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Tundra or a Dodge Ram
I am planning on purchasing a new truck within the
next month. I have been looking at the Tundras and
dodges mainly. Don't care much for Ford or
Chevy's models. I am fairly confident in Toyotas
quality, dodge seems to have improved theirs. I
have read several of the posts, but I am justing
looking for some more info about the trucks from
current/past owners.
Thanks for info
Jarod
next month. I have been looking at the Tundras and
dodges mainly. Don't care much for Ford or
Chevy's models. I am fairly confident in Toyotas
quality, dodge seems to have improved theirs. I
have read several of the posts, but I am justing
looking for some more info about the trucks from
current/past owners.
Thanks for info
Jarod
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This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Almost 21K on the odo and not one problem. I don't have any beaf with Toyota trucks and I'm not going to feed you the line about Tundra's not being real trucks. From my prespective, here's what I think the Dodge's advantages are (assuming you're looking at the Ram 1500 and not the heavier models):
1. Cab design: Dodge erogomics are impeccible. The highlight of the interior is the huge center console The cab is much larger than the Tunrda's. In my reg. cab, I can sit three across the bench in perfect comfort and have sat four in a pinch. I'm not sure you could that in a Tundra. Also lots of headroom, which was really important to me.
2. Proven Engines: Dodge's engines are the oldest designs on the market. On the one hand, they don't have the high-tech gee-whiz of Toyota's 4.7L V8. But on the other, the 318 and 360 V8's have been reliable and proven truck engines for a long, long time. From what I've read, the Toyota is higher-revving and is better for cruising around, but the Dodges have more low-end torque because of their greater displacement and will be better for towing or hauling. Another possible advantage of the Dodge V8's is that you can get them with a stick shifter, if you like. Tundra's V8 only comes with an auto.
3. Solid Front Axle: Ram 4x4's are the only 1/2 ton trucks that still have solid front axles. I prefer the solid axle because it provides more suspension travel for off-roading and is generally more sturdy than IFS setups. Also, I've heard the solid axles are easier to install lifts on, if you're thinking of that.
4. Price: The Ram starts out with a lower base price than the Tundra, plus it has all kinds of incentives that Tundra doesn't have. Not to mention that Tundra is still a hot item and dealers aren't going to be likely to give you a good deal. I got my Ram for invoice with no hassle. Current model Ram's also hold their value exceedingly well; better than any other full size truck the last time I checked.
5. Selection: Tundra comes in two models-ext. cab with a short bed or a reg. cab with a long bed. With the Ram you can get whatever combination of cabs and beds you want, including whether you want suicide doors on your ext. cab or not.
Consider an extended service contract with either truck.Don't assume there is any difference in reliability of the trucks because the Tundra is a Toyota.I don't feel there is anything to the Toyota super reliability myth,but regardless of your beliefs just be aware that the Tundra is a new design and therefore untested over time.
That being said I personally believe the Tundra will be as reliable as any truck,no truck manufacturer comes to market without extensive research.So it boils down to,which one do you like the best.
One major factor for me was the size of the cab. I am 6'-5" tall and had to lay down in the Tundra to fit in. Getting in the back door was out of the question. BTW, my Ram was also built in Mexico. If you read any of the boards here, most will say Mexican made Rams are of equal quality to those built in the States. That Mexican-Ram-Slam has no basis whatsoever.
Drive them all and pick the one you like the most.
If you like the peterbuilt look styling, get the Dodge.
If you like get a dually, or a crew cab, get the Dodge.
If you like to get those Dodge incentives which could be cash back or a nice low interest rate, get the Dodge. However, this could be relative, you would have to compare like models and equipment.
Otherwise get the Tundra.
Bud_light _dude, not being a mechanic hardly disqualifies someone for having an opinion. Your holier than thou attitude is showing.
Moparmad, Chrysler almost did go bankrupt and was rescued by the US government with bailouts many years ago. Since then, they have been dead last in the race. Daimler bought the company to make some big money on the backs of Americans. It remains to be seen if product quality improves as a result. In the meantime, the Dodge Ram is big, ponderous and uses far too much fuel. It severely needs a facelift as well. Don't just take my word though, just look at the many posts on the subject and you will quickly get a clear picture of the situation. By the way, Ford is the one making huge sums of money these days, not GM and certainly not Daimler-Chrysler.
