Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

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Comments

  • catman10catman10 Member Posts: 3
    Has any one had troubel with paint chip damage from rocks or whatever. I have some paint damage that seems to be worse than one should have. I don't drive on gravel roads or follow the sanding truck. I have a place where the paint is gone that is about 1/8" wide by 3/16 long. I got this while on a trip and feel that if a rock hit this I would have heard it but do not recall any extraodrinary noises. The pa8int seems thin and fragile, any comments would be appreciated.

    thanks in advance
  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    In a civil manner, I will point out that the reviewer at times appears to question the existence of the Forester in Subaru's lineup. I will again add that, beyond the marginally more useful cargo space, there's not a lot to differentiate it from the current OBS beyond physical appearance. That was not the case from 1998-2001.

    The '98-01 Forester had a better power-to-weight ratio than the Legacy Outback, and had more useful space and more power than the then-currrent OBS. Had there been a more powerful Legacy wagon or an Impreza 2.5RS wagon at the time, I may have considered them - but there were not.

    Ed
  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    I just read the Edmund's review of the 2003 Forester. In general, I think the article made valid points but it is clear that the writer is biased against the Forester. IMO, the reviewer captures the essence of the Forester in his comment "this is certainly one of the most fun-to-drive mini-utes on the market", but fails to highlight it as one of the key reasons why this vehicle sells. Mini-utes have grown over the last 5 years, but in doing so, they've also lost the nimble handling that made them popular to begin with.

    I agree with Ed's puzzlement on the 98 Forester comments. The reason why I purchased the Forester back then was that it was a lot more fun to drive than the OB (for me) and it offered more cargo space than the OB Sport.

    Ken
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The review seems to imply there is lots of overlap and that the Forester isn't the best at any one thing, but the other side of the coin is that it's well balanced and does many things well.

    Also, look at sales - Forester sales were incremental, i.e. they did not cannibalize sales of the Outback or Impreza. In fact, Outback sales even went UP after the Forester intro.

    So that's where I disagree. It caters to a different audience. I test drove an Outback, but would not have bought one at the time instead of my Forester. As Ed mentioned, I felt it was too heavy (about 200 lbs more than the Forester).

    But the review wasn't negative, really, he was just pointing out his personal preference for other Subies in the lineup.

    -juice
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    The main competitor to the Forester?

    First Drive: 2003 Mitsubishi Outlander



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  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    I honestly can't comment in great detail as I have not driven an Outlander. I have, however, driven both the new Forester and the new Lancer, the latter over the course of several days as a rental.

    The new Forester - and the old for that matter - has the Outlander trumped on power. The Mitsu does have the Sportronic option that I wish the Forester would incorporate from the FHI parts bin. The Forester also appears to better utilize interior space.

    I am on record as preferring the old Forester's styling to the new, but both look better than the Mitsu. The Outlander bears that awkward wide grille divider which was recently added to the Galant, Diamante and Lancer and appears meant to be a corporate styling cue a la Pontiac and BMW. The taillamps are similar in shape to those of the Impreza wagons, while the clear lenses (nicknamed "Altezzas" after the JDM version of our Lexus IS300, but which have more derogatory nicknames on the street) are clearly designed to attract the youth market.

    I have to admit I get stuck on the name. Mitsu no doubt must expect the car to be described as "Outland-ish." The names Outlander, Freelander and Highlander all remind me of that goofy Ben Stiller comedy, "Zoolander," from last year.

    Ed
  • forester13forester13 Member Posts: 11
    James Healey reviews the new Outlander in today's (friday) USA Today:
    Basic complaint: It's woefully underpowered and sluggish.
    He finds Forester better in almost every area:
    Power, cargo space, fuel mileage and towing.
  • fgaydosfgaydos Member Posts: 319
    I test drove a Forester today and was very impressed. It was very quick even with the auto.
    The salesman and myself hit it off pretty well as we have a lot in common, Viet Vets, same high school, same area living etc.
    So, I thought that was why he offered me the basic car for $100.00 over invoice.
    If I get a reasonable offer on my trade in I will get this nice car.

