Toyota RAV4 Cruise Control Problems

jimintn

(200709290120) Jim

mlmcgahee

Thanks Jim... We have a total of 12 case numbers now. Keep them coming...

(200708081405) Charles
(200708081371) Mike
(200708100591) Pam
(200708101001) Gerald
(200708140250) Cindy
(200708170082) Ron
(200708210991) Steve
(200708220207) Kay
(200708280198) Bill
(200708140096) Dana
(200709060769) Hal
(200709290120) Jim

To everyone who is reading this thread and have an 06 - 07 RAV4 with the Cruse Control Problem.

Call the Toyota Customer Experience Center at 800-331-4331 and get a case number like we have.

Tell them there are others with the same problem and reference our case numbers. The corporate guys get these comments/complaints... Maybe they will read these and light a fire under technical support for a fix to our RAV4 Cruse Control problem.

Post a message back here with your first name and case number so others can call and reference our case numbers on this problem.

Mike

rayray6

I took my RAV4 to the dealer last night and a representative from Toyota met me there and bought it back. He gave it a very thorough inspection but decided there wasn't any damage that couldn't be considered normal wear and tear. They paid me back what I paid them except for a deduction for the mileage it had on it when I first brought it in with the cruise control problem. This deduction was apparently in accordance with my state's lemon law provisions. All in all this has been a sad experience, but I'm glad that I was treated fairly in the end. Not so many years ago I wouldn't have gotten this level of satisfaction. I've learned to appreciate the internet even more than I did before. Thanks to all of you who helped bring this problem to Toyota's attention and good luck with your situations.

gunga64

Is it limited to the v4 or does the v6 have an issue as well?

thr

Thanks Cindy, Your advice as well as others accepted and acted on. My Customer Claim Form initiating arbitration mailed 03/10/07. It took a week or so to get over my rejection of the possibility that a Toyota could be imperfect. Now I want my RAV4 fixed, replaced with a new one without the cruise problem, or give me a refund and take this one back. I might even have my faith in Toyota restored.
thr

mlmcgahee

I test drove a V6 RAV4 last Friday and it was perfect. No problems at all. The V6 climbed hills with out having to downshift like my 4 cyl. does. It was smooth, powerful, and only gets 1 mpg less than the 4 cyl.

I am requesting a swap out to a V6 RAV4 rather than a buyback.

Mike

cbmorton

I can confirm - I have the V6 and there's no gear hunting on hills. If it needs to downshift you get one, and then an upshift at the top.

sumrx4

Has anyone actually had the arbitraton meeting yet?
Mine is tomorrow (tuesday 9th) and was wondering what I should expect.

rayray6, I can only hope my situation turns out as well as yours did. congrats!

crtzlow...have you heard anymore from Toyota?

pam14

I'm meeting with the Toyota field engineer tomorrow (10/10) and arbitration is scheduled for Oct. 19. I'll keep you all informed of the outcome.

crtzlow

Cindy is supposed to call them back today and make sure everything is going according to the plan. Our buy back meeting is scheduled for Wednesday of this week. They are going to deduct only for the mileage before the claim was filed. I'll let you know how things go.
Fingers and eyes crossed.

Don
aka: crtzlow

rayray6

sumrx4, As you know, Toyota settled with me before my arbitration meeting took place. I did get some information from a lawyer, however, when I wrote up my paper work for the arbitration hearing. Perhaps his suggestions might help you. He suggested that I be very specific in terms of what I am requesting. For example, rather than saying, "I want Toyota to buy it back." You should say I expect to recieve $xx,xxx.xx for my vehicle when I return it to Toyota. Take copies of everything: your purchase agreement, and any documentation of money you have put into the car. For me that included a trailer hitch I had installed as well as mudflaps. These were not intalled by Toyota, but they covered them. They weren't big deals, but they wouldn't do me any good off the car, so I provided receipts, asked for the money, and they gave it to me. Check your state's lemon laws (google them). Try to use the language they use in their form if they have one like WI does. Also, don't be afraid to ask for any other costs you might have incurred like rental fees while the car was at the dealership, etc. They can always give you less than you ask for, but they will never give you more than you request. Good luck.

crtzlow

That is what we were told before we submitted the paperwork for arbitration. To be very specific in what you wanted. Our choices were to fix the car, swap for a V6, or buy it back.

