Yes, that was me, AH. I don't have a WRX so the same rules may not apply. I have sold the wheels I'd bought, kept the tires and am working with Prodrive to source a set of wheels from them.
Prodrive has fit 225/50-17 tires to UK-spec Forester S turbos, using wheels with +48mm offset, as part of the Prodrive WR Sport package sold and warranted through UK Subaru dealerships. There is no difference in the suspension geometry of US-spec and UK-spec Foresters, so that package should work here as well, in a form that will not cause harm to the vehicle. Assuming I get the wheels, what I'll have will be the same as what a Forester WR Sport has - less the turbo and exhaust, of course.
Read page 12-5 of that cute little book called the owner's manual - should be available in your dashboard. While you are at it, check out page 11-38 of the same little book.
Also, open your driver's door and check out that little sticker on the door-jamb. That also contains the recommended tire sizes. Subaru did not affix that sticker there for fun.
Yes, of course it is Subaru recommended. You don't need to follow their recommendations, but that does not change the fact that it is a recommendation.
you spout out SOA's recommendations like it's the gospel. I bet you were just irritating in school! I prefer I bit more independent thinking. Besides, it makes life more interesting. Just an FYI, I've read manual completely. I never disagreed that SOA says what you are repeating.
Thanks for the link. I search I-Club but didn't find that thread. Incidentally, the blue WRX without the wing has the Thule Evolution 1600. The picture does not do its shiny silverness justice. Good to know you can make it work that way. Hopefully I can make it work well enough without.
what about my creaky rattle? (gotwrx Apr 6, 2002 11:06pm) Am I to resort to asking the dealer? Can no one check under their hood and see where the little grey rubber thing is on the hood support? Just to recap on mine it's about 9 inches down from the hook and doesn't seem to mate with anything.
This has to be more interesting than arguing about what "recommendations" mean.....Well may be not.
But I would like to know before I take the car in on Thursday for a quick warranty repair. Got water ballooned by some kids (I assume) first day out and it took off the plastic trim on the column between the doors on the passenger side. They are going to fix it. Hooray! Then I shall be perfect again....except for that pesky rattle.
Thanks in advance for running out to your car for me, tim
Then you shouldn't put synthetic oil in your car either,
Subaru does not state specifically to put in mineral oil or synthetic oil. They just state the oil viscosity and any oil which meets the viscosity requirements, be they synthetic or mineral or whatever, can be added into the car. UK rims are Subaru rims on the exact same car that is available in the US, which meets Subaru's (optional wheel) size recommendations, perfectly !!
Those UK rims aren't the same weight as the US spec rims, and subaru has not tested their cars with synthetic as per patti and therefore cannot reccomend it's use. But you get my point though right? Your statements of not modifying your car at all are a bit off base.
Tim: our friend Ken was able to trace a rattle my basically putting his finger on parts until the rattle stopped. That way he isolated the source, and was able to fix it.
Dealers also have a tool Patti calls "ears" to listen to and trace annoying sounds, FWIW.
I actually checked the diameter and revs/mi for our original tires (the re92 205-55-16) and here are stats comparing the factory size to other sizes and brands: The stats are all in the following order: recommended rim size/test rim size/diameter/revs
If I remember correctly, not only is it important to match the overall diameter and revs/mi of the new tire/rim to the factory rim, you have to check and make sure that you check the specs of the tire because as I found out, there are some variations in the between different tires which were all supposed to be the same diameter. From the chart above, 225-45-17 generally seems to be a size that's closer to our factory rim/tire combo. But keep in mind that I didn't include some of the most expensive tires in either size (these tires are around $100/ea). I won't be able to afford the more expensive Michelins/Dunlops etc... Any comments?
I have nothing against "mods", especially if they are not too visible/noticeable. I am all for it. In fact, I believe the best mod that one can do to the WRX is to put on better tires and the Quaife ATB Differentials in the front/rear. Would improve the handling to a totally different level.
