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Cabover Campers & Camper Trailers (pickups)
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Comments
I think we averaged about 14 mpg. Don't know why it is down about 1 mpg from last year, but it was. Could be the taller tires (I added 5% to the miles each tank to account for the height difference) changing the effective final drive ratio, or maybe the air deflector I added to the front of the camper, or maybe higher speeds. We got our best mileage up in the Colo Rockies going up Pikes Peak, Mt. Evan and into Rocky Mountain National Park. Lower mileage cruising across the plains. The worst tank was probably in the 12's and the best was in the mid to hi 15's. Don't quote me on that, it is from a frequently defective memory. I do remember paying $100 (Canadian) to fill the tank in Labrador City.
The oil minder finally went off in the middle of Newfoundland - 7200 miles from the last oil change! Not bad considering I had about 1500 miles of around town on the oil before we left. I carried the Mobil 1 and filter with us, and paid $10 (US) to have it changed in the middle of almost nowhere.
Mike L
I lived up that way for 25 years, and used to ride dirt bikes in the dunes before they fenced them off (to protect some obscure weed, I think). My daughter lives in one of the houses on the beach in Oceano (that's one spot where you actually drive onto the beach. Take Grand Avenue in Arroyo Grande to US1, head south on US1 to the next light in Oceano - Juan's Cantina is on the NW corner - then head west about 3 blocks to the beach... If you're coming from the north, you can pick up US1 right in Pismo, then head south a couple of miles to Oceano/Juan's.
Be prepared to pay a day-use fee. I'm not sure how much, but $40 rings a bell. You might want to check that out before you go.
Bring a 12-volt air compressor... letting a bunch of the air out of your tires will make a bigger footprint on the soft sand and give you lots better traction, and you'll need to pump 'em back up after you get back on pavement.
And watch the tides. (My wife used to drive around in her J-10 Jeep pickup on weekends and pull 4x2 folks out of the sand after they got stuck. The tow guys - and some of the camper guys with 4x4's - charge a bundle of money for that, she did it just for kicks...)
JT
If I go to Pismo in Sept. I'll be well informed, thanks to Vince& JT. My main reason for going there was to try & find a Manx type dune buggy, & If not, I might head over to the Ruby Mountains in Nevada..a great place to have a buggy. Filled up my propane tank this morning..might need my heater this week end. Twenty nine this AM, but then, It's Truckee!
I don't know how the guy made it to the lumber yard with the rig in this position. Nearly all of the main body of the camper was behind the second set of wheels of the tandem trailer and he had nothing up front in the trailer to counterbalance it. Maybe he was in buying bags of sand. I'll keep an eye on the newspapers to see what happened.
I enjoyed Vince's description of the jack collapse in Montana and how the horse shoe blacksmith got the wreck back together. Wonderful what a guy with an anvil and forge can do.
I have a 2001 Dodge Dakota Quadcab 4x4, 4.7 v8, 3.92 rear, auto. I am looking at getting a popup truck camper. Does anybody have any opinions on the Four Wheel Campers popups? Its the Eagle model and its about 690lbs dry. It is for a short bed, and mine is a mini bed @ 5'3". The Manufacturer said that the camper will fit my truck great with the tailgate down.
Also, is it possible to leave the camper on its jacks at the park so the truck can be used without unhooking power? Do I need any sort of stand under the floor also? Do you have any recommendations on jacks?
Thanks for everyones input, you have all given me alot to think about looking through the old posts. I hope you will all continue with your excellent banter.
Robert
Four Wheel campers are a respected brand of popup camper. They are lightweight and judging by the 10-20 year old ones I've seen on the road quite durable.
It turns out some campgrounds don't like (or allow) campers to be off the pickup. We agreed to not ask, and just drop the camper and drive off.
And I worry about going in the camper with the floor unsupported. At least put a 2x12 and a support under it. Or lower it onto some supports.
Or ask the camper manufacturer about it.
Mike L
Thanks again.
Robert
I guess it depends on your definition of close.
