Volkswagen Jetta Maintenance and Repair

mellis

Chipping the 1.8T does not void the warranty unless the part that fails can be proven to be caused by the chip.

The 1.8T engine is used in the Audi TT at 225hp.

Mod is correct - lets stick to Jetta talk here!

newcar31

I know that it isn't just an electronic difference between the 225 hp TT 1.8T and the Jetta 1.8T. The 225hp Audi has a different turbo among other things. They are not the same exact engine. The 180hp Audi 1.8T and the Jetta 1.8T are the same. About the warranty thing: A VW dealer could blame just about anything powertrain related to the chip, even if it wasn't the chip that caused it. The dealer doesn't have to prove that it was caused by the chip, you have to prove that it WASN'T caused by the chip which could be almost impossible in some cases. Transmission problems? Oh, the chip made too much power causing the tooth on 3rd gear to break. Detonation problems? Oh, one of the fuel injectors went bad, causing a lean condition that lead to detonation that wouldn't have happened with a lower boost pressure. The dealer could be very slick if they wanted to. No one can tell you 100% that your warranty is safe. I talked to a bunch of dealers about this, and independent VW shops, some said "no problem" and some said "be careful". The 100,000 mile powertrain warranty is a huge selling point and although I would have loved to chip the 1.8T, the warranty coverage was too uncertain for me to mess with.

mellis

The act that covers the warranty issue requires the dealer to PROVE that the non-OEM part caused the failure. The burden of proof is on them, not the customer. I have spoken with a friend who is a consumer lawyer and he confirms.

Your point is well taken about the dealer. Some are chip friendly, some are not. Best to check first. I think the majority of people who are doing the VW chip mod are not planning to keep the car for 100,000 miles so the powertrain warranty is not an issue. I typically keep cars for two years.

Its all about choice and what you are comfortable with.

bluejetta

Yes. You are correct in your statment regarding the fact that it's the DEALER that has to prove fault, not the OWNER of the vehicle.

newcar31

The dealer knows much more about these kinds of mods and their mechanical consequences than I do, so it wouldn't be hard for them to "create" a burden of proof. I have read every piece of literature regarding this subject that I could get my hands on when I was thinking about chipping the 1.8T. My conclusion is that the odds are definately in favor of the dealer. Anyways, how do you like your chipped 1.8T? I was looking at the GIAC chip which produced 193 hp and 238 lbs-ft of torque which seems incredible. Does it affect the lack of turbo lag or low rpm grunt?

mellis

I got the APR chip since it has the option to shut off the re-map via the cruise control. Nice if someone else is going to drive the car.

The Wolfsburg edition has the AWW model engine which due to some mechanical changes actual runs about 205 hp and 245 lbs-ft of torque. Low end grunt is incredible due to the torque and I notice no turbo lag. Just lots of smiles from being pressed back in the seat!

newcar31

245 lbs-ft of torque from a 1.8L. That sounds NASTY. That wolfsburg would be doing a lot of tire smokin. That does sound like a good idea with the APR chip. I would definately shut it off if anyone else had to drive it.

luckie13

I think the reason there are so many more posts on here than other cars is because VW owners just like to talk about their cars and brag about them compared to other cars.(I don't blame them being a hopefull Jetta owner myself soon) I doubt if even half the posts are about their problems.

vwdailydr2

Hi guys,sorry about my post made you guys upset when compare my VR6 jetta with camry and accord V6.In fact I do love my previous camry and accord about their performance and low maintenance cost,my point was the jetta really impressed me about it's acceleration compare with camry and accord which i'd been driven before,even my brother's acura CL with a 3.0 engine still not provide impressively acceleration or able to make a quick past on freeway (I repeat here one more time that it's not about racing or talk down Japanese car but only expressing my feeling about small German car but made in US-toyo and honda now are came from US also)and even though the jetta will cost me a little more for routine service compare with my previous camry and accord,I still enjoy driving it everyday and mine still stock(not tuned)except a set of 17" wheels because my stock 15" michellin need to retire.Also mine is an auto,i think i should by a 5sp or tiptronic next time.any input from you guys between the choice of 5sp and auto.thank you all.

