Honda Accord Problems 2000-2005

bsum70

bburton1
Yes, I used the torque wrench to tighten the lug nut (80lb/ft). I changed my rotor/brake 9 months ago at dealer (told them to 'torque to spec') but shudder come back again..... I rotate the tires but not helping..... Is that some other parts I need to check????

jrct9454

I hope you are using Honda pads, and doing the appropriate lube work to keep the calipers moving freely. If the latter is not the case, you will get symptoms very much like warped rotors - it is caused by the pads vibrating within the calipers.

That doesn't mean, of course, that the rotors aren't warped again. 9 months may seem like a long time, but it only takes one situation where they get wet when they are hot, and they're lumpy again.

I can't tell from your post whether you are doing all the work yourself, or someone else is doing it. Either way, I would have an authorized Honda dealer, using real OEM pads, do them once more, and turn or replace the rotors as necessary. And yes, I never allow the car to be driven off the service drive before I PERSONALLY retorque the wheel bolts with my own torque wrench. These cars are notorious for this problem.

bsum70

bburton1
Yes, I used the torque wrench to tighten the lug nut (80lb/ft). I changed my rotor/brake 9 months ago at dealer (told them to 'torque to spec') but shudder come back again..... I rotate the tires but not helping..... Is that some other parts I need to check????

venanzik

I have a 92 accord automatic and was wondering if it has a filter in the transmission. A while back i just changed the fluid by removing the plug and then added new honda trans fluid. Is this all you have to do or do you have to remove the pan to get to the filter if there is one.

also:
what do most people recomend, a flush and fill or just a drain and fill for the coolent?

mikegold_1966

Took my car to the dealer today and had the air conditioner checked--it wasn't blowing cold enough. They checked for leaks and there wasn't any. They put in freon (c134?) in and the air condition now blows frigid cold air. My question is, if there are no leaks, where did the freon go?

alcan

It has a leak, the dealer didn't find it. It'll eventually be low on refrigerant again. R134A (or any refrigerant) doesn't just disappear.

goodengine

Honda rotors are bolted directly to the hub. Once the rotor/hub assembly is over tightened vie the lug nuts with an air gun, the hub will actually deform and never run true again. This is why Honda dealers have an on-the-car lathe to cut new rotors to compensate for hub run-out. buy new hubs, rotors, and pads. Press them together, then never allow anyone to tighten the lug nuts without a torque wrench. Problem solved.

parodie

Hi,

I'm a new 2002 Accord V6 EX owner. I bought it for two week and put 350 miles on it. I have two questions:

1. I found the steering wheel is slightly trembling when the speed reaches around 60 miles. Below or above is fine. Is that normal for every car that has a specific speed for "trembling"? Should I avoid driving in that speed?

2. There are some scratch on my front bumper. I guessed it's some one did it when they part their car. The paint is dropped for some lines. Should I repaint it? Will dealer take care of this?

Thank you very much!

auburn63

There is no service filter, you just drain and refill on a regular basis(30k or so). There is a filter screen on the inside of the transmission but it is non-serviceable until the transmission is being rebuilt.

mikegold_1966

The dealership ran a extensive leak test and found none. I am wondering when Honda had a recall on my car's air conditioner/condenser, if the technician making the repair caused the loss. From that point on, the air conditioner never cooled properly.

jrct9454

No, never tolerate even a small amount of shaking, at any speed, in this or any other new car.

Everyone's knee-jerk reaction is to assume one of the front tires is out of balance - my extensive experience is that most often, this kind of subtle shaking is caused by out of round conditions [ what the trade calls vertical runout ].

If it were my car, I would start by rotating the tires front-back, retorquing the wheel bolts carefully by torque wrench [ see all of the posts above ], and see if the problem goes away. If it doesn't, it means that one of your front hubs is slightly out of round.

One of the things I do before ever agreeing to take delivery of any new car is to check it thoroughly at all highway speeds between 50 and 80 mph on a smooth, asphalt surface, to check for exactly the problem you describe. I have lived to regret it every time I have violated this cardinal rule, because chasing these problems can be a very subtle, time-consuming, and often frustrating process. The biggest problem is that the service dept almost immediately rushes to the wheel balance machine, when balance was never the problem in the first place, and about 90% of the time, they manage to make it worse.

