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Midsize Sedans 2.0



  • 14871487 Posts: 2,407
    "All in all, the XR is entertaining, and IF they offered a better price, as in cost of car AND my trade-in, I would be driving one today. They did not. "

    better price? You werent going to get an Aura, period. You have been pointing out the flaws of the Aura and how its inferior to the Accord for months now. The Aura currently has a $1500 rebate that makes its price more than competitive and considerably lower than comparable 2007 or 2008 accord.

    As for 18" wheels, they do have a benefit. They make the car look better. This is why so many cars under $30k offer them these days.

    The SE is indeed bare bones. No power seat? No MP3 jack? Sorry but ESP and a V6 do not mean a car is loaded.
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    Okay, 1487, you are just being ridiculous now.

    For a long time you were complaining about many the so-called "import fanboys" did not give a fair shot to the domestic products. Now we have a guy who may not be an "import fanboy" who compared the Aura and Accord back to back and ended up choosing the Accord.

    Instead of praising the guy for giving an equal shot to the Aura you outrageously accused him for never going to get an Aura. If he decided to get an Aura and never tested anything else wouldn't that make him a "domestic fanboy"? Please explain to me, are you here to preach "may the best product wins" or trying to convert people to become "domestic fanboys"?

    Enough is enough. Unless if you are on GM payroll of course...
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,907
    Kia admitted using Mercedes as its inspiration for the Amanti. They've even poked fun at the resemblance in their ads. It's very clear to me at least that Honda used BMW to some extent as an inspiration for the 2008 Accord (because they would never mimic a Kia, would they). Is that a bad thing? Hyundai was very open about Audi being the main influence for the Sonata's exterior.

    Do you know how many cars have horizontal taillamp bands ala the 2003-7 Accord and 2006+ Sonata? Lots. In fact, the car that most resembles the Accord's taillamps is a Buick from the '90s (I think it was the Skylark). The shape is almost exactly the same. Whereas the shape of the lamps on the Accord and Sonata is much different. Does that mean Honda copied the Buick, and pretty blatantly at that? I doubt it.

    Anyway, does the fact that Car A's grille or taillamps looks like those of Car B pass the "So what?" test, other than it being an interesting point about a car? Or does it demonstrate that automakers are running out of unique ways to bend sheetmetal and mold plastic, and when they do something unique (see: Aztec or Matador) it doesn't work out that well?
  • urnewsurnews Posts: 668
    Or does it demonstrate that automakers are running out of unique ways to bend sheetmetal and mold plastic, and when they do something unique ...

    I still say that the 2006-08 Fusions look unique, unlike the lookalike Asian products. That, of course, doesn't mean that everybody likes it just because it's different. Indeed, sales have been good but definitely not outstanding.

    I just know that looks-wise I am more satisfied with the Fusion than I would be with an Accord, Camry, Altima, Legacy, Aura, Sonata et al.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    Function over Form is how I see it. If it works better, screw the looks. These cars are redesigned every 5 years at the most, so not much time is spent designing them. Looks are somewhat important to me if we're talking about sports cars, but a family sedan, not so much.
  • drwilscdrwilsc Posts: 140
    I came onto this board hoping to read intelligent discussion comparing cars like the Aura and 2008 Accord. I happen to have chosen the Aura XR, mostly because of the rebates, but I certainly wouldn't laugh at anyone who buys a 2008 Accord.
    Unfortunately, instead of interesting discussion comparing the two cars, the board is filled with childish, personal comments between people who are obviously biased for their own cars. Oh, well. Too bad...
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    I would like the reply to that:
    1) You are wrong.
    2) You are wrong again.
    3) You are wrong a third time, but maintain a certain consistency, no doubt.
    4) You win the prize, as you are wrong again.
    Glad to have been of service, before someone mistake's these wild assumptions as anything close to fact.
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    In the Ford line, I kinda liked the Milan more, though perhaps that has to do with the tail lights. The chromed front on the Fusion is pretty cool. Both are sharp. Has a little edginess to it, like the old CTS, which was pretty cool, but with a softer roundness to the middle.

    If they are least had a single Legacy Sedan on the lot, I would have tried out one when looking for cars. At the time, there were zero, so I not only did not try the car out, I figured people are not buying that model at all. Guess Subaru is all about the other models??? I saw one or two over the years in the showroom and they looked pretty smooth. They 1000% for a Subaru when compared to some of their previous disasters for stylin'. Now I wouldn't mind owning that sports car they had some years ago, but alas the name escapes me know.
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    After all the years though, the Accord and CTS, IMHO do not look better. They just look puffier. And I thought I would like the Altima in a revised look, but now I am thinking enough already with the over-sized lamps and overall, it just in need of something really, shall we say New.