tgunnocs

I own a 2000 VW Jetta GLS. Its a nice car, but the cost of ownership downright sucks. I will have owned this car for two years as of this upcoming August. I currently have 46000 miles. I drive about 30K a year so needless to say I spend a lot of time in a car. I have religiously taken this car to VW for service. At any rate, I had the 40K mile service performed at the end of March to the tune of close to $500.00. That would have been fine had that been the only service I needed. The very next day after the 40K service, I am pulled over for having a tail light out. Maybe it was coincidental that the light went out the very next day after service. At any rate, I replaced the tailights and was on my way.....for about another week, until the the check engine light came on when I was out of town for a weekend. I called every VW dealer in Detroit at about 2:00 PM on a Friday to see if they could fit me in and just check it to see if what was up. Not ONE could get me in and NOT ONE was open on Saturday either. When I finally got back to Cleveland, I took it to my dealer and was told that they were having problems with the gas up here and that they were going through sensors. He asked if the check engine light came on right after I got gas (which it had) and not to worry about it. So I didn't. At any rate, the light goes back out. For the next couple weeks, every so often when I got gas, the light would come on. Next thing I know the engine starts dropping RPMS and the car is shuddering. I quickly take it in (now I am at its 45000 mile service). Now they tell me I need to have three different sensors replaced (not covered under the 100,000 mile powertrain warranty) to the tune of 900 bucks. So in two months, I have spent 1400 dollars. Needless to say I am pretty hot about this. If I wanted to spend a 100 bucks or more per month for a car, I would be. At any rate, I go to pick up the car, andI haven't driven more than five miles, and the check engine light comes on flashing. The engine starts stalling. I have to have it towed to the dealer! I guess they had to clean the spark plugs, replace some cables. (Finally i didn't have to pay for soemthing). At this point, I am not sure I would recommend a Jetta. The cost of ownership is very high. The service sucks. The dealerships hours suck. The service departments seem to be incompetent. Only one dealer in all of Greater Cleveland is open on a Saturday. If you have a nine to five job, good luck getting service. The worse part of this all, is that when the car is running right, I love it. I am just not sure its worth all the hassles.

moparbad

Find a good independent mechanic. If you are not satisfied with the dealers work then find someone you can trust.
If you feel that the parts that were replaced should have lasted longer then contact VWoA and ask them to cover part of the cost of the work.
It will not cost you anything to ask and many people have been able to recover a portion of the repair cost. I would especially encourage you to do this if one of the parts that failed was a MAF sensor. VW has had a problem with this part on Jetta, Golf, Passat, etc..
Another common problem is window regulator.
VW dealers are no better or worse than those for any other manufacturer (IMHO). They are not uniformly good or bad, so it is well worth the time to ask around prior to buying any make of new car to find out the reputation of the dealer in your area.
$500 for 40K service and $900 for sensors does seem to be too high in cost. Find a good shop that specializes in VW's or European so that you can avoid this in the future and enjoy your Jetta.
Best of luck.

twig93

Found this today on a site about the Lemon Law. I was wondering where the Jetta is on this list...according to the postings HERE, it should be someplace on this list. Yes, I know that this is not a complete list, but the Jetta is obviously not one with the most customer complaints. I'm sure it is further down the list with every other car in the world. Jetta owners must have more access to computers or be more eager to voice their complaints on this site.

Here it is....

Thanks to the efforts of the Center for Auto Safety, we are able to provide you with the vehicle complaints on file with the National Highway for Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA).  Each year, thousands of Americans call their government to register complaints about their vehicles.  The federal government collects this information but has never released it to the general public.  The complaint index is based on a ratio to the number of complaints for each vehicle to the sales of that vehicle.     
                                                   
MODEL COMPLAINT INDEX RATIO
Audi A6  23,183
Mercury Cougar 20,829
Honda Passport  18,049
Lexus SC300/400 16,671
Kia Sportage 14,100
Mitsubishi Galant  13,808
Isuzu Rodeo 13,692
Chrysler LHS 12,459
Honda Odyssey 12,032
Jeep Grand Cherokee 11,881
Volkswagen Passat 10,458
Mazda Miata 10,091
Mercury Villager 9,113
Volkswagen Golf 7,971
Pontiac Montana 7,957
Pontiac Grand Am 7,916
Cadillac Catera 7,735
Chevrolet Tracker 7,572
Ford Windstar 7,533
Saab 9-3 7,365
Chevrolet Venture 7,147
Chrysler 300M 7,131
Oldsmobile Intrigue 7,060
Lincoln Navigator 6,962
Oldsmobile Alero 6,952

