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Midsize Sedans 2.0



  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,174
    If you mean by translate the fact that as you scroll across the icons a definition pops saying "smile", "grin", etc., yes my computer does that. But when it comes to that symbol it just says "pblt". I googled "pblt" and get nothing even from slang internet language. Don't mean to take up a lot of time but was just curious. Doesn't look like this forum is that active this morning so I don't think I'm depriving anyone of valuable airtime. ;)
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    I have no idea what "pblt" means then. Sorry!
  • exner60exner60 Posts: 11
    On my last tank, I was able to get 501.3 miles with 1.5 gallons left. It's a 2007 Mercury Milan 4-cylinder with the 5-speed manual transmission and 17.5-gallon tank.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    In the universal world of smileys, pblt has always represented the icon sticking its tongue out, and it is meant to be humorous.

    I have always thought that it is supposed to some verbal representation of someone making a "raspberry" sound in sticking out the tongue, but I think I made that up in my own head. :)

    Hope this helps.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,905
    I remember the comparison that somebody did that compared a V6 Sonata Ltd. to an I4 something else because they were the same price. That's really helpful.

    It was a few years ago, when the 2006 Sonata just came out. The purpose of the review was to find out what $22k (I think?) would buy in a mid-sized sedan. Just so happened they were able to buy a V6 Sonata for that price, vs. just an I4 Accord and Camry. I agree with you, I found the review helpful because I typically look for the best car that can meet my needs within a certain budget. Personally an I4 is powerful enough for me in a mid-sized sedan, but I know there are many buyers who would opt for the extra power and smoothness of a V6, especially if they could get it for the same price (or even less!) than an I4.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,905
    I never thought there was any humorous connotation to a "raspberry". For example:

    raspberry: A derisive or contemptuous sound made by vibrating the extended tongue and the lips while exhaling.

    Thesaurus: Any of various derisive sounds of disapproval: boo, catcall, hiss, hoot. Slang bird, Bronx cheer, razz. See sounds/pleasant sounds/unpleasant sounds/neutral sounds or silence.

    There are several other Emotorcons for humorous purposes. I don't think the raspberry is one of them.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Um, the question was what does "pblt" mean. Perhaps you can define it. Clearly I failed in your eyes. ;)

    I would just point out that the icon sticking its tongue out here (and in most places) has a big grin on its face and it's clearly meant to be humorous. To me, the grin would negate any negative connotations to the sound that pblt is supposed to represent, no matter what you call it.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
  • stephen987stephen987 Posts: 1,994
    VW could do a lot worse than bringing an actual Skoda Superb to the US market. IMHO VW's current US offerings are too expensive to compete directly with cars of similar size from other manufacturers. The Rabbit is the lone exception. VW's "traditional" virtues are better represented by the Skoda lineup than by the current Jetta and Passat or the upcoming CC.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,905
    I did try to define it, as best I could. It's clear we just disagree on this. No big deal, right? No need to think you have failed. You just stated your opinion, as I did. That is what this forum is all about.

    Another thing we disagree on is that you see a big grin on the pblt symbol. I see what could be a grimace. Try smiling and doing a "pblt" with your tongue. It's pretty hard to do, isn't it?

    The "pblt" seems to me to be like the sound one would make when doing a raspberry. That's the closest I can come to it. Maybe the person who developed the original "pblt" Emotorcon will see this thread and tell us exactly what he/she was thinking. Then we'll know for sure. Otherwise it's just specualtion, and different opinions.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,174
    Tks. It's just kind of funny that nobody knows what "pblt" stands for. To tell you the truth I couldn't tell what the heck the face was doing....that's why I was curious as to what "pblt" meant. Oh well, I'll have to ask somebody that text msgs all the time. They'll probably know.
  • VW could do a lot worse than bringing an actual Skoda Superb to the US market. IMHO VW's current US offerings are too expensive to compete directly with cars of similar size from other manufacturers. The Rabbit is the lone exception. VW's "traditional" virtues are better represented by the Skoda lineup than by the current Jetta and Passat or the upcoming CC.

    I think the same of the Euro Mondeo and S-Max, but I think the issue is in Europe, those are $40-45k vehicles, and that isn't going to fly in the US. This is why our market gets "dumbed down" versions.

    VW did a US tour a few years back and came to the conclusion that in Europe its about The Drive, and in the US its about everything but...that is a paraphrased quote. Kind of sad I think.
  • stephen987stephen987 Posts: 1,994
    Based on what little I know of European pricing, it seems to me that VW could field Skodas (probably with VW badging) in the US market for perhaps 15-20% lower prices than the corresponding VW. That would be enough to put them a lot closer to the mass market.

    I think the problem is that we don't get dumbed-down (i.e., market-appropriate) VWs.
  • tenpin288tenpin288 Posts: 804
    Here's a link to an interesting article about the challenges US and other automakers have to deal with to "Americanize" their European models for the US market...