But when we put on non-recommended tire/wheel sizes, it is akin to putting in 15W50 oil (non-recommended viscosity), in place of the recommended 5W30 or 10W30 viscosity. Nobody will prevent you from doing it, but the engine will not perform optimally with the non-recommended viscosity, regardless of whether it is synthetic or dino-oil. When you put in 5W30 synthetic, it is well within the recommended viscosity parameters. But I do understand what you are trying to say.
Narenji:
Another option in a non-recommended size, that maintains the stock diameter pretty closely is the Sumitomo HTR+ in 215/50R17.
Yes it is AA traction and A for temperature. I just combined them into one.
kens:
I would think going to premium tires on the stock 16" rims, would get you better results than so-so 17" rims/tires. Good 17" rims/tires would get some incremental benefits over the 16"s with premium tires, due to the reduction in sidewall flex. However, there are brake upgrades like the 4-piston Subaru brakes, that would not fit under the 16" stock wheels and would either need wider 16" wheels or the 17s.
If you're strictly on a budget, get really good 16 inch tires rather than 17 inch tires with no-name or second tier brand tires. Getting cheap wheels usually means more weight which is a no-no.
Juice, thanks for the tips. Won't really help with this one since it only occurs in low gears when moving usually right after changing gears. Hard to "put your finger on the parts" when you are driving along.
Did a search of I-Club for rattle related problems and found the following. I think they were all WRX problems but I couldn't swear to it at this point.
1. Heat shields around the turbo 2. Hood hinge 3. Struts - requiring replacement to fix 4. gearbox - requireing replacement to fix 5. Dashboard rattle - loose green "diagnostic" connectors. 6. Mysterious rattle that finally got fixed after installing a Cobb turbo and "tightening everything down"
Some of these are quite alarming though I'm sure are relatively rare. Problem with creaks and rattles is that they tend not to show up when the dealer is around. I already experienced a dash board rattle that was quite loud for a day and is now gone (might be no. 5, haven't had a chance to check). That was bothersome but the creaky thing is a bit more worrying since I think its coming from the engine compartment.
I am considering buying the WRX wagon. I have test driven the 5 speed and love it. However do to my wife's inability/unwillingness to drive a stick, I have to get the automatic (which I have yet to test drive). I've heard numerous complaints about the auto being slow off the line. I'm wondering if I'm wasting my money getting an auto WRX and maybe should just get the Outback Sport version and save some money. Any thoughts?
The Sumitomos are far better than the Kumho 712s. A friend with a WRX wagon has em and loves em the HTZR II+ or something like that. I'm not a big fan of the Kumho 712s at all. I'm likely going to get the Sumitomos for my WRX rims that are running on my XT6 currently.
I prefer the title to be "How good is the automatic transmission" as opposed to "How bad is the automatic transmission"?
Anyway, people who own the WRX in Automatic seem to be thoroughly happy with their choice. If my Automatic-WRX gets stolen today, I would go right back and buy another one. I would not even consider another car. Did you hear the "complaints" from Auto-WRX owners or did you hear it from non-owners ? Both the manual-WRX and the Auto-WRX are a bit sluggish off-the-line, primarily because the turbo does not come alive until about 3000rpm. After that, both of them are total beasts. Also, brand-new Auto-WRXs (available at the dealership) are slower due to the Adaptive Automatic transmission that the Auto-WRX employs. The "adaptive" nature of the "smart transmission" will allow things to be totally different after having been driven a few hundred miles, since it adapts the shifing patterns to your driving style. My Auto-WRX drives entirely differently from a new Auto-WRX available to be test-driven at a dealership and is comparable to my other car, the Acura 3.2TL with its turbine smooth and powerful engine, and is faster than the Acura, once the turbo kicks in. Incidentally, the Acura is no slouch in the speed department.
Read through this thread and (around 600 posts back) and the other WRX thread in the "Sedans" forum (around 1500-2000 posts back from the current post) and you will have your answers.
