Yep the Envoy can have the locking rear (which won't help you when the angle of departure lifts both rear wheels off the ground) most 99 and all 00->02 Troopers have rear LSD. The 01->02 Troopers have the Corp 12 bolt rear while the 92->00 have Dana 44s, you can get numerous lockers for the Dana 44s. You can also get an ARB locker for the front of the 92->02 which is the Isuzu 10-bolt diffy. Also you can get the Isuzu Impulse rear LSD gears and put them in the front of the Troopers 92->02 as well giving you a front and rear LSD.
01->02 TOD Troopers have a modified rear Isuzu Corp 12 bolt differential. 92->02 non TOD have Isuzu Corp 12 bolt diff(some LSD and some not). ARB makes a locker for the Isuzu Corp. 12 bolt. I believe the numbering for it is RD44 but this is not for a Dana 44. The rear LSD for an Impulse or for a first generation Trooper (either one or two) should be an Isuzu Corp. 10 bolt which will fit in the front of the second generation Trooper. I believe this is correct, but feel free to correct me. One question. If Isuzu ever had a Dana 44 in the rear how would one identify this and what models was it placed in (1st or 2nd Generation...S,LS,Limited...years)?
According to a knowledgeable source at planet isuzu 98->00 all Troopers used a Dana44 rear end. I may have been mistaken on the 92-98 models. I believe pre 92 had dana 44s in the rear and 98->00 have Dana 44s as well.
A buddy of mine has a '98 Acura badged Trooper with 32K on it. For no apparent reason, the transmission failed catastrophically. The Acura dealer is replacing it under warranty.
Is this a common occurence (losing a trans I mean, not having it replaced under warranty)?
I don't drive my 98 much, and I think I will probably get to 5 years long before I get to 50,000 miles. I guess I'm worrying that I should get that extended warranty...
The tranny in the Troopers, rodeos etc. is known to be a long long lasting unit. They are one of the strong points of these vehicles. I would not worry about it at all. This is about the 3rd or 4th tranny out of maybe 300-500 owners I know of.
My '95 blew it's tranny at 34000. Replaced under warranty. It actually didn't "blow", but the clutches were slipping and it would randomly down shift into second or first. Shop tech's said they were suprised it still ran when they took it apart. Apparently the steel had turned a nice shade of blue in there(really hot). The replacement has had no problems and it's on 50,000. I would hate to have it replaced out of warranty though.
Troopers never had DANA44 rear diff EVER. 88-97 had Isuzu Corp 12 bolt ...ring gear measures about 8.6" It takes ARB RD44 locker..same as 1st gen AMIGO.
98+ have modified Isuzu Corp 12 bolt with DANA GEARS with ring gear diameter of about 9.6". ARB RD85 is the locker application for this one. Meca vacuum locker is also available.
ARB DOES NOT have locker for the 10 bolt YET but it is under R&D(50+ paid up front deposits made this happen) tho there is no definite release date. Other options for the 10 bolt is lock-rite locker, power brute lsd, and MECA vacuum locker. HTH
It is HIGHLY UNLIKELY that these models have DANA 44 rears since Isuzu uses removable 3rd member on all Troopers. Trooper diffs are also beefier than their DANA counter parts, ie Corp 12 bolt is bigger that DANA44, modified Corp 12 bolt is almost as big as DANA 60. Unless someone proves to me otherwise (hard fact ..picture of the diff for one, specs from Isuzu, etc) I'll stick with my claim.
01-02 is definitely a different diff than the 98-00 ones. I waiting for Tad to login today so I can verify that the 98-00s have a DANA 44 rear. If I were to climb under there what would I look for to verify a Dana 44? I'll test out the new digital camera while I'm at it.
So I should see a panel on the back of the pumpkin if it's a 44, and no opening if it's not? I am not clear on what a "3rd member is" other than the obvious sexual connotation!
Mike: I'm pretty sure that no troopers ever used the Dana44. I think: All 86-87s had the isuzu 10 bolt, 88-97 troops had the Isuzu 12 bolt rear end, and 98-02s have the modified 12 bolts with Dana gears.