We've gone camping up in the Sierra's. They have distributed camping off the dirt fire roads. We've had good spots off 108 above Strawberry. Stop at he ranger station (Mi-Wuk??) and get a map of the fire roads.
We've also camped a few times in the Los Padres forest. Go to the San Antonio Mission on Ft. Hunter Ligget (be sure and stop at the mission and buy a forest pass) then head north west on Del Venturi Road. About 10 miles out you will find a couple of campgrounds, or you can camp many places just off the road.
Another favorite is Sequoia/Kings Canyon. Free camping after the first snow! And they have heated toilets. You get a lot day users coming up from Fresno to play in the snow, but the nights are very quiet. We've been the only ones there, we've also had a foot or more of snow while we were there.
And my all time favorite is a little further - Death Valley. So many canyons and you can camp most places as long as you are 2 miles off a paved road and several hundered feet from a water source. Take the 30 mile dirt road out to Racetrack and check out the rocks that move across the dry lake bed. You have to walk about 1/2-3/4 mile out onto the far end of the lake bed to find the rocks. This has some of the quietest and most remote camping you will ever find.
A couple of other really good spots:
In the White Mountains at the Bristlecone Pine forest. Distributed camping or a free campground. 8-11,000 feet, so be prepared for cold nights.
Lake Thomas Edison. Up 168 past Huntington Lake to the end of the road. Try the unofficial free campground a couple of miles before the Forest Service campground.
Other nearby camping:
East entrance to the Pinnacles off highway 25 south of Hollister.
Basalt campground at San Luis Reservoir. Not on the water, but on the other side of the dam from the highway. In the trees. Hot showers - bring quarters.
Limekiln State Beach or Plaskett Creek campground. Both south of Lucia on Highway 1
Of course, heading north on Highway 1 you will have many, many campgrounds to choose from.
Get a AAA map called: Northern California Camping and the other one called: Southern and Central California Camping. Together they list over 1200 campgrounds.
Mike L
The interview was about 8 months ago.
I wonder what I said. Hmmm, I guess I'll have to go out and buy a copy for myself.
Mike L
Thank you!
Robert
'I feel sorry for people who need an expensive pickup to boost their self-image.'
and:
'They are willing to spend $30,000+ for a big car with a huge, open trunk. Then they complain that it rides like a truck.'
Of course, the quotes are accurate.
I believe that if you want a car like ride, you should get a car. If you need a truck to carry the load, then get one.
Unlike an aquaintance who just bought a Silverado HD for over $34K (2wd no less) and he will never carry anything in the bed. But, he needed it so bad that he just couldn't wait! I think he has other needs that having a big truck won't help.
The article in the WSJ explained how the automakers love truck buyers who never carry anything. The price of trucks is up, profit margins are up, and the bigger trucks (8500# GVWR and up) don't count against the CAFE.
Wow, I better get down off my soapbox now.
Enjoy your truck! No matter why you bought it!
Mike L
For local camping spots here a few of my favorites within a few hours of you.
-If you have a dog, the best cg by far is Mt. Madonna County Park on the summit of 152 between Gilroy and Watsonville. It's a nice place all on it's own, and they have a great trail network which allows dogs. This is rare. Cost has gone up in the last few years to $14 I think. I'm heading there in 2 weeks.
-Butano State Park is a very pretty, small cg in the redwoods. It's located outside of the town of Pescadaro off Hwy 1. Only 25 or so sites so it's quiet, and only a 10 minute drive to the beach.
-Henry Coe State Park above Anderson Lake is an okay place, pretty small cg but the sites are in the open for the most part. The advantage of this place is a vast area for hiking and biking. No dogs on the trails of course!
-Henry Cowell SP outside of Felton is huge and gets some rowdy folks from town. Best to avoid even though it's in the redwoods.
-Big Basin SP is nice but crowded and a long road to get in. Butano is better.
-Sunset Beach SP is pretty good. Camp sites are just okay but it is nice to have the beach nearby. No dogs on the beach.
