Owe more than it's worth... I'm upside down and I can't get up!

boomer1b · January 2005

Don't feel bad....My buds new titan is 4 weeks waiting for window parts. Hes still driving it tho...........

I did try and warn him.................

akangl · January 2005

The window parts got there in just 2 weeks, the other parts are still 4 weeks out at least. I brought the truck home today, its running kinda yucky, but seems ok. They said it won't hurt it to drive it. I love the truck and the dealer got a new service manager (again) who is a guy I've known for 8 years and he's a sharp cookie. Hopefully it all works out and the truck chills out. I do enjoy driving it.

explorerx4 · January 2005

hopefully the windows aren't down.

max ac · January 2005

I bought a 2000 LS about 8 months ago and put close to 14k miles on it already. I ended up financing about $17,500 at 7.1% (60 months)which included a 3yr/36k extended warranty (about $2k). I wanted to keep the car for about the 3 yrs of the warranty not anticipating all the miles. I realize the warranty will expire sooner than I had hoped and because of the miles on the car its value is steadily declining. Real world trade-in is about $10k and retail about $12k and the warranty is transferable. My loan payoff is about $16k. My only other debt is a wedding I'm paying off which is why I put so many miles on the car. I can probably gain a couple points on a loan when the weeding is paid down more.

Based on the current and future value of my car, should I get out now or wait?

kyfdx · January 2005

If you can afford the payments (and obviously you can), at least keep it until the warranty expires.. You won't be as far upside down by then..

At that time, reassess things..

boomer1b · January 2005

The window WAS down ! On a Saturday too..Snowing and blowing at -1.

Sooo lucky to have a body tech buddy across the street with a heated garage ! He popped off the door panel and unhooked aka "cobbed" the plastic track junk and lifted the window back into place for now..................

mac24 · January 2005

.........My only other debt is a wedding I'm paying off which is why I put so many miles on the car.......

I'm really curious to know why paying for the wedding is causing you drive so much (are you having to do pizza delivery to help pay off the debt)?

:--)

max ac · January 2005

For a few months leading up to the wedding, I had to pretty much drive to my wife's hometown every weekend, which I wasn't expecting to do.

kyfdx · January 2005

Boy... get ready for a lot more things you didn't expect...

akangl · January 2005

The window is no biggie, just have to remember not to let it get too close to the door or it drops, then its a booger to get back up. They had the truck for 2 weeks and didn't bother to fix it even though they had the parts. Ah well, it'll go back in the end of next month.

Its a good thing I'm BURIED in that truck or I'd be on the hunt.

andyman73 · January 2005

Anyone running a pool for Jolie's next? I will take July 1st, 2005.

akangl · January 2005

Unless Nissan buys my truck back it won't be possible. Its leased and the payoff vs what its worth is about $15k apart or something like that.

Hubby won't part with the Dodge, has had it almost a year and a half. He would sell me first me thinks.......he doesn't even let me drive the truck.

As for Zippy, well, she's just over 6 months old and 21k miles. Excellent car for my daily 165 mile round trip commute to work, don't see her leaving soon either.

andyman73 · January 2005

Actually I am pulling in your favor, for relief from Nissan, and not because of CCBA syndrome.

I hope Nissan does the right thing for you. I wish you the best on this.

akangl · January 2005

Actually I'm hoping that the dealer fixes the truck and we move on. I do really like my Titan and would like to see it to the end of the lease. Although right now its a real good thing I'm buried in it after the past few weeks. I would definatly have a new truck by now otherwise. See?? There is something to be said about being so buried it would take an earthmover to get ya out!!!

andyman73 · January 2005

Well, proper repairs would also be relief, no?

And as far as I know, a little detcord and dynamite go a long way towards unearthing a buried object. Plus makes groovy clouds of dust and noise!

kyfdx · February 2005

July 1st? July 1st??!!