Pinoy: What did your troop have in it (before you regeared)
Well according to Tad, 01-02 have a different gearset than the 98-00. I believe he said it had Dana 44 gears in 98-00 and then went back to Isuzu gears for 01-02.
Not too sure about the question but here goes... the 99 Trooper had the oem Isuzu Corp(modified) 12 bolt with DANA gears,4.3 ratio. Now have Meca(ICELAND) gears, 5.38's.
DANA 44 are now designated 216 which has 8.5" ring gear diameter. The 99 Trooper has 9.6" ....can't be a 44;in between 50 and 60. A long shot is that Isuzu decided to go back to the (old)Corp 12 bolt for the newer models (01-02) with 8.6" ring gear.
I have been trying to follow this differential stuff with little success (someday I'll have to learn what a third member is), but it sounds like you have the best handle on it with regards to Troopers of anybody so far...
Could be that they went to the old Corp 12 bolt for the 01-02 models. That is a possibility, but according to Tad over there it is definitely different than the 98-00 Troopers.
Mike: I thought that '01 - '02 had a differnt bolt pattern, but same gears (Dana) as the '98 & '99s. I also thought that the '98 & '99 use /97 bolt pattern w/ dana gears. I think '00 is mixed. Mark
"3rd members are self-contained differential units which can be removed and replaced without taking the actual brake and housing assembly out of the chassis " from pylebros.com
So if I understand this correctly, the advantage of a "third member" setup is that it allows you to pull out the diff without pulling out the axle shafts?
I guess that setup is why the rear diff back cover on my Trooper is welded on...
Are there any 6'2'' or taller Trooper drivers out there. My wife loves the Trooper but on my test drive I felt an uncomfortable angle placement of my right foot.
Did Isuzu give the driver any more leg room in the 2002?
Did I just not have the seat adjusted correctly?
Or did I just play too many basketball games this season for a 40-year-old?
on the LS and Limited you can change the angle of the seat. I like mine with the back of thebase down and the front of the base up. With the back of the chair almost all the way up. Also don't forget these are captains chairs so you should be sitting in a more upright position than in a std car or suv seat.
I'm 6'4" and have no problems at all. I find the interior room and seating position for the driver to be most comfortable. It is more "chair" like with the knees bent, but I DO NOT hit the dash or underside of the steering column when sitting or getting in/out. I agree with Paisan, there has been no change in a few years. I think the overall position is the same as in my 1996 Trooper.
cpintucson I'd pay attention to what you "felt" about the seats not fitting quite right. I have owned a 98 and still own a 99 Ltd Trooper and my biggest complaint is teh seats are very uncomfortable. I'm 6' FWIW. I bought a 98 "s" model and got rid of it in a year to get the 99 as I thought the leather power seats in the 99 would solve my problem...I was wrong. The Trooper is a GREAT truck, I love mine even though I'm uncomfortable in it, BUT I also have a 2001 Montero and its a much nicer vehicle to ride around in all day, AND I even think its better offroad than my Troop (and I'm not saying that to bash the Trooper, I really do love that truck!)....Anyway, just remember that if you aren't comfortable now in the seats think how you'll feel 50k miles down the road in them..good luck..!
IRS = bad offroad in general. So I'm not sure how the monty could be better offroad. It should be better on rough roads but not true off-roading. Also the montys are 10K more that can buy a lot of seats and tires on a trooper.
Paisan...I thought the Troop would be better as well for scaling inclines. I was surprised that my Montero does a better job at the same exact places...I love my 99 Trooper buy my 01 Montero definately climbs slippery inclines with less "hunting" for traction..Remember that the Monty comes stock with larger tires as well..
I am 6'3" (also 40). In test drives of 99 models, I found the base model seats uncomfortable due to the angle of the seat base. It left me trying to hold my leg up off the throttle, leading to a tired muscle in my lower leg after a short drive.
Then I drove the mid-level Trooper with an "8-way adjustable seat". It made all the difference, as I was able to raise the front edge of the seat to support my thighs. I find this seat very comfortable, much better than my previous vehicle (Blazer).
