2005-2007 Toyota Avalon

bobwiley · April 2006

easttexas: Sorry, the Limited I test drove also had undercoating as the dealer undercaots them automatically before they go on the lot. That was the only Avalon Limited test dricve as I was sold immediately on the ride, comfort and quietness of the car. Undercoating is BOTH a protection and sound deadoning material--so, I'd get it done--it can only help! I hope ya get your Avalon quired down--guess I'm fortunate!
Bob

fin · April 2006

Here's a free opinion:

1. New cars at the beginning of any model year will bring a premium. Buyers pay it to be the first to drive one home. This happens with many cars, not just the Avalon.

2. If the Avy gets the 6 speed (probably will), add another premium to #1.

3. If Toyota PR somehow convinces the world that the '07 Avalon is truly "new and improved".... add another premium to #2 and #1. It can happen.

If you are not in a hurry and don't need a new car now, you have a 5 month wait for a new model year. It's probably worth it. Others may have more ideas.....

benkay · April 2006

I had a 03 XL and now own a 05 Touring. I agree that 03 was much a quieter and softer ride. The firmer ride on the 05 Touring seems to pick up more road noises and vibrations. I don't know what your issue with the seats is, but I find no issue with them myself. I do have this rattle/chattering noise coming from rear right door area that I have been meaning to have checked out. Other than that, I love this car.

pat · April 2006

There are those who say the undercoating can block the moonroof drains.

mem4 · April 2006

Here is the URL:

http://www.trademotion.com/partlocator/index.cfm?siteid=213860

I would call them at 800-527-2781 and ask for the wiper blades for the Avalon. When I used their on-line ordering form they have the drivers side listed but their computer sent out the metal arm instead of the rubber blade. It was easy to return and I have had good luck dealing with them. They show their parts as discounted but you also pay shipping so you may want to check with your local dealer for the price on the blades.

leitann · April 2006

I Currently have a Camry, had zero trouble with it, but I thought that I might move up to the Avalon because the Camry does have quite a bit of road noise. Now, after reading all the posts about all of the other problems posted here, I'm wondering if the Avalon is truly a step up, and not just a "label" to impress others. I truly just want a quieter, more comfortable ride. I am puzzled.

tjc78 · April 2006

The seats were just a little bigger on the '03. By no means is this an uncomfortable car. I am a big guy and just preferred the wider seat on my '03. When I washed my car this weekend, I noticed the weather stripping on the driver's door was not perfectly aligned (a piece was tucked in too far causing a gap), I played with it a little and now notice a little less wind noise.

lzc · April 2006

I'm also in the middle of a Camry/Avalon decision, having enjoyed two Camrys. I think you'll find the Avalon to be the more comfortable car. It's seats are larger and cabin roomier.

As to road noise, my test drive of an Avalon Touring model over several different road surfaces seemed quiet to me. I should add, though, that my wife drove the freeway portion of the test at only 60-65 mph.

I'm inclined to wait to see what Avalon does for 2007. The current transmission is dated, and possibly flawed. The CD player isn't mp3 compatible, the center stack includes a tape player in place of NAV (in Touring). Avalon needs a tad updating, imo.

Good luck.

alan_s · April 2006

My opinion: Get the 2007 Camry XLE V6. It doesn't have the defective 5-speed transmission (although who knows whether the new 6-speed is any better) and some of the early-release models are MADE IN JAPAN, so most of the build-quality issues the Kentucky plant is having probably won't be an issue. You can identify the Japanese build ones by their VIN which begins with a J.

captain2 · April 2006

and it wouldn't be logical that Toyota may use the same transmission control software and pedal design in the 6 speed as it does with the 5? Given that the whole point seems to be maximizing mpg, it is also not too much of a stretch to assume that the 6 speed to be 'worse' than the 5 simply because now we have more gears to search thru? My point is that the trans. is NOT defective - good or bad, it works the way it is designed to!

alan_s · April 2006

Hey Captain: The transmission may not be "defective" in terms of "malfunctioning" but it is ill-fitting for the purpose. Considering the number of complaints Toyota has had about this - and there are considerably more complaints in the V6 Camry implementation, one would think that Toyota would change the functionality to one that is more "normal" in operation, and more similar in behavior to the unintrusive units offered by the competition.
Then again, I don't know why Toyota has let this matter persist since they introduced the 5 speed in 2002. The research I have done shows complaints about the transmission/hesitation issues going back to when they first introduced the 5-speed into the 2002 Camry and Lexus ES300. The previous 4-speed was a model of smoothness.
Like you, I think the 6-speed will be busier and more difficult to manange than the 5-speed and the 8-speed on the new Lexus 460 must be an absolute nightmare. CST - a new acronym perhaps - Continuously Shifting Transmission

Interestingly, Nissan/Infiniti is moving toward CVT's as opposed to more gears with greater complexity, although I can't say I am a fan of CVT's either.
If a glove has 4 fingers, it may not be defective, but as designed, it doesn't fulfill it's purpose!

pat · April 2006

Some personally directed comments and subsequent responses have been removed. Let's just keep comments focused on the subject and not each other. If you see a post you feel is out of line, please email the host for assistance instead of responding. Thanks.

havalongavalon · April 2006

alan_s,

Two weeks ago, you confirmed yourself that the transmission in your Avalon is not defective. You discoved a defect in the offset of your gas pedal, that you fixed, and cured your transmission misbehaviors.

