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Comments
One thing I do not like about the CRV is the spare being mounted on the rear door. This design doesnt make sense to me. If I were to get hit in the rear I would think the whole rear would be squashed in because the bumper is mounted closer to the frame then the spare is.
Then again how often will one get hit in the rear and if one does its the other drivers fault. But just think the design is a little flawed.
Heres some data I found on the 2002 CRV
Due for release as early as September 2001, the
keenly awaited next generation Honda CR-V will be
powered by a 2.4 litre dohc VTECi engine to counter
the increases in size and weight. The increases have
been made to further distance the up-market CRV
from Honda's own HRV, a model seen to be
encroaching on CRV sales, especially since the HRV
was launched in the more practical 5 door format.
The new 2.4 unit is an enlarged version of the 2.0
litre i Series unit currently seeing service in the
Stream and Stepwagon MPVs.
I'm having a little problem getting a discount on the HL right now and my search if becoming a pain in the [non-permissible content removed]. I can get an Mazda MPV DX with power package and 2nd ac for 20k exactly. While the HL 4cyl 2wd I'm looking at costs around 24,000+ because they dont want to sell it without all the options. They also tell me the 4cyl is hard to get. My only conclusion is to wait a few months when more SUV's come out, and the HL is'nt as new, then maybe they will deal.
The Mazda Tributes price has dropped dramatically since its inception last year.
Noticed Toyota just increased their discount on the Corrola and Camary 250.00 to 1250.00 now
Also Mazda increased their discount on MPV from 1000.00 to 1500.00.
Granted the HL is a great car but I need a little incentive. I doubt our economy is going to get any better the next 3-6 months.
I have not heard anything about a redesign that would move the CRV into a competitive position with the HL. I have heard that Honda is planning a mid size SUV as a cousin to its Accura MDX. (Much like the relationship between the Lexus RX 300 and the HL.) My understanding is that that future vehicle (probably 2003) will replace the much maligned (and slow selling) Passport (built for Honda by Isuzu). Honda's new midsize SUV is more likely a competitor for the HL than a redesigned CRV (which would continue to compete against other small SUVs such as the Escape, Tribute, Santa Fe, etc.). Honda's two current SUVs are no match for Toyota's five SUVs in terms of market coverage and appeal.
At this point they are not comparable vehicles. It is obvious they serve two different segments of the SUV market. I would expect the 2002 CRV to not dramatically change from its present model, else why would they still call it the CRV? If it is going to be comparable to the HL, it should be named differently. Besides, the market for mini-SUVs is still very strong.
Thank you so much to everyone who has been writing here, and sharing their experiences. It has been a very useful resource for us. I have spent the last three months doing pretty much nothing other than research cars in all of my free time. We ended up making a decision this last week, and I thought perhaps some of the fruits of that research might be beneficial to some of you.
Buying a car is such a personal process in the sense that it has to match the needs of individual families. Let me explain our circumstances, so that you know what we were looking for.
-we were looking to buy a car that we could keep for at least 8-10 years, and be able to afford to pay it off in 4 years. We were hoping for something no more than about 28-9, which is no small change for a young family.
-we have two children now, one 8 and one under a year. The one under a year is in a car seat with a base. We are hoping to have another one soon, so I wanted a car that could accommodate two car seats and a third child somewhere down the road.
-where we live, this past year we got 192 inches of snow. No joking. There are also lots of hills around here. I really did feel better about having an AWD drive vehicle, even though I know some people feel that they can do o.k. with Front wheel drive and good snow tires. For our peace of mind, we wanted the AWD.
-the style of the car (minivan, SUV, station wagon) did not make much of a difference to us. The safety, quality, and reliability do. I have no intention of ever taking the car off road.
That being said, here are the cars that we looked at:
Minivans:
-Honda Odyssey: I had read so many great reviews about this car that I could not wait to see it. First of all it is so hard to find one to test drive, and I for one will not purchase a car without test driving it. I have to say that when I finally saw one, I was a bit disappointed that it was as plain looking on the inside as it was (for a vehicle at 26,840).
Pros’: Honda reliability, disappearing third row is pretty nifty, it seems to hold resale value pretty well.
Con’s, for us: no AWD available now. Also, by the time you get to third child, you have to use the third row, which significantly cuts down on luggage space.
-Toyota Sienna: I know it basically gets the same reviews as the Odyssey, so we took a long look at it. I hadn’t thought that I would like the folding third seat feature as much as the disappearing magic seat, but by the time you get to the third child it might actually be better.
Pro’s: I liked the inside of it actually a bit better than the Odyssey. Still, kind of plain looking.
Con’s: no AWD right now. Price goes up very quickly by the time you get to the LE with extra value package (the one we were looking at.)
-Dodge/chrsyler: I looked at this because it is a minivan with AWD. I test drove them, and just did not care so much for them. What can I say: I just felt like I was in a minivan! Wait, I WAS in a minivan. With AWD price went up quickly (28-30), although Dodge easily does rebates and financing rates.