I, too, have noticed less than stellar fuel economy. I think get around 15 mpg in mixed driving, the last time I checked. But, it's a truck, so I didn't expect big numbers. With the 26 gallon tank, I'm not having to fill up every day or anything. Besides, I don't think the Tundra does much better with either the V6 or the V8, despite all its Star Trek, DOHC, fly-by-wire techno jazz.
I find it amusing how the Dodge guys here have said they have had good luck with thier trucks and point out some of the trucks good qualities,while the Toymota guys jump in bashing on the Dodges and spewing unproven reterict about how superior Toymota quality is.So how about telling us about your good experiences,and the good qualities one can expect when buying a Toymota.
I simply stated that the Tundra is a new model and as yet untested by time,how can you argue that,it is a fact.
Apparently this guy who started this topic has already done his homework and just wants to know about our personal experiences with each product.
On that note I will say this...
So far I have not had any trouble with my 96 Dodge Ram.I don't know how you get more reliable than that.I get 16 mpg with the 360,it doesn't seem to matter where I drive this number will not vary more than a mpg.If you are used to driving a car then this fuel mileage will bother you,if you like me have driven trucks all your life then you will realize that this isn't bad mileage for a large small block.
The best add on device I have had installed is the remote start,love it in the winter.
Most of my friends and people I have worked with(over a hundred different a year)have remarked on how good my truck looks,it will still turn heads with its old,outdated styling.
I will repeat,it is a big descision,and you probably won't go wrong with either truck.So buy the one you like best,and don't worry about what others say.
I think most of us here agree with you. I don't claim any kind of GM truck superiority due to my owning one. I bought the GM because it had features I liked better than the others at the time I purchased. No other reason. I have heard many a "story" about all the truck makes, but I take it all with a grain of salt. ALL these trucks are built with very close to the same quality control.
I also agree that with any truck you buy, you will take the same risks of repair bills. It is a machine that WILL break eventually. THEY ALL DO!
I am not a huge fan of Chrysler vehicles, just because I perceive the company to be more dishonest then most and I perceive the quality to not be as good as the others. Again I had a Dakota and I have no real complaints, I am really going more on the general consensus of people I know with Chrysler products. I am not flaming anybody's decision here. I just wanted to clarify that even though I am not a DC,Dodge,Plymouth kinda guy, I do think they make the best looking cars and trucks on the market. I can see the RAM and Dakota mini RAM styling being classic in 15 or 20 years. Kinda like old Chevy Cameo's etc. The Viper is another of Dodge's violent works of art. The car itself does not suit my tastes for how it does its job and I would not own one, would that I could, but there is no denying it's appearence. I could do without that Neon and those damn mini vans though. I swear I will drive a mini van when they pry the truck or car steering wheel from my cold dead hands. Again just a personal bias.
There is no doubt that DC has some great looking vehicles. However, the long list of problem areas, from trannys to fit and finish, are a serious concern. When DC gets these things corrected, perhaps I might take another look.
When I spend mega dollars of my hard earned money on a vehicle, I expect a lot. Owning three Toyota's has proven to me that they deliver great reliability and quality. That is the bottom line.
As far as some posts intentionally misspelling toyota or tundra; some may be giving an intentional dig but I believe that most are just funnin' with you.
Thank goodness uncle sam saved them, because they have good quality now, and they have driven the competition race in the US.
Although I agree to not take Consumer's Report as Bible, I disagree with dismissing it totally. Consumer Reports only reports the reliablity of vehicles, and really aren't into the "car-like" features, like someone said. If they do, i didn't read it. Consumer Reports compiles customer surveys. I have filled out one twice. they ask questions about your vehicle about every area: electronics, AC/heat, engine, transmission ,brakes, paint, interior quality, interior integrity, and a few more. You rate your year and model vehicle in each of these areas and list the specific problems/or no problems that you had with it.
