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I'll give you a couple of guesses on how I deal with those.
This is not a letter to Resident, it had my name on it. I bought a Chevy in Oct 2006. Is Chevy sending a letter to everyone that bought a car in the last 3 or so years?
I'll let some of you tell me how many cars Chevy sold in the last 3 years. Multiply this by $.276 per pre-sorted letter mail. When Chevy/GM is losing billions per month, do they really need to add to it with a letter like this? The letter had no impact on my future purchase of a car. It is a total waste to me, and I would think it would just be a junk mail to be tossed to 99.9% of the people that receive it.
I'm glad you said that. I'd hate to think that the only call I can make to the dealer is to ask where to send the check.
If dealers don't want customers calling up and asking dumb questions they shouldn't run those ads that leave the reader confused.
I was thinking of calling the store with the $12990 PT Cruiser just to see what they say. Now, thanks to Moo, I'm afraid if I do I might be marked for death.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I'm not sure that matters. The end result is that people are getting ripped off.
If you're getting raped it doesn't matter if your attacker is a Republican or a Democrat. :mad:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Yeah, someone is likely to use up their turn on your phone call, but it's their problem not yours. Get the info you want and if the salesperson is friendly enough, you just might bite and get that PT
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
That is pretty incredible. And even if it did get someone to go out and buy a Chevy, how much would they be making? Certainly not enough to justify the cost of all those letters.
You can get a brand new 2009 Lincoln MKZ (I am pretty sure) for $23,999 with no interest for 60 months.
MSRP $33,490
Disc $2991
Rebate $4500
Renewal (whatever that means) $2000
Final price $23,999
They say nothing about this offer on the website and I don't even see a car listed with an MSRP of $33,490, the cheapest is about $37k. Maybe it is one 3 on the column model or something. I would love to know what the scam is. At that price it doesn't make sense to buy a used GM.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
That makes sense. But, wouldn't people get upset and walk out after they drive down to pick up their new Lincoln for $24k? Or do they feel really stupid by then and just take all the add-ons?
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Since I’m the one that started the now “infamous doc fee thread”, I feel I have to say something here. When I’m buying anything, especially a car where there are all sorts of ways that dealers add items and fees to jack up the price, I want to know where every dollar I’m spending is going and if that cost is worth it to me. Why is that so hard for a car salesman to understand? If a doc fee is so insignificant that it doesn’t deserve an explanation, don’t charge it. You won’t get an argument from any buyer when you do that. It’s the final price that I’m interested in but I’d like an honest answer to a reasonable question.
I guess there are some things I’ll never understand.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
And what is the lesson that it teaches? Is it that you should not answer the phone? Or you should just hang up unless it's an offer to buy? Just curious. :P
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
I learned a valuable lesson about work during my lifetime. If you try to avoid it, hate it, get upset at people easily, only wish for the day you no longer have to do it............then your days will be long and boring and you will wish you were somewhere else.
BUT
If you throw yourself into work, have a positive attitude, look at every phone call as a learning experience and as a challenge, enjoy your time at work and your precious time off (which you will enjoy even more if you work hard), then the days will fly by and you will gain experiences that you can use to better yourself later.
Every question should be answered as well and nicely as possible. If you get pushed to the end of the line the dealer has a poor system for handling calls. You have learned a valuable lesson so you can change it when you become a sales manager.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Experience is indeed a good teacher. What you sales folks have to realize is that the buyer also brings his own experience and perspective into the sales transaction. Remember, you may have sold more cars that he has...but it is entirely possible that he has bought more cars than you have.
From my personal experience, anytime a salesperson becomes evasive, flatly refuses to answer a question, shows just a touch or arrogance or disdain, I am pretty much done with him.
Simply put, I buy cars from people that I like and that I can identify with. If that salesman is not sincere, he better be a pretty damn good actor.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
I realize dealers are entitled to a profit of "as much as they can possibly make", but there is a limit to the added fees!!!!
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/blogs/beltway-confidential/Furor-grows- - -over-partisan-car-dealer-closings-46261447.html
Are any posters here in stores slated for closure?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Thanks for the info Joel. That's strange. How many people will be buying a new Lincoln, after leasing one?
I guess, if you don't have a lease, and are just buying, you miss out. Or, if you had a lease, and want to lease again, you lose out.
I would be curious to see what the deal was if I was interested in a Lincoln, but I would be hesitant to buy if a dealer used these tactics to get you in the door.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Man...I hope you're ready for what you just stirred up.
Go get em guys. I can't wait to watch this play out.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
We've heard all the excuses....China....India....US....demand.
Bottom line, demand this year alone (let alone the demand fall off the previous couple of years) is down 20%, worldwide. Supply is overabundant (how did they put it? We're running out of places to put the oil). Yet, prices rise 60%?
