Power Stroke or Cummins?

cardpunkcardpunk Member Posts: 1
in General
which engine is considered better quality? The Ram
Cummins or the F-series power stroke? or the F-250
V10 vs. Ram 3500 Turbo diesel?
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Comments

  • maplemaple Member Posts: 16
    I have owned a powerstroke and a chevy diesel, but I visited with a friend of mine today who put 410,000 on his 93 model, 3/4 ton regular cab and still has it. Most highway miles, but a lot of heavy duty stuff. He just bought another but 4X4 and ex-cab and will keep it forever. Let Ford beat that. Make sure to get a dealer who will trade, other wise there will be a real price difference.
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    410,000 miles? Hmmmmm..........
  • bob259bob259 Member Posts: 280
    No choice here, Dodge's are throw aways.... buy the Power Stroke. It has a much better rating and who would want to be seen in a Dodge.. just kidding!!!

    The Power stroke is an under rated motor and has great reliability. I know several people who have had both and tow large boats and they all switched to the Ford Power Stroke and say it is a much better motor with better fuel mileage.
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    I am new to diesels, but I am a ford man, and from what I understand the powerstroke has more power and I know I have been getting 20+mpg, I don't think the dodge can beat that. Reliability?I think either engine properly maintained and driven should and would go a million miles plus.I only have 2275 miles on my new f250, but that is my .02 cents worth.
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    410,000 miles?? I sigh again.......Hmmmmmm.....


    I don't know..........



    410,000 miles?? Hmmmm.....
  • bmckenziebmckenzie Member Posts: 118
    It is common to see a Cummins, Cat, Navistar, and Detroit engines with 410,000+ and if your are a Ford person then you should know that Ford offers Cummins in their medium and heavy duty trucks i.e. F800 33,000 GVW Dump Trucks w/215 HP Cummins (lower rated then my Ram), and being a Ford person you should know that the Powerstroke is an International Navistar engine. If you buy a diesel thats great, but when you talk diesels do your research and talk from personal experience not second hand knowledge. I am a Equipment Operator and do some over the road by trade, my choice is the Cat, but no one sells a Cat in a pickup, so Cummins is my next choice. I have two International 15 ton 6x6 Stake Trucks at work that require far more maintenance then any Cat or Cummins I have ever operated, don't get me wrong Navistar is a good engine but not my preference from experience............Bill
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    Who are you talking to?
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    I was wondering that one as well. We're not talking HD engines here are we? I thought this forum was debating pickup diesels, eh? And since we are talking about pickups, I ponder a number......410,000....Hmmmm....and we are NOT talking Kenworths, Freightliners, Peterbuilts, Western Star, etc............Hmmmmm....410,000.....in a Dodge......hmmmm.
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    The powerstroke or cummins should easily go 410,000 mi even a million + as I said. The key is properly maintaining and operating them. both of these engines are pretty darn close to being heavy duty, big truck engines. My Dad was a diesel mechanic and made it clear to me the importance of maintaining and operating a diesel properly. Really a gas engine maintained properly should and would go 410,000 mi
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    in my mind of a Dodge(Ok I'll admit it could be a Ford or Chevy, can't tell) With 410,000 miles on it. I see 4 wheels and a diesel engine, I have a clear view of the driver through the non existent door sitting on a milk crate steering with vice grips. There's more but the diesel is running strong though.
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    Must be a GM owner.
  • bmckenziebmckenzie Member Posts: 118
    Rocles,
    All Diesels are made for, as you say HD use, get a clue!!! because the 5.9 Cummins is offered in more then just Dodge pickups, it is offered in Medium Duty applications and construction equipment i.e. Rough Terrain 4x4 Forklifts with telescopic booms. I was speaking to the audience at this Forum, I guess you do not know what Hot Shots drivers are, pickups, long distance, HIGH miles, Hmmmmm...clueless.......
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    bmckenzie

    I've been in the oilfield industry, so i've seen all the heavy duty truck applications, pipe haulers, hot shot drivers, ton and a half tool body trucks, welding trucks. I've seen them all get many miles, and i've worked on every diesel engine froma 100 hp Detroit Dieselt to 2000 hp Caterpillar and Cummins, so please don't call me clueless.

    I've seen diesels in the high mile, heavy load applications, and they are the best for the duty. I've never seen a Cummins with high miles, because hardly anyone in that industry uses them, mostly powerstrokes.

    Piston rings, and rod and main bearings can make 400,000 miles, the materials we have today are SO much better than 10 years ago. But cams, injectors and fuel pumps are high wear items. Fuel pumps are usually the first to go, and 100-150K is about all they make. injectors are usually the next.