Read the following carefully, since very few people and even fewer dealers are aware of the things mentioned below.
The Outback Sport has a totally different and cheaper AWD system when compared to the Auto-WRX and lacks a Limited Slip Differential in the rear, thus it cannot transfer power side-to-side, like the Auto-WRX. If both the wheels on the left or both the wheels on the right are on a surface that does not have traction, then the Outback Sport will not move at all (since it cannot transfer power side-to-side).
Also, in normal driving, the Outback Sport drives like a Front-wheel-drive car with 90% of the power on the front wheels, unlike the Auto-WRX which drives with a rear-wheel-drive biased power split (enabled by the Torque-sensing Planetary gear center differential that the Outback Sport does not have). The power transfer (front/rear) is accomplished in the Outback Sport by using a 4-plate clutch pack, while that in the WRX is accomplished by a 6-plate heavy duty electro-mechanical clutch pack, working hand-in-hand with the Torque-sensing center planetary gear differential.
Completely different animals !!!
The OBS sport is priced okay for what it provides, but the Auto-WRX is priced much lower than its true worth, since its exclusive VTD-AWD system, is only available in the US, on one other Subaru car - the VDC-Outback which costs $30000+. It is also available in a much heavier duty form, in the World rally conquering Subaru race-cars. No other US-Subaru other than the Auto-WRX and the VDC is equipped with it. The manual-WRX is not equipped with it.
Also the Outback Sport lacks Disk-brakes in the rear. But depending on your needs, maybe the Outback Sport is the car for you, especially if you are a driver who does not indulge much in sporty/aggressive driving and thus need the additional and reserve capabilities of the Auto-WRX !!
The secret is to drive both cars, and if the automatic feels peppy enough (it didn't to me, and I MUCH prefer controlling my own gear selection) and you don't want to row your own gears, then go with it.
Convince your wife to let you get the stick. How often will she drive it? Can she learn to drive it in emergencies?
My wife doesn't drive stick, but we don't really share cars. Her car is hers, and mine is mine. I keep offering to give her lessons so she can appreciate what a great car it is, but she's not interested. Oh well, more stick time for me.
Sorry, was still half asleep when I skimmed it. Reading it again, I agree with your assessment.
AH, still haven't gotten your new wheels yet? Do it soon, it makes such a big difference. If you get halfway better tires than the RE92's, you'll swear it's a difference car.
As far as wife factor is concerned, some wives won't ever want to drive a manual. I had to get a Tiptronic Audi for her so I could get my own manual.
It's not "that" bad. The best thing to do is test drive both cars and not let the different AWD systems influence your decision.
Yes, the WRX's is more advanced, but you're likely not going to notice that much of a difference in normal driving. Only if you're pushing the car really hard in slippery conditions. The regular auto (OBS, 2.5RS) AWD is 90% Front wheel drive in normal cruising. But you can count on that it changes when you accelerate, in turns, braking, slippery conditions, etc.
With any luck, the '03 WRX's out in a few months will get the sport-shift auto. Yes, I know it's not the same, but it's a little better than a regular auto. :-)
I know what you mean about the RE92s. Everyone who has changed them to better wheels/tires have admitted that it made a world of difference in handling. I just want them to wear out a bit before changing them. Already I have 2 sets of tires lying in my garage, after I switched the tires of my other car with better ones and then changed them again for even better ones. This time around, I want to really use the tires before tossing them out.
I would love to get the 5-speed Automatic with the shiftronic controls. I use the 5-speed sport-shift (Acura-speak for shiftronic) on my Acura quite a lot and find it pretty nice, especially since Acura says that it shifts 10% faster than the regular Automatic. It also displays the gear you are in, currently, on a display.
