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As you point out, some respond, some didn't. Of those that did, they asked for me to come in. Some quoted MSRP or a slight discount. One actually quoted an attractive price. But, once I got to the store, it was a "mistake". Another one said the vehicle I was interested in had been sold.
Face-to-face has always been the best way for me to get a good deal. Alternately, I did try to buy via internet once (for my sister). We researched. Came up with a price (right down to the final delivered price, including tax, TTL, doc). Emailed it to 4-5 different dealers. One accepted. The rest declined. Again, got to the dealership and it wasn't what she wanted. Had to go in person to get the deal she wanted on the vehicle she wanted.
I do it differently. First, I must trust the dealership I'm working with. That way, there are no "gotchas" in the deal and everything is understood upfront. Then, I present my offer, in person. Handshake....done deal.
But, if you want something easy, you can email a bunch of dealerships. Get the responses. If the offer(s) are acceptable, you've got a deal. You can't really renegotiate at that point. You still have to go to the dealership to complete the transaction and drive the car home. You gotta be there anyway, so what's the point of emailing everyone, when you can do a deal in person, since you have to be there anyway?
Never could understand why anyone is afraid of being in front of the dealer?
The coffee and cigarette smoke offends.
I called cause his preference didn't show on my form. If it would, I wouldn't have called.
My point was he didn't need to be rude about it or hang up on me.
I don't flip out on people in other businesses when they make a mistake. I just don't see the point of being rude like that.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
As a side note to your comments about e-mailing, my experience is that the vast majority of the people who don't want to supply phone numbers or come into the dealership are not really in the market. They simply want some free information to think about. They want anonymity because they aren't really in the market.
Here's an example of what I deal with on a regular basis. Someone from out of state wants your best price on a vehicle. I tell them to make me an offer as I do not supply pricing to out of state customers. There are 3 typical responses to this.
1. Anger - These people just wanted to get pricing from you so they could run the number by their local dealer.
2. Don't respond. - These people were either fishing for information or were trying to keep their local dealer honest.
3. Understanding - These people are real buyers. They understand that bad apples have spoiled the whole bunch and figure out a way to work around "best pricing". They pick a specific vehicle that they are interested in and make an offer.
Then I should quit while I am ahead!
But seriously, I think it has less to do with learning styles and more to do with styles of social interaction and information processing. By the time a customer gets to the show room,he or she has pretty much maxed on learning. The task then becomes negotiation and decision making. Those skills may well be related to learning styles but the issue, imo, is not learning per se. The salesperson's role is not to teach but to inform.
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
If you are doing it remotely, they know that they are not the only dealer you are talking to and they get down to their bottom line fairly quick. I have made about a dozen purchases and only two of them were on the first visit to the store. I can honestly say they were the worst deals I have ever made.
Granted, if I lived in a less densely populated area, my method would not work as well.
--You "reward" the salesperson who shot you the lowest price - understandable. However, the salesperson that actually put in the most amount of time & work with you doesn't even get a chance. What happens if he's only higher by $50? So his time & effort are worth nothing to you. Also, it's not about being honest vs. dishonest when it comes to price - It's about taking a GUESS as to what that magic number is that is low enough to beat out 24 other dealerships. There is no salesmanship involved whatsoever. Some people like this & feel that a salesperson offers no added value. As somebody said, they treat buying a car the same as buying things from Staples. The difference is that a good salesperson asks questions & helps you buy the right car. I can't count the number of times somebody came in to my store & asked for a specific model adamantly. However when I did my job & asked questions, I was able to direct them to a different car that would actually work better for them or come up with a solution to their problem by thinking outside the box. As an example - I used to sell Volvo. I had a customer who adamantly thought he needed the Premium Package & sent in an email similar to the one your wrote. Rather than just shoot him an email with a low price, I called him (he didn't specify not to) & asked what it was about the premium package he was looking for. It turned out that he wanted satellite radio & a Multi-CD. Well, at the time - Sat Radio still wasn't available in the Volvo he was looking at & he didn't care much about the leather/sunroof that was part of that package. However, I personally had a car that someone traded in with an XM unit in it that he didn't care enough about to remove. I ended up selling him a vehicle without the premium package & had my service department uninstall & reinstall that unit in his new car an no extra charge. I ended up saving him over $2500 because he allowed me to do my job.
I don't know about you, but spending anywhere about $15,000 on any purchase is nothing like buying something at Staples.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Sorry exbo, I didn't direct that at you.
Just saying in general, someone who writes a request that sounds like it's from a 13 year old, shouldn't be expecting the world.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
I even had some customers come to me after they bought elsewhere needing help with some of the vehicle features, problems, that their selling dealer wouldn't address.