    The core of the engine can last that long, but theres got to be some parts replaced. And as far as the rest of the truck, i would love to see it after 400K.
  • quadrunner500quadrunner500 Member Posts: 2,721
    The Navistar:
    Faster acceleration
    More noise, raucous note
    Needs catalytic converter

    The Cummins:
    Better fuel economy
    Mellow exhaust note
    Needs no cat

    Both are big, big sellers. 100k warranty is on engine only. Diesel engine repairs are very expensive.

    Buy if you need it to haul your load, but if you are expecting a payback on fuel saved over a gas engine, one fuel injector, or pump, if required will eat up all your savings, pronto.
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    I am not sure who some of you are aiming your remarks to. My point is if a truck or car is taken care of and maintained they will go these kind of miles. Sure components will have to be replaced but the core of the vehicle will give you long long service.Anyone that does not agree with this does not even understand the basics of maintanance. When I was a aircraft mechanic in the USAF 16 years ago, the KC135A tankers I worked on were 25+ years old, those planes are still flying today. The key to that kind of life of a machine is the maintanace and fallowing it to the letter and also the way it is operated. I have a 1984 thunderbird I bought new in 84,I have almost 200,000 mi on it, all I have done to this car other than regular maintanance is put a water pump on it! This car still even has the original front brakes! I just replaced the back ones not long ago. The engine does not smoke at all. Runs great.
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    Sorry about the spelling errors.
  • bmckenziebmckenzie Member Posts: 118
    Corey,
    Unless you have two Forum names, alias Rocles as I directed my #12 post to, then you need to back off, I never called you clueless. If would like to debate Diesels then jump in, I have been in the Heavy Equipment buisness for 19+ years, and you?
    I think you should understand what a Heavy Duty truck application is, it is not 1 1/2 ton tool bodies, welding truck or Hot Shot truck, those are considered light duty applications (under 26,000 GVWR) no truck scales needed. Just because people in your industry do not use Cummins trucks, does not mean the rest of the world is doing the same, there are more professions then Oil, and there are more 5.9 Cummins applications then just 3/4 and 1 ton Dodge pickups, you should know that if you work on all those different diesels. You are right I would like to see some pickups after 400,000 miles, they probably would not be worth squat, but I know from experience 400,000 on a Cummins engine is not unreasonable, just because Cummins puts a 5.9 in a pickup, does mean the engine materials, design, and durability are any less then an 80,0000 GVWR Tractor. Sorry if I offended you in some way, but we all have our own experiences, and preferences in vehicles which we choose to purchase and drive.........Bill
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    Hey cdean,

    Back off!! bmckenzie called me clueless!! Stop trying to garner my deserved ignorance! LOL!


    bmckenzie,

    Feeling bitter today? I do understand and acknowledge that Few (RARE) vehicles have reached 400,000 miles. I wasn't attacking your beloved Cummins engine-rather questioning that a one-ton Dodge (of all brands-DOdge) that has been used can achieve such mileage. These type of "facts" are hard to prove over the internet which is plagued by embellishments.

    Oh thanks for the inclusion of applications that the mighty 5.9 is used for. Without your great big HD experience--I am clueless!

    During your next lesson--can you tell me what the term: Single screw and double screw mean? Your SO informative for my clueless life! Golly! Telescopic forklifts?? Gee willikers!!!

    Hmmmm...someone is getting a little flustered....
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    tracyo,

    200,000 miles on the original brakes from a 84?

    Where do you live? It might be relevant to your extraordinary situation.