Reprinted with permission from The 2001 Ultimate Car Book, 21st edition by Jack Gillis

Ó Copyright 2001 All Rights Reserved




 

bluejetta

Awesome find there, Twig!! Do you happen to have the URL for that site? You can email me if you wish: NWVW@bluelagoonjetta.com

-Jim
http://www.bluelagoonjetta.com
http://www.jettaownersclub.org

twig93

Here is the address for the site that I found the listing. I just hope that this helps some of the prospective new buyers who visit this board and decide against a Jetta based on the complaints here.

http://www.lemonlaw.com/lemonlist.html

newcar31

I wonder why the Golf made the list and the Jetta didn't seeing that they are on the same platform, use the same engines, have the same interior, and are basically the same car? Same thing with the Passat/A4, I thought that those were similiar too, but the A4 isn't on the list? Kinda funny huh? Consumer Reports reported that the Jeep Grand Cherokee had the most problems out of all vehicles (160 something % below average) According to them, the Catera is also supposed to be horrible, but it isn't near the top of the list. It is interesting to see the Lexus SC300/400 on the list, yet there are no Toyotas. Also, "people with Jettas have more access to computers?" Uh, I don't think so.

twig93

Oh my! My comment about Jetta owners having more access to computers was sarcasm! Lighten up!

As for comparing these findings with Consumer Reports, you need to take the results for what they are worth. First of all, obviously this is only a partial list. Secondly, Consumer Reports and the government collect their data differently. Look at the Insurance Institute's findings on large pickups released yesterday. It obviously differs from what the NHTSA found. The IITS even stated that their test of the vehicles is not the same test the NHTSA gives. Now, if you want to compare....have both organizations perform the same tests on the same vehicles. This would be one way to prove validity.

Yes, it does make one wonder how the Golf is up on the list, yet the Jetta and Golf are virtually the same cars. The Jetta, Golf and the Beetle are all basically the same cars. Yet, the Beetle was not on that list either.

It would be interesting to research why this board is so active. When you do research you must take into account many things you wouldn't normally think of as having influence over the results. When you read the title of this forum, it does state Jetta Problems. Do other cars have such a forum? Or are their posts good and bad all in one place? Jettas are pretty popular cars. What is the ratio of Jettas to other cars on the road? Are there more complaints because there are more Jettas on the road? VW's are generally more expensive than most cars. So, do VW owners have good paying jobs? Have they gone further in their education? If they have gone further in their education, does this mean they are more vocal in voicing their opinions or complaints? Perhaps the Jetta is junk. However, there are many happy Jetta owners out there. I am and I know many people who own either a Golf, Jetta or Beetle who are very satisfied. If they are virtually the same cars, are there as many complaints about the Golf and Beetle? Is there a forum here for happy Jetta owners?

eleazar1

I have heard that this engine is the best for the Jetta, since it has good power and "Verve". However, I am concerned about the turbo. Does anyone know how long the turbo on this engine lasts and how dependable it is? I know this question seems to be always asked and never settled, but if someone has one and can tell me how it does I would greatly appreciate it. On a lighter note; I really like the jetta. I got to test drive a GLS with the 2.0 liter 4. It needs more power. The 1.8 turbo should do it. I would really like the Wolfsburg package. My only drawback there is it does not come in silver.

wolfiedriver

Sorry I can't tell you how long the turbo engine is supposed to last. It's been in service in various Audi & VW platforms for years and has a great reputation for not only performance, but fuel economy, and don't forget the FUN factor.

I've had my new Wolfsburg only a short while, but it is so thrilling to drive, what a blast! I highly recommend the combo of 5-speed with the turbo.

I drove the 2.0 and the 1.8T with auto and 5-speed
trannys. There is a huge difference in the way the 1.8 pulls, drive a Wolfsburg, I think you'll love it.

boravr6

This review is about VW dealers and I have had so many hilarious moments with them, that I just have to share.

Dealer: Pitcairn VW, Philadelphia, PA
I took a friend in my new Jetta to see a car for him. The sales associate sees the "BORA" emblem on my car and is puzzled. FYI, a relative from UK gave me that emblem (the Jetta is called BORA worldwide, except US) to personalize my car. He says that does BORA mean that the car is a "BORE". What a jackass. My Jetta is a VR6, leather, luxury, alloys, monsoon, sunroof, the works. And a VW sales dude calls is BORING????? Is he nuts or what? Also while clinching the deal, he came down to calling it just a tin of metal on wheels (while we bargained on the price.) Needless to say that he was just a "car salesman" and we bought a car at a good price after we used the Ricart-in-Ohio method of crass haggling.

