Toyota Sienna 3.5L power?

hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
edited May 2014 in Toyota
Are their any 07 sienna owners here? If so how does the new 3.5L engine perform? i am thinking of trading our 04 in for an 07. i wanted to know how the new V6 performs while passing and when going up steep inclines? thanks in advance. =]


  • allezallez Member Posts: 21
    For me it has plenty of power - it doesn't transform the van into a sports car, but it does allow it to do what I want it to do. I can't really compare it to the 3.3L because I haven't driven previous Siennas.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    Can someone post a 0-60 video of their 07 sienna? i wanna see how well it can accelerate, i would really appreciate it =]
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It's quicker than any van really needs to be, put it that way.

    The 3.3l was plenty adequate, don't get me wrong. 0-60 was in the 8 second range, I believe.

    But the 3.5l puts it in 7 second range, even the slow pokes at Consumer Reports managed 7.7s to 60 in an AWD model.

    So if you're looking for that extra little oomph, that's basically exactly what you'll get.

    If you're not, the gearing is the same and with Direct Injection it can be extremely fuel stingy at low rpms. I've had 2 tanks where I averaged 30.6mpg. My worst tank so far was 23.x mpg, and that was around town.

    Let me find that torque curve...found it. See how flat it is? It breathes better than the 3.3l at high RPM, so that's how it makes more HP, but it has 10% more torque all over the rev band.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Note: it's the one on the right. On the left is a V8.

    The V6 actually has a flatter torque curve, surprisingly.

    Note that from about 2200 rpm to around 5800 rpm, there is no valley in the torque curve at all.

    I have that engine in my Sienna and love it.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    The flatter is better? well, i want to know how responsive is the Sienna's transmission to the newer V6?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Yes, flatter is better, because that translates to linear power delivery, i.e. you get similar acceleration at any RPM.

    What you don't want are peaks and valleys that make it slow (or suddenly fast) at certain RPM.

    When you stab the throttle the transmission gives you a gear right away, 2 gears take a little longer. With the power of the 3.5l you don't usually need 2 gears for passing, though.

    I have yet to encounter a situation where I wanted more power with my van.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    thanks alot, it is good to hear the 2007 sienna has all the power you need. have you driven it up some inclines yet? if so, how did it perform with the steep inclines? i really can't wait tell we can get an 07. Do you have an LE?
  • mitchcmitchc Member Posts: 39
    I have driven the LE '07 for 4 months now and the power is phenomenal. I live in West Texas and have driven it through some of the mountains out here and it moves easily up any incline. Remember, it still weighs about 4300 pounds. It is very tempting to just press the accelerator and drive it like a Nissan Maxima - but, it has 270 horses - and when you use all of them to pull 4300 lbs - you burn alot of fuel. Although capable of 26-28 mpg, I tend to really enjoy the engine as my previous vehicle was a V-8 powered LS430. I can get as low as 19-21 mpg in the city. Still beats the heck out of any SUV with the equivalent power in terms of gas mileage by at least 35-40%. It'd probably take a 5.3 liter V-8 to equal this pull in an SUV/truck. In fact, I've driven between San Antonio and El Paso at least 8 times with it on I-10 and I easily pass anyone or anything with ease - there is so much power still on tap at 70-80 mph. Any dad giving up a sports car for a minivan will love it. Definitely ditch the '04 Sienna. You'll fall in love with this power train immediately. A buddy of mine traded in his older Mercedes - couldn't afford the loaded LE - was looking at cheaper brands such as Kia, Nissan, etc., but after driving mine, he got a CE for under 23K simply because of this new engine. Despite two manual doors, he loves his minivan!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The Mid-Atlantic is flat as a pancake. I haven't been out to the Shanendoah mountains but even then they look like hills if you're from the Rockies.

    Any how, for things like passing, power is abundant. Hit the gas and you are there, often I used too much throttle and need the brakes to compensate.

    I also own a Miata, and while the Miata could do circles around the van, the van is a LOT quicker, no contest.
  • allezallez Member Posts: 21
    Reminds me of the saying:

    "With great power comes great responsibility . . ."

    Sometimes I have to remind myself. It is a minivan, after all ;)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I use that quote all the time! :D

    Go Spidey!
  • cmptrguy74cmptrguy74 Member Posts: 21
    We've owned an 04 Sienna (XLE w/all options) since 2004 and it's proven to be an outstanding vehicle. I also own an 02 Maxima (255hp) and am power hungry - so have always wanted more power in the Sienna.