    (Hey Billy, No "hmmmm" here. OK? Don't get nutty about brakes and referring to some forklift used in the Amazon at night under a full moon with a Macall sleeping!)
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    I agree the dodge 2500 with 400,000 mi owned by a know it all heavy equiptment operator probably would not be worth squat.
    My Ford f250 powerstroke will still be going strong though.
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    It has been a combination hiway/city driving.I just take very good care of my vehicles even in the way I drive them. If you could see my bird and it's condition I think it would prove the point I have been trying to make.
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    Your military analogy is poor only in that during those x amount of years those jets have been in service they've had countless engine changes, NDI inspections, TCTO's and an UNLIMITED maintenance budget. Only my opinion, but a vehicle with 400,000 miles on it I don't even want to guess what has been replaced even if it had the original internally lubricated parts.
  • tracyotracyo Member Posts: 72
    My point has been, with regular maintenance,inspections and component replacement when needed, this kind of long service can be had.My analogy fits here,none of what you point out is news to me as I was a part of it for four years. I won't beat a dead horse any more, you keep your infinite knowledge and believe what you will. I will just keep taking care of my fords and get long life from them.
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    My infinite knowledge is no more or less than yours. I spent four years working on F-4's and my only point was the military changes things when they are running fine just because of the hours. Please don't tell me you do that on your cars. Let's see, tranny has 100,000 miles let's remove it for depot maintenance. I'm sorry if I got your panties in a wad. My only point was even the people that claim 100's of thousands of miles on their Toyotas say the bodies are rusted beyond recognition. People on these posts state injectors at $3000 on the Ford is common after 100,000 miles. Many G.M and Dodge complaints with normal wear. My question is why bother. With regular component replacement and normal wear and tear so what if you have a 400,000 or million mile truck I don't want it and it certainly isn't worth anything unlike a multi million dollar aircraft. Like I said, stupid analogy.
  • cheapownercheapowner Member Posts: 47
    I think automakers' strategy of leaving room for improvement is good for stock market but not for consumers. I can't see why when Ford redesign SD pickup in 1999 especially F-450 and F-550 they didn't use maxium rating version of Navistar 444. It sure will be cheaper in the long run for development and keep us from spending money to stay ahead in the power game or just to keep up with the Jones.
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Member Posts: 535
    With the price of diesel here in Massachusetts over 2.30 per gallon it's to expensive to run either of these engines. big cube gas engines rule now .....unleaded is 1.35 per gallon
  • BrutusBrutus Member Posts: 1,113
    It depends on where you live as to the price of diesel. Up here in Anchorage, the price of diesel is $.03 per gallon more than 87 octane. I think the northeast is the place with the high diesel rates. I heard it has something to do with heating oil costs. Don't know if it's true. Most everything in Anchorage is heated via natural gas.
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Member Posts: 535
    Heating oil is over 2.20 per gallon
  • bat123bat123 Member Posts: 4
    Yesterday 16 Feb I called Daimler Chrysler to determine the order status of 2001 2500 Quad Cab 4X with Cummins. Talked with Dan Bogojevski. Never had the extreme displeasure of speaking to an illiterate, abusive, arrogant, and indifferent troglodyte. He deleted my order placed 24 Jan. How does a person doing phone support refuse access to management support / intervention. These DC customer assistance folks are arrogant to new extremes. According to Dan Bogojevski I have one option only - Reorder. With wait times exceeding 60 days and now having a little insight into DC customer care, reordering has little appeal. There are many vehicles available perfectly adequate to meet our needs At least GM and Ford have alternative venues in place to prevent one employee from taking such extreme measures. Any suggestions would be very much appreciated. Thank You. Bruce - bat123@qnet.com
  • rs_pettyrs_petty Member Posts: 423
    I'd buy your next choice which is probably a F250 w/PS and send a picture and thank you note (you know, something like "Thanks for cancelling my order...)to the DC dealer and corporate office. I'll bet that if the dealer gets wind of this that Dan will be on the hotseat.
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    rs petty,

    That's good and effective. No screaming or hollering! I like it.
  • miked555miked555 Member Posts: 27
    Go to www.dieselhp.com then to tec tips check out what they have to say about Cummins then what they have to say about Power stroke. They have nothing to gain they work on both. Not speaking engine, I owned nothing but fords and the trouble I had with them you couldn't give me one again. I'm not saying I might not have the same trouble with DC, but I'm going to give them a try. If DC does'nt work out next will be GMC and so on. Till I get to Yomagochie. Then I'll bye a back pack. If you had good luck with something stay with it if not it's time for a change.
    My Ford gas burner got 8 to 10 mpg so even with the price increase thats starting to go down, and gas is starting to go up I'll do better with the Diesel.
    Mike waiting for my 2001 Dodge 3500 4X4 Cummins
  • mharde2mharde2 Member Posts: 278
    In North Texas the price for diesel is running $1.38/$1.45 Reg unleaded $1.50/$1.62. I hope to see them both go back down in the future. They say that that won't happen until the Fall though.
    I think its crazy to push up the price of diesel fuel. That is inflationary in that it is used in almost all modes of commerce including trucks trains jets heavy equipment ect. That affects the price of everything.....
  • quinlanquinlan Member Posts: 1
    If you think that Ford is better you are wrong. I cannot even get a Ford person to talk with me about my problem with a new Power Stroke. I am about as upset as you. What can either of us do?
  • myers8myers8 Member Posts: 3
    The fuel prices are scaring me. I'm in the market to buy a F250 SD diesel and the fuel prices are still high. In Rhode Island $1.85 for diesel and $1.65 for 89 octane. My fear is that I sell my SUV making 22mpg and climb into a Ford and pay dearly at the pump. I have a trailer to tow and my SUV is very sluggish.
  • fatsofatso Member Posts: 2
    Don't know exactly what problem you're having with your powerjoke, but if it is lack of boost, contact Mr. Woodhouse at woodhouse.com. He is the owner of a Dodge/Ford dealership in Neb. and has a turbo fix to get boost up to max. The average dealer is not going to listen to you if the scan shows your engine within specs. Mr. Woodhouse is a power guru and is always experimenting on jackup stuff for both cummins and powerjoke. He has a propane assisted cummins at 389hp on the dyno.