Dealer: Byer's Imports, Columbus, OH
We go in to buy my new Jetta and we find that we know more about the car than the salesperson. Not only did we bully her over the engine options and horsepower, but she was totally null on the difference between a fully loaded VR6 GLS and a GLX. (She claimed it was just the wood trim). The fun was hen I asked her if the Jetta had a V5 (which is offered in Germany). She said that she would have to check on the manager for that.

Dealer: MAG, Columbus, OH
The experience is great, the showroom great and the salesperson, who even knows that the trash receptacle in the back seat is RED. But the dealership's damn liar. He claimed that a Silver Arrow with Black leather was rare and refused to sell the car at nothing but the MSRP. Pitcairn has 6 of the "rare", Byer's has "5", Princeton VW has a host and I have 7 right here in my office parking lot. (Hence the need for BORA). The sweet-looking ex-cheerleader finance consultant makes a "mistake" on the tax calculation and charges almost 8%+.

General comments: VW has a College Grad Program that offers 6% interest with no credit history. Only MAG told me about it (though they lied about the rate on the PASSAT). The others refuse to accept its existence. Given the "culture" promoted by VW as being heavy on the design aesthetic with their cars, advertisement, attitude; it is a shame that such moron's sell cars here.

Bottomline: (This needs to be verified) A randomly contacted dealer in the UK even knew who designed the Bettle, Jetta, Passat, Audi A's, the Ford Focus, and the new Thunderbird. Chances anyone in the US knows?

bryanr1

Just traded in my 2000 "new" Jetta after the "Check Engine" light came on again for the 7th time in 18 months. This time it lit up just after the warranty expired. Very sad, I really liked the styling and handling of the car. Insofar as the Lemon Law, the "Check Engine" light supposedly indicates any number of problems - all of which were cited by the Dealer as causes when I brought the car in. We also suffered excessive wind noise on the passenger side -- a problem never fixed despite numerous requests. I will never buy VW again.

bsheri

I have a 2000 VW Jetta (4 cyl) that seems to be burning oil... Each time i would take the car in for an oil change, the men would warn me that the oil was very low. So I took the car to VW and asked them to check it out, change the oil, check the filters, etc. I took the car back to them after 1000 miles so they could check the levels again. They told me everything was fine.
Just to be sure, I took the car back to them for the next scheduled oil change. Again, i was told the oil level was very low. So again, I must take it back to them after 1000 miles to check the levels. That check will occur sometime this week.

I am looking for advice on how to handle this check-up. It certainly seems like there is a problem, but I am worried that they will tell me everything is fine. Is there a history of this problem with vw Jettas? Is this something that is covered under warranty? Are there specific questions I should ask? And if they do, in fact, find a problem, what should I expect the next step to be? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

blackjetta18t1

i've got a question, I've had my car for about 3 months and have about 3400 miles on it and I am noticing that my brakes are traveling ALOT more than it was in the beginning and my friend noticed it to. Also, I have some rattles and for whatever reason, my front passenger seat keeps shifting and making a noise when i brake and go if someone is in that seat, does anyone have that in their Jetta? Also, is anyones driver window slower than the rest? Well anyway, I was wondering when I take my car in to get these small problems fixed, do I pay anyhting at all? Also, are they going to detail my car or anything, and what do you think my chances are of scoring some free merchandise/accessorie for having my brakes wearing so early? My friend just got a BMW X5 and they gave him alot of stuff for his waiting to get the car, but I know thats cause he paid like 55 grand for his, car, but you think they'll give me some stuff, like those $50 exhaus tips for free? Sorry for the long post..

blackjetta18t1

when my heating-A/C vents are open , air comes out of them so I close them but then hot air still come out making my car very hot even if windows are down and A/C is not on, is this normal? it has been like this from the beginning but then a friend of mine with a MB ML320 said his does it to, plus, from around my steering wheel alot of heat comes off, anyone been experiencing any of my problems?

byroniii

Hat off to everybody,
Name's Jerry, now doing a boring survey on car brands. Just a few questions, what do you guys think of the above 5 brands? What would u associate with each of them? Do they mean something to you? For example, some people regard Buick as for elder citizens. I don't know. I just want to know what u folks think.
Thanks.

