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However, if your 330i has the SP, I believe that you could outhandle it in the twisties as the Audi is a little softer and doesn't handle as confidently, forcing the driver to be a bit more tenuous.
Race if you have the chance. I'd love to hear of the results!
Hey, can I call you a komi?
Where is everybody? Summer blues?
BTW i spoke with the dealer and he will evaluate my steering. If it requires a fix, I may get an old rack. Keep you posted.
BTW, thanks for the F-1 BMW pictures that you sent me. It puts a smile on my face every time I look at my desktop's wallpaper.
Just wondering if Stalin ever had a chance to drive a BMW and whether the world would have been a better place if he had. Thanks for the feedback, komi.
Unlike the Audi Quattro system, the XI AWD sends power 38%-62% front-rear (this to preserve the RWD feeling according to the brochure:))
Does this make it possible to equip AWD SP with perf tires and different wheels combos (in Canada)? I seriously hope that the BMW people know what they're doing -not only marketing (those are the ones deciding the option packaging, right?!) but also the engineers.
Another question. A quick browse at Bridgestone for winter tires and I found Blizzak LM22 at 225/45-17 and even 245/40-17! Are we now saying that those are too big and unsafe? (they are the exact same sizes as the SP summer perf tires)
Brave -- this is just speculation on my part, but I highly doubt that there would be any adaptive logic involved in the throttle response. In a conventional set-up, this would not even be possible, since no electronics are typically involved. In a drive-by-wire system, however, it would be possible to have some logic involved, but I can't think of a reason why the engineers would choose this. It seems you would ALWAYS want maximum response, which means that the amount of gas/air induced into the engine would always be constantly (not variably) proportional to the pedal travel. I.e., 75% of pedal travel ALWAYS equals the same amount of gas/air fed into the engine, regardless of driver style or other conditions. Also, if you were to have some adaptive logic in the drivetrain (which includes the throttle, engine, and tranny), it would not make sense to have it in two places (e.g., throttle and Step). This simply makes it more complex than it needs to be: keep it in ONE place versus two (throttle + tranny) or three (throttle + tranny + interaction between the two). Remember: KISS. This is a particularly useful acronym in the controls arena.
Again, this is merely my speculation on what makes sense. I could be wrong -- this is a highly technical question that hopefully someone else has further insights on (or better yet, FACTS)...
-eug
This Saturday will be 11 weeks since my original date of order. I guess I'm just getting used to waiting and expecting delays every step of the way.
Can you tell me again exactly where you found this info about 330xi SP with Canadian specs? Any Canadian web site that has that info?
Yes, you can put in performance tires in AWD cars - a friend of mine who has an Audi 90 here in Boston spent the whole winter driving his Quattro with Dunlop SP8000's (very summery) and drove his car to Phily in a huge snow and ice storm 90 mph pretty much all the way. You'll be fine with performance tires but I would not put in different size tires and I still keep thinking that this is some sort of a mistake, esp. considering that it is not offered on the 330xi in the U.S.
Yes, I'm sure that 245/40/17 and even wider winter tires exist. You can also find 345/30/17 summer tires but that doesn't mean they improve the handling of your 3-series. I think a width of 245 will be OK but not nearly as good for snow driving as a width of 205. It's common sense - the wider the tire, the less it can dig into the snow. Kind of funny talking about all this in the middle of summer. It has a chilling effect on me just thinking about it
I strongly disagree with using higher tire pressure than recommended for EVERYDAY driving. The higher the tire pressure, the bouncier the car is in turns. Tires with lower tire pressure are stickier when cornering because they have the ability to adjust the sidewalls better. Bouncier tires get you better mileage and slightly better acceleration. I tried different tire pressure for my 325i and found 31/34 F/R to be optimal for everyday spirited driving. On the track, I might bump both up by 5 psi but even then it's a tradeoff between acceleration and handling. Oh, a minor detail: tires wear out faster with less air pressure. Fine with me.
Brave1heart is correct, I do not have the SP on my car, NYC metro streets are so bad that I wanted to minimize my chances of bending another rim (I bent 5 on my last car).
Koaladude,
I spent some time on the BMW Canada web site and I can find no reference at all that ANY 330 (i or xi) that has anything other than 205/50 R17 rubber. The 330xi SP does however have different wheels (type 68m) from the standard 330xi. What did I miss?