There are many more campgrounds in the area. It depends what you are looking for: quiet, trees, open spaces, lakes, boating, dog stuff, biking, etc. What type of camping do you prefer?
I am actually leaning away from the Four Wheel Camper because of the reasons you just mentioned. I ran the numbers and by time I add all the options the weight and price gets up there. I have been looking at the Six-Pac campers and found good prices and alot of features I like. We are going to Meeks RV Sat to see the units up close.
Thanks again and have a great trip.
Robert
I like the camper, I've gotten a lot of use out of it, but I wouldn't do it again.
- Different camper?
- Fully equipped 4Wheel Camper?
- Trailer?
- RV?
I know we are looking at a small trailer - a friend has a Casita 17' for sale, and we are also looking at an Airstream 19'. The Airstream is 3X the money, but it looks more liveable. Little things like, an oven, 3 sensors for the 3 tanks, a shower with a shower curtain, better fixtures, more insulation, screen door and windows, larger propane tanks, larger holding tanks, a real innerspring mattress, 1' wider, larger wheels/tires/brakes and more. Too bad they are not side-by-side, it would make comparing easier.
No, we won't sell the pop-up. We need that for places a trailer won't go. The trailer is more for taking the grandson along and possibly long stays in one area. Park the trailer and take day trips.
Mike L
Having owned a 19' Airstream I'll warn you about the only problem I had with it. THE BED! It's only 48"X74" and surrounded on 2 1/2 sides. I had no problems sleeping in it alone but found out (the hard way) that it was nowhere near big enough for 2 "normal" (she's 5'8", I'm 5'10") adults.
Except for the dinette (I much prefer a couch along the front of a travel trailer) the rest of the trailer works very well. I towed mine with a 1500 chevy Silverado (2WD, 5.3 engine, 3.73s, 4-speed auto) and averaged 14 MPG on the last long trip I took it on.
Steve
We've looked at both the dinette and the couch, and for some reason neither of us like the couch.
And besides, we've never been referred to as 'normal'.
The Casita actually has a slightly larger bed, but the 'mattress' is the 4" cushions from the dinette seats.
My dad is finally convinced to go and look at an Airstream. He's 80, and doesn't know when he will find the time to check one out. But, I told him to go ahead and spend the money - he doesn't need to leave it to us kids. Shoot, I'd rather he enjoyed it than to think he went without something just so we could have a little more money when he's gone.
Mike L
I bought the camper based on some assumptions that proved to be incorrect. For instance:
While I use the camper, I don't use it as often as I anticipated (surprise!).
I haven't done any spontaneous camping - you know...go fishing or whatever, and decide to spend the night. I thought I would do more of that.
I carry the camper on my truck all the time (...for that spontaneous camping), and it's proving to be a major pain to take it off when I want to use the truck to carry stuff. I didn't think it would be that much of a hassle, but it is. And carrying the camper on the truck screws up my already meager gas mileage.
So, what I would do if I had it to do over? I would probably buy a small travel trailer - it would be more comfortable than the camper and it wouldn't be in the way when I wanted to use the truck as a truck.
Jim
"When visiting France I spoke to them in French, but I never did succeed in making those fools understand their own language." - Mark Twain
It seems like a great idea. I dont like the idea of getting up in the middle of a hot, rainy/humid night to fuel up a small portable generator to keep the A/C running.
Since you already have propane and if you have a trailer or a camper you would also need a few cans of gas. Why not eliminate the need to also carry gas.
Site: http://www.propane-generators.com/
Opinions requested.
Robert
Do they have a web site? I'll add it to my list.
Have you looked at Northstar? They look pretty nice.