But after driving a while (few hundred miles) exclusively with sportshift (which enables you to hold the gear the way you want to), when we shift into full-auto-mode, I found that the full-auto mode had changed its shifting pattern to mimic the sportshift mode pattern of shifting. "Adaptiveness" of the tranny at work !! The same is applicable to the Auto-WRX after I drove it a while. It now intuitively recognises the gear I want to be in, and holds the gear a lot longer than when the car was new. Now, if someone like Paisan were to drive it, the car probably would hold the shiftpoint to redline in every gear. :-)
MMM redline. My AT XT6 got like that took a little finness but I could pretty much take it to redline all the way up w/o a problem w/o manually shifting it. I do enjoy driving the 5MT XT6 as well. I'm still on the fence about this AT-MT thing. For a race car the 5MT is great, but for a car that isn't going to be exclusively or nearly exclusively a track car I'd stick with the AT.
The auto is slower than the manual. I wanted the most bang for my buck, the most efficient tranny w/a turbo and so I got the manual...plain and simple!
As all of said, drive both manual and automatic to decide which fits your driving style and driving environment. Do the same between the OBS w/auto. Remember, regardless of transmission choice the WRX is all about the drive! :-)
The other problem with rattles is it's a bit subjective. Some folks are more tolerant of rattles than others. Also, dealers usually are only willing to chase rattles for the first 12 months so don't hesitate to have them check it out.
I'm curious about "adaptive" ATs. While I don't doubt the system tries to learn your driving habits, I wonder how much of it is the driver adjusting to the ATs shifting habits. I guess if in the end it works, then it works!
A number of factors led me to buy my first AT after driving MT exclusively for more than 35 years. These included: better for creeping around on really bad logging roads, most of the rest of my driving is stop-and-go urban, and my knees have been too long abused. The oddest of reasons, however, is that a few months before purchasing Rufus, I ruptured my Achilles tendon. I live alone. You don't know joy until you've driven a MT car in urban traffic with a ruptured tendon. ;~)
I totally understand the concept of getting better 16 in tires than going for a cheap 17in wheel/tire combo, but I'm looking at either Rota Tarmacs or Rota Subzeros... Subzero only weighs around 17lbs, and Tarmacs are 19lbs. I feel that's pretty lightweight, and since a racing team uses Subzeros, I feel moderately confident getting them. And AFAIK, no one has reported problems about either wheel.
Regarding the tires, Sumitomo was another choice I was looking at, and I'm glad that they seem to be better choices than Kumhos while coming in at a reasonable price point. Any additional input will be appreciated- I really want either Rota with a reasonable, well performing tire, and I need all the help I can get in making a decision...
You gotta remember, when driving on pot-hole laden US roads, more side wall isn't necessarily a bad thing. It all depends on the roads you use most often.
I'm curious about "adaptive" ATs. While I don't doubt the system tries to learn your driving habits, I wonder how much of it is the driver adjusting to the ATs shifting habits. I guess if in the end it works, then it works!
If you reset the ECU, all that "learning" is lost and needs to start from scratch. No, it definitely is not the driver adjusting to the ATs shifting habits. After I had driven my Auto-WRX for a while, when I test-drove a couple of them at our local dealer, they felt noticeably sluggish, after which when I got back into mine, it felt like a coiled spring, primed and ready for action.
This is the reason why, when some Auto-magazine tests a car like the Auto-WRX and says that it up-shifts too quickly (or something like that), I wonder how much these "experts" know about advances in modern automotive technology.
As much as I hate to, I'm going to have to agree with AH on this one. :-p
My dealer on uses AT's for test drives. I've *only* been on about 5 test drives and definitely noticed differences in the shifting between the cars. On one test drive, with a car load of four (and a few hundred miles on the odo), I felt that the car shifted better than a previous test drive when I was by myself (a couple of miles on the odo). Then again, maybe my feet were just confused with only two pedals. :-)
You're right about the potholes, but here in So. Cali, most roads aren't too bad, compared to roads in Boston and Pittsburgh (places I've driven significantly), so I'm hoping my desire to get 17" wheels/tires isn't totally misguided... But if I were to get a 17in wheel, Subzeros are at the top of my short list.