Took the new 2001 S Trooper 4WD, with 1000 miles on the odometer, on trip from Phoenix to Las Vegas and it did just fine. Thought I smelled a little insulation burning somewhere, but maybe my imagination. Gas milage sucked, about 13 or 14, however I was driving 70+ a lot of the time and traffic was heavy. Passing ability was OK, this engine is no powerhouse, but better than the '94 Rodeo I had. Breaks are good. Wish I hadn't gotten it in white. Every time I start my Ford power stroke diesel in the garage, it deposits a layer of soot on the Trooper.
I've had my 2000 S TOD/Automatic for 15 months now and have just under 25K on it. I use Valvoline 10W-30 and change O/F every 5K. I never use above base octane (87 around here, I think). I've gotten mileage anywhere from 12.5 (TOD on, less than 5K miles on the odometer, cold & snow on the ground) to 17.4 (240 mi. trip to Lake of the Ozarks, 50% hilly roads @ 55-60 mph - 50% interstate @ 75-80 mph, TOD on for half the trip). Bottom line though, I get 15 mpg average, day in, day out, (50% around town, 50% highway at 75-80 mph /w/ TOD on a bit less than half the time) which I think is a fair trade off for what the Trooper gives in return! Still love my Trooper!
Anyone driving a Trooper and expecting 25-30 mpg, just isn't being reasonable. What kind of mileage do the new Montero's, Blazer's, Nissian's or 4Runner's get? Why would you expect any better in a Trooper? This is a sizeable, heavy vehicle, with tons of interior room. You can't expect 25 mpg out of it. As for power, there's plenty for the SUV driver. It's no Corvette, or B2000 Honda, but it will certainly get out of it's own way when asked to do so. GREAT all around this Trooper. Happy Trooping!!!
Not to mention you pay more in gas, but less in repairs so it will even out. I had no problems merging with a 5100lb trailer on the highway or up-grades, which says a lot for the power of the vehicle.
Not to bring anyone down, but remember last year at this time? The owners club wasnt going yet, but I had, a few months earlier discoverd this forum, which helped me decide on a vehicle I had admired since its revision in 1992, the Trooper! Seems about this time that everyone was excitedly anticipating and speculating on the "next Trooper"! How sad that GM had to @#$%&*!@ up the Trooper as they have done so many other vehicles that have had the misfortune to be controlled by that conglomerate! You know, I would have considered what I'm about to say as pure insanity a year ago, but with its newfound (and steadily growing) reputation for increased quality, the Land Rover Discovery is fast becoming high on my list to replace my Trooper in a few years. Sad that the choices for a "true SUV" (body on frame, selectable 4WD modes, rear mounted spare) are dwindiling in the light of "crossover SUV's). Did you know that Car and Driver rated the Highlander as the best LARGE SUV? How about the MDX as the best LUXURY SUV? Both nice vehicles to be sure but TRUE SUV's??? I don't think so!!! I think Ford (Land Rover's new owner) at least has more savvy than GM. Also, thanks paisan, for posting the info on the Hyundai Terracan! Hyundai is a company that has lived up to their promise and I feel, is making a very good vehicle these days. Who knows, maybe in a few years we will all be in the "Terracan Owners Club" (just pray that GM doesnt somehow get to Hyundai!) Oh well, I'm rambling, I'll shut up for now..LOL! Have a great New Year everyone!- Dave
I think we as Trooper owners should start to e-mail Hyundai and tell them they need to bring it over here! Right now my replacement if for some reason my Trooper were to go away tomorrow would be:
Toyota Land Cruiser (if I could afford it) Mitsu Montero (if it wasn't so ugly!) Mitsu Montero Sport (I think they have a full-time 4wd model now) Hyundai Terracan (if they only sold it here) GMC 2500HD Crew Cab w/Duramax Diesel shortbed with matching cap (closest thing to an Isuzu SUV we'll be seeing anytime soon)
Hey the real post here was going to be if you ran Isuzu USA or even a Isuzu dealership, what would you do differently? In regards to the Trooper, I remember this as a quality vehicle (it beat the 93 Grand cherokee in a car and driver article) that did have some rough years (thanks Consumer Reports) but now seems forgotten. My home town never airs Isuzu ads (there is a dealer) and only adveritises them once per week in a tiny picture ad of a Trooper. Where I currently live, they do at least advertise on tv, but only during the 10pm news. They don't even show the trooper always, usually the Axiom and the special financing deals on 2001!!!! Rodeos. (There is a cool Trooper ad with the Trooper cruising through snow though...) I mean, I haven't seen a printed Trooper ad in some time. What is going on here? What would you do differently? Should the local dealerships promote "made in Japan SUV?" Should they make ads that compare Trooper with 4runner or Pathfinder? Should Isuzu USA run promotional activities...test drives...etc to get attention? How does GM's partial ownership affect this?
