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Subaru Crew - Future Models II

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Comments

  • bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    In post 4690. The NAIAS link shows Subaru scheduled for Jan. 7th at 5:30 p.m.

    -Dennis
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Press days for the LA Auto Show are tomorrow and Friday, but I'm not sure Subaru even has one scheduled for LA.

    It does make sense for them to debut the STX now, and then the Forester separately, so they don't steal attention from each other, but I'm dying to see that Forester!

    AN has an article on the new Corolla, but what I noticed is that the wheelbase is now 102.4". That's closer to the Legacy than it is to the Forester.

    So Bob and paisan may have a point - it may be time to upsize a bit. The Impreza only got a .5" stretch, so I hope the Forester gets the Legacy's wheelbase, and the next Legacy gets a couple of inches beyond that.

    I do like small cars (light weight especially), but they have to be roomy enough to please people like my wife, too.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    3-Series, one of the finest handling cars out there, has a wheelbase around 106."

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    OK, but the back seat in those is tiny. Overall room is in fact very tight.

    That's partly because of the in-line six engine, and its longitudinal layout. The cowl sits so far back that you sacrifice front leg room. Moving the front seats back, you then lose rear seat space.

    Subaru would not have this problem - their boxers are much, much shorter than Bimmer sixes.

    Even the 5 series isn't really any roomier than the Legacy.

    -juice
  • c_hunterc_hunter Member Posts: 4,487
    I just read your link, Bob -- thanks for pointing it out. Looks like the IVT is a more advanced version of the transmission on many riding mowers, which has a rubber wheel (output to the axle) that rides on a rotating metal disk (input from the engine). By positioning the wheel along the disk's radius, a whole range of gear ratios can be obtained. Looks like the Torotrak is connecting input and output disks with multiple wheels. Very cool. This will have wearable parts too, but it's probably more durable than a belted CVT.

    Craig
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    The BMW is tight because it has a relatively long hood, which pushes the cabin rearward, as well as making it smaller. The point I was making is that you can have a car with a 106" wheelbase and still be very nimble.

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I agree, however people like my wife want a longer wheelbase for a different reason (space).

    I don't care nearly as much. If it were up to me, we'd already have a WRX wagon in the driveway. Cargo space be darned, we'll pack light.

    -juice
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    IMHO you can do it sometimes, just not as a habit. I do it on mine when I feel I need to for quicker acceration or if I need to slow down often on dirt roads and don't want to hit the brakes.

    -mike
  • bigfrank3bigfrank3 Member Posts: 426
    If they didn't want it to be manually shifted they wouldn't give you the option. It would say PRNF, for Forward.

    Besides, as was said earlier, you don't really shift the transmission, you only suggest to the control computer what you would like to do. It makes the decision to do it or not based on other inputs.

    Regards,
    Frank
  • subearusubearu Member Posts: 3,613
    While I don't regularly shift 'manually' with our AT, I do on occasion downshift to 3 or 2 for controlled response. And I have held it in 2 for those times I wanted a bit more RPM response in full or almost full throttle.

    Sure, manually shifting an AT may wear it a bit more, but no more than the manumatics out there already. One is via the cars computer, the other via MY computer! ;)

    -Brian
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It's useful for starting in 2nd gear when conditions are slippery, to reduce torque. So it's not just for sporty drivers, it's practical as well.

    5 speed autos are becoming more and more common. They are offered on 3 of the minivans I've seen.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Sounds like GM is really serious about this new tranny.

    Bob

    http://www.gminsidenews.com/ToroTrak.htm
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    to offer a third brand, targeted at the "youth audience."

    Bob

    http://just-auto.com/news_detail.asp?art=36758&dm=yes
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Went to the SOA web site and did a search for the word "Baja," and while that word did not show up in any of the links that were provided—every link that was provided, pertained to the ST-X...

    Bob
  • hypovhypov Member Posts: 3,068
    try

    http://baja.subaru.com



    Think it's an omen?

    -Dave

  • bblachabblacha Member Posts: 160
    This cute little microminivan is interesting, with AWD and good functional boxiness. It's mentioned among the possibilities for the CheapYota brand.

    http://www.toyota.co.jp/Showroom/All_toyota_lineup/bB/grade_val/index5.html

    --Bart
  • fernieguyfernieguy Member Posts: 55
    I just did a search for "subaru baja" and I got this link to motortrend and it says the subaru baja will make its pre-production debut at the Detroit auto show


    http://www.motortrend.com/dec01/peek/1.html


    Stephen


    I guess we know the name now.

  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    we got a bunch of detectives here. I'd say Subaru Baja is a done-deal!

    Bob
  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    Your next mission, should you choose to accept it, is to dig up more dirt on the upcoming new Forester.

    This message will self-destruct in five....;-)

    Ed
  • fernieguyfernieguy Member Posts: 55
    if you go to that above link and go to the future models and go to 2004 this is what it says about the Forester and WRX STI coming over...