    With that said, in July, we rented an 07 Sienna LE for @ 10 days. Obviously, we missed the goodies (Nav, DVD, Power Doors, Leather, etc.) - but WOW, did I love the power difference. I have to say with all honesty that "Stomping on it" at 50mph shot us straight to 75mph in absolutely no time!!! I looked over to my frightened wife and all we could do is laugh the first time... It scared us both - that big of a difference...

    The thing I did notice, however, is that the engine seemed louder when you got on it. Don't know if there's extra deadening in XLE's or not, but it was definitely some additional decibels out there.

    If you're in the market again, 07/08 should yield some pretty big differences - especially for those wanting all the goodies. Some would include: 3.5L vs. 3.3L (270hp vs 230hp I believe), Larger DVD Screen, In dash 4 CD (vs only 1) for Nav option, Voice Activated Nav now, Bluetooth, Turn Signals in Mirrors, Power Folding Mirrors, Power 3rd Row Seat, & Rear Disc Brakes (still Drum for loaded 04 XLE) - all for a price VERY CLOSE to the same loaded 04 XLE. To me, these are all significant changes that would trigger immediate interest in trading/updating - if I were in the market. Note, however, that you may not like what they've done to the wheels!!! I definitely like my 04 17" rims much better than these new 07/08 rims - look more like standard hubcaps to me...

    Unfortunately, I'm not trading for another 2-3 years (trying to keep 6yr cycles on my cars as much as possible).

    Fortunately, my Maxima is going bye-bye in next couple months (sad, but nice). I've negotiated & ordered a loaded 2008 Highlander Ltd (2WD) to replace the Max!!! Very excited & impressed with this new styling, size, features, & ride. Just have to wait for it to arrive.

    Hope this helps - good luck in your decision :)

  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    AGAIN, can you post the HP and Torque curves of the 3.3L in 2006 vs 3.5L of the 2007? :confuse:

    Without the side-by-side comparison of the 2 engines, a comparison of 3.3L to 3.5L is of little value but it should be noted that the 3.3L develops its maximum torque AND HP at a lower rpm than does the 3.5L even though the 3.5L has more power than the 3.3L at any comparable rpm.

    Official Toyota information states the 3.3L has the Direct Injection in the same words used to describe the 3.5L. :shades:
  • cmptrguy74cmptrguy74 Member Posts: 21
    Hmm... I guess if you're THAT tied up in HP, torque curves, when RPM max torque is achieved, and so on... Why "minivan"... Get a Porsche Cayenne Turbo or something that hauls (in both senses)! At present, I believe this is as high performance/HP as you get in the current stock minivan segment. Who knows, maybe for next generation Quest, Nissan will decide to put in the 3.7L w/330HP that's found in the new G37. Doubt it will retain that level of HP w/out engineering rejection/CYA, but who knows!!

    You may want to consider one of the the upcoming high performance Crossovers/SUV's if peak performance is your objective. It'd probably end up being safer & more enjoyable at same time!

    Drive them both. Toss the papers & make a decision off real life conditions - rather than some numbers. As an 07 Sienna passes you on a steep incline on your way to Tahoe are you going to reach in the glove box, hold up the papers, and say, "According to this chart, you should not have been able to pass me between 40-55mph cause my maximum torque was reached 1/16 mile ago and yours won't reach for another 1/16 mile"!!! And as the 07 passes, you see AWD wrote on back and have to return to glove box for more papers & charts & amazement...

    From what I've experienced, there's some type of dramatic difference between these two engines - I don't care what the papers say.

    Another thought, have a friend - who's a good contender in performance testing & limits - go with you to a dealer having a used 07 Sienna w/at least 1500 miles on it... Test them out side by side in various conditions and note who pulls ahead!!! Maybe he'll beat you from 0-10 or even 10-20, but wait till you try 50-70 and inclines.

    Good luck in your final decisions and please be safe & lawful :)
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    I am satisfied with the power and performance of my 06 Sienna with 3.3L BUT I have been informed in Edmunds that the 07 Sienna with 3.5L has MUCH more power and a HP/Torque graph was posted for the 3.5L.

    I was satisfied with my 02 T&C 3.3L that had considerably fewer HP and noticeably fewer Lb-ft of torque. My post was a friendly jab to get the graph of the Sienna 3.3L posted in same posting as the 3.5L for a real comparison. ;)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Nice post, well written.

