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Geo Metro Engine Questions



  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    Yes, what you said is right; except for one thing. The name e-prom does not mean the engine contol computer. It is the name of one small part which is located inside that computer. The computer is called the EEC, for electronic engine control. EEPROM means electronic engine programmable unit. The eprom is the part that contains the instructions to tell the rest of the computer how to process the information it receives from all the vehicle's sensors. This part is also known as the "chip." It is the only part in the computer that can be programmed.
  • jrilljrill Posts: 2
    the timing gear on my 95 metro 1.3 L broke and I ordered a new one. the problem is that the engine has been replaced before I bought it and i guess the engine is diff. from the original. the new gear came and it only had four bolt holes for the belt pulley and the old one has five holes. does anyone out there know how to identify the year of my engine with the engine I.D. number??? Or do I have to keep ordering pulleys at 35 bucks a pop till I get the right one?? The dealers and junkyards are no help....
    :confuse: :confuse:
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    Both the crankshaft timing belt sprocket and the camshaft timing belt sprocket (which are located underneath the timing cover) on the 1990 Metro 1.0 3 cyl engine are attached with just one bolt. But the crankshaft pulley for the fan, water pump, and alternator belt is attached with 4 bolts. So it sounds like you are referring to that pulley; rather than the timing sprocket. The number of bolts used on the pulley for the 1.0 liter 3 cyl engine may be different from those on the pulley for the 1.3 liter 4 cyl engine. So you may have been ordering the wrong pulley; or the clerk may have misunderstood your engine information.

    But if you have been ordering a pulley for the correct engine; my experience with these apparently incompatible part situations is that they frequently happen when Suzuki engines are used to replace Geo engines. Suzuki (who designed and built the Geo Metro for GM) also sold a very similar, but not identical car called the Suzuki Swift. The Swift was produced with several different engines which might have been installed as a replacement in your car. These were the G13B, which is an 8 valve, SOHC, 1.3 liter 4; that was used in Swifts from 1989-2001. The G13A was an engine of the same description that was used in Swifts from 1989-1997. There was also an SF310, which was a 1.0 liter 4, used in Swifts from 1990-1994. And there was an SJ413; which was a 1.3 liter 4 used in a car called the SJ413 in 1985. Those would be the most likely engines to have been transplanted into your Metro.

    Suzuki also made a car called the Forsa from 1985-1988, with an SA310 motor that was a 1.0 liter 4.