Best Regards,
Shipo
I believe your sales person is not being honest with you. I ordered my 330i in April. I sat there and watched him place the order. He then gave me a copy of the order. The production number was on top. The following day I was able to track its progress.
add123
The S4 is probably slightly faster than the 330, with 250 peak HP compared to the 330's 225, and I believe it is a few hundred pounds lighter. I understand that the 330s torque band is significantly wider, however.
MotorWeek timed the S4 at 5.9 seconds in the 0-60, while it timed the 330xi at 6.2. So the S4 is ever so slightly faster than the 330xi in the 0-60.
In MotorWeek's quarter mile test, the results are even closer, with the 330xi turning in a time of 14.7 seconds, finishing at 96 MPH. In turn, the S4 turned in a 14.5 second time, crossing the line at 97 MPH.
So it strikes me that these two cars are almost a deadheat in terms of acceleration, with a slight edge going to the S4. I think the edge in handling, looks and interior appointments probably go to the 330xi. Finally, comparably equipped, the S4 is slightly more expensive than the 330xi.
As a side note, many have noted in the past that MotorWeek timed the 330i at 6.8 seconds in the 0-60. I just read their review of the 330i vs. other sport sedans, and it turns out their 330i tester was equiped with a STEPTRONIC!! This explains the relatively slow time. In fact, I suspect the manual would test out a full second faster.
BTW, KISS is Keep It Simple, Stupid - correct? Wasn't sure about the second 'S'
Finally, I have to quote my friend Conor. He has reasserted, time and again, the following: "An Audi is a glorified Volkswagen. A BMW is a BMW."
This starts to get really technical when you think about some more. I understand your point about the rate of change in throttle input. I would guess (again, a guess) that the speed with which the engine responds to the throttle inputs is dependent on a NUMBER of factors, such as: current RPM, O2 density of the air, weight of reciprocating parts (pistons), weight of revolving parts (flywheel, crankshaft), quality of gasoline, etc., etc., etc. These would be the PHYSICAL limiters of how well the engine responds to throttle inputs. I'm sure there are controls to ensure that timing and other controllable characteristics are ALWAYS optimized according to the current parameters. By that logic, introducing any further controls to adjust for driver tendencies would, by definition, be less than or equal to optimal. Still doesn't make sense to introduce any driver/throttle logic if the above assumptions are correct.
It does make sense, however, that as the engine breaks in, response may improve, as parts wear together, improve seals and tolerances, etc. This may be a likelier explanation.
Again, I welcome any other input from others who have more expertise in engine controls (I have absolutely none, just applying general engineering principles). It's interesting stuff...
Oh yeah...KISS is officially "Keep It Simple, Stupid," although the last "S" is discretional -- substitute your own "S" as desired.
It's funny - if I were going to buy an AWD 3 months ago, I would've probably bought the S4 w/o test-driving any other car. There's something about 250 HP and 6-spd manual and grip in any condition that sounds irresistible. Knowing what I know now, I'd probably go for the 330xi because the 3-series in ANY platform is a car that INSPIRES more (road feel, sound, communicative chassis).
I think the 5.9 sec number you quoted was for the S4 Avant. Audi's official number for the S4 sedan were 5.4 I think - at any rate, definitely a little faster than the E36 M3 at 5.6 sec. The S4 is still almost 200 lbs heavier than the 330xi but it would be substantially faster with its massive 258 lbs torque aided by the twin turbos. That engine has an even wider torque band than the 330.
When all is said and done, the are both great cars. I'd have to disagree with your friend on his statement about the Audi being a glorified VW. I had a Jetta for many years and every time I compared the Jetta to its same model year Audi counterpart, the Audi was just a much better-built car. We looked at the Passat and the Audi when we were shopping for my wife's car and the difference in build quality and details was astounding in favor of the Audi. Even the '00 Passat looked like an economy car compared to the A4. Having said all that, yes, I do like the fact that there are no cheap BMW's out there and a BMW is a BMW. Even an X type Jag looks too much like a Contour - you never get that with a BMW. It looks like a BMW and only BMW.
Audi S4 second fastest !!! Well, it's not that far behind...