    And yes, sports cars should have the looks, though in some cases, I can think of a clear winner over a newer better looking sports car too. And you can add to this, the oh my God, what is that, comments when a Z3 became a Z4. In this case, yeah a beauty wins, as in Z3, though a Z4 is nice and roomy inside. L
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    Aura rebates. What is the current XR rebate? At the time I was looking there was two rebates. The second one was only for those which new of such a rebate, I guess. I brought it up to the attention of the salesman and said it was listed on the Edmund's site at the time for California. Well they said they can do that, but it normally is something emailed or whatever. What the heck is that? Still believe they should stock at least a couple base XR's on all those sale lots, as it really is a good deal without needing the bump up add-ons. Sure, there is a mark for loaded to more loaded to loaded to the sky is the limit, but an XR already is pretty good for having what I need, and I am thinking what most people need in a car, to possibly overkill. Heck, maybe they could build but two models, the XR and one called the XR+ which has the leather and navagation, for those in need. Rpice the XR at $21,995 and the XR+ at $24,995 Just a thought. L
  • You are exactly correct in your observation, and it exists on most of the forums here on Instead of objective analysis, it's mostly "my car is better than yours." Freud was right . . .

    Some folks are downright fanatical about the brand of car they own, and wouldn't own another brand. The problem is most have never actually spent some serious seat time in the other cars they bash, therefore their comments are irrelevant.
  • drwilscdrwilsc Posts: 140
    I bought a 2007 XR and received 2 rebates, a $1500 rebate and $1000 'conquest cash' since I traded in a non-GM vehicle, for a total of $2500 off. I bought the car in August and do not believe the conquest cash is available any longer, at least on the XR. I also don't think the 2008 Aura's have any rebates currently

    My original plan was to wait for the arrival of the 2008 Accords and compare the two cars, but I simply could not pass up this offer. A similarly equipped 08 Accord would have been about 4 grand more. My budget was tight and I liked the Saturn, so I decided just to go with it.
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    Excellent deal ! I was offered $1,500, then later on, as in a few months, I heard of $1,750. Now $2,500 off is really getting it down there. As for the 2008 Accord, I personally am disappointed in the looks of the new one, inside and out. Do believe the seats are a tab bit better. I prefer the '07.

    Did your dealer have any side sticker for add-ons of pin stripes or window etching, or the like?

    I take it the trade-in price went well. That was the point where I lost them.
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,211
    If the Aura Comparison sales tactic worked wonders as you claim, then they would continue to do it indefinitely.....

    Why stop?
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,211
    Oh, and for the record, Saturn did NOT offer any "deep discounting" or any "big time rebates". And IMO, after driving her new Aura a few times, they don't need to.

    Fantastic!!! But in a visit to Saturn's website, they do indeed have rebates on the Aura across the board nation wide I believe. Not only that, but last I checked, the Accord and Camry were still outselling the "no need to discount" Aura.....
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,211
    the salesperson at the Saturn dealer said that a fair amount of people did test-drive all three models, and at least 90% of them picked the Aura over the Camry and Accord. Not only owners of current Saturns, but also Honda, Toyota, and Nissan owners as well.

    Wow, the SATURN salesperson said that? I'm amazed, astounded, and shocked and awed...... ;)

    I think every salesperson at the Honda dealership would agree that the Accord is a better car in every way than the Aura..... ;)
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • chronochrono Posts: 149
    Didn't think I'd get so many reactions here. You know that C&D comparo was using an XE not an XR.

    As for the cheapness, I do agree that there are some cheap bits here and there on the Aura. 2008 Aura solved some of those issues already. And honestly I think my Accord has the same amount of cheap plastics. It's just Honda is better at masking those then the competition although everyone is catching up.

    A pretty good comparo written by Autoweek shows that the XR is very competitive. REE

    As for my trade in. I've been to three dealers all of which are quoting me similar pricing which is kind of depressing since I really want to pull the trigger. Like others have mentioned there's 1500 rebate and a 1000 conquest rebate for 07's.

    I'm actually considering the new Malibu if things don't work out on an 07 Aura. The only thing I don't really like is the front end styling. That grill is huge! One of my favorite things about the Aura is the exterior. The Malibu will be priced better though. An LT2 is, if I remember correctly starting at about 22500. That's without the V6 package. Package pricing hasn't been release yet but I'll assume about 1000-1500 dollars. Plus the LT2 comes with standard suede seats and adjustable pedals. At least that's what I've read so far about that trim level.
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    Well, wouldn't the Aura XR '07 be the deal then at $21,500? Not to say that the 2008 Aura and Malibu won't both be discounted upon release. But perhaps those rebates are buy $1,000 off. Of course a $1,000 + another $1,000 off by the dealer on a New Malibu '08 could be a good deal in that it is one year newer, if you sell a car every say three years. Just a thought. - Loren
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    Looked over that article. Interesting how the Aura lost to Camry in the slalom. Seems like the long wheel based cars don't fare as well. Or is that the wheel base to width ratio? Anyway, it happens with sports cars losing to little, yet wide cars, like say a Mini -- oh doh! - that's a sports car. Anyway, it happens. The car wins the lateral G testing against the Camry, which evidently doesn't have a way to totally take stability off, if I got that right. The Chrysler 300 was limited that way in testing. Oh well, guess most family cars never make it to the race track. :shades: L
  • ykangykang Posts: 88
    You sure have a poor memory.
    Would this refresh your memory?
    Does that mean Sonata's front end will no longer look like 1998 Accord? :confuse:
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    We are here to compare the features and attributes of the CARS!!!