    Minor correction, the SAE HP figures for the 04-06 was 215hp, and for 07-08 is 266hp. A noticeable gain.

    Torque went up about 10%, and the curve is very flat, as the earlier graph shows. Even assuming the 3.3l has a similarly excellent, flat torque curve, you're still gaining about 10% of torque at all rpm, with a little better breathing at higher rpm (and no sacrifice at low rpm, hence the flat curve).

    Noone complained about the 3.3l, but the 3.5l is actually quick enough to surprise more than a few folks.

    What sold me, and made me wait, though, was that the extra power came at no sacrifice in fuel economy.
  • cmptrguy74cmptrguy74 Member Posts: 21
    Thanks for the feedback :) Most places I look, I do see the 07 Sienna as having 266HP, but the 04 I'm only seeing 230HP... Has this been down-graded due to new regulations (i.e., Premium Fuel tests vs. Regular Fuel tests, etc.)?
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    No the 2004 and the 2007 both use different engines, thats why the 04 makes 230HP and the 07 makes 268HP. the 2004-2006 Sienna used a 3.3L V6 while the new 07-08 uses a 3.5L V6.
  • cmptrguy74cmptrguy74 Member Posts: 21
    Thanks for comments. I was questioning the 215HP SAE response mentioned before my posting. I've always been under the assumption that my van has 230HP, but when I saw 215HP posting, I became suspicious that new regulations adjusted the original HP values!!!

    Thought I just lost 15 of my hard earned HP! Looking forward to the next generation Sienna. Hopefully, it'll be released by 2010 :shades:
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    Your 2004 Sienna NEVER did have an honest 230 HP since there was NO change to the engine between 2004 and 2006. :shades:
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    215 or 230HP, it doesn't matter, it has more than enough to move me away from a stop and pass, i love to drive it alone, i win lots of stoplight races with it, so it cannot be slow. I love Toyota V6's =]
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Well, it did, sort of.

    In 2004, the rules were more relaxed, you could measure HP by disconnecting certain accessory belts that use up some of the available power.

    It did still make "230 HP" at the time, but that was by using some of these tricks, which were allowed at the time.

    The Society of Automotive Engineers stopped the cheating by giving specific rules for stating output. So under these new rules, the 3.3l made 215 SAE HP, to be specific.

    230 HP under the old rules = 215 SAE HP under the new rules, though.

    Not all engines lost HP, in fact some GM engines gained a few. Toyota was "cheating" more than most, though it was allowed under the old rules, so it wasn't illegal, just misleading.

    The 210hp 3.0l V6 was downgraded to 190 SAE HP.

    The 3.3l V6 was downgraded to from 230hp to 215 SAE hp.

    We drop the "SAE" part now because they all use SAE HP. No need to distinguish any more, unless you compare output from before vs. after the new rule went in effect.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    we rented an 07 sienna for 3 days to see how much we liked it, and we loved it. it had awesome power, and we averaged 27.3 mpg over the 250 miles we had it. i love the new 3.5L v6!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    How much did the rental cost?

    I shopped for rental vans in Tampa and was FLOORED! :surprise:

    An Uplander was $220 for the 4 days, something like that, while a Sienna was $600 plus! :mad:

    At least it doesn't cost you triple to buy.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    i think it was like $200. we rented it mainly to see how the new v6 performs, and we liked it...a lot.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    That's cheap. What rental company, may I ask? We may get one if the price is under $300 for the 4 days.

    I'm not paying $600 plus, it's not 3 times the van.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    we rented through hertz i think, we only paid the difference since we had a free compact car rental for the 3 days from AAA, when our 04 sienna was in for some body work from when we were rear ended.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    C&D measured 0-60 for all the latest vans.

    Sienna got 7.2s, all the others were 8 seconds or greater. The Chrysler vans came closest, the others were well behind the Sienna.

    Told ya the 2GR was a gem.
  • lxpatellxpatel Member Posts: 34
    I have 07 Limited, i also notice extra decibels of noise compared to friend's 06. Is there a solution to this? Like using Synthetic oil. I was going to change to synthetic oil but dealer recommended switching after 10k with regular oil, meaning doing initial 5k with regular oil and switching at 10k.

    Also notice a growl at 2000 to about 2500RPM in top gear and comes to hill or something but does not down shift.

    A friend suggested to have different headers installed but don't want to go that route.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The 06 has the 3MZ engine (3.3l V6) with a timing belt. Belts are quieter, but they also need to be changed at certain intervals. So your friend will be paying for timing belt replacements, and you won't.