    2004 Subaru Forester: Turbocharged model added.


    2004 Subaru Impreza WRX STi: The Impreza WRX has been a smashing success, bringing first-time Subaru shoppers into the showroom and establishing a true performance image in America. A watered-down version of the home-market WRX, the 227-horse model will be joined by its WRX STi big brother. The Subaru Technica International model promises 260 horsepower, firmer suspension, front and rear limited-slip differentials, six-speed manual transmission, and larger Brembo brakes.


    For other years here is the link to the page


    http://www.motortrend.com/future/index0.html


    That STI sounds pretty sweet, I wonder what they will sell that hot rod for..


    Stephen

  • fernieguyfernieguy Member Posts: 55
    Check that link above and you'll see Subaru is planning on releasing a coupe based on the WRX and calling it the SVX. Thats the first I've heard of that.

    Stephen
  • bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    Thanks for the links. I believe the SVX rumor was started by a Japanese magazine a year or so ago. MagX maybe?

    -Dennis
  • miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    Hi Stephen,

    I recall reading that here some time ago but can't find it via the crippled search function. I'm waiting for the MY04 turbocharged Legacy GT. Actually I'll probably wait for the redesigned MY05. Well, I'll wait a year for the bugs to worked out, so maybe in 05 or 06 I'll retire my 93 Civic. I'd rather have the B4 Blitzen Touringwagon, but I won't hold my breath.

    ..Mike

    ..Mike

  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    the re-born SVX is an old rumor, that's probably a year or so old. I had heard that Subie product planners wanted to offer something to compete with the Audi TT, and most likely to be built of the WRX platform.

    It's been reported here and at Motor Trend. I've never seen anything from Subaru, however, to confirm this. We've heard about the STi, STX, Legacy GT turbo, the GM deal; but nothing about the SVX—officially. Maybe they want it to be a complete surprise!?

    They certainly could use a stylish coupe in their lineup. As it stands, there's a gaping hole there. They need a *coupe* (not just a sedan or wagon) to go up against the Acura RSX and Toyota Celica

    Bob
  • danjaecksdanjaecks Member Posts: 54
    I keep seeing references here to the Forester getting a turbocharged engine in MY03 or 04. I would think the supercharged engine from the STX/Baja would be a better fit with the Forester. I.e. no turbo lag, more low end power. Sounds lots better to me, I don't like the lack of low end power in turbos. And 230 hp / 210 ft lbs would be nice!

    See specs at http://irvinesubaru.com/stx/stx_specs.html
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    won't have a supercharged engine. It will come with either the 2.5 H-4 or the 3.0 H-6.

    Bob
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    that the link to that Irvine CA Subie dealer was referring to it as the Baja too. Anybody still doubt that name now?

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Edmunds just put up their links, under News. I'll comment on each model they cover:

    Continental: not just suicide doors, but also suicide door dings! Those open so wide you'd need two parking spaces. Also, why does Ford insist on being obsessive-compulsive with all its concepts? Way too many horizontal lines. Last time it was too many ovals, before that it was too many triangles. Get over it and stop obsessing. OK, I'm going to go wax my wheels again now. ;-)

    Crossfire: should compete with the Audi TT, but not nearly as stylish. Will be small, nimble even? Mercedes V6, nice. The hatch looks weird, but if quality is good it should be interesting.

    H2: should have a diesel. Better suited to the character. Indy front suspension.

    S-Type: notice 6 speed autos are becoming common? Subaru is two steps behind now.

    Navigator: 4 wheel indy! They even got a magic 3rd seat, wow! Adjustable suspension, too. Cut the price in half and I'd even consider it. They really, really should have updated the styling though, it looks like the old one!

    Matrix: $18,750 for 180hp in a sporty looking wagon. These are going to be hot. It'll steal WRX shoppers that are bargain hunters, IMO. This is way cooler than the Celica. Bring back the Altezza lights, though.

    -juice
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Subaru Baja it is. I like it.

    -juice
  • fernieguyfernieguy Member Posts: 55
    Since I was the one who was 'warm' and actually guessed the "Baja" name do I win anything... Please...

    Stephen
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    gets an injection fo Viper: A 205 hp 2.4 turbo. From the front it gets a Viper-like grille and a hood scoop, and looks like what the WRX should look like (IMO).

    Bob

    http://industryclick.com/microsites/index.asp?srid=10250&magazineid=1004&siteid=26
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    is one good-looking car! Both the WRX and Neon have oval headlights, but the Neon's *execution* is soooo much better...

    http://www.wieck.com/public/*2PV_032555
  • armac13armac13 Member Posts: 1,129
    You've got to be kidding. Really, you are, aren't you??

    Ross
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Absolutely not. I think, from the front, that is one sharp-looking car.

    Bob
  • hypovhypov Member Posts: 3,068
    http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/hypov/vwp?.dir=/My+Photos&.dnm=Sloth.jpg&.view=t
  • fernieguyfernieguy Member Posts: 55
    Here is an article that reviews the new twin turbo legacy (liberty as its known down under)


    http://www.autospeed.com/A_1229/page1.html


    There is quite a few nice shots of the car, and it looks like one hot car to say the least. Using my conversions I get about 260 hp and 231 ft.lbs of torque. Sounds like enough to get me around.


    Stephen

  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Thanks for the link! :)

    Interesting comment about the "hole" in the power band.