    Both Suzuki and Chevy dealers have exploded parts diagrams on microfiche, or on computer; which should include an image of the fan belt pulley for each model engine; that would show how many bolt holes it has. So you may have to personally go to the parts departments at those dealerships; in order to look at the microfiches. You could also make a trip to a local auto wrecker who has a 4 cylinder Geo or Chevy Metro to look at the pulley. It may be that the pulley used on engines with power steering or air conditioning has more bolt holes than the one used on cars without those accessories. And even if your engine does not have those accessories; they may have been on the car that the engine came from.
  • jrilljrill Posts: 2
    Thanks for the info. After several trips and phone calls I found a pulley at the dealer for a 96 Geo, the only diff. is that it has spokes on the back of the pulley for the crank sensor, my Eng. has a distributor and no sensor. After reading your info I looked over the engine and found a casting tag on the end of the head by the bell housing, It reads [G 13 B]. so it seams that I may have a swift engine. As far as the year of the engine I still have no clue. But all things said, at least I got the little thing going and it is running good again. Again, thanks for the info and help. :shades:
  • A few days ago my 98 Chevy Metro LSi 1.3l 4cyl 250k miles, drove fine to work but when I got off and tried to start it, it would run real rough and stall after a few minutes. After a few more starts it would seem a few minutes turned into 5-10 seconds, now it does not turn over. I borrowed a ODB II sensor from a friend and it read a P0335 code (crank position A circuit malfunction) so the next day I bought a new sensor and installed it, made sure the the teeth inside were fine. Everything seemed good so I crossed my fingers and went to start it.... With it having the same issue with no code due to dissconnecting the battery. Now I cant get it to run at idle to produce a new code. Spark plugs/wires are fairly new(I have spark), timing belt seemed fine, I know I have fuel in the tank, checked the fuses under the hood and under the dash. Any ideas what im looking for now? I have a feeling it has something to do with fuel delivery? Any help would be A+ in my book right now.
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    This sounds to me like your timing belt has jumped out of position; but it looks fine because it is still physically intact. You can check this by turning the engine until the timing mark on the crankshaft pulley lines up with the 5 degree mark on the scale on the timing cover. Then remove the distributor cap and see where the tip of the rotor is pointing. The rotor should point DIRECTLY to either the cap terminal for the plug wire to number 1 cylinder or the wire to number 4 cylinder. If it points anywhere else; the timing belt has jumped, and must be replaced.
  • Well my dad said he checked the timing belt after I changed the crankshaft sensor but I will give it another look today when I get off work. Will update when I check it. Thank you zaken1 for replying.
  • joehujoehu Posts: 1
    Does anybody have a full diagram of the vacume and emmision hoses to a 1991 geo metro or maybe pictures of them within the engine compartment. I can't find any, even in repair manuals.
  • rjcurajrjcuraj Posts: 1
    Hello to all,
    I am new to this commmunity. I am looking at 1993 Geo Metro Convertible. I have never owner a Metro before but I like this car and the asking price is $1000. I would like to know what can I expect from a Metro? This on has had a new head gasket installed. I noticed the inside of the tail pipe is wet with what appears to be dirty oil. I am told it does run. And only needs some cosmestic issues repaired. I am will be going to check it tonight and will learn more when I start it up. I would be taking to my mechanic to have the compression checked, brakes, exhaust system and the electrical.
    Any thought on what else to look for would be appreciated.
    $1000. Seems to be a very good price??
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    If the head gasket was replaced without having a machine shop check the head to see if it was cracked or warped when the motor overheated; then there still may be coolant leaking into the cylinders. And that could be why the exhaust pipe is wet. (But it is also normal for the exhaust pipe to become wet when the engine is first started. However, it should dry out after a few miles of driving). So it would be a good idea to pressure check the cooling system; including seeing whether it holds pressure when the motor is running. It would also be a good idea to check whether the electric radiator fan comes on when the coolant temperature goes more than 3/4 of the way up on the gauge. The fan relay often goes out on those cars; which will lead to overheating and potential engine damage. And if you live in a state which requires an emission inspection on change of ownership; that emission test will tell you a lot about the condition of the engine. Incidentally, here in California, it is the seller's responsibility to pay for the smog test, and to make sure the car passes.

    Some of the other things that could be a problem on such a car are the amount of life left in the battery, the amount of wear left in the brakes, the condition of the tires, whether the clutch is slipping or needs adjustment, how much oil the car uses between changes (or whether the oil was even changed regularly). If the motor is in good condition, I would find out what brand and weight of oil the owner was using, and would make an effort to continue using the same oil brand and type. This can make a substantial difference in the length of the engine life.

    Also; many mechanics consider compression good if it is similar in all the cylinders. But on the Metro, it also has to be AT LEAST 170 psi in all cylinders.(Normal compression on that motor is 195 psi).