    Also test drove a CR-V and did not like the seating and space. Also it felt tippish but it does have the best resale value of mini-utes.
    Also, sat in the PT Cruizer and thought it looked somewhat cheap. Kept thinking of the poor frontal crash tests, which equals broken legs. The new 'Dream' Cruiser has this gold paint and I kept thinking of the word 'pimpmobile' for some reason.:>)
  • barresa62barresa62 Member Posts: 1,379
    in USAtoday. It's funny how USAtoday(James Healey) doesn't recommend it because of the low power but Edmunds only mentions the low-power.

    http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/reviews/healey/2002-08-08-outlander_x.htm


    Stephen

  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    What can we say. Imitation is the highest form of flattery.


    I'd have to see one first, but it looks like a good first attempt at the US market. Mitsubishi is probably following a similar strategy as with the Lancer -- intro a base model and then later go with higher performance.


    In the JDM, the Outlander is marketed as the "Airtrek" and guess what -- there's even a 2.0 Turbo version that has similar output to the turbo Forester.


    http://www.mitsubishi-motors.co.jp/AIRTREK/lineup.html


    The JDM model gets a more conservative grille.


    Ken

  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    That USA Today article wasn't very positive. Other than the rear passenger legroom, spec-for-spec, the Outlander seems to fall short. I wonder if Mitsubishi considered this obvious comparison before bringing it stateside?

    It's kind of like free advertising for the Forester!

    Ken
  • ducktapeguyducktapeguy Member Posts: 115
    Anyone ever come across these web pages? Some useful information in the archives

    www.endwrench.com
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    They'll probably password protect it now :-)

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  • goldencouple1goldencouple1 Member Posts: 209
    ordinarily, I'd back down. But this time I can't. My comment is not a "cheap ad hominem attack", it is a considered observation of automotive writers formed over my 30 years of reading auto publications. In my opinion, their perspective is highly skewed and has no application to the ordinary concerns of most people buying the product they review. Their opinions are worse than worthless, they are pernicious. I read what they say and largely disregard it as bovine fecal matter. Others may do what they like with it, but from what I have seen it is a waste of paper or electrons, depending upon their chosen medium of communication. I maintain that, in the vast majority of cases, theirs is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing. I glean numbers and a few basic impressions from what I read in auto publications and forget the rest, and it is well forgotten.
  • ducktapeguyducktapeguy Member Posts: 115
    I hope they don't password protect it, that would suck. A lot of the problems I hear on this board were mentioned in some of those articles. Oh well, maybe I shouldn't have mentioned it. You can delete my previous post if you want.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    It could be like publishing TSB's - people read them and run to the dealer with "phantom" complaints. Got to be one reason why Honda and BMW don't publish them at Alldata, etc. anymore (that and trade secret reasons perhaps?).

    Nice find, and maybe it'll be around a while too.

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  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    My business to get them in hard-copy version. I may download as much stuff as possible on there tonight.

    -mike
  • originalbitmanoriginalbitman Member Posts: 920
    At least what is available in the archive without registering doesn't seem all that technical.

    bit
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Hmm I read some of the tranny articles and they seemed pretty in depth.

    -mike
  • casecom2casecom2 Member Posts: 72
    The New York Times has a review of the Forester in Sunday's paper.


    They praise the reasonable price, good handling and standard features but don't like the lack of a V6 option and the low seating position.


    The low point: "The interior, despite upgrades, is too utilitarian even for a Subaru." Ouch!