    Your 2GR V6 has a timing chain, which indeed makes more noise, but lasts the life of the car. Toyota added some sound insulation in the door jambs and in the firewall to offset that somewhat, but you will hear more engine noise.

    Still, in the C&D van comparison the Sienna was one of the quietest vans at cruising speeds.

    I wouldn't make any changes.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    Can someone do a 0-60 video of there 07 Sienna and post it on youtube? i have a video of our 04 Sienna.
  • lxpatellxpatel Member Posts: 34
    Thank You, I plan to try the Synthetic at 10k oil change and stickier tires that has a traction rating of A, at about 20k.
  • prinesurfprinesurf Member Posts: 4
    I'd like to get some of you 3.5L owners to weigh in on my post in "slipping/non-responsive trottle". I think it is closely related to power issues!. I previously owned a 2001 sienna, and I swear that car had more pep and response than my new 2008 sienna. This unresponsive throttle issue is making me not feel the power!!! What do you think??
  • siennamisiennami Member Posts: 116
    You're kidding, right?? I drive an '07, which has the 3.5L engine, and it has plenty of pep. I live in the midlands of South Carolina, which isn't really hilly, but has some hills in various spots. On my way home today, my Silver Shadow took those hills like a champ! There was no problem at all accelerating up the hills. I will have to admit that the one thing that I've noticed is when cornering, and I've lifted my foot from the accelerator, the van does jerk whenever I do put my foot back on after making the turn. I don't remember my '00 doing that, but it's been 4 yrs. since I last drove that one, so my memory may be faulty. Other than that, I really don't have any throttle problems that I can point to.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    Glad to see the 3.5L doesn't have problems going up hills. Could you do a 0-60 video to post on Youtube? a lot of people keep talking about the Honda Odyssey being more powerful when it is not.
  • prinesurfprinesurf Member Posts: 4
    Please do your homework on these new 2008 Sienna's. This apppears to be a similar problem that has been plaguing the Camrys and Avalon for a few years. You can read other owners and expert opinions as well as technical reasons for the poor design on it at this website: ms-expose-toyotas-problem-reporting-problems/.
    All the symptoms they describe are exactly what is happening with my new van. If you test drive one be sure to do this coasting/ then acceleration thing, between 6-8mph. You will REALLY notice it if you hit the gas after breaking, and coasting over a speed bump.
    By the way there is no doubt this car is powerful, but this lagging acceleration after coasting really makes the car very annoying to drive. Maybe it isn't a slipping trottle thing. I wish I'd listen to my gut when I first brought this car home and not let the salesperson convince me that "the car needed to break-in", it was a "drive by-cable thing" and "the car learns how you drive". I would have brought it right back and asked for my money back.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Just as an FYI, the Sienna uses the U151E transmission, while the problematic 6 speed in the Camry/Avalon is a totally different design, code named U660E.

    C&D just tested all the latest vans and the Sienna was quickest in every single acceleration test, including their 5-60 "street start", which is 1mph below what you are reporting, but still shows a lag isn't normal even from a running start.

    Sienna was also quickest in all the passing tests.

    In another thread, I linked to the intake modification you might be interested in. Check that out.
  • prinesurfprinesurf Member Posts: 4
    Thanks for the FYI. Perhaps it isn't exactly what the Camrys are expereincing, but this problem has been written about in 2005 and 2006 Siennas. My van IS fast in acceleration. The problem isn't the constant application of the gas pedal-no problem there. The problem comes when you accelerate, then you cruise, then you apply the gas again. This is where you will feel a noticeable lag until it catches up and goes. The car will rev like it is in neutral then literally lunge after it (goes into gear?).
    I happen to be very annoyed by it on a daily basis, because I have a winding subdivision to navigate before I hit the road and I'm often at this under 8mph and coasting mode.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I tend to strive for good fuel efficiency, so I roll in to the throttle gently most of the time. That seems to work well for me.

    The few times were I punch it, though, mine seems to respond pretty quick, in fact some times I get more than I wanted (more noise, too much speed).
  • siennamisiennami Member Posts: 116
    Hey, ateixeira..... are you willing to bring your family on a visit to sunny South Carolina so that you can do one of those modifications on the Silver Shadow for me? :shades: I'm pretty much used to the hesitation that I feel; to me it's a small price to pay for the fact that I'm back in a Sienna! And have "y'all" noticed? Doesn't that 3.5L engine sound all "muscle-y" when you accelerate? That's what tickles me to death about mine; it sounds powerful, and it is when I need it to be, especially driving around the peeps around here like I do! ;)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Yeah, the 3.3l (3MZ) had a timing belt, but the 3.5l (2GR) has a chain. It makes a more metallic sound, more authoritative.