newcar31

Buick-Old people. Passat-an audi for less. Audi-looks better than passat but costs more. Accord-appliance like, extremely reliable. Nissan (which Nissan?)--Also reliable, a little more personality than Hondas & Toyotas.

jcp5

I purchased a 2000 Jetta from Tulleys in Nashua,NH and have put 37,000 miles on it in the last 1 1/2yrs (long commute). So far, the cars problems include:
*Burning through several quarts of oil prior to oil changes
*Sunroof Broke
*Speaker system broke after 1 month of use and has never been fixed properly
*Today the window came off its hinges - $200 to fix!!!
*Service engine light is on (yes I've tightened the gas cap)

This is intended for prospective buyers!!!
I don't qualify for the lemon law since I am having several different problems and NOT one problem that persists. Any questions?

blackjetta18t1

anyone experienced my problems?

bluejetta

You should post these to the club list...;-)

For those little 'problems' you are having, you have the first year or 12K miles to get that kind of stuff fixed -- yes, for free -- after that, the cosmetic stuff is no longer covered. Just give them a list when you take it in for your 5K checkup.

And no, don't expect anything for free while waiting for your car. Well, maybe coffee.

-Jim
http://www.jettaownersclub.org

blackjetta18t1

so the brakes are only covered for the firsdt 12K? or are you only talking about the rattles and squeaks

bluejetta

I was referring to the little stuff. Creaks, rattles, stuff like that.

jettagls18t

I have a '01 1.8T (also black) and have noticed some of the problems you are mentioning.

1- the rattles: if they are coming from the tweeter area on the back doors, that is caused by the lock latches being loose, the dealer fixed that quickly. They seemed to know exactly what was wrong. If they are coming from the dashboard area, I just talked with someone who had the problem and fixed it by himself: take out the plastic part that covers the AC vents above the radio and put two pieces of Dynamite by the prongs
on the back of the part. Personally, I'm waiting for my next service appointment and I'll let the dealer do it for me. That's what warranties are made for.

2- The seat problem: I had it, but with the driver's seat. The dealer fixed it by changing the seat bracket, which by the way was not done on premises, they took it to a contractor shop, wierd ha?

The other problems, not yet. I guess you either love VWs or hate them. No middle ground. It's just a compromise we have to take for what we are getting under 20K.

moparbad

If you chip your car and require warranty work that could be connected in any way to the chip then you risk voiding your warranty.

mellis earlier posted-
Chipping the 1.8T does not void the warranty unless the part that fails can be proven to be caused by the chip.--

The warranty provided by VW requires you to go through arbitration if you have a dispute.
A VW owner with turbo failure and resulting engine damage had a chipped ecu and VWoA refused to honor warranty. Thinking he was protected by "warranty act" he went into arbitration thinking VWoA had to prove that the chip caused the damage. VW brought in expert that testified that the chip changed the normal operating parameters of the engine and this resulted in turbo failure. The owner who had chipped the car was out of pocket to the tune of $3000 plus.

Now I see someone has posted that they are having problems due to chipped ecu and I will share it with the edmunds audience.

quote..
I started having problems with my car so I switched to the stock chip. The problems went away for two days but then came back. The problem was that the car would be idle very rough, and the revs would keep going up and down by itself. Up to about 1500 over and over. Also the check engine light was on and the epc light would come and go. When the epc light was on the car would go into limp mode. I took it to a friends house who has a vag-com and the only code was something with the throttle body. I brought it the the dealer and they called me back and wanted to know if I had an aftermarket chip. I said no. The wanted to know why I had an aftermarket dv(forge), and I said because the stock one broke and I didn't want it to happen again. They said well that's usally a sighn of chipping. I said no. Then they mentioned my tt exhaust and kept asking about the dv. He then says that I am showing throttle body codes and that that is usually when someone pulls the ecu to chip it and doesn't put it back in right. He asks me what he will find if he pulls the ecu, I said a stock chip. He says ok I'll call you back. Calls me back ten minutes later saying that they found the socket and they seemed pretty happy about themselves. Tells me that they can't fix my car. I tell them to just replace the windseild(I was also there for that) and leave the rest alone. They call me back after, say the windsheild is done but now the car won't start. They can't get any readings with the computer and that my ecu is fried and that its because of the soldering job. They want $450 for a new ecu.
Does this seem right, I don't really believe them about the ecu being broke. I also think it was wack that they pulled the ecu because of the dv and exhaust.
Any suggestions? I was thinking of going up there tonight since the car is outside and seeing if the ecu is really dead. --

Never heard of one person who has prevailed using the "warranty act" defense. Have heard of several examples of people who have learned the expensive way that VWoA can and will refuse to cover some warranty claims of VW's with chipped ECU.