I've got 17"wheels/tires and live in Seattle. Our city streets are pretty bad and we have hills just like San Fran, even cobblestone. I don't have problems. It also depends on type of 17"wheel you get and even more importantly, type of 17"tire. Personally, I wouldn't scrimp on tires, especially 17"ones. I think both Warpdrive and myself are running Toyo T1-S and would recommend heartedly. They are not cheap but not the most expensive either. I believe I paid $161 a piece.
I LOVE having a manual tranny BUT... I live in suburbia (Long Island) and did NOT want to deal with a clutch. I tend to keep the car in 3rd unless I am cruising on the highway. By doing this, I am always close or near to 3000 rpm around town so I ALWAYS feel I have ample power. Like AH said, if something happened to my car, I'd go right out and buy another Auto WRX. Umm wait... I'd wait for '03 and HOPE for a 5EAT with tiptronic! BTW.... did I ever mention I like this car better than my leased C320??
So I just picked up my black wrx wagon 5 speed yesterday ($22,500, hope I did good). So far so good. Lots of question. This seems the place to go. Admittedly, I haven't gotten all the way through the owners book yet, so some of this might be redundant... Hope you guys can help:
In no particular order... 1) I don't wanna pay $400 for the boost gague thing, is this a part I can order and just swap in for the clock (I'm good at bolt on stuff, not good at custom or engine work) or are there a billion little sensors I have to add? Car has 100 miles on it, I'm not going to void the warantee today. :-) 2) Never owned a turbo before. I'm pretty sure the big silver radiator thing under the hood scoop is the intercooler. My momma always told me not to pour cold water on an overheating engine. So I'm curious what happens to all the rain water that looks like it would just pour on the exhaust manifold (left side of scoop facing car) or what's underneath the cooler itself. 3) Friend of mine asked me this: Where are the spark plugs? Is this one of those drop the engine things or do I just have to take the wheels off? 4) The coolant is murky green. The coolant in my VW GTI is red. I never got that, whenever I have to, can I just use a prestone mix? 5) What's the break-in period for the engine? I've kept it under 3000 rpm so far, and I don't push it hard I just drive slow and piss off everybody behind me. Of course I haven't felt the turbo yet, but I'm willing to wait to not wear the engine unneccesarily.
I'm sure there's more but that's my top 5 for the moment. Thanks for any wisdom you can bless me with.
Comments
- Phil
Prodrive has fit 225/50-17 tires to UK-spec Forester S turbos, using wheels with +48mm offset, as part of the Prodrive WR Sport package sold and warranted through UK Subaru dealerships. There is no difference in the suspension geometry of US-spec and UK-spec Foresters, so that package should work here as well, in a form that will not cause harm to the vehicle. Assuming I get the wheels, what I'll have will be the same as what a Forester WR Sport has - less the turbo and exhaust, of course.
Ed
Stephen
Also, open your driver's door and check out that little sticker on the door-jamb. That also contains the recommended tire sizes. Subaru did not affix that sticker there for fun.
Yes, of course it is Subaru recommended. You don't need to follow their recommendations, but that does not change the fact that it is a recommendation.
Later...AH
I prefer I bit more independent thinking. Besides, it makes life more interesting. Just an FYI, I've read manual completely. I never disagreed that SOA says what you are repeating.
Stephen
-mike
Incidentally, the blue WRX without the wing has the Thule Evolution 1600. The picture does not do its shiny silverness justice. Good to know you can make it work that way. Hopefully I can make it work well enough without.
Tim
This has to be more interesting than arguing about what "recommendations" mean.....Well may be not.
But I would like to know before I take the car in on Thursday for a quick warranty repair. Got water ballooned by some kids (I assume) first day out and it took off the plastic trim on the column between the doors on the passenger side. They are going to fix it. Hooray! Then I shall be perfect again....except for that pesky rattle.