Now, they don't even make an attempt to give a bogus reason for price rises.
I'm not one for government intervention, for any reason. But, this economic mess was caused partly by oil companies (in conjunction with "funny money" financial institutions). We're making attempts to pull out of it. Then, here comes the oil companies with their whining, crying, even when they were raking in record profits, with no reasonable explanation to justify them last year. That puts a damper on everything.
I agree with you. This makes no economic sense. And, stinks to high heaven of price manipulation. There's no reasonable justification. Only way to get the oil execs to reverse their thinking is when they were hauled before Congress last year. Yes, someone (many someones) needs to go to jail. As hard as the auto execs were grilled for their misdeeds, oil execs need a large push in the same manner.
We're seeing the effects of this by all the recent closings of dealerships, of the auto company layoffs. While oil isn't the only reason, it certainly has plenty to do with the general economic malaise.
And, I also agree that it is stealing from the future of younger generations who are coming into the job market to find unemployment reaching double digits in many states.
Progress won't be made in the move towards hybrids, electrics, plug-ins, or any other alternative fuel vehicles if people aren't employed, getting a paycheck to buy them, and replace their less fuel efficient vehicles.
:mad: :mad: :mad:
I think Crysler did that with their "Invoice + +" deal. One of the $500 discounts were only for people with a Chrysler lease. Seems like a sure fire way of getting a lot of people mad.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I have no love for oil execs but according to CNBC this morning the run up in oil is due to speculators....AGAIN :mad:
I thought we were going to see some government regulation in this area? I guess that kind of change wasn't on the list.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
The best way to win at this game is to buy oil stocks. I don't like seeing the price at the pump go up, but the cost is more than offset when I see my oil stocks go up.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Do u price them as a used or a certified preowned car?Or are they slightly less expensive than the 09 cars?
I could not see any link in Edmunds regarding that.Also how do I get the TMV and invoice values for new 08`s on Edmunds..All I can do is get info on the 09`s.If I need info on new 08 invoice pricing,,I have to look in the used cars section.
A local Toyota dealer says there is no rebate on a 08 Toyota 4runner but Edmunds lists the 08 incentives of upto $5500 total..
Folks,,Do I sense an interesting sales story developing here?? :P
Thanks;
Consider couple of facts:
1. Most of oil reserves in the world is owned by state-run companies, from Canada, to Middle East, to Latin America, ro Russia. "Big Oil" profits on contracts with these guys, either on exploration, or services, or leases. In other words - they surf the wave, they don't really make it.
2. You consistently and persistently seem to forget all those 2 bilion people in India and China who woke up and decided they want a new car, better food, better house and better TV. Ten years ago those people couldn't even dream of those items, today they are actually buying them. Where do you think they get fuel to manufacture and run all of that? Moon?
Bottom line there is a real pressure on natural resources created by forces that didn't exist twenty years ago and are totally out of control of the evil Big Oil. If you looked closely at Exxon last year you would actually notice they had no control over the price of their commodity whatsoever - and they knew it. They were hoarding cash in anticipation of the crash (if they had such power and control, as you seem to believe, whould they actually allow that crash? Why would anybody do that?) at that time everybody else was already in $300/barrel camp and acquiring properties for exploration at top dollar. Today they started buying those properties at steep discounts. All you can do is applaud their foresight and savvy - and perhaps buy their stock (disclosure: I do not own stock Exxon, but I am always considering buying some
Basically - there are way more powerful forces in play for commodities than the evil Big Oil. All those guys can do is try to surf that wave and profit. Don't get me wrong - they do and they are easy target to hate (we all like to have one, don't we), but the power is not in their hands. Not really.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I'm in Orlando and have seen ads with dealer fees as high as $899. Orlando is fast becoming a snake pit, you should see all the screamer ads about "special pricing" due to the C and GM BK. And I'm with you on how to work around them. On my last purchase, I told him I was adding a doc. fee the same as his to handle the paper work of signing over the title to him. :shades: So we charged each other doc. fees of $499, LOL.
If you did own their stock you would know better. Buying Exxon stock would seem like a good idea...unless you actually look at the Exxon stock performance during the last couple of years. From July 2007 to July 2008 gas prices went from $2.70 to $4.12 per gallon and oil prices went from $68. a barrel to $137. per barrel. In July 2007 Exxon stock was priced around $80. In July 2008 the stock was priced at...$80. so the stock did not go up at all.
So far in 2009 gas prices have gone up by 60% and the Exxon stock price has dropped from $70. in Jan. 09 to $68. yesterday !!
So it seems that Exxon has even found a way to stiff their own investors. Where in the world did those billions of dollars in excess profits go if all that money had no effect on the value of the company? Certainly not to drilling or exploration. Bonuses?
