Honda Civic vs Toyota Corolla vs Mazda3

mdaffron · September 2005

We're not knocking Honda.

We're just saying (and we have a lot of expert company) that the Mazda3 is better.

Everyone here knows the current Civic has been knocked off its pedestal. It's just too bad so many people have been brainwashed into thinking that Honda always builds the best car, and won't take off their blinders to consider one that has pushed Honda aside.

Meade

mdaffron · September 2005

The Mazda had xenons, fog lights, rain sensing wipers, leather, heated seats, auto climate control, a 48,000mile/5 year warranty and a loaner car program.

When did Mazda change its warranty? My '05 has a 4 year, 50,000-mile warranty.

Meade

iwantonetoo · September 2005

They didn't, I reversed the numbers by mistake when I posted.

stickguy · September 2005

is 4 years/50K still.

stickguy · September 2005

having driven all 3 lately, the Corolla shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence as the 3 and th 2006 Civic (I never drove an '05). Other than the Toyota reliability rep and good mileage ratings, the ROla trails the pack.

All MHO of course.

Anyway, the Toyota has uncomfortable seats, an odd driving position, is noisier/slower/less content/inferior driving dynamics.

Other than that, I like it though!

Seriously, the Toyota just feels like a cheaper, older design badly in need of an update, which it is.

Between the Civic and 3, tougher call. I drove both yesterday, and think they both have benefits. I really wanted to love the Honda, but wasn't completely convinced. I think the interior takes a little getting used to, but it did drive nice. Biggest worry, to me, was the seats were not as nice as the Mazda. Not as torquy either.

stickguy · September 2005

one thing I notice is that people tend to always compare the 3S (2.3l) to the Honda (1.8l). SO, the mazda ends up quicker, but lower mileage and more expensive.

A more equal comparison is to the 3i (2.0l). You can get an i with almost the same options as an s, except for leather and gizmos like auto climate. Basically, an i is equipped like a Civic DX/LX/EX, depending on which option packages you get.

Having just got the brochures for both, they have almost the same output (140-148 HP, 127-135 torque IIRC), wiegh within 50 pounds of each other, and get similar mileage (5 speed, 28/35 vs. 30/38). Consumers reports also rated the 3i as the #1 compact car recently (although to be fair, that was agianst the old Civic).

The 3S, especially the grand touring (leather/hids/etc) doesn't really have a Civic to compare to. It is probably closest to the mythical Acura EXL that the US doesn't get, or basically a baby TSX.

autonomous · September 2005

Interesting comments. A few questions for you:

1. Would you say you're an average driver (e.g. average build, 60/40 city highway driving ... )? I'm asking because of your comments regarding space and to understand your other requirements.

2. Are you comparing automatics only? The Mazda manual is much more efficient than the automatic.

3. Are you comparing similar models ( e.g. both with heated leather seats, xenons ...) Are the features what you want or would you remove some if you could?

On first impression I find the new Civic an interesting choice in the field; with its legendary reliability I predict Honda will continue its primacy among the compacts for the average driver. Tuners are another story. My preference is for hatchbacks, so the Mazda3 is the way I'd steer.

stickguy · September 2005

I suppose I can offer opinions in this thread and the Civic vs. tC thread, since I am actively shopping, and looked at Honda and Mazda this week (and will go back today probably), and I currently own a tC, so that one I know well!

Anyway, to me, the 3 is more of a performance car, some mix of sport sedan/hot rod. A more engaging drive, lots of fun. The Honda is a bit quieter and smother, with nice steering but not quite the level of handling or "sport". I found the Mazda seats to fit me better, and the leather especially is very comfy.

mdaffron · September 2005

I agree 101%!

I read all these posts where people are saying the Mazda3 is so much more expensive than the Civic ... then I read that they're comparing the 3s with the Civic LX or EX. If you really want a Civic to compare the 3s against, it would have to be the Si, which rolls in between $19K and $20K.