Good Luck Sumrx4!!!

Don

crtzlow

The V6 Rav 4's are great! Plenty of power and no "gear hunting". No major problems with them that I have found on the forums. Toyota wanted around $3K difference between the 4 cylinder and the V6 to swap out. From all the information we have gotten today we will meet at the dealership next week and they will inspect the vehicle for any damage and then give us the buyback check.

Don

jimalso

I purchased a 2008 RAV4 4 cyl 2 weeks ago and have the same problem. Case number 200710091064.

ces1938

If I were you guy, knowing what I know now I would run, not walk and take that sucker back to the dealer and make them keep it till they fix it (they wont) or give you your money back (they might) if you scream and raise enough hell with them, my Rav is a 2006 with 15000 miles on it, my problem is that it wont do it all the time and my dealer is not interested, he knows he wont be selling me a car in a while, he sold me two of them in one year, my other car is a Camry, but I like it... :lemon: :sick: :mad:

sumrx4

Make a copy of all the case #'s here and take it back as fast as you can. I would also check the buyers order and whoever you financed it with and see if there is a grace period that will allow you to get out of the purchase.
When you go to the dealer I would not mess with the sales people...I would see the Customer Relations Manager and the dealer President and demand a resolution.
Go straight to the top of the food chain!!!

mlmcgahee

Hi jimalso,

Please provide a first name with your case number so I can ad it to our list...

Thanks,

Mike

me1939

I have an arbitration meeting at my dealership Wednesday concerning the shifting back and forth from 2nd to 3 gear when using cruise control. Today I received a copy of the Manufacturer's Response Form with Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A., Inc's "Manufacturer's Statement."
It appears they are going to resist all logic. They have stated: "The customer is currently experiencing a concern with the cruise control. When the cruise control is in use and the vehicle climbs an incline an rpm surge is experienced. This concern is characteristic of this make/model vehicle. The use, value or safety of the vehicle is not substantially impaired by this concern. No repairs have been attempted. Because the use, value or safety of the vehicle has not been substantially impaired due to this concern we feel that this vehicle does not qualify for a repurchase."
If this is going to be Toyota's attitude it looks like we need to find another car manufacturer before another purchase.
I have had the vehicle in the shop twice for the problem and the service dept. acknowledges the problem and keep expecting a Technical Service Bulletin to tell them how to fix it. IT LOOKS LIKE THERE IS NO FIX! Wish me luck on my arbitration meeting. Kay

pam14

Kay, I received the same statement from Toyota as "Manufactuer's Response." The statement annoyed me too. I'm sure Toyota will continue to disavow any problem--that is a predictable response from them. What counts is what happens at Arbitration.

How many miles do you have on your car? I have about 6500 now and the cruise control problem seems to be going away. My arbitration is scheduled for Friday, Oct 19, but I may delay arbitration so that I have more opportunity to check if the problem is really gone or not. The arbitration can be delayed and then reinstated at any time. Pam

ces1938

I have 17,000 miles on my 2006 Rav, and the cruse is no better now than it ever was, I have just learned to put up with it, when I know it is about to kick out I just go ahead and tap the brake or lever and just use my foot on the accelerator, that way it does not down shift when I go over a hill, what a deal on a new car huh?? As far as the problem going away, mine will in about a year when I get rid of the car, Toyota can count me as a lost customer... Way I look at it Toyota, is if you screw me once, shame on you, if you screw me twice shame on me....
Charles

wdpcpa

"How many miles do you have on your car? I have about 6500 now and the cruise control problem seems to be going away."

As I reported earlier, my wife took a trip and ours didn't act up. It hasn't acted up since that trip. It was suggested to me to make sure the air conditioning was on and to see if that extra load would return the gear hunting. I think you should do that. Please report back.

Mine is in the shop. When I get it back, I will try to check it on modest inclines.

The Manufacturer's response flat out misstates the problem. Increasing RPMs and shifting in and out of gear isn't the same thing. If they can't write down what the problem is, how can they hope to fix it.

Would be nice to get some national exposure - anyone got an idea?

