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Comments
2 115 power outlets - Sienna has this
plus power converter - what does this mean exactly? :confuse:
blue tooth U connect - Sienna just got this, too
third row vents in ceiling to control air flow - don't all vans have this?
second row heated seats - I'm not sure about this one, this may indeed be unique
halo lighting - I listed that (LED lighting)
Able to view movies up to front dash screen when van is stopped - Most NAV equipped cars can do this, though I'm not sure because I didn't get that option
Offers two different rides. Softer on Chrysler, stiffer on Dodge. - not sure if that's really a feature, but it's useful to know, I suppose.
Voice recognition on the NAV - pretty sure Honda has it
3rd row split bench seat that can tailgate - Sienna can, Ody cannot
It's important to note that while you can put the Ody's 3rd row in that tailgating position, it will not hold, i.e. the seat will collapse in on itself. This is dangerous so please do not try this by seating your kids there, it's not meant to handle the weight! :surprise:
Honda has the largest screen for the NAVI - aren't they all about 7" nowadays? Some may be 6.5", I'm not sure.
Ody does have 8 seat belts, even if the 8th seat isn't comfy for a long trip, it can handle an 8th passenger, at least. Should we give it half credit?
roll down the windows remotely using the key fob - not sure if the others have this. I do open the doors remotely to cool off the interior, so I can see the use for it.
I'm gonna cut you some slack here because you did say they will come down in price, future tense, but that's not the case as of yet:
Fitmall.com's no-haggle price on their most-loaded FWD Sienna XLE Limited: $36,178.
Same dealer, Town & Country Limited FWD, best equipped model on their lot: $38,580.
So for now, you can spend about $2400 more at the Chrysler store to get those extras.
Both are 2008 models, so they probably will come down a bit on the Siennas, actually. 2007 models started with no rebate, but that crept as high as $2000 at the very end of the model year.
Bottom line: will the Chrysler drop in price by $2400, potentially $4400? Possibly.
If I were shopping again now, I'd probably wait to see how prices shake out. I bet they will BOTH drop.
As an owner of a 7 passenger 2006 Sienna, I do NOT think the 2nd row seats of the Sienna are as comfortable as the 2nd row seats of the Odyssey. I would prefer to ride on the 8th seat (middle seat in 2nd row) of the Ody for any distance than to ride in any of the 3 seats of the 2nd row of an 8 passenger Sienna.
All you have to do is have the 2nd row outer seats of the Ody slid forward or back the same distance and fold the armrest up even with the seat back.
To be fair, the Sienna does have the MOST cargo space behind the 3rd row of any minivan. :shades:
I could not disagree more.
All 3 seats are very comfy, 7 of us just drove 3 hours to the beach and eveyrone wanted to sit in those seats to get front row seats to the movie, people were fighting to see who got to sit there!
I disagree 100%! They are first class seats! :shades:
I don't get your love/hate, seemingly bi-polar opinions of the Sienna, honestly. You mix in a small complement as if to make your criticism more plausible, why? :confuse:
The chrome surround for the gauges you mention all the time? Guess what? They're not even chrome. I looked closely. They are black, a bit glossy, but certainly not chrome. My Miata has chrome rings. Neither one bothers me!
You really gotta get over these little pet peeves you have. Your posts are otherwise informative and useful, but you get so hung up on these pet peeves! :P
Ody does have 8 seat belts, even if the 8th seat isn't comfy for a long trip, it can handle an 8th passenger, at least. Should we give it half credit?
roll down the windows remotely using the key fob - not sure if the others have this. I do open the doors remotely to cool off the interior, so I can see the use for it.
I think the Honda has an 8 inch screen.
Half credit for the half-size seat sounds fair,
and the bonus about opening the windows is that you can immediately lock the car back, setting the alarm should someone try to get in your car. With your doors open, anyone can climb on in and quietly take your things. Not a huge deal, but here in Alabama, where we just had a record-hot-August with 104 degrees being the norm, its worthwhile.