So, we crossed off the minivans for now. We might look at them again in a few years (maybe the VW microbus will be out without all the technology mumbo jumbo for around 30?)
We looked at a few SUV’s, but I could not stomach the gas mileage (and insurance) of most. One we took a good and long look at was the MDX. Yes, it has great reviews, and probably will have good crash test results. (important to us).
-pro’s: very nice, luxurious feeling inside. I do like the folding and disappearing nature of the third seat. I wish more Suvs and minivans came like that. It has AWD. Everything feels like high quality.
-con’s: price. It just hurts to pay 34,850 for a car. If it wasn’t selling at MSRP, maybe.
-I did look at Subaru’s, which we have been driving for a long time. I really have not felt that they are quite big enough for us. The 4-cylinder doesn’t give us quite enough power, and I don’t want to fork out 28-30 k for a v6 Subaru. They are great cars for the winter, though.
Second choice: VW Passat Wagon with 4motion. God, I loved this car! I had ridden BMW and MB’s before, and this reminds me so much of them. Incredible ride, great, great feel on the road. An amazing piece of design and ride. O.k. somebody stop me now before I drool too much.
Pro’s: very good AWD system, taken from the Audi. Wonderful design. Perfect for two kids with stuff. VW’s advertising fees are a lot lower than toyota’s in our area (100 vs. 500). Don’t get me started on how much of a scam it is to charge the customer for the car maker’s trying to sell a car to us. Why don’t I charge them for the time I have spent researching the car anyway, their advertising fees are lower, and there is generally much less dealer mark up on these cars than there was on Toyota’s. So sometimes the bottom line difference is actually less than you think. I was so impressed with the safety design on the car: front airbag, side airbag, the awesome curtain air bag. Amazing crash results . All good!
Con’s: as frustrated as I am to say this, it was a tad bit too small for us. Thinking of having not two but three kids in the back seat, it felt too small. We tried and tried to convince ourselves that it would do o.k.,, and maybe it would for some other parents’ children. But for ours, who are infected with the “dad, she is touching me” germs, it was too small. If you have only two kids, it just might be the perfect car.
The GLX is certainly VERY nice, and it would have been sold to us for right around 31k. A bit more than what we wanted to spend. If you could find a GLS with 4motion (very hard to do), it was a bit cheaper, maybe around 28 or so. I do hope that someday they will come out with the 4 cylinder with 4motion for around 24-5. I know it would be a huge success for them.
Believe me, it was hard to say no to this car. After the kids are a bit more grown up (and we get the inevitable minivan), I would love to come back and look at this car.
Our choice: Toyota Highlander V6, AWD.
First time I got my wife in this car, she said: woooooo .. Thank God there were no salesmen around!
:-)
she loved how it rides high, and it has a magnificent view of the road. (open the sunroof, and drive on some hills to see what I am talking about). It has the unibody thing going for it, so the gas mileage is not as bad as most SUV’s. My conscious felt better about that. It got pretty much the exact same gas mileage as the VW with 4motion (which is not the same MPG as the regular VW).
The seats in the back are definitely bigger than the Passat’s, and two car seats and a kid all fit, quite comfortably. Yes! On paper it says that it gets .5 more cubic feet of cargo space than the Passat, but it felt like there was more useful space. When people want to knock the car, they call it a raised camry wagon. People who want to make themselves feel better about it, call it a Lexus RX 300 without the Lexus price, plus it is a tad bit bigger. I think both comments have a measure of truth to them.
The one we have gotten has front and side airbag, so I feel good about the safety score. Given the recent crash test score of the Toyota trucks, I would expect the HL to do 4 out of 5 stars or better. It has that great engine, which hopefully will go for at least 150k. What can I say: we were so torn between the two cars. For us, the Toyota was a bit bigger (which fit our purposes), it was 3000$ cheaper, and perhaps would get more reliability down the road than the VW.
Highlander it is for us. May it keep my family safe for many, many years.
I hope this has helped some of you who are thinking of making your decision.
Also, any recommendations on a bike rack?
I just bought Toyota's Yakima rack, the "Terry Firm". Use 15% discount coupon I got from dealer parts department when I bought my highlander.
I'm still leaning towards the HL and the Mazda MPV but dont see a reason to rush it. The next few months new and revised versions of other suvs are coming out, and buying a HL while its so new is like paying through the nose.
Bye the way dont take your car to Jiffy Lube I hear so many horror stories about them.
http://www.hitch-web.com
It is not listed on thier web site. They list a Draw-tite hitch and a Dalan hitch, which are both square tube styles. The Hidden Hitch is a round style. The cost is about $150 shipped UPS (plus tax if applicable).
If you want to tow a trailer (and you have the tow prep pkg), all you need for wiring is an adapter cable that plugs into the wiring harness located inside the black plastic cover on the bottom of the vehicle beneath the spare tire. This adapter cable is available from :
http://www.toyotaguys.com/towparac.html
The cost is $24 shipped.
Both items are easily installed by anyone who can use a wrench. The only additional thing you may want to do is mount the adapter cable mounting bracket to the hitch or the vehicle with screws. This requires drilling 2 holes. If you have any questions or want to see pictures of an installation, e-mail me.