    The kind of service you'll get from such a car will depend greatly on its mechanical condition; and on the quality of maintenance and repair it has been given. Metro engines are extremely responsive to the way they are maintained. Neglect, abuse, or misadjust them; and they will fall apart. Keep them well tuned, treat them with respect; and they will be astonishingly trouble free and economical. If you get less than 38 mpg in city driving; or less than 50 mpg on long highway trips; the engine is not running right. But those figures are for a car with a 5 speed transmission. Metros with an automatic will get about 10 mpg less than those with a stick shift.
  • I have an 89 metro 3 cyl 5 speed and i rebuild the head and replaced the burnt valve and cleaned everything right up. the cylinder walls looked exceptional but the rings r bad. I only getting 145 psi give or take a few on all 3 cylinders. I know they need replaced. So since it is still summer and hot in indiana i stopped my excessive oil consumption by puttin some stp in the oil and whatever else it lost after i put in some 10w40 and it stopped burning oil. Now I know that it's not the greatest for these engines but i currently dont have the cash flow to rebuild it. Now getting further to my question, after i rebuilt the head, i ran a couple tanks through the car and then had to leave for maine for a month and i parked the car at my grandmothers house. I am certain that no one messed with anything on the car while i was away, but now the check engine light comes on periodically, and it only seems to be when im at slower speeds or downshifting to slow down. I am thinking a bad sensor because the car doesnt seem to run anydifferent when the light comes on. Where is the OBD 1 plug for these cars. i have the key for reading it but i do not know where to stick it. When i rebuild it i was going to replace most of the sensors but for the time being i want to make sure the car will make it until then. thanks to all
  • gentleman......just picked up a 89 LSI....I knew it had problems when I bought it,but it looked good and my 93 was having problems so for $800 what the hek.....
    anyway its been a real headache from day one!! itll start but doesnt sound right and make a familiar timing belt noise" ive heard that sound before" thiers also clicking coming from the head, when it 1st starts I can see smoke out the pipe
    heres the bad part>>>>>>>>>> Ill excellerate out of 1st and it wants to pop and fart then it dies like its not getting gas, well this BS has happened on the freeway 2-3 times and the car just dies!!!!! Ill wait a few minutes and itll start.....

    2 things are possible, ignition or fuel...just tinkering around havent been able to figure it out ............Ive replaced the plugs.rotor,cap and wires but nothing seems to simply runs rough!! BTW when I pulled the old plugs the elctrodes were eatin away and the plugs looked terrible!! they also had plug extentions on all 3.....I dont know why? the car also eats oil like thiers no tommorrw!! any ideas??
    the speedo reads 104K....or so it sez!? the clutch pedal isnt that worn down so it could be right, ...I belive it was not replaced
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    When the check engine light comes on under the conditions you listed; it almost always is caused by the "insufficient EGR" code. That can be triggered by too lean a fuel mixture, or too much spark advance, or intake or exhaust modifications, or a clogged or disconnected EGR valve; any of which can cause the motor to run at such a small throttle opening that the EGR valve does not receive enough of a vacuum signal; so it does not open as far as it normally would. If the compression is too low; it can also set that code. These engine will not tolerate changes from stock specs.

    The code readout is turned on by shorting two terminals in the fuse block under the dashboard; but it's been so long that I forgot where the terminals are. Sorry about that. It's in the service manual.
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    It sounds like the reason they put extensions on the plugs was because they were fouling from all the oil the engine was burning. There is no way to tune out the consequences of low compression. So since that is probably the root of the problem here; run a compression check on all 3 cylinders. Stock compression on that motor is 195 psi. If any cylinder is below 170 psi; you'll never be able to make it run right without an overhaul.
  • I do not have an EGR valve though. Some 89 models didn't have them, when i rebuilt the head because i had a burnt exhaust valve i started to look for why the valve burnt. the first thing i looked to replace was the EGR valve and there was none. so i did some research. I believe the valve burnt because the catalytic converter was improperly installed by the previous owner. I believe the timing is supposed to be 6 degrees or something like that. I cant remember for sure but i can check within the week, do you remember what the timing specs are? also, This happened a day after my cousin installed a radio in the car, it previously did not have one and had the harness cut. Could something have shorted? because now the light has not come on at all in 2 days
  • is it possible to swap a 96 4 cylinder and drop it into a 98 with a 3 cylinder
  • I'm looking at buying a 93 metro but it has low compression in the third hole is this a burnt valve and how would I check this or does it just need a new motor
  • i had same problem new set of rings and stainless valves and it will last you a long time cost of my job 1000.00
  • I need to replace to 3 cylinder engine of my '95. Will a 3-cylinder and trany from a '92 drop right in or do I need to bring along the cv axles, hub-knuckle assemblies, and struts?
  • Bought the car a year ago and had to replace the fuel module to get it running, and it has been running strong, however occasionally the fuel pump will not come on and bring the fuel system to pressure when the ignition is turned on. The way i get around this is simply to turn the key back and fourth four or five times and eventually the pump will kick on. The pump corresponds with the check engine light. in other words when the pump is not working the check engine light will not come on before the car is started and when the pump does work the check engine light will come on and turn off as soon as the car started. this is what makes me think it is an ignition problem. possibley a switch somewhere? have any of you encountered this before? or at least what is your guess at what the problem is?
  • My son limped home my Geo and it has not started since. It cranks, all cylinders have good pressure, Have fuel no spark. Tested Coil and it reads good. I do not have a crank P/U. The distributor pick-up coil test good, The distributor ignitor may be the problem...I am unable to check at this time and can't find info on how to test. Is there anything else that I could check before I buy parts?
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    Before you start testing for spark anywhere; it is essential to understand that you cannot jumper across the ignition switch on a Metro to make the engine run. There is an anti theft circuit built into this electrical system which shuts down the spark if you jumper across the ignition switch (even when the key is turned on). So you must have all the wiring connected in the stock routing.