  • dt63944dt63944 Member Posts: 66
    Reading the Times article was interesting in that it shows, again, how reviews can be biased. I don't need to be told what the reviewer felt the Forester needed to be to be "successful". I didn't even mind the comparisons to other mini-SUV's - that's fine. But to say that the Forester's differences are necessarily good or bad is a waste of my time. I bought two of them because they instantly felt good to drive and had all the space and common-sense design that I was looking for. BMW's do the same for me. The Edmunds review should be seen as pretty unbiased compared to the Times review.
  • maverick1017maverick1017 Member Posts: 212
    This is a toss out to anyone and everyone:

    For an aftermarket Catback system for an NA Forester, which pipe diameter would yield the the greatest reduction in backpressure without loosing too much to affect lowend torque, 2.25inches or 2.5 inches??

    Also which muffler manufacture/model would you guys recommend that would yield a mellow tune even at WOT??

    Thanks in advance

    Mike
  • originalbitmanoriginalbitman Member Posts: 920
    Probably because I was only interested in MY00+. There is a lot more of MY98-99 stuff I didn't look at and I bet they are a lot more detailed.

    bit
  • rsay777rsay777 Member Posts: 100
    Approaching 1k miles and am very pleased with the car. I had the hill holder on the 91 Legacy so I'm comparing the HH on the 03 to the 91. On the 91 it worked just fine in fact it took some extra brake pedal to set it. On the 03 sometimes it grabs just fine and others (same grade same intersection) the HH literally takes half way into the intersection to release. It feels as if I have used the parking brake. At this rate I'll be buying a new clutch before usual. Anyone with thoughts on this? Thanks
  • mrluthermrluther Member Posts: 23
    Does anyone know what the French call the Michelin man? I know they have a nickname for him but I cant remember what it is!!! There is a bet riding on this..........Mike
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    link
    another link



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  • lakepoplakepop Member Posts: 221
    Mike, seems like most technicians recommend that you stay with the smaller pipe (stock) to preserve low end torque. Also keep in mind that you will want to remember the air in air out principle for your engine. With that in mind consider a CAI or at least a less restrictive filter.

    Now for which muffler...I tried a couple ...most were far to DRONEY for me to handle on my daily driver. I ended up with a Brospeed which is only marginally louder than stock and NOT DRONEY! The noise maker on my machine is my CAI which howls when I really get on the go fast pedal.....just right for me.

    Hope this helps.........
  • mrluthermrluther Member Posts: 23
    Many thanks!!! I never would have remembered that moniker!! Subaru people know many things grasshopper........but can they walk on the rice paper????????? Mike
  • gened1gened1 Member Posts: 256
    Hi,
    I just returned from a trip to Vermont. I had heard( and now read in the Owner's manual) that my 02 Forester had a low fuel warning light. I tried to see it but when the gauge got down to the "e" it still wouldn't go on. I quickly got to the gas station shut off the engine then turned it back on and then the light came on. Then I refueled. The manual says I still had 2.3 gallons of fuel left when this light comes on, maybe about 40-50 miles I recon but shouldn't it have come on before I had to shut off the engine and then turn it back on?
    Has anyone been brave enough to find out when this light actually turns on? Has it been when you were waiting to test the 24hr roadside assistance part of the Subaru experience?
    Gene
  • jburjbur Member Posts: 4
    Just got through my first tank of gas on my new silver XS (auto trans). I got about 21.8 mpg on mostly city driving. Hope to see some improvement after the ECU adjusts. Also, I am planning to order a Klasse sample kit to give it a try based on the recommendations that I have seen on this message board and elsewhere.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Please, no buying or selling on Town Hall. Thanks -

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  • bird19bird19 Member Posts: 10
    for my ignorance of the rules. Please remove my post immediately.

    Thank you!
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    No biggie - we just don't want the boards to fill up with want ads. Thanks for understanding.

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  • speterson1speterson1 Member Posts: 228
    I have an '01 Forester and have had the low fuel light come on several times just as it's supposed to. When I was a grad student I only had a three mile commute and there was a gas station down the street from my apartment, so the risk of getting stranded was low. There have been other times on longer trips when I've been a little more daring; I think the most I've driven after the light has come on has been about 15-20 miles.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Outlander is a half-hearted attempt. It might, maybe, compete with the RAV4 and the plain Vitara, but not with the real contenders.