Toyota Original p/n 90915-YZZB9 Oil filter $3.99 or aftermarket FRAM PH3614 $2.99 or FRAM DG3614 $6.99
hope this helps.
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
-CD
(wondering)
CD
I sat in a Subaru Forrester last week and found that the steering wheel does not adjust up high enough to clear my knees. And the sunroof takes away the inch of headroom that I need. I was very dissapointed becuase I had seen CR's report rating it as one of the most reliable vehicles being made today and because it has more bang for the buck than just about anything out there, if you are looking for 4-wheel drive.
I've driven a Tribute and was impressed with the handling and power, although the engine made a lot of noise on hard acceleration. I am going to test drive the HL soon and find out for myself whether I prefer the 4 or the V6...
Goto www.rateitall.com
Choose the SUV section and hit the polls!
As I posted on a couple of messeges earlier (no. 2763-4), we finally ended up deciding to buy a Highlander. We look forward to picking it up next week.
I wanted to take a minute to thank our own "cliffy" here. I am sure that those of you who read the messeges here have seen his very helpful notes. I am a bit neurotic about the decision to buy a car, and over the length of the 3 months that I spent on it I bounced endless questions off of him. I was always impressed by the courteous way that he handled them.
He sells his cars in VA, but I was willing to actually drive from where are (NY) to there to get a car from him, except that we found out that one of the options that was very important to us living in NE region does not come on the non-limited HL's that are manufactured for mid Atlantic area. So we did end up buying one locally.
Anyway, I can not say enough about cliffy, and how he treated us during the whole process, even after he knew that we were going to purchase from another dealer. For every nightmare story that you read about crooked salesmen, it is good to know that there are still some wonderful souls, full of information and respect still around.
thank you cliffy, keep it up!
and just for you cynics out there (you know who you are), no, I am not affiliated with cliffy or his dealership, I don't make any money by referring people to him, etc.....
He is just a very informed person about Toyotas who sells cars at the best rate going. I thought others might want to know that, and use his service.
Your price is pretty good. There are several stores in LA that will respond well to e-mail requests. Seek them out.
Cliffy has friends in that area, you can email him and I'm sure he'll be glad to refer you to someone. I'm not allowed to do so because of my job.
I considered the Odyssey the Hl and the Mazda MPV, I have test driven all multiply times.
The Odyssey is nice but its as big as a bus and you will have to get used to it. Quality seems to still be there.
The Mazda MPV drove ok don't believe all the bull that you hear about it having too small an engine.At 20k + tax tag and title theres little to complain about. For me.
The Highlander drove the best of them all. It's probally on the top of my list, I have a 4 year old and 7 month old lots of room for them to grow into it. You have a 10 year old and a 15 year old, I'm not sure how good that size suv will be for you basically I think it might be a little small. But if you test drive it and it looks fine by all means go for it.
By the way the dealers here are starting to hurt, sales are dropping all over the place even at Toyota. Maybe we can get a shot at it cheaper.
Has anyone ever used this company for chrome wheels. I was considering them for the HL, but $595.00 seems high.
Is there a better way?
Another thought about hitches - we live in Colorado and will use the HL for skiing, camping, biking. The hitch option gives you the opportunity to attach a bike/ski rack (we bought a Yakima)to the HL without using the roof. We drove into our garage with bikes on the roof of our 92 Camry. Bad.
For those considering a HL our advice is buy one!
The Brits killed that rule about 30 years ago, but the Japanese bureaucrats move slowly. I've not been to Japan in 10 years, but I think they did away with that regulation in the early '90's.
It was never a styling gimmick and ruined some perfectly good fenders on otherwise decent-looking cars.
What annoys me is that I have to pay for common items such as the tonneau cover and cargo mat, considering how much the HL cost. I was told by Toyota parts departments in Vancouver and Washington State that the tonneau cover is not yet available and it would cost 850CAD or 500USD respectively. Are they insane! Who would pay that amount for a piece of cloth on a spring? Does anyone know of a generic substitute that will fit?
In addition, I know there has been much discussion about a centre cosole. Personally, I wouldn't mind having one, but did not have that option. Toyota has nothing portable available. I checked the Jeep Wrangler one suggested on this board. It is the only one I have found that will fit the 7 1/2 inch space between the front seats, but it looks cheap (though it isn't cheap). Any others out there?
From reading this board, I found that many HL owners are having to make compromises(i.e. Lexus hitch, wrangler console). Looks like Toyota figures their reputation for quality makes up for their lack of attention to customer needs.
Venting is good. I feel better now.
When will they be available? I assume Toyota will be making more of them to meet demand. How about pricing.When will Toyota recognize that it is in their best interest to make more available?
need some real world info.
By the way, putting felt pads on the glove box eliminated the vibrating like a charm. You can get them cheap at a hardware store or wherever. got a bunch at home depot for cheap. Use them on everything else too (like our banging security door)
Thanks......
Thanks for any responses in advance.