takes forever to load, but looks like a new design with good 4wd system, dual depowered airbags, side impact BEAMS, projector headlights and foglights, good interior styling (especially for juvenile hyundai). Looks modern and up to date. www.hyundai.com If we are lucky, maybe they will import it...
Sadly, I do think this is my last Isuzu. Probably won't like the Brave Envoy that will Trailblaze as the Ascender (very bad pun).
I was at the GMC dealer and looked at the Envoy. Overall a nice vehicle. I understand that the inline-six is actually made or at least designed by Isuzu (that's what the GMC salesman said) but for the price, the Envoy just did not do it for me. It's a good looking design and the overall size is OK but it is way too "tight" inside. When I sat in any outboard seating positions my head was right against the SIDE of the roof. Any bumping, and my head would crash into a side-window. I think the market is heading me toward the Mistubishi Montero if they ever give it more power or provide some buyer incentives. The Land Cruiser is great, but hoooey the cost even on three-year-old models (pretty good resale value as SUV's go though).
The Troopers have had close to 50% reduction in sales volume in the last few years even with huge discounting and improved contenting. Last year there were usually more Troopers on the lot of my local dealer than there were Rodeos. This year, they usually have 3 to 5 Troopers and 50+ Rodeos at any given time. I wouldn't be surprised if they just stopped shipping them over by mid-year. Since there are already thousands of $$$ in dealer/customer cash on the 2002's and the 2001's are still available through dealers and online, like at www.carsdirect.com. The port-of-entry lots are probably full of unsold Troopers (and Axioms).
The thing I liked is that it was kinda like an updated Trooper. Still boxy, yet newer. Still retained the solid rear axle, TOD system, (with low range to boot) and 3rd row of seats. No big buldges that you see in the Montero and Santa fe. Of course I'd have to sit in one to see for sure but the specs looked nice.
The following happened on the way back from a 150 mile trip to the mountains.
About 50 miles into the trip stopped for fast food, when I rolled down window noticed a bit of smoke from under Trooper and definate "Stinky Trooper".
SWince oil pressure and temp was good I went about another 10 miles to stop for gas and to check out problem. Got out and Trooper was leaking around middle of truck, entire rear of underside wet with oil. Checked motor oil - full. Chekced what was leaking, thick oil, clear, not red, fresh, not hot or heavily used. With kids in Trooper, and Trooper running with no sign of Engine, Transmission or rear end problem I decided to carry on and try to get home.
The Trooper did get me home.
I crawled underneath and noticed from the rear of the transmission oil pan forward is spotless. Entire rear of the car from transmission oil pan back is coated in oil. Drivers side is much cleaner, passenger side is wet. Looks to me like what I think is called the Transfer case. (I am not a 4WD guy!)
I removed the guard under the transfer case and it had quite a puddle in it. I can not locate the source of the leak, though. Looks like the top of the transfer case? What is up there that I cannot see?
Not leaking much anymore because I think it is dry. I can put it in 4WD and drive back and forth with no unusual sounds or symptoms.
FWIW, we were up in the mountains and I breifly used 4WD for the first time in about one year. About 50 feet each time, just for getting in and out of a driveway that had some ice.
Thanks. It is going to the mechanic tomorrow, and I would appreciate any advice!
If it is, then it's probably going to cost maybe $200-$300 total? That is a total guess, it could be much less like $100. It's probably a $5 gasket, and the rest is labor. If you haven't used the 4wd at least 1x a month most likely the t-case seal dried out. You should always engage 4wd 1x a month for a little bit just to keep the seal wet with fluid.