Thanks in advance for running out to your car for me,
tim
Stephen
Subaru does not state specifically to put in mineral oil or synthetic oil. They just state the oil viscosity and any oil which meets the viscosity requirements, be they synthetic or mineral or whatever, can be added into the car. UK rims are Subaru rims on the exact same car that is available in the US, which meets Subaru's (optional wheel) size recommendations, perfectly !!
Later...AH
-mike
Dealers also have a tool Patti calls "ears" to listen to and trace annoying sounds, FWIW.
-juice
The stats are all in the following order: recommended rim size/test rim size/diameter/revs
RE92 205-55-16: 5.5-7.5/6.5/25.1/830
Kumho 712 215-45-17: 7-8"/7"/24.6/838
Sumitomo HTR Z 215-45-17: 7-8.5/7/24.6/848
Sumitomo HTR ZII 215-45-17: 7-8/7/24.5/845
Yoko AVS 215-45-17: 7-8/7/24.6/841
Goodyear GSD 215-45-17: 7-8/7/24.6/848
Kumho 712 225-45-17: 7-8.5/7.5/24.9/829
Sumitomo HTR Z 225-45-17: 7.5-9/7.5/24.9/837
Sumitomo HTR ZII 225-45-17: 7-8.5/25/823
If I remember correctly, not only is it important to match the overall diameter and revs/mi of the new tire/rim to the factory rim, you have to check and make sure that you check the specs of the tire because as I found out, there are some variations in the between different tires which were all supposed to be the same diameter. From the chart above, 225-45-17 generally seems to be a size that's closer to our factory rim/tire combo. But keep in mind that I didn't include some of the most expensive tires in either size (these tires are around $100/ea). I won't be able to afford the more expensive Michelins/Dunlops etc... Any comments?
-juice
But when we put on non-recommended tire/wheel sizes, it is akin to putting in 15W50 oil (non-recommended viscosity), in place of the recommended 5W30 or 10W30 viscosity. Nobody will prevent you from doing it, but the engine will not perform optimally with the non-recommended viscosity, regardless of whether it is synthetic or dino-oil. When you put in 5W30 synthetic, it is well within the recommended viscosity parameters. But I do understand what you are trying to say.
Narenji:
Another option in a non-recommended size, that maintains the stock diameter pretty closely is the Sumitomo HTR+ in 215/50R17.
Sumitomo HTR+: 6-7.5"/7"/25.4"/829revs/mile
Stock WRX tires: 5.5-7.5/6.5"/25.1/830revs/mile
The Sumitomo HTR+ is a W-rated (168+ mph) Ultra-high performance All-season tire, who has temp/traction at AAA and treadwear at 360. Cost:$89.
Later...AH
-juice
Which gives you the better performance bang for the buck?
1) Getting so-so 17" rims and tires
-or-
2) Getting premium tires for the stock 16" rims
Ken
Yes it is AA traction and A for temperature. I just combined them into one.
kens:
I would think going to premium tires on the stock 16" rims, would get you better results than so-so 17" rims/tires. Good 17" rims/tires would get some incremental benefits over the 16"s with premium tires, due to the reduction in sidewall flex. However, there are brake upgrades like the 4-piston Subaru brakes, that would not fit under the 16" stock wheels and would either need wider 16" wheels or the 17s.
Later...AH
Did a search of I-Club for rattle related problems and found the following. I think they were all WRX problems but I couldn't swear to it at this point.
1. Heat shields around the turbo
2. Hood hinge
3. Struts - requiring replacement to fix
4. gearbox - requireing replacement to fix
5. Dashboard rattle - loose green "diagnostic" connectors.
6. Mysterious rattle that finally got fixed after installing a Cobb turbo and "tightening everything down"
Some of these are quite alarming though I'm sure are relatively rare. Problem with creaks and rattles is that they tend not to show up when the dealer is around. I already experienced a dash board rattle that was quite loud for a day and is now gone (might be no. 5, haven't had a chance to check). That was bothersome but the creaky thing is a bit more worrying since I think its coming from the engine compartment.