The Michelin tires on this car are usually excellent in terms of having good quality control on runout, but even Michelin can let one get out that is out of tolerance for this car. Even a 1-1.5 mm level of vertical runout can be felt by any sensitive driver.

Start with a front-back tire swap; if that doesn't do it, you probably have a front hub problem. If it does do it, one of the original front tires is probably not round enough and needs to be replaced.

Note that all measurements of vertical runout have to be made when the tires have been allowed to heat up, typically at least 10 miles at highway speeds. Otherwise, you will be looking at the slight flat-spotting that occurs whenever the tire gets cold and sits overnight, and thus all measurements are useless.

cokane5227

if anybody remembers, i posted a few weeks ago about having brake shudder, the service department told me everything was fine and reset the brakes and everything went fine. but just the day before yesterday the shudder came back again, brought the car in today, they checked it and found warped rotors but the service manager told me that honda wouldn't warranty it, so if i want to fix this problem i'm going to have to spend $220 out of my own pocket WHEN I HAVE EXTENDED WARRANTY. my question is that is it true that honda wouldn't warranty warped rotors? i've been in the TL forum and saw people had their warped rotors replaced under warranty, why wouldn't honda do it? is it reasonable for me to pay to fix warped rotors on a 16,000 miles car?

gandalf17

Hello everyone.

I do not own a Honda Accord, but recommended my mother buy one, which she did a few years ago. She has the 4cyl., V-Tech EX sedan with automatic. She hasn't had any problems with the car until just recently. During normal driving, she noticed that the check engine light had come on. She immediately took the car to the dealership for a diagnostic and was told that it was likely a "V-Tech solenoid malfunction or the oil pressure switch was having problems".

After receiving the car back from the dealer, the check engine light is no longer on and they have asked her to come back if it happens again.

My question is this: Has anyone else experienced a similiar problem with their Accord. Please feel free to also comment on this problem as the dealer's explanation seems somewhat suspect in my opinion.

Thanks,

isellhondas

It is highly unlikely that a technician could have done anything to cause your A/C system to leak freon.

What year is your Honda? How many miles?

In time all systems will slowly lose a bit of freon so it's possible the charge will cool things down for quite awhile. If, three months from now, your A/C is blowing hot, you definatly have a leak.

And those slow leaks can be VERY hard to find!

mikefm58

Definitely complain more and LOUDER. Rotors do not warp at 16K miles.

srradide

I had both these problem w/ my 98 Accord, 16-20 months after purchase. Both were replaced under warranty. Since the dealer did not have a spare solenoid (rare problem....etc etc...), they gave me a loaner car for 2 days. The second time was when the oil seal broke. Blamed it on OEM parts.

gandalf17

Thanks for your feedback. How serious is this issue?

jrct9454

...can occur at any time and with any number of miles. We had an '87 BMW 3er that had to have its rotors replaced twice within the first 10,000 miles. BUT...they did replace them, and with no questions asked. It was pretty well known by then that BMW had problems with a supplier...the car was always babied and I was very careful to follow my own advice about hand-torquing and avoiding cold water on hot brakes.

I would find another dealer and try again. I would also avoid triple-digit speeds on SR4, but that's another issue.

Short of a industry-wide adoption of carbonfiber disks [not in our lifetimes, I can tell you], this will continue to be a problem, and I can assure you it is not unique to Honda. The dealer is the gate keeper when it comes to warranty claims - I'd look for someone in a more generous frame of mind [by the way, if you read the warranty carefully, it can be interpreted to mean that brake parts like this are indeed not covered...but different dealers have different levels of pain when duking it out with the factory over warranty claims].

maxhonda99

Brake pads & rotors, like Tires, are considered Normal Wear & Tear items, therefore typically are not covered under factory warranty or extended warranty. Typically, though, manufacturer's do give a 1year/12,000 mile warranty for wear and tear items like brake pads & rotors. My rotors warped at 14K miles and the dealer wouldn't cover it. It would have been nice if they had, but they didn't. But I didn't fuss about it since I knew my case was not the fault of the Honda dealer or Honda manufacturing.

cokane5227

i called another dealer and also America Honda, the answer is the same, NOT CORVERED.
guess i'll have to pay for it on my own then. it's okay i think everybody did the best they could do.