If you compare apples to apples -- the Mazda3i to the Civic LX/EX -- you get numbers that are much closer. And remember that the Mazda has more interior room, still more power even in "i" trim, better handling, and carries a better warranty and gives you free roadside assistance for the duration of that warranty. How much is that worth? Keep in mind also that CR rates both cars the same reliability-wise.

I speak from experience as well. I've owned Chevy and Mazda (in high school) and then moved up to Toyota and now Honda. I can clearly see the differences.

Please share those differences with us, since they're so clear. We'd like to see them too. And please, I'm still waiting to hear why the Civic gives you more for your money.

For the record, I've owned Chevrolet (twice), Mazda (six times), Honda (twice), Toyota, Saab, and Hyundai (twice). The Mazda3s beats them all.

Meade

stickguy · September 2005

back in the mid-80s I needed a family (4 door) car. Ended up looking at the Civic (an '85 at that time) and a 323. Ended up with the 323, for a couple of reason:

better seats with a tilt feature, as opposed to the cushion on the floor that Honda offered at the time.

A sliding sunroof (nada on the CIvic sedn then)

CHeaper IIRC

And, this was at the height of Honda dealer arogance. FOrget about dealing, they acted like they were doing you a favor letting you in the store!

Even back then, the Mazda felt a little bigger and more "sporty", but the Civic was light on it's feet, and might have been rated a little higher on MPG.

mdaffron · September 2005

Here's a Canadian review of the Corolla. I think this reviewer says best what we Mazda folks have been trying to say about the Civic and Corolla.

http://www.baileycar.com/corolla_ST_html.html

Meade

stickguy · September 2005

that pretty much sums it up for me. Uncomfortable (I'm 6'0 with a long torso), and uninspiring to drive. Plus, I had a (borrowed) AT, so maybe a 5 speed would be better.

midnightcowboy · September 2005

Newcar 31,

I believe Legalpengiun is saying his answer is in post #86 "...because they have been a around a long time... and becuase he hasn't had any problems with his Corollas"

Cheers,

MidCow

iwantonetoo · September 2005

1. Would you say you're an average driver (e.g. average build, 60/40 city highway driving ... )? I'm asking because of your comments regarding space and to understand your other requirements.

I consider myself an average driver build wise, and I don't really due much true city driving, but also not a lot of long highway trips. I find the cockpit of the 3 to be tighter than that of the new Civic. The console is rubbing against my right leg. I Don't have a brochure on the 3 as the dealer claimed they don't have any yet.
Also, the rear floor is flat in the Civic, it is not in the 3, to me it feels like there is more room back there too. Maybe the Civic has more usable space.

2. Are you comparing automatics only? The Mazda manual is much more efficient than the automatic.

I am comparing automatics and only the 3s has the 5speed, the 3i is the 4speed.

3. Are you comparing similar models ( e.g. both with heated leather seats, xenons ...) Are the features what you want or would you remove some if you could.

Actually the 3s I looked at was better equipped than the Civic Ex. I have no complaints about the price comparison. I merely questioned the loss in gas mileage for a 20 hp increase. I know the 3i is closer to the Civic in hp, but it still still doesn't have the mpg.

I'm not criticizing the 3 at all. These were my initial observations of both models.

iwantonetoo · September 2005

The Mazda definitely has a better warranty and it also has the loaner car program.
As far as interior room, I feel the Civic the has more usable room for the driver, on the 3 the console is against my leg. And the back seat floor is flat in the Civic, it just seems bigger to me, or again, more usable.

I don't doubt that the Mazda will be the better driver of the two. I think these two cars will offer each other some stiff competition, which is good for all of us. We have good choices on this segment.

I have no compliants price wise. I like the 3s Grand Touring with all the goodies. The console is the only thing that I don't care for.

stickguy · September 2005

I test sat again today. Yes, my right leg did rest against the console on the 3, but that's OK, I like to lean it sometimes.

