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Consumer Reports
Consumer reports, which I have depended on for many years, recently did an article on full-size pickups. No surprisingly, they rated the Tundra first followed by the Silverado. They had a lot of good things to say about the Silverado, but predicted much worse than average repair problems. I am considering buying a Silverado, but the last thing I need is a vehicle that gives me a lot of problems. Are 1999 and 2000 Silverado owners having problems? I tend to keep my vehicles about 13-15 years and it is probably too soon to tell if the Silverado will hold up that long. Any predictions?
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Get a grip. If they are so good at predicting 13-15 years into the future, they should be making your stock picks.
As the saying goes, "past performance is no guarantee of future performance."
Silverado/Sierra is an entirely new truck. Whether any truck can last that long no one can say. But what's easier, putting in a new small block Chevy engine, or replacing rusted-out body panels on a Toyota?
p.s Get the split bench-its way better
How can a vehicle that is predicted to have "much worse than average repair problems" be considered a good (second best) buy? There's something in that loginc that escapes me. (All, please I'm not trying to start a T vs. C vs. G vs. F vs. D war. I'm just questioning the logic of the rating.)
Rich
Is this fair? No. When the rated the F150 back a few years ago they tagged the predicted reliability with a NEW instead of rolling the past performance of the old F150.
I have noticed that CS has some sort of gun against GM. In one of their small car ratings they compared a Toyota Corolla along with a few other small cars. One of those small cars was a Chevy that was the EXACT same car (GM remarkets the Corolla). Upon one of their dissatisfaction points against the Chevy was that you could cut your forhead open with the trunk lid if was left wide open.
You could also rip your forhead open with the Toyota because it was the same car but there was no mention of that. Just praise for the Toyota. Go figure.
I own a Silverado and could not see any point that they made against it stick. The ride is firm and tight. Not rubbery as they stated. They complained about the seats but had an equal complaint about the seat in the Ford and Ram. However reading how it is mentioned in the Ford write up it looks like the seats in the Ford are more comfortable.
Notice how they never really mentioned anything about the rear cab head rests? I think all trucks with a rear seat should have them. I would rather have the back of my head smack into the head rest instead of the rear window.
So I think there is some sort of bias put out by Consumer Reports. I would also like to know what sort of cars their "testers" drive as their daily driver car. Would it be fair if most of these drivers own Toyotas and Hondas. Any evaluation of ergonomics etc will be biased twoards those models.
Therefore interpret their ratings as a subjective report with positive and negative critisisim and evaluate the vehicles yourself.
mgdvhman,
As for reliability of Toyota's I own an '88 Land Cruiser with 221,000 miles. It has no rust and has had no problems, no major mechanical work, actually really no mechanical work. I don't want ot jinx it, but it is a quality vehicle. I know this is apples to oranges, but it was stated, broadly, that they don't make them to last. I have had excellent luck. My $0.02.
But I have to agree with the last post, Toyota has made some incredibly durable products. All Landcruisers have been very well built and durable. They are truly great vehicles on and off road. The old jeep style rigs equipped with GM 350s are still about the ultimate off-road vehicles out here on the Rubicon Trail, Baja, and the desert. The 80's vintage Landcruisers are also awesome (once again, especially when equipped with a GM 350). The new ones are a little too pretty, but I'm guessing they will hold up well also. At any rate, those older Landcruisers look like they have held up better today than any Ford or GM similar products of the same vintage. The old SR5 pickups and 4Runners seemed to hold up well, too.
Now that said, the Tacomas do not look like they are holding up well, and the T100s all look like they are falling apart. So it seems Toyota picks and chooses which vehicles they want to build tough for durability. Time will tell with the Tindra. I sure won't be the guinie pig for a vehicle that does not offer nearly as much as the Big 3.
Next, I've heard a lot of bad things about the V-6 engines in the Tacomas and T-100's. I think they are the same engine. I'll probably avoid Toyota this time around because they are way too proud of the Tundra. I would definitely get a V-8 in whatever truck I buy. I also have a '93 Villager and a '98 Monte Carlo. The Villager was in the shop 13 times in it's 35 months, generally for "fit and finish" type of problems. Since then it has been OK. The Monte Carlo has never been back to the dealer. No problems in almost 2 years. I do the routine maintenance myself.
The people I've talked to have loved their Silverado's, so maybe I'll try one when my little pickup dies, or someone in the family needs a vehicle.
Is there any substantial difference between a Silverado and a Sierra? There is a GMC dealer close to my house, but no Chevy dealer close to home. Thanks for the input. I'm amazed that my question got so much response in 1 day.
The Tundra is a full size wanna be. Its interior room/dimensions are not full size. It also compares the lowest V8 engines in Ford/GM/Dodge lineups. Ford/GM/Dodge offer so many more engines, transmission, suspensions, and cabs than Toyota. It will be decades before Toyota comes close. This hype about the Tundra is a joke. Does the Tundra even offer a limited slip yet??
Look around the forums, you'll find forums dedicated to the Sierra/Silverado differences. Essentially, the two trucks are the same, except for finishing touches and package options. I expect that the Sierra's headlights are better, although there is no data supporting this (but since they are bigger, I'm guessing they let out more light with the same wattage). Otherwise, it's a matter of personal prefference on the looks (I personally prefer the less cluttered look of the Sierra front end). Both are great trucks. A little more advice, consider the 3/4-ton.