    European to US standards challenges
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,174
    Very informative article. Tks.
  • stephen987stephen987 Posts: 1,994
    Aside from the powertrain choices, I wonder how different the US-market VWs are from their Euro-market platform mates. It stands to reason that VW would have had to either (a) design the Passat platform to meet both sets of standards, or (b) design one version for Euro standards and one for US standards. If the platform has already been engineered to fit both sets of standards, and the Superb uses the Passat platform, then it ought to be as easy to sell the Superb in the US as it is to sell the Passat. The same principle might also apply downmarket, to arguably greater effect, as some variation on the Octavia could replace the Rabbit/Jetta.
  • That is a great article. In graduate school I was very familiar with a lot of the details and requirements that differed between the continents. Each region would have it's own standards.
    Part of the issue is the use case for a car is different in the US than in Europe or elsewhere. In Europe, people walk to work *gasp* and are unlikely to drive an hour to get to a Costco or something. It is also one of the reasons EU takes pedestrian crash safety more seriously than the US. A lot of the driving is on rural or urban streets. In the US, people commute over an hour each way to work and don't blink an eye; most of that commute is on ultra-boring low-workload high-speed super-slab. So where cars are driven and why is somewhat different.
    Also, in Europe they have ENCAP (I might have the name wrong) that rates safety using a slightly different paradigm than NHTSA or IIHS. Europeans are less fearful of government and legislation than Americans (which is why photo radar is much more prevalent there than in the states).
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Posts: 3,855
    Kind of silly that one of the specific "problems" identified is "Europe refused to allow rear turn signals to blink red instead of amber". Sooo...just make them amber, since the US allows amber and EU requires amber.

    I do agree that the US crash standards should not be designed to protect fools who choose not to wear their seat belt.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    What you are missing, backy, is that "pblt" has represented the mischievous tongue-sticking-out icon across many sites for many years, way beyond this site. It was not defined here. Sorry you don't see the grin, but it's there, just as it is on other sites. Sometimes it's more of a goofy look than a grin, but the intent is always the same - playful, mischievous, fun-poking, that sort of thing.

    I think we've beaten this subject way beyond any reason now. Time to move on. Thanks for the debate.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,174
    Tks for everyone's help to my curious question. I feel it's anwered and get the intent even if I can't tell exactly what it's doing without a magnifying glass. :P
  • Click me!

    Yes, the Mazda6 finishes first over the Accord and Altima.

    Check out the overall fuel economy that edmunds got in their tests:
    Mazda6: 20 MPG
    Accord: 18 MPG
    Altima: 17 MPG (on Premium no less).

    Another surprise is the fact that Mazda is the only one that uses scissor-hinges to keep them out of interfering with trunk space. I knew that the Altima didn't use them, but the Accord as well? Wow. I thought Honda would be better than that.

    Discuss! :)
  • I'm not surprised by the results. The Mazda is the newest sedan in the midsize family so it packs the most features, the highest horsepower and the best handling (which was to be expected from Mazda) so I'm happy that it did so well in the comparison test.

    The more I look at the new Mazda6 and read reviews on the car, it seems like the new Mazda6 is becoming what the old Accord used to be: A car with sporting intentions with just the right amount of compromises. Handling is best in class, ride falls somewhere in between the chushier Accord and the rougher Altima, the interior has nice materials but isn't as boring lookin inside as the Altima nor as "Star Trek" as the Accords and yet it has the worst EPA ratings of all three cars and comes out on top with observed Fuel economy. I can't remember which poster here begged us not to jump the gun on EPA ratings for the Mazda6 but it appears that he/she might have been least for this comparison test.

    I only wonder why Edmunds didn't add the Camry SEV6 to the comparison test. I wonder how the results would have turned out?
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Posts: 3,855
    Surprising that those other cars still use those cheap, intrusive hinges on the trunk. Even the old version of the mazda6 had the unobtrusive hinges and pneumatic lifters.
  • The dashboards of these three cars offer either too little or too much. The Accord EX-L Navi groups its controls for the audio, navigation and ventilation systems in logical places, but there are so many buttons that it requires either thorough pre-flight study or too much on-the-fly attention to navigate the myriad buttons, displays, knobs and dials.

    That's the reason I hate Accord the most especially the '07.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,905
    I would have liked Edmunds to include the Sonata SE V6 in the comparo, since they haven't tested it yet and it has done well elsewhere, e.g. 2nd in MT's recent 10-car comparo of I4 sedans, where it bested everyone except the Passat.

    Which begs the question... where was the Passat in Edmunds' comparo? Or the Malibu LTZ?
  • The Sonata would have been another good choice for the test as well. I guess since the Malibu came in 3rd place the last go round, Edmunds decided not to compare the car again. Maybe they figured the 6 would slot somewhere between (or in this case) above the last top two sedans compared in the test. That may have been the same reason the Camry was left out of the Comparison test as well. Didnt it come in dead last in the last Edmunds V6 comparison???

    It really wouldn't make sense to compare the Passat to the other three midsize V6 sedans considering the price of a V6 Passat would put it well into Acura TL territory and the fact that for MY09 the Passat will only be available with the 2.0t four cylinder engine in "Komfort" trim. Using an 08 probably would have been more of a hassle to obtain too. All 09 model Passats will be four more "Turbo", "Lux" or "VR6" models. :( and no more manual transmissions either :mad:
  • but there are so many buttons that it requires either thorough pre-flight study or too much on-the-fly attention to navigate the myriad buttons, displays, knobs and dials.

    That's the reason I hate Accord the most especially the '07.

    But the 07 model didn't have that many buttons!
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    This was a V6 comparo, not an I4 comparo. Maybe that is why it was left out. I have a funny feeling that the performance numbers would have been creamed by all three competitors.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,905
    I'm not so sure about that. In the MT comparo, the Passat 2.0T turned in some excellent performance numbers including 0-60 and was far and away the favorite in terms of handling. The Passat doesn't seem to get much print in general in these comparos (except the recent MT one).
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