cokane5227

i just went through the brakes forum and discovered that over-tightening the lug nuts after tire rotation could cause the rotors to warp, therefore i recall bringing my car to a local tire shop for tire rotaton/balance a few thousand miles ago, which now i think might have caused the warped rotors.
my question is that this afternoon when i made the appointment with the service dept it sounded like they are not going to replace the rotors but just machine the surface of them (i really don't know anything about the job or the process or anything related to them). is that going to totally fix the problem? or should i tell them to simply get a new set of rotors? i know this might be a silly question but i don't know anything when it comes to mechanical stuff and i want to get this problem fixed the right way, because my classes will be starting soon and when they do, i won't have anymore time to take care of these problems.
any advice would be greatly appreciated.

edlchiang

I have owned two Civics in my life and in each time the front brake rotors warped at around 2-1/2 years/30,000 miles. In both cases the Honda dealers (two different) machined the rotors under warranty. Although I do like Hondas I don't like the fact that the rotors go bad every 30,000 miles or so.

tntitan

It seems that the simple solution is to hand torque your lug nuts whenever you have any brake work or tires rotated, etc. I have 2 new Hondas and I decided to spend $65 at Sears for a torque wrench instead of hundreds on new rotors when some car jockey overtorques my lug nuts.

bodydouble

I've been told that it may be fine to machine the rotors just once or twice. But if they are machined too often, the rotors get thinnned and then they will have a higher propensity to warp.

bsum70

The bad thing is after you changed the warped rotors, the vibration WILL come back. I had change 4 sets of rotors (from OEM to different makes) and the vibration still comes back. I think the 'hub' need to change with the warped rotors to make sure the vibration don't come back, which is COSTLY.
I am kind of mad about the whole situation. Yes, the rotors (or design) from Honda is easy to warp, but who are the one warped them most of the time?? those 'brake specialist' or 'mechanics' or even dealer service department. They are the one use those powerful tool to OVER torque everything and cause the rotors to warp. Remember we PAID those guys to do brake job, that should be THEIR responsibility to make sure 'torque to spec' not the owner themselves!!! Why we have to pay somebody to do the job and we (the one paid the bill!!) need to go back and check or redo the job??? Ridiculous!

isellhondas

Hard, abusive driving will warp rotors also.

mikefm58

It's OK to resurface the rotors as long as after they are resurfaced that the thickness is still within specs. In fact, I would NEVER let a dealer tell me they couldn't just be resurfaced rather than replacing them. I've never heard of rotors that couldn't be resurfaced about twice before needing replacements.

cokane5227, you need to find out why your rotors warped prematurely.

bsum70, if rotors continually warp in your case, something else is wrong.

isell, how does hard abusive driving warp rotors if everything else is OK? I agree hard abusive driving will wear through pads quite easily, but not warping.

My '99 CRV had the first brake job at 2 1/2 yrs, 55K miles and the rotors were still perfectly true.

bsum70

Harsh/abusive driving: driving 100+mph and then panic stop, brake hard in raining condition etc...
I brought my Accord to the dealership and ask the same question: 'Is there something wrong in my car cause the rotors to warp (I drive conservatively and torque 'my own nuts') that often??' No answer, they even denied warped rotors are common in Hondas... what else can I do or say??? I hate that brake vibration I get but I don't want to spend closed to $1000 (change rotors/pads and hub) fix a 1994 Accord, which is ashamed because it drives perfect!!

hbund216

From what I've heard continued hard stops could wrap the rotors. but it seems like most of the people here are having wraped rotors despite that. I have not driven my Accord hard, or gotten the breaks wet and there is vibration in the breaks. I would have to say that this is an issue with Accords. As it has been with other manufacturers at one time or another. Lets see if they get it right with the 03 model.