Now I don't know how many people are actually surveyed, but I found Consumer Reports ratings of past vehicles (early to mid 90's) as very accurate. Problem areas with Dodges were transmissions, brakes, and electronics. Those were all areas that I saw lots of problems in with Dodges used in the drilling business of S. TExas. They were also accurate with GM and Ford problems of the time. GM had great trannies, but troubles with brakes and some paint probs. Ford and brake, paint, and electronic troubles. All accurate with my experience in work vehicles.
MSN Carpoint is another good source. They also have a consumer survey. They do no testing ONLY consumer survey. They had remarkably similar results as Consumer Reports.
So I would take the reports to heart, but as Moparman said, personal experiences are just as important.
Unfortunately, I haven't remotely had as much luck with Dodges as Moparman has...
16 mpg is excellent mileage for a Dodge, around here at least. maybe its the fuel and climate. A close friend of mine drives a '96 ex-cab, with the 360 and 3.54 rear end. He drives slower than a 95 yr old lady, and he has never gotten more than 14 mpg. But he does love his truck, and hasn't had any major probs. What rear end do you have in your truck?
I also find the insurance bureau safety information valuable. The Dodge Dakota for example, is lowest in the safety ratings and the Toyota Tacoma is the highest in that catagory. See for yourself at http://www.hwysafety.org/
Got to disagree with you on the safety aspect. Didn't study the link you posted too closely, but I did see that Tacoma safety was average compared to other small pickups.
Overall safety can also be misleading - have a look at the US government's highway safety site - www.nhtsa.gov
I haven't reviewed it lately but I believe Tacoma beats Dakota in frontal impact, but Tacoma definitely loses in side impact - it is generally acknowledged to be absolutely horrendous. Incidentally Tundra front impact is there - slightly better than average I believe, and side impact is due this month.
Of course there is the whole question of whether Tacoma and Dakota are in competition with one another anyway.
I am currently researching a buy a new truck and while quality of the American name plates has clearly improved, they still are not at the level of most of the Japanese vehicles. The gap is closing though. The more that there is competition from the [non-permissible content removed] nameplates, the less the gap will be. History showed us that several decades ago with cars.
Ragarding safety, the vast majority of vehicle accidents involve the front of the vehicle and if look at the reports form the insurance bureau, the Dakota is clearly the underdog in this case.
Side impact is an area that has only recently garnered attention and is a natural progression now that many companies have improved their frontal crash performance. Side air bags will soon become standard equipment, just as seat belts and front air bags did.
Andy Jordon, we can debate forever if the Tacoma and Dakota should be on the same list. Fact is, they are.
Gentlemen, if the posters on this board would stick to facts and opinions, then it will be worthwhile to read. Leave the mud slinging posts for the garbage can.
2) I wasn't looking to debate Tacoma vs. Dakota
3) If you are looking for respect please learn to spell peoples' names correctly.
4) I believe that the generally accepted test that is the most accurate recreation of possible collisions is the offset front impact - that is at the corner. I don't know the results but I believe that imports generally do well here.
5) I would say that a 1 star rating was a major problem wherever it was - Is 4 star better than 3 - yes of course - but 1 star is just downright dangerous - regardless of whether it is on an import or a domestic.
These Toymota guys are only here to argue,and that is all they will do.It is fine for them to come here and say every Dodge I drove was junk,but it is not fine for me to say every Dodge I owned has been a good reliable truck.Then these boys say that we are hypocrites,and close minded.
This is simply because we do not believe Toymota is superior.
I am not irate or angry or anything of the sort.I am very cynical,and a bit sarcastic at times,but if I offended anyone's tender ego then I will apologize.I have always believed in sticking up for what I believe,and I believe Dodge makes fine trucks,and I have offered up my experiences to support my opinion.Everyone likes to attack me for owning a dozen different Mopars,but when you own 2 or more at a time and put 50,000 miles a year on them you will go through a lot of trucks in thirteen years.
I have never owned a Toymota just like probably half the guys who claim otherwise have probably never owned a Dodge.I have never given anyone advice not to buy a Toymota,and I have never said Toymota makes an inferior product.I have two friends who both own Toymota's(one of those guys got me calling them Toymota's),and one has had very good luck(the Toymota guy),the others wasn't so good,he broke the frame in half on his truck,but that wasn't the trucks fault due to misuse and NYS road salt.