Could be the seal between the tranny and the T-case. I had a little seepage (no dripping) on my '99 and they replaced that. Seems to have cured the problem. Could also be an overflow valve on top of the T-case unit. Maybe after no use the oil heated up enough to come out.
Well my wife - god bless her - decided to surprise me with a set of Rancho 5000 gas shocks for our 2001 TOD Trooper. I had previously installed the polyurethane bushings on the sway bars which made a significant improvement in the handling - but I'll tell you what - with the new shocks the Trooper is a go-cart - much more planted in the turns and greatly reduced nose dive on braking. Just made a 1000 mile round trip run to West Virginia - woke up one morning last week and it snowed 3". Off I went to play - actually got to see the TOD light kick in and went up an unused mountain road with the transfer case locked in to the low range - was true fun. The check engine light came on for the last 500 miles but has since cleared itself - now why?. Gas mileage (11,000 Miles) for this trip on the interstate at 75-80 mph was 16.4 mpg. Had the shocks installed at NTB for $13 ea. Thought about doing it myself - looked easy enough - but the concrete driveway was too cold - the NTB guy said that the installation was a challenge - he has two sets of Ranchos on his own vehicles and said that Rancho's are difficult to install - don't know why - but glad he did it. Before the trip had Wallmart change the oil - it is actually cheaper to have them do it than it is for me to buy the filter and Mobil 1 - but guess what - they forgot to put to oil filler cap back on - when I got home I noticed all the leaking goo - back to Wallmart where they cleaned up the mess - cap was still under the hood - noticed they also did not drop the skid plate pan that provides easy access to the filter - so under the Trooper I go and clean up this drippy mess as well - motto is next time I do it myself. Happy New Year all.
Glad to see you are having fun Bill! I'll get to report back on TOD + Scoripion AT tires in snow after this coming weekend. I'll be up in the Adirondacks romping around in the snow.
This is my first SUV, is the preventative maintenance schedule Isuzu lists normal for SUVS? Things like repacking front bearings every 30k miles? I try to minimize costs by doing some of the easier maintenance at home. Sure looks like I'm going to be busy.
A couple of specific questions, has anyone done the: check propeller shaft flange bolts torque settings themselves? if so, do you loosen them first then tighten to prescribed setting, I think like 43 foot pounds, or just tighten as is to confirm the torque reading?
Second question, the manual says to replace the oil plug gasket every time you do an oil change. Does anyone actually do that?
Comments
-mike
-mike
Is this a common occurence (losing a trans I mean, not having it replaced under warranty)?
I don't drive my 98 much, and I think I will probably get to 5 years long before I get to 50,000 miles. I guess I'm worrying that I should get that extended warranty...
-mike
88-97 had Isuzu Corp 12 bolt ...ring gear measures about 8.6" It takes ARB RD44 locker..same as 1st gen AMIGO.
98+ have modified Isuzu Corp 12 bolt with DANA GEARS with ring gear diameter of about 9.6". ARB RD85 is the locker application for this one. Meca vacuum locker is also available.
ARB DOES NOT have locker for the 10 bolt YET but it is under R&D(50+ paid up front deposits made this happen) tho there is no definite release date. Other options for the 10 bolt is lock-rite locker, power brute lsd, and MECA vacuum locker.
HTH
-mike
-mike
Isuzu Corp 12 bolt has a removeable third member and NO inspection cover.
-mike
Pinoy: What did your troop have in it (before you regeared)
-mike
the 99 Trooper had the oem Isuzu Corp(modified) 12 bolt with DANA gears,4.3 ratio. Now have Meca(ICELAND) gears, 5.38's.
DANA 44 are now designated 216 which has 8.5" ring gear diameter. The 99 Trooper has 9.6" ....can't be a 44;in between 50 and 60. A long shot is that Isuzu decided to go back to the (old)Corp 12 bolt for the newer models (01-02) with 8.6" ring gear.
-mike
-mike
I guess that setup is why the rear diff back cover on my Trooper is welded on...
Did Isuzu give the driver any more leg room in the 2002?
Did I just not have the seat adjusted correctly?