Robert
HARDSIDE:
http://www.bigfootrv.com/
http://www.lancecamper.com/
http://www.fleetwoodrv.com/truck_campers.html
http://www.skylinerv.com/2weekender.htm
http://www.wrv.com/products/index_atc_ltd.html (Alpenlite)
http://www.starcraftrv.com/hardsidetc.html
http://www.northern-lite.com/
http://www.nashtraveltrailers.com/campers.html (Arctic Fox)
http://northlandcampers.com/index.shtml
http://www.summerwindcampers.com/
http://www.hallmarkrv.com/
http://www.okanaganrv.com/camper.htm
http://www.shadowcruiser.com/
http://www.kz-rv.com/truck_camper/truck_campers_index.htm (Sportsman)
http://www.s-scamper.com/
http://www.wcrv.net (Adventurer)
http://www.six-pac.com/
POPUP:
http://www.fourwheelcampers.com/
http://www.palominorv.com/
http://www.phoenixcampers.com/index.html
http://sunliteinc.com/
http://www.northstarcampers.com/ (RC Willet)
http://www.alaskancamper.com
http://www.lite-craftcampers.com
http://www.hallmarkrv.com/
http://outfittermfg.com/
The 1970 "10 foot" Sycamore slide in that John Steinbeck traveled the country in while writing "Travel's with Charlie" was there. Bought and sold at least a couple of times since, and showing the wear, it was mounted on a 1965 Chev. "Custom Camper" that looked awfully small under it. While I was inside it several other people came in through the door and I thought that the axle might come up through the floor to greet me.
From the information provided by the exhibit, I learned that during those years there were over 100 manufacturers of slide-ins (four times the number on Vince's email address list above). During 1965, Chevrolet turned out 44,300 pickups with a Custom Camper nameplate on them, specially equipped for hauling campers. The exhibit described the plus and minus aspects of campers that we all know about and concluded that the RV market today is less enthusiastic about slide-ins than about other RVs.
The Custom Camper by the way had 8.75R16.5 load range D tires on it. You who have read Steinbeck's book will remember that he was plagued with repeated tire failure until he finally put on some high quality tires.
The roof of the camper had leaked and the sagging interior was being held up by a pine 1x4 finishing nailed to what must have been a wooden cross member in the roof system. The furnace was a huge old monster, and the lighting looked ancient. The layout was about what we have today, however. There are only so many ways to put together a sink, stove, frig, bath, table and bed. Nice decal of a trout and deer on the rear alongside the door, too.
There were some other great RV's. The 1928 Zagelmeyer pop-up tent camper had wooden spoke wheels and the beds folded out to the side instead of front and back. It contained a portable kerosine heater of the burning wick type, and there were lots of similar bits of camping gear spread around the mockup campsite. The cotton canvas looked like it wouldn't last more than a few minutes in the downpour that we had on Saturday night.
There was a video showing Henry Ford, Harvey Firestone, and Thomas Edison , entertaining President Warren Harding at their campsite. The food was cooked in a traveling kitchen hauled by a Ford truck that looked like a pack mule, two huge cabinets sticking out one on each side. Henry keeps hopping up to put a stick on the fire, but it looks like the chefs in tall white hats did all the cooking for those on the tour. Their campsite was at some waterfalls in western Maryland.
I had no idea that the first motor home was developed around 1916 - a huge thing with solid rubber tires, 60hp engine and 9 forward speeds. It hauled a folding bridge to close gaps of 20 feet in the road, and mounted a winch for the tough spots. The builder planned a cross country trip but after arriving in Chicago after a harrowing (I think, two month) journey from New York, wisely put it on the train for California instead of trying the western roads.
A 1957 Airstream, beautifully maintained, was next to a prototype 16 foot Airstream Bambi with an art deco interior. Lots of photos of Wally Byam, etc. Pyschedelic schoolbus camper, VW camper, etc, etc. Plus a lot of information about an industry that shipped $10.4 billion in RVs during 1999. Down a bit since, but still strong.
Worth a visit for the R.V. stuff alone. The rest of the museum is a bonus.
Ray T.
We really liked the Airstream Bambi 19' and the Airstream Internatiol CCD 22'. Problem is, Airstream really likes them also. ~$30K and $40K. Not much else of real interest. Most trailers are way too big. We did see a couple of 19-20' RV's, but they were $65K or $45K used.