    We're not here to snipe at each other and that just has to stop. Who copied whom first does not matter. What you think someone elses biases are does not matter. It's the specifics of the vehicles themselves contrasted with each other that we should be focusing on. This continuing oneupmanship is unnecessary and certainly not conducive to a productive conversation.

    We have GOT to stick to the cars and drop all this personal stuff. :mad:
  • Fantastic!!! But in a visit to Saturn's website, they do indeed have rebates on the Aura across the board nation wide I believe.

    Wrong again!

    I checked out the site, and noticed only financing offers for the '08 Aura. And 5.9% is for 3 years is pretty pathetic IMO, since one can easily do better at a credit union. No cash-back incentives posted anywhere. As for the '07, well duh! Everyone is offering incentives to unload the '07 models this time of year, including Honda. When she purchased the car in JULY, locally, there were no such incentives or cash-back deals, and the financing rates weren't very stellar either.

    Face it, there are other excellent cars in the midsize class besides the Accord.

    BTW, I'm taking a break from this discussion, since all I seem to read lately are comments made from certain members holding their car on a pedestal while belittling others for their decisions to buy something else, all the while throwing out assumptions and "facts" that just don't hold true anymore.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America I70 & I75 Posts: 21,319
    I'd like to see people list 5 top features or characteristics of their chosen, favorite, owned, whatever car that they'd like me to know about.

    Pat asked posters to do that in some discussion in the past and it was interesting. It helps potential shoppers like myself know what's good about that car.

    I have a potential new or used car in the future in months to give a new driver in the family access to a car. Both cars currently are full-sized. A mid-sized car is my most likely purchase, new or used.

    2015 Cruze 2LT, 2014 Malibu 2LT, 2008 Cobalt 2LT

  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Why don't you stick around and help us get back on the right track? :)
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Yes, listing the top features of your car (or someone else's) that you like is a great way to get information out here that can actually be useful to someone making a shopping decision.

    It's also okay to list a few things about your car that you'd like to change.
  • It's also okay to list a few things about your car that you'd like to change
    I have a 2006.5 KIA Optima.The trip computer has no MPG so I would REALLY like to have that. :blush:
  • It's also okay to list a few things about your car that you'd like to change.

    Here it goes... that's tough because I really like my car a lot!

    2006 Honda Accord EX 4-cyl (cloth)

    I have a power-height controlled seat; why not spend the extra $2 Honda and make it FULL power? Well, they did for 2008 at least.

    Exterior styling was a weak point in this car; the rear end is nice with the LEDs but the front is kind of non-descript.

    Stability Control across the lineup would've been nice too, like Hyundai did.

    Honda has fixed my gripes for the past model, while introducing some new ones (I sat in an LX-P and an EX 4-cyl Accord Sunday - interior quality is no longer head of the class IMO - major disappointment as this was a HUGE plus of getting the Accord over competitors). Now I won't have a clue where to start next time around!
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Some people discuss cars, you chose to discuss people. If you care for automotive discussion, talk cars!
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,907
    We did this not too long ago, but if it helps prospective buyers then great:

    Kia Optima
    * Good blend of ride quality and handling
    * Roomy, high-quality interior but reasonable exterior size
    * Good fuel economy (I4, 5MT or 5AT) for the class
    * Warranty
    * Price/value

    Needs improvement:
    * Better availability of ABS/ESC package (e.g., can't get it on the base trim without an "appearance" package, and even then it's very rare--only 3 LX models with the package in my entire region when I checked a few weeks ago).
    * More power for the V6 (this is not an issue for me as I prefer the I4, but the V6 is outclassed by just about every other car in this segment).
  • urnewsurnews Posts: 668
    A pretty good comparo written by Autoweek shows that the XR is very competitive. - REE

    I found that article to be very enlightening. Unfortunately, we are no longer in the market for a new car, having purchased a 2007 3.0-liter V6 SEL AWD Ford Fusion 9 1/2 months ago on Dec. 4, 2006. Still, it's good to be informed about what's available and how the different models compare to one another.

    People who are in the market for a new car certainly have a lot of good mid-size sedans to choose from these days. I don't believe Accord and Camry dominate the segment the way they used to. Our Fusion is a very good example of an alternative, especially the SEL variation.
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