On the Civic, the same lean spot ended up being the point (top button) of the handbrake. Not very comfortable, depending on how I adjust the seat. But, this was in the showroom, I don't recall it being a problem while driving.

iwantonetoo · September 2005

I think the Civic has more lean room!

legalpenguin · September 2005

Meade, are you always such a nag? And you're a guy? And guys tell us ladies that we are nags! LOL

[The Mazda had xenons, fog lights, rain sensing wipers, leather, heated seats, auto climate control, a 48,000mile/5 year warranty and a loaner car program.]

A majority of those things are clearly not a necessity, but a luxury, when it comes to buying an automobile, so they are not worth all that extra money unless you actually want them.

Sure the Mazda has a slightly better warranty, I give them that. However, how is their customer service in resolving any problems that may arise?

I'm not going to repeat myself as to why I believe I got my money's worth with my Civic. I did all the research, test drives, everything! I also based my conclusion on the many comments I received from family, friends and co-workers who had experience with Honda. My parents own a '93 Civic and they would buy another Civic in a heartbeat. And up until now, they were always an American car buyer!

I don't need all the fancy bells and whistles, even though I couldn't turn down a Civic LX Special Edition with it's leather wrapped steering wheel, alloy wheels, an awesome audio system with 6 CD/MP3, and a spoiler. I bought the car for under $15,000. With the added protection of a navigation system, I couldn't go wrong. I definitely did get my money's worth (the dealer gave me free molded mud guards, free oil changes for the warranty period, free water park tickets and a free $1,000 online shopping spree).

As for looks, the Civic has classic lines. I also dig the fancy headlights. It's also definitely sporty looking especially with the added spoiler. I sure get a lot of looks driving down the road! What does that say?

The Mazda3 and the Toyota Corolla are too rounded in their overall appearance and that makes them look "fuddy duddy" to me. I can't help but see an older lady driving a Corolla and a young kid driving the Mazda3 because it's so cute and diminutive looking going down the road. That's just my observation.

I don't dislike Mazda. They do make decent cars. I just happen to prefer the classiness of the Honda and it's long-time reputation. They've continuously been rated Best Buy and Excellent in all over value for years. That definitely stands for something in the auto industry.

So there! Does that answer your questions now?

pete22 · September 2005

Yes I like the way the Honda looks better too. And have been offered the Honda with similar features for over 1000 less than the Mazda. But I do like the way the Mazda drives better. I am only considering the Mazda3i to keep the price more in line with the Honda but even there theres over a 1000 dollar difference. Anyway I probably mentioned these before but my choices I am deciding between are:

2005 Honda Civic LX (auto) 14250

2005 Mazda3i (auto + power package) 15900 - 500 gerber coupon = 15400

2006 Mazda3i (touring and auto) 16500 - 500 gerber coupon = 16000

I am leaning towards the 2006 Mazda3i as of right now. Plan to but in the next couple of weeks.

iwantonetoo · September 2005

What's the deal with the Gerber coupon? Where, how and can you still get it? Thanks for any info you can provide.

pete22 · September 2005

Look through the Mazda3 prices paid board theres alot of information about it there. It includes the website to apply for an email certificate. ANyway you need both an Ad from Gerber and a certificate. You go to the gerber website to request the ad, also the ad tells you the certificate web site. However I have all that info at work not here. Another option is people on ebay are selling zoom-zoom 500 dollar or certificate and Gerber ads. The two discounts cannot be combined.

iwantonetoo · September 2005

Thanks Pete. I went to the Gerber website, had them call me and they said they will mail me the ad on Monday. Hopefully they will. I still don't know what I will buy, but I'll take a free $500 off coupon. If I don't use it, I will pass it along to someone I know. Too bad you can't use the Gerber and the Rev it up coupon together.

pete22 · September 2005

Which cars are you deciding between because as I probably mentioned I had the same indecision. I pretty much am leaning towards the Mazda but the 2000 savings on a Honda is tempting.