Bill

mlmcgahee

I have had my new 2007 RAV4 for 6 months. As of today I have 12800 miles on it. It has been in the shop and had the transmission replaced twice. Including the original one that came in the RAV4 this makes my third transmission. This is a direct result of the cruise control problem. The only time the problem goes away is when you do not use the AC in the vehicle...

Mike

me1939

Pam:

I have about 3600 miles on my vehicle.
Be sure you have your Air Conditioner on when show the problem. Like Mike (#176) it seems to work with the A/C off.

Kay

nipper101

I just mailed arbitration paperwork today. I have 7500 miles on my 2007 RAV4 that I have owned for almost 4 months. The cruise control problem continues. Could someone compile a list of those who have filed arbitration and where they are at in the arbitration process? I am becoming confused on who has filed and what their outcome is. I would like to present this information at my arbitration hearing. Seems to me, if they offer a buyback or exchange for one person, they should have to make an offer to everyone that is having the same problem. Does that make sense to anyone else? Thank you to everyone involved in this forum!!
Ron

bearcrkrd

Hi. My first car with Cruise Control was a 2001 Camry with the 4 cylinder and 5 speed Manual transmission. The cruise worked super. Fifth gear on the freeway, and you barely slowed on big hills. Worked perfect.
Next, I had a 2005 Tacoma. Base model, 4 cylinder, 4 x 2, extra-cab, with the SR5 pkg and 4 spd Automatic transmission.
What a difference! I learned rather quickly to turn off the cruise control on hills, or else it downshifted, sometimes close to Redline. Spooky, after the Camry. By the way, that base model extra-cab Tacoma 4 banger was a supreme freeway cruiser. I had to trade it because after 18 mo it already had close to 40,000 miles. You could drive all day at 65-75 and watch the sights go by. And I did, over and over!
One year ago I bought a 2006 Sienna with the 3.3 Litre six cylinder and 5 speed Automatic transmission. It does downshift on hills on the freeway with the Cruise Control on, but nothing intrusive. Just 400 RPM's higher, or so. I turn it off on long sweeping uphills. You can use less gas pedal on those manually than the Cruise applies. Not as sweet as the Camry, but the Sienna is acceptable. I got tired of shifting my own anyway, especially in rush-hour traffic here in the Seattle-Tacoma area.
I kicked the tires on the new 6 cyl 2 WD Rav a couple weekends ago. Didn't test drive, just sat in it. Very tempting.

ronn

Folks,
I really do feel sorry for you and the problems you are having with the 4 cyl and the cruise, and Toyota should do what they can to fix the problem, however I think people should be careful in selecting a 4 cyl. with the weight of the RAV4. Before I decided to buy the 6cyl. AWD, I did alot of research, and I also looked back on my 92 4 cyl. Camry. Any time I went up a grade, the Camry had problems, even without the cruise but with the AC on. The cruise on the Camry did the same thing. It was hard on the car, and it constantly tried to shift.
When test driving the RAV4 08, I went up some steep grades with the AC on, and the 4cyl. was not good. It kept shifting and did not have the power. The V6 was great, with no problem.
I have a mechanic friend who works for Toyota, and he told me to never get the 4cyl with the weight that the RAV4 has. For flat driving, you are fine, but it will not pull hills, and really puts the engine in a bind. I will say that the salesman told me that the V6 had too much power, and the 4 was enough. PLease do not listen to that. If you get a RAV4, you need a V6. Very little difference in gas, and it runs so much better. The V6 was also more quiet, as the 4 cyl. engine makes more noise.
I hope all of you get straighten out, and I know it is a disappointment to you when you buy a new car and have these problems. Please know that I am not badgering anybody, just stating facts from a reliable mechanic, and also studying and test driving alot before making decisions. I wish you well, and hope those of you that are trying to get the V6 as a trade, win! Yoy will be very happy with the V6. I have friends that already have the V6, I am still waiting on mine to come in. They havehad no problems with their 2007 or 2008 that already ahve them.
Best of luck!

sumrx4

Ronn...I appreciate your comments and understand exactly what you are saying. My response to that is: If the 4cyl. does not have enough power to effectivly perform under normal driving conditions than it should not be offered and is therefore still a problem that Toyota should address. Personally I do not see this as the problem.

