Toyota Highlander

dmuzyka · February 2003

So there we are, the wife and I, finally deciding on the Highlander instead of the Escape because of quality issues. We want the 4 cyl., (the 6 didn't impress us - it was heavy and lumbering, and after driving the Escape, we didn't want a sled...), leather seats, roof rack, aluminum wheels, privacy glass...and, oh yeah, SIDE AIR BAGS. We have a kid, it's only a $250 option, very reasonably priced. Not a single 4 cylinder model available in the US with airbags. We have to wait 10-12 weeks for Japan to send one from the factory. Is that stupid, or what? Isn't the Highlander (essentially a tall Camry wagon) supposedly a 'family' car? What gives?

tidester · February 2003

We have to wait 10-12 weeks for Japan to send one from the factory.

Pardon me for asking, but why, exactly, is that a big deal? It seems reasonable to me.

tidester, host

bigorange30 · February 2003

Take a look at honda and what they do with their Pilot and Odyssey. You cannot buy either off the lot period. Everyone who gets one has to order it no matter what options they get. They also charge MSRP for them and they are still both very popular. Think about why that might be. The restrict production and thereby drive down the supply which in turn drives up the demand and therfore the price. Its pretty smart if you ask me. Domestic car makers on the other hand, make high volumes and have them sitting on the lot and dealers are forced to offer them at cut rate prices to get rid of them. Who is the stupid one? I don't think its the former.

dougweaver · February 2003

There is a 4Cyl FWD HL with side airbags on a lot in Virginia, but sorry it's mine. We ordered it back in Oct and it just got here. It also has the Vehicle Skid Control and my dealer says you won't find another one like it. Now they have to put in the leather seats, fake wood dash, gold package, rear spoiler, and front hood guard ... and then it will be ready to be picked up. The waiting is starting to kill me. Patience .. man .. Patience! dpw

steveb84 · February 2003

It appears that you are placing a special order for a Highlander. If you can get in in 10-12 weeks, be happy. Special orders can take a bit longer than that, esp on Japan built models.

karp7 · February 2003

I test drove a Highlander V6 AWD today. It is -9 celsius here. I noticed, due to the ergonomic, tilted dashboard, the heater blows all the heat at the ceiling of the vehicle. When heat goes up, it does not come back down. I therefore, froze my torso and back. At the end of the test drive, I switched the control to the floor vent at which time, the heat on my torso improved a little. Does anyone else notice this? A good heater in Canada is key. I don't want my kids freezing in the backseat.

nimrod99 · February 2003

V6 2wd is 3660 lbs
4 cyl 2wd is 3500 lbs

If you think the V6 is heavy and slow - why would you get a 4 cyl?

nimrod99 · February 2003

On the 2003 center console - there is a small compartment in front of the cup holders. I presume it is an ashtray - but there are slots on either side. I don't know what these slots are for
Any ideas?

thanks

dougweaver · February 2003

Frozen kids in the backseat ... may not be a bad thing ... no more are we there yet .. are we there yet?? Makes long trips a little more bearable. dpw

phrosut · February 2003

you can buy an optional ashtray for that compartment that slides right in guided by those slots. That's the only option I saw listed in the manual but it may not be the only one available. Seems like there ought to be other choices since it would have cost Toyota the same to simply make the container that's there an ashtray in and of itself, although I'm glad they didn't since we use it for storing a mailbox key. It's even lighted at night.

phrosut · February 2003

I've used synthetics for over 25 years and weekend before last finally put 5W-30 Amsoil into our Highlander at it's first service (5000 miles). Thought I'd just report here on the early results:

Driving the same road to work and back daily, mileage given by the onboard computer went up about 1/2 mpg. It's an 11 mile trip over country roads, gaining about 1500' and "enduring" 2 stop signs and 3 lights. For the past few months mileage was consistantly 19.1 at the end of the day (lower going up to work, higher coming home). It is now consistantly 19.7 mpg avg. I haven't ever checked how accurate the onboard computer is for mpg, but the 1/2 mpg gain would be accurate I think, even if the absolute numbers aren't perfect. Of course, the gasoline savings won't be enough to pay the increased cost of the oil. I'm not sure yet whether I'll run extended drain intervals or not, as any engine warranty problems would then turn into an argument of whether or not the oil change interval was the cause.

