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So does that make them half German.
This was mentioned in some of my past posts ( you can search) that they have a platform agreement to share.
"Many people stated" ok that's a switch from the last post- but if you did a search it's a select few -
"Interesting to see what top q50 will go for" I could bet its going to be less then current 335, and prob closer if to "top" BMW 328 will go for and offer more( in tech for sure). Just like the g35 I own- did and does vs the comp at that time.. For the people who think the Infiniti needs a great car please look at us sales numbers vs Lexus is and acura to over the last 6 years- they have a great car - lets hope it's even better.
Blinders off - let's wait for the reviews and have a ride.
As you made mention of, getting a G (or now Q50) or an Acura TL to butt heads at the $50K mark puts them among the best of the segment (namely, the BMW, MB and the Audi). They don't want that fight if I had to guess.
Speculation, but sounds like the Q50 will be larger, with the same power trains. So, performance with today's G would be similar.
I'll reserve judgement on looks until it shows up in the flesh. But, if it comes in anywhere north of $45K, it's going to cannabalize the M, which is close to that number discounted.
Following the train of thought that the Q50 will be a slightly smaller M (will it become the M50 with the same 3.7L?), and given how slow the M is selling, anyone care to make a deduction on the new Q's sales numbers?
BTW, the local Infiniti dealer is advertising cars (relatively) cheap right now. $7K off a G37x. $5,500 off a G25. $6K off an M. A little ngetiation and probably beat those prices by a few hundred more.
Well, replacing 330 with 335 few years back at similar price was a great deal, as 335 is much stronger than 330 and gas mileage was maintained if not improved. But the new 320 is going to be priced about same as previous 328 - and that is not a good deal. Especially because:
- the steering feedback on new 3-series is a step in WRONG direction
- quality of materials on new 3-series is clearly result of cost-cutting spree (chep "hard" switches, cheap "ratchet-like" feeling iDrive, cheap "hard" door latch from 80s).
- 50 horses was sent to pastures (180 vs 230), but you pay just about the same; you will gain miles per gallon, which some people will appreciate, but I find my E91 at 23-25 mpg on the daily commute satisfactory (not mindblowing, but decent).
I would consider 320 a good deal, but at price point about 5 grand below. And the got to fix the steering, the interior feel and the damn door latch.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
http://infinitinews.com/en-US/infiniti/usa/presskits/us-2014-infiniti-q50-press-- kit
- Ray
Still a BMW driver...
Dollars make sense - remember this is Elpps -
http://wot.motortrend.com/2014-mercedes-benz-cla-chased-by-a-wolf-in-new-ad-3228- 21.html
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
208 hp/258 lb ft torque
7 Speed Dual Clutch Automatic
How much does it weigh?
When are they going to put a "build your own CLA" on MBUSA's site?
I'll wait to judge until I see some (unbiased) write ups.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
Much in the same way that a $35K 3 series of C class hits $50K.
The CLA - and soon the new 1 series and A3 - are designed to bring MB, BMW and Audi back a few years in price and size to where the next generation of buyers can afford them. I'll wager that more than 50% of the CLA will be FWD with MB TEX and be offered at $259 a month.
It's not going on sale in the US until September 2013. Check back in August.
A "Typically Configured At" price would be more helpful but then it's a grey area anyway. One dealer would state "our" typically configured vehicles come with leather...their's don't.
I wager most people realize that a new Mercedes for 29K isn't a top of the line, loaded vehicle; a loaded Optima and Focus can top that price...
We recently purchased a Honda Crosstour and the MSRP was 33K (4 cyl); our sales price was substantially lower. The older I get the more expensive everything seems :sick:
Garbage that's 6K if it breaks, overpriced junk (seriously have you USED a Mercedes NAV vs a Garman?), mostly useless bling, what's wrong with normal cruise control?, terrarium that leaks eventually, and way way more pricey than better aftermarket rims.
The truth is, the car is best in its base configuration. If you add bling to a car like that, you're either so rich you don't care about the cost or you're a fool.
To each his (or her) own.
My wife's car (not an ELLPS) has Xenon's - living in an area where wildlife crosses the road frequently, we've found them to be much, much better than regular headlights.
Me personally, I love the added creature comforts.
Price matters in the segment - lets not be blind here people- a 4cly 3 series is close to 40k and it comes with pleather seats. The junk someone mentioned should be standard- otherwise you are just paying for a badge.
Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans - yep, I should think that some luxury features be available.
I think the big difference between Acura, Lexus, Infiniti and MB, Audi and BMW is that the Germans offer 'unbundled' options (Xenons only? Ja Wohl) whereas the Japanese only offer 'bundled' options (Tech Package, etc.).
I also agree with you about a good windshield mounted GPS. My BMW's fully integrated navigation is nice to have, but if I were to look for another E90 328xi, I could live without it.
Where I live in CT, the back roads and even the Merritt Parkwayare not well lit. I love my car's Bi-Xenon Adaptive headlights.