I had my arbitration hearing last week and I am awaiting the decision of the arbitrator. As some of you mentioned from letters you received from Toyota I experienced basically the same thing at the meeting. During the hearing there was a rep. from Toyota present via speakerphone. According to the rep. Toyota's stance on the issue was that it was a "characteristic" of the vehicle, not a problem. It was also made clear that Toyota was not developing any type of repair for the situation nor had any intention of doing so. I then asked if they had ever driven any vehicle that acted as this one does....My question was never answered!!!
They flat out refused to answer the question and said that performance of other vehicles was irrevelant to the hearing.

According to the time frame given by the arbitrator I should receive notice of the decision by Fri. the 19th. Whatever that decision is I will let everyone know.

me1939

I attend an Arbitration Hearing today concerning the cruise control problem. The arbitrator, a representative from the dealership made a scheduled call to the Toyota Inc. representative. Toyota Inc.'s representative explained Toyota’s opinion and offered me a 100,000/5 year bumper to bumper service warranty. I turned it down in lieu of arbitration.
Toyota also said the problem was not serious and would not harm the vehicle. She said the cruise control was an accessory and did not effect the vehicles operation. Also a Technical Service Bulletin should be out in the first quarter of 2008 with a fix for the problem.
After the phone conversation I took the arbitrator for a drive and demonstrated the defect. The demonstration (In my opinion) was perfect. Setting the cruise control at 65 MPH tapping the brakes and letting the vehicle drop to 55 MPH and then pushing resume on a slight hill; the vehicle switched back and forth from 3rd to 2nd gear about 5 times before settling out again in 4th gear.
The arbitrator could not comment but said he would make a decision in about 2 or 3 days but it would be about 10 days before I would get the results. Kay

sumrx4

What really seems odd to me is that we all have different stories about posible resolutions and different action being claimed by Toyota. Where is all the inconsistance coming from? Do the reps. from Toyota not communicate with each other. Maybe the rep from each case has the authority to act as they see fit without answering to anyone. One would think if they all had to report to some type of central office there would be more consistancy between them. Maybe each is giving ua a line in an attempt to satisfy us and shut us up!! It all seems very wierd to me!!!! Any ideas??? :confuse:

pam14

My car has about 6500 miles and the cruise control has not malfunctioned recently so I have postponed my arbitration hearing. Last week the field engineer, a dealer's rep, a friend of mine, and I all rode in the car together to test the cruise control. The car had a full tank of gas and the AC was on in order to stress the engine as much as possible. We drove the same highway in cruise control where I had consistently had problems in the past and there was no malfunction at all. Since then I have driven the same highway by myself without malfunction. I talked with the Nat'l Dispute Center and they have put my case "on hold" and I can reinstate it at any time. Since a Toyota representative or engineer have not witnessed the problem I only have my video to prove the problem and I was concerned that I would lose the arbitration hearing. My state (Missouri) also has a Lemon Law which I could pursue if the arbitration fails. So now when I drive on t he highway I carry my camera with me just in case. The engineer also told me that a "fix" might be available by first quarter of 2008. I was so happy with my Corolla for ten years and I am so disappointed that Toyota engineer designed the RAV4 so poorly.

wdpcpa

"After the phone conversation I took the arbitrator for a drive and demonstrated the defect. The demonstration (In my opinion) was perfect. Setting the cruise control at 65 MPH tapping the brakes and letting the vehicle drop to 55 MPH and then pushing resume on a slight hill; the vehicle switched back and forth from 3rd to 2nd gear about 5 times before settling out again in 4th gear.
The arbitrator could not comment but said he would make a decision in about 2 or 3 days but it would be about 10 days before I would get the results."

Kay,

Your my hero. Thanks for making sure the issue was demostrated beyond question.