Drove 300 miles up the coast to check out a Casita 17' a friend has for sale. Only used 3 times, just like new. $10K. Too small. The living space is about the same as our Phoenix popup, and unlike the popup, you have to put the bed away to seat more than two. Only advantage was the toilet/shower.
Not only are we still undecided on a trailer, we haven't decided on a tow vehicle. A full size van or a midsized SUV could tow a 4500# trailer. Maybe a used Tahow/Suburban. Or??? Suggestions welcomed.
As long a you won't get upset if we ignore them.
Mike L
Jim
"You can lead a horse to water, but if you can get him to float on his back you've really got something."
The kid complains when the shift lever hits his knee when going into 4th. Plus, I've gotten used to having the fold down center seat as an armrest on long trips. Hence, we're thinking about an altenate tow vehicle.
Mike L
Do they have a website that I can check out? Normally there is a ton of information on a website.
Thanks,
Mike L
Here is some Wildwood info
manufacturer is Forest River
http://www.forestriverinc.com/default.asp?page=wildw&menu=wildw
Some dealer info
http://www.countrytimerv.com/Wildwoodpage.asp
http://www.dlsrv.com/wildwood.html
Hardside has some advantages when it comes to cold weather camping.
Speaking of cold weather Vince, you guys up to some snow camping in a couple of months? Or another Death Valley adventure?
Another choice that is almost as far as DV is the Ancient Bristlecone Pine Forest just east of Bishop (and you can get the Original Sheepherder's Bread in Bishop).
For now, the plan is to keep the 2500/Phoenix popup for the shorter trips and off road adventures (like snow camping or DV) and come up with another tow vehicle (maybe a Van) for the trailer (if we ever actually put the money where our mouths are).
Mike L
Some of the converted vans with popup sections look very inviting. Biggest problem is limited ventilation. You can't open a door without inviting the skeeters in. Real RV's have screens for all the doors and windows.
Went to another RV show this weekend. Looked at about a zillion trailers, campers, RV's, etc. As we walked out, we asked ourselves 'What was our favorite?' and we both agreed it was the Airstream 22'. Anybody just win the lottery and want to buy us a $35K trailer???
Tough decision.......
Mike L
Looks like we totaled 11344.4 miles, 801.57 gallons, for an average of 14.15mpg for the trip. Not bad for 6.0L and almost 7500#.
For the life of the truck we have averaged 14.12 mpg. Looks like the numbers are starting to stabilize now the the warranty is worn out (over 36K).
Mike L
I don't remember the exact models, but they should be on the website:
http://sunliteinc.com/folding.htm
Or, are you planning on deserting the popup ranks for even less gas mileage?
Mike L
I mean that the cabover part is so far forward, I am sure that the front axle is taking some of the 1400lbs right?
I want to make sure that I load my truck right and I would think that payload is whats over the rear axle.
The reason I ask is that I am looking at these hard sided campers for compact trucks but they are all over 1000lbs and when they are wet, they will probably come out to 1400lbs or more. That sure is close when some of these compact trucks only allow up to 1500lbs payload, and the manufacturers advertise that these units are for them. My truck is allowed 1600lbs payload and one camper advertised to fit my truck is over 1400lbs dry. Its so confusing.
Any advice with this is greatly appreciated.
You guys have really helped me alot and it is greatly appreciated more than you know.
Thanks for your patience.
Robert
Our first Silverado had a 2000# payload and we got a 1400# camper. We were 50# over the GVWR. And we had to install Air-Lifts to keep the back from riding on the bumpstops. In my glovebox was a rating for a slide in camper - 1400#! You may find a similar rating on your ratings plate, or in the owner's manual.
Don't believe the camper manufacturer's when they tell you a camper is 1/2 ton compatible. Maybe somewhere they found a '1/2 ton' truck rated to carry the weight. But clearly, all trucks in that class cannot carry the same weight.