Also, using "avg mpg", does anyone know how many miles is used for that "average"? It can't be averaging until reset as it changes too frequently for that. I'm guessing 30 or 50 miles but thought toyotaken or wwest might know the actual mileage used.

cmcardle · February 2003

mom27, two car seats fit nicely in the back seat... depending on how large they are, there may or may not be enough room for a third child. Definitely check that out by putting your seats (and kids) in there. You may need a vehicle with the 3rd row.

karp7, I leave my climate control on auto (with a/c), and here in WI, it's been on heat for months. Watching the little arrows, it's always on floor heat, unless I specifically punch up the defroster. Together with the seat warmers, it's very comfortable. And there are visible heat vents/ tubes that appear under the front seats to push heat to the back. We've had no problems with our passengers or baby that rides in her car seat.

wwest · February 2003

Automotive climate controls, "automatic A/C", typically rely ONLY on cabin air temperature as a simple/single measure of human comfort factors.

Cabin air temperature is typically less than half the human comfort equation.

In the wintertime, especially at night, with the huge amount of glass greenhouse effects in modern day vehicles, radiant cooling effects can sometimes become so dominant a factor that cabin air temperature must be raised another 10F to bring the equation into balance.

junepug · February 2003

The slots can be used to hold lighted cigarettes when the smoker is not puffing. I do hope that no one in their right mind would light a cigarette in such a nice auto as the Highlander. I used to smoke in my cars and they did retain the smell. Like many people today, I use the ashtray for various items like small keys, etc. There is nothing worse than a smelly car ashtray!!! BTW, I have recently stopped smoking.

vinod_s3 · February 2003

My HL braved the winterstorm yesterday having had to huff and puff through several inches of snow(sometimes feet). All seemed fine until this afternoon, the day after the storm, I was driving and felt a steady vibration in the entire car. It was strong enough to make me feel very very uncomfortable. However, after a few mintes, it was gone and the vehicle drove well.
Wonder what it was - any inputs folks ? Thanks in advance.

slorenzen · February 2003

probably ice on the wheels...

toyotaken · February 2003

most likely, the vibration was some packed snow or ice on one of the wheels. If it is on one side of the wheel, it can cause alot of vibration as the wheel is unballanced until the snow or ice melts or breaks off.

Ken

dougweaver · February 2003

If you were on ice or snow when it was vibrating I would guess it was ruts in the ice. I noticed tractor trailers, especially going up hills, the trailers were sort of bouncing causing ruts in the snow and ice and that might be what caused your problem. dpw

vinod_s3 · February 2003

As a matter of fact, "ice on the wheels" was the first thing I looked for, but found none. Maybe I missed it.

Thanks anyway !

griggo · February 2003

I had exactly same vibration driving yesterday but did not see any ice on the wheels. Vibration is gone today.

brad_22 · February 2003

Mine sometimes acts that way in below freezing temps. When the HL heats up, the problem seems to go away. No idea why it works that way, though.

djw479 · February 2003

Perhaps in the cold weather your tires are retaining the flat contact patch(where it sets on pavement/concrete) for a few minutes until the tires warm up and return to their more normal round profile. Especially if you have snow/ice caking on tire and/or wheel - tires like anything else can be a little stiff for the first few miles.

Also, the snow/ice can adher to the backside of the wheel - most of us do not notice buildup there as much as on frontside of wheels as we approach vehicle. Just a few thoughts, Dan

blkhl02 · February 2003

On friday night, in the mist on the 03 blizzard that blanketed NYC. I ventured out in my 02HL 4cyl 2wd. It handle very good through 1 1/2 inch snow on the ground. My only problem I had was coming down a not so deep hill, and I slow pump the brakes, and for some reason I got a counter reaction. You pedal pump back, and started vibrating. Can some explain why, if there is answer.

Also, can someone explain the ECT Snow botton on the shift gear? I assume in gave me some traction in the snow. Every time it snow a good amount I press it.

stever · February 2003

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Steve, Host

runpanther · February 2003

The counter action you feel when you hit the brakes while driving in snow is your ABS kicking in. You shouldn't "pump" your brakes anymore as the function of ABS is the "pumping" being done for you.

A lot of people think their brakes are "broken" when they start feeling their brake pedal grinding/crunching when ABS takes over. Don't worry - it's normal.

I may need to be corrected, but the ECT is primarily for starting off in deep snow. Once you get going you can probably turn it off. Fortunately, I've never had a need to use it - even in 18+ inches of snow in Vermont (AWD V6). I guess I need to read the manual too

blkhl02 · February 2003

I truly felt that I wasn't going to stop at the bottom of the hill, which was the intersection. Fortunately the light change I gave it gas. So I should just step on the brake full, instead of pumping them?

Also, thank for the feedback on the ECT button.

blkhl02 · February 2003

I truly felt that I wasn't going to stop at the bottom of the hill, which was the intersection. Fortunately the light change I gave it gas. So I should just step on the brake full, instead of pumping them?