Does anyone have firsthand knowledge of anyone who has successfully used the often quoted "warranty act".

newcar31

That is what I was affraid of, and that is one of the reasons why I didn't get the 1.8T and chip it. Just because a salesman told me that it would be OK, doesn't mean that it is OK, he just wanted the sale. Also, the so-called "chip friendly" dealers can change their mind anytime they want to, the odds are in their favor. Like I said before, no matter what *anyone* tells you, chipping the car is risky business. I cannot afford a new engine or a new turbo or a new ECU.

whpd15

I have a 2000 vr6 with 25,000 miles on it. At first the emissions workshop light was coming on. The dealer said it was the o2 sensor and fixed it once. I drove it off the lot and it came back on. I immediately called the dealer and they had me return the next day. They had my car in the shop for about a week and a half before calling me to come pick up my car stating "we are waiting for WV to make a new part for the car" I advised them I dint want to drive the car if something was wrong with it. They told me "it wont hurt it do drive it". Now, they fixed that problem but now, the car spits and sputters when I turn it on in the morning or it has been sitting for about 8 hours and the temperature gauge doesn't come up for about 20 minutes into the ride and then it fluctuates thought the trip going form middle (190) to zero. Also, when I have the A/I on occasionally I will hear a "gong". The dealer cant find anything wrong with it any of this and just rests the codes when I bring it in and complain. Just seeing if anyone else has had any problems similar to these and if can offer any advise. I am scheduling it to go back into the shop for the hemp gauge and sputter but am sure they will tell me the same thing (at least about the sputter. My next step is to contact the manufacturer and cry "lemon"

mellis

Go to www.vwvortex.com and do a search on chip. Read all the posts. That is your real evidence rather than a couple of posts on edmunds. Very, very few failures of any kind. And people there are NOT shy about posting problems!

Sure, a chipped ECU can go bad. My buddy with a 2000 GTI had his stock ECU fail.

If you are not comfortable chipping then by all means do not take the plunge. If you are on the fence talk to people that have actually done the upgrade, not people that have "heard" about problems.

newcar31

I've been to VWvortex. Read a bunch of stuff, this was a long time ago. I don't care what they post, if I had a problem with *my* car, what good is VWvortex? Is the dealer going to suddenly honor the warranty because of something that is posted on VWvortex? The only reason that I didn't get one is because if something did happen, I would not have the extra money to fix it, and I would not have any transportation. I also read an article in SportCompactCar or some Euro mag, can't remember, they said it wasn't a good idea to chip for longevity unless you upgraded the turbo and intercooler which is considerably more than $400.

bluejetta

I have been (also) reading VWvortex for quite some time and have found the people that have the most problems with their cars are the ones that putz with them all them. The ones that add all these aftermarket tweaks. Doesn't matter if it's the 1.8T, VR6 or 2.0.

It has been my experience, both personal and using the experience of others, that you really need to take a lot into consideration when tweaking your cars.

They were engineered for certain maximum stresses over a certain period of time. That's how they're built and tested. When you add an aftermarket chip, you totally change that equation and everything changes.

Some dealers are more lenient when it comes to chipping. But, that can all change if something breaks. You are taking a big gamble if you chip or otherwise tweak your car. Look at what the Neuspeed supercharger does to the 2.0! Amazing stuff, but not worth wasting my warranty.

The law does state that VW has to prove that your chip caused the failure. Well, they have very well paid lawyers and all the time in the world. Not to mention the backing of the engineers that designed the engine, so I guarantee they will be able to prove it. Not many of us VW owners have access to a highly paid team to defend a case like this over a $3500 engine replacement. You'd pay way for the lawyers than the engine alone.

Personally, I don't think it's worth it and you're taking a big gamble with chipping your car. To anyone that's currently in the market: Wait until the 2002's come out as the HP on the 1.8T and the VR6 is being increased dramatically by VW.