AWD isn't a requirement (especially since the CLA is a FWD car). I like having it, even if it gives me a "false" sense of security. If I were to buy a FWD or RWD car, I'd have to buy snow tires for it. If I were to buy a dedicated set of snow tires and winter wheels, that'd be basically not too muich less than the cost of what the manufacturer charges for an AWD system.
As far as looks go, to me there is no single determining factor that impact whether I like the way a car looks other than the wheels (rear end is second). I really like the way my 17" split 5 spoke (value package) wheels look on my car. The Sport Pkg Wheels & the ///M SPort Pkg Wheels look fantastic on the E90s as well. Some of the "base" 16" wheels on the lower optioned 328i E90s make the car look down right cheap. I would never buy a car with wheels I don't like and say to myself: "I'll get a set of sport package or ///M Sport package wheels in the spring."
I'm sure the car (as most are) is "best in it's base configuration." Like others have said, how many of these base or low optioned cars are going to be at the auto shows, in press fleets, on dealer showrooms?
Look at something like a Wrangler Unlimited. In it's base form (Sport), it is perfectly capable and will handle a lot of snow and even some light to medium duty off roading. How many Wrangler Sports do you see driving around? Where I live, I see a lot more Saharas (High $30K Sticker) and Rubicons (Low $40K Sticker).
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
Xenons? Yeah, I think this is a disapointment that Germans charge extra for those. It should be standard today on ELLPS.
Leather seats? I'd agree that in US-market it is also a big disapointment that BMW or Benz demand almost two grand for that, but knowing a bit about Euro market, I can certify that Europeans at large do not revere leather uphostery nearly as much as Americans. Many straight out prefer high quality cloth over leather on both their home couch and their car. One could call it charitably a "cultural difference". MB Tex is reporteadly a very high quality material, both in terms of appearance and durability, so it is even preferred by many. Quick inventory browse shows it is a majority on C250 models, which seems to confirm that assertion. If they sell, they can't be so bad. I bet many people actually think it is leather (as it is faking it really well).
I don't know about BMW, their leatherette has much less footprint. It may mean the quality differential is greater. However, BMW also bundles leather with its premium package (MB does not), which is considered a must, even by selling dealers (BMW dealers actually order the cars they want within model allotments), plus it was even a free upgrade when E9x was being phased out (I know it was $0 option on my 2012 wagon).
Anyway, I remember, when I added sunroof and those fold-down seats to sedan, suddenly the wagon (where it was standard) was not more expensive, at all. Tells me a lot about the mindset and market. I guess it is their effort to expand the buyer's base to those "aspirational" purchasers (not just by leases, but also by playing with content level), whereas wagons, coupes and convertibles do not have to carry that burden.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Phoenix Motor has 25 C250's that are under 39K... Half are 37.9K and under. I'm sure most have leather and 7 spd auto.
http://mercedesofphoenix.com/new-inventory?Make=Mercedes-Benz&Model=C-Class&sort- =Price%20asc
Granted they also have 56K C350 sport too... OUCH...
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Now I'm not an acura fan in its current state of bland but will say if they are Ellps ( and to me that's debatable) they have pricing and packaging down.
2013 C250 Sedan with Mars Red Exterior, Black MB-Tex Interior, Sport Package, 17'' 5-Twin Spoke Wheels, Becker MAP PILOT Navigation, Aluminum Trim, and Much More!!
Now we all know how dealers get people into the showroom, but if the description is correct, the car has sport package, but according to MBUSA webpage the sport package comes with 18" wheel and tires not 17..
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I will be purchasing a car in the near future and I am going for CPO. I really want an AWD, so the S4 is my first choice. I heard the Quattro is sick. The car will mostly be used for Road trips and Weekend driving. I have a older Nissan Maxima that is my daily driver. My main issue with the Audi is that most people state that it will be costly and frequent, in the future, and I plan on keeping the car for a long time. My 96 Maxima currently has 171k on it.
I live in San Antonio Tx and it can get pretty hot. Are there any reasons I should avoid the Audi besides costly repairs??? I am not a wrencher, but I am not afraid to dig in.
I am open to other cars too
Please give me suggestions!!!
So far the cars that caught my eyes are:
Infiniti G37x (looks cheap in most areas, but still a great ride)
Lexus GS350 (Never owned a Toyota and this one seems pretty nice)
Audi B8 S4 (so far has all the specs I want and I like to have cars I don't see on the road all the time)
***BMW 335xi is not on my radar because I see way too many BMW's out here. I don't want to join the club.***
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
Edit: Adding Sports Package to a red C250 Sports Sedan jacks the price to 41 grand (you have to add premium 1 with it, too, total bundle $4800). I doubt dealer would advertise such car for 37 grand. Considering the wheels, it is simple case of misinformation/misdirection.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I read alot of the stories out ther and know the car will be expensive. I do want to keep it until 100k if possible.
I know AWD isn't necessary in Texas, but I think it will be fun.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I LOVED my 1998 Audi A4. I drove it 88K and after the warranty ran out I probably spent about $1800 total on maintenance and repairs. Most of that was a cooling issue that the dealer had trouble finding. I sold it earlier than I normally do as I was worried about more costs/problems. But it was never unreliable or left me stranded.