They came back to me after they bought elsewhere because although the other dealer gave them a lower price, also gave them crap service with that super low price. Even though it was flattering that they thought this highly of me, I told them to head right back where they bought their car and deal with it there.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
It seems that is exactly what they think. They may be right too. Why else would that stuff continue?
The only trouble these days is that the gullible buyers have all gone broke because of their poor buying habits. Now the smart people are circling like sharks.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Here's a true recent story from 2 months ago that's still ongoing that shows why we rarely send out numbers:
Recently I had a customer who emailed me with strict instructions as to what he wanted, when he'll make the decision to buy (within a week), and that he's looking for the best otd price. When he gets his quotes he'll got to the closest dealer with the best price to leave a deposit.
Ok fair enough. My reluctant sales manager gave me the bottom price after I convinced him this guy was legit. I phoned the guy too as he offered to be called for any clarifications. He told me he's serious, that couple dealers told him they'll beat whatever price he gets, or the ones that told him to come in and he said he won't deal with them, and crossed off his list.
He said he wanted to be fair and he wanted a dealer to make a fair profit. (Ok, I rolled my eyes, that's not how any dealer is going to make any fair profit but whatever).
So, against all instincts, we send him the rock bottom below cost price. All costs, terms, doc fees detailed.
Judgement day came and went, with no replies. I email him a few days later. No reply. I call him. he answers. He said our price is the best and that he'll be in on day XX to make the purchase. Hurray I think!! It's a victory and I can convicne my manager that throwing rock bottom numbers into cyberspace does really work! My vicotry was short lived however.
Day XX comes and goes, he doesn't come. He said he got tied up, but he'll be in tomorrow. Ok tomorrow goes by he still doesn't come. I call and can't reach him.
I email him. He gets back to me saying the economy is bad so he's holding off. :surprise: WTF? The economy sucked for the past 8 months. The quote he got was during crappy economy, it's not like anything changed I tell him, ok, when you're ready then contact me.
I follow up with him next month by email to tell him of new offers. He emails back and tells me he's on vacation now (in an exotic location and won't be back for another month). WTF again I think. I thought the economy sucked.
So after he gets back he sets up a few more appointments with me that he doesn't show up for. :sick:
First he wastes everyone's time for quotes. Then he makes an excuse about the economy that doesn't make sense that he contradicts later by being on an exotic vacation. Ok it' none of my business where you spend your money, and where you go on vacation, but if you gonna say you're buying within a week, and then you don't and drag this thing out for 2 months now, why go through this lousy excercise of wasting every dealer's time for pricing.
And that's why if you request a quote and get the come on down, you'll know is cause of "buyers" like that that not only you end up losing moeny on, but also will waste your time for nothing. :sick:
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
This is most certainly true. Since I pick a price I can live with, the first dealer that meets it gets my money. I don't need to grind after I get what I set out to get. If I can get done what I need to get done in fifteen minutes instead of four hours, it works for me.
ps the coffee at the dealer I bought from has a starbucks machine that grinds your choice of bans and brews it by the cup. I wish he was a little closer, I'd be in there every day chugging java and using the bathroom.
It was your software bug that caused this problem.He clearly indicated not to be called.
I would never entertain a customer who is trying to get my price for this reason.
I would let him walk. He is welcome to go to that dealer and get whatever he wants.
exb0...in all frankness, if that method works for you, run with it.
But, the only way to negotiate is if two sides are willing. Won't work if only one side is willing. If you go in with a price in mind, tell the sales person the price. Add that you're only making one offer. You're buying right now. It's a "yes" or "no" offer. That gets you to the "bottom line" immediately. If it's yes, you've tied up maybe 10 minutes of your time for it to be approved by the desk. And, you get the price you're seeking....no muss, no fuss. If it's a "bump" that comes back, you thank them and leave.
Doing it remotely, as madmanmoo points out, you aren't going to be taken very seriously, and will have an offer that they've put together with as much effort as you've done to get it.
On the other hand, check in with jipster. He makes a trip to the dealership and packs a lunch and dinner, just to do the bumpety-bump routine 'cause he takes joy in that.
moo....your scenario makes sense. If someone is irritated that you follow up on their internet lead, probably not a good candidate. If you don't give them a number, you've lost nothing.
Boom, out of curiosity...how many people buy a new car from the internet?
It sounds like it is impossible to sell a car that way. No matter what number you come up with they will use it against you. Would it be best to give them a realistic number on the internet, but tell them you will give them a special discount if they come in within the next 72 hours?