sr45 · September 2005

Each dealership I talked to in Florida where I live, either did not respond to my e-mail or just told me out right that they can sell the civic at msrp or higher, and would not give me a deal, even a small one on the EX model with NAV. Finally had enough of this game playing, and bought the 06 Corolla LE, automatic with many options at a cost little over $ 16,400 out the door, tax, lic, fees, etc. As oppose to the $ 21,111.00, not including fee's, lic, etc..... Far too much. That would put a civic over $23,000 with tax and lic.

pete22 · September 2005

I'm in Southern California. Theres a honda dealer here that claims they will match any internet quote or give you 500 dollars. I was looking for the LX and got a out of state internet quote (Virginia) at 14250 which is about 1200 under invoice for the car with automatic. At least verbally they said they would match it, don't know what would really happen unless I started nogioting and was ready to buy a Civic.
I think the same internet site gave me a 15800 quote for the EX but didn't talk to them about matching that. Anyway the internet quote is from Koon Honda somewhere in Virginia.

carguy58 · September 2005

"Why do you knock Hondas? Their cars have been rated Best Buy and Excellent for years. Mazda merges with Ford and that's why Mazda is a follower and not a leader and is behind the top three - Toyota, Honda, and Nissan."

Uhh, Well Nissan merged with Renault if you want to say Mazda merged with Ford. Mazda has been partially owned by Ford since the late 70's. Also, Toyota shares a plant with General Motors in California.

iwantonetoo · September 2005

At the moment I am considering the new Civic EX sedan and the Mazda 3s Grand Touring. I know it's not exactly an apples to apples comparison, but I am a bit torn on which way to go, the mpg of the Honda or the upscale features of the Grand Touring, leather, Xenons, Bose, etc. Plus more power but at a big hit on fuel economy.
The Civics are at MSRP now, and I have no idea if the 06 3 will be discounted in my area yet. Decisions........

mdaffron · September 2005

So there! Does that answer your questions now?

Actually, no, it doesn't. But it does show me where you're basing your opinion. You are saying Honda has a lot more "value for the money" because Hondas are all you know about. You have never had any experience with Mazda, and you're relying on supposition and personal subjectiveness to make your point.

I've purchased five vehicles in the Protege/Mazda3 line since 1991. I have put a combined 268,000 miles on those five vehicles. The only problem I had in all those cars and all those miles was a set of front strut bushings worth about $220 on a car that had 85,000 miles on it (and my extended warranty covered it -- I paid a $50 deductible). I also believe I caused those bushings to fail with my "slaloming" down our street to entertain our 4-year-old son. But in any case, $220 over more than a quarter-million miles seems pretty reliable to me.

BTW, I also get free oil changes for the first 36K miles and free tires for life (as long as I do my service work at the dealership). I get a free loaner car for any service -- and not just warranty work; I can even have one if I don't want to wait around for one of those free oil changes. I get free roadside assistance during my warranty period.

My dealer was fresh out of Chuck E. Cheese and pedicure coupons, but I did get a $90 set of "premium" floor mats thrown in for free; my dealer has detailed my cars on occasion for free just because I'm a repeat customer; and my wife and I were offered our cars at invoice because of our loyalty. My wife and I received Mazda key rings and a bottle of touch-up paint for each of our most recent cars in the mail. I appreciate real up-front savings and extras which have something to do with the car as opposed to gimmicks like water park tickets and shopping sprees. BTW, where was your $1,000 shopping spree good at?

As for looks, the Civic has classic lines. I also dig the fancy headlights. It's also definitely sporty looking especially with the added spoiler. I sure get a lot of looks driving down the road! What does that say?

Absolutely nothing. It's all subjective. I happen to like Mazda over Honda for exactly the reasons you stated. And I don't know how you get all those looks driving down the road, since Civics are about as common as a Big Mac 'n fries. I not only get looks in my Velocity Red Mazda3 hatch, I get spoken compliments. Lots of 'em. A lot of people want to know what kind of car it is. I'll bet you've never been asked that.

I don't need all the fancy bells and whistles, even though I couldn't turn down a Civic LX Special Edition with it's leather wrapped steering wheel, alloy wheels, an awesome audio system with 6 CD/MP3, and a spoiler. I bought the car for under $15,000. With the added protection of a navigation system, I couldn't go wrong.