It is not the things that we don't know that hurt us. It is the things that we know...are are wrong about.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
BTW, using your own period S&P dropped from 1500 in July 07 to 1300 (14% loss) in July 08 and is today at 900 (40% loss from July '07). Exxon has no loss 07-08 and and 15% over this year an a half. I would take that loss plus paid dividend in a minute over that kind of performance, not to mention all that cash left in coffers for acquisitions, dividend payments, or what else.
It's always easy to beat up on somebody, especially when the target is big and really sympathetic. Who likes big oil execs? No real accuracy needed, just aim and fire, something will stick.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Secondly, the big stock market crash did not occur until shortly after that time period.
Thirdly, Exxon is one of the foundation companies that make up the Dow-Jones index and that index only fell about 5% during that time period. Not that averages matter that much. Many other stocks went up during that period and if any one stock should have gone up it would be Exxon.
Lastly, yes they are easy to beat up on. Deservedly so.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Very well said and I completely agree with you.
Anyone who truly believes that the investor-owned oil companies dictate petroleum prices would be foolish not to buy shares in one or more of these companies.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Now I happen to think that the rise of OPEC in the early 1970s changed the fundamentals of the oil business, & severely & permanently crippled the oil companies' power to set prices. IMO, oil shares were a much more compelling investment before that. I own a few shares, but I won't add to my current holdings.
BTW, Exxon was just an example - I don't want to get into technical discussion about their stock price - it was not the point. Perhaps they were not the best in their sector, perhaps they lagged - again, not the point. Buy it, not buy it - don't care.
The point is they only surf the commodity wave, they don't make it. 2+ billion people in Asia aspiring to our standard of living do. The governments of another half billion of people who hold the fields with the energy to fuel those aspiration hold the rest of the cards. Exxon, BP, or whoever else you will throw in are little merchants serving those two big interests and making money of it. Their power is mostly in the technology and experience they hold, not in actual commodity. They are no less at mercy of those governments than those Jewish bankers in medieval times. Sure those guys were getting rich until the king decided he didn't want to pay them anymore - then he organized little "pogrom" and got his slate clean so he could borrow again. Some French kings were doing it mutliple times.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Additionally, their stock prices stayed about the same, even as oil doubled in price. Oil is currently about the same price now as it was at the start of 2009 but gas prices have increased by 60%.
Why would anyone invest in something that defies logic?
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Precisely my point.
a)$60,000 to spend
b) a limit of $30,000
c) a limit of $20,000
d) a limit of $15000
My answer would be the same for all 4 - a Scion XB. My wife & I love her old style one and the new one looks and rides even better. This is something that got me into some interesting conversations with customers over the years when they would ask me "what do you drive?". I was a shock to them that I not only didn't drive what I was selling, but didn't own a car at all. I prefer to keep my expenses to a minimum & ride an inexpensive scooter or motorcycle to work. I'll save the extra money to buy important things... like vacations and nice dinners.
Crude Oil (barrel): 140 40 50 38 63
Percent change -72% +25% -24% +65%
Gasoline (gallon): 4.10 1.70 1.80 1.90 2.43
Percent change -59% +6% +5% +28%
Anything can be derived from it, depending on you time frame. You chose yours to say "Oil companies screw over inventors" and "oil companies chose gasoline price off the wall". There is a correlation between oil and gasoline. But it's not straight line - trends lag, intersect. You conveniently snapped two shots in a incredibly volatile market, from time where oil was up from its lows, but gasoline was still close to its lowest (as it lagged crude's steepest decline ended just month prior your snapshot), then skipped the part when it fell giving gasoline time to "recover" then it rose again, which eventually caused gasoline to rise with it.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Now there is a unique choice. I think you and Oldfarmer win the award for originality, he chose all used cars and kept the extra cash.
What kind of cars do you sell?
You are probably a particularly good salesperson for someone who wants a car for basic transportation but isn't "crazy" about cars....maybe you can relate to those people who are possibly in the majority of car buyers.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I was surprised to pay an extra $250 for a Monster Cable $80, when a no name for $20 would do about the same, plus connectors and a few other parts. The Geek Squad did a good job, they were polite and neat, and I did expect to pay for some extras, but not an additional $250 with taxes etc. I think it is a new way to run up your bill, and at that stage you don't have much choice in the matter.
Next thing car dealers will install rust proof and mop and glo and not tell you about it until it is already on the car....oh sorry, they already do that!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
When I buy a new car, I always make sure that the contract contains a "no advertising" stipulation & I always ask for & get plain black frames for the license plates. The salesmen I've worked with have never objected & have always complied with my request.
Why don't more people do this? Why do most new car buyers put up with this visual clutter? This stuff does nothing to improve a new car's appearance. Why give the dealer free space on the back of your car?