-mike
-mike
Anyway, people who own the WRX in Automatic seem to be thoroughly happy with their choice. If my Automatic-WRX gets stolen today, I would go right back and buy another one. I would not even consider another car. Did you hear the "complaints" from Auto-WRX owners or did you hear it from non-owners ? Both the manual-WRX and the Auto-WRX are a bit sluggish off-the-line, primarily because the turbo does not come alive until about 3000rpm. After that, both of them are total beasts. Also, brand-new Auto-WRXs (available at the dealership) are slower due to the Adaptive Automatic transmission that the Auto-WRX employs. The "adaptive" nature of the "smart transmission" will allow things to be totally different after having been driven a few hundred miles, since it adapts the shifing patterns to your driving style. My Auto-WRX drives entirely differently from a new Auto-WRX available to be test-driven at a dealership and is comparable to my other car, the Acura 3.2TL with its turbine smooth and powerful engine, and is faster than the Acura, once the turbo kicks in. Incidentally, the Acura is no slouch in the speed department.
Read through this thread and (around 600 posts back) and the other WRX thread in the "Sedans" forum (around 1500-2000 posts back from the current post) and you will have your answers.
Read the following carefully, since very few people and even fewer dealers are aware of the things mentioned below.
The Outback Sport has a totally different and cheaper AWD system when compared to the Auto-WRX and lacks a Limited Slip Differential in the rear, thus it cannot transfer power side-to-side, like the Auto-WRX. If both the wheels on the left or both the wheels on the right are on a surface that does not have traction, then the Outback Sport will not move at all (since it cannot transfer power side-to-side).
Also, in normal driving, the Outback Sport drives like a Front-wheel-drive car with 90% of the power on the front wheels, unlike the Auto-WRX which drives with a rear-wheel-drive biased power split (enabled by the Torque-sensing Planetary gear center differential that the Outback Sport does not have). The power transfer (front/rear) is accomplished in the Outback Sport by using a 4-plate clutch pack, while that in the WRX is accomplished by a 6-plate heavy duty electro-mechanical clutch pack, working hand-in-hand with the Torque-sensing center planetary gear differential.
Completely different animals !!!
The OBS sport is priced okay for what it provides, but the Auto-WRX is priced much lower than its true worth, since its exclusive VTD-AWD system, is only available in the US, on one other Subaru car - the VDC-Outback which costs $30000+. It is also available in a much heavier duty form, in the World rally conquering Subaru race-cars. No other US-Subaru other than the Auto-WRX and the VDC is equipped with it. The manual-WRX is not equipped with it.
Also the Outback Sport lacks Disk-brakes in the rear. But depending on your needs, maybe the Outback Sport is the car for you, especially if you are a driver who does not indulge much in sporty/aggressive driving and thus need the additional and reserve capabilities of the Auto-WRX !!
Later...AH
Later...AH
My wife doesn't drive stick, but we don't really share cars. Her car is hers, and mine is mine. I keep offering to give her lessons so she can appreciate what a great car it is, but she's not interested. Oh well, more stick time for me.
AH, still haven't gotten your new wheels yet? Do it soon, it makes such a big difference. If you get halfway better tires than the RE92's, you'll swear it's a difference car.
As far as wife factor is concerned, some wives won't ever want to drive a manual. I had to get a Tiptronic Audi for her so I could get my own manual.
Yes, the WRX's is more advanced, but you're likely not going to notice that much of a difference in normal driving. Only if you're pushing the car really hard in slippery conditions. The regular auto (OBS, 2.5RS) AWD is 90% Front wheel drive in normal cruising. But you can count on that it changes when you accelerate, in turns, braking, slippery conditions, etc.