Please re-read your own message #11901 that you posted for us on April 4 to tell us that you had "discovered that in the (your) Avalon there is a "dead spot" from accelerator idle-position to on-throttle, so an inherent time-delay exists every time the pedal is depressed when fully off."

You capped your message #11901 with a key finding:

"I fabricated a piece of plastic of appropriate thickness that when installed in the correct position in the accelerator housing upwards of the pedal shaft, I slightly changed the "off-throttle" or home position of the gas pedal to be just below the point at where RPM's increase (just below off-idle), essentially taking up the initial dead-spot or slack, and simulating a partly on-throttle condition to be signalled to the computer, without raising the idle RPM's.

I have been driving the Avalon like this for 4 days now and have found that the hesitation has all but disappeared. There is no hesitation "off the mark" - the engine responds immediately to on-throttle, and when lifting off the accelerator and reapplying during traffic, the transmission remains in the current gear because the ECU thinks the foot is still on throttle (or shifts DOWN if braking) and simply picks up when the throttle is reapplied. THERE IS NO GEAR HUNTING, NO MORE "SLIPPING" AND NO MORE HESITATION! "

alan_s, your transmission is not defective! And the Avalon transmission has not been reported to share the serious transmission/hesitation issues of the 5-speed that the 2002 Camry and Lexus ES300. It is misleading to "lump" the 2005-6 Avalon 5-speed with the earlier 5-speed transmission.

Pick your battles... such as how to fix rattles.

havalongavalon

alan_s · April 2006

True, however what I omitted to convey to you all, is that recently the ECU started to compensate for the changed gas pedal position, and gradually reverted to it's previous strange behavior and "hesitation". Very frustrating.
I disconnected the battery for 15 minutes over the weekend and the transmission is now less erratic, so something or the other is being reset to factory default which changes over time.
I really don't know what the "issue" is - transmission, throttle sensors, etc, but the "system" has some anomalies that adversely affect the driveability of the car.
All I know is that my Avalon becomes almost undriveable after a period of time with spontaneous surges, changes and hesitation episodes which make it very difficult to control in bumper to bumper traffic. My wife refuses to drive it in traffic.
I am pursuing this with Toyota, however as this is obviously a sensitive issue for some people, I shall refrain from posting further information on the subject.

pat · April 2006

Please feel free to post whatever information you find out and whatever experiences you have.

The posts that beat up on people who report negative experiences are going to stop - or if they don't stop, they are going to continue to be removed.

This is the place to share what happens, and I encourage you to do just that. Just as I hope everyone else will continue to share their experiences - positive or negative - with the Avalon. That's what we're here for.

havalongavalon · April 2006

alan_s,

Thank you for this update. I fully understand your frustration, you have certainly encountered and endured an extraordinary number of problems and have put a lot of effort in trying to figure out causes and possible fixes. As complicated as car control systems are nowadays, and since your car is under warranty, I would leave it to Toyota to fix it. If your transmission misbehaviors are as flagrant as you describe them, there is no way their service people could ignore or dismiss them. And if they cannot fix your car, then they should replace it with a new one.

Best of luck,

havalongavalon

pat · April 2006

Everyone needs to understand that everyone's experience with a vehicle is unique. Because someone has a different experience with the same vehicle you own than you have had does not make that other person wrong.

And everyone also needs to understand that all are VERY WELCOME to post experiences here and that everyone should be free to post whatever has been his or her experience without being peppered with "no that didn't happen, you are wrong" comments.

If you want to post a contrasting experience that you have had with the car, certainly that is fine. If you want to tell someone else what he/she has or has not experienced or what he/she should or should not be posting, that is most definitely NOT fine.

We really need to get this straight; it's gone on for way too long. If anyone has any questions or comments, please feel free to email me. I'll be glad to discuss it further off-line.

But meanwhile, everyone here is on notice that comments that have anything to do with telling other posters how to behave, post, what they did or did not experience, are not going to be tolerated.

Now, please, let's get back to talking about the car.