Well, no he doesn't! :P It's the little things that can cause people to love or hate their car. Sharing these feelings with other readers can help them discern what things that should look for in a test drive that might otherwise be missed. Chances are, if something bothers someone, they aren't the only one it will bother.
Waaahhhhhhh mommy, I need the 8" screen Waaahhhhhhh ~~~
Here's Edmunds' take on things.
Battle for the Best Minivan: Dodge vs. Honda
I won't spoil the ending for those who haven't read this yet. They do note that the Dodge is the new hot-rod of the minivan field, with Honda having superior dynamics.
I went aftermarket for the DVD player because we wanted a big screen - 12.1" means everyone can see it. :shades:
Here's a question - do any of these vans have a one-button, close all windows (including moonroof)? That would be useful. Close EVERYTHING. All windows, moonroof, and lock the doors. Put that on the wish list.
-juice
Insert your key in the door lock on the outside, turn it left, then turn it left again and hold. The roof stays open (if equipped, my aunt's is cloth-equipped - no roof to close), but the windows go up, the doors lock, and the alarm is armed, in the Odyssey (and my Accord as well). It's CLOSE.
Valid point, but the glare he complains about from chrome rings (which aren't even chrome in the first place) are on a van he doesn't have. He took one test drive (I suppose) and concludes that's a deal killer. How long did he spend in that van, honestly? A few minutes at most?
He even admitted that the issue with the 8 seater comfort was something personal, i.e. we are all shaped differently. Surely these seats are better than the miniature Stow-N-Go seats Dodge uses, for instance.
Then he complains about resale on an ALG rated 5 star minivan, and says he's going to buy a Dodge, rated 1 star for residuals, worst possible. That simply makes no sense! He paid too much for his new van, that's all. Shoppers come to this thread and should know they don't have to make the same mistake, yet you read his comments and assume resale is poor (5 stars is poor?).
The fact that there is one vocal unhappy Sienna owner makes him the exception that proves the rule. The Sienna threads are full of happy owners and his views are simply not representative of the typical Sienna owner.
Remember, 79% would buy another Sienna if they could do it over. 21% would not. He's in that minority, 21%. Nothing he says changes the fact that 79% are happy, the most among minivans.
Sienna owners are happiest overall, period.
Honda should program the roof to close, too.
We have an aftermarket ASC moonroof that closes when you remove the key, it's very cool. It's actually programmable, too, you can set it so that it stays open if you want it too.
I honestly didn't know, and I really didn't want to pour through 250 posts to see if it had. Edmunds has it on the front page of the "CAR REVIEWS" sections so it can't be THAT out of date.
Same here. Our kids are grown and gone and we are older. But I also bought my 2005 because of Stow-n-Go and we also keep the one passenger side, second row seat stowed for the same reason. I like putting stuff in the side door much better than the rear, except food. Our dog also likes laying there. When we do carry two, three, or four others, it is so easy to get to the back seat with the one seat stowed.
Your also right about the A/C. Here in Arizona, it can hit 105-115 for months and the A/C has no problem cooling the whole van. One thing I checked out real good before buying, as my Dodge Dakota did a lousy job of doing it, as it had no recirculating switch on it.
They would be great for each kid to have a place to store their toys, a stuffed animal, a spare sweater for when they get cold. You would use that all the time.
I would not want the miniature seats, but I believe Edmunds said you can get the Swivel-and-Go seats, which are nice captain's chairs, and still get the under floor storage.
Is that right?
I do wish my Sienna had more covered storage bins. You can actually get up to 2 consoles, front and middle rows, but the model I got only has the tray.
I can always buy them from Toyota and snap them in place, but we just slide a shoe box under the tray and put the toys in there.
Funny thing is vans are almost TOO big, so cargo has to be tied down else it slides around. Covered bins are nice for this reason.
I have a co-worker that has asked about my interest in an '05 Grand Caravan with virtually every option out there, including navigation, DVD, etc. It only has 34k miles and has a 100k mile extended warranty. He's asking $18k for it.