    No 5 speed at all, either, plus it's not nearly as space efficient as the Outback (which has a multilink rear also).

    All I can say is the price had better be low, low.

    NY Times wants a V6? That right there tells you how much they know. BOXER 6, B6, H6, but not Vee! Duh. An auto journalist should know better.

    For the 2.5l boxer the ideal exhaust diamater seems to be 2.25". That's what people have reported the best results with, FWIW.

    -juice
  • subaru_teamsubaru_team Member Posts: 1,676
    Okay - well, I'm not sure if the set-up is different than we had before. I'm requesting a 2K3 to drive and I'll compare the system with our '90 wagon to see how different it feels. I'll also ask some questions about it.

    If you are having a problem, please bring it into the dealer. For all new models the dealers do quality reporting. It will be a big help!

    Thanks!

    Patti
  • fgaydosfgaydos Member Posts: 319
    Just read the article in the times, see above.
    Thought it was off the mark.
    I test drove the Forester after testing the Honda CR-V and they both felt the same seat height. That was her biggest complaint, plus it was no luxury car inside. I prefer more 'utilitarian' surfaces as they are easier to keep clean inside. All in all a very favorable review.
    Thinking of buying one.
  • subiedaddysubiedaddy Member Posts: 22
    hi everybody!

    first off, i think it's very cool that this place exists and there are plenty of fanatics to keep it buzzing. so cal does not seem to be subaru friendly generally and it's great to feel at home albeit webly

    my 2k3 X has the antenna in the left rear window. a fellow at the tint shop that the dealer recommended said that titanium interferes with radio reception. im considering putting in titanium everywhere except on that window and going with some shade of conventional on that one. titanium is guaranteed for life, keeps interior temp down and protects the interior as well...

    any ideas, tips or tricks out there for getting around this? also, what can i do to get more juice out of the engine without compromising longevity?

    thanks, really, my wife is jealous, thanks!

    j
  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    j,

    Congrats on your 2003 Forester. While So Cal has fewer Foresters than No Cal, the number has definetly increased over time. I remember when I first drove down to LA in 1998 with my Forester, I was the only one on the road. When I was there just this May, I would see an occasional Forester.

    As for window tinting, the film shouldn't interfere with the radio reception since the film is applied to the inside of the glass. The antenna receives signals from outside, no? Perhaps someone else can comment -- my 98 Forester S uses a mast antenna.

    Honestly, it's difficult to get extra performance in an naturally aspirated engine. You can get marginal gains by adding a cold air intake or a bigger exhaust, but the bang-for-the-buck is low compared to a turbo.

    Ken
  • varmintvarmint Member Posts: 6,326
    I thought that the Edmunds review was okay. It hit the high and low points of the design. I thought the expectations were clear. Given that information, the reader can make up their own minds on whether or not those expectations match their own. Kudos for including information on both the automatic and manual tranny.

    The comparison with other Subaru products was probably unnecessary. Anyone going to a dealership is going to see and read about the differences or lack thereof. But I can't fault Brent for stating the obvious. That's part of the job. After reading the individual comments from the other reviewers, I thought he did a respectable job of summing it up.

    The Healy article blasting the Outlander was another story. The whole time I read it, I kept asking myself if he knew it wasn't a Ferrari. Apparently, he can't drive 55. Yet he doesn't give the reader much of a clue as to what would be acceptable.

    I'm guessing his reader polls must be dropping and he is trying to be the Howard Stern of the auto industry.
  • leo2633leo2633 Member Posts: 589
    j,

    I have an '01 Forester and my wife has an '02 Outback, and they both have the radio antenna in the left rear window. We had the windows tinted on both using 15% metallic film, and have had absolutely no problems with reception. Each vehicle also has a "hands-free" car kit for our Nokia cell phones, and the antenna is mounted on the right rear window on each. Because those anntennas stick on and conduct their signal through the glass, they had to cut away a small section to prevent interference. The cut-away section is covered by the antenna mounting surface, and isn't visible. These work excellently, BTW. Hope this helps.