I will simply not post to Toymota guys in the future,I don't mind swapping opinions but the answer from these Toymota guys is always the same...But consumer reports says...Noone has given any arguement to convince me of Toymota's superior quality,everyone but Toymota guys question Consumer Reports.I wonder what these Toymota guys would think if they knew Consumer Reports picked the 300M as a best buy and gave it thier highest praise for reliability...and oh my god..it's a Chrysler...wait a minute Chrysler can't build cars.
While we are on this topic, lets look at Chevrolet. There are 16 vehicles in the lineup. two are rated "recommended". The Lumina and Prism. Ford on the other hand, has 10 cars with that nameplate. 8 are recommended. I am not a fan of Ford but those numbers are impressive. Toyota has 11 different vehicles in the 1999 CR issue I refer to, 8 are recommended. The Tundra isn't one of them because they weren't out when this issue was published. It did receive the recommended label in the Nov 99 issue. Pretty impressive stats and they are based on feelback from 400,000 Americans.
Hmm. Sounds very biased to me!
Ferris: Unfortunately, you are one of the only good guys in the Toyota topics that can look at things objectively and keep personal bias as personal bias, while not trying to pass off that personal bias as fact. I for one, have never seen you post bashing or disrespectful comments. You have shared your opinions of the Tundra and even your past domestic experiences without slamming others' choices. I respect the info and posts you have provided. A few of my previous posts have resorted to some of the same immature tactics that the majority of the Toyota owners here have posted. For that I apologize. I have just grown weary of the unfactual comments and disrespect they have shown here and as any normal person would do, I lashed back. Like Moparmad, I too have stopped the long debates with these posters because for one, they have no knowledge of their truck and even why they claim a superiority, and two, they can't admit that they bought from a biased preference just like we all do. They want to make everyone think that the reason they bought a Toyota is because it is the only good and viable truck choice to make and that anyone who doesn't buy a Toyota is making a stupid choice. And again, Moparmad is correct, no matter what you say to these people, even if you agree with them and try to find at least "some" common ground, they will still post some moronic slam based on zero fact or even a high level knowledge of what they are talking about.
A thanks goes out to you for being a mature poster that is interested in sharing info and experiences rather than slams and disrespect.
Eagleeye: Again, you are referring to a magazine article to claim some factual data on superiority. It shows your lack of knowledge about the auto industry. Everyone knows that magazine articles are biased and based largely on who's deep pockets get filled first as to what the "ratings" are. That goes for all makes. Even when Motor Trend magazine claimed the Silverado Truck of the year last year, I gave it no merit. The magazines are very biased, even your beloved consumer reports that supposedly gathers it's data from public survey. Yeah, ok....whatever.
I will say again, it is very apparent that your "facts" in your article are bull. GM may not be in "your factual" magazine, but I still highly scrutinize what it states. GM sells way more midsize and luxury cars than any other domestic make and also Toyota. Ford outsells the GM trucks, but not by a large margin. I don't know Dodge's sales figures, but they too sell way more cars and trucks than any Toyota.
If there was that large of a disparity in quality and such, I guess that just proves the Toyota theory that all American buyers are stupid are continually buying junk vehicles in leaps and bounds every year ahead of Toyota. Well, I guess I will continue to be stupid then... happy now?
By the way, I have never heard that Toyota thinks all American buyers are stupid as you say. They do say that buyers want the best value for their money and Toyota strives (and sometimes fails) to deliver that. I got 100,000 miles out of my front disk brakes on my Camry. My Buick was lucky to get 20,000. That is the kind of thing I refer to Dude when I talk quality. No squeeks or rattles either and I have owned the Camry now for 8 years. The doors are still tight...no wind noise. See what I am talking about?
I test drove a Silverado a few months ago. The steering wheel squeeked when I turned it, the passenger door wouldn't close tightly, there was lots of wind noise and the motor was very loud. The ride was rough on smooth pavement and it was tough to park because of its gerth and wide turning radias. Then I tested a Tundra...one word describes my feeling...awesome! The motor was so quiet yet very powerful. Lots of room for my wife and I inside. Didn't need a step ladder to climb in. Easy to drive and in fact, it was fun to drive. Add to that my past experience with Toyota quality and durability, guess which one gets the nod? I even get a longer warranty than the Big 3 give without extra cost for extended warranty.