cokane5227

i don't know exactly why my rotors were warped, i once brought my car to a local tire shop for balance/rotation which might have caused the rotors to warp since they probably don't torque correctly, but then i remember the brakes weren't so smooth before i did that. and i've always done my work at the dealer except for that one time when i didn't want to get up at 7am in the morning to catch an appointment. the car is at the dealer now, front pads are being resurfaced and the pads are being replaced when there are 7mm left, everybody's telling me it's a waste of money but i like my vehicle mechanically problem-free, because ANY CAR should be mechanically problem-free. my friend has a 94 accord EX, which he has driven VERY HARD for 70,000 miles, he purchased it new and TRUST ME, he's ABUSIVE, he drives crazy therefore i never ride in his car because he drives his accord like a race car, AND he never takes care of his car, it was ME who told him to go for the 30,000 and 60,000 miles service, yet he's never had a SINGLE mechanical problem, there's rattle everywhere inside and his leather is totally messed up, but mechanically, his car is perfect. i can drive his car up to 110mph(he usually does 120) with full confidence when, my car, at that speed, is uncontrollable because of vibration (not the brake shudder, something else) in the wheel, seat, and under the car, the vibration makes the driver side mirror shake too therefore when i look at the mirror, i get dizzy. and that's 90mph, not 110mph.
maybe now isellhondas would like to explain to everybody how "abusive driving would make your car go bad".
i don't think the current new accords are worse than the 94 my friend has, i just think the currecnt new accords have more out-of-the-factory-defects that are hard to diagnose, hard to find the problem and hard to find a cure because they are factory-defective.

jrct9454

...is that if you get the brakes hot, and then suddenly stop and park the car, you run a good chance of warped rotors, and as I've tried to point out, THIS IS NOT UNIQUE TO HONDA. The problem is that when you stop the car and park it with the brakes really hot, the portion of the rotor that is sitting under the pads cools at a much slower rate than the rest of the disc. Voila: warpage. And this is beyond the obvious no-nos, like over/uneven torquing, and hitting a hot disc with cold water.

This happens a lot, and many people just ignore it. Real car nuts can't of course, which includes most people on this forum. But don't for a minute think this is somehow a generic Honda problem - my experience is that BMW, Toyota, Nissan, VW...you name it...have the same complaints. How many depends more on the nature of the drivers than the car manufacturer. Most Buick owners don't notice, or don't brake hard enough, to ever induce the problem.

jrct9454

...Cok, the high speed vibrations you're feeling could very well be related to the problems with the rotors/hubs being so bad now that the only solution is complete replacement. However, it could also be wheel balance, or tires that are not round enough any more. My particular specialty is chasing vibrations, and both of our recent-gen Accords [a '98 4cyl and an '01 V6] were absolutely as smooth as a baby's bottom up to any speed I dared maintain without worrying about the CHP air bears. But I do all my own tire rotations, at mileages that most people won't consider [2500-3000 miles max], and carefully check for runout and irregularities after every tire movement on the car. I also never let anyone else mount a wheel without checking the torque using my own wrench.

Brake work is always a time for high anxiety, because it carries with it the potential to take a good car and make it not-good. Again, I tend to supervise the work and at the very least do the torque check before driving away, and have had good luck with our high mileage Accords at the local dealer. But I would never turn one of these cars over to any of the independent brake shops, chain or otherwise. Just too risky...

mazda_jim

A month or so back, there was a bit of discussion about dimming/flickering instrumental panel lights and headlights on the '98-02 Accords. Since my 2000 EX-V6 sedan was afflicted with this problem, I raised it with the service dept. at the 30K mile service interval today. I just got a call from them informing me that they will be replacing the alternator under warranty. They noticed some kind of unusual noise coming from the alternator, and they think replacing it will resolve the dimming lights problem, too. We'll see if that's the case. I imagine this would have been a pretty costly repair if not done under warranty.

I have to say I'm pretty pleased with the dealer service. They were very responsive to a number of minor complaints (about rattles, etc.), and they agreed without hesitation to do a number of repairs to address every point that I raised.

cokane5227

i don't know what exactly is wrong to cause the vibration but it has been there since new, it started happening on the 3rd day of my ownership, i brought it back to the dealer for many many times but never really got it solved, but over time and my observations, i don't really think it's the tire/wheel anymore, i think it has something to do with the steering/suspension, because at 80mph on a normal day, the car gets tossed around by wind very easily, only the front though, the rear stays very predictable, but the service advisor refused to believe me, he said he felt the vibration when he test drove but it's within specs so they are not going to do anything about it.

edlchiang

you maybe correct...about warped rotors not being a unique problem to Honda...however my wife has a Toyota Corolla with 77,000 miles and she never has had warped rotors and she is really hard on her brakes. My dad has a Mazda 626 with 120,000 miles without any rotor problems. Both of my Civics has the same warped rotor problems. They had to be resurfaced every 30,000 miles or so. I realize that this is only anectdotal evidence, but it seems that Hondas do have rotor warping problems while other cars do not! Oh by the way Isellhondas I am a fan of Honda and not a Honda basher!

jrct9454

Both our '90 Corolla [50k miles] and my mother-in-law's '91 [about 30k miles] were ready for new rotors or a turning when these cars were sold. Neither was really bad, but both were noticeable, and if either were to have stayed around any longer, they would have needed the work.