Sticking to strictly 4 door and using manufacturer claims (because they're all done in the same controlled fashion and therefore permit an apples for apples comparo), I'd say it goes like this:
1. BMW M5
2. Jaguar XJR
3. BMW 540i (6 speed man)
4. Mercedes Benz E55
5. Subaru Impreza WRX
6. Mercedes Benz S55
7. (uuggghhh) Lexus GS430 (watch the rear end in high speed turns, it's a snapper)
=8 Audi S4 (6 speed)
=8 BMW 330i (5 speed)
=8 Audi S8
=8 Audi A6 2.7T (6 speed) (yes, the same as S4)
=8 BMW 740i Sport Pkg (SWB only)
=8 Lexus LS430
there are more
Other comments.
denrights friend connor "glorified VW" is more than a little unfair. There're really quite different cars (despite recent models platform/engine/suspension sharing). An Audi is a far higher quality finish and it's the Audi engineers who come up with things like multi-link front suspension and 5 valve cylinder heads (may-be we don't really need them but BMW can't make that claim). The Audi's engineering is every bit upto BMW and Mercedes Benz.
Having said that, I will share something I've been holding back on with regard to the ongoing S4 vs 330i debate. (God I hope my Audi customers aren't watching!) See, I sell Audi and BMW (we also have MBZ, Jag & Porsche) and I've had plenty of chances to drive all versions of both cars, frequently and in different conditions (including off public highway in simulated emergency situations)and I can tell you one thing...
There really is, quite simpley, no comparison between the two cars. Sure the S4 is quick, but I find it sorely dissapointing next to, say, the old E36 M3. A 330i is just as quick as the S4 but the BMW has a feel that puts it in a different league than anything this side of a 360 Modena. Seriously. I'm hoping that with the new A4, Audi will have a better feeling car but I really don't think they will. The BMW is unique. Even the Porsches, great as they are, don't have that all-round sense of solidity and feeling of total understanding of what the car's doing. You all just don't know how lucky you are. They really are that good and comparison to ANY other car is in many respects pointless. Especially to Swedish cars!
One last thing. Give up on the go sixers nonsense. You'll all feel that much worse after Big Shaq and Uncle Kobe bust out the brooms.
Let's go Lakers, let's go....
2. 5.2
3. 5.6
4. 5.6 (and a half?)
5. 5.7
6. 5.8
7. 5.9
8. all 6.1 (no 4 doors at 6.0 interestingly)
Audi S4 approx 3650lbs (DAMN !!) in stick shift form and 250 hp. 3650/250=14.6 lbs/hp
Subaru WRX approx 3050lbs stick and 227hp.
3050/227h=13.4 lbs/hp.
That's nearly a 10% better power to weigh ratio. I wonder how that works out for our 330i ???
2.I was also curious about the Regensburg build for all the 3-wagons. I checked with BMWUSA who said yes.
3.I checked out the glove box CD-changer but the install instructions required removing radio to run cable and I didn't feel comfortable with that. The rear install is "plug-and-play" easy.
4. Sorry, but I don't ever get snow. Lots of rain, though, and the AST/DSC are very comforting.
While most of you are looking for the right snow tire, I'm going to be looking for a better rain tire than the Michelins!
> He couldn't accommodate her with an evening appointment. Since she had
> to go to work the next day, she told him: "I'll leave the key under the
> mat. "Fix the dishwasher, leave the bill on the counter, and I'll mail
> you the check. By the way, don't worry about my Doberman. He won't bother
> you. But, whatever you do, ...do NOT under any circumstances talk to my
> parrot!"
>
> When the repairman arrived at Mrs.Davidson's apartment the next day, he
> discovered the biggest and meanest looking doberman he had ever seen.
> But, just as she had said, the dog just lay there on the carpet, watching
> the
> repairman go about his business. However, the whole time he was there,
> the parrot drove him nuts with his incessant yelling, cursing, and
> name-calling.
>
> Finally the repairman couldn't contain himself any longer and yelled:
> "Shut up, you stupid ugly bird!"
>
> To which the parrot replied: "Get him, Spike!"
>
<<< It does make sense, however, that as the engine breaks in, response may improve, as parts wear together, improve seals and tolerances, etc. This may be a likelier explanation.>>> Sums it all up but still wondering about your first statement above.
Apparently there are no experts out there, unless Mr. Dinan himself is monitoring...this one may go down as an Unsolved Mystery.
Most of the differences with the stock program are in the "open loop mode" area, which you're only in when you're heavy on the throttle. On the street, you're usually in closed loop mode, meaning the ECU is "tuning" the engine in response to what the O2 sensor in the exhaust pipe is saying. There is some tuning done in this area, but not as much.
I don't know as much about Dinan, but I know for the Jim Conforti software the big compromise you make is you can't run anything other than premium, unless of course you like the sound of pre-ignition.