Thank you for your cooperation.

captain2 · April 2006

there are a number of manufacturers besides Toyota (VW, Daimler and GM come to mind) that are having issues with these silly DBW systems - IMO overapplications of what is still a fledging technology. And there are certainly mfgrs. that handle it in a more 'normal' manner (Honda and Nissan come to mind). The 4 speeds you cite other than being naturally less mechanically complicated also not the same sort of DBW technology? CVTs may end up being the new wave once they can get them to work in higher HP and low temperature applications. Nissan's (to the best of my knowledge) first successful attempt in a higher power/weight vehicle - the 240 hp Murano.
That all said - I fully understand the objections you have with the way the transmission reacts in certain circumstances - but, for my part, don't find it so objectionable that I would be willing to trade off that power/economy combination that all us Avalon owners experience. And yep, from Toyota's perspective I'm sure they have told you that there is nothing wrong with it, that it is simply working the way it is designed.
PS CST -more properly 'continuously slipping transmission'?

easttexas · April 2006

Thanks for the good advice Bob. Your right, it can only help. I'll put that high on the "things to do" list and let you know how it goes (difference it makes).

Good comment the Host made (reply to your message 12053).

ET

easttexas · April 2006

Taking the Av in for window tinting tomorrow. Anyone have this done and had regrets, such as terrible radio reception or other.

Thanks in advance

catman2050 · April 2006

I purchased the Avalon Touring about a month ago. I've had it up to...well, let's say 90ish...and its as quiet at 90 as it is at 60....and 45...and 30. for me, its just such a smooth ride that I enjoy the drive.

catman2050 · April 2006

I had the windows tinted before picking up the car from the dealer...and I haven't had any problems. I guess I wouldn't know if the tinting affected the radio reception...but, so far, I haven't had any problem with the radio.

bobwiley · April 2006

leitann: I'm a VERY satisfied Avalon limited owner---car is QUIET QUIET QUIET--it is undercoated as we live in the Midwest. The "old" Avalon's--pre-05, were top me, just a Camry with a dress--not so the new Avalon--it is one AWESOME car!! Go drive--not just awound the block--tell the dealer you want it for 2-3 hours----drive it, get in & out, drive again on rough roads--drive it at varying speeds. Drive the model Avalon you want to drive, i.e. XL, Touring, XLS or Limited. Do your homework--check Consumer Reports --for $39 they offer a 3 month subscription--it gives you VERY DETAILED cost info and you can compare cars side-by-side----very worthwhile! Good luck from a VERY HAPPY Avalon Limited owner!! My email is fishing9209@aol.com--I can certainly guide ya in the right direction as far as cost, accessories, likes, dislikes and extended warranty info--and I'll be glad to do it!!
Bob

bobwiley · April 2006

easttexas: Had it done at the dealers--looks great and no reception problems, Did have to have them remove XM Receiver from front windshield to rear window location--what a difference in reception.
Bob

bobwiley · April 2006

pat/host: Had no problems and the car has been in the rain and thru the car wash.
Bob

endovit · April 2006

Had mine done after-market. No effect on anything except keeping the sun out. Toyota did tell me to stay away from the film with metal in it. It might effect the remote start or the hot zones for the key fob. They put in the darkest possible without metal. No problems.

ny_avalon · April 2006

Are there By-pass options that will allow the Navigation to be used while the car is moving

melbc · April 2006

I would also be interested in knowing if there is a by pass. My husband and I were on a day trip on the weekend and I (passenger) wanted to punch something into the navigation but it wouldn't let me, as long as the car was in motion. I understand why the driver probably shouldn't be programing it, but what about the passenger?

MelBC

tstrick320 · April 2006

Still hoping someone will respond to this...

...of course not until we've finished exploring the molecular structure of the gas pedal cover and whether the lunar phase is accounted for in the ECM operation.

neil5 · April 2006

I recommend 3M Color-stable Auto film it is designed for Sat systems and radio and NAV reception. got 30% grey. Non

metallic

havalongavalon · April 2006

Hi Tom,

Have you tried these?

link title

Highly recommended. Works best as you rhythmically step on the gas pedal.

And this one is ideal for practicing at stop lights:

link title

havalongavalon

easttexas · April 2006

Catman2050 / Bobwiley / *Endovit / Neil5 / Thanks for the reply. Tinting's not a big thing but your response let me go into this without concern. Had it done this morning, looks great and (as you all indicated) no reception loss...in fact I think I was picking up a Canadian station on the way home, ha.

*home run

easttexas · April 2006

Tom, good to see your smiling face again (your presence).

easttexas

tstrick320 · April 2006

LOL!

I guess I should have been a little clearer in my request. I was hoping to train THE CAR to understand my speech. But, failing that maybe I can improve my diction so that the NAV system understands when I say "Stop Guidance" that I don't really mean "Show me French Restaurants". (no kidding)

I guess now I know how those people feel about being re-trained in the fine art of gas pedal depression technique!