The only slide in campers that I've found suitable for a typical 1500 series ext. cab truck are the lighter weight popup campers. See Vince's list:
HARDSIDE:
http://www.bigfootrv.com/
http://www.lancecamper.com/
http://www.fleetwoodrv.com/truck_campers.html
http://www.skylinerv.com/2weekender.htm
http://www.wrv.com/products/index_atc_ltd.html (Alpenlite)
http://www.starcraftrv.com/hardsidetc.html
http://www.northern-lite.com/
http://www.nashtraveltrailers.com/campers.html (Arctic Fox)
http://northlandcampers.com/index.shtml
http://www.summerwindcampers.com/
http://www.hallmarkrv.com/
http://www.okanaganrv.com/camper.htm
http://www.shadowcruiser.com/
http://www.kz-rv.com/truck_camper/truck_campers_index.htm (Sportsman)
http://www.s-scamper.com/
http://www.wcrv.net (Adventurer)
http://www.six-pac.com/
POPUP:
http://www.fourwheelcampers.com/ http://www.palominorv.com/
http://www.phoenixcampers.com/index.html
http://sunliteinc.com/
http://www.northstarcampers.com/ (RC Willet)
http://www.alaskancamper.com
http://www.lite-craftcampers.com
http://www.hallmarkrv.com/
http://outfittermfg.com/
Good Luck,
Mike L
If you already have the truck, I agree with Mike again and suggest a pop-up slide in. If, on the other hand, you are looking to buy a truck then the camper, go get a 3/4 or SRW 1 ton if you are set on a 1,400 lb camper. If you think you'd rather have a 2,000+ lb camper, get a 1 ton DRW.
All of this may sound like overkill, and to some degree it is. But, trust me on this one, you'll be much more relaxed driving down the road knowing your truck is beefy enough to handle the camper and anything that gets thrown at you.
I used to have a slide in that weighed 2,476 lbs dry, according to the manufacturers tag. By the time I added the water, propane tanks, food, clothing, firewood, etc... I was packing well over 3,000 lbs. Well, I have a 1 ton DRW with a GVWR of 11,200 lbs and I estimate that I was about 500 lbs over! But, the truck handled it almost as if it weren't even there!
One last thing: Does your truck have FRONT AND REAR sway bars? If not, you need both! When you put that much weight that high up, your truck will roll from side to side as if it were a boat in high seas.
Anyway I had a shock. I expected low to mid 8000's and it came back at 9020 lbs! And that was with 3/4 tank of gas and water. So full up would be about 9150 lbs. This is on a 8600 GVWR truck.
The breakdown was 4040 on the front and 4980 on the rear. That includes 2 passengers & 1 dog. The truck axles are rated 4400 front, 6000 rear.
The camper has a sticker with a typed value of 2225lbs wet which I assume is correct for that model but doesn't include "optional equipment" like the jacks. The glove box sticker in the truck shows a camper rating of 2805 lbs so I assumed I was fine. In fact, without any air in the airbags the camper only makes the truck sit level so it doesn't seem like an overload.
Where is the extra weight? If the truck is 5500 with fuel + 2600 camper + 500 passengers etc. = 8600 lbs. Yet I'm 500 over that. Obviously I'm underestimating somewhere.
Mike, do you know how much our trucks weigh? Or anyone else? 2000 Silverado reg cab 4x4 2500.
By the way, to you folks worried about a few pounds, I feel very comfortable and safe in this truck even though it's overloaded technically. I did add some suspension helpers but acceleration and braking are fine as is.
With the airbags and conservative driving, the truck probably isn't dangerous. The real worry would be liability. If you are running over the GVWR and have an accident, your insurance may not cover you and you may be sued for contributing to an accident that is not your fault. That would concern me a great deal.
Is there any chance you could leave the jacks home, fill up the water at your destination, cut back on the pots/pans/food to the minimum and see how much weight you take off? Weigh the jacks and water and stuff removed on you bathroom scale and add it up. It would be very nice to get down to the GVWR.
Mike L
http://www.camperking.com/
Robert