Our '87 BMW 3er went through 3 sets in less than 10k miles. Service people were apologetic, and always responsive, but I sold the car when it needed it done again at 13k. And this car was babied during its whole life.

Our '92 Sable developed lumpy rotors after a single, gentle stop from 60 mph at the end of an off-ramp, in 115F heat in Phoenix, after less than 10k miles. The brakes just never had a chance to cool properly before the car was stored for the night...

Our Hondas, on the other hand, have been pretty good about this. My mother's '91 Accord wagon's discs were ready for a good turning at 45k miles, but this was just routine, and there were no untoward problems beyond the fact that the pads were nearly gone [all town driving].

Those are my anecdotes, to go with subscribing to nearly two dozen of the boards here on Edmunds. Other makes with notable lumpy rotor problems: Audi [esp the A6]; Lincoln [LS]; Volvo [S80]...this is not a unique Honda problem.

hbund216

mazda_jim, let us know if replacement alternator solves the problem. I have the same problem and Honda is blaming it on the alarm.

maxhonda99

Brakes warp on all cars if the right conditions are present. One condition is definately overtighten the lug nuts, the other is definately hard driving(Abusive driving), the third that I know that is common also is when the rotors cool down really quickly after being hot. This especially happens if your rotors are really hot and you drive through alot of water-this can warp rotors. And generally you can resurface rotors twice before you need to replace them. At least that's what a few techs have told me. BTW, replacing rotors every time they warp is just too costly.

And even though the rotors on my Accord warped for some odd reason at about 14K miles(car sat for 2 months in the driveway in the winter while I was on vacation, when I came back they were warped), another 14K miles later, they haven't warped. So, I doubt it's a "Honda" problem.

auburn63

ISell may be being to easy on us techs. It could be possible that the problem/leak maybe tech installed but if it has been a while since the repair it would be too late to complain about it to anyone. Also if it was a tech installed leak it would be in an area in which they should be able to find it. If they havent put in freon dye yet then it is time. If they have, then they need to look around the a/c lines at the right shock tower and pull the insulation back on the lines as they develope a leak in that area and it is hard to find. As well, inside the evaporator box is a place to look if no other leaks can be found. Sometimes the evaporator or expansion valve does leak. Good luck...

cokane5227

hi auburn, since you are a honda technician i was wondering if you can help me out a little on my vibration problem.
the vibration started happening on the 3rd day of my ownership, at first, it only happened sometimes, but as time passed, it got really bad that i couldn't drive faster than 70mph, i went to the dealer a few times for it and on the 3rd time they found a bent wheel and replaced it, that took care of 80% of the vibration but there is still something left, it can be felt through the steering wheel, from the bottom of the seat, and if you put your left foot on the footrest, you can feel it there too, the vibration can't be seen because it's not servere but noticeable, the vibration is exactly the same kind as the one before they changed the bent wheel, only much less noticeable, and the weird thing is, before they changed the bent wheel, the vibration was very bad but the driver side mirror didn't shake at all which now it does, very bad that at 90mph, i can't use it anymore, they replaced the mirror with a new one which obviously didn't work because it wasn't the mirror's problem.
the vibration did go away on several occasions, but i couldn't find a pattern, it's not temperature-wise, it's not how long i drove it before it went away (one morning i took it out of the parking lot and onto the freeway and it wasn't there), and it's not the way i drove it.
i was at the dealer today for brake jobs, and along i told them again about the vibration problem, a technician drove with me and confirmed the vibration, he said it was probably the tire that was ot of balance, so they did a 4-wheel balance, but it didn't do anything, no changes at all.
i'm really puzzled, this problem has been with me for 9 months and 16,000 miles, i couldn't find a pattern of the problem occurring and the techs couldn't find what was wrong with it, during the few times (4 or 5) the vibration went away, i felt really good driving it, it felt worthy of the money i paid for it, but on other occasions, it's always there, bugging me, sometimes getting on my nerves.
if you have any suggestions or advice, it would be really great.