    Bob
  • fernieguyfernieguy Member Posts: 55
    I noticed that comment as well about the "hole" I'm pretty sure you just tune that out but it is interesting to see that Subaru would give out a car with that much potential with what I would call a glaring engine fault. I'm no mechanic or anything but with two turbo's you should be able to adjust when they kick in and out so you don't end up with a hole, it also depends on how sensitive the turbo's are to the conditions (humidity, temp, elevation... etc.). Its weird that MotorTrend didn't have any comment on when or if this car would make it to North America, it looks like a car that would certainly do well on this side of the pond..but what do we know we're Subaru geeks. :-)

    Stephen
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The trick is to sweet talk the CSRs (trained models, really) into letting you get a close look. I got behind the ropes to see the Chevy Borrego up close and personal, for example. She was able to answer a few questions I had, too. Just don't get too technical, you gotta remember they're trained for a mainstream audience, not us Subie nuts!

    -juice
  • jimmyp1jimmyp1 Member Posts: 640
    VOD = Valley of Death, and it is talked about at length on the UK's B4 Yahoo groups board. There seem to be many people who are knowledgable in general and specifically about the WRX (Euro version) and they seem to be at a dead end as to what can be done to make it any better. Most believe it is a necessary evil in the twin turbo setup. Live with it or don't buy it. I will buy it and live with it, if it ever comes. :)

    Jim
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    www.subarubaja.com

    Well, at least it takes you the SOA's home page. If you type the word "Baja" in the SEARCH window, it will (now) give you a couple of links that mention the words Subaru Baja! The links are not yet active, and probably won't be until Subaru's press announcement which is either Monday or Tuesday afternoon. Anybody know for sure??

    So that "confirms" the name, and that's at least a start...

    Bob
  • miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    Impressive detective work, Bob. I never noticed search buried in the footer. For me, search returns 12 active links in a small non-sizable window (oh how clever of the web dilettantes). All are a variation of a press release containing:

    A design that hints at Baja racers and classic dune buggies meshes perfectly with the "California Dreamin' 2000" theme for the Los Angeles Auto Show, where Subaru introduced the vehicle.

    Re-indexing the site (usually done off-hours) might cause inactive links. However, I think you're on track. Good work.

    ..Mike

    ..Mike

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'm sure even in its hole it makes more power than you'll ever need. I'll take it. It may even mean shorter wait lists. :-)

    Neon is not an ugly car. The first one was too cute, very femme, but the new one isn't. At least it's unique.

    People gush over BMWs but look at them - they are completely average looking. Remove the blue/white propellor badge and put a Kia badge and people would call them ugly. The new 7 series is the ugliest car on the market, well maybe 2nd to the Aztek.

    What I'm saying is that the badge on the hood matters as much as the looks of the car itself.

    -juice
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I hate that "Hunchback" on the 7 series. I keeps reminding me of the movie.

    SANCTUARY!

    It should be banned to the inside of a church in Munich, so noone has to see it, just like in the movie. ;-)

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Juice, I've always felt the Neon to be a vehicle of excellent visual proportions. The only weak link visually for me was the grille. This new turbo-Neon has now married the Viper grille with the rest of the car quite successfully. It now clearly looks like a "Dodge." I also like the WRX-type hood scoop.

    To me it's interesting to compare the front fender contour (with its oval headlights) to that of the Impreza. The Neon's fender has a soft graceful tapered curve, whereas the Impreza has a very hard upright contour to it. It's very much—in-your-face—as opposed to being graceful and subtle. It's an awkward mix of shapes that don't work well together. I think when most people criticize the Impreza's looks, that's really what they're responding to.

    Bob
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    It looks like a larger CRV. If you look closely, you can see the third rear seat has a 60/40 split fold. :)

    Bob

    http://ptcruiserusa.com/hondasuv/pilot/preprod_honda_pilot.jpg

    http://ptcruiserusa.com/hondasuv/pilot/preprod_honda_pilot2.jpg
  • hypovhypov Member Posts: 3,068
    Bob- not only does "www.subarubaja.com" takes you to SoA's site. Now, the site addy I'd posted hypov Jan 3, 2002 10:37am which didn't do much takes you there too.
    Every road is leading to Baja.

    -Dave
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    SOA has REMOVED the two Baja links that I referred to yesterday!

    Bob
  • bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    Yesterday I was speaking with someone about it. He knows someone that is working on the advertising art for it. As we've all heard, it is going to be called the Baja. Bob is causing choas over at SoA. :-) I'm sure Patti has been biting her tongue, anxious to say something for a while.

    -Dennis
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    especially around "Showtime!" I've been there twice today, and both times new images from both the Detroit and LA auto shows have been added.

    http://www.wieck.com/public/index.html

    I don't care for the Chevy BelAir. I didn't like the the Ford '49 from last year's show circuit, I like this even less. Been there, done that. Since the retro Prowler, all these other "retros" have been nothing but "me-too" efforts.

    I do like the "retro" Ford GT 40, however. I would love to see that get produced. Acura's showing a radical RDX. I need to learn more about it before commenting...

    There are others too—too many to mention.

    Bob
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