As for the 1.8T, I totally agree with Newcar31 (go figure!) where he says: "...it (isn't) a good idea to chip for longevity unless you upgraded the turbo and intercooler which is considerably more than $400."

Very true statement.

-Jim
http://www.jettaownersclub.org
http://www.bluelagoonjetta.com

mellis

You are right on the 2002 1.8t going from 150HP to 180HP. VW is changing the chip!

mellis

This is a futile discussion. Where did I post that vwvortex would help you if you fried your ECU? What I said was that there is plenty of objective evidence that chipping can be done safely. If you are not comfortable with it then fine.

bluejetta

Yup! 2002's are essentially chipped AND it's covered by the VW warranty!

mellis

Yes, they are chipped but not at potential. I'll take my 20 extra HP and 45 extra lb/ft of torque!

Did you see that the 10/100,000 powertrain warranty is gone now? They increased the bumper-to-bumper which I suspect is what most people want.

bluejetta

I saw that the 10/100 is toast. Most people don't keep their cars that long. I do, so I'm glad I got my 10/100 thank you!

As for the chips: It's nice to have that option. Heck, I'd love to drive a 2.0 with the supercharger. That thing is supposed to whoop some serious butt.

And speaking of buts....But, I didn't buy my car to race. But, it's nice to have those options available for sure.

newcar31

Bluejetta summed up all of my concerns quite well in post 1089. I did here that the VW 1.8T in the Jetta/Golf will get a boost in power for 2002. 180hp sounds about right for the 1.8T. I'd be curious to see if it has the same outrageous torque figures of the chipped pre-2002s. I'll bet it doesn't, and I'll bet there is a reason why it doesn't. They should have done that in the first place and brought the Euro VR6 24 valve along when the Jetta 4 came out. Instead they strangled the poor 1.8T so that it didn't beat up on its big brother, VR6. As far as which engine is better, I'd take the 2002 1.8T over a chipped pre-2002 1.8T anyday. Whats the difference? VW "chipped" it, so you know that it has been tested extensively, and the necessary modifications and precautions, if any, have been done to accomodate the extra boost. No doubt GIAC, Neuspeed, etc. are great companies, but I think VW knows a little more about their cars and has more money for R&D than the aftermarket tuners. Oh yeah, and there would be no need for a lawyer.

mellis

Go away - take your troll somewhere else!

mellis

You are not comfortable with chipping and are more comfortable with the 2002 180hp. I am not comfortable leaving that much performance on the table (the torque is what makes the difference anyway, not HP) and enjoy my chip. Lets just agree to disagree!

Let us know when you get the '02 and how you like the car.

bluejetta

Just curious -- not a slam or a flame here -- do you autocross or something that you need the max performance/power out of your consumer car? I'm just a usual consumer here: Drive to work and the store and such. A fun drive to the country and all. No racing or anything, so that's why I'm curious as to the need for all this power as there are a lot of different avenues to pursue for a performance-peaked car other than a Volkswagen.

-Jim
http://www.jettaownersclub.org

mellis

No autocross, just want a little driving fun I guess. $499 is a small price to pay in my opinion for what amounts to a stealth VERY fast car with room for four that gets 31mpg.

I also enjoy moments like Fri PM on my way home from work when a Mustang GT pulled along side me on the interstate. Dropped my right foot and buried him. By the look on face when I let him come along side again the driver was not pleased!

bluejetta

I see. I was just wondering what $499 and the loss of the engine warranty was all about.

-Jim

wolfiedriver

Don't waste your time arguing with newcar31. He's not getting an '02 VW or any VW, because he just got a Mazda instead.

Can't wait to put a GIAC in my '01 WE. Why? Because that extra torque and HP turns a fun car into a REALLY FUN CAR.

javacat97

Every time it rained heavy my 97 Jetta would refuse to start without at least 15 minutes of engine cranking. Since I assumed this was not the way Jetta's were supposed to act I brought the car into the dealer, and foolish me I thought the repair would be covered since the car was "certified" and had a "warranty" Why was I suprised when the dealer told me this was not covered and was considered a "maintainence" issue? WARNING, if you do not get a regular tune-up your Jetta will refuse to start when it gets wet!!! This is evidently not a flaw in the car but a design feature.

What a joke. Volkswagens warranty is a JOKE. Last time I buy anything with a VW on it.