k_time

I have a 2001 4cyl ex and it does the same thing. The problem is with a vacuum hose connected to the rear engine mount. Honda has a TSB out on this #00-059 "Rear engine mount-thump on cold start". I think all that is needed is to reroute this vacuum hose. I will take mine to the dealer when I get a chance.

auburn63

If this vibration is there while cruising, not during braking or acellerating, then it most likely is going to be a problem with the tires and rims. What you will probably need to do is find a dealer or tire store with a up to date tire(balancer) machine. You need one that measures and pin points road force. Chances are that one of your tire/rim assemblies has a high amount of road force, possibly even the tire that had the bad rim on it. If so chances are that you can use the balancer to either break the tire down and move it around or change the tire from one rim to the another for a better match of tire and rim or replace the bad tire/rim. We just got a new machine about 2 months ago and the reason we did was an Odyssey that was driving us and the customer crazy much in the same way as yours. We were able to take the tire and match it up to one of the other rims on the vehicle. After the swap all was better and has not yet returned.
You will probably not only need to find someone with a new machine bit also a tech that knows how to use it as the machine does confuse some techs until they get used to it and its functions.

Since the vibrations did get much better after the rim replacement then I would have to say that if the amount left is not normal then it would seem to be in the tire/rim assembly. However still have a look at the struts for leakage. Good luck

jrct9454

Auburn has confirmed what I said several posts ago: Tire/wheel runout is deadly on these cars. It is almost always the source of these kinds of vibrations. As little as 1-1.5mm will do it. You need to find someone who is willing to spend the time to examine each tire/wheel for both lateral [wobble] and vertical [out of round] runout.

help_me_honda

Hi-do all. I just purchased a meticulously maintained 88 Accord DX 3-door and had the bright idea of cleaning the engine (yesterday). Now (as in, this very morning) one of the headlights has started opening and shutting continuously if you turn the lights on. It continues to wink even if the car is shut off, so I've had to remove the fuse for the retractor (it only took me 20 frantic minutes on the roadside to figure that one out). The headlights work fine--it's just the retractor that's goofy. Any ideas how to deal with the retractor motor or where else the problem might lie? Muchos thankias.

cokane5227

thanks for the advice, it's very helpful, i printed it out and brought it to the dealer with me, i told them the balancing they did yesterday didn't help at all, it didn't change anything so they told me to bring the car back in on tuesday and they'll bring it to another place where they have a much newer machine there, and they'll balance again and switch the tires/rims as you suggested to see if it'll fix the problem, if not they said they'll have to call a honda rep to come down here and further discuss the problem.

auburn63

It is possible that it may fix itself as water may have gotten into the retractor motor. But if not then you will need to trace down the short or leave it in the up mode as you are doing. Let us know if the problem persist and if so I will try and give you areas to look at.

auburn63

Cool, let is know how you make out on tuesday and good luck.

mazda_jim

I drove the car at night for the first time since the alternator was replaced, and I don't think this solved the dimming lights problem (at least not completely). The lights still dim more noticeably than any other cars I have owned whenever the A/C compressor kicks on or a power accessory is used. A true comparison will not be possible until this fall or winter, however, because it was much more noticeable in cold weather even before the alternator was replaced. I am coming to the conclusion that this is just a characteristic of the model and it is operating "within specs." Sorry that won't be of much help in your case. I am pretty sure your alarm system has nothing to do with this, though.

isellhondas

Well...a long time ago, you posted about your habit of driving 100 MPH on Highway 4.

I guess that's why I wasn't surprised when you said you had warped rotors.

And, yes, warped rotors can happen on any car and, as others have mentioned can be from several causes.

Your other vibration does sound like a tire/wheel problem. You could even have a tread seperation.

cokane5227

it's okay, i got a new set of pads and resurfaced rotors, i'm sure i'll be more gentle on the brakes, but if it happens again, i'm sure i'll fix it again, regardless of paying or not, it's just something i can't live with.

tread seperation? i don't really know too much about these things, can you explain it a little?