    A> The next thing to check is to remove the distributor cap and have someone watch the rotor while the engine is being cranked. If the rotor does not turn steadily as the engine is cranked; then the timing belt has broken or slipped out of position. If the rotor does turn; then turn the crankshaft until the timing marks line up at the 6 degrees BTDC position. At that position; the tip of the rotor should either be pointing STRAIGHT UP, OR STRAIGHT DOWN. If it points anywhere else; the timing belt has jumped out of position.

    You say you have no spark; but you didn't specify the location where you found there was no spark. This can be critically important; because the spark can be blocked by something as basic as a defective ignition switch. If that were the case; and you hadn't first checked to see if there was battery supply voltage at the coil positive terminal, you could spend a fortune replacing every part in the entire ignition system, and never see any improvement. So, to do ignition diagnosis properly, and avoid needless waste of money; you need to start at the source, and then work step by step along the entire path from the battery to the spark plug..

    B> Make sure you're getting full battery power to the coil; and confirm a voltmeter reading with a large bulb (24 watt stoplight or equivalent) to be sure that the voltage is maintained when an appreciable current is being drawn from the power source. A bad test reading could come from high internal resistance in the ignition switch, or a poor connection between the battery ground cable and the engine; or between the battery ground cable and the inner fender. There MUST be a solid conection between the battery and BOTH of those points.

    C> If you get a confirmed voltage and power supply at the coil; check the igniter by connecting a good, old fasioned point dwell meter between ground and the coil negative lead. Crank the starter; and you should see a dwell reading of somewhere between 25% and 75% of the maximum number of degrees on the scale. So, if you had the dwell scale set to 8 cylinders, where 45 degrees is the maximum possible reading; you should get a reading somewhere between 11 degrees (which is about 25% of 45) and 33 degrees (which is about 75% of 45). If you use the 6 cylinder dwell scale, where 60 degrees is the maximum possible reading; your reading should be between 15 degrees and 45 degrees. It really doesn't matter which number of cylinders scale you use; it is only the PERCENTAGE of the full scale reading that we care about, and that will be the same regardless of which dwell scale is used.

    D> If the dwell meter test comes out good; then test for spark directly between the coil high voltage terminal and ground. First check the resistance of the coil to distributor cap high voltage wire with an ohmmeter. The resistance should be less than 1,000 ohms per inch of wire length (so a 12" long wire should have less than 12,000 ohms resistance, etc. If the resistance is greater than that; replace the entire set of plug wires.) Just hold the end of the coil to distributor cap wire about 1/4" to 1/2" from a metal part on the engine (with your hand at least 6 inches back from the end), and crank the motor. If there is no spark in that test and all of the previous tests were good; then either the coil is defective (or the wrong model part for this car) or the distributor pick up coil is defective (even though you said it tested good).