Also, thank for the feedback on the ECT button.

runpanther · February 2003

Learn all you can about ABS. A lot of good info on this site. Particularly this one - -

http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/driving/articles/43814/article.h- tml

Also - for ECT - read the manual for more info

wwest · February 2003

is designed to elongate your stopping distance in favor of allowing you to maintain directional control of the vehicle.

If what you need to do is stop in a straight ahead fashion and in the process your vehicle itself doesn't "want" to skid sideways then ABS will almost always be a detriment.

"Be that as it may" until something better comes along ABS is the best compromise for most modern day vehicles. Depress the brake firmly and constantly for best braking activity.

Some ECT systems simply cause the automatic transmission to start up in second gear instead of first, and others actually modify the engine's torque curve, as in the 2000 GS300.

Something better: I expect that one day soon the VSC system will get "hooked", integrated, into the ABS system such that ABS will not activate unless VSC indicates that the vehicle is not following the proscribed line.

junepug · February 2003

By pressing the ECT button, you are starting the car in 2nd gear, and skipping first. Same thing as with a manual trans. When in deep snow I always started in second grear.

b717 · February 2003

To help minimze wheel spin, this mode locks out 1st gear. Transmission starts out in second gear instead of first.

cmcardle · February 2003

"When ABS engages, a loud grating sound and rapid brake pedal pulsation often accompanies the pumping action. When this occurs, insurance companies and safety experts theorize, drivers assume that something has gone wrong with their brakes, and they begin to pump the pedal or simply lift off the brake pedal, which defeats the system.

Some drivers forget that ABS allows them to continue steering the car, since the front wheels aren't locked up. Often, drivers successfully avoid an obstacle in the road by yanking on the steering wheel, but to their surprise the car actually responds, and the turn of the steering wheel that avoids the obstacle in the road ends up putting the vehicle off the road, where it sometimes crashes."

toyotaken · February 2003

Actually, something that I recall happening to a customer may be the issue for you. Air compressors often have water built up inside of the chamber where the compressed air is stored. This is most frequently drained each morning by a tech at most reputable dealers. However, at others or if you fill your tires yourself, it may not have been. If this is the case, when the tires were inflated or re-inflated, water may have been put into the tires along with the air. If this did happen, it's difficult to tell until they either pull the tires off of the rims or the water freezes. If it freezes, it would be similar to if a large chunk of ice was on the wheels. In the situation I recall, they had close to a 1/2 gallon of water in each of the tires.

So that may be something to check out...

Ken

djw479 · February 2003

I differ regarding the ABS response in #7894. While academically you can state ABS lengthens stopping distance; in the real world 'academics' lose BIG TIME!

It has been proven in automobile racing and other formalized tests that a locked-up tire does NOT stop (or aid maneuvering)a vehicle as well as a tire that is just a the edge of adhesion loss(lock-up). Being a ex-racer of both Formula-based race cars (SCCA) and oval racing I can attest that 99.99% of race AND normal drivers can NOT modulate a brake system to reduce lock-up as effectively as a computer-based system.

If ABS is legal in a racing division - ALL the racers will have it working! Only a FEW race drivers in all of the world('Rainmeisters' they are jokingly called)can effectively modulate brakes to outperform ABS and they normally are NOT trying to come to a stop; they are comfortable slidding a vehicle to change direction and maintain momentum - not a good practice for all of us to try at the same time on streets!

In snow/ice/water conditions we humans can not modulate FOUR separate tire adhesion points with any accuracy in comparison to a braking system that determines lock-up at EACH corner of the vehicle multiple times per second. Each corner/tire adhesion point of the vehicle has dynamically changing vehicle weight (weight shift, pavement undulations, changing adhesion of pavement, etc) during the stopping process.

ABS is a life-saving feature for the NORMAL driver; one who is not specially trained in vehicle dynamics, etc. Some of us think we are 'Mario Andretti', but few of us are!

Without ABS in a true PANIC situation; most drivers tend to lock-up one or more wheel/tires and lengthen their stopping distance in comparison to ABS; therefore ABS is NOT a detriment to these normal drivers!

All this being said, ABS (nor a highly skilled driver) can overcome laws of nature/physics. If you drive too fast for conditions, the available tire adhesion (to stop or turn) may not be enough to overcome the momentum you have already 'given' to your vehicle. Normally an immovable object slows us down faster than tire adhesion, or we slid to a rest with perspiration on our browse!

I personally test available adhesion when I am in difficult driving situation. Try your ABS in a empty parking lot or on a empty road(with no other autos around) to see how your ABS works. Then you will be more comfortable in your own vehicles stopping/manuevering characteristics before you need them in a panic situation.