My guess is two.. maybe three more by then.... I'm going for St.Patrick's Day.

regards,

kyfdx

(who would be rich, if Vegas took action on this)

bismarck · February 2005

I am the unfortunate owner of a 2000 Millenia S. Have my eye on a 2004 BMW 330Ci with 7000 miles on it and the CPO warranty -- a car I can see myself driving for several years with arguably stellar resale. Even after putting down about $4,000 on the Bimmer, my fear is that the stealer will say that I am another $2,500 buried in the Mazda.

Does it make sense to go through with the deal as it appears that the BMW is priced about $2-3K below what other dealers are looking for? Like I said, I would keep it for at least 2-3 years...

Thanks!!

andyman73 · February 2005

I was trying to be generous.

She still has to wait for the parts to come in for them to attempt the fix.

I'm stickin to my date. Only time will tell.

mac24 · February 2005

You won't be able to tell until you get a value put on the Mazda. If you get a good price on it, and really do keep the BMW for several years, it's probably a good deal.

akangl · February 2005

LOL, you kill me!! Actually I had no intentions of adding anything else to the stable, but.....

A girl at work is offering me a 96 Sunfire 4 dr for $2500, its a bargain at that price considering the miles on the car. Thinking seriously about adding this to the stable, could use another run around. Not getting rid of anyone mind you, just adding.

kyfdx · February 2005

Time will tell.....lol

Looks like about an hour and a half...

andyman73 · February 2005

Doggone! There goes my pick.

driftracer · February 2005

Yeah, that's what a family with two drivers needs - FOUR vehicles...

akangl · February 2005

We have 2 gas hogs and live 100 miles from town. We have to share the Focus (which I'm not willing) when it comes to trips into town. I drive 5 days/week 165 miles/day. We could use another little car.

The Dodge is business only and the Titan, well, its a toy, hate to say it, but its the truth. Its our "tow the camper" vehicle.

I wouldn't mind having another small car, especially a cheap one.

manamal · February 2005

Valentines day., followed by saint pattys day, followed by April Fools day followed by Cinco de May

eharri3 · February 2005

How long you would have to hold onto that little car before the amount of money saved in the difference between fueling one of the hogs or fueling the newly purchased little car exceeds the initial purchase price of the little car?(does that even make any sense???)

Say you got the little car that's gonna cost 1200 bucks to gas up for a year. Big truck costs 2000. So that's an 800 dollar difference. You spend 2500 dollars to buy the small used car. You gotta go something like 3.1 years before the amount of money saved on gas vs. driving the hog puts you ahead financially over just driving one of the heavier vehicles back and fourth to town.

Add in the fact that you live in an environment that's rough on vehicles so maintenance costs will be high but the car will probably still die sooner than it would in a warmer climate. Obviously my numbers were just hypothetical because I don't know enough about your situation to calculate more exactly. But it might not be a bad idea for you to give it a try.

cadillacmike · February 2005

That's what we have, so what of it?

It allows us to "spread the wealth, i.e., miles, over more cars, insurance costs drop with car #3 and on, and allows us to have different cars for different situations, Formal outings (the Fleetwood), beach party, (the DeVille), everyday driving, (CTS and Eldorado). Also the Fleetwood doubles as the boat tow vehicle.

Two of those are convertibles, for more flexibility!

Isn't America great?

akangl · February 2005

Considering I drive 165 miles/day (5 days/week) round trip to work and we live 100 miles from the grocery store........you do the math.

driftracer · February 2005

I was giving Jolie a hard time - wasn't directed at anyone but her.

akangl · February 2005

Imagine that.........drift giving ME a hard time......like that's never happened before. LOL

mazda04rx8 · February 2005

I have found an excellent way to find out when you are no longer upside down. Is to take the residual on the vehicle and reduce it by 10% for example 20k car 50% residual for three years. Value of car after on paper 10k at the end of three years. Now reduce it by 10% or 1,000 dollars. Value of car after 3 years equals 9000.