Do you actually give someone a number and then get a sale?
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Then I should quit while I am ahead!
I agree too, that you should have quit while ahead that is. Even though you do an excellent job here...giving us enough leeway to keep things going, during these slow sales days.
I think the four styles was important for sales people to know. Having been sales for many years, the more you learn about human behavior the better salesperson you will be. Even losing a customer is a good experience, makes you better next time around.
I think the 4 techniques were valuable....I never even really thought about it before.
You can use that information in designing ads, and in dealing with different types of people.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
It was your software bug that caused this problem.He clearly indicated not to be called.
That's still no excuse for being rude.
If your software bug caused a miscommunication would you be ok if I used that as an excuse to be a a-hole to you?
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
and he said he won't deal with them, and crossed off his list.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
So say about 50% of all inquiries I get are "live" meaning I established two way contact with them.
Out of those, about 50% have appointments to come in. Out of those about 50% do come, and 50% of those buy.
So out of 100:
50 are live
25 set up appointments
12-13 showed up
6-7 bought
Out of the live ones, that request a price only and won't budge till they get one, I'd say it's about 1-3% will buy, meaning one deal if I'm lucky.
Hence I'll spend my time and effort on getting folks to come on down.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Now that I think about it, several car purchases ago I made an appointment with the sales lady. Now this wasn't to talk about anything or test drive we had already done all of that. I was ready to pull the trigger and I called her to confirm prices and everything and told her I was ready to come in and buy. All I wanted to know is when she would be available to complete the sale. She picked the time, I showed up and she wasn't there. :confuse:
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Have your "buy it know" price in mind, but ask the dealer for an offer 1st (the infamous, will you buy now if I knock your socks off offer).
Then, you can do 1 of 2 things. Make your counter offer (prefaced as 1` time, take or leave). Or 2), take the dealers 1st pitch, in case it is lower than what you had in mind!
ANyway, I have used the internet for reaserch, but never felt like trolling out for offers. But, the last few cars I have bought did not lend themselves to this method:
1) 2005 Odyssey, when the new body style was out and some colors weren't even on the ground yet (but, I did find a "1 rice" guy in Mass. that was selling for $239 over invoice. briefly). Actually bought local, after he grudginly agreed to match on one of his only in stock units.
2) THe 1st customer delivered Scoin tC in my area, and since those were 1 price only, no price to shop (and put your name on the wait list)
3) the last 2005 Accord EXL stick left over (in mid-December). Can't shop what no one else has!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
What Prius owners don't like to gamble? Or even work in casinos?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Learning styles do deal with social interaction and information processing. The style relates to how the teacher (salesman) presents the information in order to achieve interaction in the classroom (on the sales floor). That is why teachers (salesmen) need to be prepared to address the various types of students (customers) in order that the information be processed effectively. Example: If I determined that you were a strong visual learner, I would give you brochures, booklets, spec sheets, a CD, etc. about the new car model. You've seen those things sitting around the show room. Some customers look at them and some don't. The visual learner may say something like, "Can you give me some information to look at on Model X?" Once they have looked over the material, the customer may be much more receptive to discuss the car model with you. The auditory learner wants the salesman to tell them the same information that is in the printed format. They don't want to read it themselves.
"The salesman's role is not to teach but to inform."
Yes and no. If you demonstrate how to operate the CD changer, the convertible top, the nav system, etc., you are teaching your customer valuable skills. If you tell the customer mpg, nitrogen tire pressure, oil change info, etc., then you are informing them about specific things. I always think of the salesmen on this thread as good teachers. They don't realize that they have taught customers like me many things about cars and purchasing cars. I remember one night many months ago when you taught a very complex physics problem. Like it or not, you DO play the role of teacher.
Come on now. Give in and agree with me. :P
Richard
But the opposite to that is never, as the seller, make the first offer. Someone has to make it and to streamline negotiations you need to know when you have to make that first offer. Sometime the customer has to make that first offer or nothing gets done.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
In a way both methods work.
At Honda, when we presented the first offer, and usually it was about $250 off, yes two hundred fifty, but it set up the negotiating that there's not going be very much discount available. The customer then would look silly making a counter offer of $3000 off. But then again at Honda the margins are slim, so even $250 off was a lot.
At Chrysler and Nissan, we let the customer make an offer. By that, the customer makes the offer to buy, initials by the number, and usually gives a credit card with the offer. So this way they commit to buying. Once there's a commitment, it's easier to get the deal done, where as at Honda there was no commitment until after we present the numbers.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
No debate there... I agree rudeness is not necessary. Unfortunately for you, the buyer probably thought you deliberately chose to ignore his do not call request. I doubt he believed you; I'm not sure I would have either. Still, no need to be a horses rear on his part. Hopefully someone is working on a software fix....?