My 3 came with a leather-wrapped steering wheel and shift knob, 17-inch alloys, and a spoiler standard. I didn't have to buy a "special edition" to get those things. It also came with a much more powerful engine (160 vs. 115 hp) that also has VVT but also has dual overhead cams as opposed to your Civic's SOHC, disc brakes on all four wheels as opposed to your Civic's drums in the rear, fog lights (an option on yours), and oh -- this makes a big difference in your wallet down the road-- a timing chain that never needs to be replaced, as opposed to your timing belt which will set you back about $500 every 60,000 miles. Your Honda's engine is an interference engine too, btw; my Mazda3's is not; so even if my timing chain does ever break, my engine won't be history as your Honda's will be with a much more likely timing belt failure.

All the aforementioned stuff was standard on my Mazda3. I didn't opt for any of the (relatively few) options since I didn't need them.

Funny -- I don't see a navigation system listed even as optional equipment on the Civic LX, even the SE. It is an option on the EX, which drives the MSRP of that model up to $20,000. So what kind of Nav system to you have? Garmin?

My Mazda3 hatch MSRP'd for only $1500 more than your Civic. Considering the features that are standard on the 3 that you have to pay extra for on the Civic (or aren't available at all), I say I got more for my money. And speaking of "added protection," my added protection didn't come in the form of an electronic map. Mine came in the form of a better standard warranty, plus a 6-year, 100,000-mile bumper-to-bumper extended warranty my dealer sold me for half price. (Another loyal customer perk.)

You can't just compare the two cars' prices and say the Civic is the winner. The Civic LX is a lot less car than the Mazda3s. Plain simple, you get what you pay for. Maybe you should be comparing the Civic LX with the Mazda3i, which is a much fairer comparison -- even though it still blows the Civic out of the water performance-wise.

Meade

legalpenguin · September 2005

Meade, you sure like to make incorrect assumptions about people you don't even know (and what do they say about that?

). And you are more than welcome to continue to talk to your heart's content, but you are not going to change my mind about my choice of automobile. I made the absolute best choice for me after doing a ton of research on all of the vehicles in the compact class.

If you wish to continue to bury this right into the ground, that's your perogative. I don't care. Because I could have told you this from the beginning - we are talking about two different cars and car companies here. There is no comparison IMO. You love your Mazda and I love my Honda. You believe you got your money's worth and I know I got my money's worth. It's a win/win for both us. Isn't that all that matters? So let it go already man and get a life please.

pat · September 2005

Let's not turn this into something personal, please. Both of you can agree to disagree without the digs. Thanks.

legalpenguin · September 2005

And one last thing. No need to answer, but think about this. How you can be subject at all about any other automobile when all you know is Mazda? Your messages are extremely biased for that reason. But I have to say I'm amazed to see someone so passionate about a vehicle!

This is my first Honda. One of the reasons I bought it is because everyone I know who owns a Honda has said they had no problems with theirs and would buy another one. Previous to that I owned Toyota (Camrys and Corollas) for 16 years. I put on a large amount of miles on those autos as well with no major problems either. That's why I kept buying them.

I don't care about a ton of bells and whistles, whether they are standard or not. All I want in a vehicle is well-known reliability, an excellent track record of owner satisfaction and an excellent rating year after year in cost of ownership over the long haul. That what I've gotten in Toyotas and that's what I will get with Hondas.

Have a great day! And as Dennis Miller would say -- I'm outa here!

drexelnet · September 2005

Hello,

I am planning to either buy a 06 Mazda 3 or 06 Corrolla S or 06 Civic LX. Does anyone know if the dashboard on a Mazda 3 or Corrolla S used hard plastic or do they used those rubbery soft material on their dashboard, because i know that civic used those standard hard plastic everywhere inside of their vehicle.

thank you

drexelnet · September 2005

Hi legalpenguin,

Do you have the 2005 or 2006 Honda Civic LX. Is the dashboard and interior covered with hard plastic or with thoes rubbery soft material on your Civic?