Bill

sumrx4

For what it's worth I too took the dealer rep and the arbitrator for a ride at the arbutrators request. I was able to demonstrate the problem three times naturally.
I posted earlier that I asked the Toyota rep if they had ever experienced this type of problem, and while they would not answer the question the arbitrator admitted she had never seen a vehicle act this way!

bearcrkrd

Correct. Absolutely amazing what 4 cyl vehicles can do these days, how far we have come! But there is a limit.
I do not think Cruise control is meant to be used on hills? I am not an engineer. I know if you stick your finger in a light socket is hurts like heck. Have not advanced past that point. There, I'm outed.
Wish you all well! After discovering the limitations of the cruise on my 4 cyl Tacoma, even though I now drive another vehicle, I am still uncomfortable when approacing a hill. Pavlov. I just turn it off. You use less gas pedal, and it does not downshift.

nipper101

I failed to mention that before we decided to file arbitration, the Toyota rep that we were dealing with offered the 100,000/5 yr extended platinum warranty plus make one month's auto payment. She also said that she thought they would have a fix by the end of 2007. I think it must be to each reps advantage to get cases closed. We were very suspicious!!
Ron

crtzlow

One thing for sure is that the 4 cylinder has more than enough power for the weight of the vehicle. If you do not believe this just don't use the cruise control on a spot where you have trouble when using it. Not using cruise control ours would not drop out of overdrive and the motor RPM's would not change but would still maintain speed.
Cindy had the meeting with the rep at the dealership on Wednesday of last week and they bought the RAV 4 back. We have a statement from Toyota saying that they know that there is a problem with some of the RAV 4's and that they do not have a fix at this time. The meeting was very pleasant and professional. Saying goodbye to a car that Cindy loved was another thing. We purchased a 2007 Toyota Highlander V6 on Saturday. The ride and performance are several steps above the RAV 4 in our opinion. Of course the deal on last years model was not bad either. Basically it cost about the same as the RAV 4 when we bought it.
One thing when going through arbitration is to ask for what you want.....not demand anything. Our requests were to fix the car, swap for a V6, or buy the car back. They offered to buy the car back. It was in our best interest to go that route. They reimbursed all expenses with the exception of a mileage deduction which was in line with our state's lemon law. Overall I am pleased with the way things went. It was a good ending to an unpleasant ordeal.
We hope that everyone has a similar experience.

Cindy and Don

sumrx4

Congrats to all!!!

I received my letter with my arbitration results Sat. am. After reading several pages about the hearing and the results, what I was looking for was finally found in the last paragraph of the letter...While there seems to be some problem with the cruise control under certain conditions it does not effect the operation,safety or Value of the vehicle therefore your request for a buy back of the vehicle is DENIED.

So what am I supposed to do now???? Any suggestions please.
I could persue it through a local lawyer..that would cost me several thousand dollars. I could trade it for something else (definately not a toyota)...that would cost me several thousand dollars, or I could simple contunue to own a new vehicle that does not perform as its designed to. :mad: :mad: :mad:

A point I have read here and the Toyota rep brought up as well is the drivng on hills. The rep stated that it was explained in the manual against the use of cruise control on hills. Someone please tell me where it states this in the book. It sure isn't in the section regarding cruise control operation. I have been waiting since the meeting for Toyota to tell me where it states this info but they still have not!!!!!! :mad: :mad: In case no one can tell I am P_S_ED O_F!!!!!

ces1938

I understand your frustration, I went thru that too, now I am just driving the Rav and when I know it will start down shifting and going nuts I just kick it off and use my foot.... I drive mine in city traffic or short highway miles mostly anyway, if I have a trip to take I just drive my 2005 (4cyl) Camry, only thing is I can't haul my power wheel chair with the Camry, that is what I bought the Rav 4 to do..... Yup, ole Toyota would have to kiss a lot of butt to get this customer back... ces. :sick: :mad:

mlmcgahee

Next thing I would do is proceed with your state lemon law process. I bypassed the Toyota arbitration process and went directly with the Georgia Lemon Law process. Toyota is in their last 30 days of having to do something about my 4 cyl. RAV4. As I stated before, I keep driving mine with the cruise control as I normally would, and it has damaged 3 transmissions so far. I think I have a strong case.... We will soon see!

Mike

crtzlow

You can follow this link to a copy of the letter that Toyota sent to us in response to our problems with the cruise control on our 2007 RAV 4. Hopefully this will be of some help to someone. Let me know if the quality is not good enough and I will email you one direct.