Run a loan amortization table and take a look when your loan balance hits 9k. If you hit 9k at 3 years or less you are plus. If after 3 years you are upside down. Of course there are many variables but this will give you a good idea.

boomer1b · February 2005

Post again.........Terry said his or Edmunds goodies crashed the other day and he lost a bunch of posts. I couldn't get on the forums that day either. I DID see your post tho.............

isellhondas · February 2005

One hundred and sixty five miles a day!!!

That HAS to be a record!

akangl · February 2005

Yeah, I'm growing to hate it, another year or so and we should be able to move closer.

My Focus is just over 6 mos old and has 22k on it, poor little bugger will be well out of warranty by its first b-day.

driftracer · February 2005

When I first took this job, I was commuting 155 each way, 310 a day, for 2 months until my kids got out of school for the summer - that sucked...

ex v6 · February 2005

Hi, I am going to get a pre approved loan from a bank but the manufacturer is offering a lower interest rate. Does applying at the bank reduce my credit score? My expperian score is 755 and i don't want it to go down when i apply for loan with manufacturer. Any suggestions? Thanks

rroyce10 · February 2005

....... Obviously I don't know your situation, but a 755 is a great score, but a great score doesn't guarantee anything ... a working college student with a 1 year old Burdines charge card can have a 755 score nowadays .. I would check with my own back first, then if you can get a better rate at the dealer, then grab it .....

Terry.

sandymess · February 2005

I have a 2000 Mitsubishi Montero Sport with just under 60,000 miles on it. So the warranty is about to expire and the manufacturer recommends about $1500 worth of service on it after it does expire. We bought it used 2 1/2 years ago and financed for 60 months. I know this wasn't a great idea but we were in a bind.

Anyway, the payoff amount today would be $8315. and the car is valued between $6100 and $7500. This vehicle is the nicest car I've ever owned but I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to trade it in for something better on gas, and better in the snow. I'm thinking that I should really have an AWD or 4WD for the area I live in...lots of snow! And I've gotten stuck in it so many times!! We still have just over 2 1/2 years left to pay on the Mits...should we keep it? Or trade it in for a more sensible car? Our payments are $283 and we can't afford more than that.

ghulet · February 2005

....sounds like you're not looking forward to the $1500 service, which is understanable, but getting another vehicle to avoid the service isn't so wise, IMO. You're pretty much in a 'pay now or pay later' situation; if you trade the Mitsu, you're going to have to either come up with the difference between the payoff and the trade-in value ($8315 minus that, so ~$800-2200) or finance it with the new vehicle. It doesn't seem too likely you'll be able to find a newer vehicle with AWD or 4WD and still have a $283 payment unless you finance it for about ten years. If it's been reliable, I'd probably just keep it, given your situation.

driftracer · February 2005

perspective...

Having been a dealership service manager, I know unneeded items may end up on the menu for the sake of profit.

Before you make any decision based on a large repair bill, take your owner's manual and discuss with the manager of a reputable private shop just exactly what NEEDS to be done. Instead of the turn signal fluid flush and repacking the muffler bearings, you may only need a transmission service and a tune up, if that - have them give your Mitsubishi the once-over and figure out what's going on -

If that alleged $1500 repair bill suddenly turns into a $200 estimate, I'd think it would change your whole outlook on trading the vehicle. The Montero Sport is a nice truck, you have low mileage, and it seems like you like it - why trade unless the thing is getting ready to crater, only to carry negative equity into another loan?

Kirstie_H · February 2005

To add to what driftracer recommended, there's a difference between "recommended" and necessary. If you can find an itemized list of what's been recommended and post it in one of our Maintenance & Repair topics, like Maintenance & Repair Costs, some of our members who have expertise in this area can tell you what you really need and what you should expect to pay.

cadillacmike · February 2005

" Instead of the turn signal fluid flush and repacking the muffler bearings,"

That's wild. But I would highly recommend exactly what driftracer is saying, find out what it REALLY NEEDS, and get costs on that.