Thanks

mdaffron · September 2005

I'm not trying to change your mind. This is a comparison discussion, and I'm debating your statement that the Civic gives you more for your money. I am sorry you took my post personally; it was not intended to be taken as such.

Meade

legalpenguin · September 2005

Hi!

I have a 2005 Honda Civic LX. The dashboard and interior are covered with hard plastic. No rubbery soft material at all.

You're welcome.

legalpenguin · September 2005

I didn't take your tone as a debate. And frankly, I don't wish to be a part of whatever it is anymore. I did my own comparison and that is really all that matters. I went with the Civic. I bought my Honda Civic LX SE for less than what all of the other dealers in the area were going to give me for a regular LX with nothing else added in. So it's not just me who said I got a lot more for my money. The dealers who lost their bids said the same thing. I DID get more for my money. Period. There is no debate on this issue.

pat · September 2005

Best to drop it if you don't want to be a part of it anymore ...

fitguy · September 2005

Stumbled on this thread and wanted to say, I drove both a Corolla S and Civic EX and LX when purchasing in '03- the Civic was more refined road-manners wize, smoother, and quieter. Both cars offer legendary reliability and gas mileage; I ended up buying an Accord (my 3rd) as I am accustomed to mid-sized cars and compacts just feel, well, too compact. We now have a Mazda6S Hatchback and it has been phenomenal; we didn't drive the 3 but read all the road tests, drove the 6 and bought it that day. Mazda knows how to tune a suspension better than any other mid-price Japanese manufacturer; the others are competent but not cutting-edge. The gentleman so passionate about his 3 did have some valid points in terms of it's advanced engineering. Mazda's aren't for everyone- and I'm glad, because they set the owners apart as more of a driving enthusiast. My Volcanic Red 6 gets looks and comments every where it goes- and I frequently see BMW owners eyeing it as it goes by. Not because they want one, certainly; but because they know it's a car that will perform at a level somewhat close to theirs (esp. if it's a 328i), looks unique, and costs 10K less. Mine has 14K miles so far with 0 problems. Oh, and it also has a timing chain.

mdaffron · September 2005

Thanks for the kind words. I think you understood my message. I'm glad you recognize that this is a discussion group and people tend to debate things. If we all just decided on the car that's best for us and didn't care about what makes one car better than another, we wouldn't be here -- especially after making our purchase -- would we?

BTW, did you trade the '03 Accord for the '05 Mazda6? Was it the better handling that made you want to get out of the Accord and into the 6 that quickly?

Meade

z71bill · September 2005

These are front wheel drive 4 cylinder economy cars - and although they are fun to drive - they are not high performance sports cars - its kind of like a debate on who has the largest shrimp.

Nothing against the Mazda3 - the main reason I bought one is because - when compared to the other econo boxes being sold - it is one of the most fun to drive - but anyone who thinks that a true driving enthusiast would WANT a front wheel drive 4 banger must have a different image of what driving enthusiast means.

I would recommend test driving a BMW 325 - after 25 seconds behind the wheel you will never again compare it to a Mazda3/6.

pat · September 2005

All he's saying is the Mazda3 is more of an enthusiast's car than the other two subject vehicles, at least that's the way I read it.

legalpenguin · September 2005

Meade, it was supposed to be a debate but that's why the HOST clearly stopped it because it wasn't. I hope we can get back on track now.

IMO most of the time it's the young people who want a fun ride (or a person who is going through a mid-life crisis

). It all depends on what you want and your priorities.

I'm not looking for a "fun" ride when I'm buying a car. I'm looking for a good ride in a car that is known for reliability and stability over the long haul.