    He would probably explain the fix maybe even sell you the part etc, as it is a waistgate fix.

    I dumped my 2000 joke and got a 2001 cummins HO dodge. I am happy again. My powerjoke had 16 lbs boost. The cummins is rated for 26lbs max and this one feels like it has most of it.

    Good luck,

    Fatso
  • rangerknowhowrangerknowhow Member Posts: 25
    well humm.........i choose ford...cummins is better but i dont like the tranny behind it.
  • khitch710khitch710 Member Posts: 6
    I have a 99 super duty crewcab with the power stroke and it doesn't have a cat.....My 95 did but this new one is without .....Love the Fords....
  • davidd1davidd1 Member Posts: 9
    I don't understand why so many folks don't believe that the Dodge Cummins combo won't survive for high mileage.

    Here from my two latest issues of the TDR.
    They don't list year of truck but have pictures. Owners must present a picture of the truck and Odometer for credit of mileage.

    New body style:
    300K - 378k 1 ton Boca Raton FL
    200k - Westwood NJ
    233k - 1 ton - Danridge TN

    Old Body Style:
    302k - 3/4 ton - Lake City FL
    214k - 3/4 ton - Peralta NM

    These are just a few of the long running trucks.

    David
  • robert1972robert1972 Member Posts: 51
    Go with the cummins, I had a 97 p.stroke at 40K the eng went, bought a dodge with the cummins (97) it now has 188K and still pulls strong.

    Also see too many topics on the p.stroke w/ problems and not one on the cummins.

    I think the ford is a better truck overall, it's too bad they didn't keep the rights to cummins, that would have ben a great truck. Dont get me wrong, I like my dodge, but it's the cummins that I stick with, God forbid they put the cummins in the tundra, I guess I would be driving one of thoes (with a bag over my head but I guess I would)

    Good luck
    R.....
  • rrichfrrichf Member Posts: 211
    Humm, 188,000 miles since sometime in '97. That's about 60,000 miles a year. Humm, about 1200 miles a week and 50 MPH is 24 hours of freeway driving a week. That's a lot of time behind the wheel. When do you find the time to use the Internet?
  • robert1972robert1972 Member Posts: 51
    Hey genious,
    when I go to florida from where I live, round trip is about 5000 miles, it takes me 6 days do do that. You figure it out from there.
  • rrichfrrichf Member Posts: 211
    When I drive to Daytona Beach from where I live it's 2584 miles one way. It takes 3 days one way. And that's almost 5200 miles round trip. Doing that just 12 times a year is still a lot of driving.

    a.k.a. Albert
  • robert1972robert1972 Member Posts: 51
    Exactly,
    Now you know why my truck has so many miles, and why I still have time to go on the net and B.S. with all my fellow truck nuts.
  • meredithmeredith Member Posts: 575
    "Truck Nuts...."

    izzat anything like "beer nuts?" Or "You might be a Redneck if....?"

    Inquiring minds want to know?....

    Front Porch Philosopher
    SUV, Pickups, & Aftermarket and Accessories Host
  • robert1972robert1972 Member Posts: 51
    Y'all Know what im talking bout.
  • 81chevy81chevy Member Posts: 37
    Yes, I'm a certified one

    "Where and Truck or V8 sound will turn your head, and you can tell what engine it has in it by Sound"

    lol

    This doesn't include cars with beds, such as Toyotas
  • cleev1cleev1 Member Posts: 1
    I have a 1998 Dodge 3500 with the 24valve Cummins Turbo-diesel. I heard you can get a large increase in torque and HP from this engine. Is this true?

    GMontgomery
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    Try Gale Banks in California. If you have an Automatic I'd be wary of any more power. I know in '99 Dodge diesels were "de-tuned" from the factory when equipped with an auto.
  • robert1972robert1972 Member Posts: 51
    Another great company is tstproducts.com they have every thing you need, for your 24v or 12v, and if you have any questions they are very helpfull.

    R.....
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