I bought a new ('87) cherokee on CR's recommendation, but also based on driving one around and comparing it to my brother's blazer. 230,000 hard miles later, I finally had to put in a new engine in my Jeep, although amazingly enough, the clutch did not need replacing.
So where did I go to first research purchase of new 2000 pickup? CR, but then I found Edmund's to have better information, although E's is a bit reluctant to just come out and say "this one sucks!" whereas CR really slams (e.g.) Dodge ram. I appreciate CR's forthrightness; with E's you kind of have to read between lines.
So where was I going with this? Oh yeah, Consistencies/inconsistencies. CR was pushing Toy's way back when (and apparently still are), and CR scored new 2000 GM trucks as poor in reliablity only becasue they are a new redesigned truck and new redesigns are supposedly poor in reliablility, but my experience with a new redesign that CR touted years ago has proven very reliable over the last several years.
You are a rare consumer.
CR is based in New York. They have a perspective of vehicles that is based upon living in New York. When I was a teenager in Brooklyn, I thought that the stupidest thing you could do was to own a car. I mean, like just where the heck do you park it? You didn't have to park the subway or a taxi. It took me a few years to get my head screwed on straight.
Usually, everything in CR is based upon fact. Unfortunately, their perception is warped towards New York. I think that if CR opened a west coast evaluation or test office, their reports on vehicles would be better oriented towards the rest of the 50 states.
As far as the anti GM thing goes, do you remember Ralphie and his infamous book, "Unsafe at Any Speed"? To this day, he still doesn't own a car. Anyway, Ralphie was a member of the board of directors for CR. (Actually CU.)
Don't beat up on CR, they try and the information is factual. Just try to look at the facts from a New Yorker's perspective. Sometimes it applies to the other 49, sometimes it don't.
Rich
But CR is pretty lame about a lot of things. CR comes out and rips the Durango for driving like a truck. Well, that's what it is. It has the power and suspension for doing truck things. Way more so than a Exploder, 4Runner, Pathfinder, Blazer, Montero, Trooper, etc. They also trashed it for the THIRD seat being cramped. Well, at least it has one. Further, if you took out the back seat entirely, it would be way bigger inside than most of the competition. Further, they seem to match up vehicles against others that aren't true comparables.
The Durango is just one example. I think their Customer Satisfaction Rating and Resale Rating are the most meaningful things you can get out of CR.
Why do you say I'm a rare comsumer?
I think a lot of my attitude toward buying a car is based on my bad experience with the '74 Fiat. I had just gotten out of the military then and was pretty broke, but we needed a 2nd car and the Fiat was cheap. Unfortunately, we paid almost as much on repairs in the 2 years we owned it as we paid for it originally. That experience taught me that all cars (or trucks) are not created equal.
Secondly, I hate to have a vehicle that I have to spend a lot of my time fixing and/or constantly taking it to my mechanic.
Finally, vehicles cost so much initially and aren't too cheap to fix, so I try to find one that won't break the bank on repairs. Unfortunately, I can't do much about the initial cost. I grew up driving used cars and I'm sure there are some good ones out there, but I prefer to buy new vehicles and take good care of them. So far that strategy has meant my vehicles have lasted quite a few years.
Anyway, I'd be curious to know why you consider me a rare consumer. Thanks.
Mark
I didn't mean any disrespect. My quote of you being a "rare" consumer is valid. I meant the title as you are a rare breed of consumer today that buys a vehicle and intends to buy based on performace over 13-15 years. Most buyers today do not list that as critera for buying a product. It wasn't a knock and I actually find your actions refreshening. Then again, if it is your basis--you might want a Ford! LOL!! Let's face it, most people don't even consider that length of time since they generally get rid of the car/truck in7-10 years.
Roc
I went to a website that listed owner comments on a wide variety of vehicles. You could pick any model/year combination and read actual owner comments. Generally speaking, there were far more dissatisfied Chevy owners than any other brand.
FYI - I'd love to own a Chevy truck, as I think they offer a lot, in terms of "truck for the money" and features. I'm just scared to death of the design, build and material quality.
I'm not knocking you Doudis, just giving my point of view.
Notice their reliability ratings are not recommendations. It is purely statistical, it's not an opinion.
You don't know of doudis' background do you?
He takes it personally because of his grand-dad and generally hates anything made overseas.
doudis,
Am I right or not? Second off, who cares about CR anyway? Journalists always have a personal agenda and it gets ugly when motor vehicles are involved. Hell, it seems as if every Motorcycle Mag hates my bikes but I always wonder if they test-rode for real or not. I can never seem to find the problems that they write about!! Same thing with car Mags or even this site.
Edmunds: "Chevy has cheap plastics" HUH? Since when does plastic look more expensive on a Ford or Dodge?
"Swoops and swirls on the F-150" Whatever! Most people can tell you that a subjective feature shouldn't be stated along side more serious ones.
later-Roc
this topic is being "frozen". It will be archived or deleted in the next 10 days or so.
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