I'm torn-I know my wife would love the stow and go. I'd certainly love buying something that has more bells and whistles that I wouldn't get buying an Odyssey, but I'll also get a vehicle that only has 1/3 to 1/4 of the miles I'd have to get along with the warranty to boot. Buying an Odyssey of similar mileage/options would cost a LOT more.
What would you do?
Buy the Dodge...
Remember - early Odysseys had transmission issues, so you're not necessarily buying reliability in this case.
An 05 Dodge with 66k left on the warranty, 3 years newer with far fewer miles, plus more equipment.
Having said all that, shop around. I've seen 06 Dodge SXTs for as little as $15k.
The extra equipment and the warranty are probably worth the extra amount in this case.
And with an extended warranty, you can keep it for a long time, so the amount of $$$ you get for it down the road will be far less significant than getting a good deal now.
If it turns sour and doesn't feel like it will hold up for the long haul, you can still sell it with 5k miles left on that warranty, so you have a "plan B".
I have a co-worker that has asked about my interest in an '05 Grand Caravan with virtually every option out there, including navigation, DVD, etc. It only has 34k miles and has a 100k mile extended warranty. He's asking $18k for it.
I'm torn-I know my wife would love the stow and go. I'd certainly love buying something that has more bells and whistles that I wouldn't get buying an Odyssey, but I'll also get a vehicle that only has 1/3 to 1/4 of the miles I'd have to get along with the warranty to boot. Buying an Odyssey of similar mileage/options would cost a LOT more.
What would you do?
I have a 2005 DGC and it's been trouble free going on three years. I think 18 is a little high, but maybe not if it has leather, navigation, DVD and warranty.
Stow-N-Go is a very nice feature. It can hold a whole lot of stuff, including a small television you can plug into one of your outlets. blankets and pillows if you go camping.
I keep one passenger middle seat stowed most of the time so the dog has a place to set, or if I want to haul something big and already set up, like a bassinet. The side door is much better to load stuff like that, than using the tailgate.
Don't be fooled about those middle seats being uncomfortable. Maybe if your 230 lbs., but not for the average person. I have made two trips from Arizona to Ohio in it and my brother sat in them both times.(2,000 miles one way) He never complained about them. They are firmer and narrower, but far from being uncomfortable.
The advantage having to be able to stow those seats and have all that storage room, makes those seats a real bargain. I like the idea that they have arm rests on them too and the seats can lean back. Something you can't get on some bench seats.
I think you'd be happy with the Dodge. With the 100,000 warranty, you have little to worry about.
Well my brother isn't any kid and a 4,000 mile round trip is a long time to sit in them and he hasn't complained. Now if you don't lift the head rest up, you'll complain. I have had others set in them for short trips of less than 60 miles and they never complained either. Maybe you have a more than tender rear end.
I've been in my Stow N Go seats to Toronto a few times, with no complaints after a 5 hour drive. My elderly parents have been in them for hours and I asked what they thought. They had no issues. You can't beat em for ease of use and flexibility. I love not taking seats in and out for camping trips or big Home Depot runs. It'll be interesting to see when or if others bring out anything like them. It would take a commitment to a specific minivan chassis for Honda for example because the Oddy, Ridge, Pilot and MDX all share same architecture. Will they come up with a better mousetrap, compromise "comfort" or stick with what they have?
Hey I think the rest of the minivan is a good value and the stow N go's are handy. They had to make some sacrifices is eat comfort to make the seats work. If you sat a Chrysler next to all it's major competitors and sat in the second row seats, you'd note the difference. That's what I did when I was shopping.
If your going to compare the middle stow-n-go seats to the Ody or Sienna for softness, of course the stow-n-go will come in last. That's a given. They are firmer, but they are far from being uncomfortable. But those of us that bought the Chrysler/Dodge, mainly for the convenience of stowing the seats instead of removing them when we needed the room and loved the large storage bins, did so knowing they wouldn't be as comfortable, but also knowing they had big advantages over the Ody and Sienna for those of us that use our vans for more than people haulers. If all your going to do is haul people and don't need to worry about storage, Chrysler's stow-n-go is not for you. But there are many people like myself that hate having your van or truck messed up with toys, tools, jump cables, blankets, etc. That like the idea of going into a store, buying something, stowing it out of sight in those bins and then leaving it to go to another store. Not worrying someone will look in and see it laying on the floor.