With any luck, the '03 WRX's out in a few months will get the sport-shift auto.
Yes, I know it's not the same, but it's a little better than a regular auto. :-)
-Dennis
Later...AH
* automatic more robust than Subaru's clutches
* VTD AWD is more sophisticated than the VC
* usually it helps resale
* easier off road or towing
Having said that, I'd like to see two major upgrades:
* 5 ratios on the automatic
* shiftronic controls, which the 2003 Legacy GT gets
-juice
But after driving a while (few hundred miles) exclusively with sportshift (which enables you to hold the gear the way you want to), when we shift into full-auto-mode, I found that the full-auto mode had changed its shifting pattern to mimic the sportshift mode pattern of shifting. "Adaptiveness" of the tranny at work !! The same is applicable to the Auto-WRX after I drove it a while. It now intuitively recognises the gear I want to be in, and holds the gear a lot longer than when the car was new. Now, if someone like Paisan were to drive it, the car probably would hold the shiftpoint to redline in every gear. :-)
Later...AH
-juice
-mike
As all of said, drive both manual and automatic to decide which fits your driving style and driving environment. Do the same between the OBS w/auto. Remember, regardless of transmission choice the WRX is all about the drive! :-)
Stephen
I'm curious about "adaptive" ATs. While I don't doubt the system tries to learn your driving habits, I wonder how much of it is the driver adjusting to the ATs shifting habits. I guess if in the end it works, then it works!
Ken
;~)
Ross
Regarding the tires, Sumitomo was another choice I was looking at, and I'm glad that they seem to be better choices than Kumhos while coming in at a reasonable price point. Any additional input will be appreciated- I really want either Rota with a reasonable, well performing tire, and I need all the help I can get in making a decision...
Stephen
-juice
Just in case you were losing sleep over that one!
Tim
-juice
If you reset the ECU, all that "learning" is lost and needs to start from scratch. No, it definitely is not the driver adjusting to the ATs shifting habits. After I had driven my Auto-WRX for a while, when I test-drove a couple of them at our local dealer, they felt noticeably sluggish, after which when I got back into mine, it felt like a coiled spring, primed and ready for action.
This is the reason why, when some Auto-magazine tests a car like the Auto-WRX and says that it up-shifts too quickly (or something like that), I wonder how much these "experts" know about advances in modern automotive technology.
Later...AH
My dealer on uses AT's for test drives. I've *only* been on about 5 test drives and definitely noticed differences in the shifting between the cars. On one test drive, with a car load of four (and a few hundred miles on the odo), I felt that the car shifted better than a previous test drive when I was by myself (a couple of miles on the odo).
Then again, maybe my feet were just confused with only two pedals. :-)
-Dennis
Stephen
In no particular order...
1) I don't wanna pay $400 for the boost gague thing, is this a part I can order and just swap in for the clock (I'm good at bolt on stuff, not good at custom or engine work) or are there a billion little sensors I have to add? Car has 100 miles on it, I'm not going to void the warantee today. :-)
2) Never owned a turbo before. I'm pretty sure the big silver radiator thing under the hood scoop is the intercooler. My momma always told me not to pour cold water on an overheating engine. So I'm curious what happens to all the rain water that looks like it would just pour on the exhaust manifold (left side of scoop facing car) or what's underneath the cooler itself.
3) Friend of mine asked me this: Where are the spark plugs? Is this one of those drop the engine things or do I just have to take the wheels off?
4) The coolant is murky green. The coolant in my VW GTI is red. I never got that, whenever I have to, can I just use a prestone mix?
5) What's the break-in period for the engine? I've kept it under 3000 rpm so far, and I don't push it hard I just drive slow and piss off everybody behind me. Of course I haven't felt the turbo yet, but I'm willing to wait to not wear the engine unneccesarily.
I'm sure there's more but that's my top 5 for the moment. Thanks for any wisdom you can bless me with.