This is a no brainer Dude. It isn't a conspiracy against the Big 3 or designed to hoodwink the American public. The public wants and demands quality for $30,000+ hard earned dollars and Toyota delivers.
Back then they weren't in the same ballpark. Today it's neck and neck with Toyota ahead by a nose (if you believe the surveys). The margin is not even worth sweating, so who cares? The great news is as consumers, we all benefit by the improved reliability. Thank you competition!!
What's great about the USA is that we get to choose. The Toyota suits me better. Great power and ride comfort, great handling and if their track record hold exceptional reliability. But it is smaller than the big 3 you can't even get a LB with extended cab. And it's a 1/2 ton. So it's not for everyone.
My perfect vehicle? Tundra handling, ride,and fit and finish with the Silverado rear seat and looks, 30mpg around town, full locking differential, for half the price. But I'm very happy with what I have.
The last Toyota I drove was a 1997.Too small,obviuosly,but I thought it rode much worse than the Dakota I drove and I could buy my current Ram for just a few thousand more.I did get a screaming deal on my truck,if I had not I would have bought a Dakota,because that is what I could afford.I try not to slam Toymota over the few road miles I have had in them,unlike many people seem to do to Dodge.
I am through arguing this. It is clear that you Toyota owners are set on this perceived quality advantage. I am set that it doesn't exist as do the other domestic truck owners.
The Tundra is a good truck, no debate there, but definitely no better quality in my mind than the Silverado and "I" feel that I got way more for my money by buying the Silverado. I checked out trucks, including the Tundra, for about 6 months before I purchased. I had another Chevy truck and a Toyota Tacoma. After driving all the makes and checking out the different aspects of them all, the Silverado was and still is the winner in more categories than the others. If I have this truck 10 years from now, I know in my own mind, based on "my" experiences, I won't regret my decision.
Glad you all are happy with your "choice" in truck. May we part peacefully with that???
By the way, maybe I am just getting old but I would rather hear the music from a CD than engine roar. Those days are long gone.
Have a good weekend, Dude.
As for the Bubba crack, if you play the part then be prepared to take the hits my friend. By the way, I am not a Yank.
Ford on the other hand only has to market the F-Series. This allows them to more efficiently convey to the public the strengths of their truck without dilluting the message with an identical product with a different brand name. I know Lincoln is coming out with the F150 based Blackwood but that will be a totally different animal in my eyes as it truely will be a luxo. truck.
This is just how I see the two. Ford seems to have a smarter more streamlined approach to selling cars and it seems to be paying off for them as they continue to grow in market share even though they are the little guy to GM, relatively speaking.
I am not trying to start a brand war as I really have no pref. Just stating what I see.
BTW somebody asked in one of these Tundra Forums how the Silverado can run on no coolent. Not sure where and to be honest I don't have time to find out where, but I figure they check all these forums out. As far as I know the Silverado's computer determines the coolent loss and shuts two of the engines cylinders down and uses them to, in some way, air cool the engine. I don't claim to be a mechanical mastermind but I think that is how it works in the most simplistic way.
Ford has it too, not sure if Dodge has come on board with this yet or not.
I guess this is just yet another inferior feature of the Silverado to the Tundra. I am sure the Tundra never overheats and can run on no coolant and no oil either.....:)
I have said it once and I will say it again. I think the Silverado is probably the most technically advanced truck on the market today. I just think it is going through a lot of growing pains. All of my test drives with the Silverado left me feeling that this was a technically perfect truck. It did everything right. It just did it in such a boring fashion for me. It didn't get my blood boiling.
Remember my choice was between the Tundra and the Silverado. I too research the hell out of my purchases and what I found out from my dealer friends back home, I have friends in both Toyota and GM dealerships, was that as many as 40 or so % of the 2wd Silverados were having major vib. problems that they could not fix. My truck would have been one of the 2wd varients. This scared me. The Toyota people told me that they were having minor vib. problems with some trucks but they were few and far between and that they were alignment problems. I am willing to admit that because GM sells about a billion more trucks than Toyota that they will obviously report more problems but with buying a house at the same time I couldn't take the chance that I would get stuck with one of the problem trucks.