    Toyota actually added more sound insulation to the fire wall and door sills to compensate.
  • bearcrkrdbearcrkrd Member Posts: 167
    My 2006 does the same thing. I notice it in parking lots after going over a speed bump then trying to speed up. Also when slowing way down, then making a 90 degree, or more, low speed uphill left turn. But, different from the article referenced, I have never been in danger. I do not work for Toyota, nor gain anything by endorsing their products. While the slip, or rev is slightly annoying, as long as I am 100% sure that the tranny fluid is full/clean, and the tranny is not wearing out, I can live with it. I discovered it is just about the only time I (just speaking for Me) can justify manually downshifting. Works every time I've tried it. That is the 'slightly annoying' referred to above. Under brisk (brisker?) acceleration, the 3.3 does just fine. Always :) I also agree 100% that it has EVERYTHING to do with gas mileage, and not wanting to turn back the clock on the gains Toyota has so cleverly managed to wring out of its powerplants.
    PS - the Dodge Chrysler Vans I have rented over the years did the same thing, but I thought it was more pronounced then my '06 Sienna.
  • siennamisiennami Member Posts: 116
    While making the 2 hr. trek back from the hospital after visiting my father, I was reminded again to be grateful for the choice I made in vehicles. The Silver Shadow is incredibly easy to drive on the interstate. She darts in and out of traffic if needed. And, hause07, to answer your question about 0-60: it does so quite easily. Before I knew it, the Silver Shadow and some Dale Earnhardt fan were about to become really close friends! The Sienna is very responsive, I believe, and I get where I need to in a very comfortable way. Obviously I am very biased......... :P
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    27.9 mpg on a round-trip to the coast this weekend. Not bad considering there was some traffic.

    Gotta love this powertrain, the combination of power and efficiency is unreal.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    i wanted to ask if you set cruise control and travel up steep grades, does the new engine require a downshift or does it hold it's gear at the same speed up the incline without problem? thanks in advance. We just got back from a road trip to Washington and through Mt. Shasta our 04 had to down shift to hold 70mph up some grades.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It will shift down.

    Keep in mind the gearing has not changed. It's very tall geared. At 55mph it's barely idling along at something like 1500rpm. At 70 I think it's just barely over 2000 rpm.

    As flat as the torque curve is, you hit an incline and it will shift, though mine has only ever shifted from 5 -> 4, never two ratios.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    So you would be around 2,500 RPM to pull up a grade @ 70mph? or would it require more than that? Our current 04 has to go up to 3,000-3,300RPM to pull up some inclines with cruise set @ 70mph.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Not sure about the rpm in 4th, but the gearing is the same as yours, so I doubt that will change.

    The 3.5l has roughly 10% more torque across the torque band compared to the 3.3l. So there may be a few scenarios where that 10% makes enough difference.
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    Does ANYONE have a link to a graph for each?

    Toyota specifies 87 octane for the 3.3L in the Sienna but states that the 3.3L provides more power on higher octane premium. Does the 3.5L also develop MORE power using premum? :confuse:
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    On paper, the 3.3l made 215hp by SAE measures. Figure you lost a few on 87 octane, but it's still probably about 210hp.

    One of the few manufacturers that stated HP for both types of fuel was Subaru, when their H6 engine came out. It made 212hp on premium, 208hp on regular. Since power output is similar for the 3.3l Toyota engine, it seems reasonable to conclude there would be a similar HP loss.

    Now, to the 3.5l, Toyota states an SAE output of 266hp. This is low for the 2GR, other models make 268-270hp from the same engine. The RAV4 is rated for 268hp even on regular fuel.

    Can they make more HP on better fuel? It depends, if Toyota tuned the engines to advance the spark timing, then yes, they could squeeze out another 5hp or so, is my guess.

    The catch? We know the 3.3l is capable of running on 87 octane, because that's all that is required. So it was tuned to be flexible enough for both types of fuel.

    We don't know, however, if the 2GR (3.5l) is tuned to take advantage of higher octane (by advancing spark timing beyond stock settings). Any answer is just a guess, we don't really know.
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