Drive carefully and keep the rubber side down! Dan

Kirstie_H · February 2003

Are you an SUV owner who has taken special action since the anti-SUV backlash began? Have you traded in your vehicle, reconsidered your purchase, cut back on your use of your SUV, parked in more protected/secure areas, etc? If so, a magazine writer wants to hear from you.
Please respond with your make and model to jfallon@edmunds.com by February 28.
Thanks,
Jeannine Fallon
PR Director
Edmunds.com

wwest · February 2003

I think most would agree that some form of ABS is more desireable in low traction conditions than otherwise.

It is my understanding that it has now been proven, time and again, that on low traction conditions locking the tires will always result in a quicker stop.

I have always contended that is really needed is a driving simulator, very much like the ones used to teach commercial pilots what to do in the event of a failure or some type of emergency not readily replicable in the real world.

Learning to drive is of itself a relatively simple task, learning how to react properly to the unexpected is yet another thing.

cliffy1 · February 2003

Our back parking lot is unpaved. On Wednesday, we decided we needed to move a large number of vehicles out. The lot was covered by over 2 feet of snow which was melting and making the ground beneath it VERY soft. It was so soft that we couldn't get a plow back there.

We first got the 4Runners and Tacomas out. The Runners did fantastic. The VSC and torsen center did a great job. The Tacomas did well also. We used a Runner with a locked center differential and low range to pull out a number of Corollas and Camrys.

Finally, we got to the Highlanders. I didn't expect them to make it. The 2 wheel drive ones didn't without a tow rope attached. The AWD models made it with little more fuss than the Runners. It behaved just as one should expect and made an uneventful exit. VERY cool.

sirfile · February 2003

Dear cliffy1:

Re: Post #7902

Impossible!!

Sincerely,

wwest

kybill · February 2003

sirfile, nice touch of humor!

cliffy1 · February 2003

LOL

wwest · February 2003

NOT!

Improbable, but not impossible, especially coming from such an unbiased source.

WWEST....The REAL WWEST.

rmui1 · February 2003

Hi everyone, I have seen very little information on actual gas mileage that Highlander owners are getting. If you are as currious as I am about how you are doing with your mileage, could you please post what you're getting from your Highlander. Thay way we can compare notes.

Please include in your post the model of vehicle you own, ie. 4 or 6 cylinder engine and 2WD or AWD. Thanks very much!

I'll start this off by listing my experience: 20.3 MPG on first tank with 4cyl 2WD in mixed city/highway driving (hoping for better later when road conditions improve :-) ).

ssufldhcky · February 2003

2002 HL 6Cyl & 2WD (7k miles) .. mixed city/highway/country roads.. 19.8 MPG

johnlaskowski · February 2003

I have owned my Highlander V6 2WD for two weeks.
The first tank got 21.7 MPG, the second tank was 23.5 MPG. Third tank = ?

ch1133 · February 2003

2003 HL 8000+ miles now
with 50 city/50 hwy each tank is 23.7 to 25,3
very satisfied with gas prices climbing

goldston · February 2003

Mr. R. Mui,

My wife's 2001 & my 2002 H/L Limited 2WD V-6 both average 22.7 city and 25.7 highway.

The 2001 has about 13,000 miles and 2002 has about 8,000 miles.

We are very happy both H/L's and very happy with the mileage we get.

I should note, we live in Phoenix Az so the driving terrain is flat. I'm would think that mountains, snow ect.. would effect the mileage.

Best Regards, Phil

590116 · February 2003

2002 V6 2WD: 22.2 mpg average for 13078 miles. Range is from about 25 mpg (mostly VA & NC highway, <70 mph, no a/c, fall/winter) to about 17 mpg (city, a/c on, summer). At most fill-ups I see approx. 20-21 mpg.

brupop · February 2003

2002 V6 AWD LTD 14K mi.
18 to 22 MPG overall
18 to 19 for usual mix of city/urban expressway
20 to 22 for sustained highway only

hsvillage · February 2003

Just returned from a 864 mile trip to Mississippi in our 2001, V6,4wd HL. I used 36.5 gallons of 87 octane Shell, that works out to 23.67 mpg. I'm conservative on the Interstates, usually set the cruise at 65. I try not to jack- rabbit at stop signs and on state highways usually go 55-60. While I'm pleased with the gas mileage my wife gets 31-34 mpg in her 4 cylinder Camry.

cmuniz · February 2003

2002 v6 AWD limited - just finished an 800 mile trip on interstate at 23.3 mpg. Ave 19.5 on daily trips

Toyota Highlander

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