Don

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2951512730102171166gbgnqx

thr

After reading the first paragraph of the arbitrators reply in the final paragraph of the results letter to you, I made me sick. However,I'm going for my arbitration Nov 1st, while making preparations for a lemon law settlement. This whole scenario is unbelievable. I've always loved Toyotas and believed their warranty was something I would never need to use. Now that I need it, it appears to be worthless.
Next, I think NHSTA needs to hear what cruising at 65 on the interstate uphill sounds like as my RAV4 "Bucks n Jumps" between 2nd gear at full throttle, and 4th gear like the brakes are on...over and over. It sure felt dangerous the first time it happened to me. Consumer Reports, who recommended the RAV4 as a "best buy" needs to retest the RAV4.. going uphill.
Sumrx4 thanks for relating your story. It makes me want to fight the big guys with everything available. Hal

sumrx4

I would print this entire thread and present it or at least copy all 12 case # listed here. I would also (if it comes up) make someone show you where it states in the manual about driving on hills. I started to get my manual during the hearing and call her out but because I had not read the manual I was afraid she could prove herself right. I know now she could not. Any and everything you can provide in your favor should be brought to the meeting.
For what it's worth, I made a meeting with a local lawyer about the lemon law process. He advised me that while domestic manufacturers would deal with you all the foreign manuf. especially Toyota would never admit they are wrong. Good luck with the process.

sumrx4

To all heading into or thinking of arbitation...Today I brought the letter of decision from my arbitration to work so I could reread it. Here is the exact type from the decision portion of the letter.

Although it appears the vehicle has a problem with the cruise control mechanism, the customer failed to provide sufficiently compelling evidence to support the claim that the problem substantially impairs the use,safety,or value of the vehicle.

Here is my suggestion before going to an arbitration hearing. I would take it to at least two independant machanics and get their opinions in writing of the problem and possible effects from it and I would also take it to at least two vehicles dealers one of them being a different Toyota dealer and after disclosing the maint. record and the problem, get a witten offer for a trade in. The results from these poeple may prove to be invalable to your case.

Why does hind sight always have to be 20/20

cdmac36

Speaking of 20/20. Anyone thought of contacting ABC News 20/20 for possible investigation? Maybe the negative publicity will make Toyota come up with a fix sooner. I was considering buying a 4-cylinder RAV4 but will hold off now after reading the posts on this forum.

crtzlow

With the results of going into arbitration going from one side of the scale to the other I wonder how much (if any) input the dealer has on this? Our dealer was great to work with and really seemed to want to get the problem fixed. The person who inspected the car at buy back told us that he had rarely been to this dealership for this purpose but had been to other dealerships in the same city several times. Everyone at Team Toyota in Baton Rouge went out of their way to help us in any way.
It doesn't make sense for Toyota to reply basically there is no problem to some and then on ours they say, "is due to the computer logic".
With this problem continuing into the '08 models one would think they should have it fixed. One thing I do notice is that people are still posting favorable reviews of the 4 cylinder RAV 4, so at least some of them don't have the problem.

Don

sumrx4

I contacted my local news station that has a feature about problems people have but the reply I got was nill.

Does anyone know anything about a class action lawsuit?
If Toyota or Toyota dealers are buying some back there is no reason they should not make some restitution to any and everyone that brings this problem to their attention.

cdmac36

You can also file a complaint with the NHTSA (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration) Office of Defect Investigations. Here's the link:

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/

When the rear tailgate window of my Mercury Mountaineer shattered out of the blue, I filed a complaint. NHTSA investigated and Ford/Mercury issued a recall for a design flaw.

sumrx4

Thanks Carmen,

I just filed via your link and suggest we all do this. There was currently one complaint for this issue filed a few months back. Don't know if it was one of us or not.
If you do file it takes about 10min and have your VIN handy and the name and address of all the dealers that have looked at your vehicle.

Maybe a small window of hope

mlmcgahee

I have filed a complaint with NHTSA also... Thanks for the info..

Mike

bigdadi118

Yep I think that is the best shot by filing to NHTSA. If the number of complaints are high enough, then NHTSA will do their own investigations and may force Toyota to do the recall.

me1939

I had the National Center for Dispute Settlement email me the arbitration decision. The request for repurchase was DENIED. I don't know where to go from here. It looks like I
will have no cruise control on my 2007 RAV4 unless they come up with a fix. The bottom line seems to be that you have to provide compelling evidence to support your claim that the condition substantially impairs the use, value, or safety of your vehicle. I thought that I had done this. The term "substantially" is at the arbitrators discretion.

Kay