    E> If you have a spark at the coil, but not at the plugs; then with the distributor cap off and the rotor in place, hold the end of the coil wire next to the metal blade on the rotor while the engine is cranked. There should NOT be a spark to the rotor in this test. If there is a spark; the rotor is grounded and must be replaced.

    F> If the rotor tests good, and there is no spark to the plugs; then either the distributor cap or the plug wires are bad.

    G> Whenever there has been a lot of driving with an ignition problem; the spark plugs can build up conductive deposits which will then make the engine run badly; even after the problem is fixed. So it is always good insurance to replace the plugs.

    Please note that Metro engines are highly sensitive to both plug brand and gap setting. I strongly recommend avoiding NGK plugs in this motor (although I use them on other vehicles where they are an appropriate choice) and suggest using only Autolite # 63, ACDelco # R42CXLS, Champion Truck Plug # 4430, or Bosch # 4306 platinum +2, or Bosch Fusion # 4506.

    I hope this helps!!!
  • I recently changed plugs and wires on my daughters 2000 metro 4-cylinder. I was confused by how many wires needed changed. I told her to go buy plugs/wires, she came back with 4 plug wires but I only saw 2 that I could change. The other 2 just have wires (not plug wires) that connect to other plugs.
    One more thing, does the 2000 metro have a fuel filter and a mass air flow sensor?
  • "One more thing, does the 2000 metro have a fuel filter and a mass air flow sensor?"

    2000 CHEVROLET METRO 1.0L 3-cyl Engine Code [6]

    Fuel Filter WIX 33569 Fuel Filter
  • We have to replace cylinder head in 1990 Geo Metro because it had a crack and we bought a used cylinder head from another 1994 Geo metro in which there are 2 valves which are burnt.
    Here are my questions.

    1.Can we use the good valves from our old cracked head ?or we should buy all new valves?
    2.Replace only those 2 burned valves? or replace them all?
    3.What is the best way to check this new head and valves that it is going to last for some time?
  • cafanncafann Posts: 27
    My mother has a metro 4cyl with auto trans. been running great still does however a noise has come up and until I can confirm what it is she'd not driving it.

    The noise is like a metal rattling sound when the engine is running. It sounds over near the belts, so the pass side of the car. I listen sloser to the engine and it sounds within right near the belts.I noticed something sounded funny weeks ago but now the sound is much louder.

  • May be the crankshaft pulley. These models are known for this problem. There are other posts on this site describing it. I have a 96 Metro with the same problem. If it hasn't already, it will eventually cause the car to run rough because the wobbling pulley throws the crankshaft position sensor off. There is a post on this forum outlining a do-it-yourself fix. I haven't tried it yet, but plan on it in the spring.
  • hey folks, I am new here and I am looking to find some one who can tell me if the geo engine can be used as stationary power scorce. If so dose it matter what year.Would appreciate any help I can get. Thank you in advance.
  • I have a 1997 Geo Metro lsi with the 1.3L 4 cylinder engine. It starts and runs great. Has about 230,000 miles on it but after warming up and driving maybe about 30 miles it acts like it runs out of gas. I pump the gas a few times and it runs ok for a while longer or does it again after a few miles. The local repair shop can find nothing wrong but, did reproduce the problem. They put a fuel pressure gauge on it and ran it. The fuel pressure is good even when this happens. I have changed the fuel filter, spark plugs, wires, rotor, cap and even the coil. It also "seems" to be worse when driving in rain or fog, if that would make any difference.
    Today it totally quit on my. I coasted over to the side of the road, turned off the ignition and restarted it and drove the next 10 miles (about) to work without any problems (my total commute is 66 miles one way).
    Any ideas as to what to check???
  • While shopping online I see many different part numbers for shocks and struts for my 92 metro. I know the convertible has 13" wheels, so does that affect which front strut to buy. The KYB's have a different strut for left or right side but the other manufacturers don't. What's up with that? The monroes have three different struts for this year car, so which one is the right one?
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