The Toyota, even with what I would consider a little less technology in some areas, brakes for example, I feel the sum of the parts work much better together. The Tundra is as fun for me to drive as my Dakota R/T was and it just feels much more solid that the others I drove.
Besides the Tundra fits in my garage with about 6 inches to spare. I would have hated leaving my Silverado outside.
I do not miss anything from the Silverado when I drive my Tundra. As I have stated, I thought I would miss not having 4 wheel disc brakes but I feel the Tundra has superior brake feel and much better ABS. I thought I would miss not having a LSD, but my Tundra is the most stable truck I have ever driven in the weather and it is a 2wd so I won't be offroading. The only thing that I would miss is that No Coolent running. I don't miss it now, but if I ever have a coolent problem I am sure I will think about it.
Remember a vehicle is not about the best numbers, or what is deemed the best tech. It should be about how that vehicle fits you. How does it make you feel to drive it, what kind of sense of security does it give you. These are all things that cannot be broken down and quantified into numbers. Am I a Toyota person? No. I am a Tundra person. Why? Because the sum of the parts that make the Tundra make my driving experience better then any other truck on the market and give me the sense that it is built better then the competition. I don't know if that is true. I know enough about cars in general to know that it is just as prone to failure as any other but my perception is that it will be more reliable. This in itself makes it a better truck for me.
The white flag will only be flown right along side of the US flag. Sorry you have ended up in the middle. If or when your counterparts want to start peace talks, I will have no problem settling things. Until then it will be bash for bash.
I have no problems with any truck anyone else wants to own,but I have owned Dodges all my life and haven't regretted buying even one.So I would think people might see why I will continue to own Mopars,until they give me a reason not to.
I suspect this topic was not started by someone legitamately shopping the Tundra and Ram,I think it was started by someone who wanted to watch the war.That is why I have said my peice and can no longer see posting here.
I have enjoyed conversing with you Ferris and Bud light Dude,I had just about given up on Edmunds as a source for anything but new ways to slander someone elses ride.Hope to see you on another topic soon.
I am going tomorrow to pick up.... MY DODGE RAM 1500 SLT 2wd quad cab. I won't be signing up for the TBA though. The toyota put up a tough fight, I read, drove, and read some more. Went to several dealers and got the best deals I could on both trucks. Noticed the Toyota boys weren't willing to deal much. Kept saying where number 1 and the hottest saleing truck. We don't have to lower our prices.. That was about the point where I told them they could keep their precious TOY. but I eventually found a deal I found agreeable for the Toyota. One thing I did not like was that 2 of the 4 toyota dealers I went to besides being Jerks (hey they are trying to make money too) decided that they wanted to treat me like I didn't know anything and tell me about all the problems with the dodge Transmission, steering, etc..... I asked them about the shimmy that I have read about on this site and they suddenly lost the ability to talk or remember. Anyway I didn't like the way they handled that. The dodge boys always said that the toyota was a good truck, one guy even admitted that he was considering one (for his second truck of course )
The Dodge boys, made one offer I made mine and I got it for 100 over invoice out the door. I agree with the posts above about the dodge having the better base price while the Toyotoa has a lot of "NICE" features that cost a pretty penny.
The thing that finally decided which truck was when I took the family baby boy, daughter and wife to test drive. The baby is still in car seat. While the Tundra does drive like a car, it has about as much room in the back as one too! The car seat barely fit, with seat all the way forward or at least as far forward as comfortable and safe. Granted he won't be in the car seat forever, but long enough to make it impractiable.
The dodge on the other hand had ample room.
I am going with the belief that when the makers of Toyota learns to make that are size proportional to their target group, then maybe I will buy one. They have to learn the average american is not 5'5" . I realize that may sound sterotypical, and I do not mean that in anyway, but it does seem that Toyota is more about being compact rather than comfortable.
Thanks again to everyone and I guess I will see you out there. I will be the one in the Dark Green Dodge !
jarod