Or did I just play too many basketball games this season for a 40-year-old?
2002 = 2001 = 2000 = 1999 = 1998
-mike
MK
-mike
Then I drove the mid-level Trooper with an "8-way adjustable seat". It made all the difference, as I was able to raise the front edge of the seat to support my thighs. I find this seat very comfortable, much better than my previous vehicle (Blazer).
-mike
Toyota Land Cruiser (if I could afford it)
Mitsu Montero (if it wasn't so ugly!)
Mitsu Montero Sport (I think they have a full-time 4wd model now)
Hyundai Terracan (if they only sold it here)
GMC 2500HD Crew Cab w/Duramax Diesel shortbed with matching cap (closest thing to an Isuzu SUV we'll be seeing anytime soon)
-mike
I was at the GMC dealer and looked at the Envoy. Overall a nice vehicle. I understand that the inline-six is actually made or at least designed by Isuzu (that's what the GMC salesman said) but for the price, the Envoy just did not do it for me. It's a good looking design and the overall size is OK but it is way too "tight" inside. When I sat in any outboard seating positions my head was right against the SIDE of the roof. Any bumping, and my head would crash into a side-window. I think the market is heading me toward the Mistubishi Montero if they ever give it more power or provide some buyer incentives. The Land Cruiser is great, but hoooey the cost even on three-year-old models (pretty good resale value as SUV's go though).
The Troopers have had close to 50% reduction in sales volume in the last few years even with huge discounting and improved contenting. Last year there were usually more Troopers on the lot of my local dealer than there were Rodeos. This year, they usually have 3 to 5 Troopers and 50+ Rodeos at any given time. I wouldn't be surprised if they just stopped shipping them over by mid-year. Since there are already thousands of $$$ in dealer/customer cash on the 2002's and the 2001's are still available through dealers and online, like at www.carsdirect.com. The port-of-entry lots are probably full of unsold Troopers (and Axioms).
-mike
Try this link, and click on the Galloper button. If you like boxy, this is your vehicle.
David
-mike
About 50 miles into the trip stopped for fast food, when I rolled down window noticed a bit of smoke from under Trooper and definate "Stinky Trooper".
SWince oil pressure and temp was good I went about another 10 miles to stop for gas and to check out problem. Got out and Trooper was leaking around middle of truck, entire rear of underside wet with oil. Checked motor oil - full. Chekced what was leaking, thick oil, clear, not red, fresh, not hot or heavily used. With kids in Trooper, and Trooper running with no sign of Engine, Transmission or rear end problem I decided to carry on and try to get home.
The Trooper did get me home.
I crawled underneath and noticed from the rear of the transmission oil pan forward is spotless. Entire rear of the car from transmission oil pan back is coated in oil. Drivers side is much cleaner, passenger side is wet. Looks to me like what I think is called the Transfer case. (I am not a 4WD guy!)
I removed the guard under the transfer case and it had quite a puddle in it. I can not locate the source of the leak, though. Looks like the top of the transfer case? What is up there that I cannot see?
Not leaking much anymore because I think it is dry. I can put it in 4WD and drive back and forth with no unusual sounds or symptoms.
FWIW, we were up in the mountains and I breifly used 4WD for the first time in about one year. About 50 feet each time, just for getting in and out of a driveway that had some ice.
Thanks. It is going to the mechanic tomorrow, and I would appreciate any advice!
-mike
It is a '96 with Auto trans and 99k trouble free miles.
Can you lend more info on the seal? Where is it, and what is your estimate for repair - given that I do not want to do it myself
-mike
-mike
This is my first SUV, is the preventative maintenance schedule Isuzu lists normal for SUVS? Things like repacking front bearings every 30k miles? I try to minimize costs by doing some of the easier maintenance at home. Sure looks like I'm going to be busy.
A couple of specific questions, has anyone done the: check propeller shaft flange bolts torque settings themselves? if so, do you loosen them first then tighten to prescribed setting, I think like 43 foot pounds, or just tighten as is to confirm the torque reading?
Second question, the manual says to replace the oil plug gasket every time you do an oil change. Does anyone actually do that?
Thanks for any info.
Kevin
-mike