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Cadillac STS/STS-V: What's New for 2007?
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They actually build the SRX and CTS together.
I have sen pics of the CTS and SRX following each other on the assembly line.
I doubt if there will be 2 many problems with the startup of the STS.
They were building '04 CTSs last June. So I guess they can build '05 STSs.
In any case, I am just curious when the new STS will likely start to show up in numbers at my local dealer. My guess is that if production is scheduled to begin in 6 – 8 weeks, then the press pre-production run is complete and in the hands of CD, R&T, etc. by now.
I was interested to read the weight difference between the V8 RWD and AWD of approx. 4230 - 3921 = over 300 #s.
And a GM expected 0-60 time of 5.8 for the RWD V8 – and 6.6 for the AWD version . . .
Link: http://www.autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat- _code=reviews&content_code=02729100
And further interested to see (last paragraph) a top price of $66K. Seems like a loooong way from $47K base price for the RWD V8 version to $66K!
- Ray
Curiuos-er and curious-er . . .
You can see many journalists of different races around any new car at an auto show...
Its something different from the Norm, Euro/Japanese concortions. It should do well with Yakuza if it ever goes on sale in Japan
But the Japanese mafia using an STS? I dunno about that. Whenever I go to Asia, people say they drive Nissan Glorias.
What color is Moonstone?
How about Sand Storm?
This color is now on the SRX.
- Ray
Interested still, and wondering when first (preview) tests will be published . . .
-Paul
If GM is going to pendle the same Chevy stuff as a Cadillac (remember Catera?) then, the market will take them back to the drawing board.
Do not get me wrong, the LS6 is one of the best Engines in the world. World class, up there with the Ferraris, Lamborghinis and Porsches. But it’s a Chevy Corvette engine. Not Cadillac.
Cadillac, needs its own credentials. Take the Northstar Powerplant, its known as a Cadillac engine, the same should happen with the V Series. Eventually Cadillac should develop special engines for their Cadillac V performance. Currently, they are selling you a corvette Powertrain in a Cadillac body.
See My point?
Having an engine in a particular car, in this case a Vette, you can pretty much get the idea of what it is capable of. They are proven. If a new Northstar becomes available, it has to prove itself in terms of power, mileage, and reliability. I think the Vette link provides that history and would put a Caddy owner at ease. Just my opinion though.
I do agree that the Northstars associate to Cadillac, but ultimately, it is STILL a GM engine, regardless of which brand using it.
-Paul
No. I don't see why anyone should have a problem with a Corvette engine (especially a tuner Corvette engine) in a Cadillac.
Unless they don't like kicking butt.
Cadillac = Exclusive Luxury commute
I don't know that many masses transit in Corvettes.
I'm sure it's a lot less than transit in DeVilles.
Hmmm. . .
"Mass transit"
Really fast - and in Latin?
- Ray
Who would be quite happy to have a Ford 427 side-oiler installed in my Lincoln . . .
When you consider Cadillac's desired image: performance luxury, that is a stark contrast to what has actually been done in the past. I can't speak for anybody else, when I think of Cadillac I think of hearses, old retirement fleet cars, and tricked out Escalades.
Cadillac wants to get to that performance route. They are making great strides in the luxury department. Their racing endeavours at races like LeMans are gaining notice. But a great way to market the performance aspect is to HYPE the Corvette engine in their new sport sedans. During this time, they can continue their development of the powerful Northstars.
Tying to Corvette right now is a VERY smart marketing move. Not everybody is going to like that, but it does set a benchmark expectation for those looking at those new cars.
When I think of a Caddy with a LS6 engine in it, I think one word, "sleeper."
-Paul
I see no reason, currently, to worry about this image issue -- Cadillac's image is evolving quite nicely, I think, FWIW.
GM has a lot to crow about, both currently in the showrooms and "coming soon" (with respect to Cadillac).
I read an article that seemed to be somewhat critical of the Northstar engine, claiming that it was overly complicated, lacking the design simplicity and possessing too much mechanical complexity -- this was an article, not an advertisement, praising the Chryco Hemi with MDS.
A lowly pushrod engine was lauded and, in some ways, was presented as an almost more reasoned alternative to the Northstar.
I can't recall but I think the article was in Autombile magazine or Car and Driver, but if I read the article in a vacuum, it would POSSIBLY make me come to the conclusion that the Northstar Engine was the way it was for Marketing Purposes not Performance Purposes and that Chryco (DC) actually had a better mousetrap if what you wanted was economy, performance and reliability (fewer moving parts).
I haven't seen anything that makes me think Cadillac is going to chinzt out on the upcoming generation(s) of automobiles it will bring to market -- there's just too much riding on it.
I don't know much about Corvettes, but what I think I know is that they have reputations for good engines. If someone told me my new STS had a Covette engine in it, I don't think that would be a bad thing.
FWIW.
Cadillac should go Northstar exlusively.
There's an common engineering acronym called KISS - Keep It Simple, Stupid. To their detriment, the Germans don't seem to get KISS.
There's also an old sports saying that I also like to apply to engine horsepower.... "It ain't how, it's how many."
I'll bet there will be a high zoot Chryco Hemi super duper high wow output version of a 300C within, hmmm, 9 to 18 months -- it will be, in the usual car magazines, maxed out with special HP stuff and in AWD guise will be tested and pitted against the STS AWD.
While DOHC gets a lot of positive press, I suspect that the current DC Hemi MDS system has already earned the respect of some, who shortly ago, would have said "no way" to a pushrod engine.