When I have an occasional urge to get a fun ride, I will just step into my boyfriend's BMW and put the top down. Yes, there absolutely is no comparison. But hey, when you're single (for now), you need to go with what takes your money the furthest. That's why I now have a Honda and used to buy Toyotas.

audia8q · September 2005

Meade.....Some folks feel a car is like an appliance...I don't get it and probably never will..They don't care if it drives like a Gran Marquis or a MZ3. They like what they like, right, wrong or indifferent....not that there is anything wrong with that.

sr45 · September 2005

Just for me.....I have finally grown up, and only want a reliable car with good mileage, and a nice looking, non cheap interior. Care less about 0-60 stuff, or those digital dash with the cheap looking and feeling plastic that is on the Civic. I also don't like manuals anymore. Too much work. Just nice, and easy with a upscale interior like the Corolla LE. We all change during our life time. Let the kids think its a status thing or driving 0-60 in 6.9 seconds means anything. I won't waste money ever again on MSRP. Happy motoring

audia8q · September 2005

Just for me.....I have finally grown up

is there a difference between growing up and growing old??

I fear the day I want to drive Town Car.. :P

It's a little harder to get in and out of an RX-8 or Miata these days, I'm not 18 anymore, but I still love em.

midnightcowboy · September 2005

To each his own., I haven't grown up enough to not worry about performance and handling; I hope I never do! Cars are more than just a means to get from point A to point B.

I also still buy manual shift cars. I think the new Civic Si and the whole Civic line are winners, except for the price creep. And at least Honda has a manual shift in most of their Civic lines. I was looking for a high mpg commuter car an the 2006 Civic Hybrid looked like a good possibility until I found out it was CVT only.

If you think Civic have cheap looking plastic , there are other cars that are much much worse, including even your Corolla LE.

Cheers vruis'n in 6th Honda style :shades: ,

MidCow

midnightcowboy · September 2005

A civic is still young.
A town car is more middle age.
Buick is growing old

Go 2006 Civic. Take an Si put some rims and tires on it a AEM cold air intake and a Tanabe exhaust, wind it out to red line in 1rst and 2nd and see if you don't feel at least 10 years younger.

Cruis'n in 6th :shades: ,

MidCow

mdaffron · September 2005

Well, since I'm in Richmond and within sight of St. John's Church, I guess I'll have to say ...

I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me Zoom-Zoom or give me ... enough money to buy a BMW! :P

I just turned 40, I've been married 10 years, and I have a 4-year-old son. I've been driving 5-speeds since I was 20, and 20 years later I'm still lovin' 'em. Wouldn't have an automatic if you gave it to me, the unreliable, non-responsive, heavy pieces of performance-robbing frou-frou.

I've watched my dear old dad's heart die over the past 25 years. When I first got my license he was a Volvo man -- you remember the 144's of the late 60s and early 70s? Those were fun little cars. I learned to drive in them. Then it started ... in my junior year of high school, he bought a Pontiac Grand Le Mans. What a tugboat. Then came a Buick Skylark. NOOOO!!!!! Then ... came the Riviera. And another. Lastly, a couple of years ago he called me and told me he'd just purchased a SPORTS CAR. Curious, I drove by his house that evening. It was a STINKIN' BUICK REATTA!!!

Today his driveway is occupied by that Reatta and his latest Riviera.

I WILL NOT LET MY HEART DIE! NO BUICKS IN THE DAFFRON DRIVEWAY, EVER!!! (And yes, Dad has to park on the street.)

Meade

stickguy · September 2005

we have a few things in common. Die hard stick drivers (I don't like the way ATs function, especially in smaller cars), and I also learned to drive on a 1969 Volvo 144, 4 speed of course.

My father got lazy a few years ago and bought an Olds Alero (1st auto they had since before the Volvo), but Mom still drives an Older Saturn 5 speed (although she really wants a Mini Cooper, and she's 73!) At least I know where I get it from.

sr45 · September 2005

" If you think Civic have cheap looking plastic , there are other cars that are much much worse, including even your Corolla LE ".

Click on the below link and scroll down to where this other individual talked about the cheap plastic dash. I'll take an LE on the Corolla any day of the week

http://thehollywoodextra.blogspot.com/link">

Honda Civic vs Toyota Corolla vs Mazda3

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