I love the idea we can go to some place like park and swap and if I see something I like, I don't have to go home and take out my seats and go back and load it.
About a year ago, I went into Sears to get a bassinet for our daughter. They only had the floor model left and I took it. I dropped the middle passenger seat and slid it in the side door, standing up. Did the same thing with an air compressor. I would have had to pick it up to get it in the rear hatch. I only had to bend the handle down and slide it in the side door. No heavy lifting.
So yes, you give up a little softness in the middle seats for the convenience of stow-n-go. To me it was a no brainer. I got rid of a truck because of the stow-n-go seats and have never been sorry.
I also disagree with them having a cheap feel to them. The seats have a solid steel frame and the cloth is the same as the other seats, the arm rest are firm. There is nothing cheap about them. Even the cover over the bins are steel and solid. I think most people who own one will agree.
Did you ever ask him/them? If I was a guest in someone else's vehicle I sure wouldn't be telling the owner that the seats suck...may find myself walking home.
That one should be obvious - I wouldn't buy something I felt was uncomfortable either; it may explain why nobody owning them think their Stow n Go seats are uncomfortable. To the owners, they are comfortable!
I REALLY don't think it would happen as much as you'd think. The seats in my sedan are VERY firm, but quite comfortable (they are fairly large captains chairs though). With 350k+ sold every year, people aren't dismissing that seat very quickly.
I make it a point to sit in LOTS of vehicles when the auto show rolls in here in November. I'll have to try out the DCX SnG seats again. Last time they were just too small for me to get REALLY comfortable. They weren't "Gawd-Awful" as some people make 'em out to be, but they weren't as good as our 2000 model Odyssey's 2nd row for me (I'm 6'4" and always had plenty of room and comfort in our 2nd row). Sure, the seats didn't stow, but we did more people moving than cargo moving, so it didn't matter too much to us. We actually never took the seats out - we didn't move that much stuff!
Nobody's questioning stow-n-go's practicality; it's a compromise that makes sense to a large number of people. For people who haul more rears than gear, a more comfortable seat is worth losing stow-n-go.
Chrysler did keep them, but they also offer different seats for Swivel-n-Go that appear to be more comfortable (thicker padding, higher off the ground). So at a minimum they hedged their bets.
If Chrsyler thought the smaller Stow-n-Go seats were fine, they probably would have used the same design for Swivel-n-Go, yet they didn't.
On the other hand, most of the times its kids in these seats, and if you have an infant seat or a booster for a toddler it really doesn't matter what is underneath, in fact a thinly padded seat might make it easier to secure a child safety seat, so it could be seen as an advantage.
Simple conclusion - try them out. We are all shaped differently. I found they're a bit short for me, no thigh support, and too thinly padded. marine's brother is either too nice to complain or simply shaped differently than me, perhaps both.
Would you buy a van knowing it was uncomfortable?
I'm afraid you won't find what you are looking for, unless some people had a change of heart (or change of backbone ). Seat comfort isn't a problem that would "develop" like a burned-out bulb. It should be relatively static; it would be existent from the time of test-drive. Do ya kinda see what I'm trying to say?
I'm not knocking you, really I'm not. Seat comfort is subjective, and there's no point in trying to convince someone that something is comfy to them or not, since everyone has a different idea of comfort. There are obviously loads of people who find the DCX seats perfectly suitable. The thing is, people that had a problem with the seats probably didn't BUY THE CAR which is why you aren't hearing complaints from owners. They wouldn't buy something they found uncomfortable in the first place.
That's (the underlined part) all I'm trying to say.
paging hansienna, paging hansienna, you're needed in the Minivan shopping forum.
To be fair, I think it's just a matter of not taking a long enough test drive.
BTW, he is VERY vocal about what he perceives as poor seat comfort. He is by far the most vocal Sienna critic here on Edmunds, one of the very few.
Leave it to the 'Yota drivers! KIDDING! :P