60,000 mles, you're probably going to need a new timing belt, that'l bump up the cost (unless you have a timing chain). Air filter (should be self installable), spark plugs (unless platinum plugs- not likely on a mitsibitshi), transmission service (no "full flush" needed, just drop pan, change / clean filter, reinstall), and your good ole LOF. Anything else, is as valuable as the items that driftracer mentioned in his post.

driftracer · February 2005

so $200-300 is a good range, unless there's something really wrong with the truck.

ghulet · March 2005

...I didn't even think of that. My mantra about dealers (sorry to any of you I offend) is that once the vehicle is out of warranty, it doesn't go back. Dealers make most of their money in their service department, obviously for a reason. When my brother's Blazer was getting fixed at the dealer, I scarcely remember a time it didn't cost $6-8-1000. Having it checked out and shopping around a bit on the service can save a bundle.

isellhondas · March 2005

The mass merchant or small independant can't figure out a complex problem or it's a miserable job they just don't want to do.

A lot of great independants out there to be sure but they sometimes lack the experience and equipment to fix a sticky problem.

lancerfixer · March 2005

Unfortunately, modern cars just out of warranty usually still need a dealer's specialized diagnostic tools to fix. One of the two indy Euro mechanics ('my' Volvo guy) recently packed up and closed up shop. Why? He no longer could afford the software, etc to support modern European cars. The deal breakers, he told me, were a 2000 S80 and a newer (can't remember the year) S Class Benz, both of which he was flat out unable to fix. He couldn't make the investment in equipment for each make he supported (which was pretty much every Euro brand, plus Lexus) to make it work.
Last I'd heard, he became the lead tech at the local Nissan/Subaru joint.

There's now one indy Euro place left here in Cedar Rapids, and frankly their rates are no better than the local Volvo dealer. I'll be taking the S70 to the dealer from now on.

ghulet · March 2005

...so I guess that applies to pricey European cars, but usually if you can afford an S-class or Volvo S80, taking it to a dealer is not an issue, financially. I do remember it being next to impossible to find someone to effectively (i.e., the first time) fix my old SAABs. The one guy on the north side of Chicago who basically has a monopoly on fixing them is such a creepy, miserable [non-permissible content removed] that I vowed I'd never give him another dime. So I'm never owning an old SAAB again.

Still, I find it hard to believe it will ever be prohibitive for indy shops to fix something like my brother's '96 Blazer, or something like a Corolla or Taurus.

scoutyjones · March 2005

Do to job changes in the last 2-3years for my family. We are now in an extremely sound financial picture. I am at a crossroads as to the following:
Paying off a 2000 fully loaded Eddie Bauer Expedition that we bought used...owe $16,000. It has 58,000 miles and is in good-great condition...new tires ,windshield, brakes, synthetic oil maintenance every 4,000 miles.

My new job will not allow me to drive a 5 year old vehicle so I need to either, go upside down on a new Expedition (love sitting tall (Napolean complex), safety and need of 4 WD, and work pays for gas and gives a generous allowance to compensate for potential increase in car payment):
or
drive wifes beloved 2003 Legacy wagon and give her the EB...

I believe I know the answer but I can "justify" new vehicle due to compensation from vehicle allowance and "uncomfortable driving experience" for long miles I will be driving with new job...

Advice...

danf1 · March 2005

If you have the money to pay it off then you aren't upside down. You owe 16k. It may be worth 8k. If you pay the difference on a new deal it would be the same as paying it off and then trading. Hop over to Chronic Car Buyers Annonymous for some advice on what to buy.

cadillacmike · March 2005

Your job won't allow you to drive a 5 year old vehicle?????

How about a 9 year old vehicle!

Owe more than it's worth... I'm upside down and I can't get up!

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