction who cares what the torque distribution is, what does it matter?
The important thing to note is: How would you go about proving this statement wrong, even if it is absolutely incorrect?
Now ask yourself: "Where is the power input?"
The answer is from the front axle, THROUGH the viscous clutch, to the rear axle. Even there statement, while technically correct, is totally misleading.
If the RX is rolling along with all four wheels having traction with the roadbed how do you determine whether of not all four wheels are being driven with equal torque? And furthermore why does it matter?
Would you like to take a "Survivor" vote to see who people would like to leave here, you or me? I'm willing to abide by whatever folks decide, how about you?
Have a nice day.
No, I don't think I have to be right anywhere near all the time, but when all of the evidence indicates the truth of the matter, I do tend to question other's unfounded opinions.
Tell you what. You go outside, jack up the front of your RX, CAREFULLY, using a roller jack, and see how much traction the engine delivers to the rear wheels.
If you can send me a video tape of the RX moving forward, even ever so slightly, then you win and I leave the board.
A word of caution here, I have no idea what the time constant of the viscous clutch is, everyone knows that the fluid increases in viscosity as it is heated by the friction from the disparately turning of the two sets of plates, but in the RX case I don't have any real idea how long that might take.
My test only lasted long enough for me to get out and manually brake each of the front wheels with my hand and then make several tries at accelerating the engine up to about 20MPH indicated to test if the rear wheels would try to climb the chocks.
My feeling was/is that if the clutch time constant is longer than this then it is useless in any real world environment. But my advice would be to be more careful about the possibility the RX will apply torque to the rear wheels if you sustain this test over a longer period.
Tc,
I really thought that I had a valid argument countering the fog-light issue using the very words you said were valid for the other case, that color doesn't matter. If you still feel strongly about this matter after re-reading your post link would you please share your logic with the rest of us.
Thanks, and my sincerest apologies to anyone who I have inadevertantly offended.
Willard west
If you can talk to Lexus and actually prove that it isn't permanent 4WD, rather than AWD, I'll be the first in line to sue them based on false advertising. I'm completely serious, I bought this vehicle in large part because of the proactive rather than reactive drivetrain found on other vehicles.
Well????
Most of them are very like the one you posted, lots of words but no definitive answers. All the answers read as if written by lawyers who do not want to be penned down on this issue.
What about my questions to you?
this resistance in the viscous coupling will help direct power to the axle that has the most traction
but no power is directed to the rear when the fronts spin @20MPH
Lexus says:
if a drive wheel or wheels loses traction, TRAC will direct power to the wheels that still have traction and brake the spinning wheel(s).
but it doesn't work when the rears are stuck and the fronts spin @20 MPH
It is helpful for readers to find out what passes for "Lexus 4WD" these days. By the way, this dreadful performance was confirmed by AMCI, they are the pros in comparative vehicle testing. (They invented that Lexus is "reliable" - because they couldn't find anything else remarkable). I actually saw when the RX-300 failed the test on the roller hill. And it wasn't even a difficult test, the other real 4WD vehicles had no trouble whatsoever. AMCI is at http://www.amcitesting.com
Wolfgang
Some definitions may be in order.
Permanent 4WD.
The industry, in general, doesn't call what the RX has for drive setup 4WD, it is more commonly referred to as AWD. Smeone please correct me if I'm wrong here. I think the term "4WD" is reserved for drive setups that are PART time use, on slippery surfaces only. While I don't buy into it as an issue, I have also seen it stated that true 4WD vehicles have a low range gearbox.
"Permanent"... As in engaged all of the time, or "Full-time AWD" is the way it is most commonly referred to.
Please excuse the additional verbosity, but I don't want to get caught up in an argument over the meaning of words. I'm having a discussion about the actual operation of the RX AWD system and as long as we understand that, you can call that system whatever you like.
Pete
Much of all of the confusion has to do with the marketing folks, of course, who also answer e-mails or the phones ;-)
More here, in case you're interested:
ateixeira "4WD & AWD systems explained" Sep 28, 2001 7:21am
Drew
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Will would be too easy, now that I think of it he does remind me of Rudy, the stubborn ex navy seal.