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flushing, engine oil

armtdmarmtdm Member Posts: 2,057
edited April 2014 in Toyota
flushing, engine oil
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  • mrdetailermrdetailer Member Posts: 1,118
    When I changed my oil (115,000 miles on the car) I wondered about residue on the bottom of the oil pan. Yes, I've seen the new Synthetic Penzoil Adds where the Pan is much cleaner. My Mechanic said that if I changed the oil regularly it should not be an issue. But my local Jiffy Lube says their treatment gets rid of a lot of sediment. I use conventional oil on this vehicle.

    Should I do it next time?
  • adc100adc100 Member Posts: 1,521
    Residue which has collected on the bottom of the pan is likely to do no harm and a flush could break it loose to depos it elsewhere in the engine. If you have been changing oil frequently I think it may be un-necessary. You might do better to use a couple of quarts of syn on your oil changes to gradually get rid of the deposits.
  • brorjacebrorjace Member Posts: 588
    Worse than an unnecessary waste of money, those things can be dangerous to the health of your motor.

    On other boards, I have heard numerous accounts of engine flushes making old engines worse or killing/seizing them completely. People take an older engine that has a slight leak or oil consumption problem and ruin it with these damaging solvents.

    Mostly, I'm talking of the kerosene-type engine flushes. This stuff ruins an oil's ability to lubricate and the engine damages itself when you are running it, distributing it throughout the motor.

    Basically, on old, tired motors, leave sleeping sludge lie. If you feel like you MUST remove it, try frequent oil & filter changes using a motor oil that has a reputation for high detergency or possibly a mild detergent additive like CD-2.

    --- Bror Jace
  • spokanespokane Member Posts: 514
    I agree with with the above. Anything in the crankcase other than motor oil is dangerous to the engine bearings ... even if used for only a few minutes. As brorjace said, frequent oil and filter changes are the best course of action.
  • tboner1965tboner1965 Member Posts: 647
    ...that you stop by the truck stop and get a straight 30 weight or 10W-40 the truckers use and do a couple of oil changes with that.

    I suppose that oil has even more detergents, etc.

    Dunno the details about those oils, but if it meets the performance specs...

    Any danger in such a technique?

    TB
  • adc100adc100 Member Posts: 1,521
    probably killed some engines and saved some. I don't believe using oils not recommended for engine service is the answer. Especially since there is probably no relationship to the detergents in that oil. The straight 30 weight could cause damage in colder weather due to high viscosity on startup. Frequent oil change is the answer.
  • mrdetailermrdetailer Member Posts: 1,118
    Boy the response is pretty universal, and I don't think I'll be trying the flushes. However this car has been using conventional oil which definitely leaves a residue. Would taking off the oil pan, cleaning and putting on a new seal be a better alternative?
  • tboner1965tboner1965 Member Posts: 647
    Hmmm,


    If an oil meets the API spec, does you advice still apply.


    Somehow this link came to me, and it is an oil marketed towards the trucking industry, but meets standards for both gasoline and diesel engines.


    http://www.chevron.com/prodserv/nafl/L1_J.htm#3


    Meets SH API spec, amongst others.


    Wouldn't you be ok if the oil you chose meets the API spec your owners manual specifies?


    Cheers,


    TB

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Nix on flushes, I agree! Sediment is sediment...either the oil filter is picking it up or it's so caked in there that it does no harm. If you want to "flush" your engine, drop your normal oil, then get some cheap but decent oil and run it at fast idle for a few minutes and then flush it out. Then put in the new filter and new "good" oil. This is about the safest thing you can do.