I now have an Acura TL with 130K and pretty near nothing has gone wrong. It's more reliable and cheaper to own than the Audi, and a very nice car.
Costs aside, I'd pick the Audi. Just be prepared for some extra $$, which you might not need, but you never know. If you are concerned, you might be able to buy an extended warranty.
G35O another nice rig but its more of a cruiser then a hot rig- love the looks and RWD pretty cool.
G37- awd nice cars - bummer can't get with stick- halls - best value in this class- not the best in the slick weather (snow) with 18s -
In Texas - I would go slightly used s4 (stick), new g 37 sport RWD stick, then awd g37x, then gs.
All pretty good choices - good luck.
Before the GF bought her S4, she did her due diligence. Personally, if I like a car, I'm all over it. But, I don't give much thought to reliability. And, quite frankly, I don't put much stock in Consumer Reports reliability rankings, as I consider them little more than the CR faithful (who they base the reliability rankings on) as confirming foregone conclusions. That's a different topic, though.
The GF talked to everyone she knew who currently owned, or at some time owned an Audi in the past, about their ownership experience. While not scientific, and probably only numbered a dozen people, without fail, Audi ownership experiences were positive.
pletko....well smack me silly and call me foolish. I like sport seats (that are heated). I like trick DSG transmissions. I like big fat leather steering wheels in my hands while driving. In other words, I'm one of those fools you describe. I'm good with that.
Had this discussion with a friend while at a SuperBowl party last Sunday. He owns, among others, a BMW 6 series. Nice car. Not sure what the drivetrain is, but I think it's a V8 with a manumatic. I've ridden in it several times. I even drove it once (to take his inebriated butt home). It definitely is big and heavy, and you feel the mass and weight. It's not a particularly good handling machine, and it's not particularly quick. It's what I consider a poseur. That said, it's pretty and it costs a lot. Both of those traits fit my my friend's personality to a tee. :P
We had the GF's S4 at the party. As we got into discussions about cars, he found the S4 not "blingy" enough for his taste. That alone made the S4's status move a couple of rungs up the status ladder for us.
As we were talking, he asked me what I did not like about the TL. In all reality, I couldn't list one thing. There were some niggly things that maybe would bother me more than others (like a hint of torque steer on quick starts from stop). But, nothing that was a show stopper. Granted, the S4 and my 335 are faster and handle better. Plus, the suspension/ride/handling compromise in the Germans and 2nd to none.
But, the TL SH AWD will get you to 80% of what the Audi will do. There are some things that the TL does that no other car I've ever owned was able to do. Now, these are minor things, but noticeable nonetheless.
For example, I've never owned another car that had more comfortable sport seats than the TL. Nothing is perfect. But, for me, the TL's sport seats were about as close as you can get. They're bolstered perfectly and are comfortable while holding you in your seat.
The HVAC system heats up and cools down faster than in any other car I've ever owned, too. And, it holds the perfect temp (that I've set) better than any other car I've owned.
Ergonomically, at least for things like window switches, seat belt, steering wheel, etc., I could get in the TL, and with one smooth move reach and click the seat belt without reaching....all the while having my hand fall in the perfect location to the start button.
Up until the B&O system in the S4 (which is insanely good), the TL's stereo was the best I had ever heard in a car (that includes some high buck aftermarket installations).
Point of all this, even designs that are long in the tooth, like the TL, are still really good ELLPS these days. And, I certainly don't feel foolish for liking the options they come with.
I know AWD isn't necessary in Texas, but I think it will be fun.
I've had AWD, FWD and RWD and IMO most of the fun to be had with AWD is when driving in snow. For dry weather fun nothing beats a good RWD car.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
How will it be fun?
Yeah, but it doesn't snow in San Antonio...
I don't need all the appearance stuff, but I appreciate them. I opted out of M-package, but there are times I look back and second guess it. I saw a M-pack 328 wagon same color and year on a picture and it looked even better than mine. Don't know if it was 2 grand better, but it was better.
Yeah, I'm a fool.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I did not say that at all, or to be precise, don't have recollection of that being my intention. My original post was in reference to leather vs. MBTex. I believed you stated you can have a leather C250 for $37K, quoting some Phoenix dealer and I responded that it was impossible cause you can't have leather without crossing 40 grand. We must have misunderstood each other.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I woulnd't buy one anyway, but it is interesting to see what dealers think sells. It appears to me that BMW dealers tend to have better variety of options (from strippers to fully optioned), perhaps not at all times, but it is easier to find content level (and price) closer to anyone's preference (except for manual transmissions - those were non-existent in Tampa Bay last time I checked), which means they anticipate customers for every level of content, whereas Benz dealers seem to think people want the the star on the hood, but don't really care for the extras. But as I wrote in the past, there are some particular practices on both lots that are beyond me (like those fold-down seats on 3-series sedans, available as stand alone or part of cold weather pack and since Florida cars don't need cold pack, almost none of the ordered sedans get fold-down seats :mad: ).
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2018 430i Gran Coupe