If it goes, goes well, runs well, is fast and quick, reliable and even has a modicum of "economy" -- I, frankly, don't think the buying public will poo-poo it with their dollars just 'cause it ain't complex.
Just a thought.
Seems keeping it simple IS STUPID! Double Vanos, VVTL-i, Hybrids, even New-Gen diesels are more competitive than GM Pushrods!
2. Not how, but how many? A 3800 lb. 530i can beat many cars with bigger engines and more HP/torque with their now dated 3L 225HP engine. It's not just how, but where (where is the torque/gearing)!
I'm totally making a 2005 Acra RL vs. 2005 STS Board!
DrFill
Who cares? HP/Liter only matters when there are displacement taxes. The truly simple solution is to just add displscement..... easy to do on OHV motors because they are extra compact.
"Double Vanos, VVTL-i, Hybrids, even New-Gen diesels are more competitive than GM Pushrods!"
In the M5, those fancy, expensive solutions use more fuel and make less horsepower. There's no hybrid or diesel sports car, so much for that.
But diesel is a better solution than hybrid. Much simpler, just as efficient. Even the Europeans have gotten that. All they need to do is make some low sulfur fuel available.
It seems you are. Those who have reviewed the LS6 application in the CTS-V have commented that the level of refinement is very high.... much different than what they've seen in the Corvette.
And now we're seeing the 300C's powertrain getting rave reviews... hmmmmm....
"I think it is stupid that GM is not developing a new fancied up Northstar for all the higher end Cadillacs."
Actually, they're developing a V12.
Yesterday, driving from South Carolina to Ohio (12 hour trip), the Stability System engaged about every 3 to 5 minutes, until the last 4 hours of our trip when the ambient temperature dropped below 70 degrees.
Any idea what might be the cause of the malfunction?
M
Based on the XLR data (from an R&T comparison test) of:
WT: 3670
Final Drive: 2.93
Tires: 235/50 x 18
0-60: 5.8
Quarter: 14.1 at 101.9
My fearless prediction of STS V8 RWD magazine times:
( Assumptions –
HP: 320 = +10
5-speed trans: same
WT: 4026 [9.7% diff.]
Final Drive: 3.42 [16% diff.]
Tires: 255/45 x 18 )
0-60: 5.8
Quarter: 14.1 at 101.9
Just a guess.
But this should be interesting . . .
- Ray
Thinking that would be a pretty quick Sedan . . .
Perhaps there is something deeply flawed in the Chyrsler 300C's Hemi with MDS.
Reading the editorial and analytical stuff being cranked out about this lowly pushrod engine, does not make me dislike complexity and cool new tech, it just elevates my perception of the the Pushrod Hemi -- and apparently I should be impressed with the Corvette application as used by Cadillac.
I think there can be co-existance of these technologies.
My BMW bigoted Co-workers and friends are all taking notice of the 300C and the Acura RL -- both engines do some interesting things with different approaches.
I think they want mo' power and mo' milage -- and if there is a diesel or a gasoline engine that can do that and they can buy it, it is unnecessary for the engine to tout a complex technological pedigree, now a refined engine, yes!
craig
What did buyers want before?
drFill
I'm waiting for the next generation V8 with hp from 340-600, 4.6, 5.5 and 6.3Ls.
I see Cadillac is going to do a supercharge Northstar. Sounds like it should be a hell of a motor. I wonder if they'll step up to the 500hp standard.
M
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
With Lexus going for a $100K car above LS, GM has to follow suite. after all Buick is not in the game yet.
On the LS Vette engine, it may be Pushrod, but its not 'low tech' Its one of the most advanced automotive pieces out there. the LS6 Gen III may have its ancestor in the 'small block' but , its come a long way to all Aluminum, Advanced fuel injection and Engine management systems, to a complete redesign along the way.
This engine is as advanced as any racing engine out there.
The New LS6 Gen IV will push the envelop even further. Not just in Displacement but in performance.
The Z06 will be going after the New 911 Carrera Turbo, and since the Porsche is out GM has a Chance to best it in #'s.
There is another Vette or Cien planned to set site on Ford's Ferrari and Lamborghini slaying GT and the New Chrysler ME Four-Twelve Super Car which is already undergoing testing with several mules.
These are interesting times to be a car Buff. Congress might act soon or later, meanwhile We are all happy.
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
In any case, it is a VERY slick presentation -- all black, letter-sized envelope -- large, high gloss pics of the interior and exterior in the brochure -- caddy seems to be going all out on this one. Just when I start to loose interest in this car something comes along to perk me up again.
Nothing new on release date -- just "Fall 2004".
The styling on this vehicle is growing on me and I get the feeling when I see it in person it might make a very nice impression. I guess this "insider" might just have to go on a test drive!
“
Distribution Updates
Updates for STS
Week of 5/24/2004
Effective 5/24/2004, the following changes will be made to the Vehicle Order Guide:
Mechanical section-Added (R8E) Gas Guzzler Tax as "A" in (6DC29) V8 1SG column with a footnote that reads "(R8E) is not orderable but will be automatically added when AWD (MV3) Transmission is selected".
Mechanical section-(MV3) Transmission, 5-speed automatic, added footnote that reads, " (R8E) Gas Guzzler Tax is automatically added to (MV3) orders. “ – quote from GM Dealer World.
Not good news.
- Ray
Who was hoping for at least ‘decent’ gas mileage from all versions . . .