Tom

alan_s · April 2006

For those of you who think I am fabricating the transmission problems, read this:

http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=128303&page=5

There are a few posts on toyotanation.com regarding 2007 Camry 6-speed transmission issues and if you read the 2007 Camry forums on Edmunds, there are already reports of hesitation/changing problems on the 5-speed used on the 4 cylinder models, similar to the ones I have experienced.

I was hoping to press Toyota to replace mine with a 2007 Avalon with the 6-speed but it appears that this may not be an improvement.

I don't know why some people seem to be having problems while others are okay. There must be manufacturing quality control variations.

The good news is that my car is actually worth more than I owe on it, so I've been test-driving the competition. Infiniti M35 looks and drives pretty good, and the Azera on the other end of the scale is a tremendous surprise.

Anyway, I know you are all thoroughly sick of the transmission discussion, so I'm out.

jjr1 · April 2006

One way is if you buy the filter insert from the dealership, (about $5) directions come with it.

zekeman1 · April 2006

....Anyway, I know you are all thoroughly sick of the transmission discussion, so I'm out.
There's no way to comprehend how sick I am of this discussion...talk about get down into the grass and run it into the ground!
zekeman1

captain2 · April 2006

as noted by jir1, instructions come with the filter cartridge which I think is still only available from Toyota (although this should soon change). Doesn't actually require any special tools - 14mm socket (drain pan), 3/8" rachet with short extension, and the correct size cap wrench -all turns out to be pretty easy and clean - but it is different.

endovit · April 2006

Go to the following link:
http://members.cox.net/n0v8or/avalon_oil_change.pdf

captain2 · April 2006

wish you luck with your replacement choice - of all the cars I looked at an drove a year ago I personally thought the M was best - bnt, at the time they were well north of $40k (and selling at sticker). Recently drove the Azera and will agree that it is a surprise, although still a little 'Buicky' for my taste, and then there is still that whole resale value issue.

tzuppe · April 2006

Had my local generic take a shortcut.

Just remove filter housing and paper filter.

Wipe out with paper towel and put on big o-ring.

Lube o-ring and insert paper filter.

Bolt on filter housing.

Alot less steps than PDF instructions.

jl618 · April 2006

Toyota should at least add "AGREE" to the voice system in the Avalon when the nav screen first comes on. It would make it a bit more tolerable.

melbc · April 2006

Can anyone tell me if it is possible to change the setting on my mileage info screen so that it shows miles per gallon instead of liters per kilometers? So far I haven't found a way.

MelBC

jdre86 · April 2006

You haven't said whether or not you have the navigation system or not. I think I know how to change it if you have the navigation system. If you push MENU and scroll down to Setup, you should see the option to switch from Km to Miles. If you don't have the navigation system, I can't help you. You should consult your owners manual if my instructions don't assist you.

melbc · April 2006

I have the navigation system. I will try your recommendation. I tried the owner's manual route and couldn't find it. I found some kind of set up but it didn't give me the km to miles option. I will check again though.

Thanks

MelBC

pat · April 2006

Great topic! Let's have this conversation in a separate discussion - Wish List for the 2007 Avalon.

I moved the current posts to it - see you over there!

dandisk · April 2006

I know what you're talking about. I say "Go Home" and she says, "Are you sure you want a route to home?" I say, "Yes" and most of the times she says "Showing Gas Station Icons".

I swear I don't have a lisp. But most of the time, I'm getting gas station icons instead of my voice activated route home

dandisk · April 2006

I have a 2005 Avalon Limited. Is anyone experiencing steering column noises (buzzing) at high speeds on regular interstate kind of travel. Also, I'm kind of suprised by the amount of rattle noise I'm hearing (either from rear passenger door or maybe it's coming from the front passenger seat (when no passenger is riding with me). I guess I had high hopes from the flagship Toyota. Was that my mistake?

billyg · April 2006

One mistake that I was making was replying to the "yes or no" question when there was no longer the green icon in the upper left hand corner.

When the system asks you if you are sure you want a route to home, be sure to hit the NAV button again on your steering wheel and then reply YES.

The system doesn't hear you unless the green icon is present during the entire time that you are responding.

regis · April 2006

Contrary to popular belief, the 2006 Avalon XLS is priced substantially higher than the new Lexus ES350 (at least in Canada). The base price of the 2007 ES350 here is $42,900 compared to the base XLS of $40,150 but the ES has standard features such as VSC, brake assist, seat ventilation + memory, extended warranty etc. To equip an Avalon with the same features requires the purchase of Package B that brings the Avalon's Listing up to $43,725. And, factor in the extra cost of bringing the Avalon's warranty up to the Lexus standard. So what do you get for this extra cost? Maybe a slightly larger ES350?

2005-2007 Toyota Avalon

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