    Len
  • subiedaddysubiedaddy Member Posts: 22
    ill go metallic then and if it doesnt work on that particular window remove it and look for options. seems like it should work just fine based on your experience.

    thanks again

    j
  • originalbitmanoriginalbitman Member Posts: 920
    I have metal tint in my 01 GT and have had no problems either.

    bit
  • skooterpieskooterpie Member Posts: 7
    Hello all,
    Just purchased the new style Borla© header for my '01 Forester. Just wondering if anyone has put a header on their forester and if you put some kind of heat wrap material around it to prevent warped valves, O2 malfunctions etc. I live in Southern California where the temperatures do not dip extremely low, but we do hit the slopes in the Winter ocasionally.
    Thanks for any and all advice!!!!!!!!!
    /Scott
  • vifamvifam Member Posts: 5
    Just came back from 900 miles trip (Los Angeles to San Francisco) with my 02 L AT. The average highway gas mileage is 27.8 MPG. Right on the mark. Unlike So Cal There are lots of Sube in bay area.

    I am also considering tinting, but concern about metallic tint might interfere radio reception. Could people with metallic tint share with us which brand you have? Maybe some brands interfere while some don’t. I also found a German brand (Huper Optik) that use ceramic coating instead of metallic. Anyone has experience on this brand? The tint shop (the only Huper Optik dealer in Los Angeles area) quoted $330 for 5 windows. Is it too much?

    - Jason
  • dstch82dstch82 Member Posts: 8
    Subaru is ranked no.4 in resale value, just after VW, Honda and Toyota, better than Nissan. Not bad at all.


    http://www.cars.com/carsapp/national/?srv=parser&act=display&tf=/news/national/storytemplate3.tmpl

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The Outlander may actually be adequate for the driver that drives at 6/10ths all the time, because the torque peak happens and low-low 2500rpm, and available torque ain't that bad.

    But it doesn't make much power high up in the rev band, so street demons aren't gonna like it. There actually is no point to revving that high, it's probably just as quick shifting at 4000 rpm vs. redline.

    I take resale values with a grain of salt, but that may be because I hold on to my cars for long periods, usually 7 years or more.

    The flaw with them is that they don't know exactly what you paid in the first place, so how can they calculate resale as a %? They probably use MSRP, but who pays MSRP?

    Here's an example. I paid $19200 for my Forester, and they were selling for $14k or so about 3 years later. That's 73% actual residual value. The study puts it much lower, at about 50% or so, so they must be using MSRP. But even then the residual value would have been about 67%, so the numbers don't add up.

    Maybe they're looking at wholesale trade-in? I dunno. My Forester is 4 years old, and in the DC area they don't sell for less than $11k, and $12.5k is more common. Even at $11k and after 4 years, my residual value is at 57%, better than any of the cars in that study (after 3 years!).

    Plus, how do they account for people that paid markups for New Beetles, PT Cruisers, and Honda Odysseys? And Mini Coopers now? Residuals will seem artificially inflated unless they account for the markups paid.

    Same goes for cars with rebates, unless they account for the rebates and discounts those cars' residuals will seem deflated.

    -juice
  • originalbitmanoriginalbitman Member Posts: 920
    I have Madico Onyx tint and no probs with radio reception.

    bit
  • p0926p0926 Member Posts: 4,423
    I have Solargard (sp?) metallic tint on my 01 Forester and no problems with radio reception either.

    -Frank P.
  • jackleungjackleung Member Posts: 79
    Anybody knows where its located on the 2001 Forester? Anyone did a test of it's reading to see if it's accurate enough?

    Rgds,
    Jack
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