Well, that is both compelling and persuasive. I submit and declare you the winner.
Like it or not, you DO play the role of teacher.
As a matter of fact, I do teach and I'll even go so far as to say that teaching is about selling too! You come from the educational frontlines and we both know that one size certainly does not fit all. From my own experience, there is a world of difference in how automotive technicians learn compared with med techs or paralegals, electronics engineers and so on.
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
Let me share this interesting little note with you. They sold my '06 convertible yesterday. I timed it. The car was on the lot for 16 days. They sold it to a local person. I guess that I will see the lemon :lemon: around town. I hope that the new owner doesn't have too many problems with it. I had figured that it might go to auction, but the dealer found an up. I told him today that I was glad that he could sell it. He said, "You AND me!" I'm buying my Explorer tires from him. Perhaps I'm too innocent, but that dealership has been so nice to deal with since I moved here.
I guess you'll be glad when the 15th comes and goes. It must be a hectic time.
Richard
You're still a winner because I gave you an "A" for debate tactics, an "A" for participation, and an "A+" for being open to the thoughts of others.
BTW, I pegged you as a tactile learner because of your knowledge in physics and math. Most physics and math students love hands-on activities, manipulatives, and tinkering with machinery. Jmonroe is another tactile learner with a physics background. If he couldn't mess with his cars, he would go crazy. Of course we do have some doubts about his mental state. :P :shades:
Richard
Oh, I've got multiple partial disabilities (have had arthritis since a teenager though I function quite well, thanks) but somehow manage to keep myself just north of not working. In another few years I can officially collect Social Security. I could collect a pension right now but since I'd have to make up the difference since my kids are still young I may as well keep working.
Credit (as is often the case) Wickipedia.
Ok here is my interesting little note. I found out today that someone is going to be selling a '79 MG later this spring. Guess who will gets the right of first refusal?
All I have to do is sweet talk she who must be obeyed so I can buy it if the price is right.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I beg to differ. I am definitely ahead on slots.
Ok I only play them once or twice a year and I walk away when I am winning.
Ok I hit it really big once (more than 3,000 times the bet when I played the 2 cent slots).
I usually play Blackjack.
The casino I usually go to had a big fire a week or so ago.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I am glad you gave the answer Richard. As I said I would have guessed an email person....physics is an exact science and if everything is written down it will be easier to analyze.
I am glad Tidester agreed with you. Knowledge is power, and the more a salesman knows about human behavior the better. Alsmost all jobs require some sales ability...a politician tries to sell himself, an assembly line worker might try to sell the idea he is a hard worker etc. Any help is greatly appreciated...it might even make us understand our children better, or even spouse.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Thank you boom, that is an eye opener. A lot of work for little pay off. I could almost see it coming though, most people using the internet are shopping for price.
The real goal is for you to get the guy into the store. I think you need something to draw them in. Tickets for a movie or a certificate for a restaurant if they actually come in. I think you have to turn it around and play on their greed. Maybe a spinning wheel in the showroom...they get 1 to 10% off the MSRP if they actually come in for a test drive...that will separate the players from the real buyers.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Jayrider be careful, what you are starting here.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I know, let's get Mikey! He'll offer anything! (I hope someone is old enough to understand that...)
Anyway, if the dealer insists that I make the 1st offer, it will be a lowball. Why would I start at my bottom line (IOW, Bobst them), if they require the negotiating game be played?
Really my point is that if you don't ask, you won't get.
And add in the psychological aspect the Boom mentioned. If MSRP is 20K, and I am willing to Bobst 17K, and they wnat 18, the 17 looks pretty good when I start at 15!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I don’t think dealers feel buyers are so stupid/gullible as to pay $995 for an ADM wax job. I do however think that there are enough buyers that will negotiate this wax job down to say, $75.
I’m sure any dealer will allow himself to beat out of over $900 and still be thrilled to sell his cars for $75 over MSRP. I also believe these buyers are the ones that will tell everyone they talk to how much they got off the dealers asking price.
As everyone here knows, this practice wouldn’t exist if it didn’t work.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
OK, here I am! If I had a dollar for every time someone has said that to me, I would have retired long ago.
What's this stuff? I don't know, some cereal. Did you try it? I'm not gonna try it, you try it. I'm not gonna try it. Let's get Mikey to try it. Yeah, he won't eat it, he hates everything. He likes it, hey Mikey.