    The junk in your engine maybe doing you more good than you think.
  • spokanespokane Member Posts: 514
    Mrdetailer, it certainly can't hurt to remove and clean the oil pan but it's not likely to be worth the trouble since the residue, if undisturbed, will probably stay in place. While some engines do have noticeable residue but I recently saw an exception when inspecting the oil pan from a 3.8L GM engine which had accumulated 123,000 miles on conventional Pennzoil 10W-30. This pan was spotless; it could have been used in one of the Pennzoil ads. I should point out that the oil change intervals had been 2000 to 3000 miles.
  • adc100adc100 Member Posts: 1,521
    The problem is that it (10W-40) doesn't meet energy conserving specs and will not be recommended by manufactures. Besides there's no need to utilize a syn in 40 wt. A syn 30 wt will give the protection of a 40 wt conventional oil in most cases. Will it work?-sure. Straight 30 wt? No one would recommend that one.
  • armtdmarmtdm Member Posts: 2,057
    Will certainly clean out the sludge and gunk and be a safe way to do it. Assuming that the pan is easy to get too etc. Another alternative is what I tired, I recently picked up a SUV with 57,000 and the valve cover etc. has the dark oily (not sludge) residue of a petroleum based oil. I converted to synthetic and decided to change it at 3000 fearing that it would remove a lot of gunk etc. Well, the oil analysis was great at 3000 and the valve cover does not look much different so either the engine is cleaner then I thought, or the synthetic is slower working then I thought or it is not going to remove the yellow coloring. Anyway, I am now going to go 7,500 for the next change and then to my once a year schedule.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I think dropping the pan is overkill in these matters, unless you are really experiencing a drop in oil pressure, etc, and want to examine the pump screen, etc. It would be a radical intervention for a serious problem, otherwise I'd forget about the residue at the bottom of your oil pan and just increase your changes/filter changes.
  • mrdetailermrdetailer Member Posts: 1,118
    The estimate to change the OIL PAN is $265.00. I just had an oil change (without doing a flush due to all of the comments) I looked in the owner's manual, and had Jiffy put in EXACTLY the 4.5 quarts recommended. It was perfectly on the full line. So I'll save the money since there isn't enough sludge, if any, to affect storage capacity. I always change at 3,000 miles using a syn blend.
  • armtdmarmtdm Member Posts: 2,057
    If you are going to use a synthetic blend then blend it yourself, at least you will know what you are getting. None of the blends on the market tell you what percentage synthetic is in the blend, could be 10% or 50%, but knowing oil companies and profits, and the sludge like Castrol misleading the public on Syntec, I would say probably 10%. So mix it yourself and or go to pure synthetic.
  • dpwestlakedpwestlake Member Posts: 207
    Why bother mixing? What is the advantage to a blend?
  • armtdmarmtdm Member Posts: 2,057
    Perhaps some synthetic is better then none. I was in a auto chain store yesterday and it really miffs me that Castrol can sell their hydrocracked petroleum as a synthetic and sell if for $4.20/quart. Really sad ccommentary on our marketing system and court system that permits this!
  • rcarbonircarboni Member Posts: 290
    I remember seeing a test that found synthetics based on hydrocarbons actually produced more deposits than petro-based oils, which left 10-25% deposits. They didn't mention brands, but I think we know who they were talking about.

    The polyol ester-based synths in this test left virtually no deposits.
  • mrdetailermrdetailer Member Posts: 1,118
    Quaker State according to the technical person I called has 20% synthetic for the 4 X4, and 25% for the high performance. I don't want to use a full synthetic in this car because I have some cam seals that leak. Synthetics, being uniform molecules leak quicker. I like blends because they are sturdier and only cost about a dollar a bottle more than pure DINO

    But sure, you can make your own blend.

    See Engine Oil, a slipery subject earlier entries, and also synthetic oil.

    The 4X4 blend has worked well for a number of years in this car, so I'll stick with that.
  • brorjacebrorjace Member Posts: 588
    Dropping the pan merely to clean it is one of those projects you might feel compelled to do ... but you can't justify it on a cost/benefit basis. Do this only if you want to kill some time and indulge your obsessive-compulsive side. >;^)

    Yes T-[non-permissible content removed], the 'heavy duty' truck oils DO have more detergents in them than most ... according to an article by Patrick Bedard in Car & Driver over a year ago.

    So, you might want to go down to Walmart and get some Shell Rotella or Chevron Delo400 15W40 and use THAT to clean the inside of your engine. Leave it in for 2-3,000 miles and then switch back to something lighter/thinner for regular use.

    --- Bror Jace
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Isn't exactly a job for a do it yourselfer either!
This discussion has been closed.

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